An Unnecessary Tool...that EVERYBODY Wants!
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We love our Festool Domino Mortisers. We use them all the time. We use them so much that we're often asked if it's possible to build our furniture without using a domino. We realize it is a very expensive tool to purchase, and definitely a luxury to own one. So in this video we're going over the various ways that we use dominos in our furniture and woodworking projects, and showing alternative ways that you can get the job done, and get an outcome just as good.
WOODWORKING PLANS
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FEATURED TOOLS
▸ Woodpeckers Tools (all the red stuff) - bit.ly/wpfoureyes
▸ Doweling Jig - bit.ly/DowlingJigRockler21
▸ Rockler Project Matt - bit.ly/iiii-ProjectMat
▸ Kreg Pocket Hole Jig - bit.ly/Pocket-Hole-Pro
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I am forever grateful for all of you who support the show on Patreon. You really do help make doing this possible. If you want to support the show, get a T-shirt and even discounts on plans, check out the patreon link and see if it's right for you - / chrissalomone
CHAPTERS
0:00 Introduction
0:50 Domino Alternatives
1:26 Mortise & Tenon Joinery
7:57 Dealing with Wider Panels
10:34 Miter Joints
12:28 Splines
15:03 Box Miter Joints (Bevels)
17:48 Registration Holes
19:30 Panel Making
I bought the glenn chair course and easily the best online woodworking course I've ever taken and maybe the best overall regardless of topic. I haven't even made the chair yet! But that's not really the point. In my experience with your course, the immediate benefit to me has been learning tons of skills and techniques that are applicable to all my other projects. So for me, the chair wasn't necessarily the primary end goal, but it served as a very effective context in which those things were demonstrated. The quality of presentation, order, pace, attention to detail, illustrations, animations, plans and diagrams... all top notch and worth every penny. And eventually I will also get a beautiful chair out of it.
Appreciate the kind words Ross...and for everybody else. I swear we didn't pay him to say this. Which I know, is what you would say if you secretly paid somebody to say something...but again, We didn't...which I know, is what somebody who....you get the point.
@@Foureyes.Furniture so you're saying you paid him $50 to say this
@@brewtalityk All joking aside. No, we did not pay him to say this.....
I will say the same thing if you pay me $90. I will use the funds to buy a course, haha. All joking aside I can’t wait to purchase a course and try it.
The author does like to kzhead.infoUgkxkNYRBJuiJ6EwD-tQSAlxg0eFKsnR2cgz from scratch, shaping and trimming wood from large blocks into fine finished products. As another reviewer mentioned, most projects require a lot of high-dollar equipment that most of us don't have the room or budget for. But, knowing how to do these things, even if we won't be able to practice the full stack project, is still great.
I am a full time professional furniture maker. Own a domino, biscuiter and dowel jig. And still watched this video. Love it boys. Some great tips and always good to have a little reminder from time to time. Cheers 👍
I super appreciate the subtle note that "nothing at all" was "not pictured." Had a good laugh. I was almost expecting to see glue here but "nothing not pictured" hit harder.
Rockler dowel kits are inaccurate and they do not clamp well. The lines on the plexi do not align perfectly with the drill guides and the clear plastic material used does not clamp well and will slip regularly. Dowels may be a good alternative, but the Rockler kit is not the answer.
You are absolutely right I have the exact same experience.
Try using clamps with sticky rubber type ends, and doesn't use the line directly use the end of the jig it works a lot better
Dowel max
I love the quality of your videos. You could talk about food, motorcycles, knitting, whatever, you are making great content. Thanks.
I love my Dowelmax. Precision made, easy to, little setup, and no need to measure.
The Domino 1019.00, is my favorite tool for joinery. The DowelMax jig, is a very good alternative to the domino. It’s well machined , accurate and easy to use.
Came to post this. I'll eventually own a domino, but the dowelmax has been amazing for me.
I just want to say that I watched this out of appreciation for your thumbnail and title. Nicely done!
This is an incredibly well done video. Thank you.
I'm a DIY woodworker, so although I love tools like this, it would not be value for money. If it was my business, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. I see them as saving time and less time per job = more profit.
EVERY alternative to domino 500 sized builds I have EVER seen has only made me happy I bought a domino. Pantorouter for big stuff.
You guys make some awesome furniture, I'm glad to see you around, it seems like a long time since you last posted something. Very well made informative video! 👍 😀
Very helpful. I'm just an amateur DIY and I have a lot to learn about joinery. This video answered several questions.
Thanks Gary...glad it was helpful :)
Awesome content guys. Keep up the great work.
So… about time I send you guys a few pecos as a thank you. I’ve learned a great deal of woodworking and most importantly snark from the channel. Thank you.
Thanks, Guys, love your work and teaching. I’ve used my DowelMax for both simple and more complex builds and love it.
I love your videos, and appreciate you guys making them. I just noticed on this video, and your panel glue up video that you mentioned the Rockler beadlock system and their deluxe panel clamps respectively, and didn’t show them in use. As a beginner that happens to own both I’m curious why. Do you find any or both unnecessary or gimmicky?
You guys make some stunning chairs. Hats off. Brilliant
Great video, good points! I don’t know why but I cracked up laughing when you posted “Nothing at all, no pictured” 😂
The graphics are awesome. And the woodworking. And the design. And...jokes like "not pictured". How many buses of people are working on one of these videos?
The animations are actually quite amazing 👍
love the A's hat !!
I have a weird but honest request. I love the idea of woodworking and even have dabbled a little in the past. But I simply don't have the space to keep all the tools that I would need to make such wonderful pieces. Here is my proposal. Would you ever consider having a week or weekend course where you allow us to come into your shop and you teach us and guide us how to make these pieces in your workshop and then we can build them and take them home. Of course, I would be willing to pay and would say at a local hotel. It would be similar to taking a course at a local community college but you would be our master teacher. Plus the knowledge we learn would be invaluable. I know a crazy idea but I just had to ask. THank you so much for making such wonderful projects and wonderful videos! I really do find great enjoyment in watching them. Blessings, Jack
Thanks guys!
I was going to buy a Domino but got the DowelMax because of the educational video. Works great!
Awesome video as always!
I love my domino, very practical and like this author, would buy another if it broke. Is it necessary, no, but sure works great…….and a time saver. Oh, thought I should mention, I am a professional woodworker with 40 plus years experience.
Back in the day, 1970, age 15 and up, we also cut tenons and dug mortise using hand saws, chisels, mallet. Still have the tools, but I use dowels as I can't afford a Domino and don't have a solid, heavy workbench
Hey guys, great video! Question- what is an alternative method for the seat back on the Cece plans I purchased where the back is attached to the seat panel. Feel like it needs some additional strength here but could not get any dowel jig to work with the correct angles. Your thoughts are greatly appreciated. Keep up the good work. It’s on to your dining table next. Your videos and plans are AWESOME!!! Be well, thank you so much in advance and God Bless. PS-are you all cruising Whittier Blvd. these days? That was great fun in the early 80’s prior to your births of course😂.
another awesome class
Great idea 💡 👍 👏 👌 😀 🙌
Would love to see something on Knockdown joinery methods(screws, bolts etc). I have a lot of functional projects that I need to disassemble, transport, and reassemble elsewhere.
Have you looked at the peanut fixings and jig? It looks like a great alternative to the lamelo
@@spycedezynuk Thanks for the tip! Looks interesting.
Great information.
I finally bought myself a Domino and I will never go back to dowels or biscuits again. Dowels are strong but very fussy to align. Biscuits make alignment a breeze for panel glue ups but don't add much strength. They are also don't work for smaller width boards and are dubious at best for end grain to face joints. Yes, it is a luxury but it is fast and accurate.
Paralleling biscuits doubles the strength of a joint...🤫 The chair slats could have been supported by a rebate on each side by just a slight modification to the design... Loadsa ways to remove the hide from a feline... 😌 From the Emerald Isle 😎👍☘🍺
Just imagine all the furniture built prior to Dominoes😏 -yet people still ask the question-"do i need dominoes?" GREAT VID GUYS!!!
Did people build furniture back then? I thought furniture first started being made back in about 2007
I'd love a link to that triangle square on the bottom of your Woodpecker stuff hanging there. I can't quite see if it's a Woodpecker product. either way I've searched everywhere ( including the Wood pecker site) and can't find anything even like it. Another great video, fellas. Well done. Not only are your videos very instructional, but I also find them very relaxing for me. Thank you.
There are already hundreds of comments on this video so I imagine this will get buried, but have you guys ever considered making a video about the tools you use? I know there are countless other videos that already exist on the topic, but one of the things that crosses my mind literally every time I watch any of your videos is "I wonder what made them choose that tool specifically over everything else?". Obviously a lot of it is preference and very subjective, but I genuinely value your opinions, and the way you guys explain and break things down is incredibly helpful when I'm looking for a bit more clarity.
great video as always. thank you. i was wondering (per section @9:05); what (if any) is the diff. between a straight router bit w guide bushing vs a template bit?
Pretty simple answer: straight bit and guide bushing allows you to use spiral bits that are better for plunging or regular ones that are cheap, as the guide bushing is at a fixed height you don't risk that the cutting edge of the bit touches the jig whatever is the depth of cut (think about a deep mortice that you obtain in many passes at progressively increased depth of cut). cons: you can not use a bit of larger diameter then the hole of the guide bushing allows and you have to take account of the overhang, the side of the cut is not at the same level of the side of the jig. Template bit: non overhang, so easier setup in some situations and you find template bits of larger diameter then the one allowed by the hole of the guide bushing. Cons: you don't find template bits with very small diameter, AFAIK you don't find them spiraled so less suited for deep plunging of mortices. Understand the pros and cons of each one and chose the better one for the particular application, they both excel in some situations and are not suited in other applications, they are similar systems but each one works better fro some situations, you can not chose one of the 2 and pretend to use it in all the situations because is "better" then the alternative.
Great video again.
In many of the scenarios described, splines or even bow-ties could be used... but I guess those are sort of variations in floating tenons ... :D
I have the samall one and the big one and because i do woodwork on my freetime, they make my work far more efficient and without them i took more time to build staff
7:37 If you are plugging the screw hole anyway, couldn't you also use the pilot hole to drill a hole for a dowel? Doesn't seem more complex to me than using a screw and plugging it up. 🤔
I know it’s not your style but I would be interested to get your opinion on how to join herringbone benchtops. I know the obvious would be a tongue on 1 side & end then a groove on the other 2 but just curious on your thoughts as you always seem to have the idea that I think “that’s so obvious why didn’t I think of that”
On the example of the leg to the headboard connection, you glued the joint together, which, I believe is how it would have to be done, but wouldn't that lock the two together??
Great video. Can you identify the jig tool that you are using with jorgensen e-z hold clamps at 12.56 for the odd angle glue up? Thank you.
If it’s what I think you’re talking about. The angles clamping blocks. They aren’t available anywhere. We made ourselves more out of plywood. Can’t remember which one. But we covered it in one of our recent tips videos.
@@Foureyes.Furniture Thank you. Yes, the angled clamping blocks. I have a project coming up that requires gluing odd angles and the lollipop jig that is available most places just doesn't seem to be sturdy enough to cut it. Your blocks look heavy duty and the interplay with the Jorgeson E-Z clamps looked like a set. There is printing on the device, can you provide the detail and I can possibly hunt down the manufacturer. No matter how hard I tried, it appears that the lettering can't be deciphered from the video. Thank you again. The quality of your furniture looks exceptional from the videos. You are in a league and with a similar style with the late Sam Maloof.
I like using biscuits, but only for alignment purposes. I find they do very little to add strength to a joint.
what software do you use for the 3d renders?
Basically if you are a hobbyist and not in a production business, just learn the traditional method. The first project I ever build was a traditional storm window. learned mortise and tenon and pinned the tenon. Wasn't difficult for the 2nd or 3rd window I build. Also a domino wouldn't hold up as well outdoors overtime. As the title of the video is Unnecessary tool everyone wants as it's also $1,000.
Top!!!!
Arrrrggggghhhh, why did I start watching your videos. Now I want to get back in my garage and somehow learn how to do this stuff.
Woodworkers have been joining wood together for hundreds of years without a domino machine. It's a fancy, proprietary, overpriced, one trick machine. For most of us weekend wood workers, a table saw and a router or a drill can get you there without the added expense of that thing. I'm glad that someone had the courage to make a video showing that all this joinery can be made using alternative, tried and true methods. You can even make domino joinery using a router to cut the slots and a table saw and router table to make your own dominoes. The one advantage to the domino machine is a little bit of time savings, but us poor people would be much better off spending our money on a table saw and a good quality fixed/plunge router and a router table. You can even build your own router table.
What was the source of the clear dowling guides used? If you made them, any special materials? Thanks
It was Rockler but I cannot recommend them. See other comments on this vid about them. Dowel max is pricy but much much better and can do waterfall miter just like domino.
I like everything you said. But I use biscuits side by side if wood is wide enough. Ie a double tenons. I no that the biscuits are shallow but I have had to work hard to break joint.😁
I believe it. Usually joints are a lot stronger than we give them credit for, or expect them to be.
I've gotten so used to using the Wnew doweling jig I can't imagine a domino machine being that much faster and I have no want for one.
liked and subbed with thanks.
The tenons shown at 6:52 scream through wedged tenons! IMO!
Miller dowel Co not happy about the alternative list you made there lol
11.44 spline joint with contrasting wood would look good
12.40, got it covered
For speed,accuracy, strength,flexibility and mobility of application,adjustable angles,range of sizes,I can't think of another tool equal to the domino for small run,small shop use. Then there's the Domino 700 as well...
For the bed headboard example, if you glue both ends of the tenon, does that not defeat your goal of allowing for wood movement. Same with making the second domino hole bigger, if you glue it then you aren't allowing the movement regardless ?
Personally would only glue the bottom ones in both pieces to allow expansion in one direction, the ones above that would only get glued in the side rails
Thank you for this awesome educational video 👍 Question, what type of dowel tool were you using? I use alot of dowel consept in my furniture I suppose if I would have watched a little longer my question was answered 😜 thanks I want to order the dowel kit from rockler. But I have to wait as so many of us have been evacuated from the monster fire that's ravaging our communities here in Northern New Mexico. Hopefully I don't lose my home and shop to the fire 🙏
I find biscuits, dowels, dominos are not needed. As long as you mill correctly and are working with low % moisture, you're going to do great. There is a wood store I use and all their tables are just straight glue ups w/ c channels. I modeled my work off it. Now, if I was a professional and bringing good money and it shaved time, which allowed me to scale up - this would be a no question purchase. I believe we have to examine value to answer the question.
Good descriptions, but an old fashioned mortice and tenon joint would be just as easy in a lot of the situations...
Cool! i never use a Domino for my work too😄
I'm not sure i understand. Make mortice and tennons to provide for movement... then glue them, which will stop them moving. What-I-miss ??
Yes you can. The domino is for those who don’t want to learn woodworking joinery.
Is this a re-edited version of a previous video? I swear I've seen a lot of this before.
7:40 oh shit that's smooth
Thanks for the great presentation. I think it would be interesting to compare the Grizzly and Triton dowel joiners that have all the same speed and flexibilties as the domino but cost about $225.
I bought and returned the Triton duo doweler. The cutting heads were not in plane and lead to misalignment 99% of the time, it was just poorly machined. I'd get a Domino but they're $2500 in Japan lol.
@@grumpybugger110 Thanks Jim, this is literally the only time I have ever heard of someone actually using one.
@@lincolndickerson1293 tolerances seem sloppy kzhead.info/sun/m8udlbKnbX9uZHk/bejne.html
Just a little history. The Domino Joiner first came on the market in? (Have a guess?) In 2007.... So, how did we do it before? Well... with dowels, or with slots and mortises.
You just got to think about how to do the job with the tools and knowledge you have, thats the most efficient way to do it
The term you are looking for when hiding screws in a pocket is called a "counter-bore"
I am confused. Can you explain the difference between a countersink and and counterbore and plug.
I honestly am not sure on the first two. When we say “countersunk” we are taking about below surface. Then that can either be plugged (covered) or not
The domino tools are expensive. There are plugs for pocket holes which mitigate the ugliness somewhat but ... Very good and much appreciated video.
Bought a Domino, thank you
In my opinion trying to use a similar or the same wood for plugs never works. I can always see the plug. I always use a contrasting wood and place the grain of the plug perpendicular to the face as a design feature. If this design feature is not appropriate for the piece then dowels or dominions. Thanks
"Of course it's not necessary. But sometimes a little luxury is necessary" -Debra Barone's Mom
In the base of the dresser, mentioned around @2:30 to @3:00 another option would be sliding dovetails top down. I use these a lot for that type of application & it works great. And you end up with the same look as you have here.
Then again, a sliding dovetail is really just a modified dado, which is really just a modified tenon, if you think about it.
On the taped panel miter joint, you can easily add strap clamps after to align any minor panel warping.
What really bugs me on the spider table is that the stand-offs are not just the splines extending upward.
I'm done with Festool. My Vac remote broke internally in 4 months and I was informed that accessories are not warrantied. Why am I paying top dollar?
You need one
Great information, but do I really need a domino. Just kidding.
Real stupid question. You're showing gluing a large floating tenon in an end grain to face grain joint; does the glue still allow for movement or would that end up being trouble?
Not a dumb question....but we address this in the example in the video when we're talking about the headboard of the bed.
@@Foureyes.Furniture Firstly - thanks for the videos and super prompt response. Perhaps I misunderstood. Do you still glue those loosely cut dominos? And so you would cut the slot oversized, and despite the glue it would still allow the wood to move as needed? Especially in the single large tenon scenario, if the glue does sort of cement it in place for the lack of a better term (it's glue, the better term, but awkward there) would that preclude movement. I'm just learning about movement and consequences so this is all quite genuine
Yes you are right but the fans would love to see expensive tools in videos 😎😎😎😂
I know they aren't needed, but still can't wait for the day festool's patent expires and there's hopefully some cheaper options lol
Glue solves sketchy joinery.
And Peanut connectors!
The only biscuits I have are arrowroot.
"Bourbon Moth Woodworking" tested the strength of 10 different wood joints - "What's the Best Wood Joint || Insanely Strong Joinery!". Results are really surprising 🤔
My only wish is that some day before I freakin die other companies are able to make a cheaper domino! 😆
Just buy a Domino people, in fact buy both sizes - they're fantastic and really not at all expensive in the grand scheme.
If you wouldn't replace them if they went missing, then why do you have two? 😜 Does anyone "need" one, of course not, should anyone have one, of course they should. I get it, $1k+ for a Domino DF-500 is a lot of money. Only by using one will you be able to see how accurately it does all it can do, while being so fast and easy. Only then will you understand why so many have spent the money on it. 😎 I'm surprised you have two DF-500's, why haven't you bought a DF-700? Its depth of cut of 2.75" opens up more creative ways of use it. All the Best, Chuck
To clarify I said I WOULD immediately replace them. Not “Wouldn’t”. The reason we have 2 is because there are 2 of us that share the workshop and we both had them before combining shops.
Thank you for the clarification, I had to use CC to see what you were saying as it did sound to me like "wouldn't", maybe it was that you were also kind of shaking your head "no" as you said it? And it was meant as joke not a dig. Anyway, my bad, but to the bigger point, they are an unbelievably valuable tool to anyone doing joinery. Other joinery techniques are good to great, but the Domino is so easy and fast it is hard not to own one. Also, have you looked at a DF-700 to see if it could be useful in your workflow? One great advantage is being able to "through hole cut" the mortise from the outside panel in one shot. This makes locating the mortise simple and the exposed tenon can be incorporated into the design. And I have to say you guys are making some awesome builds too. All the Best, Chuck
I mean a domino is just a squished, oversized dowel so obviously a few dowels are just as good in pretty much any scenario.
10:55 Bourbon Moth made a joint strenght test lately (kzhead.info/sun/dqlqZJuHrmmIoIU/bejne.html) and the outcome was that the mittered joint was one of the strongest joints (the version with splines). Also you have a nise face expression at 12:02 (accidently paused the episode that moment) - sorry, couldn't restrain myself XD
the Domino was the first Festool I bought and after getting several more, it's the best Festool tool on the market for the average cabinet/furniture maker... but it's not necessary at all. A Toyota will you get from A to B for 30k.. but a Bently will get you there faster and more comfortably for 250k... same thing
I had a 700 festoon what’s it. Never used it as I can’t afford the dominos. Seriously. If I’m needing a joint I’ll Spend the time and make a feature of it. Otherwise I’ll fire brads, screws, paslode nails and fill or plug. I won the 700 in a raffle. Anyone want to buy if from me? It’s unregistered so full warranty available.
Dowels are floating tenons...