1 Year of Toyota PARTS CANNON...Long Crank When HOT? (Part 1 - 3rd Gen 4Runner)
2024 ж. 12 Қаң.
59 614 Рет қаралды
This 3rd gen 2002 Toyota 4Runner has issues starting after a HOT SOAK...
Lots of parts have been replaced, including the INJECTORS! ...SOUND FAMILIAR?
Even though we've seen these exact symptoms before on a 2003 Camry V6, let's NOT jump to conclusions just yet.
S.U.R. & R. FPT22 Deluxe Fuel Injection Pressure Tester:
www.amazon.com/dp/B004IJOLPE?...
S.U.R. & R. FPT290 Deluxe Fuel Pressure Tester Adapter Kit:
www.amazon.com/dp/B007QV0B6E?...
ASTRO AMP CLAMP:
www.amazon.com/dp/B08MTCMWLB?...
Enjoy!
Ivan
19:38 is where Eric O. says "Well there's your problem, lady!"
This video gave me the excuse I needed, to not go out and shovel in this blizzard. Wish it was longer.
Lol I'm still looking out the window, hopefully thinking the wind will change directions, and blow the snow drifts away. 😅
Good time to rewatch some oldies. Watched that one in the garage last night where someone put diesel in for gas. Good one!
Amazing! I can't believe that it runs so nice with fuel pressure that low and that the computer can compensate that much. Looking forward to part two.
It will run even better when the pump is replaced! That truck isn't a rocket, but it's down on power at WOT.
Well, even better is an understatement! This is my 3rd gen in the video & the throttle response is amazing. Not a race car, but love the butter smooth engine. Had one in my 97’ T-100 manual and loved it.
Congratulations on 200k subscribers
You & Eric O are my fav car guy's So smart , honest ,genuine and very hardworking . Ivan i hope its a fast journey to a million subscribers. You deserve to get that heated shop !!
Congrats on getting to 200K subs man! Another crazy case study for the master to help us learn with. Thanks for all the great content lately.
Thank you for your support! 🙏
It should be 2million you are great and more people would be able to fix their own stuff
I'd also check fuel pump connector for corrosion and pin fitting, and check pump one more time by feeding it good power and ground before condemning the pump.
Absolutely!
If I ever bring my vehicle to PHAD. I'm going to bring the vehicle in the summer so I can sit and drink cold beer. While I watch the video live.😆😆 Great job as always Ivan.
Hah.
Hey Ivan, just wanted to say that I have been liking your videos a little more than usual. I don't know what it is but keep up the great work! One critique, don't let us wait so long in between different parts! 😅
Yes please, upload part 2... love your videos 👍🇳🇱
I thought we had another Camry, but this is a whole lot different. "Weakest fuel pump ever" risks to be an understatement - 550mA?? Great diagnostic Ivan! Can't wait for Part 2 🙂
My experience with owning Yota trucks is they almost never leave you stranded, but hunting down oddities such as this one for the mechanically inclined dyi like me usually turns into the parts cannon and frustration. I've also learned more from your content about modern vehicles than any other channel I've discovered. Thank you for your hard work and sharing your knowledge.
200K! Hell yeah. Congrats Ivan!
18:03-I worked at Toyota when these were new and was really amazed wrenches didn't ever hit that battery post and roast a few vehicles and we tied the injector cleaner tool in there often.
I’ll be waiting for part #2. Thanks again
Nicely done man!
Great work! I was with you on this one - so many are over my head......
Congratulations on 200 k subscribers, Ivan! Always enjoy your videos….thanks!
You're definitely on the right track!! Thanks Ivan!!
Another interesting issue. Looking forward to part II.
BRAVO on such amazing diagnostics. Love your videos, your patience, your knowledge, your experience and your LOGIC.
Thanks for the video Ivan.
Love this channel
Very interesting final check on the pump draw.
I had the coolant hose problem before with a Tacoma after a had gasket failure. I attributed it to oil mixing with the coolant and softening the rubber. I had to replace every hose on it. The entire cooling system was a mess of oil/coolant mixture. I had to flush it several times.
Customer complaint is, I'm wanting to buy the newest model but this damn thing just won't die!
Great diag Ivan!
Your the best Ivan! Thanks!
I really appreciate you vocalizing your logic. It is very helpful in building a grasp of your diagnostic process. Thank you!
Will have to check out p2. Love the old Toyota trucks currently working thru a P2138 intermittent on my 03 tacoma. Good job Ivan and thanks for the content
hey Ivan, i hope you're having a great weekend.
I like the redundant testing.. You not only have pressure drop, but also it's pulling low current. I'd feel a lot better about dropping that tank after seeing both tests. Very nice. :)
Sr. Ivan. I thank you for all the knowledge that you share with us. Lost job and I need income so now I’m doing some repairs with friends. I live in California, too many shops. Unfortunately many costumers are cheated every day, from bad mechanics.
I took my printouts to my neor/sleep doctor. She said I have much better information than they do. She said she learns something every time I visit. Makes me wonder who should be paying.
Been waiting for this one to post. Hope he told you I guessed it right.
The voice of reason! It just did not act like a normal bad fuel pump, but yes brother…you were right this time!
You probably couldn’t hear Me, but I was suggesting to check the fuel pressure early on, especially after the first bean test. But at the same time I was thinking after all work that was done, someone surely covered that base. So I was right, and wrong at the same time! No access panel for the fuel pump? WTH. I had a Highlander of that same vintage, same engine, still kicking myself for selling it. Great stuff as always. 👍👍🇺🇸
great way to think abt open loop.. choke parameters...
The swollen hose was likely from the trans cooler leaking inside the radiator early in its life. EPDM material on the coolant hoses do not play well with petroleum products. Saw that happen a few times on these.
If so that would be a good reason to change out the cooling hoses, thermostat, etc.
Ah the radiator was definitely pretty new! So glad my Suzuki is a stick shift haha
Yep, the dreaded strawberry milkshake will degrade the coolant hoses, and possibly the rubber seals on the radiator cap and thermostat.
Ahhh, a blizzard special! Getting my cappuccino ready now. Let's goooo!!!
My car has similar issues and symptoms but it's very rare for the issue to show up. Doesn't want to idle on hot start without giving it some gas. Excited to see repair on this one.
High current might indicate a flow problem. Good call and thanks for teaching us to stick with the diagnostic tree and not to jump to the parts cannon. To me this looks like worn impellers on this 21 year old beast.
Good video! Looks like the PCV air intake hose fell off. The one between in the air intake pipe and the passenger side valve cover.
It just doesn't quit! You get your share of diagnostic treasures. My bet is on the injectors and possibly the fuel pump/regulator. The old injectors might be OK because the new ones are flowing more than spec to keep it running disguising or even causing the low fuel pressure.
Back in the day, the 87 Buick GNATs needed all the flow and pressure you could get when putting in bigger injectors, or raising the regulator pressure delta vs boost pressure. Either with a bigger pump or stock, we would measure the voltage and see .4 or .5 of a volt drop from the battery voltage, so from 14 to 13.5 example, at the back of the car, sometimes worse. That or more was enough to fight for and would have an effect on pressure and volume under high demand conditions (full throttle, max pulse width, 20+ psi boost). The most popular early fix for mild hp cars was a fuel pump wiring and relay kit. We’d run thicker wires (fused) from the battery power block back to just before the pump, and use a high amp rated relay to power the pump, using the former wires that powered the old pump to activate the better relay. This way the ECM and associated electrics still controlled the pump. This made a big difference in how a stock or upgraded pump would perform at higher pressures.
That coolant reservoir hose has been contaminated with oil of some kind. Radiator hoses do the same thing when trans coolers start leaking into the cooling system.
Thanks for this upload Ivan. I’m a Toyota fan also....especially that model. I’ve a 1992 Hilux Surf SSR-G 3.0 V-6 parked in my Tokyo garage.....maybe a 1st gen model? Loving your diagnosis regimen.
people are putting these 3.4 in place of the 3.0 never done one myself fyi long time toy mechanic here
@@juanrodriguez-ry6yt Hi Juan, thanks for the heads up on engine swap... not possible here due to government registration regulations... ie. weight, displacement, smog changes. Paperwork and certifications galore. Vehicle has only 77,000 KM..... gonna be a “barn-find for someone, for sure.
Very cool thanks Ivan, I've had this on the 4cyl 2700i Toyotas before, the pumps don't like to run dry at all and if they do they often start to lose pressure then become noisy, the Jeep 4.0 on the other hand will lose power with the slightest drop in fuel pressure🙂
I have seen the issue with the overflow pickup tube before. May be a difference in the type of antifreeze. That vehicle originally had green now red, mine was the opposite but same result.
My old 02 6.8l f250 had what I call a soft fuel pump failure. I was looking for the cause of a fish bite misfire at steady cruising, in the beginning it was only at 35-40 mph, over 2 years it grew in speed range. I did find 2 bad COPs but the fish bite remained. I checked fuel pressure with no load and it was perfectly in spec. I tested the regulator and it worked perfectly. When the fish bite got really annoying I did all of the same fuel pressure tests and got the same results so I put it in drive set the parking brake( my gauge has a short hose that didn't reach the windshield and I was alone) and just as the parking brake cable snapped I saw the pressure drop to 20 psi. Until that point I had max pressure on acceleration and above minimum at idle, in gear or out of gear.
Awesome! Yup, low fuel pressure will give all kinds of problems. My car had the hot soak problem. It was the fuel pump!! I was lucky, don't need to pull the tank in the 2004 Lincoln Town Car.
At least the Fuel Line Quick Connect Fitting didn't keep popping off inside the Fuel Tank. This actually happened on my 2010 Land Rover LR 4. I Subsequently replaced the Quick Connect Fitting and Fuel Pump, but it was a nightmare diagnostic procedure.
As always, excellent diagnosis! 👨🏻🔧 Ivan! Do you ever feel nostalgic for the Russian winter))) 😤🥶😤 ?
Good that you called yourself out for mis diagnosing the fuel pressure drop as a line leak
That's not a misdiagnosis, just a correction to the experimental procedure. A misdiagnosis is when you complete the repair and the car is still broken 😄
A handful of Toyota pumps of that vintage where the electric motor is fine but the pump portion failed ( impeller/vanes) Low amp draw along with pressure and volume. Looking forward to part #2.
I have an old Ford with 2 tanks. Both have cheap fuel pumps in them. Both run low fuel pressure, but I have issues with cold starts. Warm starts are fine.
I hate fuel tank issues... They suck. Go get 'em, Ivan! 😎😎😎
Nice 4Runner
Been years, but i had similar issues with clients GM truck. It was the hose from pump to metal feed line in tank assembly. It was rotten and split. Amp draw threw me, yet it did guide me dropping fuel cell and inspecting pump assembly where i discovered split hose. I'll be Standing By.
Those 3.4’s have one o2 sensor and one a/f sensor.. the o2 is a typical 60$ hollar but the a/f sensor looks like a typical o2 sensor but cost 3x as much because they trigger quicker and respond quicker.. according to toyota.. mine wouldnt run right until i paid the 162$ for the a/f sensor then stopped running lean all the time..
When my dad retired he took the caravan to France and did a season skiing. Anyway i went to stay with him for a week. On the way back from the airport he said somethings up with the car it wont go over 67mph and keeps kangarooing violently. Anyway he'd bough a load of parts plugs leads and changed them still did it. Two days later we went on a day trip and the car was literally kangarooing up really steep hills we gave up half way on the trip. The next day we took the carb to bits checked all the jets etc float etc screen. Still no difference. Anyway i took the fuel hose off the carb and on cranking it was dribbling out, then i took the fuel filter off and it shot across the carpark about 15feet. I said dad has the filter ever been replaced " well no" and he had done about 80 thousand miles without changing it. When we cut the old plastic filter open it was totally blocked with black stuff 😂 Fitted the new 2euro filter and fixed 😂
Ivan, I love your videos and want to keep seeing them too. Please never use a metal catch tray, esp with pos battery terminal. Use a plastic container next time and hang it on the garage door top track rail for future use. Safety first, please. Yes I know you are very cautious, but stuff happens when we get older hands shake or what have you. Old coke or pepsi bottle.
We had a 2002 S-10 with a 4.3L that had a very similar problem. Hard starting but ran good. Fuel pressure would drop while revving up the engine. Ended up being the fuel pump. One of the pump motor brush springs was broke and not putting enough pressure on the brush.
I think I would try using your bench power supply to feed the fuel pump. Changing the voltage from 13 v up to 16 volts and watch the fuel pressure. Do this to try and prove whether it is the fuel pump itself or possibly a damaged wire restricting current to the pump. Test before replace.
Hi Ivan. If that fuel pump is like the ones used in the sienna mini vans. Toyota oem pump costs around $1,100.00 give or take a little. I have learned so much from watching your videos. Keep up the great work. I wished that Toyota would put in a nice easy fuel pump access plate in those types of auto's. The Sienna Mini vans are the same way. You have to drop the tank.
84 dollars rock auto denso
$1100 ... that includes labor, right?
That price is just for a 2005 Toyota Sienna Fuel pump and fuel filter. No labor. That Toyota had a totally different fuel pump assemble which I was surprised to see.@@LeverPhile
Before you drop the tank, you have to get under the rear seat and go through the hatch and unplug the connector on the top of the tank. The harness is to short to undo it while dropping the tank. Why Toyota gave us to that tiny hatch just to unplug it and not big enough to get the tank unit out is nuts. The pump voltage supply and ground run in the door sill along the driver's door. Pull up that plastic sill to get access to it.
You can check the fuel pump rpm with a scope and low amp clamp compare to know good pump rpm
Just one last check to do before replacing the fuel pump would be to see if you can power up that higher amp tail light bulb makeshift tester that you have. Just because you see 12v on the test meter, it doesn't mean anything if those wires can't carry a current. Those bulbs should be nice and bright if those wires are any good in testing the fuel pump's power and ground.
Absolutely 😊
Dont forget to thump that merch, maybe even see if someone could design a secondary logo. I was thinking orange pine trees up the sides going to a point with pine hollow written in the middle kinda like a tunnel shape. Full size on a black hoodie. Just an idea.
i thought all euro cars made fuel pump replacement easy! glad u keep the mistakes in
That fallen hose is OEM and common to come off on most 4runners (3rd gen). I put a cable tie to secure it and it holds!
A zip tie?
A Tye-Wrap?
I would liked to see a scope trace of the fuel pump current. You can spot a bad pump motor that way. I also would have like to have heard the pump. I had one that went thunka-thunka-thunka. Easy diagnoses, not so easy repair.
After 175K miles I am not surprised it needs a fuel pump. I should think one should be replaced after 150K miles, as it is a wear item. On to part 2! Very good, interesting diag work, Ivan!
i have a '97 Taco 5VZFE with 341k miles and original fuel pump still with no issues yet
Yeah it’s not a domestic POS. These fire pumps last a LOOONG time!
I thought I’d better mention the brake fluid also looks low and dirty in the reservoir.
I had the same problem on a 1990 Mustang 5.0. Fuel pressure would fall off when the engine was shutdown. It was a hole in the rubber fuel line in the tank. It was basically bleeding back into the tank. I replaced the pump and the rubber lines. The car ran like new.
There is an access panel under the rear seat.
I predict pinhole leak in fuel hose going from the fuel pump the fuel distribution assembly inside the gas tank or a clogged fuel pump strainer sock. also a possible pinched fuel line under the truck.. a fuel flow test would be interesting.. he may have low pressure and low flow.. when you deadheaded that pump the pressure should have gone alot higher until it hit the bypass.
Years ago my Toyota Celica with 160K stopped running, took it to the Toyota dealer and they replaced the fuel pump.
We had a car with bad fuel pump (no one checked). Started when cold (got extra fuel), started when hot (easy).But if you went to a shop for 20 min it wouldn't start, you had to wait for 20-30 min, then it started again.
Would like to see a scope pattern of the fuel pump, voltage spike and ramping of the amperage. As an added piece of information calculated pump speed.
Wait for Part 2 😉
It looks like a fuel pump. On to part 2.
18:30 Kind of risky doing this @ your home what if you hit that positive battery terminal ? I had a buddy who worked on cars in his families home garage and they had a car fire. Changed his and his family's life forever.
I always think of Scanner Danners Jeep Cherokee fire whenever I see a naked positive terminal 🔥😬
When you went to check the throttle body for gas fumes, I almost thought I heard you say perfume. I'm thinking that Ivan loves his Shell #5. lol. Anyway, is there a fuel filter on those things? That too could cause a low fuel pressure issue if the fuel filter is clogged. But you checked for voltage and amp load. Only 1 amp draw? That ruled out back pressure from a clogged filter or pinched line. It's the fuel pump alright. "She's dead Jim".
Stuck open purge valve is going to be my guess based of symptoms
Had the same problem on a3.0 bad pump
The test for the fuel pressure said to test it with key on engine off.
On the evap code the issue is going to be the gas tank. I threw the parts cannon and the last thing i replaced was the tank. It had a Very Very small pinhole at the top.(probably due to our PA rust lol)
Toyota super long life coolant attacks rubber and plastic when it gets old. That is likely what happened to the overflow hose.
Ivan, I'm surprised you didn't examine the fuel lines for obstructions or kinks. I was thinking about the video a couple years ago of the junkyard car that had 5 fuel pumps thrown at it and you found that the fuel hose was twisted or pinched.
... of course, I still agree that you correctly diagnosed the weak fuel pump motor. Hahaha.
If you pinch the return line and pressure is still low, that rules out any restrictions 👍
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Well that is something I didn't know. 🤔 Thanks for pointing that out, Ivan.👍
only time you can have "fun" in these is when there is EVAP code that disables the traction control.....then it's party time (2001 with 313K)
High resistance in fuel pump ground side perhaps.
We'll check that in Part 2 :)
👍
Pressure, coming down on me.
Ice ice Baby.
this may the problem I have on my 1989 4runner 3.0 runs good but no power 15000 Miles. I need to check this.
👍👍
The only thing I hate about the Toyota 3400 V6 Is where the thermostat is located at which can be a real royal pain in rear to get it to work correctly and that stupid jiggle valve
Arm chair mechanic.. Could you measure the voltage closer to the fuel pump? Maybe a but unlikely a wiring problem between the relay and the fuel pump?
I'm honestly surprised that running so lean for so long didn't cause internal engine damage. I'm seen many engines melt pistons and other parts from running too lean.
Luckily ECM had enough fuel trim range to compensate!
I suppose the pump could just be weak or it's flowing right back into the tank from an internal leak that could explain the low draw
a real Toyota Hecho en Japon.
At their Tahara plant no less where all the Landcruisers are made, the cream of the crop for sure
I have a feeling it's the timing chain . It is out of time as I had a neighbor once back who had one of these and she had the issue of starting seem to get longer and longer and hard to start. Turns out her timing chain was starting to stretch ...
If it’s a V6 then it’s a belt driven motor. 2.7 4cyl (3rz) was indeed a chain drive
Apart from a blocked filter or pickup screen, could there be a crushed fuel supply pipe or a partially clogged fuel supply hose?