Here are my thoughts about the BenQ ZOWIE EC2-CW, the first wireless mouse out from ZOWIE!
✅ LethalGamingGear code: haus5
5% off from purchases!
lethalgaminggear.com/?ref=hau...
✅ PMM.gg code: HAUS
pmm.gg/
✅ Pulsar referral link:
www.pulsar.gg/?ref=haus
My nickname online is Kammyz / hauskamies and I am an ex Professional COD1 & COD4 gamer, and I've played CS at a VERY high level.
Follow me on Twitch / Twitter
Twitter: / hausgames_
Twitch: / hausgaming_
If you want to support me more, join as a member:
/ @hausgaming
CS:GO config: www.dropbox.com/s/chf16z9olzg...
Music from Epidemicsound: www.epidemicsound.com/referra...
Best CS DM Servers for Europeans: brutalcs.nu/servers
00:00 Quality & Slight changes
01:42 Wireless Performance
04:40 Weight & comparisons with DAV3
06:44 Possible downsides
07:32 Is the EC2-CW worth it?
Man that’s a nice mouse, but holy **** that’s some smooth hair!
😂😂
Your the man TheTechne.
@@hausgaming you should start reviewing shampoos
Haus=Glorious Gaming logo IRL
his hair is for the ladies, don't touch
The starlight came out 2 years ago as the lightest (full sized) mouse available, with the latest tech at the moment and made out of magnesium, a new material that nobody was using, at a price of 189, and everyone freaked out saying it was a complete madness to charge that much for a mouse. Well, now Zowie has come with its wireless mice line, several years later than any other brand, with outdated tech and weighing more than any other alternative from 76 to 79 grams depending on the model, and for 189 too.
too be fair people werent happy about 189 but the main issue was the no stock at first and terrible qc
@@rarinth did you mean to reply to me i was tallking about the starlight?
@@krombunk2764 i literally typed an whole essay lol sorry But anyways, most aimers recommend the finalmouse because it's light af and uses magnesium. But unfortunately it had shitty qc and I saw a pic of the shell being broken on twitter. Yet the people who bought it thinks they will climb to radiant or something like that because it was recommended by their idols, but in reality they still perform terrible like before
@@rarinth - g502 user
@@LUCKIPUP atleast it's still goated (i use the deathadder v2)
Thanks Haus! As always your knowledge and thorough reviews are god tier! I probably will get this eventually since I'm a zowie fanboi, but I'll probably hold off for a while... Just to see user reactions.
Zowie labs need better ventilation, they are obviously sniffing glue!
Thank you for the review. Really appreciate technical insights and format of the videos that you have been putting out recently, albeit infrequently (more from you would be great :D). Regarding the mouse, price completely kills it for me, I could get a small upgrade for my PC instead. Used wired mice go for around 30 EUR in my country, don't think I need to shell out 100EUR for something that doesn't necessarily perform better.
Thank you! I'd only get wireless if you want the convenience and are bothered by the cable. Otherwise, as you said, wired mice are cheaper and go for really cheap on the used market atm!
Time to start an onlyfans to fund me buying the entire zowie wireless collection.
😂😂
bro, it's a 76 g mouse with a dongle receiver size of a router. this is like blackberry coming back with it's 2005 tech in today's world.
@@threadripper3750 the dongle things fine, i like when my mouse actually fucking works and isnt interfered by everything in the world like nearly every other wireless mouse
@@threadripper3750 the dongle is actually combined with the charging hub
@@WorldKeepsSpinnin just to comment - no hate - but the Viper V2 Pro came with a universally acceptable wireless mouse dongle extension cable (around 4-5ft long) that has an attachable female USB port that can be connected. So, once I got that mouse and eventually switched back to my G Pro X Superlight, I started using that dongle extender and it has been freaking amazing and allows the GPX to do so much better in latency tests than it did when the dongle was a few feet away from the mouse. With the extender, the dongle is only like 2-3 inches away from the mouse =D.
Good video, man. Happy New Year! I will stick to the Razer Deathadder V3 Pro, but I hope this year that Logitech will come out with a superlight G703.
i really appreciate this video. thanks for always being honest with us
My pleasure!
I have this exact mouse and on a whim decided to try holding it like you show here (vs claw but w/ pink curled further down) and I think it really helped with more precise tracking and flicking, I feel much faster when I have to switch targets.
Beautiful review, I agree with what you said about the price.
Loving your reviews. After years with ss rival I’ve order the ec2c wired. Will arrive tomorrow. Can’t wait to use it!
Thank you brother! Much appreciated
how is it and what size hands + grip style do you have
I've got EC1-C and I'm so happy with it!
Nice review! Ec2 or Ec3 for aggressive claw 18x9?
Great job @hausgaming very well put together vid. Yea, even at 150 that is extremely high priced. If you factor in for inflation here in the USA plus shipping it's still way more than most average gamers are going to pay. I mean I'm a Zowie fan myself and the specs sound very solid. One day I will purchase it. But that will be when it hits at least the 100 dollar mark. Maybe Christmas? 😂 As always Haus, appreciate your great in depth analysis. Cheers...Fatal
I've been waiting for a wireless zowie mouse for years... Recently got my Deathadder V3, unfortunate timing. Happy with that one too tho.
Great video, very informative as usual. Any plans to review the wireless XE that releases ~next week? Was hoping you got an early unit like you did the zowie so I can see before I purchase :)
I will for sure! I'm not sure when I will be receiving my unit though!
@@hausgaming Ok cool looking forward to seeing the latency results
I was eyeing this mouse after its announcement....but I don't know if I would be able to handle the weight considering the fact that I should be getting a 23g mouse next month. It would be like switching from swinging toothpicks around to swinging boulders haha.
Great review! But that cpi deviation got me worried! i don't want to spend 180 euros for a fault product! I have also read in another review that they measured SPI timing jitter in their mouse also! Do you think that this is something that could be a problem with the EC2-CW in general? and that can affect performance? Thank you!
I actually like the heavier weight. I used to use a DAV3 and the light weight has definitely messed with my aiming as I would often over flick or I'd miss over the most minor of movements and I could never get used to it. When I went back to an EC1-C, I immediately noticed a huge difference in my aim despite the wire. Definitely considering the wireless version.
I'm a huge Zowie fan as well. I've mained the GSR and the GTFX for some time. I've mained the EC1 and the ZA11 as well for some time. Zowie's approach is similar to Toyota's approach to design. Slow, methodical, and not quick to jump on the latest tech trends. I respect that. However, I don't think this mouse is worth 150$ to me personally and I will not be spending the money on it. I would consider it if the price were to be cut in half. At this price, I would've liked to see 4k/8k polling rate with the best sensor on the market. I'm disappointed a little. Still a diehard zowie fan tho
Feeling the same here. For such a high price, I expect it to be made with the newest tech lol. The price is so disappointing since I’ve been waiting for a wireless Zowie mouse for a while now. Gonna see if it drops below 100 during sales. I’m still using the same old EC2-A since 2015.
4k/8k polling rate is utterly useless for a mouse, especially wireless as it just annihilates battery life with no noticeable performance gain. Our human bodies can't even begin to start using something like 1k polling rate let alone 4 and 8k.
@@De4dSp0t this. Except the part about “human bodies able to use 1khz” what do you even mean lmao.
@@alkestos What I mean is 1k polling rate is 1,000 data transfers a second. We can't even register that in our brains or react to it. Going from 500 to 1k doesn't make a gigantic difference but you can see it, not that you can use it. You're human eyes can't even really discern the difference between 500 and 1k just barely, but from 1k to 4 or 8k yeah, you're not seeing or gonna be able to use it at all. 1k is already 1 or under 1ms response time, as in faster than most monitors latency wise and way more data transfer a second than a monitors capable of, as well as your human body. Your eyes might be able to barely tell the difference but it makes no change on the use of it, since your muscles can't adjust for that, nor your brain, nor your eyes register it fast enough to matter. Your aim or use of the mouse won't change from 1k to 8k polling rate is what I mean.
@@De4dSp0t Actually you can tell the difference between 500hz and 1000hz on 144/240hz and potentially even 1000 to 4000hz but you actually NEED a 240/360hz monitor for those to really tell any kind of difference, and even then... On my 240hz panel I can tell 500 vs 1000 very very easily, but 1000 to 4000 I can't really tell much of a difference. I know 500hz panels are becoming more common and eventually we'll hit 1000hz since that's the limit of what most humans can perceive so...I think ultimately we'll probably stay in these ranges for the perceived future. But yea ultimately this stuff won't really matter to a bronze player in any game in general.
The upcoming lamzu thorn looks to be the same shape, appears smaller, has optical switches and comes in at 43g, so its shaping to be a bettee choice especially if it launches at same price as the atlantis or even if at a bit higher price.
Thank you! Also, what is that orange Pulsar mouse?
I remember in the EC2 wired reivew you said that the lines on the sides of the mouse bothered you a lil bit , but is it the same case with the wireless as well??
I would like to know your opinion on the mm712. I usually like using the viper mini and my m42 but lately I brought my mm710 out the closet and I really been liking the shape just hate the holes and the sensor position feels to low. On the mm712 it looks like these problems have been fixed. I would like your opinion on it.
Aqua Control Zero review when? got one coming in the mail!
Hi haus, could you make a video about what are your main gear at the moment? It would be so interesting, thanks for your great content as always!
Hey! Yes I've had this planned for quite a bit! In the next month!
I really expected 55-60g, 4k hz and 3395 sensor for this price. DAV3 pro looks like a better choice for a ergo mouse.
It is zowie mouse so they not follow trends on mouse. They just change the shape a little and added wireless to the mouse.
@@CodeVenomSnakes I understand. I have the ec2-c and love this shape, but personal to me no make sense a wireless mouse is more weight of a wired mouse.
@@leonardosouza5066 it makes a lot sense tho. Add a battery + some sort of wireless reciever. This shit can add up to 5-15g depending I assume
First time viewer here. Didn't expect Breach from valorant to be such a good reviewer😂 In all seriousness, very informative review with a lot of character!
lmao, thanks brother!
Hahahaha
Still gonna get it. I got the money and the shape is perfect for me, not to mention build quality.
The mouse charger reminds me the base of my robot vacuum cleaner
😂😂
WRAIA AUTA PALIOSXOLEIO ALLA TO LAMZU TI LEEI
Great review. Would you recommend changing the click latency? Normal vs fast?
fast always!
Even though I'm a huge Zowie fan, these prices are absolutely insane. Let's wait and see how Vaxee set their prices with the new XE Wireless. As always your videos are awesome bro! Keep up the good work!
Zowie always make basic mouse compare to other brands because they not follow trends on mouse. Zowie need to make it lightweight or better sensor. Just having wireless is not worth the price.
Hello, did you use the Fast mode click response time or the Normal? and which one would you recommend.
Can't wait till they release these with the FK series
190 € are just too much. I've been using the EC1-C for months now and I'm never looking back. The cable is so good, I don't mind it at all. Thank you haus, your reviews have helped me get to a stage where I am super happy with my gear and don't want to change anything.
Glad to hear I've been able to help!
Dude Zowie never follow mouse trends so they just added wireless and change the shape a little.
@@anxanxanx10 I believe I was using the Odin Eclipse at the time. That pad has been discontinued. Now I use the Zowie GSR-SE Rouge, which is a bit slower.
First time here in the channel, great review! I used to be a huge Zowie mouse fan, sick shapes and construction quality! But unfortunately, as usual is overpriced. I agree that you can find good options with way less investment. Also, you remind me very much of f0rest the CS legend! Anyway, I subscribed to the channel looking forward for more reviews!
Great video. Glad you’re not shilling overpriced products like other reviewers might
Hello, I noticed that you have an X Raypad Aqua Control Zero. Could you share your comments about the mousepad? will there be a review?
AC Zero review soon? How does the speed compare to the Saturn and Equate?
3:35 you can lower the click latency when you plug it in there is 2 settings normal/fast
Zowie prices are this high because people buy it no matter what, like apple products. They are always late to the party and bring no real inovation for the price to make sense. With a lot more companies making amazing mice, zowie needs to leave 2015 behind and get their head on the game.
this is probably the worst mouse opinion ive ever heard
@@SNTIME the new zowie mice are unironically the worst price to performance mice we’ve received ever other than possibly the finalmice but this might even be worse, these literally appeal only to miserable csgo players that swear loyalty to zowie and nobody else. these mice are bad.
@@wqite 😂
And people shit on Razer for being overpriced at least they bring something to the table
@@wqitehave you ever used a Zowie mouse
Is it bigger than the super light as I’m looking for a little bigger
Hello my friend, What’s your main mouse and mousepad? I’m using razer deathadder elite and I want to buy new mouse but not ergo. My hand size is 19x11 and my grip style is palm and relaxed claw. What do you prefer for wireless mouse for siege type game esspecially Looking for low click latency and build quality. Endgame gear type mouse very interesting example for shape so I tought lamzu pulsar and ninjutso also looking for crazy coming mouse in 2023 like new pulsar amd emdgame gear mouses. Thank you for your time.
gwoles hts plus at 50gms is using 3370 sensor and is charging $120 on max gaming with out any "enhanced receiver" which I don't need as I am not a pro(ordered 2 days back). Similarly katana superlight at 60gm, 3370 at $90(currently maining). Even if they release a bundle without "enhanced receiver" at $120 as its 78gms, I ain't touching them with 10 feet pole this revision. I love ec shape so much and own ec1,ec2 and ec3 c-versions but I can't just ignore the weight now. If they just reduced the weight at 60gms, I would be happily paying them $300 for 3360 sensor too and it would be my main like ec1-c for a year main. But here we are......
Another great video, like your opinion, keep it up
excellent video as always!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Worst part is unlike razer or Logitech who do deep sales, I’ve never seen a zowie discount.
Idd, it's 190 euros in a year as well :D
The EU pricing is really a big let down....
The price is absolutely insane but the EC2 is my endgame mouse so I'll get one anyway will probably get the Xlite V3 as well, I don't need any other shapes this is perfect and I'm happy Zowie finally went wireless. The weight would've been perfect if it was 65-70g but it doesn't bother me, I've even used the DAV2 lately and I've never felt like the weight prevented me to perform well (and I'm not a CS player).
Dav3 or dav3? If you meant dav2 then you should really try out dav3
@@bonkersbruv I meant the DAV2xHyperspeed to be exact. I did use the DAV3 for a month but I didn't like the shape so I returned it. It's too long, bulky and the right side is too flat for my liking. It also had a little bit of creaking and flexing where I rested my thumb. I like the old Deathadder Elite shape the most out of the Deathadders but the DAV2 is decent as well.
hyvä video! ❤️
Are these numbers using the latest firmware(1.3.1) for the SL12?
zowie could have sold the external antenna + battery charger separately, even charging 50€, being something that should only be purchased once and should be compatible with all wireless mice, instead if we have to buy more mice it would be useless to have like this many bases
Good point! I'd guess most people will not really need it. I had perfectly fine performance with the standard dongle myself!
Zowie should’ve hired you for this release this is a great idea
Wait the men in my glorious model D is a real person? damn!
😂
if I still had any hair left, I would ask for your hair products - because damn that hair is LUSH AND BEAUTIFUL.
lmao 😂
Cool to see but EU price is just insane indeed. Using S1-C and really don't even feel the cable. I wonder how much Vaxee one will be.
Would you say this mouse is a better steelseries prime wireless?
Hausman making the real important vids.
Been waiting for this. I honestly think the mouse should be 130 regardless of area. The weight I bet can be fixed with a battery swap. It's 1k so it wouldn't be an issue. They need to stop shipping mice with the black skates imo. I've always hated their stock black skates
I like the black feet with faster pads tbh, but they should ship mice with the black feet preinstalled and have the separate feet be the white ones. I agree that 130 bucks would've been a nice price, considering the quality and feel these mice have. I feel that most enthusiasts do not really understand weight and especially when it's important for a mouse to be lightweight and when it's not, I'd bet most people have never held an EC-series mouse in their hands :D.
@@hausgaming I think most people get over invested in things that are easy to see. Sensor, weight, etc. You're on of the few talking about the mcu used which is a really important and expensive component.
@@NotSoCommonSense It's the same MCU used on the MM731 and (very possibly) on the MM712 as well. The MM731 was going on sale for $48 a few weeks ago, and the MM712 goes for $70. I know there's a gap on build quality between CM and Zowie, but they're still definitely overcharging by quite a lot.
@@vvvvooooiiiidddd oh no doubt. I'm not justifying this release at all. I'm just saying the sensor and the weight isn't really the end all be all. I think zowie honestly should have done more especially for as long as they waited. And the price is definitely expensive but the receiver/dock/overall wireless implementation I'm sure cost a lot more than the standard dongle. So it's not exactly 1 to 1 but 150 is steep like really steep. I would probably only do it for the s2 tbh because there isn't a good wireless s2 yet
@@NotSoCommonSense Oh yeah, definitely. I agree 100%
Hi, May I know the name of the mouse @2:13 orange one,,..thankyou.
This price is unjustifiable for any mouse but let alone for a mouse that doesn't have the most up to date specs
Agreed, but it’s a Zowie EC-2 wireless so.. they’re allowed to get away with it sadly.
And I’m going to buy it after buying and selling every single top tier mouse in 2022 because no one comes close to the ec2
@@RadicalizedRadical abaoluteley brainwashed or still living in 2015
@@reflexx8332 You literally have the mentality of "if it has more weight and has the components that are old but still perfectly fine in 2023 = bad". The reason zowie is popular is because they care about the shape (designed by 1.6 legends who would absolutely destroy you in their prime), not because they use the newest components (eg. 3395, optical switches, etc) because they know newer components, rgb, and less weight doesn't make a shitty player climb to radiant/faceit level 10. If the component upgrade or following the trend actually matters, then they will go for it You act like using the newest components actually matters, but you're wrong. You're the one who is brainwashed by marketing
@@reflexx8332 nah the EC2 is an iconic design that has nice natural fit to certain hands. For example mine are what are referred to as rugby player hands after playing for so long the hand naturally has a curve grown into it and arches out more from having to have your hands out wide for holding the ball. The ec2 and death adder are the only ones that fit.
zowie increased the prices so much 69€ to 89€ cable mouse then the 2566k 649€ to 699€ and now 190€ wireless mouse, I'm glad there are good alternatives
Shit on the pricing of their mice but their monitors are literally the best for competitive gaming, especially at the price point considering any monitor at a similar price will have a pretty significant amount of ghosting in comparison. To even get close you'd have to get an OLED monitor at 2x the price and it still has a little bit more ghosting than zowie's newest monitor. They're simply unbeatable in terms of visual clarity.
I mean, isn't it more expensive because of the wireless transmitter thing? I'm guessing without that the mouse itself would probably be a lot cheaper? Could be wrong.
Yes definitely, which is why I think $150 is fine. But 190 euros is way too much with it included!
Glorious!! Reviewing Zowie. Sorry just first image come to my mind.
IDK wtf zowie is doing in Europe, but the gsr-se rouge is 60 Euros, the GSR is 50 etc...hello?
So I should basically stick to the Deathadder V3 Pro then...
Are they going to come out with a wireless S2?
II buy a few FPS gaming mice a year. I've tried all the wireless superlight mice, but I always find myself going back to the wired Zowie EC2-C. I'll be buying this mouse for sure.
rich ahh
DAv3 is better
I'd rather wait for the new model from LAMZU, the Thorn which will have the same shape and better specs and weigh only 47 grams. Btw great video!
The price for the tech they are offering in the mouse in unnacceptable in my eyes. Not only are they heavier than the competition, they aren't even offering the latest sensor or 4k polling. I get that the mice may test well but the pricing should reflect the tech inside the mouse and its weight imo. If these retailed at $120 I would be fine with them.
Having the 3395 or 3370 in it will not change the amount of investment BenQ has made for the mouse barely at all. Like if ZOWIE had started developing the wireless platform for the 3395 and came out with it, the price would've been the exact same. What we most likely see in the price is ZOWIE tax, the dock/receiver and R&D investments (which are non-existant for the OEM solution mice with 3395 out atm). The 3395 doesn't also necessarily mean the mouse is 4K ready. None of the 3395 that are out at the moment support 4K just out of the box with the PCB design that they have!
newer components and lower weight doesn't make a shitty player climb to radiant or something like that, if it was necessary they will go for it
I get what you mean haus and that is fair, whether it would have changed the price tag at all for them using a 3395 or a 3370 though, the average consumer not in the know is going to come to the same conclusion which is "the competition is using an objectively newer and better sensor (whether testing shows it or not) and they are lighter and they are charging less. Zowie tax be damned lol
@@jheymann69 my point more so was that the sensor itself doesn't mean anything. The general consumer can think that and everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but all in all, just by seeing a number in a sensor, you can't call the mouse objectively better in terms of tech 😊
in Canada the DA V3 is 189.99 ... so yeah I understand your frustration. It seems the USA always get the better price even when company increase their price in other markets, the USA do not get hit by increase. I did buy the DA V3 for 189.99 + taxes but i end up returning it, its just not worth it that these crazy price.
I assume that's cuz import tax mainly a UK issue
@@Tony-ui2sl Also US prices are without value added tax which differs from state to state.
@Pavel Peřina true. But the UK countries have to pay import + duties fees.
sounded good at the beginning, but the weight AND the price is a big yikes for me. there is so much sub 100$ offerings that make more sense. still nice for people that pref heavier mice i guess.
Im way to hyped over a EC2, but ill hold on to see if they release a lighter version and a sale. Cant argue paying almost 200 euros for a mouse thats.....well not worth it.
ive been wanting a Zowie Wireless for so long that I dropped Zowie and picked up Pulsar... considered going back upon seeing this, but at €189,99... jesus man, no. I can get a Pulsar for like €80 and i cant feel the latency anyway, thats way better.
Give it a better sensor and make it slightly lighter and $150 is somewhat reasonable. But as it is now, literally no point in buying it when mice like the Glorious D- and DA v3 exist. Sucks since I love Zowie and used an EC2B for years
Too bad, that is my fav shape but for that price they are shooting themselves in the foot. Thanks for the review Haus
Thanks brother!
whats with the huge receiver? are we still in 90s?
can you recommend me a alternative mouse if this is the perfect shape for me? i don't like the weight though.
u should give the xlite v3 medium a look
feel like they should offer the mouse with a standard dongle and without the enhanced receiver for like 100 bucks instead
Can you test its DPI deviation at 400 DPI?
3370 is sad but pretty cool they used the high end MCU
Even the vaxee outset ax, now is 150E. The price are nasty, mostly in europe :(
Have you tried the HSK Pro series yet? I've never tried anything like it, ever!
Yeh, I've got it! Need some extended time to test it properly, maybe a quick video about it soon though!
@@hausgaming Looking forward to that!!
Did you make a video comparison between the pwnage symm 2 vs ambi
I never tried the Pwnage Ambi, and I most likely never will sadly :/
gotta say this release is a bit dissapointing but I will get the fk2-cw ... its just the perfect shape for me
Recently I took out my Razer Deathadder and right mouse button hits my finger when I click or its just wedged in that spot and its not comfortable, just cant grip it after playing with ambidextrous mouse. How big of a problem is it with the EC2?
0
Small suggestion/request that would make your reviews even better, at least for me: No talking while clicking the buttons and using the wheel, I always like to hear how the mouse sounds when in use.
Just get 2 Superlights for the price of it. Or about 3 RVU at this point.
I'll be waiting in the ZA wireless lobby.
Finally!
Wow the price is actually shocking.
I was excited... But I see the price... I bought superligth for 55 euros. So... Y will keep the zowie cable mouse for a while
cool, but wtf is that price?
80g 1khz deathadder v3 nice bro!
the receiver add much to the cost but i like it
what does control mean?
FK1+ next please! 🙏🙏
god is back !
mine showing orange light and flash sometimes when using dock then the mouse dc and reconnect again what does it mean?
The $50-$60 comes from the enhanced receiver so they just need to sell that their mice without it. No one needs the enhanced receiver outside of a LAN party.
In UK it will cost 170 pounds so it is around 205 Dollars
i wish they release fk3-c. a bit shorter version of fk2. does not matter wired-wireless i will buy it
I just bought Xtrfy m42 today as replacement of 7 years old FK2 (cause mouse wheel issues) so youtube still recommends tons of videos about mice. With smaller hump it's basically smaller FK2 with holes and few improvements: buttons have "dips" so they are easier to control with fingers. Mouse is 5 or 6mm shorter. It's slides way better and it feels much lighter (being 59g vs 85g, FK2C is 70g). It has extra option to use 1200dpi if 1600 is too fast and 800 is too slow. But I have small hand and for me it's almost too small, there's barely any contant with my palm so i hold it almost exclusively by fingers. And I'm not a fan of holes, they are not that bad, but they are definitely not improvement - especially holes on sides. So compared to original FK2 it's more precise and better at everything, except size of FK2 is more comfortable (more contact with palm) and side holes. I considered FK2 flawless (except squishy wheel not registering very slow turn, which was super annoying when i needed one step per second)
And s3-c too