2024 Porsche 911 Carrera T Review - Not Enough Car For The Money?
2024 ж. 27 Сәу.
21 905 Рет қаралды
With a starting price of $126k (this example is $148k), the 379hp 992 911 Carrera T better be a nearly flawless sports car.
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Hey guys! Zach here (owner of the car). Firstly, thanks Fenton for the video! Great quality and always fantastic to hear your thoughts on all the great cars out on the market. I think that Fenton hit the nail on the head on most of the talkings points regarding this car (and the 992 generation 911 in general). They’re bigger, they’re not as loud, and Porsche is slowly but surely moving that engine further to the front of the car.. the car is so good. It does everything almost flawlessly and that’s what I love about it. I know the car is a lot of money, but dont get hung up on that $148k msrp. The car started at $124k (I know, a LOT of money) but pretty much all of the options on the car are aesthetic (minus the RAS). The leather interior/stitching alone is nearly $7k! You can have one that performs just like this for just under $130k. The Cayman 4.0L comparisons in the comments are fair. The Cayman seems like a much better value for the money. Before I got the T, I actually had a Cayman GTS on order as that was the perfect “new” sports car in my mind. When the opportunity to order the T opened up, I was able to drive both cars and the 911 won because I absolutely LOVE that low end torque coming from the turbocharged engine. The cayman just didn’t have enough of it for me to be in love with the way the car’s power was delivered. Additionally, a manual transmission was a must have for me and as a tall guy (6’4) the 911 is a MUCH better fit for me with a manual. I found it much more difficult to drive the manual 718 because of my height. I’m typing this from the airport in Long Beach after having rented a 718 Cayman T for the weekend for AirWater in Costa Mesa. I could not have been happier with my decision to switch to the 911. The cayman felt AMAZING through Angeles Crest Highway because of its light weight and size, but I really missed my 911 every other time I drove the car. The power is more than enough for me in the 911 and the car really does shine through high speed corners. For me, it’s perfect despite the ok steering feel and the lack of the high pitched scream of the 991.1 engine. Anyways, those are my thoughts as the owner of the car. Thanks to anyone who made it through the end of this comment and feel free to ask me any questions about the car or my ownership/driving experience (I’ve double the mileage since you drove it, Fenton!!!) Great vid and you’ll for sure be driving whatever I end up with next!
I also just bought a 911T, I prefer the engine in the GTS 4.0 but I NEED back seats and a driver seat that reclines. Cayman platform does not work for me.
Each to his own, but I’d never choose torque over that amazing sounding high revving 4.0 in the Cayman GTS, especially since NA engines that good are rarer and rare. Pretty sure the Cayman handles better too.
@@craigyirush3492 That’s actually one thing I forgot to mention as well. I thought that if I got the cayman then I’d need to get an exhaust for the car as well. I was a bit disappointed by the sound of the 718 6 cyls compared to the 981. I love the mid engine platform and think in the future I will end up buying a 981 S or GTS. Likely a PDK car now that I’ve scratched my manual transmission itch!
You made the right decision with the T! A 911 is so much easier to live with due to all the interior space, a true daily whereas 718 are more go cart. I also really dislike the NA 718 engine sound, but with an exhaust it sounds great - see Fenton's modified 718 Spyder pdk video.
Great choice! Only thing that would make it better is speccing it in Rubystone Neo!
I have owned my 911 T now for a few months and it is the best true performance car that I have ever owned. Hands down, nothing else even close. It does provide this almost perfect driving experience though. Most people love that, some don't. I view it as this perfect piece of art that might have finally reached perfection. I also love it from an investment standpoint for the long run. As Porsche continues to push its hybrid models, this purest model will be the one to own.
I think that the typical person that can afford that car is going to love the way it drives.
Some people just don’t understand Porsches and they never will. You can have the loud 600hp cars that have that character but they’re not great dynamically. You can feel the history behind a Porsche and how it’s a purpose built sports car and not just a base model sedan with added HP.
When you say is too good,too precise so much confidence in these brakes, doesn t catch you off gard, thats exactly what I want, Im not a race driver I want something reliable. Thanks porsche
Carrera T is worth the money at MSRP relative to competition, if you account for massive depreciation of its competitors (BMWs, AMGs, Audis, Aston Martin Vantage, etc.) when they are brand new. In fact, Carrera T equipped with manual 7 speed ZF may depreciate very little, or possibly appreciate, after 992.2 comes out with hybrid models and significant MSRP bumps.
Totally agree re: Carrera T vs competitive models from BMW/Audi etc. but the argument against the T is more about what other Porsche models are also available for the same price. GT spec Caymans are available for around the same money which offer arguably more exciting engines and driving experiences.
A rather bizarre review given most journalists and enthusiasts consider the Carrera T to be the best value proposition in the entire 911 variant range.
I agree with him though. While it's a good car, if I was spending 100k+ on a Porsche, I'd be making it a GT product, even if it had to be used at the same price. Maybe a 991 gt3 or gt4 of some kind. This is the kind of car that fits as a tourer/daily for someone who can afford multiple 6 figure cars and I'm unfortunately not that guy 😅
@@frederickschulze8014 You missed the point. You're sharing a preference for a used/older GT car over a new non-GT car. That's fine, of course, but it has nothing to do with the value of the Carrera T versus the other Carrera variants in the range. The problem with KZhead, and the Internet in general, is that anyone can post uninformed drivel. 99% of the posters have never owned or even driven the various cars being discussed. That does not make for a meaningful conversation. I have owned several GT cars, and I would not take a single one of them over the Carrera T for road driving. I take back what I said about this being a bizarre review. It actually makes sense. There are endless glowing reviews of the 992 Carrera T, including some by the top automotive journalists in the world. So how is a reviewer who arrives late to the party supposed to garner attention and get clicks? By taking the contrarian position, of course. And here I am helping further the cause. Sigh.
@@frederickschulze8014 Porsche remains a weird marketplace unlike any other brand. Everybody says prices are falling, but that's just because a lot of the newest cars were purchased with huge dealer markups. Unfortunately you can't get used GT models less than 10 years old at anywhere near the MSRP of a new T (equipped with popular options). Even the Turbos and Turbo Ss from the 991.1 generation have crept up in price and are over the cost of a new T. The best most people can do for the price of a new Carrera T is buy a 2 year old Carrera S with 20k miles on it - or better yet, get a 991.2 Carrera T (which was even more basic with the fabric door handles), which is roughly the same price as when it was new ($95-100k). Or better yet get a Cayman GTS 4.0 which a TON of folks I know in PCA are doing. I find it hard to believe the sales of 718s are as low as they are - then there are yet more people with 992s still on order. There is one guy who shops at my dealer who is literally known by everybody who works and shops there - he trades his cars every 3 months. He owned the first 992 Carrera T sold by my dealer (I have the second), and sold his 3 months later, just as I was getting mine delivered. I think he has a GT3 Touring now, unless he's traded it.
I own a 992 Carrera T and I didn’t fully appreciate the car until I drove it from Bay Area to PECLA to drive the gt3 and gt4 (I prefer the GT3). I now realize it’s an amazing everyday street car, saving the gt3 for the track. The steering is light and responsive, in Porsches tradition, but they’ve done some trickery to transmit feedback improving upon the 991. Although it has inhumane amount of grip, you can still skid around with traction control off on the wet road. I didnt like the shifter as much as porsche’s six speed, and the car is bigger (despite having shorter wheelbase than cayman). However, i never thought the base 911 was down on power, but adding a tune will open up the exhaust valve and bump the power to carrera S level.
Normally I don’t comment, but I have a T with exact spec apart from the leather option. Had it for 14 months now with 11K miles. All said in video is true, unless you start pushing the car 8-9/10ths. Zygrene did not try hard enough. Sorry 😅 Only then the car feels truly alive, moves nose up and down like a 911 with light steering, with feeling in the wheel, and you control the turn with your gas pedal. Unfortunately you are already in criminal offense territory.. thats the sad truth of the modern 911..
its an exciting car from the way it sounds to the way it drives.
To be fair that’s the issue with most modern performance cars. They are all insanely fast nowadays.
Which is why I don't think I will buy a sports car that is newer than 2018. I'd rather put 20-30k into an older model making it faster and have 10x the feedback
Having to push a sports car at 8 or 9/10ths to get excitement is kinda sad. I test drove a Carrera T and had that same feeling, it's got fizz, but you need to be pushing it a lot to get any fun out of it. I'm glad used old 911 are plentiful as my 997.2 is entertaining even at low speeds. Plenty of feedback and feel from the whole chassis, tons of road info from the steering wheel, all the mechanical noise a person could want too.
Yup there’s no point in a car like this if you’re only going to get excitement out of it at 9/10ths.
Driving in Sport mode would have given you more exhaust crackle vs, Sport Plus mode.
I have the 2024 automatic version of this. Couldn't be happier.
An automatic? Lol...why even bother. you might as well just drive a Prius.
@@bigmacdaddy1234 Yeah? keep shifting gears like it's your life's purpose while I enjoy technological advancements.
@@capaldi328 Get a self-driving Tesla and call it a day.
@@bigmacdaddy1234 I have one of those, too. You sure care a lot about the cars I drive.
@@capaldi328 Not enough to buy them.
I don’t disagree with anything he said. However, I hear often “it’s too perfect” or “it’s boring”. Like why wouldn’t we want a damn near perfect car as a daily? I think it depends on why you are buying the car and what the goal is. I am not sure there is a better daily out there. If want the engine, good luck at getting a Z06 at MSRP. Because that’s a bargain at MSRP. But other than that, for me, this is the best choice for a daily. For context: this will be my first Porsche, so I don’t have other Porches to compare it to.
I have been a 911 fan since 1980. People were complaining about their high price back then and have continued to do so. There is a price for that level of quality and engineering. Enough people were and still are prepared to pay that premium. While the comparable cars you refer to that provide more value slide into obscurity, 911s become classics. You have to think long-term when you purchase one.
With a 911 you can think short term too as they depreciate slower than most if not nearly all cars.
steering that is "devoid of feel" is unacceptable in a 150k Porsche 911....
I'll admit that was an exaggeration. It's not completely numb. Just typical modern Porsche EPS numb.
This is why i highly enjoy my GR Supra. It's rowdy and playful
Clinical is a good way to describe modern non-GT Porsches. Porsche doesn't understand that for a car to be fulfilling, performance isn't the key, it's how and what you feel while driving.
Makes me wonder how much better to drive the lower end models could be with smaller, lighter wheels and skinnier tyres. They'd still have plenty of grip but to a lower limit providing more fun at sensible speeds and potentially also improving the lack of steering feel.
"it's how and what you feel while driving" That's a fair point, but surely 'most' buyers don't want that else they would just buy a Lotus Emira/Evora? It's a balancing act between comfort and driving engagement. If it really was all about driving feel, Porsche wouldn't fit all the 911s apart from the GT3 with sluggish dual mass flywheels to numb the engine response and so on. I think it's important to keep the market position in context, it could be a lot worse -- the steering might not be as lively as the unfiltered hydraulic steering in an Emira/Evora or a McLaren, but then it is a lot better than the highly filtered numb jelly steering in a BMW M5 -- it's all about compromises. Recall BMW's interview with Car and Driver where "most drivers indicated a preference for no "bad" steering feedback" hence why there is aggressive pull-drift compensation in BMW's electronic power steering, apart from the versions where the engineers were off the leash like the M2 CS. Porsche (not to the same extent) is trying to cater somewhat to the luxury car buyer too with their sportscars, hence the car being how it is -- a lot more numb than a Lotus, but it's all relative. Even the older M BMWs like the E46 M3 had that rubber coupling in the middle of the steering column to reduce steering vibration after all (like a KIA Forte does!), albeit I'm sure the rubber hardness of it was a lot harder than in the KIA (the couplings in KIAs are prone to wearing out and causing a steering clunk).
@@TassieLorenzo Selling the Porsche and buying a Lotus - exactly what I did.
@@gazman9468 See the BRZ/GT86 for evidence that I belive your right. As another point, in my experience the base 911 from the 997 to the 992 is more fun to drive than the high powered, highly equipped models.
I had a 2018 T that I did not spec. It had 18 way seats, I prefer the base seats or LWBS. I traded that for a 2019 GT3 Touring. After driving the GT3T, I realized that the Carrera T is a very good grand tourer even though it is marketed as a back to basics “raw” / focused Carrera. I prefer the 991 generation Carrera T, I think it’s a little more special, especially with the right options which you cannot get on 992s. New Porsche prices are getting up there and I will probably not be in the market for the new generations. I’ll probably look to prior generation if I ever want to change.
Hate to say this but the GR86 was more fun to drive. And I own a 992 S with Ohlins and complete aftermarket exhaust.
I wrote a similar comment. Few will dare to admit it. I don't own a twin or a Miata
Owned a 718 GTS (2.5T), 991.2 GTS, 718 GT4, and now 992 S. And based on those cars, 991.2 GT3 in manual, I believe is the sweet spot that I must have next!
@@KoryoJK Interesting progression! I have a friend who is an ex-991.1 GT3 owner and he's currently considering buying another in the not too distant future. The .2 is out of reach and I've suggested that perhaps an almost 10yr newer 718 GT4 might make a good alternative as the .1's are still suffering from the odd failures and are now approaching the end of Porsche warranty. How did you find the GT4 and what made you switch to a non GT 911?
@@gazman9468I absolutely loved the GT4. It was the most fun out of the four. However I did miss the flexibility of the 911 (two small kids). I felt that the 991.2 GTS in terms of handling/feel was about 80% of the GT4 but having low-mid end torque from the 911’s 3.0T was fun for street driving. Wanted to therefore get the 992 GTS but at the time couldn’t get an allocation for one so I “compromised” with a CPO’ed S, especially since it’s just a detuned version of a GTS. But ultimately, having tasted the visceral attributes of the GT4 and my kids starting to complain about the 992’s rear seats, I think 991.2 GT3 is the sweet spot. However, if Porsche knocks it out of the park with the new 992.2 GTS, I may go with that instead. Money no object, I’d have both the GT4 and 911 GTS (daily).
It's true. I have a 22 BRZ on Hipermax Rs. I'd take it over any Porsche. And I had a 993 & 997. Only car more fun I've driven is my Evora. And its closer than it should be.
I like so many people would love to own this car yet is not in the budget lol 😂. For now my gti that weighs the same as this car yet doesn’t have the same power will have to do for now 😊
I was on the porsche reddit replying to a cayman/boxster hater. I told him that under $175k there isn't a single new 911 i would choose over the cayman boxster range. I would rather get a gt4/spyder or gts 4.0
I don't think the people buying the 911 T brand new are focusing on the best driving Porsche for the money (as that would be the Cayman GTS 4.0), but they just want a 911 or to say they drive a 911. Which is also fair.
I'm not sure if the Cayman/Boxster does drive better. Mark and Jack from Savagegeese in a Q&A said the 992 Carrera T is a no-brainer over the 718 GTS 4.0. I've had a 981 Boxster S and currently own a 987.2 Boxster S, driven a 718, I think the 991.2 T drives a bit better, even in canyons. You have to master trail braking in a 911 though to truly get to that magic.
I agree with this. People who buy a base 911 buy it over high spec Cayman just to say they have a 911. But then again, there are a lot of non car enthusiasts who buy base 911 because it is a do it all car that is not just focused on only driving excitement.
I was on a wait list for a 718 Spyder for over 6 months and then switched that to the T after being told production on the Spyder had stopped and there was also zero chance of getting a 4.0 Boxster or Cayman. I was then on the waitlist of the T for several months before I got an allocation. I have a friend who has been on the GT3 waitlist for years. The T was the best driving Porsche I could purchase brand new. You can't (in most places) just walk into a Porsche dealer and purchase any new sports car outside of a 4 cylinder Boxster. I'm currently on the GTS waitlist and am not holding my breath I get one anytime soon.
well the Carrera T is a more hard core 911. I personally chose this rather then the GTS because of the ability to have rear seats. It sounds great, it handles great it does the 911 thing very well. I disagree with the sound being "bland". It sounds exciting, it feels NA with the small turbos. Again does the "911" thing with its howling flat six. I do agree with the price, but that's just how the world works.
Well, I sold my 997.2 C4S and got a 991.2 T and absolutely love it. Not a fan of the 992 looks in general but haven’t driven them and honestly don’t need to. Love my T and I’m not showing off to anyone. Pure love.
As a 991 Turbo S owner, I drove the 992 T at a Porsche Experience Center and was blown away by its capabilities and how fun the car was. I hear you on the cost of it, however. Porsche certainly needs to re-evaluate their pricing, as the Carrera range feels really congested.
Given they are selling near-record numbers of 992s, at least way more of them than the 718 models, I doubt they will be re-evaluating their pricing. Considering a few years ago, the CEO, when asked if there was going to be a new entry-level Porsche sports car that was smaller and cheaper than the 718, said a proper entry-level Porsche is a "pre-owned Porsche". Meaning used 986s, 987s, 981s and 718s are the de facto entry-level Porsches. As is perhaps the 996-type 911 with the funny headlights which you can still often get for under $30k, sometimes with the IMS bearing replaced already.
I think it’s the best car they make right now but the price has gotten crazy. Not long ago you could get something similar for $100k nicely optioned.
Exactly. It's a fantastic car. But the price tag is eye watering.
I swear that 5 years ago the cheapest base 911 was only just under $100k and didn't have a leather dashboard (just squidgy rubberised plastic like a mid-spec VW), had the base seats (I think they were faux leather or cloth) and so on?
GT cars are special, newer non GT 911’s ‘can’ be a little boring IMO. Great cars, amazing actually, but lacking some emotion for the enthusiast. I would advise buy a 997 GT3 while you can….997GT cars are the last GT3 with hydraulic steering, much more raw than newer GT-cars. 997 generation just feels like the right mix of old and new. JMHO
Having driven a ton of stuff myself, I am slowly coming to the conclusion, if you want feedback and fun, there are few new cars beyond the GR86/Twins and MX5 stock. The more expensive metal is always much heavier, more serious, and less fun. If comfort, power and capability like G force is what you want sure, money gets you a lot of options. It's unacceptable that a 911 has numb steering. Totally crazy. Recent Porsches have all left me cold (not driven a new GT3). Even the Boxster GTS felt big, wide, weirdly geared and the butresses and high belt line reduced visibility even with top down.
I had an allocation for a 2023 Carrera T. I ended up surrendering it to the next in line and got a 997 GT3 instead for similar (or less) money. No regrets. Older car is much more visceral and special to me vs a non-GT 992.
My 92 NSX you reviewed is a keeper but I've been eyeing a 2017-2019 991.2 Carrera T. Some say the 992 is a little more boring than the 991.2. I've driven a 991.2 base and S in the 7-speed. Like them both and still prefer the styling and full mechanical gauge cluster of the 991.2 versus the screens on the 992.
I would much rather spend a bit more and get a high spec 718 GT4 or even a 991.2 Carrera T with carbon buckets. This 992 gen just doesnt feel special at all besides maybe the nice interior.
Have you driven all these models?
@@robertlevasseur6843 yes I have. I actually cross shopped these three cars and ended up buying the 718 GT4. I liked the 991.2 Carrera T with the lwbs as well but the GT4 felt more special. The 992 felt the fastest going straight but not in the corners. Feels like a boat at times. All three of these cars were priced right around 135k-140k so it was a no brainer for me to choose the GT car.
@@YY-ub9if thank you for answering back.
Agreed, from the factory the car is a bit of a snooze, but if you want more drama spend $3000 and have it tuned. I ended up doing a stage two tune with a soul performance exhaust, 200 cell cats and an intercooler and the car really wakes up. I'm currently running about 540hp at the crank and love how it drives. I also really like how the smaller turbos feel with the additional horsepower vs a GTS. Almost like an NA engine.
It's not always about the power that makes the driving experience more enjoyable
A simple tune gets you 75 +HP/TQ with no modifications. Intake/exhaust/e85/tune gets you 500+ easily. You're paying for a supercar level platform.
Waste of money. The typical 911 owner won't even begin to push the stock limits.
A Cayman or Boxster GTS 4.0 is a much better new car. More special engine, exciting driving experience, cheaper, mid-engine dynamics. $125k-$150k for an essentially base 911 is just ridiculous.
As much as I love the 718 generation and especially the 718 Spyder, it's hard to argue that the 718 is fundamentally a better car. The 992 is able to provide a much larger spread between its comfort and sport modes. It makes the 911 more versatile as a commuter as well as a fun weekend toy.
What’s neat is, since they removed the manual from the base Carrera, everyone who wants the least expensive manual 911 is now forced into buying the T. This also resulted in a LOT more 992 T’s being sold compared to the 991.2, which only sold around 970 over two years total. More and more I feel like the 992 T lost a bit of what made the 991.2 T a great value and special.
It's interesting, because Jack and Mark from Savagegeese said the Carrera T was much better than the 718 GTS 4.0.
Agree with @dafaqking but I'd probably still go with the GTS 4.0 if it's not my daily
You're dead-on IMO. I had a 981S, considered a 991.2T, wound up with a CGTS 4.0L. I test-drove a 992.1 and found it to be a little too heavy and staid for my taste.
Yes, Porsches are expensive, but considering their global reliability and their performance, it makes most of their competitors outrageously expensive. So it’s a matter of point of view, is’t it. On the other hand I do agree with you that on public roads with their speed limitations, this Porsche Carrera T (and its sisters) can feel a bit numb in as much as it doesn’t have the opportunity of expressing its capabilities. But you still have a lovely 911 which in itself, at least to my mind, is a great satisfaction 😎
This is why I stopped upgrading my Porsches. The new ones are so good, that they only make you Crack a smile at 10/10ths.. the older cars have you smiling from the word go. More fun to drive slow or fast. The new ones will beat the old ones on the track and straight line speed, but not as engaging unless it's a gt3. Also, I refuse to pay the ridiculous price gouging 25% porsche does with options that should be standard on a $100k car . even though I can afford it, I am not into wasting money. Buy gently used versions a few years old and save yourself $40k
it might be worth it if they put in the 718 gts 4.0 engine or a detuned gt3 engine.
If you're going to get a newer Porsche, you're going to have to pay the "Porsche-tax," ie, you pay 50-100% more for the Porsche compared to similar performing sports cars. To me, the base models of the new Porsche lineup aren't special enough to consider over a much cheaper car or a similar-priced better performing car. Also with good steering and shifter feel, similar weight, similar power, and nimble driving dynamics is the Toyota Supra for example, which will put down similar lap times and costs half the amount ($60k). And with an engine that can be reliably tuned to 450-500hp for $3-5k in mods. Or for the price of a Carrera T, you can get a Corvette Z06, which has an engine with even more character than a GTS 4.0, and laps as quickly as a 992 GT3. At some point, you're just paying an extra $50k+ to have a certain body style, brand name, and engine in the back. That said, there are some Porsches in many price ranges that are good bang for the buck or special enough to be worth considering. To me, these are the 986, 996, 997 base, 996 turbo, 987.1 base, 987.2 S, 981S, 718 Cayman GTS 4.0, and the 997-992 GT products. But then again, I enjoy pushing my cars, and I don't see much utility in having rear seats in this type of car so that probably influences these picks.
You’re paying the extra because it’s the best. All those cars you mentioned had the 911 as a benchmark. Some people just don’t understand Porsches. They would rather buy a “sports car” from manufacturers that just add more HP to their base models and call them performance cars. The 911 is purpose built by the best engineers in the world. I drive a 997, there’s not too many cars from 2006-2012 that can still holdup to the quality and feel you get from a 997. That’s why it’s the best.
Great review, thank you for the honesty in price vs wow factor. IMHO a Porsche should be able to get your heart rate pumping on a canyon road!
For me this raises the age old question of 911 vs Boxster/Cayman. When the 987/997 came along it became obvious (to some) that the 911 was priced higher purely down to historical brand significance and heritage. Not because it was in any way better built or cost less to make. Now that there are so many 911 models to choose from it does beg the question of whether or not the Boxster/Cayman makes higher spec "entry level" models such as this redundant.
@Zygrene, great video! After driving this and the Cayman GTS 4.0, how do they both compare in your opinion? Which would you pick?
992 T feels higher quality and quicker. But GTS 4.0 is much more exciting to drive. Hard choice.
Why do you no longer link your Zygrene performance index spreadsheet?
I think a Cayman S would be a much better value.
Maybe the GTS 4.0 as I just don't think the 4 cyl does the car justice
Great review! Did you also review an S?
What would you recommend at this price point (and below) that is more exciting and fun? Don’t care about practicality but it must be a vehicle you can daily on some level (so Ariel Atom for example doesn’t count)
I ordered a T with manual/carbon buckets/RAS and wanted to start here as a lightweight sport classic meets ST on a budget type build (heck I already ordered the seat insets from the ST) - with an M engineering tune (supported by dealers now) and sport cats, some suspension tuning and few tweaks here and there to further reduce weight, I have no doubt this will be an exciting road car.
If cross-shopping between a Carrera T and the LC 500 (given Zygrene drove this in a recent video), which is the more emotional/less boring vehicle? Which is the better buy?
For almost $150K, the 718 Cayman GT4 in a rare PTS color is the way to go and you will probably get back some change. BTW, I mentioned this in your last Porsche video, you need the RoadSpy RS1 to mount those cameras instead of the old fashioned suction cup camera mounts.
not bothering with each😂, the 2020 manual evora GT are getting into the high 70K range in used market, get that one!
0:55 tell your bro to get some after-market front mesh-screens for his intakes otherwise his radiator fins are going to get destroyed
Is it too expensive at $130k? Just look at the waiting list at Porsche dealer for 911s and how much they are charging for ADM. A used 2020 911 can be sold at its original MSRP because Porsche increased 911 line up price in early 2023 by more than 10%. Demand dictates price. Simple.
The new aston martin vantage is more appealing to me than a 992 at this point. Even with it being zf8 auto only.
that's a crazy statement
@@car-nugget but v8 and sideways!
Loved it! It’s crazy that the wait times on the automatic Carreras are 18 months!! 🤯🤯🤯
What about buying it in a year or so when it will have depreciated a bit? let's say around 120...would that change your mind? For weekend drive there would be these options: 718 GT4, 991.2 T, 997.1 GT3 or this 992 T. What to choose?
Can't find 718 gt4 and 997 gt3 for 120k anymore
@@lotusupra I live in Europe and here you can find them for that price...hence my question (120k Euro)
Would get a 40k mile 997.2 GT3 every time
Same, but not as an only car
He is hung up on the price too much, as others that pointed to that… this is a world we live in, this is now much 911 costs right now … no more under 100k 911… look at the prices of corvettes and bmw m cars etc , they are approaching 100k now… Is 718 gts 4.0 a better drive , I don’t think so. Review is very shallow, wanna something better … savage geese, many other channels
WOW what a 911
Great review. However, I prefer a rear engine car that does not "misbehave" if I am pushing it hard through a hairpin corner. Especially if there is little feedback through the steering.
Porsche keep moving the engine that extra bit further forward with each generation of 911, to make the car handle better (or easier at least).
This is nearly identical to the 992T spec I used to own. Totally agree it's a lot of money for the car that it is. Wish it wow'd for the money as much as the prior generation T.
Overpriced considering you could get a preowned R8 or NSX for the same price. Or a 991.1 with more emotional connection for half price. This coming from an owner of 2 911s.
Or a c8 z06 new
@@Sayu2x or a gt4, lotus emira, Aston Martin vantage
Or a GT4
@@Hodlprojectlots of choices 😂
Having two sports cars, a Z4 and 911 Carrera, I see the point but disagree a bit. At 190hp, the z4 is fun and can be pushed pretty hard to the limit easily. The 911at 325 hp gets into scary land, especially in New England roads. At 375hp, I could not even imagine the trouble I would get into. Porsche is almost forced into the hp wars although 90% of the owners never need or use it.
Could Porsche make a normally aspirated 718 2.0 flat-four with 200-something hp, a modern day base model 914? Or would no one (spec sheet racers) want to buy it because it's "slow"?
It would be awesome for Porsche to bring back the 912 model with the flat 4 cylinder from the 718 at like a $45,000 price range. Just having an affordable, lightweight model that most driving enthusiasts can afford would be perfect
For the money it’s way underpowered so it handles how many opportunities do you get to drive fast on tight roads
No double wishbone for $150k? Not like lack of space is the issue, it doesn't even have the engine at the front. They have all the horizontal space in the world and they put a strut. 🙄
There are plenty of glittering 911s parked up in front of nail salons, quietly waiting for their owners to emerge, here in Los Angeles.
VERY perceptive review. Your explanation of how the car’s near-perfect driving qualities might result in a certain lack of character, this is very interesting to me.
I have a 992 Carrera T…I can see what you are saying. I think a lot of what’s special about this car sort of comes through as a mixed use and ownership experience. My previous car was a 2001 Boxster S that I winded up loving more and more along the way…stepping from 997 GT3RS’s back into the Boxster never felt like a letdown, you felt the heritage. Similarly with this car I suspect. As someone in a test wrote…maybe not the most exciting one night stand, but the one you want to marry.
I read somewhere that the 911 has some of the highest, if not the highest profit margins in the industry. Not sure if that’s true, but they must be pretty darn good.
It's one of the only conventional stamped steel monocoques in its class isn't it? Where almost all competitor cars are some kind of aluminium spaceframe/bonded aluminium or carbon tub. So as long as the economies of scale from a relatively high production volumes are there, that should produce cost savings for Porsche I guess. It's impressive that Porsche can make a car with conventional steel construction that is similar in weight and stiffness to rival sportscars.
One thing is for sure, I loved the build spec of this car. The interior color and the matching on the tach. But my money and heat say cayman
I own an NSX and a Carrera T. The Porsche doesn't feel remotely as special to drive and I think the sound has a lot to do with it. I'm already thinking of moving on. My hope is that while it is expensive that that the actual cost of ownership will be low after selling it. I will say that for a sports car, it is extremely practical and a good daily driver.
What would you get after selling the T?
@@lotusupra I'm actually leaning towards an NC1 NSX. Would be cool to have both in the garage and it would be a completely different driving experience to anything I've owned before. I got to be around the NC1 for the first time last year at NSXPO, and it is much better in person than in the pictures. Beautiful cars.
" I think the sound has a lot to do with it" Because it's turbocharged?
@@TassieLorenzo That has a lot to do with it. It also doesn't rev as high. The NSX is just a symphony between 7k and 8k.
It's a very nice car. A little expensive. We own a Type S Integra. For what it cost it offers a fantastic driving experience. I'll slide a car that cost 50grand. I'm not going to slide a car that cost nearly three times that!
Even the GT3 in 992 form is just meh. GT4 or 997 GT3 is way more exciting!
A pickup truck is $90,000 so $124,000 for a 911 isn’t outrageous. $90,000 is outrageous for a 1/2 ton pickup
Preciously why I bought a 718 GT4 instead. If this was a daily driver it’d be a different story.
This seems to be the overall consensus for people who’ve driven multiple Porsches and performance cars. I got to drive one and ultimately don’t see why it’s so expensive…maybe like 90k, but 130k ish is a bit of a stretch
126k STARING!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Porsches have never been about performance/dollar. My Camaro LT1 would absolutely smoke this 911T on the straights and keep up on the turns. MSRP $40k new. But the interior is straight out of a rental car. A 911 is not a performance value, but its a quality product in all measurable and immeasurable metrics. What you pay for is a car that is equally at home on a backroad, a freeway, a countryclub, and city traffic. Plus you can squeeze in kids with a 911 with the 2+2 layout which significantly increases its usability compared to typical 2 seat sports cars. That being said, prices have crept up, but i attribute that to general inflation.
Lol you’re delusional bro. At best your LT1 would keep up with the T. After a while your steering wheel might fall off pushing it as hard as a Porsche can take it. You’re right though it is expensive for what you get but it’s the best.
@essel23fly would I rather have the 911T in a vacuum? Sure. But in real life, I'd take the LT1, keep up with the 911T in 95% of situations and have an extra $100k left over
I don't think it's enough car for the money. Porsche is protecting their 911 margins by continuing to hamstring the Boxster/Cayman suspension.
WHATS THE MOST EXOTIC CAR UNDER 40K?
V8 Vantage
335i with a burble tune. Jk. Maybe a higher mileage Elise
996 generation is a BLAST to drive and looks the part.
This car is so clean
yes its overpriced
Which Porsche models were your favorite then?
In no particular order: 997 RS 4.0 997 GT2 991.2 GT3 manual GT4 RS
I have a 2018 T. I paid just over $100k for it with 10k miles. The MSRP was $116k, with the rare LWBS option. There was, and is a lot of value at that price point. I find no value in the newer car, considering a pretty basic spec pushes up around $150k with just a couple of similar options to what my current car has. I still find myself day dreaming about Ruby Star Neo though 🤩 Edit: I want to add, I have a 2023 RS3 daily driver and my wife has a 2023 Taycan 4S. Another thing I like about the 991 T, every time I get in it, being greeted by a set of physical gauges and buttons is a welcome change of pace from the direction new cars are moving. The wall of screens in the Taycan especially, which is the same design language in the 992, is a tasteful execution of the modern design style, but there is something comforting about dropping into a bucket, turning a key, physical gages bouncing around, and just driving without having to confirm a user profile. I really have little desire to let go of this part of the past, and the 991.2 may have been the last 911 that will give that experience.
With LWBS that’s pretty good deal imo. Most people who bought the T did not spec it with LWBS and instead swathed it in leather and other bits you don’t need, so it’s hard to find an enthusiast spec used. The 991.2 Carrera T is my favorite, feels so alive and just enough power to keep you out of jail.
@@hobear637 I heard 173 were spec’d with LWBS. I think at the 991.2 MSRP it was an even more difficult prospect to consider, because the cost would be higher % of the total cost, compared to the higher cost of the 992. I mention this as I anticipate higher % of 992 will be spec’d with LWBS.
Street/canyon driving alone, driving slow car fast ftw. Spent 150k on something that you cant utilize the full potential is absurd.
Got rid of my new Audi and bought a 987.2 Cayman S. Traded competency for soul and fun!
I don’t think you are the target market for the new 911T. T actually does stand for touring. Then consider the performance enhancements and it’s a nice performer. Again, a car evolution not suited for your “giggles”.
Id take it
I’d get a 997 Gts
He should have got a GTS 4.0.....
Road name pls???
mines
@@tomlee9183 where?
overpriced
all that money for a base carrera with different badging
Rennthusiast sold his 992 carrera T after 6 months of ownership bc of similar reasons
Too clinically precise is right. It's more of a car drives you vs you drive the car type of experience, which make it less exciting and engaging, and we could say a bit soulless.
Compared to say a 997, it has a worse sounding engine, worse steering, worse curb weight, worse size. Try harder Porsche.
Objectively it corners better though. And it's 5x as livable. Pros/cons for sure
for $150,000, can get a GT4, if not a real supercar like a mclaren 570s or Audi R8 that do challenge the driving experience
Best 911 T interview so far 🙏🏽
You’re not crazy, it is boring. Say it, they are not worth the $. Leave the Porsche reverence out of the review. My Cayman S was boring and I sold it. You’re right, there is so much out there that is worth the $ as a driving experience.
What would you prefer to replace your Cayman S? (What gen did you have?)
I went from a Camaro to a 911. Yes the 911 can feel too sterile but you really appreciate how it’s a purpose built sports car. I guarantee you nobody would take a Camaro over a 911 if given the choice regardless of model year. It’s girl you keep, not the one you have a one night stand with, as it’s been said…
I think every Porsche, new or used these days, is over-priced. A lot of the blame is on Porsche, but a good amount of it I think is also on a number of factors ranging from the economy to car culture as a whole with auction websites and whatnot drumming up hype for any sporty car with a manual. It's not entirely fair for me to single out Porsche, but they do come across like they spit in people's eyes moreso than other brands. They're like the Rolex of the car industry in that regard. Like, of course I like Porsches, and the 911 T is more up my alley than other models probably, but the utter lack of value and expectation to essentially just pay for the uniqueness and badge is pretty insulting.
A base model Macan is a relatively affordable entry point into the brand isn't it? 😃/s
$80k work trucks are the norm these days also. I think Porsche prices are ok relatively speaking.
There is nothing boring about the T you are terrible
Seems like a fitting car for some old guy who likes keeping it below 4k rpm and babying it all the time. Cars and coffee car only lol
Non-GT 911s are the German equivalent of a boomer's Corvette. Their owners don't buy them in search of a driving experience, as bad as that may sound for a "sports car".
That doesn't apply to all owners. I think plenty are still appreciative of the driving dynamics.
As a new 992 t manual owner, I totally agree with you. This car is great in so many ways and it is a logical choice of me. But in the end, I don’t feel any passion while driving it.