Joe Rogan and DC discuss whether Alex Pereira has the potential to dominate the Light Heavyweight UFC division. They also consider if Jamahal Hill has the appropriate fighting style to defeat Pereira.
#jre #joerogan #danielcormier #ufc
Joe Rogan and DC discuss whether Alex Pereira has the potential to dominate the Light Heavyweight UFC division. They also consider if Jamahal Hill has the appropriate fighting style to defeat Pereira.
#jre #joerogan #danielcormier #ufc
Funny how Pereira became 2x champ inside the Ufc within no time and meanwhile Chimaev has been talking that hes gonna smash everybody for years and doesnt even have a title fight yet.
It is because Izzy was already quite high up and Alex was better at kickboxing and their rilarly sold. So he got to skip the line a little bit :P Oh and also... Alex already was a Glory champion. So the best in kickboxing. Glory is a sick competition.
Pereira fought top 5 contenders to become a 2 division champion Chimaev did it on Twitter
Alex was fast tracked
Simple as one guy could make weight consistently and one guy couldnt Khamzat 100p would have fought for a title if he made weight and beat Nate Diaz. His next fight was for a belt But cant give him a title shot after missing weight by 8 lbs and then he had visa issues or something to stop him from fighting for a while.
@@onlybetasgetoffendedbystri8030 true but chimaev also doesnt fight more than once a year
I'm here to tell Rogan... Pereira knocked the shit out of Jamal in 40 seconds 😂🤣
😂
Jamahal*
That’s not even how you spell his name🤦♂️💀💀
DC: they’re all so good and so close Joe: they’re all so good and so close Schaub somewhere: they’re all so good and so close
Somewhere? I know where he is. Living rent free in your head lol.
There all so good and so close
They're all so good and so close
There all so good and so close
I agree. 100 percent.
If Alex Pereira was 2 or 3 years younger, he could be the 1st three division champion.
Alex said he doesn't like HW in a brazilian podcast. And that's true, he would be a really small heavyweight and has no ground game, he can survive in the ground but that's it. Jailton almeida gets away with being an small HW because all HW have no groundgame lmao
@@lazonaasombrosa8688 He usually walks around on 104~105kg, he could just bulk up 4kg for a couple months and be a proper HW
Not against Jones
He can still do it
if my grandma had wheels, she would be a bicycle...
Izzy knocked him out and Alex was like "I needed the rest" and kept it movin like it was nothing.
I still feel like the loss looked good for him, because if he'd never seen as much money as he did in the UFC, he was probably blown away by the money he made in the fight against Izzy. And, given this reality, beating Izzy for the second (or fourth) time in a row would end his golden goose.
"When he gets taken down, survive." His first loss in MMA he was winning the fight, but it was close. Pereira tried to get up from a take-down in the last minute of the third round and got choked out. That's when he learned to not take chances, just survive, until the next round starts, where he dominates in the stand-up, and can fight off take-down attempts.
And...? Nice story
@@MrElpajitathat MMA fight was in 2015 before he met with Glover, his take down defense has developed significantly since than.
You've gotta get close to get that takedown and Pereira can KO a buffalo with that left hand.
@@ThomasPrarthaha facts, and gotta watch out for that knee as well
I think he's fortunate that there's not really any high level wrestlers at the top of the LHW division because I still feel like a high level wrestler will be able to implement the opposite strategy of "survive 30 seconds of stand up" until you get a shot then keep him on his back for 4 minutes. But he has a pretty nice lineup of guys at the top of that division who aren't elite wrestlers. Honestly reminds me of Izzy's reign, he was really fortunate to not have to face much wrestling.
Pereira looks like Sagat especially throwing that flying knee. Shout out to my streetfighter fans
Alex is already 36. Jones was the Light Heavyweight Champ for most of his 20's into early 30's and dominated all of the top contenders in the primes. But it was clear that he was on another level from his first UFC fight. No one was throwing spinning back elbows and german suplexes in fights.
No one was throwing spinning elbows or suplexes wtf u on?
@@shakenbake8597 Hes talking about Jon Jones, 1) he german suplexed Stephan Bonnar, 2) One of Jones' signature moves is the spinning elbow.
@@shakenbake8597no one was doing it the same way Jon Jones was, single leg to spinning elbow, that's a Jon Jones orginal move
Matt Hughes
@@ludvig45848that one is a classic
@3:35 DC had that to let that one out 😂
Lmaoooooo
Bro got that dorm knowledge
vahahahahaha it was nuclear
C'mon now😂
FINALLY they have a podcast together. I’ve been years for this lol
Jones and Pereira The absolute Leg Destroyers! I LOVE IT
7:17 DC "he gotta have two eyes Joe" xD
I love DC hes probably my favorite commentator with how articulate he is and how in-depth he is with grappling
If you like dc as a commentator you have brain damage
Dc is a terrible commentator
Anik > DC > Rogan
@@UpSettingP32 Anik is more of a host if that makes sense. I don't think you can put him there with the other ones because he does his own thing. I think Paul Felder and Dominick Cruz are better personally.
I also love DC but he is not articulate lol. Go read the definition of articulate and then tell me that's what DC is.
Jamal murray hill will be periera's easiest fight in the UFC till date. pin this comment
Idk Sean was a pretty easy fight for Alex lol
jamal muray hill will be easier than strickland fight
@@robertomugabe11Maybe, maybe not we will just have to see. Hill has nice KO power, I think he could get an upset but I think Alex wins this yeah
@3424 i mean jamahal murray hill defeated a 45 year old glover to win the only belt in his life and now acts like he has been a dominant champion for a decade. Periera has been doing this for years.
@@robertomugabe11 While I do agree with you, this is a sport where anything can happen any given night. I just think it’s pretty dumb to automatically assume Alex beats him so easily when they haven’t fought yet, and when you realize that Hill is a pretty good striker with KO power. I’m rooting for Alex, and I think he’s going to win this fight and he might win it easily who knows but I’m just saying not to count Hill out because since this sport has been a thing major upsets have happened multiple times.
Love how Joe changed conversation when DC tried to bring up Izzy 😂
Probably just Joe’s lack of memory and lack of ability to stay on one thought at a time.
joe the elk meat rogan is still salty his favorite buddies volcanoskating and genderbender lost
@@robertomugabe11that's a shit nickname and it ain't gonna catch on
@@robertomugabe11yep. Cruz and anik r awesome
@@shaidanwheel6199 joe the elk meat rogan talks about every UFC fighters in the history of mankind with every guests , doesnt matter if the guest is fan of MMA or not. but the second someone bring adesanya's name and volcanski headkick, he changes the topic
Thank you Izzy for giving us great fights and giving us Alex!😂
Dc feels pasion about the sport
Underrated combo....shoutout Joe and DC every time💯💯💯
3:35 DC chaging his sitting position about to let loose his hole
"Yeaahhhh" -DC with that sigh of relief 😧
😭😭😭
You noticed it nigga...
Pereira vs Jon Jones would be crazy🤯
Jon jones would DE-STROY him. lol wtf u talking about
Na, jones by sub R1 20 seconds
Jamahal Hill infact was not a problem
The one eyed fighter isn't giving Alex a problem. He's talented but he's not at that level.
He is blind on the left side also
@@cricketcavalry1824oh really “one eyed fighter” didn’t really capture that
I think you right, not yet at least right now
they arent even same weight class
@@DogLover4L Alex known for left hook. He will not see the hook
i wish Pereira got to the UFC when he was younger ideally around 30.
He was born ready. I think he’ll go for quite a while to be honest, He only seems to be getting much better and looks the best he’s ever looked at LHW
The thing about MMA is that the final evolution is a striker that you can’t take down. Alex can really just survive and he’s so composed but you’ve seen how in his recent fights he’s slowly stopped doing dumb striker shit like trying to kick people in the clinch and other stuff like that. The dude is so strong and so powerful all he’s gotta do is fight the sub and take minimal damage bc that dude is guaranteed is gonna blast you on the feet and entry when you shoot.
Such a meaningless statement. That's like saying the final evolution is a grappler that you can't hit. MMA is a game of tradeoffs, timing, and tape.
@@asraarradon4115 yeah but it's not because you pointed it out yourself: there's no such thing as a grappler you can't hit. Everyone gets hit and can get caught, but good enough TDD could mean you never go to the ground at all. Grapplers have to move the fight to the ground for their specialty, but strikers with elite TDD can use their specialty the whole fight if they stay on the feet.
Pereira isn't surviving a real grappler, Jan & Jiri are oke dimensional kickboxers with dogshit grappling skills. If DC or Jones fought Alex they would oil check hin in front of his wife/kids & alex wouldn't beabke to do shit about it, even guys like Ryan Bader would wrestle fuck Alex easily
@@jayb3304 On a flipside, the divisions that Perreira has fought in so far in the UFC, didn't really offer him any grappling challenge of the same caliber that someone would get when fighting against the likes of Charles or Islam or Colby. I can literally cite Charles as an example of fighter from a recent time and say the final evolution is a grappler who can eat up a few strikes and then maul them on the ground.
@@jayb3304 khabib was a grappler who was never really hit.. sure some guys landed a few strikes, but Khabib showed how pointless striking is in MMA, at least with current rules
Best Podcast in a long damn time
3:37 DC rips arse
No he didn't, he just made a noise with his mouth
@@samk.4158 then explain why he leaned to the side at 3:35
Jamal going down hill with a head kick or a flying knee.. the thing also is his injury is on the foot.. few kicks may mess him up
Biggest joke is Hill is challenge for Alex💀😂😂😂😂
Alex wasn't in a bar when adesanya did that interview, do your research, damn. Alex was already champion or glory top contender, he stopped drinking around 13/14 years ago, he said himself... That bar thing was just figuratively.
They are both cumdrunk on their UFC money to even think about actual facts. Just two bloated old men getting paid to hype fights.
I believe he was saying it figuratively
Izzy is definitely top 2 middleweight goats
@@fabrice8940yea right behind Anderson Silva
It's not that deep joto
Alex destroys Jamal hill
According to DV Hill, he's not on his level 🤣
Hill had a major injury, the achilles is no joke, so idk if he can truly recover and prove to be a top challenge, even if Alex himself is too old (but he is a athletic freak, so maybe age will not be a factor). It would be way more interesting if Hill was fully healthy, but here we are. Besides Hill, Jiri... maybe Chimaev, there's not much else. Izzy can chase Alex, but he seems afraid (for good reason)
Ankalaev might’ve spelt his name wrong but how come nobody is talking about him being a serious challenger to Alex
"Izzy can chase Alex but he seems afraid." Comment makes absolutely no sense but ok.
@@Obiodum_ He got kicked out of the weight class before. And if Alex was so strong even cutting weight like crazy, Izzy was barely able to keep up, imagine if he fights Alex at his natural weight? He knows he will be dominated, that's why he is dismissing the idea
@@RRRRRRRRR33 Genuine question, have you actually ever watched their fights? Adesanya is and always been the much quicker fighter in every aspect. Pereira is a very slow kickboxer but he makes up for it with his insane power. That's what has saved him even in fights where he was losing or on the backfoot. Also, save this pathetic weight cut excuse. I'm tired of hearing you Pereira groupies bring up that bs. He fought most of his combat sports career at Middleweight. He weight bullied for most of his career to fight smaller and leaner guys to get the advantage. Even at LHW you can see how much more human he is when he gets tagged. Jiri Procházka, a lean 205er was snapping his head back periodically in their fight. Adesanya has no reason to fight Pereira at 205 when he's a 185er with unfinished business. He just lost a disgusting decision to Strickland which he needs to avenge and there's still many more fights there for him and a legacy to cement. Where is the logic in him going up to LHW to fight for a belt that he more than likely won't even defend if he wins it? Foolish comment.
@@Obiodum_ Disgusting decision, lol he was dominated by Strickland. And yes, he had the speed and skill advantage, but got overwhelmed eventually. Kudos for Izzy, literally trapped Alex and knocked him out in the second fight. At LHW, there's no speed advantage anymore, maybe Izzy can't even reach Alex at this division, Jiri can beat him. In the end, Alex never fought Izzy at his natural weight, Izzy always had the speed advantage and he got beat up 3 times anyway, to assume he is the better fighter is something ludicrous, he will not chase Alex because he knows he can't even survive the LHW division, let alone win... and that's fine by the way, it's rare to find fighters who can win in multiple weight classes, this is supposed to be "special"
DC splitting the guard at 3.34😂😂
Love from Ghana
Funny is when joe say When pereira hits people they look confused hahahhaha😂😂😂😂
I like how Joe mentioned Volk. Everyone’s writing him off but Poatan did the exact same thing, even went up in weight
Is it just me or does Joe and DC play repeat after me after every statement?
Exactly my thouhhts lol. So weird
Dc is black Joe rogan
“He was literally in that bar in Brazil, and Izzy had to say something” is so frickn true 😂💀 then bro became the worlds greatest opp 😭😭
3:34 I swear Cormier leaned to the side and let one rip
No. Imagine DC got hold of Alex.
I'm not saying DC doesn't do any research, but even most casual mma fans have already seen those Alex KO's in glory.. 😆
Jiri also got knocked out against kind mo lol
😂😂😂 Alex has power and resistance..... He is shit on the ground and to defence 🤣🤣🤣 Shit just had a leg up with luck
@@user-wm1kk8un4ihis defence isn’t terrible…
@@user-wm1kk8un4ino such thing as luck against black belts, you either know how to defend yourself or you don't 😂 he knows when or not to try to get up, he doesn't give up his neck, doesn't give up a arm for a kimura or a hand triangle.
@@MrToxiclaughterexactly he is bad on the ground(a pure kickboxer lmao)but the guy above u is delusional
DC - 'You gotta have 2 eyes Joe' 😂
Jamal is going to bed round 2
Maybe even 1.
@@Gojimaru good pick
Alex sleeps Hill 💤
he did
Oh how wrong you were Joe about Jamal haha
The only guy who truly gives Alex a real true difficult challenge is magomed Ankalaev because of the wrestling, if Alex continuesly leg kicks magomed he has a path to victory but that wrestling is a problem if Izzy can take Alex down imagine what magomed would do
Chimaev is the man
Bumzat ? @@fran10780
@@fran10780he’d get slept so bad
@@fran10780 stop trolling
Izzy never took him down. He reversed Alex’ trip.
Daniel is such a great guy i bet he makes a great trainer
I like hill.. but AP is a new man at his natural weight.. way to go champ.
Lost respect for hill when he physically assaulted his brother for not cleaning his crib
@@huntersmall4313 The real story is probably Jamahal punched him after his brother said Alex looked good in his last fight 🤣
Joe is trying to hype Jamal up is funny as hell😂
Even DC was like, " Really Joe?!?!". Lmfao
@MrElpajita I have nothing against Hill, but he is nowhere near Alex's striking level or has strong chin or grappling. The only threat to Alex right now is that Russian grappler Jan fought. Also, Jan, who can maybe maybe pull it off. Otherwise, I don't see Alex losing until Jiri works his way up.
@@kapilthevkanapathipillai6424Doesnt really matter how much kickboxing alex has, its still a fist fight, and hill hits hard, real hard
@onlybetasgetoffendedbystri8030 That's true it is a fist fight, and you know maybe he can win. But Joe's hype is overblown at best. Hill doesn't hit nearly as hard as Jiri or Jan. Although Jiri did have him hurt for a while but couldn't really capitalise on it cause Alex only needs to hit him once.
I dont get the hype with jamall, it seems hes gonna destroy himself before he even gets his belt back. Also fk him for paying his brother for 300 Dollars then beating him up
Yeah he’s a dick for beating up his brother
Das dey KuIchuh🤴🏿
just coming back to Stricklands comments about the sparring with Perreira: " yes I can hit him, but Perreira has this single shot what just shuts you down...". Hill will be sleeping, Perreira can always force the hard shot and he needs only one time to close the show.
Why’s no one talking about Periera vs Jon jones? They both 36 only a couple days apart. They both 6’4 I just wonder if Jones would wanna lose the weight after he spent so much time gaining it
Or Pereira could go up to Heavyweight since he already weighs as much as one? People aren't talking about it as it's a mismatch.
Jones would dominate him on the ground. It would go very similar to jones vs gane I believe
Classy DC, leans to his left and farts, it was a loud one, ha ha ha
Hey! Did your channel get monetized?
Did they say that Bo had a long kickboxing career or were they talking about Alex?
They're talking about Alex, they made it confusing tho haha
Clearly bo
@@onlybetasgetoffendedbystri8030 hahaha
The small mma groves are a problem for alexs defense
If Ankalaev grabs him it's done quick
Khamzat too.
Would he survive the Left Hook though? I doubt.
imagine jon jones going down with that left hook
Jamal Hill is in love with his right hand and loads it up too much( glover fight ) also Jamal Hills legs are built like a tooth pick. A few leg kicks and he will be done and that’s when Pereira will capitalize. I have the fight for Pereira by a counter left hook
DC acting like he hasn't seen footage on Alex lol
Now that Jon Jones has moved up in weight the LHW division is now fair🤣🤣🤣🤣 and a levelled playing field
Got dogwalked by Reyes
@@rajyavardhansingh4491 Reyes biggest accomplishment in life was losing to Jon lmfaoooo, Reyes going on a 4 loss losing streak 🤣🤣🤣 is hilarious, Jon too busy making history and taking his sweat time in between fights because he can😉. Reyes is pathetic, man can have 1 good fight than completely fall off and lose the next 3 😂 proper Loser he is.
@@rajyavardhansingh4491no he didnt. Cope harder
@@ATribeCalledVince damn, not a Reyes fan, not a jon Jones fan, but it was obvious Reyes won
@@rajyavardhansingh4491Buddy hasnt won a fight in a while lmao imagine telling people that dude beat jones bones
Jiri is still one of the most interesting guys, he still gonna do a lot of good things in this division and Jamahal hill is a Dangerous man for anyone
How you are posting these videos?
If ankalaev get the title shot again it’s gonna be over for pereira
He will. Just wait. Then we also have Rakic.
He already dominated the LHW division by beating former champs Jan and Jiri and becoming a new champ and I hope that now he will beat one more former champ Jamal hill,Be Sharp and alert Alex,Hill is very cunning; to me it looks like that he is going to use his wrestling and grappling and the thing which he says that he is going to outstrike you,I think he just and only said that to make you unaware and not prepare for his ground game,take downs,locks,chokes and throws .
DC looking like he's getting back in shape 👀
THEY NEED TO MAKE THIS FIGHT!!!
To be fair there's no exciting opponent against Pereira in 205 aside from jiri and jan,also there's no legitimate next challenger since hill has an issue,ankalaev will rematch walker so who's next for Pereira i hope izzy accept the challenge imagine him and izzy for the 3rd time in octagon in ufc 300 for the 205 belt that's going to be a banger
Izzy would loss Alex is huge
Izzy is too small. He bulked up for the Jan fight and only weighed in at 200lbs. He couldn't even get upto 205.
@@__D-B__He literally said he didn't bulk, it was all water weight because he didn't want to compromise his movement.
"Just take him down" how many times have they said this already
He not faced a real wrestler since his first fight 😅
@3:36 DC Shits himself real quick
Will Hill's explosiveness remain after the Achilles tear?
No one has come close to JJ. As far as I know JJ hasn’t been knocked out like GSP, and JJ hasn’t broken his leg like Silva 😂 Jon Jones is the greatest. Khebab retired early and has had less fights than Jones has had title fights.
I was just thinking how crazy is it that Peirera has been in multiple championship fights, captured 2 belts and still has not fought a wrestler
He knocks every soyboy wrestler out cold
Blachowichz had his back for four minutes and dude is a legit grappler. He couldnt do shit
@@alvarosoares3530Jan is a good grappler but he's nowhere near the level of Ankalaev and Khamzat. If those two grab a hold of Alex, it's over.
Jamal hill did real good against Paul Craig, proper sniper
He's like Sagat from Street Fighter
DC let it rip @3:36 😂
Izzy wouldn't last again Alex again even that last one seemed weird
not exactly, izzy and alex first fight in the ufc izzy was piecing him up and almost finished him until the bell saved peirera, and then wins in the last round. and then vice versa on their rematch in the ufc. insane right? they'r both elite strikers
Tf? If anything the last fight showed that anything can happen between two elite strikers. In 4 fights this is the only one where Alex immediately had the advantage over Adesanya and yet he got KO’d.
They are 2-2 when you watch all 4 fights
@@raresouls9897 3-1 Alex _\
@@realestJC777He wasn't though, Pereira out struck him and it was fairly even up until the finish
UFC needs a weigh class that's between LHW and HW. 205lbs to 265 is such a wild gap. Some of these heavyweights are cutting weight just to make 265.
One of the sickest things I’ve ever seen in the cage is Josh Barnett getting dumped on his head.
Usual Joe Rogan glazing😂😂 not mentioning that wilnis beat adesanya and saying he did “wild shit lol” when he was acting dead in front of a kid.
Justin Wilnis he said 😂😂
ok Joe out cold out cold lol dont forget alex is 3/1 vs izzy
This new breed of 205er may be the reason Jon fled. Definitely wouldn’t do to them what he did to the last generation.
People look at record instead of opponents, when it comes to Jon. He was lucky enough to enter the UFC, pre-USADA, and at a time when the LHW division was weak. It was mostly old and/or war-torn natural middle-weights at that division. When naturaI LHWs started competing, he started looking average. Some say he lost to them. That's why he fled.
Hill vs jiri I still need to see
DC if Hill only had 3 fights when he won the strap when did he lose to Paul Craig then?
Alex Pereira will end up being in the top 10 MMA fighters to ever lived to this point. I’ve been watching MMA for 10 years. That is, if he’s not in the top 10 already. Even as one dimensional as you guys claim he is
maybe but prob not since he didn't run through jiri either and lets face it Jon jones cleared out the LHW division so badly that it's legit one of the worst divisions now
yeah, prime jon kills pereira and jiri same night
Jon last fought at lhw in feb 2020, the division has moved on from that era, the top 15 then and now is completely different
Also, middleweight is by far the worst division😂 all those fights are damn near a coin flip
That's not how it works, if anything these new guys make the last generation look bad if we use Dominick Reyes/glover/smith as a comparison. A division that changes hands often is competitive
😂lol its lhw its always that worse that the reason jon able to stay the camp because he is good fighter compared to other lhw guys
the difference between guys like francis and poatan is that u can tell francis throws with the full intention and power to box someone's head off oth when poatan knocks someone out with his hook u can't even tell if it's legit .... sometimes it kinda looks like his opponents are taking a dive 🤣🤣
I don't think DC knows the meaning of literally
Only the Russian can keep the belt LHW
if these two had a show once a month itd make billions
Joe and dc doing damage control from their commentary after the jiri vs pereira fight lmao
I wanna see aspinall v pereira eventually when Tom gets the real strap
Jiri was KO'd, the stoppage was legit. Typical Joe Rogan making an issue out of nothing.
Huh? He didn’t say anything about it not being a legit stoppage lol he just said jiri switched up, which he did.
Alex is going to DESTORY JaMaHall hill, Mark my words, we'l come back to this comment ag\fter they fight😮😅
J hill will be in prison for beating his defenseless brother
Jamahal Hill don't even want the LHW beIt anymore, he wants to beat Jon Jones' criminal record now.
I completely disagree I will be here after Jamahall Hill knocks out Alex
@@ronaldhuletey3399 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂- Same laugh as Demetrius Johnson ( MM) ON Hill's face after he said exactly the same as you. 🤣🤣🤣 Look for it!
@@ronaldhuletey3399 Jamahal has fought 3 legit fighters and 2 of the 3 were well past due…..Thiago, Glover, and Johnny Walker. He gets incredibly sloppy when getting aggressive plus never seen him check a leg kick and after eating 3-4 leg kicks he won’t be stepping with any real power on his punches. Poaton KO’s him faster than Jiri 👀😮
This editing is like an acid trip
Alex has gotten better at grappling not a master but surviving
They are propping up Jamahal Hill for no reason😂
Jamahal was/is the champ and gets so little respect. It’s CRAZY. He makes it look sloppy and easy because he has that casual accurate ease about him. He’s a natural.
Magomed Ankaleve gonna submit Alex. He also won against Jan , but stipid judges gave it a draw
3:36 DC farts LMAOOOO
The thing with Jon is that he wasn’t great at everything but knew how to use everything to his advantage. Alex everyone knows his weakness is the grappling. Until he sharpens that he won’t dominate like Jon did
Alex is incredible dont get me wrong, but he's really been fed a very 'easy' road to both titles... he had very few fights before getting a striker vs striker matchup at MW, and then he jumped into LHW against an old Jan at altitude (where imo he lost the fight) and then Jiri who is certainly a challenge but still more of a striker, and coming back off intense injury. if this was in LW/WW everyone would be complaining that he hasn't had to face a wrestler and get rumbled
Alex knocked out current mw champ lol idk about easy path .....
He has face it 5 champions in 8 fights man😂, and he won against Jan, both of then fighted in the same place so no excuses, quit the crying