Nicolai Sinai: Historical-Critical Scholarship and the Qur'an
In this interview I discuss the nature and findings of modern western scholarship on the Qur'an with Professor Nicolai Sinai.
Professor Sinai is Professor of Islamic Studies at Oxford and a Fellow of Pembroke College. His principal interests are the literary aspects of the Qur’an. the Qur'an's engagement with Jewish and Christian traditions and with ancient Arabic poetry, as well as late antique Arabia and the life of Muhammad and many more very interesting things.
In this discussion we discuss different theories about the origin of the Qur'an in western scholarship and how to evaluate different approaches to the Islamic corpus.
You can find his recent book, The Qur'an: A Historical-Critical Introduction here: www.amazon.com/Quran-Historic...
I hope you enjoy the content on this channel and please remember to subscribe to this channel and like this video if you enjoyed it!
Mr. Reynolds, your broadcast is indeed praiseworthy and as a student of the history of the Qur'an, I learn a lot from your videos. Thank you very much.
Thank you!
Reynolds is an orientalist Christian missionary whose job is to attack Islam by making false claims that the Qur'an is an offshoot of the Bible. Be careful of him.
Gabriel is an orientalist clown, rely on your own Islamic tradition for history of Quran, not on this missionary.
Wow, these interviews are amazing. Thank you, Dr. Reynolds.
Thanks for your video and your kindness
Thank you for inviting Nicolai! I'd be very interested in listening to further interactions and conversations between you two.
Thanks 🙏🏻 professor Reynolds for ur exceptional scholarship, u and ur esteemed colleagues finally exploring and help us understand one of the least studied and very interesting areas in human history
Thank you for this nice talk with all the insights you have shared
Concerning 49:00, about the difficulty of accounting for Ethiopic loanwords in the Northern Hijaz. There was a port (Aila) in the North of the Hijaz for which there is evidence of intensive trade with Ethiopia, Yemen and further. Ports are known to be places where different cultures come together. In fact, it is a necessity to do trade. Could that explain some things?
Rewatching this episode. Great discussion and very informative. I am drawn to historical critical scholarship, much easier to find in Biblical studies (like Dr. Dale B. Martin’s Yale course from the early 2010s). These types of discussions and scholarship are invaluable for modern study and appreciation of the Qur’an. Thank you.
Read, "The History of The Quranic Text, from Revelation to Compilation - A Comparative Study with the Old and New Testament by Muhammad Mustafa Al-Azami" And you will learn more about the Quran from a REAL Muslim scholar than any of these charlatans of the Western academia.
Be careful of this orientalist Christian.
@@hassanmirza2392 Haha it’s only orientalist when it’s historical criticism about Islam huh. Let’s just appreciate scholarship, agree or disagree with the conclusions they make
First Sara revealed was probably Sura 67 Milk (along th Sura Fatiha).Though the commonly accepted tradition is that first five verses of 96 were the first revelation but verse 6 doesn't make sense as a subsequent revelation for it starts with the words: "Nay" which suggests it was an uninterrupted continuation of a conversation. Also regarding the order of verses in the mushaf Quran 75-16 tells the Prophetؐ that God will collect the verses, implying will set their order. And tradition has it that during the last two years, that' what was done during the life of the Prophetؑؐ۔
To me, as someone who has worked for years on the study of information theories, probability, and linguistics, the arrogance of these researchers to factually express their strange claims is surprising. For example, citing the dubious etymology of "Ommi", they conclude that its meaning is not illiterate and that it means "without scripture". They cannot appreciate the fact that, for example, in English, words like green, thick, and shallow, despite their etymology, can mean ignorant and illiterate. Or "Arrahman" is a name and not an attribute of God. Referring to the argument that God cannot have emotions from the point of view of anthropomorphism and ignoring the fact that the Quran speaks in the context of parables which should be understandable. And the most amusing is the conclusion on the chronology and the Meccan and Madinan suras, and curiously, with a meaningful and cynical smile, they express doubts about the very existence of Mecca.
They argue from bad faith. The starting position has baked in assumptions and then they follow from there to confirmation bias. I gave up on these Orientalists a long time ago. They constantly make outlandish claims (Crone, Luxenberg, Neuwirth, etc.) with little evidence and methodological errors. Once their nonsense is refuted, they double down or just move on to another jibe. Their irrelevance in the real world of Islamic studies in Muslim lands bothers them because they want Muslims to have doubts about their history and beliefs. Only naïve and feeble minds fall for their deceptions. The level of scholarship in Arabic absolutely demolishes them. They are oblivious to this fact as they don’t engage in contemporary research in Arabic. It’s just an echo chamber bouncing around one polished turd after another. Once you see it for what is, it’s pathetically funny.
There is no place in Mecca (SA) where the early muslims could have survived the blockade of the Quraish. There is such a place in Petra.
🤣@@amuthi1 kzhead.infogaming/emoji/7ff574f2/emoji_u1f617.png
When Nicolai began the interview by denying the critical studies & research of the Qur'an, they just turned listeners off. Knowing that his discussion will not be objective.
Hello, I disagree with Mr. Nicolai @1:00:30 he says according to the occurrences of the word 'Ummi' in the Quraan an 'Ummi' is someone who is not a member of the ahl al kitab, someone who is scriptureless, someone who is not privy to a scriptural revelation. In the Quraan 2:78 the ayah in surah al Baqarah is speaking about a group of people from bani Israel. Bani Israel are from ahl al kitab (people of the book), who have a scripture ( hence why they are called ahl al kitab - kitab - book - scripture) and have therefore received scriptural revelation (Torah). Aya 2:78 refers to the group as 'umiyoon' plural for 'Ummi' as explained by Mr. Reynolds @59:40. While the word 'Ummi' does have a variety of meanings it is clearly not accurate to say that from the Quranic perspective the word means scriptureless since there is at least one occurrence in which people with a scripture are referred to as the plural of 'Ummi'
In Jewish sources, the cognate means someone uneducated in Torah. It used to mean a gentile, but then the meaning changed. In the Quran, it has the meaning of a person without religious education.
Wishy Washy!!
But don't the asbab al nuzul stories exist independently and then get applied secondarily. I mean I guess some are phrased as being a response to a question but most seem Independent especially when at least al Wahidi gives multiple different stories for many ayat.
Why are you constantly mentioning Nöldeke but never (excuses if I have missed out on something) Goldziher?
That Hebrew word which Nicolas mentioned meets the Arabic word ummat and ummah which means nation in Arabic , but the word ummi comes from the word umm (mother in Arabic ) and it also means original source , umm Alqora is usually translated as mother of villages , the root sound of Umm is A Mo Ma ... Furthermore, amma is a verb of leading to a direction and intentional act , all those words comes from one root sound A Ma Ma, any way the letter M in Arabic means moving to a direction . both root sounds originated from the same basic letteral root A M M , always the root must be analyzed specially the middle letter if sounds Ma self acting the letter meaning ( in this case move to direction) , if Mo means was made to act , and if Me the the verb was acted on him/her or the letter meaning itself is disabled .
Gabriel interrupts Nicolai Sinai abruptly - and frequently. It’s important to be courteous as a host and allow the guest to talk …
Praise God, I can testify, the moment I gave my life to Jesus, everything turned for good. Because God is good. Experienced real miracles, also my believing husband did. His name is „gift of God“ and he literally is! All glory to Jesus Christ and God the father
Since Christians by the rise of Islam also viewed themselves as Israel, “ummi” could mean something like “goy.” I think Holger Zellentin discusses this in his new book, Law Beyond Israel.
@Exploring the Quran and the Bible please Shoemaker next :) and ask him some juicy critical questions!!
very likely to happen!
The use of the term and "al-Ummi الأُمّی" in the Quran, two alternatives: 1) al-Ummi الأُمّی : The one from Umm-ul-Qura أُمّ القُری (Mecca) 2) al-Ummi الأُمّی : Untutored - NOT illiterate! There has been a long debate on this within the Muslim world about the term and about him being illiterate or not. The division is very much along the Shi'a-Sunni split. The Shi'as REFUSE to accept that he was illiterate, unlike their Sunni counterparts, generally. But some Sunnis do accept that he was literate, in line with the Shi'a rivals! Islam as a reform movement has also been talked about in the Islamic world. The root of this goes back to the institution of "Hilf-ul-Fudhuul", that started when the Prophet was still a young lad and witnessed his uncles, Abbas ibn Abdil Muttalib and Abu Talib ibn Abdil Muttalib, plus others, take the lead to form this group! Sinai's suggestion of "unscriptured" is also interesting!
"Sinai's suggestion of "unscriptured" is also interesting!" It's not Sinai's. Even Muslim scholars noted this meaning centuries ago, commenting on Qur'an 3:20: Al-Tabari: وَالأميِّينَ } الذين لا كتاب لهم Al-Zamakhshari: { وَٱلاْمّيّينَ } والذين لا كتاب لهم من مشركي العرب Al-Baydhawi: ٱلأُمّيّينَ } الذين لا كتاب لهم كمشركي العرب Al-Razi: لأنه دخل كل من يدعي الكتاب تحت قوله { ٱلَّذِينَ أُوتُواْ ٱلْكِتَـٰبَ } ودخل من لا كتاب له تحت قوله { ٱلأمّيّينَ }
It can't be illiterate because in one of the earliest biographies of Muhammad by Ma'mur ibn Rashid 770AD it says "ʿAbd al-Razzāq, on the authority of Maʿmar, on the authority of al-Zuhrī, on the authority of ʿUbayd Allāh ibn ʿAbd Allāh ibn ʿUtbah, on the authority of Ibn Abbās, who said: When death came to take the Messenger of God, a number of prominent men were in his chamber, among them ʿUmar ibn al-Khaṭṭāb, and the Prophet said, “Draw near to me so that I may *write you* a testament, lest you go astray after my death.” But ʿUmar said, “The Messenger of God has been overtaken by pain, and you all have the Qurʾan. The Scripture of God is sufficient for us.” The household of the Prophet disagreed and began to dispute with one another. Among them was one who said, “Draw near so that the Messenger of God may *write his* testament for you, lest you go astray after he dies.” Among them was another who said what ʿUmar had said. When the foolish talk and disagreements around the Messenger of God became acute, he commanded, “Leave, all of you!”
What was stopping him from learning to read?
@@TheMagnificentGman there is no evidence in Muslim sources that he learnt how to read and write later on.
@@ConsideringPhlebas I refer to THIS video! Thank you!
Exploring Bible too.. Compare Codex Sinaiticus vs KJV for example.
I started yesterday within one min of upload and just now finished. Fitting Mr Sinai didn't have anything extra to say at end cause it was a long interview hah
Quran was transmitted both in text and in auditory form. When you hear Quran today, as long as the reciter adheres to the rules of Tajweed, you are hearing the Prophetؐ. The best way to explain how Quran was transmitted by analogy is to think about how you know your mother. You were too young to remember it. But everyone around you without any moments of gaps in your life confirms the lady you call your mother is your mother. Biblical sources were lost during Babylonian Exile, subsequently passed on for generations orally. Quran, while not poetry of its day, would be considered poetry today, at least in free form and more conducive to rot memorization (probably 200 million who have it memorized cover to cover today; attend a prayer and you'll notice if the Imam forgets there is some in the congregation that reminds him; if you change it by mistake, it doesn't sound right even for the layman). Plus Quran doesn't have to follow grammar; Arabic grammar was set by Quran. So, I wouldn't apply the same textual analysis to both scriptures.
Any chance of having Bart Ehrman on the channel or does critical scholarship only work for a Holy Book of a religion you are not apart off?
Bart Ehrman isn't the only Biblical scholar on the planet and there is a comment from GSR below that says the next interview is a New Testament scholar.
He has a scholar on the synoptic problem, also I am pretty sure dr Reynolds main field is within Islamic studies and theology. So it makes sense that he leans towards this. You can always watch other channels to see critical scholarship on the bible (mind you , bart is not the only biblical scholar out there)
He's literally a Islamic scholar.. and does have many biblical scholars on here. There are plenty of channels for biblical scholarship if you are interested...
Brother Sinai, you said at 40:20 that the statement at verse 7 of Sura Al-Imran (Q3:7) is "strikingly at odds with Qur'an's general insistence that God's word is clear, that Qur'an is clear". Verse 7 of Sura Al-Imran (Q3:7) states: aujubillahi minashaitanir rajim, bismillahir rahmanir rahim "Huwa allathee anzala AAalayka alkitaba minhu ayatun muhkamatun hunna ommu alkitabi waokharu mutashabihatun faamma allatheena fee quloobihim zayghun fayattabiAAoona ma tashabaha minhu ibtighaa alfitnati waibtighaa taweelihi wama yaAAlamu taweelahu illa Allahu waalrrasikhoona fee alAAilmi yaqooloona amanna bihi kullun min AAindi rabbina wama yaththakkaru illa oloo alalbabi" Translation: "He it is Who hath revealed unto thee (Muhammad) the Scripture wherein are clear revelations--They are the substance of the Book--and others (which are) allegorical. But those in whose hearts is doubt pursue, forsooth, that which is allegorical seeking (to cause) dissension by seeking to explain it. None knoweth its explanation save Allah. And those who are of sound instruction say: We believe therein; the whole is from our Lord; but only men of understanding really heed."(Piktal Quran Translation). Text, pronunciation and translation: www.alim.org/quran/compare/surah/3/7/ You are right that Allah Tayala has proclaimed that Allah made Qur'an easy to understand, examples are many, such as Q39:28; Q41:3 etc. But at the same time Allah Tayala has stated this foundational rule for the readers of the Qur'an as stated in Q3:7. You may not have noticed that it is not only at this verse that this rule is stated, consider verse 26 of Sura Bakara, bismillahir rahmanir rahim, "By it [similitude] He causes many to stray and many He leads into the right path" [quoted in part, Yusuf Ali Quran Translation, ibid]
Beware of the stabbers
NICOLAI SINAI IS STRUGGLING TO ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS & GABRIEL IS TOO POLITE!
Please elaborate?
What about ما كان محمد ابا احدا من رجالكم ? Doesn’t the past tense verb ما كان clearly indicate that it was written after Muhammad’s death?
Past tense in Arabic can be used to refer to present people. The Quran itself has a prophetic tone it can use past tense to refer to future events as well.
Fluid tenses are common in the Semitic languages as a rhetorical tool. See all the verses referring to the end of the world in the present tense.
Mr. Reynolds should also do a podcast on the fabrications included in the New Testament. How come in the first three Gospels Jesus himself is not claiming to be divine. 5800 NT manuscripts have enormous errors and fabrications.
Of course he is. Just because you're an ummi doesn't mean he doesn't make many divine claims.
@@toomanymarys7355 You yourself are a jahil ummi, who does not know that in synoptics Jesus never claims to be God. Bart Ehrman and John Barton has pointed this out many times. Protestant scholarship has exposed lies of Paul the apostate. Ever heard of the fabrication of Johannine Comma in Textus Receptus?
Does Jesus need to claim divinity for it to be true?
@@IsraeliteDefense Evil Chosen People
Little doubt that the synoptics think jesus is divine.
هولاء المستشرقون لا يبحثون عن الحقيقة و لكن هم لهم اعتقادات مسبقة معادية للاسلام و يستخدمون لغة البحث العلمي و التزييف و التحريف لاثبات تلك المعتقدات, و هم لا يختلفون في شئ عن الاسلوب الذي اتبعته الفرق الباطنية عبر التاريخ الاسلامي بتفسيراتها المنحرفة للنصوص لتأكيد معتقداتهم, ولذا تجد هولاء المستشرقون يستشهدون باقوال الفرق المنحرفة الباطنية او غلاء الشيعة و لا يهتمون كثيراً من مصادر الاسلام الاصلية, فالمسلمون يتبعون الدليل و هولاء المستشرقون يتبعون الهوي, و لا يعملون بالقاعدة التي بني عليها علماء الاسلام العلم الاسلامي و هي "اذا كنت مدعياً فالدليل, و ان كنت ناقلاً فالصحة" اي اذا كنت تدعي شيئاً فعليك اثباته بالدليل المناسب له سواء كان دليل عقلي او تجريبي او احصائي مرصود, و ان كنت تنقل خبر عن النبي عليه الصلاة و السلام او شئ عن اخبار الغيب او الاسلام فعليك اثبات صحة النقل بتقديم سلسلة الاسانيد و عرض الكلام علي اصول المسلمين العقدية والفقهية و استخدم علوم الحديث في بحثها اما لقبولها او دحضها, هولاء المستشرقون يستخدمون الاساليب الادبية و تحليل النصوص غيرها التي استخدموها في دراسة الاناجيل ثم يجمعونها مع شذرات من مخطوطات مشكوك فيها و يفترضون قصة او رواية ثم ينسجون احداث خيالية و بناء حبكة قصصية و تغليفها بلغة البحث العلمي للتلبيس علي عقول الناس, و من اراد فهم نصوص الاسلام فعليه دراسة و استخدام علوم اللغة العربية مثل اعمال التفتازاني و عبد القاهر الجرجاني وعلوم اصول الفقه و الدين و من اراد دراسة صحة مصادر الاسلام فعليه دراسة علوم الحديث, وغير ذلك من الاساليب فهي علوم زائفة لا طائل منها
المصادر الاسلامية مليئة بالقصص والروايات والاحداث الخيالية، لم يكونوا علماء ولم تكن تعنيهم الدقة..هؤلاء أساتذة بالجامعات يمتهنون التفكير ولا يستمع لهم الكثيرون ولا يضيرهم لو فلان أو علان دخل أو خرج من دينه، هذه من أوهام العرب فقط
@@Sallyy150 قولك ذلك يعني انك لا تفهمين منهجية البحث العلمي في العلوم الانسانية التي يتبعها هولاء, و لا تفهمين دراسات الكتاب المقدس في كتبهم و كيف تم صنعها و لا تفهمين تحيزاتهم, علماء الاسلام استخدموا ما يسمي بعلوم الحديث و الاستدلال بالادلة علي حسب موضوعها اذا كان عقلي او تجريبي او مشاهدة او سمعي
Learnt nothing whatsoever from this ramble !
I have better morals than mohommed.
Quran being explored.. what about the bible?..Not worth exploring?
No. The Bible is boring.
The bible has been proven the Quran has no legs to stand on!
Well if the claim it's the literal word of God than I think it should be more important to explore? No?
He has other episodes where he explores the bible
What are you talking about? There a whole department dedicated to biblical studies in every major universities or institutions. This channel is focusing on Quranic studies, why should they talk about other topics? Base on your logic then they should start talking about Buddhism, Hinduism too? Hell why not politics or economic also? Beside many videos already discuss about biblical topics so whats the issue here?
The more I listen to these "Quran Scholars" and their methodology the more nonsensical I find their arguments and methods.
nice thanks for your input 👍
This shows the lack of consensus among western scholars on the Quran.
kzhead.info/sun/dcOlZLR6ammLhac/bejne.html what about it
@@IbnAlHimyari this is such a weird Rhetorical point. There's rarely ever a real consensus on every aspect on the origins of a religion in history.
Maybe you are not intelligent enough to understand
Sad episode of intellectually dishonest speculations - lot of alt-facts without any background evidence