#10MinuteTalk
We see it all the time - New shooters come to the internet for advice on a riflescope for their first long range rifle and are instantly berated by all the gear junkies who look to the absolute top of the top competitive shooters for all their gear with super expensive and complicated options that they apparently “Have to get” to somehow avoid utter failure and frustration. Nick Laufenberg joins us for this 10 minutes (Plus a bonus at the end) to explain the differences between what a recreational target shooter might actually need at the bare minimum vs what a competitive tactical long range shooter would require for their matches. In the end, he also discusses a riflescope’s theoretical maximum capable range with any given rifle based on its available travel and subtensions in the reticle.
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Goals are important. You helped me to refine my thinking....
Great knowledge guys!
10 min is a great format. 👍
In order (sorry vortex) mrad and FFP only 1) tangent theta (5-25×56) not (7-35×56) 2) zero compromise (5×25×56) 3) vortex gen 3 (6-36×56) 4) Night force (comparable) 5) Leopold (comparable)
So many great choices. The first rifle I got was the Mossberg Patriot .308 Win and it came with the Vortex Crossfire II scope already on it. (3x-9x/40 mm BDC reticle in MOA.) Total budget buy, the cost of the whole thing through Shoot Smart was $515 + tax. I bought it from Shoot Smart, so they waive the transfer fee. You just flash your LTC and fill out the 4473. You can dial up and down. It has dust covers, so, you can also set and forget. And that is suitable for hunting on some property that his heavily wooded, such as WMAs in northeast Texas (region 4) or the Piney Woods (region 5.) Most clear shots are going to be less than 50 yards. 100 zero, 25-300 yard zero, doesn't matter, just aim and shoot like it was a red dot. And that could be the limit of money spent. When I bought more rifles, I wanted what I thought was the ideal cross-over. Hunting and some recreational long range, when possible. And that is the Diamondback Tactical 6x-24x / 50 mm. Solid clicks. Really good glass. Parallax adjustment, which got me spoiled, really quick. Both the Crossfire II and the Diamond back have windage marks in the reticle for hold over. So, I like that. Even if, at close range, the wind is negligible to 5 MPH hold left or right on full value. In demonstrations, I have seen good results using the stove pipe reticle on medium weight rounds (avg 150 gr. in .308 Win.) And for hunting the close distances I have, I have it zeroed for 25-300 yards. But I still print out and save solution sheets that I get from the ballistic calculators of the ammo company. For example, one of my favorite rounds is from Federal. So, I go their website and choose the caliber and their model type, input sight height (scope y axis aligned with action) and zeroing distance. That way. if I were ever to need to fire past 300 yards, I have some idea that will get me within an inch or two. For example, shooting at 400 yards from a 300 yard zero will require 4.4 MOA adjustment. Or hold 4.5 MOA, favor into the wind. Essentially, estimated DOPE that I could refine with actual DOPE. If I were into competition long range, I could see buying the Razor. The whole build might be $10k and, by then, the scope is the least expensive thing. But I think more tactical, since my intention is deer hunting at unknown range (though I can see well enough to get a decent estimate.) Which is the other thing I like about First Focal Plane. The scale of the MOA marks with changing zoom. For one thing, I like math. Secondly, ranging in the reticle works when batteries fail or other objects in the distance reflect better than the target. Knowing the height of something and counting reticle hash marks is easy, especially below 500 yards.
What ur thoughts on viper HS LR ffp i have 2
I have razor gen 1 and I put a 60 MOA rail on it and I got 118 mins of usable elevation plus the recital. It’s on my custom rem 700 .308 so it need all It can get
You say “moa or mil hash marks at a minimum”: I've been reading a lot of old sniper doctrine lately and I would actually say it's even less. At a minimum you need to know what mils or moa the ticks on the BDC coincide with. So long as you can dial your BDC and you know what it corresponds to it'll be serviceable. Not my first choice, but if that's what you got, don't let it discourage you from coming out!
I like the swfa fixed 6 and 10 power
I shot 1000 yards for the first time last weekend with my hunting rifle. The scope was a bdc with a single rotation zero stop and I maxed out at 18 MOA so I used StrelokPro to figure out how to use my bdc and elevation turret in combination to get a first round hit at 1000
The only scope I buy is vortex. Got a closet full of them amazing scopes for the money!
What rifle is the one camo one?
Love the Diamondback tactical works great in competition you just have topay close attention to detail
Any blue blocker type optics?
When are y'all going to be releasing a .224 Valkyrie video?
Good talk!! It's important to recognize there is a huge gap in skillset from 350-500yds and 500+ yds. Particularly for people exploring long range shooting, get the gun you can use today and worry about the 1 mi. tack driver when your skills are in line with such an objective.
Take most guys or gals out around these parts and sort em out after 300 yards. Lots of things change then
I've got the new strike eagle 5x25x56, it's the best buy I've ever made so far.
Is the 6.5 cm with 147s loaded hot?
I have a question for your guys guest. Actually two I guess, one I do I need Turret locks? And secondary is so I need a 34mm tube scope? Was wanting to shoot to at minimum to 1200 yards. I have just got an option on a very nice scope but it’s 30mm without locks, and those two things are my concerns. Thanks so much, great videos you have
Run ballistic program with your cartridge to see how much elevation you will need. Then check scope elevation range and try to figure if its gonna be enough. You’ll maybe want a 20-30 moa base to help get more of the elevation range on the scope.
@@orr89rocz great advice !
Thoughts on viper PST FFP for PRS?
Fantastic choice - many people use that scope for that application.
Hey is Vortex going to come out with a tactical 7-35 or 8-40 high mag to compete with some “other scopes” in that range. ?
They probably never could at that $400 range price with the features of the diamondback tactical and have any optical quality to speak of much past 30x and that might pushing it with the amount of chromatic aberration from glass quality at that level without getting up around $1,000 mark at least. I know most people don't go much past 18x when shooting out to 1,000 yards so wouldn't be much use at that price range to have such a high magnification or if you need high magnification for bad eyes well at that price point it'd be a 100% diminishing return. Lol sorry for long response
what about the strike eagle
What is the rifle & scope w/ the camo stock?
Scope is a Razor HD AMG 6-24x50. The gun is Nick's and he would be able to tell you all about it. Hit him up on Instagram - @nick.laufenberg
How does the IOR Crusader compare with the NF BEAST and VORTEX
Check out Richard Utting's Sharpshooter UK. He did a review of these scopes in late Nov 2020.
@@Wyo2Wis thank you very much.
I consider it 'long range' when wind starts to matter a lot... I can do that with a leupold freedom, nice, light weight, affordable excellence.
What gun is that on the table with the magpul stock?
Ruger American Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor
I have the option to buy that same gun for $620 or wait and get the ruger precision in 6.5? Your opinions would be awesome! Plan on topping it with a vortex Diamondback Tactical
@@homercannon36 Truthfully it's the same action, barrel, etc and everything between the two guns, but the RPR has a more techincal chassis for long range precision shooting. What kind of shooting do you intend to do with this rifle? If hunting and recreational long range shooting, the American is the better value. If you want to shoot matches or really dive deep into precision long range stuff, then the RPR is unquestionably the right choice.
Mainly just hunting and getting into 6.5 not really “long range” for you guys but to shoot out to 1,000yards around my next of the woods is about max. I appreciate you guys taking the time to respond. Love the 10 minute talks. Keep up the good work!
@@homercannon36 The American would be the ideal choice then - an RPR in that use scenario would be a bit overkill. Happy to help any time! Thanks for tuning in.
Glass quality, glass quality, glass quality. Try hunting at last legal light with a lower end optic and you will soon be upgrading to something better.
223 WSSM and factory rifles tank, come on Ya'll
Is that the ruger American predator
It is
From my money being a casual distant shooter between 500 and 800 I love my black hound optics 4 to 14x44 it's very similar to the primary arms only it's a very simple radical excellent tracking first focal plane exposed to it zero stop and the thing is a beast as far as durability. I bought that then there 6x24 then I went back and bought another 4 to 14 That KZheadr the cheap shot has a discount code that's still active mtorian it saves you 5% off your entire order and gives you free shipping
Golden Eagle for me /// I take a photo on my phone of turrents before I shoot so no matter were I go I just look and adjust back or up to were it started get a close up of it
Great idea!
Is anyone else missing the sound?
No
Lol wouldn't buy a Vortex for a start.
I'm a fan help me out Hugs !!!!!