The Moral Arguments Around the Israel-Hamas War
2024 ж. 9 Сәу.
492 639 Рет қаралды
JRE #2133 w/Brendan O'Neill
KZhead: • Joe Rogan Experience #...
JRE on Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/4rOoJ6E...
JRE #2133 w/Brendan O'Neill
KZhead: • Joe Rogan Experience #...
JRE on Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/4rOoJ6E...
Comparing Israel vs Gaza to the American Civil War doesn’t correlate to me.
True. The Brits werent baby reyping animals.
Bias justification
Does not ah???? Well, when we had killed 2 million of German Civilians at a loss of ZERO American ones in order to destroy the Nazi Regime ,does that correlate to you? When Red Army had stormed Berlin and was destroying all that moved with its Artillery Fire and Katiusha Salvos , killing tens of thousands German civilians in the process --were there people like you today , telling them : "stop , you killing German children " ?? or every body were just pushing them on - finish the Bastard State ? Use some basic thinking , not your bias against Jewish people that you been condition to have with bullshit lies over 2000 years if you re in Christian world and 1400 years if you re in Muslim world.
@@DagnirRen Yes they were, just not to the extent that the Israelis are, though.
His comparisons are a reflection of his twisted morality.
“Who the fuck is that guy “
A smart man.
Someone correct.
@@JackAaron1992 Someone who hasn't read up on his history you mean
He's definitely not antisemitic nor pro Palestine he's un biased
I just said that in a Conor McGregor voice 😂.
Except the Balfour Declaration, which basically planned the establishment of Israel was written in 1917.
Jews have been living in that area literally thousands of years before Islam, or Arabs were even a concept. How far back do you want to go before you say this is the starting point? History didn't start on October 7th, or 1948, or 1917, or 1840, or 1831, or 1516.
Lord Rothschild
@@ATXGooneryour comment does not make this comment any less true.
@@Lostparadigm "If you're right, why do I aggressively misunderstand the point you were making?" You could have just written that instead.
I thought that was the Sykes-Picot agreement that Britain and France made
Steve harvey at the Nuremberg trials: “they did what with the ovens?”
I’m telling my best friend Nick Mullen you’re stealing his jokes
This is one of the dumbest takes I’ve heard
Same. Joe comparing Mexican gangs to Hamas. Mexican gangs would never be as motivated as Hamas to slaughter civilians because Hamas conflict is about RELIGION not MONEY. Hamas has religious reasons for hating and wanting to kill Jews
you never really watched the video
The smartest one, you are the dumb one
@@onepunchman8328 its pretty stupid to argue about morality from a podcast. If he was a soldier in the war, then his take would be worth anything.
The truth hurts, try to use your brain more
Listening to a Brit referencing Britain to debate the morality of war is like eating beans for breakfast
BBQ the next morning.🤔 So.....
As an Irish person I agree . Just remember it was Britain that created the Israel state
Beans are breakfast for 3/4 of the americas & carribean
It’s absurd int it, who the hell is this guy
Americans, throwing stones in glass houses since 1776 😂
Imagine the loophole we'd create if we said that terrorists weren't going to be targeted if they embed themselves in the civilian populations.
You got Bin Laden with minimal collateral damage...
@hugoramirez9295 Bin lagen wasn't imbeded in the civilian population. He operated guerilla forces in the Afghan mountains.
@@sparten5654 the fact is Israel's government decides the amount of collateral damage that's acceptable for them, and the numbers speak for themselves
@hugoramirez9295 The ratio of civillian to combatant death is five times lower than the average for this type of conflict. But whatever makes jews the bad guy, I guess..
@@sparten5654the bin laden raid was in a compound building in a city in Pakistan……
"WAR is Hell but its not the worst thing in life" - Amen
This obtuse argument is insane. Killing innocent people will never be ok. War zone or no war zone. Mowing down people gathering flour for bread is not an excuse for mass execution.
What about at a music festival?
Crazy you believe what terrorists say. Israel will be free from terrorists
How do you fight a war without it?
@@DreadPages notice how he didn't justify that either, my god, the what aboutism is insanely common
@@georgiadawgs8260 without civilians casualties you can't, but theres a scale, that makes it an acceptable military target, say there's 2 militants to one civilian, or even a 1 to one ratio, those are acceptable numbers on the international level, but 300 civilians to one possible militant isnt,
Excuse me, as a European, my great grandfather did not shove any Jew into any oven. Be specific about who did that and maybe those people should offer part of their state to the Jewish people.
Lol he is literally justify everything just because people in past did horrific things with jews
I agree and also stating that Europe hasn’t had to fight for anything is just a ridiculous thing to say
You are painfully naive
the Palestinians are occupied for 75 years they have every right to fight back the occupation
You did
I wanna last long enough to hear Joe talk but I’m 3 minutes in and already like “shut the actual fuck”
M so glad i missed this ep, imagine listening to this guy for hours.
This guy checked off all 12 of Ben Shapiro's talking points.
Meaning he is a rational smart guy
Genetic fallacy
@5dollarshake263 planning on addressing any of them? Or should the free world never wage war against people who put their military HQ underneath their own hospitals? 🏥
Ah, the good old Western propaganda on the JRE. "Britain had to make a decision to go fight the Nazis"..... he simply "forgot" to mention who actually ENDED the war. THE SOVIETS. To the UK and the US, war means business, and profits, the longer a war lasts, the better for the billionaires running the show. By the way, the only country that is still legally allowed to rally out in public, flying a swastika flag is the United States, everywhere else on the planet, it's illegal. In early 1945, Allied troops entered Germany. By mid-April, the SOVIETS had encircled the German capital of Berlin. On April 30, 1945, Adolf Hitler killed himself. The German armed forces surrendered unconditionally in the west on May 7 and in the east on May 9, 1945, bringing an end to World War II in Europe. You're welcome, Britain.
@@amsz6326 snart indeed.
The moral judgement by a Brit that starving people is a legitimate practice isn’t a surprise given what his country did to Ireland.
And India
& 1/2 the world
“that was just for funzies though innit mate?”
Israel sends food supplies to civilians while hamas takes it gluten themselves leaving innocent civilians starvimg
He’s Irish too
“Sometimes sacrifices have to be made, but it is very important that it doesn’t affect me negatively.”
“War is okay because we are the good guys” -whoever he is
Thank you Joe for pushing back against this ridiculous guy.
He didn’t make a good rebuttal
He needs Dave Smith there
@@chrisbrown2211 Dave tries to ride the fence like a stripper rides a pole…
Ridiculous to people like you Hamas people.
Please bring Abby Martin
Why didn't this happen under Trump?
Another element to this dilemma, is thequestion, did Israel attempt other methods to bring an end to this 75 year conflict? If they had only chosen to bomb, then sure I can see Joe's point. But we have witnessed Israel agreeing to a two-state solution in1948, followed by an attempt by five Arab armies to actually commit genocide. In 1967, Israel defeated the Arabs in six days and immediately offered the Arab world the territories in exchange for peace, and the Arab League said "NO". The Oslo Agreements brought great hope in 1993 but that led to a campaign of bus bombings by the PLO. In the year 2000 Ehud Barak and Yasser Arafat met with Bill Clinton at Camp David, they had an agreement, which Arafat pulled out of at the last moment. The next day the Second intifada began. Since then there has been the Wye Agreement and other agreements that have separated the territories into entities, A, B and C. In A and B the Palestinians vote in elections to the Palestinian Authority currently led by Abbas and police themselves, as well as Gaza, which became "un-occupied" in 2006. This led to rocket attacks from Gaza, which brings about Israeli retaliation. Israel has tried every option to make peace, and all have been turned down. I wish Joe Rogan would read some history of the region. The attempts to make peace, right from the beginning, serve to make the destroy Hamas option a moral imperative. As all Americans right of Stalin would agree it is incumbent on the federal government of any nation to take up arms to protect its people and secure its borders.
Good on you for bringing actual history to this conversation
All very true ❤
@@sollybradley6481all very true if you take at face value the israeli narrative. I could totally reverse that from the 1948 nakba all the way until the 1st intifada with the narrative being that Israel crashed the two state solution at every turn. At the end of the day how do you explain the great fence along the west bank, the ever growing settlements over the years against every law. What about the dead palestinian children in the west bank before October the 7th?
True but there’s slight bias. Not going in too much details but these peace deals were mostly favoring Israel. The initial two state proposal by the UN had allocated more land towards the Jewish settlers. I can’t recall the exact figures but it was something like 30% of the population were settlers and they got allocated 52% of the land. Even the Oslo accords, the fine print had Israel still controlling certain essential infrastructure such as power, water etc. No military, limited maritime allowed. The occupier and the occupied aren’t equals in negotiations.
The only comment here which is knowlegable. Thank You. I was losing hope
I'm making a moral judgement on Mr O'Neill and it's not good.
hes written in defence of child predators before
@anglodoomer5995 Link please?
Moral based on what standard?
So invading Nazi Germany was bad according to your logic.
Stupid people tend to think like you.
This guy got his talking points directly from the IDF
Maybe he should take them from Iran
@@liorzelering5988you must know from all you war experience.
@@liorzelering5988 you sound like you’re a proponent of the spontaneous squatting escapades movement!
Now, let's see if you can actually articulate a real argument?....
try and disprove them mate, you are empty of substance
People seem to forget about the “Blitzcreig”
Very good points Joe. Your not just an interviewer asking questions. Your a thinker helping to open peoples minds.
A Brit talking about morally justifying occupation and civilian casualties?! shocking....
O'Neill is Irish
@@anglodoomer5995maybe his ancestors were but he talks and acts like a Brit, was probably raised there
@@reyrodriguez4280 west Brit
As a Irishman watching this, it doesn't surprise me. he gives a complete green light to the Zionist regime. Prick makes me sick, just like black and tans
There is no occupation... Disputed maybe.... Name a war where civilians have never died? Hypocrite!
It’s like these guys are trained to speak softly about terrible things so that you forget that it’s terrible
Sometimes you got to do terrible things to survive. That is life. a lot of people in the comments dont understand this about life but their children will.
@@Kai-nh9ut Spoken like a true genocide denier. I’m sure that anyone who has ever carried one out shared this sentiment.
He's out of his mind. US is the big dog with all the money and weapons. We should control Israel not the other way around. Why the US hasn't told them to stop the genocide is a question we all deserve an answer to? Why are we letting our little bitch in the middle east cause all this trouble?
I have a psychological issues . I struggle to get over it and I work hard on it. But I can tell you , when I lie, I literally don’t feel any problem. It comes so normal. The lie detector doesn’t now sense a thing . I tried it . These guys like this.
@@Kai-nh9utYes I’m sure that’s how all of the perpetrators of genocide thought. And they still committed genocide.
Joe- “this has never happened before” history- “Which example would you like?”
The examples were all blatantly inaccurate
Did this guy ever fight in a war?
Why are both of you not talking about why Hamas exists??
Its not even a theory, its stated fact in interviews. On point good Sir.
It exists because Bibi satanyahu funded Hamas via Qatar to divide Palestine and PLO
Because most people don’t actually care to look into history that deeply and because others are paid not to care.
Or that Pa lesti nians had been the victims of violent persecution for 40 yrs before it existed.
@@layinlow77 you're gonna play the persecution game with the J's? LMAO
The lesson here is that you can be well spoken and ignorant simultaneously.
Sometimes it’s not even just ignorance, you also have to be wicked to justify 💣 children, elders women civilians.
This british clown is making money of the killing of children, in one way or another. Strange joe keeps having these guys on, but none of the voices who are against whats happening
Did you write this about yourself?
His arguments are insane. No justification for any of what he's spouting
@@adirsab🤡
Please explain the Israeli Sniper that shot young children, and 1 example is that there was 1 video a mother carrying her 1 year old baby was shot by a Sniper both baby and mother was killed..
this guy didn't even try to answer joe's question on "is there another way to do it other than bombing?"
There isn't. There you go. But, if you have an alternate where Hamas are willing to free 130 hostages taken from Israel, where probably over half of that number are dead now, I'm all ears. Hamas could have done that months and months ago, and despite destroying Hamas being an Israeli objective, the West would have given Israel zero further support, as it would have just looked like retribution. Israel hasn't/will not stop until all the hostages are accounted for at the very least. Hamas hold about a dozen Thai and Philippines, they won't even release them and they've done nothing. As a father, as a guess, if Hamas did to your family, neighbours, friends and/or co-workers what they did to Israel on October 7th, and still held, 7 months later the people you say good night to every day, go and look them in the eye and then reply to me in all honesty, what is your red line you'd want your country to do or not to do to get them back? It's easy to comment when you have no skin in the game and nothing on the line. Then, please let me what this guy should have said as an alternative.
I've been waiting months to hear the pro-Palestinian side's alternative, the usual answer I get is "I don't know, but not that way" quite easy to say from your cozy bedroom in a safe 1st world country, that's not gonna cut it for the Israelis who have to face this horror on a daily basis.
@@gadaboutunited well, there is, but they've decided not to. For whatever reason. Sending in a team. But as I've said before, nothing we say have any relevance to what happens. People are just so invested that they think what anyone says has real impact on what happens there. They get emotional and either defend or attack. I'm referring to us, people on the internet and people not involved with the action.
Listening to his logic is extremely unsettling. How can these people not see that INNOCENT PEOPLE DO NOT DESERVE TO DIE??
Listening to your logic is unsetlling. You: "Look Israel I know that for 70 years the Palestinian government has supported, funded, and taught terrorists who rape, murder, and kill Jews simply because they are Jews, but you should just lay down and take it. I mean look, even though we are rewarding terrorists by refusing to kill them if they hide behind their own familie's lives, not to mention allowing them to repeat more attacks on your own women and children in the future, it's still wrong to try to kill them." The inverted morality is shocking to see.
“Innocent people do not deserve to die” When Hamas says they will conduct October 7 attacks again and again, that is exactly what Israel is trying to prevent. Why can’t you see that if you don’t want endless innocent deaths year after year ?
what did they expect when the attacked ? or maybe rebel/vote out Hamas, o right they are not a democracy...
are you referring to the children hunted down and killed on October 7 ? Hunted down and killed
@@mz4kidsthis all didn’t start on October 7th. Learn your history
The ‘moral’ argument for bombing civilians???
The moral failure lies in the hands of Hamas
Really unbelievable....
See Dresden, WWII. Civilian deaths are always terrible, but this war was started by an action of terror by Hamas, whose strategy is always using civilian human shields. Why did they never build bomb shelters for their people in 15 years? They were receiving billions in aid.
@littlecatfeet9064 you do realize that Dresden was condemned by the allies and why international law was created...at this point why even discuss war crimes?
the Palestinians are occupied for 75 years they have every right to fight back the occupation
These are exactly the same talking points that people used to go to war in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Except for the babies being beheaded
Palestine exposes every hypocrite.
Digging up graves & removing bodies all for new settlements is heartbreaking for the whole of humanity
Can you think of any other reason they would dig them? Perhaps a habit of one side of the conflict to peddle in corpses?
Digging up Graves was how Israel found dead hostages...
Because they are Evil
@@yakov95000 you believe that nonsense, funny stuff.
No kidding. I've never seen anything so evil. We are seeing children being killed and amputated every day, most with no anesthetics. They are an Apartheid State. The idf is full of shit. Lies, lies, lies.
He sounds like a British politician, the speech patterns are exactly like Sunak and what he says is exactly like an Israel spokesperson
Very delusional indeed
except that he only said true correct stuff if you think about it without any bias ;)
The discussion in this war is absurd. First. Israel acted selflessly to live in peace with the Palestinians in Gaza. It was more than a decade ago when Israel itself ordered Israeli citizens who had lived there for decades to literally leave their homes. The first thing the Palestinians did in return was to elect a government that enshrined the goal of destroying Israel in the constitution. The elected government followed through with its promise. Since its founding, thousands of rockets have flown into Israeli settlement areas. Dozens of civilians died in terrorist attacks. Millions of aid funds - intended for civilian institutions - were misused to sponsor this terrorism. October 7th was just what Humus had been doing for years. Secondly. Israel behaved more humanely in this conflict than any other conceivable party in any imaginable conflict. It allowed Palestinians to work in Israel, receive medical care or even migrate to Israel. During war, they warn civilians where their military is operating. They admit collateral damage and apologize for it. The situation is clear. In no other conflict the responsibility for the suffering has been so one sided and clear - in no other conflict have the perpetrators been held accountable so weakly. People with voice and power who claim to reject war and the nature of war have a duty to unequivocally name the culprit of this war and do everything in their power to eliminate them. Everything else is responsibility for the resulting suffering and is as history has proved continuing this madness.
He is MOST PROBABLY PAID HANDSOMELY by his isreali masters and has clearly handed his soul to the devils
@@jankaufmann4305 yeah cause humus are literally a death cult that see pally deaths as heroism even for kids, they don't care about their own lives let alone pally people, all they wanna do is keep doing oct7ths and even at larger scales if they could, up to the ultimate scale. yet millions in the west march and protest for them =)) the post-truth society is a wild place
Where is Abby Martin and will Joe ever bring her back? 🤷♂️
Question.. so since this is now a" war "its perfectly ok for Hamas to strike back ?
I mean its as 'perfectly ok' as it was for Nazi Germany to attack the UK
I'm curious where you are trying to go with this, please continue
Im just sayin ... if its a war they should b allowed to call on and have support from there allies...... but its not ... its a mass murder and 1 big landgrab More terrorists were made after Israel invaded gaza alllll d years of the occupation
There are striking back every day, this is why it's called a war. Tit for tat. But Israel has taken this war back to Gaza, so this why you don't hear much about how this war is happening.
Give them England as their own country.
"They" (the UN) gave Jews Israel and gave Palestinians Jordan. It is already settled.
He said they were attacked for race… not that they stole land n are ethnicity cleansing
This guy would find a way to defend British history of killing people in foreign lands
they already have that country
@@Dave-cf4vd nope they the UN say westbank and Gaza including Jerusalem are occupued by the GENOCIDE ARMY.
As a vet I can assure you no war is just. You are only being used. There are no winners. No glory. No heros.
Sorry man you had to be put through that I tried to join the military at 19 but I had a withdrawal Caesar from alcohol from bad choices I wanted to be a fighter pilot and fly f-16s and if I couldn't fly them I wanted to fly the f-15 strike eagle thank you for your service❤❤❤❤
“War doesn’t make boys men, War makes men dead”
Thank you for your service, Joshua. I'm sorry our nation took it for granted.
I’m sorry for your service, but sounds like you’ve become wiser because of it 🤜🏿
U arent a real vet u are a pog
What is the alternative?
Nice arguments but forgot to mention a very important fact: Hamas is holding hundreds of Israeli hostages in Gaza. That’s why Israel can’t stop the war, they will never give up on their civilians, like any country should do.
It's nice to drop this snippet on here so that I know not to bother with this episode on Spotify
You shouldnt bother with any episodes to be fair😂
100%
He's back on KZhead full episodes
Factssss
The amount of factual selectivity makes me wanna throw up. Maybe just start with the fact that Israel is in a apartheid state? As deemed by nearly every human rights group out there. INCLUDING THOSES IN ISRAEL
It’s fascinating to see this guy talking about young people when people who are older than the state of Israel’s itself criticize Israel
so do they criticize palestine
And yet those same critics are silent on the Ukraine conflict.
Classic anti-Israeli non sequitur. He is talking about young western ignoramuses who support Hamas because they are "oppressed". They aren't. If they used the billions in aid money the west has sent them for anything other than making their leaders in Qatar billionaires and bombs, they could be a flourishing people. But they aren't and they are two b*tch made to admit it's their own fault.
@@robfarrell9104 some people are but some aren’t.
@@onepunchman8328 yes they do
Well said. Good back and forth here.
if you paid any attention in history. You can make a ton of parallels to the Vietnam war to the Israel Hamas war
This guy brushed off the Ireland conflict like it was peanuts. Wow
They have a habit of doing that
@@easydoesit83They or (((they)))?
He's Irish, and historically very pro-The Republic of Ireland. So much so that his old publication was accused of being pro-IRA.
Still, he brushes off a thirty year long war like nothing
@@hannesgranlund8838 they weren't talking about Northern Ireland. Had that been the subject at hand, O'Neil would have had a lot to say about it.
Joe has gotten so good at just letting guest dig themselves into logical holes all the while keeping distance and disagreeing politely.
It was amazing ...I don't know how Joe keeps his composure so well...
@@anthonygil1522 he’s come such a long way from when he went meathead on Stephen Crowder all those years ago
Joe really surprised me with his logical and nuanced perspectove on this. Ive seen he had a lot of pro isreal guests on recently and figured he might be insensitive to the palestinian struggle. He understands that tragedy does not justify more tragedy.
As a black man that has been to Isreal and Palastine many times, I’m so grateful for Joe Rogan. He will be on the right side of history.
Remember, speaking sophisticated and sounding intelligent doesn't mean you have high IQ and this vid speaks it perfectly
Best comment of the year anywhere, right on
But being unable to demonstrates that you have a low one, Mr Speaking Sophisticated
@@duncefunce1513 ?? Anyways
Jesus, use grammerly. Or find an adult to help your writing.
"anyway"
Holy fuck. Did he just say Cromwell fought for the "modern idea of democracy"? What the fuck is this guy on?
Maybe he fought for the idea of democracy, but he certainly didn't practice it.
Explains a lot actually, he's probably seething at the irish support for palestine too.
Just an idiot cramming the largest words he knows on top of one another to justify genocide. Period.
Yeah, us Irish really loved Cromwell's brand of democracy!
Yeah you caught that to
Thanks a million Joe for speaking up for humanity.
Never trust anyone who uses the word “conundrum”
The fact that Bassem Yousef hasn’t come on the show yet is bizzare
maybe because he's a disingenous propagandist/charlatain who traffics in lies?
Joe "I'll have anyone unless their views aren't right-adjacent" Rogan
I disagree, I think it’s pretty understandable considering how many smart political commentators there are in media, most with diverse opinions on this debate & many other political debates, and Joe is only 1 guy with 2 other careers, with tons of hobbies and he interviews people only he personally finds interesting from ALL walks of life…ironically at the beginning of this episode, Joe actually jokes about the frustration of there being so many interesting people he wants to talk to, yet only so much time & availability. I am sure he will have him on someday
I think he was in tour. I bet he comes on soon.
100% agree. the fact that he's also a comedian and he's talking about something very important right now.
Dude definitely expected Joe to just fold on him and agree. It's not ok to kill innocent people, it doesn't matter how many words you use to explain it, how much it was done in the past, or whose homeland you're attempting to establish.
He didn't say killing innocent people is "ok". He said the deaths of innocent people is unfortunately unavoidable in war. Especially when their own government is using them as Human Shields, building bunkers under their homes, fighting out of uniform, and firing from behind them.
@@dshappir watch it again man. Joe makes a point that he wouldn't be ok with "unavoidable" deaths if they were Jewish. Bombing a hospital is not "unavoidable".
@@dshappirno evidence of human shield. Only Israeli peddled propaganda
"innocent people" ok
What a ridiculous summary of what he was saying
Obviously Joe hasn't heard about WW2....
Intent is always the right question to ask what's hamas intent? What Israel's intent?
Defending war crimes is unacceptable regardless of someone's nationality.
Is morality subjective?
No such thing as war crimes. War is war.
Israel hasn’t committed war crimes
And hamas? Palestinians?
@@herbthompson8937there are rules to war
The first casualty of war is the truth
Yes and it was Palestinians who were attacked first
@@FlCarScene 75 yrs ago?
Good one
Truth doesn't bleed persons do. The obligation to adhere to Truth standards die at the hands of those who deny its power to act righteously.
Sure 75 years ago and every freakin year after that. Your colonialist mindset will not let you see that. You can’t just get away with it. Call them whatever you like, they have every right whatsoever to rise up against the people oppressing and occupying them
Calls Hamas a barbaric army because they stab and kill civilians then proceeds to defend Israel for bombing and killing civilians because “that’s just war, innit?”
Exactly
hypocrisy off the charts.
War fighters in civilian clothing*
Meh, not really comparable tbh. One is personal, and without warning; the other is impersonal and directed specifically at soldiers, soldiers that choose to hide in areas populated by innocent lives. Weird how they went south with the flow of civilians instead of staying in an area where they know THEIR PEOPLE wouldn't be, but so is an extremist death cult, idolizing being "martyred" and hoping their civilians will feel the same.
Well Hamas did it because they hate jews and want to exterminate them in any gruesome manner. Hamas is a terrorist organisation and Israel actions is to get rid of a terrorist ruled state. I don't like that Israel is bombing like crazy but I myself know nothing of war so I wouldn't know any other alternative. I think letting Hamas continue like nothing happened is the biggest mistake and its signalling that they have a very effective tactic of making themselves untouchable
joe always inviting guests that are on the money 😂
Brendan is spot on! Joe asks good questions to try poking holes in his positions too. Good discussion, gentleman.
Dude has rewritten history to justify his argument.
what part of history has he rewritten?
@@beetaliusdad here is just being triggered
@@beetaliusthe part where Muslims lie and rape.
@@beetalius He just leaves out the fact that Israel violently removed some 750,000 Palestinians from their land in 1948 and has persecuted them since. Tries to make it sound like it's all just a matter of hating Joos. And then simply denies their current war crimes that the whole world can see.
Israel existed before Palestine
Yeah screw this guy this isnt even a "war"
Oh Israel is just supposed to stop, this isnt a game, If Hamas actually cared about their people they could surrender any time. But they dont for some reason.
@@gsp3428 Average social media Hamas bot: "Did Israel just try being nice?" LOL
@@gsp3428They can keep going. But need to cut it out with calling others terrorist when they are committing terroristic acts themselves. They are no longer the “good” guys
He says young people aint ever been to war. When the fook has he been to war? 😂
It is a war. Hamas represents the Palestinian vote. They voted for ppl who organized and did these atrocities to Israeli civilians. It is a declaration of war.
People will have an entirely different opinion if they faced an existential threat
The most thought provoking moment was when Joe Rogan (paraphrased) said ‘if Hamas was situated in a Jewish Hospital no one would think it was okay to kill those Jewish people in the hospital in order to get to those Hamas fighters.’ That’s very true, I don’t think Benjamin Net and yahoo would consider it okay.
Joe, invide your old friend Abby Martin to discuss this issue
I think he doesn’t want to hear what really is going on there
He's not allow .. probably will lose some sponsorship.
Abby doesn’t come off as credible. I like her, but there are more knowledgeable and rational advocates for the Palestinians out there.
Ahh abby. The woman who refuses to denounce Hamas. Sure. Then bring on Finkelstein too. Reputable people..
Yeah, that paid Al Jazeera mouthpiece who can vomit lies with a straight face who openly admits that she doesn`t even know really what happened on Oct. 7, but that does not prevent her from parroting the lies to accuse Israel of every imaginable crime. What a waste of human life
People is Gaza were shot when they tried to access food aid. This is not a just war.
This is NOT a war. The Palestinians do NOT have any military, no army, no soldiers no tanks, no jets, no bombs, no drones, etc, nothing to defend themselves with!! The other side is armed to the teeth from the No.1 military industrial complex in the world.
Have you been to war? That is the reality of war! That is part of war, you can't wage wars and be polite! That's why we should avoid war, and hamas started it!
Did you mean Hamas members? Same thing happened to ISIS, they got killed while trying to get some food, poor people... We all should cry now.
@@waterbear1337 That is what happens between combatants . Not against unarmed civilians . You are calling war crimes . War Gazans are occupied people . They don’t have a sovereign state This is a genocide aided by USA
@@shitinsideyou what the f**k are you talking about? How can children be consider Hamas members? You have problems
Best comparison ever to explain to the younger generations how they have their freedoms today that they take for granted.
A moral judgment call is not easy in war. Innocent people do die, tragic as it is. War strategists, though immoral as they are portrayed by many, must often decide to what extent a campaign must go. Is it for the betterment of mankind or just selfish immoral psychopathic worthless endeavors.
It's pretty bold to keep asking the question of what is "morally" right, yet still implying the answer is: "killing innocent civilians is a means to an end."
Your ignorance about war, the history of war, and the laws of war, is just proof of the total failure of the educational system. I don't hold that against you. What I do hold against you is offering an opinion about something about which you know nothing.
The people who scream loudest for war do so from the comfort of their own armchairs. They know they will not have to fight the wars themselves
@@MitchellRMiller-lt1xi War is a faliure of human endeavor on every front. Knowing the history of it will teach you that.
@@tevildo45 except the jihadist that kill people and scream jihad jihad jihad
@@tevildo45 the people who scream the loudest for ceasefire have never been threatened existentially...thus, the ignorance of "luxurious moralising."
What's Britain excuse for occupying Ireland 🇮🇪 🤔
What’s the arabs excuse to invade Spain 🇪🇸🤔
What's Israel excuse for occupying Palestinians land @@chivomartinez
@@chivomartinez If you read history, after the Islamic conquest, Spain became one of the richest countries, and Christians, Muslims, and Jews lived in luxury until the Crusades came. Which carried out massacres against Jews, Muslims, and opposing Christians. If what you are saying is true, the Spaniards would still hate Muslims, but anyone who reads history knows that the largest massacres in Spain were at the hands of campaigns Crusader
@@theearthisntflat5863Jews did NOT live in luxury under Spanish rule...ever heard of the Inquisition?! Literally one of the biggest forms of persecution against the Jewish people happened under Spanish & Portuguese rule in the 14/1500s...Jews were almost never living in great conditions...something gentiles generally agreed on across the board historically was that they hated Jewish people. Muslims 🫱🏻🫲🏼Christians 🫱🏻🫲🏼Catholics🫱🏻🫲🏼Pagans all hated Jews historically speaking..
@@chivomartinez read history and talk after
So Joe’s argument is that no war should ever be fought? Or just wars when the combatants are nice enough to not hide behind civilians?
Morals are self centered, personal and individual. Not any way to govern & not any way to go to war. Knowledge is more important. ❤
"you're not supposed to make moral judgement" proceeds to make moral judgement
He’s a nitwit, cringe listening to this guy. Joe Rogan on the other hand, is a legend.
Think you missed the point…
How could you not care more about your own people than the enemy’s people? This is the only reason you exist right now.
@@UserOfTheDay triggered person of the day
You weren’t listening he said it’s unfashionable to make moral judgements but it’s something we must do sometimes
All the Zonists really trying hard to get on the Rogan podcast on the daily.
Ain’t they tho
And that is a very good thing. Zionism is without a doubt the most moral reason for a country to be created. Zionism is a good thing. The whole notion that Jewish Nationalism should be assumed to somehow be worse than other nationalisms is such obvious racism, no matter how popular that racism is. Antisemitism has always been one of the most popular racisms, but anyone who thinks that somehow legitimizes a genocidal racism that has exterminated the majority of Europe's Jews last century is the ugliest racist that exists.
Anyone who disagrees with you is a Zionist? What are you 3 year old?
We live in strange times when the term Zionist is weaponized as a normalized anti semitic slur. As if a return to what the UN has agreed is indigenous lands is supposedly bad. People like you should rather front with what you really want to say, you want Jews killed, israel destroyed, you are welcome.
I still love Joe "apples to oranges" Rogan
Joe calls it a strawman while building a strawman himself.
Dude says fighting colonialism is just and then condemns hamas for fighting colonialism.
What a guy huh ? 😂😂😂
The British Mandate was colonialism. Israel is not colonialist.
Which country is Israel a colony of ?
He's condemning Hamas for intentionally killing babies
@@fucanaoasis2000 You have never heard of settler colonialism have you
Nah bro this dude is wild, his argument is built on a foundation that is crumbling right in front of the world for everyone to see
bot
@@adirsabschizophrenic
And getting worse. Mossad is full power right now with shutting down the protests and putting sheep like this guy in front of cameras. He says make a moral judgement, I don’t think he knows what morals are.
Very well said
@@PastaCool bot
The problem is Creating the Irgun to use terrorism negates the criticism of Hamas. Both are wrong but one can not point the finger of immorality at the other. If the Irgun got away with it then the other side expect to also get away with it, its took decades of persecution before the other side has lowered itself to the levels used against it.
His explanation is lacking, and I say this as an Israeli. The only thing we should ask ourselves is what’s the most effective alternative approach israel should take, regarding the history of combating these organisations (and regarding the fact that the latter will exploit whatever humanitarian breach you’ll give them, including their people’s suffering in order to extend the conflict).
Ireland and Palestine deserve to be free
So does Israel…
Hey, remember how well it worked out when the Irish started bombing in the UK? In Northern Ireland? Remember how that all worked out so well?
That's why you are a simpleton and should keep it to yourself.
@@beetalius Go eat beans brit
@@beetaliusIreland doesn't want the north back now 😂 country full of petulant simpletons on both sides who can't see shite go by them. Brits only kept the north to save face. The British army and RUC had 3 times as many deaths during the troubles as the republicans did. The republicans and the British army were at least fighting for a cause, the loyalist paramilitaries were nothing but murderers who mostly just killed Catholic civilians. You can keep the north. Costs a fortune to police, high unemployment and contributes very little to an economy.
"You know what's worse than killing innocent civilians... people not wanting innocent civilians to be killed" - Brendan O'Neil
Genocidal statement of the year
That was a bar .... 💯💯💯
Nah it was more like not wanting innocent civilians to be killed over and over and over again. Whereas they take out Hamas now and it should be over unless palestine attacks again
"innocents". how many would you say are innocent, excluding the population under 18.
@@ehaaron how many according to you?
Interesting discussion.
If Israel wanted to target "civilians" there wouldn't be one standing building in gaza, regardless of that the palis are the heart and soul of hamas so they should stop crying just because they're paying for their actions, about 1000 of the terrorists on 7.10 were just "regular civilians" that hamas called out spontaneously a short time before the attack, if you can justify people who raid like barbarians on a whim than youre on the side of the modern nazis
I cannot believe Joe has listened to Abby Martin talk for hours and he has no rebuttal
I know. 🤦
Good interviewers let the person express themselves. It's not a debate, it's an interview.
@@GaryARahnSo when's he having Abby Martin on again?
Where's Bassem
@@ryandamon9390 im literally waiting for basem
"Do we defend ourselves against this seige of antisemites?" Uhm, Palestinians are also semitic people. This guy is literally suffocating us with his ignorance.
And even if you accept "antisemitism" meaning anti-Jew, he leaves out the part where Israel stole the land they're on and has persecuted Palestinians for 75+ years. What a complete tool.
Lol you're playing word games. Antisemitism refers.to jews, not other semities.
@@dudebro91-fn7rz That's the most dumb thing i ever heard ... are you a westerner ?
@@dudebro91-fn7rz Of course my previous comment (not to you) got removed. But even if we go with antisemitism meaning anti joo, this guy completely ignores the history of is ray el land theft and persecution of the people who had lived there for hundreds of years.
@ShalomReza Look up the dictionary definition of antisemitism before you continue To make yourself look even dumber. I'm trying to do you a favor here.
If they need their own country, why didn't they give them their land? Why give them someone elses land?
I ain’t going to lie, dude makes really good points my man Joe.
Equating genocide with a civil war is laughable, a twisted logic
He knows full well what he is doing. He's just an imperialist.
no genocide there
I knowwww what happened in October was horrible and intentional🥲
We dont know the true numbers . The death counts come from hamas. Probably greatly exaggerated. But yes israel doesn't care much about them anymore. And who can blame them at this point?
@adirsab There is no war in Ba Sing Se
This guy is a clown
he's actually spot on and very reasonable
@@figsy69 yep he is absolutely not a clown in any way shape or form. i guess he just doesnt say what the op wants him to say so therfore starts name calling like a perpetual child. i would argue @farhada6488 is the clown here. A total NOBODY in a comment section if you will
@@figsy69 Nah his argument is stupid as fk, even Joe easily shut him down
@@robaudi20v No it’s because I’m living in reality and not trying to justify a genocide
@@robaudi20v😂😂😂😂 wtf
People like this are the reason why humanity is so sad. The point is forget the whole aspect of lines and let us strive for a better co existence as a collective race
You are forgetting something crucial. When Israel tries to move civilians out of harms way in order to get to Hamas, the world then accuses them of ethnic cleansing
By dropping flyers from the sky that Hamas is also going to see? Most bogus self righteous, useless act ever… If they agree that they’re innocent civilians then how about letting aid in
Exactly
Man Im so conflicted about this conflict. Its really effing complicated. I have to almost wonder if everything I thought I knew about this conflict was Muslim propaganda...its really deep
The comment section gives me hope. The guest gives me anger
For real. Wtf is this guy even saying. Im trying to follow but i just cant because hes saying a whole lot of nothing
Yes bro
I think he is high on transgender crap
Angry at what? What do you disagree with?
@@alexthurman6808 just about every word he says lol. The irony of someone saying that it’s justifiable for African nations to evict European settlers while saying this struggle is anything other than that… the levels of lying and inconsistency of moral standards is beyond reproach.
Look at the map of Palestine and Israel and tell us which people is fighting for its survival.
If you look at a history book you’ll see it’s very clearly one side
@@rundownthriftstore the way you commented this seems like you're saying it's Israel and that's ridiculous
If you just look at maps and history books you'll see that I'm clearly right
Look up the history of the Khazars and you will understand why the world is where it is at the moment.
I missed where the IDF flew paraglides into Palestine music festivals. They specifically targeted civilians and have a history of blending into civilian areas while conducting military operations making combating them that much harder. Just like Ukraine has the right to defend its borders, so doesn’t Israel.
I live in a decent size city and everytime we get a job with the city we have to sign a peace agreement that we will always side with Israel. Pretty wild
Well I tell you what as of I’ve always said it all reminds me of when you have the older siblings and you get mad because you are the younger one and you have no truly effort to beat them up it’s the matter of you can either try or not try but in reality it’s great where people say god whatever