How Strong Are DOWELS vs DOMINOS vs BISCUITS? Strength Test
In this video I test the strength of dowels, dominos and biscuits. This is a follow up to my "do biscuits add strength to a glue joint?" video which you can find here: bit.ly/biscuitjoint
I got a lot of feedback asking me to test dowels too, and now that I have a Festool Domino it's time to test them all out! I also test the wood glue on it's own.
How strong are dowels vs biscuits vs dominos? Let's find out!
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I think these numbers are inconclusive no matter how you want to spin it. (I don't mean you, as in you Keith) In all tests the glue failed, but one, where the board failed. So the reality is, ALL the joiners that were on test here, survived! Not one broke or even cracked... Stick with whatever works best for you, on whatever the build requires in your own shop. 👍 Either way, was an interesting test, one that certainly was a surprise! Cheers mate 👍
agreed!
Inconclusive as previously told. Great intent anyway. You should use same material everywhere next time. Maybe everything beech eitheir for the inserts and for the bench, no plywood (will be more costly, Iagree)
The weak link is the plywood. The dominos are taking more 'meat' out of the plywood than the dowels so were always going to lose out. All that aside, the variables in the consistency of the plywood itself can not be measured. I do not own a domino machine and do not intend to buy as I see them as a gimmick. In normal woodworking, I feel two rows of 6mm or 8mm dowels are a better choice with my JessEm jig. I have a biscuiter that I seldom use. For 'real' furniture I use the 8,000 year old mortise and tenon joint
Thank you for doing that test because I don't have a domino joiner and I use dowels so it just maybe confirms that dowels are good and I don't need to get a domino joiner just yet. Keep up the good work.
@JSTR Dominos are fast and easy to use and with practise can enable you to create perfect joints. Biscuit joints are good as well.
Tahir Awan night question. Dowels are excellent. The advantage of the domino is speed and forgiveness (can allow for imprecise mortises and still end up with perfect joints). Dowels are plenty strong.
Interesting series of tests, but I 'm not sure what it really shows. Many of the failures occurred because the plywood laminations separated as a result of local stress from the jointing device. And the fact that one of the failures was unrelated to the joint at all suggests that the strength of the laminations in the plywood was inconsistent. Also, the measured stress levels at the points of failure were relatively close together. So that would lead me to suggest that tests demonstrated that the plywood failed at relatively consistent points, but they didn't accurately measure the relative strengths of the jointing methods. For the tests to meaningfully compare the jointing methods, the material would have to be much stronger than the joints.
Agree
I would have to agree that the plywood seemed to be the point of failure. I’d like to see this test again using hard wood. Also most of the woodworkers I watch keep saying that the glue is stronger than the wood. With most of the test failing at the glue joint I think it’s safe to say you need to get some new wood glue, like actual yellow wood glue. Where I come from white glue isn’t for wood. If it’s cheap, it’s probably not good. Try lepage or titebond.
@@dagriff861 I would say using think hard wood so as to ensure that their is no breakout at the end. The problem then becomes having a system that can generate enough force to break the joint. I would be an interesting test.
Hard not to agree with this. I would love to see the test redone with jointed-edge hardwood, a rigid vice holding the stock, and a smoother escalation of force applied.
Nice test Keith. I believe that wood joints should always be designed and thought of in a way proper to their application. A chair needs very strong joints, a coffee table still needs strong joints but not as strong as a chair. All that matters is the application, in my opinion. I see lots of videos on KZhead where woodworkers seem to rely on the Domino machine mostly as a way to slap 2 parts together quickly - which is OK many times - but I like to pay much more attention to the geometry of the joint itself than to the actual piece of wood (or metal) that keeps 2 parts together.
Would you recommend dowels for a chair made of 2x4s?? If so what size dowels?? Thanks.
Good test. I agree wholeheartedly with your Observations. .
Thank you for the test, it is always a surprise what can come out
Interesting - but the test is actually applying tension to the joint (compression at the very top - the rest of the joint is under tension). Which is why the joints are pulling apart, without breaking the inserts. I'd be interested to see the difference in shear strength, which is what something like a bookcase would have to handle.
The festool fanboys will be in uproar 😁 long live the dowells
Yeah I’m ready and waiting for the wave of abuse! 😂
I’ve got the xl any way
+Jigsey's Wokshop I doubt the test was not that consistent. I suppose he used the materials that were on hand. High quality Plywood that was consistent would enable the 5mm Domino's to do better. I am a big fan of biscuit joints but there is no way a biscuit would be stronger than a 5mm Domino. I have seen 5mm Domino's support tables that had over 1 ton of weight on them.
@@RagnBoneBrown lol
@@jonh1808 Really glad I went with buying a dowel drilling guide jig...not only was it about 1/3 the price of a Porter Cable Biscuit Joiner, it's also occupies vastly less space in the shop...and makes way less noise...thank you for test video!
There's a reason dowels have been popular for 1,500 years.
Because biscuit joiners were only invented in 1956...
Agree 100%
Thanks. This answered the exact question I was searching for -- how strong can a plywood to plywood joint on their edges be? Not a good idea it seems. I will approach my plywood project accordingly. Thanks again for saving me the trial and error process.
Great video man! Thanks for making it.
As always, thank you for another good video. I was surprised by the domino results, but that’s why tests are done. Keep up the good work.
Great video. Im applying some of this logic to some stretcher frame making.
I was entertained and I found the test results to be interesting. Thank you for the video, Keith, it was a good way to pass the time while I ate my baked potato!
Great video and lots to think about when choosing!
It seems like the parts that failed where the glue or plywood. It would be interesting to try the test again with some pine solid wood and Titebond 3 for glue, end grain to side grain joints like they would be in a chair or a table
Very enjoyable video - nice testing, interesting results
That could be an interesting test, but the plywood was not the ideal choice. I am a huge fan of dowels. They're easy to use without the need of fancy tools, extremely strong and cheap. I sometimes add dowels even if I've already glued a butt joint which is a great plus.
These reviews are great mate 🍻👍👍
Given that most of these failures were the actual plywood or the glue, as you acknowledge at the end, this isn't really representative. What you found in the end is that dominoes and dowels are both stronger than a plywood end-grain to end-grain joint. I see folks in the comments drawing the wrong conclusions, in support of whatever their favorite is. Almost every joint I do that requires strength is a 90 degree connection of some sort. Like you and others say, dowels and dominoes are very similar strength-wise. I prefer domino for all the reasons you mentioned, but I sometimes use pocket screws instead because *all* of these things are strong enough for what we typically use them for, which is not an end-grain plywood to plywood joint on inexpensive and relatively low quality plywood. :) Still fun to watch. I did fear for your clamps :)
Interesting. Thanks for testing and sharing! : )
The "resting" side of your setup needs to be a lot more solid I think. To me it seems like this variability could introduce a lot of inconsistencies in the outcome. Or maybe even a bridge-type setup where you rest left/right and apply pressure in the middle (because those are easier to get set up "solidly"). Test design is a fascinating subject :D
IMHO you had failures that voided the entire test. Failure of glue and plywood do not really test dowels, dominos or biscuits. Please retry with some good hardwood and titebond III
Jeez John I bet you’re fun at parties...... why don’t you do a test and make a video if you’re so interested!?
@@plasticbadger1663 he is an absolute blast at parties, can confirm. Swoons everyone with interesting facts. But in all honesty.. He's not wrong here brother.
Great information, thanks. It would be interesting to see a comprehensive test using hard woods, end grain to end grain, edge grain to edge grain , and end grain to edge grain. I know that's a lot. Your analyses seemed to be very thorough.
just the info i needed. thanks
good job testing
Excelente vídeo!!!! Podrías hacer la prueba en madera solida
Thank you for the video. Two things. First, I would like to see someone compare a single Domino strength to simply using two 5 cent Lamello Biscuits on top of one another. No one has done that. Even a clone Domino is 17 cents. Second, I used calipers and measured the thickness of 30 each of DeWalt and Swiss-made Lamello plate joiner Biscuits. Lamello was 1000 for $46.37 from Amazon, which is 4.6 cents each. DeWalt was $7.98 for 100 from Lowes, which is 8 cents each. I calculated the mean and standard deviation of the thicknesses and the Lamello were more than 3x as uniform. 97.7% of Lamello are predicted to be between 3.69 and 4.00mm. DeWalt are 3.34 to 4.31mm. The goal is to be as close to 4mm without going over. Visually, the Lamello have a glue-gripping pattern on each side. The DeWalt had a more shallow grid on one side. No sense in judging biscuits without using Lamello brand.
What it showed me is not to use plywood when doing joints and that if you do it's not worth the effort to do more than glue it since the glue is about as strong as the joint anyways.
and here I was thinkin' I was adding strength... thanks Keith!
Great job!
I love these kinds of vids.
Very interesting. Thanks
well done good info.
Don't understand why somebody would dislike this video.....I swear some people just hate themselves
Hi Keith. Wondering where you found 5x40mm dominoes. I’ve only seen 5x30 available. Thanks for any info.
It seems to me that it is the quality of the ply that needs to be tested first. I don't know how you do that though. Great video. Cheers John
It seemed like in nearly all the cases the dowel/biscuit/domino slipped out of its slot when the joint failed, the domino one especially looked like the glue was quite opaque at the end. Was it completely dry? I'd hazard a guess that if the glue bond inside the slot isn't strong then whichever method removes the most glueable surface area would be the weakest.
very useful and interesting video
how many inch plywood you used in testing?
Very interesting test. Thanks for sharing. It seems that for connecting pieces of plywood it's enough to use only glue. A chain is as weak as it weakest connection, which in all cases was the glue. (although only with glue the whole construction collapses, dowels and dominos will keep the construction more or less together) But (maybe a stupid question) why should somebody connect two pieces of plywood? Plywood is a sheet good and better (stronger) to use in one piece (length or width)
Would be interesting to see it done with hardwood and maybe a different type of glue. And compare the results to this one. Just to be definitive.
Here because while I love my beadlock tenoning jig, occasionally making the multiple passes moves the jig. You don’t realize it until you’re laying in bed and looking at a cabinet that is less than 1/8’s and inch off. So… here we are!
Nice one Keith, if i were younger and doing this as a business, i would have a domino, but i might just try dowels next time i create something that requires a bit more strength, thanks for sharing.
Biscuit joints are a great options as well and many people misunderstand them and will say they are only for alignment.
The Domino removes more material from the plywood therefore weakening the plywood . This is why it break at lower pressure.
I saw this video after watching two Yankee guys testing glue only joints. They used solid wood in their tests. Several issues with using ply stand out. As you state, there are unpredictable weaknesses in ply however high the quality. What makes the ply resistant to breakage is its alternate layers, but two sawn edges present inconsistent fibre surfaces to all forms of gluing. Sawn timber is going to be7 truer. Dowels interfere with the wood continuity less than dominoes or biscuits. Dominoes appear to go as deep as dowels - biscuits are relatively superficial. As is stated biscuit and dominoes are speedier and more accurate in joint placement. I used a biscuit jointer for the first time recently - a cheap Screwfix tool - which was badly calibrated. I was gluing some old oak boards which butted up badly but were relatively flat. Biscuits allowed accurate positioning of one face - dowels would have been impossible (I'm no carpenter!). Used Gorilla glue rather than shell out for a large bottle of Titebond. I think dominoes would have been the optimum method of getting an accurate join. Thanks for this video - taught me a lot. PS I took the b.jointer back to Screwfix. It did the job but I had to improvise. You do only get what you pay for.
Wandelful method and style.
Decent test, I’m not surprised about the domino results.
The reduction in maximum load of each joining insert measured relative to the glue-only joint may be proportional to the size of the cut into the side of the plywood and the following compromise of the layers. I don't know how you could have done the test better other than adding replication. Very interesting video. I like dowels but am trying to like biscuits more. Regardless, a lot of furniture out there without only side gluing. (Off to your other video to see those results.) Thank you.
Would biscuits/dowels/dominoes provide any benefit over just glue when subject to fatigue or glue strength deteriorating over the years, etc? Wouldn't be an easy experiment though.
Glue joints are not reliable as they are only relying on the surface area bonding. If there is a chemical failure over time due to oxidation then that glue joint will come apart and when force is also applied to the joint it will have greater effect. I have done biscuit joints on tables that are now over 20 years old and are still going strong but plain glue butt joints have now come apart even though both used the exact same batch of glue and wood. Screw joints would be more reliable than glue butt joints.
@@bighands69 Thanks, that's what I was really interested in... the reliability of glue-only joints after 10, 20, 30 years etc. Things like chemical reactions / oxidation, fatigue, long term stresses in general etc are not mentioned in these kinds of tests on youtube, and fair enough - they're hard to test/quantify
@@reversegreenpotato These tests are only focusing on shear strength of the joints which is a good test. But in terms of long term reliability it is hard to do tests on that. If you search the internet you will find that there are plenty of people that have built furniture with different joint types. For tables plain mortise and tenon joints are not the best joint as they can with forces get weak on the pull out so you will see people use through dowels into the side of the tenon joint to compensate for this. Here is a good example of a design were you could substitute biscuit joints for the screws that are used. www.canadianwoodworking.com/plans-projects/build-patio-harvest-table You can also do combined wood joints such as in one joint you have a dovetail and tenon joint. At the top it could be a dovetail joint and at the base of that joint it could be a tenon joint. There are so many ways things can be done and so many religions in wood work telling you their way is the only way to joinery salvation.
With a good doweling jig (dowelmax, jessum, milescraft, rockler) it is just about as fast as domino. Most dowel jigs clamp to the workpiece making them potentially more precise. The big difference is dowels use a drill which is one of the most common and useful tools anyone has an excellent drill can be had for a fraction of the cost of a domino. Also dowels can be made in any species of wood if you want to display the joinery commercial dowels are super available and very inexpensive compared with domino. A domino joiner is a fun capable tool but to say it’s superior to dowels is simply a matter of being a fan of the tool not the joinery.
I think your test was flawed from the start because of the plywood used. maybe Maple wood would have been better as the grain is much more consistant and more denser than cheap voided ply
I really have to doubt this they for several reasons: Your test setup was tilting a lot on itself. Maybe a larger surface and two clamps? Did you hit the exact same spot on the scale and the glued piece? (Torque=Force*Distance) One factor might also be the thickness and quality of your plywood vs. the thickness and length of the dowel or domino, as you weaken the side material with a thicker domino a lot, where a dowel may not. Compare it to a mortise and tenon joint, where the tenon should be 1/3 of the thickness. Here your 8mm dominos looked too close the the upper layer and ripped it clean out. The 5mm dominos looked very short... So maybe good hardwood and different joints would be nice. Most interesting would be where which method accels, i.e. miters. Who would actually glue up two bords like that!? 😉
My 30 year experience using a lot of biscuits and loose tenons. I see lots of dowel failures in commercial furniture. I have never had a proper biscuit joint fail. I now have a Domino. I expect it will perform the same as other loose tenons. Your test was interesting but not real world.
Make some Roubo bookstands!
Using plywood really handicaps this test. Also, only doing a single test with each method, rather than at least 3-5 repeats, can be very misleading (as seen with your mid-panel failure). It was a good start but getting a good distribution costs a lot in terms of materials, test apparatus and time. I would say this gets us started down the road to understanding as well as evaluating the value of a specialized tool such as the Domino or even the biscuit jointer. Nice job.
@@MKRM27 The value of the test is weakened by the failure occurring regularly in the wood rather than the joint. Ideally you'd like the joint to be the weakest point to insure that you are testing the joint itself. By the plywood letting go first, all you are really proving is that the joint is stronger than the surrounding wood (we already knew that a glued joint got us that much). There is a difference between consistency and better test design that truly evaluates the variable you are looking to test. Rag 'n Bone admits that his ability to stress the joints is limited by his shop/equipment (this would be the case for most of us with home shops) so this test is consistent and worthwhile. That doesn't mean that the design couldn't be changed to yield better, more illuminating results.
How much is a Festool compared to a dowel jig?
Roughly 600 to 100 GBP. But 500 GBP difference for a professional is not so much. That's somewhere between 17 and 20 hours of working time, which easily can be saved in a short period.
Dowel jigs are fine for DIY projects or for very high end work that means the time will pay for it self. They are simply not good for general commercial work as they require lots of practice mistakes and are time consuming to use. Commercial grade work is really dictated by cost and profitability.
Watching this test I wondered if you considered that bigger holes in plywood made dominos test fail comparing to dowels which have smaller holes in plywood or just glue where there are no holes and therefore those holes made a weak spot for breaking plywood? Maybe I'm wrong but bigger holes = bigger chance of 18mm plywood breaking.
From an engineer’s view, this test is less convincing. You need keep the same distance between the moving clamp and the joiner. For failure test, you need repeat a lot times to accumulate statistically meaning result. Anyway, the test is interesting.
Interesting experiment. Domino's / biscuits / dowels will probably strengthen joints where one of the wood pieces is end grain. That is a scenario where they are often used so would be another interesting test.
I honestly didn’t understand why the dominos and biscuits existed in the first place. All the dowels I’ve ever seen, even as a kid, are grooved to increase surface area. The glue is the primary thing holding it together. Then you look at cost effectiveness and availability. I get a pack of a couple dozen hardwood dowels for less than a couple dollars at Lowe’s. Under what reality would the dominos or biscuits possibly be better?
Dowels are great I totally agree, but there is no machine that I am aware of that accurately drills dowel holes and makes the process of dowel joinery quick and efficient, which to a modern day joiner is a big problem. The Triton doweller machine should have been the machine to do it, but the reviews seem to suggest that it's inaccurate
Rag 'n' Bone Brown shouldn’t just a plane ol drill press with a fence do the same?
Those dowels are strong as anyone could want, as strong or stronger than domino, and WAY less expensive using a drill which most everyone has in their shop.
you should use hard wood not plywood to do these tests.
Better test setup would probably be side grain to end grain. Just too many inconsistencies between plywoods
Needs a repeat on end grain to end grain in normal timber.
I think an important take away is the glue joint failed instantly and totally. The dowel joints and 'successful' domino joints failed at similar or higher strength but had some residual strength. Perhaps that could be an important safety factor. May give you or your customer time to think and recover before they hit the floor.
I think, and from what you've said you do too, that some of the surprises here are down to inconsistencies in the ply. Would be a good one to have another go at if you scavenge some skip scraps of solid wood at some point. Dowels, dominoes and loose tenons of varying types are strong and proven. The thickness of the dowel/loose tenon in relation to the wood is an important one. You don't really want to use say an 8mm former in 12mm latter. Still, love a vs test and you spoil us Kieth. Cheers mate.
That test taught me that you're glue sucks. Do it again with tight Bond too
Dowels it is!
Try to damp end grain with water before you glue or use a little glue on the end grain and let it dry to where it is tacky dry. The grain will suck the glue deeper into the board and not leave enough to the joint
What I take away from this is that dowels are just as strong as domino's but the advantage like you said is that domino's are a faster to do. Not being a tradesman and already a biscuit jointer owner, I think I'll just stick with that and buy a dowel jig. Great video, thanks for that, interesting test. Would be good to try a rebate slot and glue only.
Mafell Duo Jointer can be had for £700 to £850. If you were to buy the Mafell DDF40 for £850 it can do dowels from 3mm to 16mm which means it can do the job of the domino df500 and df700 which would cost about £1600 together.
Interesting I used dowels in my old chipboard projects and they were strong.
I "always" use dowels. I do not have a machine for biscuits or dominos. Only the last few years (since I started watching woodworking videos on You Tube) I also use wood glue (but not always) together with the dowels.
I like working with dowels! Although mis alignment is a hard thing to avoid but your dowel jig is a good idea! I will make one of them at my school which has a drill press
You must be the only one🤣 although I can't say I enjoy working with dowels, I do use them as I don't have a domino...yet
@@paulmcfadyen689 ahh, well I'm realy not interested in power tools, I drill by hand btw
@@LegoMan-cz4mn I'm way too lazy for that lol
@@paulmcfadyen689 hahaha well yeah, that's also a posibility
@@LegoMan-cz4mn You might even try digging with a tooth pick. Especially recommended for beech and oak. LOL
for the costs, Dowel wins
By applying the clamp pressure to the side of the joint you are skewing the force and in advert entry applying more force to only one of the biscuit/dowel/domino. In future tests apply the splitting force at the center of the end board (I.e., 90 degrees from where you were). I’m not a hater i do enjoy your posts.
I've been telling people for years how strong dowls are if done correctly and they are a hell of lot cheaper. Every test I've seen between dowels and dominos, dowls win. And remember the vast majority of people are not doing a production run The funny bit of the video is . Not wanting to waste plywood. A domino is a waste of money for most people. Don't fall for the pr sales pitch
In plywood ,it won’t make much difference,a biscuit jointer it is more than enough
seems to me that the dominos acted as levers to delaminate the plywood
I just use simple nails for alignment. Tap them in and cut the heads of. Much easier, faster and cheaper.
@JSTR I have been using biscuit joints for over 20 years and have found them to be strong enough for many applications. I have also used tenons and Dowel joints and find that they are great options as well.
Looks like the larger dowels and dominos were much stronger they were able to transfer the forces past the domino or dowel obviously because they remained but the ply gave up at the end of the dominos.
All that being said, I bet your really chuffed you have a domino, and I bet you won’t get rid of it. I love mine. It’s such an incredible tool👍
I've never seen a test for buscuits in a real world application manner
I have been using biscuit joints over 20 years. They are strong enough for many tasks including cabinets and I have used them in tables as well. Now if doing a large table you can combine them with other techniques as well. Look at this design and imagine how you could use biscuits, dowels and screws combined or even on their own if you wanted to. www.canadianwoodworking.com/plans-projects/build-patio-harvest-table
You need to do the same test multiple times and take an average to get statistically relevant results.
Are you sure they are 5x40mm Domino's? I've never seen those only 5x30. Maybe my supplier just doesn't keep them.
You’re right they are 30mm! Sorry for any confusion
@@RagnBoneBrown no worries, just thought I was missing out on a size! ✌️
Totally undersigned.
Maybe the test shows you need to upgrade your glue :)
The glue only test peaked at 66kg of pressure applied to it. That’s an awful lot of pressure! i don’t think there’s a problem with the glue. Any pva glue is stronger than the wood itself. Even the cheapest stuff from Poundland
You sayd glue is good 🤔
I think you should use solid wood as a better test as the difference between them is minimal. The glue we know is stronger than the wood itself. End grain to end grain as that's the weakest point therefore giving you a more accurate reading for the dowels and dominoes and biscuits. Good vid tho
Thick solid would be the way to go but good luck trying to have a set up that could break it.
Actually, there are videos showing end grain to end grain produce a stronger joint than edge to edge gluing.
I think the dominos failed before the dowels because they were bigger levers. The failure was in the plywood, when leverage was applied. If the plywood was much stronger, then maybe the dowels and dominos would have failed first.
would it be worth doing another test with something cheap, like pallet wood instead?
I don’t think so because wood glue is stronger than the wood itself, so the wood would just break rather than the glue joint. All goes to show how amazing modern wood glue is!
@JSTR 'cheap' was probably the wrong choice of word to use, I was wondering if using solid wood (pallets as an example) would give a better result then using plywood, but Keith and yourself have answered my question.
+Enabled Workshop Pallet wood is not made out of any one type of wood so it would be hard to make a pallet would test that then could be relevant to everybody.
It's the glue use tight bond or granola glue!!
Is "granola glue" only good in "with the grain" joints"??? 😉
@@robinaveling5956 grain, Granola, biscuit..humm i'm hungry !!!
Mummmhh! Hobnobs (the Royal Marines of dunking)
This video proves pinning dowels and especially dominos deserves consideration. They are tenons after all.
I think maybe dominoes are just the wrong choice for ply. It looked like the wide hole made for them weakened one of the layers.
No it is probably poor quality plywood. If he used higher quality plywood I doubt he would not have been able to break it so easily. If he used thick natural wood he probably would need some industrial system to test it. Glue joints are strong but would trust them long term?
I think you said all that needed to be said so I will leave it at that.
Interesting but perhaps don’t use plywood.
Sorry Keith, but the only thing demonstrated by your test was that glue joints fail. The addition of dowels, biscuits and dominos added such a small amount of increased strength as to be almost useless.
Plywood as a particular breaking point that these joints did not actually fail and that includes the biscuit joint. Cheap plywood is not a good testing point but it does allow people to understand what you can get out of these methods with cheaper grade plywood.
Thanks for doing such a test sequence. Very interesting. I believe the biggest inconsistency comes from the ply used. I also find the orientation odd and unrealistic. Could you try a typical corner joint instead? I'm in love with the domino cutter but can easily accept that dowels may offer similar added strength. The speed and usability of the domino will never be matched.
In my experience most of the plywood commonly available in the UK is pretty inferior. Rather than be shocked at one of your sheets completely failing at the joint, I was surprised your joints failed first in the other tests. And as for the 'best quality' 'hardwood faced' plywood - with huge variations in colour and with big patches, and voids everywhere, it is anything but quality. But that is what the market seems to put up with.
most uk ply is ok for shuttering and...... er......shuttering
@@MrBez007 There is different grades of plywood. None structure grade plywood is very common in the UK and to be honest is just cheap rubbish.
Looks like the glue may not be as good as you thought.
Funny how I'm still using it years later