A6 C8 and A8 D5 with noisy 3.0TDI engine.Audi dealer said it's normal acoustic noise, did we fix it?
Welcome to a 3rd video with the A6 and A8 with 3rd gen TDI engine.
Both cars came in at almost the same time for the repair after we did the technical report on them and the warranty company agreed to go ahead. In this video not only do we change parts but we want to get to the bottom of the issue. We made a measuring tool to check the clearance between the camshaft sprockets before we took them off and did the same measurement after we installed new parts according to the Audi manual. Will all this sort out the noise coming from the engine or was it a waste of money ?
Thank you for watching
If you want to get in touch with us visit our website www.vagtechnic.uk
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The finger indeed helped to hear the noise, excellent addition!! 🤙
Mech Eng here. That pitting is in fact sub surface fatigue of the material caused by the material being over stressed and then failing such that a piece then falls out. This is likely one more of a few things, narrow contact width, material specification, heat treatment, lubrication issue. The spring force onto the tooth looks a bad idea from a tooth life point of view imo.If you want to find out definitively then send it to a materials test lab and they will tell from the morphology and strength test what is likely the problem. Unless your oil pressure mod gets more oil there then it isnt going to work but a supplementary spray jet may well help a lot if you can figure a way but no doubt not easy.
Helical cut gears would go a long way to solving this.
@@xxshellsbellsxxcan't get a chain on that
Precision works…. Good job mate…
For some reason I love the finger wags
FANTASTIC WORK
GREAT VLOG AS USUAL
great stuff ! very formative and interesting
When Audi spend billions on a high performance engines and their mechanics half arse it by saying its within tolerances tells me all i need to know about Audi workshops. There is a clear difference in engine sounds before and after, no mechanic worth their salt would say that was acceptable
You can’t avoid the human factor. Same as doctors you can find those who really know what to do and what to search and those that will you a painkiller just. I am driving always my Audis 380km to the dealer service of another city simply because I know the technicians are doing what they are supposed to be doing
Billions spent on a 3.0 tdi engine I think not there fuckin junk mate Pmsl as for high performance that’s lol
If they spent billions why are they shit 😅 btw there is no such thing as an Audi engine, it's all VW. All r and d goes through vw. Even the veyron/Chiron engine is 2 Passat w8 engines on a shared crank 😂
Some of the wear on the cam gears looks like cavitation orientated wear. The profile of the gears will likely be promoting cavitation of the lubricating oil at or above a certain RPM.
It’s good to see someone that still takes pride in their work, love this channel , it never disappoints - I’m on like Audi number 7 - I feel you guys ! Minus a lift
Seems like the loose tensioner let the chain wear the cam sprockets ? Vibration from loose chain tensioner ?
Audi: Secretly subscribed to VAG Technic and taking notes on what is being seen in the field while “coincidentally” releasing updated parts. VAG Technic: Quietly fixing poorly designed VAG products while fighting a public backlash of haters! Well done yet again. Really curious to see how long this new part number will last.
Love your content Tomas.. Even if slightly frightening as I own a 2016 3.0 bitdi SQ5+ 😬
Great work as always well done on that one😁 Looking forward to the next one 😒
Good update keep it up the good work 👍👍
My Audi sounds exactly like that from almost new! Never bothered me and car drives like a dream 😊
Here's some fuel for paranoia. What if your Audi has been broken since new and you just don't know any better :D
@@boerieza many audis are ...
Same here. Diesel engines rattle. But if you didn’t buy a petrol like this guy recommends and don’t need an engine replacement you can always spend ££££ on the “noise”.
I had a q7 2017 3.0 TDI. I bought it at 48.000km and drove to 160.000km with nearly all the time towing a trailer between 1300 an 3500kg. I only changed the oil/filters and had a minor coolant leak for the whole time I owned it. It made the normal diesel rattles but had no issues luckily. Maybe the car is now destroying someones wallet but my experience was good
@@thizmferiznotreal I have owned Audi A4 b6, B7, B8 and B9 Allroad and now driving 2020 A6 allroad c8 and all these diesels make funny "noise". After spending thousands on my b6, and learning everything there is to learn about Audi diesels, I will never spend money on subtle "noises" again! Can anyone on here share any link where this 3.0 tdi engine has had a catastrophic failure because of the said "noise". I can't find any 😅
Characteriatic and aesthetic quality.
Amazing. I have a 2012 volvo xc70 D5 awd 215hp engine with 470.000km on odometer. Have followed maintenance, and have had no problems. Fluched gearbox 5 times, replaced two heater fans, one wheel bearing and all shocks, but thats it. My wife had a 2007 Audi A4 turbo Quatro, which exploded with only 190.000 km on it, because of stretched cam chain. VAG=nice cars with good performance and nice to drive, but not reliable.
You can continue to drive that shuebox lol
I have a 350,000mile 2.0tdi engine has never been opened only suspension and oil changes. Original clutch too
Love your videos
I hear them saying "Minor acoustic inconvenience" alot😂😂😂 First time about 15 years ago, back in the days of the first gen 3.0tdi regarding the timing chain issues.
Because that is exactly what it is. Show me where a 3.0 tdi engine has had a catastrophic failure because of the said subtle "noise"
@@prrrakrrra A relatively high performance engine on a 20k+€ car pushed regularly and out of time.. yeah it will fail. Theres plenty of 3.0TDi engines that died... the first owner is generally ok but the 2nd one usually cheaps out because he/she wants a premium car for a fraction of the price and then the 3rd owner will pay the price :D either way its not that bad, of course mechanics show the bad cases because noone brings in a car for 10 000€ service when its working right :D
Those engines are normally brilliant
Happy to help you out with any questions regarding 48v repair
Same, even though I know nothing about the system.
The whole point of the secondary gears is that it gives zero backlash....there shouldn't be any freevplay at all!
he intentionally locked the two to measure the play. anyway, no play is probably not a good idea from wear perspective
yet another interesting video would just like to ask you guys were you gained your knowledge and experience with VAG products were you master techs within the VAG group .
good job!
Great video as always! Wanted to ask your advice for buying a 2024 Q7, any engine to avoid?
Makes you wonder what the life is if a VW, Audi TDI engine with normal servicing as detailed by manufacturer. Plus can you trust the dealership?
i had a4 b6 with 419 000 km engine had 0 problems and now i have b9 2.0 tdi 140km with 210 000km and also no problem change oil at 10 000km and clean intake time to time about 60 000km
It's bad engineering. Straight cut gears have rough engagement Vs helical gears. Toyota used gear drives on the 1uz in 89 and onwards and they had helical cut gears, no issues
I know nothing about Audi's, but love your honest channel :) I don't think the ticking noise was caused by the wear on the camshaft gears - even though I agree that wear is extensive for 30k miles. I think the ticking was caused by soft hydraulic lifter which you replaced as well. This must be some bad material choice for those gears by manufacturer as they shouldn't wear that much - or maybe the backlash tension is set too high.
We used to use pins on opposite sides of gears and then measure size of diameter. This gives you wear on gears.
So do you think the oil cleaning fluid you added prior to oil drain may have improved the chain tensioner operation on the A8? I always use an oil system cleaner (Penrite product here in Australia) in all my engines that I service and I stand by this process for sure. It seems that any engine work on Audi needs an engine removal from what I see on your channel. Very expensive cars to maintain given the material failures in the cam drive gears. Do you see the brand of oil used making any difference to the logevity of these gears?
It would be normal for like materials to polish each other when coming into regular contact. The state of those gear teeth, however, is pretty bad. That will have an effect and degrade further over time.
Another very informative video. What is the manufacturer is the scissor lift table at 20.00? Greetings from Germany.
I own a present gen A8 and know a ton about the 48V system. Let me guess. The belt starter generator died and you need to replace it. In time, you will know how to do it in your sleep. These fail every ~ 4 years, every ~40,000 miles. I track this on Audi World and have a huge data set. Big sigh.
For the inlet manifold cleaning try Mr Mussel oven cleaner be sure to wear gloves😷🌞
Great video guys and loved the Root Cause Analysis on the gear teeth, it was plain to see once you pointed it out, Warranty companies couldn't argue against that. Do you ever give feedback to Audi on your findings, although they possibly know about this issue anyway. Keep up the great videos and keep finding those faults.
audi do not acknowledge any issues with their cars. ever
I'm not talking about feedback to the Audi dealerships, but feedback to Audi UK (HQ)
@@camau3 Audi UK couldn't care less, they barely recall anything in the UK regarding engine problems. Just as an example the thermostat leak on a EA888.3 engine. All they do is issue technical service bulletins to the dealers but don't give any recall notices on bad parts. In America however its different, car owners sue Audi themselves forcing them to have lots more recalls to engine problems etc.
You know nothing! Audi have a bulletin on this issue. @kevinmortimer1883
@@clarkson427 have a bulletin just means they know the problem exists. They offer no support to fix it especially if people don’t have warranty, even though it’s a fault from the manufacturing side of things
Hi, can I ask, if the back lash is left unchecked on the 30k engine, what would you expect the mean time to failure to be, and what would the failure actually be? Is the engine at risk of becoming out of time and/or a catastrophic failure or just extra mechanical noises? It really looks like the double sprocket is designed to compensate for tear and wear to keep backlash to a minimum. Reminds me of my old Fiat Coupe 20v Turbo oil pressure paranoia, and my current N47 timing chain paranoia. Noises that shouldn't be there, but its not broken its a feature from Audi inspector made me wonder, can it be just left and live with it or ticking time bomb.
the Audi saint, with a Dobermann(best dog ever made, no debate, I have 2 but 4 total)
Why do the sprockets wear out so fast? Are they not case hardened to correct depth? Or just bad design? Thanks
good luck to you! tell me the engine oil temperature rs5 B9 oil 0 W 30 what is the maximum? Thank you)
Just noticed different number plates between the car in the work show and the Audi cam is it the same car?
I had a flat spot on my Audi once and Audi UK said it was normal. It turned out that the turbo was ceasing up eventually
Now there is another noise instead :D
Could it be down to oil change intervals My Skoda was on variable service when I got it, think it was 20k or so many months. I’ve just done it every 10k Lads 1ltr eco boost engine, I’ve changed oil every 10k and recently done the Wetbelt on it. Oil pump was spotless and not like you see on KZhead
We deal with a warranty company in Ireland. Scammers. They get us to strip and remove parts then tell us that parts not covered so ends up with a car stripped on the ramp for weeks waiting for some one to pay
Hi do you have a link to the chemical cleaner for intake as I’m due an oil change on my 2008 a5 3.0 tdi
I am looking for a c8, what do you think of 55 tfsi engine, does it have any problems, and which is it?
What is the name of the chemical you are using for cleaning the intake manifold please? Thank you
How about using dial indicator to measure play? Just a steady stand with it and you can show play with that.
Not long enough
what tool you use for cleaning intake manifolds?
It’s in tolerance is mechanic’s favourite words I’ve spent £800 getting my steering straight only to be told when it’s off set oh it’s in tolerance not my tolerance it’s not
Hello, is the gasoline engine from the A8 60tfsi better?
24:01 - Wow, an expensive baby rattle.
Is it possible that the 839 engine has the same sound from the balance shaft gear?
I wonder what lubrication can be used to ensure that the throttle body works properly in a B8 S4? and if you replace it, do you have to code it to the car, or can you literally swap out one throttle body for another?
Had these engines done very high mileage?
Hey its this a problem with diesels or petrol or both?
At the end of the day, can we truly trust dealerships (not to mention, their knowledge) to have our best interest at heart? I think not!!! Let's not stop at the dealerships, The brand is also to blame for cutting corners.
Vag owners: you don't understand, maintanence wasn't done on time, haven't had a single issue with mine!
Had a Q7 in with this engine for glow plug failure and when i started it i rang the customer straight away and said i dont want to touch it until you come hear the noise it’s making and his answer was “ yeah its been making that noise for nearly 3 years i was told it was normal “ 🤦🏼♂️ it sounded like it was about to explode 😂 i told him it needed engine out and chains kit replaced possibly more depending on what is found he said nah its fine 😂
Is this the same 3.0 Tdi in the Porsche Cayenne?
Strange that range rover/Ford use cam sprockets without the separate tension part with zero issues
Is exist complet part replacement and guide to do this kind at self?
The remap of oil pressure you did in A8 doesn t affect the full warranty?
What warranty?
Did you forget to remove the pins from the camshaft before measuring? :) 16:30
According to many petrol engineers I have talked to, Oil Needs to be changed every 3000miles or 5000km, if you plan on keeping it for a long time. Dealers and Manufacture recommend 7500miles intervals or more but they also want to sell you another Audi.
This video just tell me that my a6 c8 need to go for sell to avoid silly bills to pay.
Tdi are normally noisey just inspect your cam gears and timing chain.
sorry, the master tech and the mechanic are talking rubbish...seriously...this is why it's best to come to you and get a PROFESSIONAL diagnosis and correct fix for the issue. I love coming to you for advice and also proper repairs and diagnosis. them guys there don't have a clue about the engines
I leaned to stay away from Audi.😂
Have to say watching to the end and seeing the state of those sprockets and the missing material, Audi just got the design wrong here, maybe combined with thin oils they run now for economy and start stop technology letting the oil drain away is not helping. No wonder they have changed the part number, probably added a harder coating to the gears/spockets to try and mitigate the issue. I wonder if running a thicker oil would help alot?
Thicker oil?i don't buy this... what is with a cold start than?this is overerengineering or simply deutsch logik.this shi...is bad and we the best oil still is the shi...
@@zikovsnorton A 5w-30 and 5w-40 both behave exactly the same at cold start, but one is thicker when hot. He's exactly right in what he said, these manufacturers are using ridiculously thin oils in an effort to maximise MPG and reduce emissions.
@@MattyEnglandok but distribution and lubrication it's so shi...on the car.you can have more km with another oil but you have same shi..under the hood
I thinks it more the straight cut versus other manufacturers who use helical cut gears which can handle more wear, the coating is just a band aid to slow down the wear from contact,
I've never thought about it, thin oils paired with start stop and the motor not warming up frequently is a very bad mix.
Unrelated question. I am looking at purchasing a A6 C7 audi with the 3.0 Supercharged v6 ( or a B8 S4 with the 3.0 supercharged v6 ) is there any real big got ya's with those models engine wise?
Depends where from
@@VAGTechnic I’m from nz so I won’t go for a japanese/singapore import
At 30,000 I’m these problems should not be present on a diesel engine. These modern cars are absolutely rubbish. The cost of repair is extortionate.
Emissions regulations and its consequences have been a disaster for automotive reliability. You can clearly see engine reliability nosedive after 2005.
Looks like the case hardening has failed on the gears.
My chain rattle some times on cold start, should i be worry. Audi 3.0 218hp 2016
In a few years as the teeth eat away at each other, yes.
Seriously thought about getting a a6 bitdi these videos have made me stay away from them
Is there a new(er) Audi which is reliable?
The Volkswagen based EVs? 😂 Not real Audis though...
Have they got the 2.0 TSI sorted out by now? I would think they just about have the bugs worked out by 2024 lol it's only been 20 years.
@@Salmon_Rush_Die I got new A4 with TSi 2.0 mild hybrid. Previously owned GTi with TSi 2.0. Not sure what to expect from new one, but don't care. Amount of fun I got from those cars justify hight maintenance cost.
Even on video you can hear some unregular knocking noise coming from timechain area… Not sure how audi services can say it’s normal???
Good Job Tomas and team, and as I said before, what other car will give you 30 mpg return on average speed of 80mph over 80 miles huh? They are all flawed in design, I bet If i kick toyota like I do audi, it will fail badly sooner
That racket is normal for Audi 🤪
Pretty sure the Audi dealer employee knew full well what was going on here but it's such a large problem Audi are doing everything keep the number of repairs down and to avoid a recall or service action on this. If they were getting these engines in the US there would be a class action lawsuit going on.
Comments are hilarious 🤣 ppl need to relax.
The only way I'll enjoy the current generation of Audi/VW is if I am hiring. Can't own this engine nightmare.
could have just used a dial indicator to measure the play
It's crazy how these cars keep getting more expensive and with more problems. Audi... Always under diagnostic inspection 😂
Main dealers only good enough for an oil change and MOT.
I have an Q8 tdi and im afraid what will happen to it in a few years.
Dont worry mate , this is prob one out of 1000 audis that is broken , all of us audi owners are looking at this one audi and worrying , its a syndromme, your car will be fine
Yup, this is definetly overexaggarated, change oil every 10k km max, and this surely wont happen, and not that long life 30k km nonsense which is the main thing why this is happening
Take it to these guys and have the oil pressure mod done, check out the previous videos.
@@Koko.Bill. Exactly, I’ve just commented about the oil change interval, some of them are unreal
Where's Miroslav!?
In the office
Audi dealer didn't want to get involved in this claim.It's similar to other dealers who don't want to get their hands dirty. Brush the customer off unless they are looking to change their cars.
It kinda sounded like a rattling flywheel
Sound when engine has been on a good run before repair: kzhead.infoZSZl23e9-ho?si=VwPXN9Q43QzDWAJb
One thing I have learnt from Audi main dealers mechanics in my experiences is avoid Halesowen Audi when it comes to service or repairs.
anyone know the mileage of these engines ?, nevermind … only 86k on the A6 and 30k !!! on the A8… yikes… my 2015 Cayenne 3.0 has 105k … only momentary tick for 1-2 sec at cold start … but ive read somewhere thats a hydraulic lifter thing ? Anyone else had problems with their 3.0 ? Mine had the common coolant leak in the valley (intake off job) at 95k …
Guys, you don't make videos with petrol engines anymore. What happened? They have become more reliable than diesel ones, and stopped visiting service?)
Nah , habe to take a brake from TFSI videos 😀 coming out soon
I'm just curious why not use a dial indicator to check the backlash or the play between the cam gears like u would wen rebuilding a rear differential?
The materials used in the engine do not seem fit for purpose. It’s about time owners got together and took legal action against Audi.
the v10, the 5cyl, and the v8tt are ok all the rest isn't, not that I support any of those really
Comes down to bad design work and poor developement as even if the engineers believed that they had a durable design clearly in production the material chosen could not be made to withstand the forces involved and that shoudl have been spotted after engine endurance tests. If the new camshafts have a different part number there must be a technical bulletin in hte Audi system about that. Audi should be changing these FOC up to at least 60k miles even if car is out of warranty.
Audi engines just love to be out of their chassis, they demand it, please take me out!
can not help but say, why spend 5k + on that engine? it was running fine,so take it to a another brand dealer and part exchange it for a better car and brand.stay way from new audi.
Aesthetic noise... wtf?!?
I cant hear anything..
😀
@@VAGTechnic Will the engine have sudden catastrophic failure because of this noise? It it possible?
I'm a master tech for audi and this engine is a complete disaster on all levels!
Dealership mechanic hahahah...ITS NOT EFFECTING ENGINE PERFORMANCE 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 holy fuck