John Lindell SLAMS Mark Driscoll for Sinful Behavior During Sermon (Lessons for Pastors)
Unfortunately, this conflict has continued and the aftermath from the 2024 Stronger Men's Conference has gotten messier.
Much has transpired between Mark Driscoll and John Lindell (and his family) since the conference wrapped up.
In this video, I'll show you what happened and pull out some important lessons for us to consider.
The full message from James River Church's Wednesday service: • Video
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There should have never been a pole dance on the stage in the first place.
What a shame Lil John doesn’t see an alter only a stage and opportunity to grab money. No way such an abomination will lead any one to repentance and redemption on a WWE circus platform. Holy Spirit definitely not being allowed to enter. And apparently Mark was there for his portion They are both poster boys for how far from His Holy Word humanity has traveled. Those church member should be afraid. Very afraid. Most of them know there is nothing Godly in the event and the circumstances that arose as a result of the pole dancer opening
kzhead.info/sun/odilnsaMbWd9jGw/bejne.htmlsi=Ax6NbD_RH442toak
Exactly!
And the guy took off his shirt for " safety purposes " while climbing the pole😮
yeah james river church is an example of so many large watered down effeminate community social clubs. where instead of word they want entertainment.. instead of wholesome bread, they want cotton candy christianity. they want good music for an hour to sing along to and maybe 1 verse out of the bible put into a practical self help incite.
I did not hear Lindel publicly apologize for anything he said or did. I think he needs to be the one to repent.
That’s because narcissists never apologize
I was thinking the same thing!!
That’s because there was nothing wrong with having an acrobat perform. Y’all are losing it.
@@1bbbbbaaaaa That's not what I was referring to, although that should've never been at a Christian conference.
John Lindell says Alex has been a Christian for five years. There are pictures of him dancing with half naked women and meditating to Buddha just 5 months ago
Shame on all the Christian men for staying at the conference after the queer show.
Exactly Charles 💯 ❤
Lukewarm Christians and apostate churches love entertainment and secular company. James River Church appears to fulfill both obligations.
Ya 10000 men love queer shows. Or ..maybe you weren't there and you're a duped fool?
Exactly! How will John know the men were not pleased if they don't tell him or ask for a refund.
EXACTLY!!!!
John has not apologized for the pole performer!!! That's who needs to repent. John's pride is in the way.
Gay pride all over this
@@laurabennett2420 I bet
@@laurabennett2420 Yep, John has aligned himself with rainbow-ism. Mark called out the Pole guys act. Then John says he himself is anointed and is above correction and used Elisha verses concerning the Bears attacking those who mock him and it's better to say nothing against the anointed. So of course if Mark gets attacked it will look like it was due to Mark called out the Pole guy. You already know where this is going, as you said!
@Winterstonecalling Exactly right ! !
That guy John seems like he serves Satan and not Got!
John Lindell was out of order for this, from the sword swallowing act, to the public reading of personal/private text messages. This was very manipulative
Thats what Jezebel spirit does. She’s manipulative
Indeed, J.L. claims "come to me first", but then exposes the privacy of when M.D. does come to him.... Why does this Video Content Creator even have these private text messages to spread to the world???
YES!! Exactly!! Thank you for stating this.
Pastor Mark definitely did the right thing and called out. In yesterday’s service, he took the high road. He started the new series. Sitting in service people were waiting and not once was a single word mentioned.
I'm here after 9:30 James River circus page he keeps pointing at mark, blaming him the level of deflecting John was doing, not humble! Convinces me he is too scared of admitting he enjoys that type of male entertainment 🤔
This is what public character assassination looks like. The fact that John Lindell quoted Matthew 18:15 at the beginning of this and now he airs it for the world. Not a single word about the original issue. No responsibility taken for his own actions. It’s quite sickening.
Exactly!!
Thankfully we know to completely avoid John Lindell. Another pastor added to the list of gaslighting narcissistic pastors to mark and avoid
Agreed
Agreed
i think John likes people to grovel!! I think john needs to get saved
As Christians, we are to avoid every appearance of evil. This was a horrible decision for the Christian mens conference.
Nothing good could result from that nonsense. What type 'discipling' takes place at lindellz house of horrors. There is more likely a ton of hidden perversion
IMO.
🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻 you said it
He didnt have to go to the pastor first, the pastor allowed a male stripper on stage publicly and was then reprimanded publicly
Pride of man is horrible thing and compromise is horrible
John Lindell needs to do 3 things: #1. Apologize for allowing a male pole dancer at a men’s conference. #2. Apologize to Mark Driscoll for slandering him. #3. Repent of his prideful deeds.
He won't, John is part of the Bill Johnson (Bethel) camp. Any time he's called out he pulls the "I'm anointed" card.
..........and 4. Quit his Sunday job.
Amen, and Amen! 🙏
You and the replies here are right on point. Resign John.
This is BS! Mark did the right thing. He should not retreat from the truth.
Amen
Amen
When is John Lindell is going to apologize for the weird freak show, Former Gay stripper climbing up a pole, licking and sticking a sword down his throat, then doing an upside down crucifix. Seems as if Marks mistake was pulling back on his public rebuke of Lindell or the organizers of this event because of his personal friendship and love for Lindells family. When is John Lindell going to apologize for making Marks observation/ admonition about him personally rather than the admonition to the congregation and to the coordinators of the event. Now John Lindell is publicly, throwing Mark under the bus for all to see because of his private calls and voicemails. I’m very suspect of this pastor John Lindell. Now he’s rushing before his church to cover his own butt in self preservation mode. All the while he’s slandering Mark. All the while Mark chose to remain silent publicly, after the initial statement on stage.
This John is a closet gay this proves it
Where are you there? Do you think it’s possible that you don’t have all the facts straight?
@@billgreen4173that stripper was sexy as all get out.. maybe he shouldn’t be a stumbling block for Christians to struggle with. Any one struggling with that kind of sin is trying to become closer to God and instead is offered up a half naked attractive man performing on a pole. Tell me what facts I’ve left out. That I have struggled with just images. At a “church” event. This makes people want to avoid church it makes church a mockery
@isaacpena9214 you are spot on! I watch this guys first coverage of this and he was on point… but now he’s off in left field. I can accept if people disagree with this but it seems like both Jon and this video are avoiding the actual issue of what’s happened and how Jon is literally going opposite what he called Mark out on. Just sayin’
Exactly!!!! And like this video maker said Mt 18 is used when someone sins against you privately, but the male stripper was a public event and therefore pastor Mark was right to publicly shame the event, just like Jesus when he saw people selling and started throwing over tables, he didnt go “privately” to the organizer NO hejust started shaming the event once and for all!!!!!! Whats good is good and whats bad is bad!!!!!!!
I’m worried about John Lindell. Something is seriously wrong. I am praying for God to open his eyes to His truth. I am also praying for all those who listen to him preach, that they will not be deceived by his false doctrine. This is a very serious situation.
Yeppers
Agreed I always respected him as a good expositor of Gods word. Something has changed over the past several years
@@LL-wz7jeit started with the writing books and conferences, then the abundance of speakers of such ill reputations and scandals streaming in to collect speaking fees…but when his cancer came back, something broke and he started drifting further from the gospel to a point I could no longer deny that James River had be come a goat farm.
I'm more concerned for the people sitting under his spiritual guidance.
@@jba1999 and rightly so… many of us left when it was obvious that James River had become a goat farm and was just making merchandise of the congregation
Mark should have stood his, dusted off his sandals and left all that nonsense behind
Yes, right. He still can.
Yeppers
Exactly
100%
This is 100% wrong on Lindell’s part. He takes zero responsibility for his poor decision on this ridiculous performance, for so rudely talking the way he did to Pastor Mark who is supposedly his good “friend” & to continually trash Pastor Mark but yet we who have eyes to see and ears to hear knows this is just Lindell’s way of deflecting his unholy actions and attitude. Lindell needs to look in the mirror and check his walk with our Lord
As a mental health professional, I can safely say that this man has a lot of narcissistic traits. I can’t ethically diagnose him with narcissism, but that would be the first thing I would assess him for in therapy. Based on these behaviors. Of course, if he actually has narcissism, he probably would never go to therapy because he’s never wrong. And now this is what we call a “smear campaign“ when you dare to challenge a narcissist. Mark would be best off creating very healthy boundaries and never speaking to him or his family again. And it’s not over. This man is just getting started. if he actually has narcissism, he will begin to try to destroy Mark behind the scenes. Very scary that he’s been a pastor all this time.
Lindell says I love you? Wow thank Jesus I don't love like that!
We'll see
No interresst in what God is saying? No insight in spiritual things? Does anibody know JESUS?? Who understands Matth. 7,3+21-23. Its a fearful thing!!!!!!
I agree with your professional opinion.
@@bekahwalker9325 Thank you. I appreciate that.
I do not know who Mark Driscoll is, and I do not know who John Lindell is. They are not teachers I follow. I became aware of this situation through Dailywire. That being said, after watching all 3 of your videos on this issue I can say this. Mark is 100 % in the right. He did not call out John for sin. He called out everyone at the conference. Saying WE ALREADY have the Jezebel spirit here in OUR CONFERENCE. WE and OUR include Mark. Is there no sensitivity to men who may be at their conference who might be struggling with their sexuality? Do they not know that a slang term for a homosexual man can be "sword swallower"? John immediately cut him off and removed Mark, and the message God gave him for the conference from the platform. The Jezebel spirit is at work in James River Church, and it starts off with John himself. The demon crying out when it is put on display. No different then the demon crying out when Jesus was in the synagogue. Mark did what was right see Galatians 2:11-21 of Paul calling out Peter PUBLICLY. Mark should not have apologized as Paul does not apologize to Peter. However, after a brief investigation into Mark I can understand why he did with the whole Mars Hill deal. Also, John should be the one repenting for making public private conversations with Mark. Mark is reaching out to them to try to correct something he sees as going wrong with James River Church. Even if John does not agree, all he has to do is say thank you Mark for your concern, and thank you for your prayers. In Marks conversation with David, Mark is right. Something is wrong at James River. Enmeshment is going on between John and his sons. Notice John is the one addressing Mark from the pulpit not David. There is a mixture of sinful and scared in the church. See the opening act of a sword swallowing half naked pole dancing man. I do not agree that they are still being blessed by God. I believe they are maintaining through their own ability without God, and I expect this church or at least it's leadership will fall soon. I would agree that there is something wrong with a pastor who can watch a rehearsal of that act to open this conference and not know there is something wrong with it, which apparently Brandon Lindell did. John told his son David watch Mark you are going to see John the Baptist, who was a prophet in the spirit of Elijah, and that is what John got, except he couldn't stand the prophets message, and offered up a personal attack instead of taking to heart what the prophet received from God to give to that church for it's correction.
Excellent point.
Fantastic comment 💎
I never knew this "code word" for such. Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
Very true!
Absolutely agree! 👍🏻
Here's the core of the matter: Was the lewd display at the men's conference a moral good in the eyes of Christ? No. Who should be apologizing then? Clearly Lindell, who repeatedly has doubled down on a childishly irresponsible "you messed up my party so now I'm mad" mentality. This reminds me of middle school. What a joke.
Shame in the Kingdom! I repented from seeing this garbage and they need to repent for not stopping it!
Yes! Very childish!
John is so full of Pride he can’t see what HE’S done to his long time friend & his Church…not to mention his Son…Satan always pleads his case to cover & distract, Period. This is absurd behavior
Lindell should have never done this in his Wednesday night service.
Where should he have done it?
He shouldn’t have done this at all. This is utterly worldly behaviour. This is trying to justify himself. The name of Jesus Christ is not honoured by this man, quite the opposite and it’s terrifying. No fear of the Almighty and Holy God. God cannot be mocked like this. This man should repent with trembling, while he can. ✝️
@@noahcallaway7574 no where. Between him and mark. Lindell got mad about what mark did at the event, then turns around and does the same thing in public. While situation is a mess
He won’t recover from this insanity!
Let Lindell’s church be shut down in Jesus Name.
What is shocking is John's mega church is agreeing and clapping on the suggestion that Mark is at fault and need to apologize! OMG! Really? This church agrees there is nothing wrong having a pole entertainment for ministering in God's sanctuary. Breaks my heart beyond words.
This is the herd mentality… following a person instead of Truth 😢
Been to that church and know many attendees. They are brainwashed sheep and very worldly! Reminds me of Elevation. Horrible churches! Clones!
@@HisFeet3 Cult culture.
I know that freaked me out too. They have to be brain washed. The lack of wisdom at this church is astounding. Praying God opens there eyes.
Exactly
So why is Lindell bringing his whole congregation into this? Why has he not repented of what he chose to do at the conference? Why is he spending so much time defending himself? This tells me there is something not right with Lindell. He is not humble and he is not repentant ?
Narcissists do not say sorry! They play the victim. They have to be in charge at all times. I don't think Lindell will ever forgive Mark. His anger will continueto fester. I'm an expert with them. I was married to one for 40 years.
You could feel the arrogant and wrong spirit controlling pastor lindell when he hollered at driscoll
Pride is terrible thing to waste!!!😢
Definitely, I felt the spirit moving and when people started leaving I felt the Holy Spirit around the room protecting some of us as the spirit of pride moved around the room, the worship team came on and I had a peace come over me and God truly called me to a deeper place of reliance in that moment, the Holy Spirit told me something that I felt was God and now I can see his truth clearly.
John Lindell is playing victim for allowing disgrace at his event. Mark called it! And John didn’t know what to do! Insert foot in mouth. Jezebel Spirit at work and is causing division. It is no one person!
Here we go again call good what is bad and call bad what is good, that is not the gospel is Hollywood and John Lindell should be the one to repent, but now is the Victim, how stuped is that
Agreed
I too agree
This is a shameful publicity stunt!!!! If you go to a church where the pastor can’t apologize when they have clearly made an error ……..RUN 🏃♂️🏃♂️🏃♂️ That person is leading you astray.
YES
Just left one just like it! Run!
“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. Therefore by their fruits you will know them.” Matthew 7:15, 20
Amen to this
Amen
Who should apologize and repent, Mark Driscoll or John Lindell?? Who paid a male to perform on a pole and place a sword down his throat?? How is this, Godly?? The only one Pastor Driscoll needs to listen to OR repent to is God.
AMEN !!!!!!!
What's wrong with gymnastics or swallowing a sword? Why does everybody take it to sexual ideas? The performer should've just kept his shirt on. Both these men seem focused on themselves & access to Church coffers.
Amen. And sword swallowing is actually demonic if you study it out. And stripper poles Have been used since biblical times.
How does Driscoll need to repent?
John gaslighting this whole service …taking it publicly but didn’t let mark speak 🗣️ on stage .. ignored the sword licking conversation entirely.
Yep.....the sword licking was the epitome of the whole thing...,..the audience agreed with Mark..... You can see the unrighteous steward all over this.
It just sounds like Lindell is trying to save face and say how he's totally vindicated and right and has no reason to repent, and it's all on Mark Driscoll. It could have been handled better on both sides, but I think it starts with Lindell allowing the pole dancer's performance to begin with. It just goes downhill from there.
I do believe the Holy Spirit was the one that prompted Mark to say that. That is why he couldn’t help but say the truth!
I don’t think the he said, he said stuff matters. I think Lindell is using all this nonsense to try and escape from the fact that he had a performance at the men’s conference that was completely unacceptable to Our Lord. Maybe Mark does have issues that he needs to deal with too … we all do. But what happened at that men’s conference lead by John Lindell was seriously not acceptable. Stop passing the buck, and acting like you are Holy …
This whole situation is unbelievable to me! We love Pastor Mark, He is a Holy Spirit filled man. Not perfect, but full of humility, grace and truth! And obviously, not many people want Truth. I listen to this ridiculous message last night, just for information. I was blown away with this! It was about everything else but John. Also, talked about Marks spiritual advisor Jimmy Evens. Whom we love, and are very familiar with. Now, I didn’t hear a thing about John’s spiritual advisory. Maybe I missed that part. I also couldn’t wait for Pastor Marks message on Wed night. And I got, just what I expected from Pastor Mark. Didn’t say one thing about John.
Character assassination in public. Question to answer is why Mark D continues his association with this John character? John is clearly not for the cause of Christ nor for the Kingdom of God. It’s all about him. Flee from such ‘teachers’ or ‘pastors’, absolute ravening wolves.
He's already been disqualified from Church leadership long ago.
No, it's not settled. It's a hot mess. I watched the Wednesday service. I felt sick to my stomach.
John lindell: Repent for the kingdom of God is at hand! You John needed to be rebuked publicly since that despicable abhorrent act was done in public. Ask yourself John if Jesus had been there. What do you think He would have said or done???
No doubt! ✊
that's right! i agree. also, if that was allowed in public, there's probably a lot of rot hidden elsewhere in that community or at least the leadership.
That only needs to be rebuked but he needs to be removed
CIRCUS ACTS BELONG IN THE CIRCUS, NOT IN THE CHURCH. The problem with certain pastors/churches is that instead of keeping there gatherings Holy and Righteous, they have decided to bring the ways of the world into the house of God. Because Mark spoke out, I believe that others will think twice before bringing CIRCUS ACTS to the house of God/gatherings. Many churches have fallen into things that shouldn't happen in the pursuit of Holy and Righteousness
I’m really shocked to the fact that Pastor John not once said that the whole entertainment was wrong. Has he apologize for anything. Very concerning
I see that too. Nothing holy about this opening act. This man is said to be a ex stripper.. but Jeremiah Johnson posed pictures of him practicing new age/ Buddhist practices 5 months ago. Any non worldly man or woman would say this was inappropriate Just admit it and move on
Your take here is off. Youre trying to bring up Marks past is a mistake. Youre skipping right over the severety of pastor johns sinful behavior. Pastor mark didnt do anything wrong. Pastor john is fueled with pride and anger and ego. Pastor john also lies in this sermon. Pastor john should repent ans step down. Hes done.
Thank you for your observation and I feel the same!
Agreed! I felt almost confused watching this video coverage compared to his first video coverage. 🤔 I think his focus is off from the actual crime happening here. Hate that with the first video being on point..
that's right.
I dont think bringing up Mark's past is necessary. I would assume as a chrisitian and a pastor he has matured in his walk. Assuming if he was wrong now (which i dont think he was), that he would refuse to repent now because he wouldnt repent before is ridiculous. We cant throw out his rebuke because of his past. Lindell should repent for leading his flock astray. God will deal with spiritual leaders more harshly for leading his sheep astray.
That was so wrong. It has nothing to do with the issue and love keeps no record of wrongs.
You are 100% right ,plus we all have a sinful past , he speaks like a prideful man
@@paulmerritt2484 amen! love keeps no record of wrongs.
Driscoll has never repented for his many sins and injustices. The Bible stands against unrepentant people and in particular unrepentant Christian leaders.
WOW…Reading all these comments is giving me great HOPE ABOUT THE **TRUE** BODY OF CHRIST!!! My love and prayers are with you all, precious family in Jesus!!!🕊✝️💞
yes. the body of Christ is wonderful thing. you should maybe consider having believers over at your place for a bible study or something... i got fed up with the large effeminate social club churches and starting inviting folks over to go through books of the bible together and it has been something i look forward to every week! where 2 or more are gathered in his name... boom church. :)
I thought the same thing! 🙌
John Lindell was sure quick to throw Mark under the bus. Im no fan of Mark mind you, but if John so quickly can make a statement like "enmeshment to mark means anyone that doesn't agree with Mark", that's a pretty low opinion. I ask then why did John invite Mark to speak? We're seeing the immaturity of contemporary christian leadership all over the place. From how KC IHOP is handling the scandal, to how the rock star leaders of Driscoll and Lindell are dragging each other. I say DISQUALIFIED!
That was definitely a petty remark as he was going through the conversation.
John Lindell is in CYA mode. Self preservation mode, self righteous, proud, un loyal, and downright manipulating and using of scripture for his own personal reasons. He needs to repent!
This act at the conference should have been to an empty audience. I can’t believe the men didn’t walk out. Also why was the stadium filled the next day. I would have abandoned that conference
Exactly my point! People pray to get the opportunity to defend CHRIST and when it happens .. they deny him! How ironic history repeats itself in different time! I’m more upset with the men than the performer and the church leaders!!
Exactly my thoughts
Lindell is SUCH A HYPOCRITE!!
Never heard of him and don’t care if I ever hear him again! Mark is a man after Gods heart and full of problems but is still Kingdom Minded and praying that there’s a quick recovery for Mark!
PASTOR LINDEL NEEDS TO REFLECT AND REPENT AND APOLOGIZE FOR BETTER JUDGEMENTS. Instead of attacking Pastor Mark, Pastor Lindel needs to address the issue of allowing the UNGODLY CIRCUS act to take place. I can see the spirit of WOKENESS that Pastor Lindel allowed in
@josephcatsanche YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT! WELL SAID!
@@robinl6659 We all need to take a stand against the enemy that is infiltrating our churches/gatherings. Let us stand together and pray for those that are called to teach and lead, that they would put on the full armor of God. That they recognize these are the last days and the enemy is out seek to kill steal and destroy as many as he can.
It was totally inappropriate to have this guy fo what he did, and Pastor Lindell used Two verses out of context .
This is why I do not want to attend these events. Forget the sword swallowing what about the monster trucks??? Is it really necessary to appeal to men as though they are children?
trucks might not be great but they aren't harmful the performer could have been a stumbling block to any Christian that had homosexual tendencies and is (rightly so) resisting them.
Im a Mark Driscoll fan. I have been a fan for about 2 months and I dont care what happened before I started following him. If I hear something that is against the word of Yah. I think Mark was trying to a peacemaker in light of processing what happened. Lindell is completely wrong..then using his pulpit to slander Marc Driscoll is so out of line. Marc has not slandered Lindell,hes not said anything publicly about it. Pastor Mark should have dusted off his sandals on the way out of the door. All of those NAR ministries should go away,they are apostate and hurt true believers seeking truth. When they realize there wont be a pre-trib rapture and they will actually fight and possibly die for their savior,well then..they will fall and drink from the same cup of Judas.
The striptease sword ‘artist’ performing in a Christian setting was the first joke. Now we’re being confronted with catty pastors. Another reason to avoid these supermarket churches.
Lindell was over the whole conference. He should have researched the stripper and what his act was . Lindell was in the wrong. Matthew scripture did not apply to this situation because it was public to everyone. He didn’t apologize" 😡
From what I've seen in the previous posts they already knew,if Lindells son auditioned the performance before they brought him there.
I believe that John Lindell is in error. This "entertainment" was totally inappropriate!!
Should we even have "entertainment" at any gathering in the Lord's name?
@@ILovePuzzles7 Would Apostle Paul provide entertainment? I think it's inappropriate.
Shameful behavior from John Lindell. 🥴
What person wants an apology? This is childish and all about pride. Pastor John needs to repent and admit his errors and move on. He is doing a terrible job of gaslighting and he is doing it publicly. I pray he see's it humbly and repents. This can still be a win and huge blessing!
lindell cannot see it... remember Jesus saying he also came so that those who think they can see are made blind. like a political pharisee, he cares more about power, etc than King Jesus.
I do not attend this church and will not. I did not attend the event and i will not attend others. What i know is what i have seen on media and it is embarrassing. The dirst time i saw the pole dancer portion i was thunking what is the purpose of auch crap. Regardless of a peraons past we who believe the word of God are called to call out sin for what it is. I believe marks intent was genuine and not malicious. This ia not how i would like the city where i live remembered. Jamea river is who needs to repent.
Yeppers
If Pasror Driscoll would have just left and not apologize for doing God's will and calling out the Jezebel spirit. Amazing how they are trying to change the script.
Then I went to the James River Church page, and the graphic on the homepage read "Pastors John and Debbie Lindell". Women can't be Pastors. Pastor's Wife is not a Biblical Office. Once I saw that, all I needed to know.
This is not a red flag, this is
Shows what they believe . 😢
Pastor Mark has NOTHING TO REPENT OF OR APOLOGIZE FOR
Except for saying at the table with John, “maybe it was just me...” John has chosen the world over Christ and that the “maybe it was just me” comment by Mark makes me think that maybe he chose Johns’ friendship and church affiliation over Him too. Now, the devil will have a hay day in both men’s lives. It’s ironic, but it seems that John and his church leadership is the “Jezebel” in all this, but Mark is the “Ahab”, and at some point, Mark, friendship or not, you’re going to have to stand up and get up off your knees and say, John, you’re wrong!
"stronger men's conference"????!!!! what a joke, when apostle Peter was wrong apostle Paul rebuked him openly!!!Gal. 2:11" But when Peter came to Antioch, I opposed him in public, because he was clearly wrong." what happened to the fear of the Lord with these 'strong' men???!!!
Excellent point!
You think they fear God with entertainment like that? An open rebuke is better than secret love. Proverbs 27:5
that is right! i agree.
How is John going to cite a passage about not airing dirty laundry and then devote part of a sermon to airing dirty laundry?
I had never heard of Mark Driscoll and didn't know anything about his past. But, here's a thought. Despite whatever Mark didn't get right in the past, perhaps he got this right. Just view the comments through several videos about this. The majority of the people are alarmed and disgusted that they allowed a performance like that at a Christian conference. I'm not excusing anything Mark may have done in the past, because I don't know about that. But, I believe it is wrong for John Lindell to use Mark's past to discredit his concern about that creepy performance. John and his family are not bringing truth about Alex. A KZheadr did thorough research about this man and there is nothing that indicated he is a believer on his social media. He does have a music video that he uploaded a couple months ago where he is sitting in a garden of stone Buddha gods. He is sitting there practicing eastern meditation and appears to be in an Asian country. I don't think the Lindells are willing to realize this man may claim to be Christian or even thinks he's christian, but he's entrenched in eastern mystic practices.
Alex put out a video I believe Thursday correcting all the things John claimed about him! It's sad no one took the time to actually witness to Alex the performer but he sure being used! Shameful!😢
Dude you can't tell this guy is lying? The whole thing is made up character assassination. And anyone who reads text messages at the pulpit like this is a disgrace. He's definitely making up most of this and the fact that he's pretending to read personal messages and phone calls - what an embarrassment and disgrace to real Christian men and the pulpit everywhere.
I asked why not scree shot the messages instead of typing them out? No one was on the call but David? All we have is a one-sided story! Yesterday, Sunday service he apologized for inviting Mark and the sword swallower! That's it and it was the shortest message I've ever heard! Also the whole Lindell family, all 5 ran the service yesterday!
Lindell pulled out the "you should have spoken to me privately first" defence... except that defence only works if you sinned against your brother IN PRIVATE. What Lindell did and allowed was not just in public of his own church, but broadcast to an even wider public audience. It was a PUBLIC sin and a PUBLIC offence, meaning the response has to be quick AND PUBLIC. Peter, Paul, and the other writers of the New Testament didn't follow the "go to your brother privately" rule when they were addressing Churches of sins being committed publicly IN and BY churches. They simply addressed them, admonished them, and dealt with it. Lindell is the paster of that church, and he allowed that sinful behaviour: he gets publicly dressed down. He does NOT get to hide behind what he said. He needs to repent, and since he's now mishandled his authority as a pastor, maybe even step down from holy orders and never be given church authority again. There are consequences and whilst there is forgiveness if he is repentant, he has very likely lost his anointing. But that last is up to God and the leading of the Holy Spirit.
Jesus is removed from a conference, Jezebel is inserted and two pastors are worried about themselves and don’t give a rats azz about thousands of men scratching their heads!
Sorry to say it but these two pastors see $$$$$$$ and not 👨👱🏽♂️🧔🏼♂️👨🏻🦰👴👨🏻🦳 We as men need to focus on Jesus and not their garbage they call Christian Life!
No, Mark has not come out and slandered John. But John is doing a full on character assassination
Don't throw the baby out with the bath water...
Only one person is being attacked. The spirit of God is not in control of this so called pastor Lindell.
Mark kinda folded and just thought he should have left the conference and took a week to think about and pray about thousands of men who were confused about decisions that John made for them!
Never apologize for speaking the truths of God and His ways
"There is a mixture of the sinful and the sacred". Yup,spot on. Instead of being defensive, take that on board and do something about it, Pastor.
- Who in that church would go up to the leadership and complain? They just saw how John Lindell in action - and the culture is everyone claps and supports the pastor. You say anything, you will be accused of sowing division, undermining leadership and not being supportive. - The issue with Driscoll sowing division in the Lindell family would not be an issue (about family) if nepotism was not so prolific in large churches - instead it would have been Driscoll going to a leader, outlining issues with another leader.... - To think the entertainment would not be a stumbling block to some, or controversial to others, is so unwise. What were they trying to appeal to? Have the Lindells apologised for their unwise choices? Driscoll has his own responsibilities. - Driscoll is a useful deflection for the Lindells. Then, John Lindell stating how much he loves Mark Driscoll?..... not very believable, just seems like false virtue signalling/hypocrisy. - Always be guarded about someone whose first response is to attack when called out or an issue related to them is raised.
Absolutely
I just saw that James River Church is deleting all the comments on that video that dont agree with that preacher. There were a LOT of people who were standing up for righteousness and calling out pastor Lindell and almost all of those comments are gone!! All thats left are comments that praise him and his church. This is a deceptive church!!!
Not only was the decision to have a pole dancer unwise at the very least, but the whole point is how as a speaker, unaware of the pole dancer, Mark Driscoll was now guilty of the Jezabel spirit by association along with all the other speakers. This entire show is sickening for the Church but God only knows how it will play out for His Glory. If I were God, and I am not, I would shut down James River church and fire anyone and everyone involved in absolutely disgusting decisions. John Lindell needs to REPENT of his own decisions.
This is the falling away of immoral spiritual leaders. You're not men of God.
Two wrongs don’t make any of this garbage right! It stinks to High Heaven and is an embarrassment to the men of God who face a real devil every day while you guys plan your next deception!
The Truth is here to shine a light on the people that are false and their misdeeds. It is what we have been praying for ,,,,
What kind of person shares that stuff, especially about his sons, publicly!!
💯
I think John needs to repent. He seems very proud and wants everyone to know everything Mark said. What John did was not right and he knows it but is to proud to admit it. He certainly has his church people supporting him. 😂
Your boy John didn’t accept much needed correction either. He was very much in the wrong and his ego did not allow any type of conviction. I don’t know much about either one of these guys but they both seem foolish to me
This phone call manuscript was based on what was remembered and construed, not from an audio recording. I thought Lindell was just off base. Now I think he's actually evil. So sad.
Please stop giving this John Lindell. airtime. I’m not interested in hearing what he’s got to say.
He is a fraud
John Lindell, guess what; something is wrong at your church buddy. You're defending it. I only thought I was a failure when leading as a pastor. Apparently I needed to see that other pastors are seriously flawed. From one hypocrite to another, you need to evaluate yourself Lindell.
John really that whatever you wanted to call it . Should of never been . Ask yourself what would jesus of done walking in on a freak show. This has no business in the church. And at a Mens conference .
If the entertainment with sexual undertones had not been invited none of this would of happened. Lindell needs to ask himself what he missed.
Lindell weaponizes "Matthew 18" (wrongfully) to others, yet he himself does not practice what he preaches. If he really believed *his* own flawed interpretation of Matthew 18, he should have talked to Driscoll privately. Rules for thee and not for me mentality. Plus, that pole stunt at the Christian conference was just wrong.
If Jimmy Evans suggested that Mark Driscoll should submit his authority to the authority of John lindell instead of the authority of Christ then Jimmy Evans is also a false teacher just like lindell. The Bible does not say that men are the head of the church the Bible says that Jesus Christ is the head of the church there is not one man in any of the story that can stand in the place of Jesus therefore to apologize to a man for messing up his church is ridiculous because the church does not belong to that man! If Jimmy Evans sides with Wendell in this he's going to find out that he made the wrong decision! I listened to the Julie Royce podcast about Mark Driscoll and everything that happened at Mars Hill and I had a bad opinion of Mark Driscoll not ever having heard anything about him prior to that and I still believe Mars Hill was a bad situation but this thing with lindell proves that lindell thinks that he is in the place of Christ and that my friends is the spirit of the Antichrist.
Never heard of Lindell and hope to God I never do! He needs to repent!
I believe that "EVERY knee shall bow, and EVERY tongue shall confess that JESUS CHRIST IS LORD." Phillipians 2:10-11 That will settle all of it, forever!
What was the purpose of the pole and stripper? It had no place there in a church function. That act deserves no defending. It was wrong. Didn't belong. Shock factor?
It was a Church conference, not a Church service. There is nothing wrong with gymnastics or sword swallowing as entertainment, but the performer should've used modesty and kept his shirt on. But i agree with you in that it seems like the main focus of these guys is Church coffers, not Christ.
This is all so evil! Shows exactly the state of the church in this hour....
Did Jesus apologize to the money changers?
Nope
Agree! and did he go and talk to chief priest in private first? I was disappointed with Ps Lindell, now after this truly disgusted. Talk about spiritual bullying!
As I ponder ALL the nonsense online about this situation. I’m thinking from all of it, Pastor Mark, and Johns comments included. I can’t remember hearing One thing Pastor Mark said specifically about John personally..at all! And John keeps referring to Pastor Mark saying he loves him and his family. As Christians, we are called to love people, and hate sin. I believe if people really listen to understand and not just judge, you will find what you are looking for. You referred a couple of times to Pastor Mark negatively, and controversial. That seems unfair, but your opinion. My opinion.. Great!! We need more men and pastors to stand up for what God really says!! Not for peoples opinions of them personally. Again, we Love and Honor you Pastor Mark!!
And I didnt hear Pastor Mark condemning the performer once.. he didnt call him a stripper.. He referred to a man doing what lady strippers do...
As well, how do we know Lindell isn’t lying? I’d like to hear jimmy Evan’s say that that’s the way his and marks discussion went.
Truthfully I don’t care about that because it has nothing to do with this issue. Not only that but.. Matthew 18 has nothing to do with what happened originally and Jimmy Evan’s may have that same theology as Lindell.. but it’s not scriptural.
When Jesus was accused... "HE SPOKE NOT A WORD"!
Jesus was innocent.
He makes a lot of speculation about how other people feel. Also totally ignores that he brought in a un holy show. He is character assassinating this Ps Mark. He presents text messages publicly that we can’t see to verify.
The only repentance necessary is john Lindell at the foot of God's throne. true Repentance will bring the change and love needed in this Man his family and the congregation. Its been incredibly disheartening for this to unfold minutes from where we live. God expose your church and bring repentance and your saving grace now! For far worse is coming according to revelations and with Christ Jesus we are whole! There is truth and there are lies and God is calling truth forth!
My feelings too
Agreed
Praying for all of them and those who witness this incident.
I can see very clearly his (Lindel’s) spirit of pride and arrogance! That Pharisee spirit-that vindictive spirit-assassinating Mark’s character while completely denying his (Lindel’s) own sin…flipping the tables on Mark (Gaslighting) him and putting the spotlight on Mark to draw away attention from his insidious sin and failing to take accountability from his own sin! 😔
totally agree.. all he did was say what he thought was inappropriate and he was blasted with missiles and atomic bombs! Spiritual bullying at its worse. All I see is EGO EGO EGO!
Why are you believing Lindell about Mark never repenting? Tho does not have anything to do with this situation!
Yes it does. Mark might have been right to call out that inappropriate performance but it does not mean he was right about all things in that situation
In an event that purposed to be about men swallowing a sword, one pastor brought with him the two-edged sword... The WORD. It cuts deep.
I wish mark was allowed to finish what he was saying that day! I know what he was going to say, that Jesus is the word and the word is the sword, so why this opening act? If you don't see the truth, you need to repent because you have the veil covering your eyes! Whom do you fear man or God?
This man should be explaining or appologize to the church.
So now when Mark goes to leadership privately to express concern and what he thinks needs to happen...after he was publicly stabbed in the side after apologising to John publicly...he is called a backstabber? Really? And rather than going to Mark privately John publishes a version of what can be remembered and pretends it is a hardship. His tone says it is not a hardship. He is delighting in publicly attacking Mark who has given his word to not do anything publicly but is coming directly to key members. John should be going to him privately and not making a Wednesday night address on it and publishing it to the internet. How very spiteful. I just want to say here that I've seen many men like John in ministry, but I've also seen more men unlike him and I thank God for that greater witness. Anyone disgusted by this whole thing and wondering if this is what true Christianity is...let me air you that it is not. John needs to be stood down...but by whom? He's anointed and untouchable right? John Maxwell would have stated by now that John has to go and David too...for the sake of the church. Mark is not wrong about enmeshment. And he's not wrong about John not being right to lead...if it's true.
He didn't spread demonic lies, he exposes the demonic activity in John Lindell's church! It was the most shameful behaviour in a church. This type of activity grieves God's heart. Exposing sin does not require an apology, John should've been apologising and repenting before God for allowing sin in church!
What kind of person says these things. This is not a Christlike attitude in my opinion. How can he go and preach and yet carry on like this in the background? True or not to air private messages publicly is working against the kingdom. This is he said he said kindergarten stuff.
The people hated the prophets of old when they spoke the truth and we see the same thing happening here. They still think having a male stripper at a service where our Lord Jesus should be honoured and worshipped is okay. The Lord will not share His Glory! The elephant in the room is being completely ignored😢
Repenting for telling the truth is denying the truth...who ever didn't cringe at the demonic entertainment is not in tune with the Holy Spirit, which totally addresses the failure of the Christian leadership of the conference itself. Pointing that out is nothing to repent of. The performer needs to repent and the leadership should not be exalting him and his sinful demonic performance! He did not exhale the Lord with it , he exalted A demonic spirit. Plain and simply seen.
These mega churchs are 😢 so off worldly things to bring everybody in regardless of it all what's the point.in have all these side freak shows 😳 sad mess
Lindel is a sorcerer and sorcerers go in the pit.
This comment gave me shivers. Such truth
There was something really wrong and creepy at that Wednesday night service....
🎯 I agree. The enemy sows the tares and they ( are allowed by the Lord to) grow side by side with the wheat until the endtimes when God's angels will be commanded to deal with them. Jesus told the disciples this. Today too many churches are infiltrated by sorcerors and High Level FMs, warlocks and witches galore. They head for the highest positions possible in order to deceive the flock. The enemy acts like a strategic military commander intent on utter destruction. He often uses covert means through deception yet so much of the sheep are caught up in a Hosea 4:6 situation. 🙏🙏
This makes me so sick and sad! Taking an entire church service to attack someone and make yourself look better... It's disgusting and heart breaking. God save us from ourselves!
Wow! This is all just disgusting. Shame, shame, shame!😢
Let’s all get real: GOD IS EXPOSING ALL THIS UNHOLY FOULNESS IN HIS CHURCH! NO MARK SHOULD NOT REPENT BUT HAVE A RIGHTEOUS BACKBONE! ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST!
If I wanted entertainment, I’d go to a movie theater. This whole topic boils my blood.
This whole thing seems odd to me. From the stripper to the apologies and now all the aftermath. How does this even happen at a Christian men’s retreat is beyond me.