Latin Poetry & Conversation: using Virgil to become better Latin speakers, Living Latin in NYC 2023
In this talk, I show how we can use Latin poetry to improve our ability to speak Latin, and vice versa. I go into much more detail about this in my new audiobook, The Conversational Latin of Virgil's Eclogues and Latin Pronunciation Guide: luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/pr...
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Intro and outro music: Overture of Die Zauberflöte (The Magic Flute) by Mozart
I go into much more detail about this topic in my new audiobook, The Conversational Latin of Virgil's Eclogues and Latin Pronunciation Guide where I teach you the correct scansion of Latin poetry and the right way to pronounce Latin in conversation: luke-ranieri.myshopify.com/products/the-conversational-latin-of-virgil-s-eclogues-latin-pronunciation-guide Many thanks to the Paideia Institute for inviting me to speak at their Living Latin in New York City 2023 conference. Join me at Living Latin in New York City 2024, Feb. 17-18! Register here: www.paideiainstitute.org/llinyc_2024
We were traveling in Prague and no one around us could speak English or Italian. Then, my aunt tried Latin. All of a sudden, five people came out of the crowd and began speaking to her in Latin. We were just stunned! And to think we had to travel all the way to Prague to get directions in Latin to a museum. Wonders never cease.
I am sorry, but I don't believe you. Literally everyone speaks some English in Prague (younger generation). Almost no one speaks Latin tho....
@@nikto81Mind the time period wasn't specified
Yeah, unless it was really LONG time ago...
@@nikto81 Depends what you consider long time, that scenario is still concievable in fair living memory.
@@jankrizkovsky9446that long that the Common tongue they found themselves speaking was Latin ;)
I'v read that during the WW2 in France Arthur Reddish wanted to know where are the German soldiers but no one can speaks french. He knew latin and ask french priest "Ubi sita Germanorum?". Priest answers "Germanorum in pontem sunt".
Nice story but bad Latin😅
You and Captain Picard bear striking similarity … in your love of space, philosophy, and culture. :)
I dare say the character had a positive influence on me.
@@polyMATHY_Luke I was listening to an audio version of Seneca's letters to Lucilius the other day. Hearing this passage in letter 5, "Quod pertinaciter studes et omnibus omissis hoc unum agis, *ut te meliorem cotidie facias*..." immediately made me think of Captain Picard. I used to watch Star Trek with friends in the early 2000s. While I was never that much into it, Patrick Stewart's character really stood out to me. In fact, I feel like rewatching some of the old episodes now. 😄
I think the coolest thing about this is that we get to memorize beautiful passages which may forever embelish our memory. Beauty should not be underestimated.
Very well said! The introduction to the audiobook has an extensive passage about this.
As a native Spanish speaker I became fluent in Latin in a short period of time ❤
I LOVE the beard and the suit
Gay
@@user-li5uh9cn4l A true gentleman can compliment another respectable gentleman without it being gay.
My favorite TNG episode of all time . “Sokath, his eyes uncovered!” Great video Luke, and I always appreciate your unique insight. ❤
Thanks for your comment and support, Jason! It means a lot to me. Temba his arms wide!
Omnia vincit amor, l'amour vaincra , bravo pour vos conférences sur cette superbe langue latine! Gratias tibi ago!
I've never thought about the use of memes and more generally assonance in conversation and literature. Now I realize how convenient these little shortcuts are! gratias tibi ago, Luce.
Grātiās et tibi referō!
Luke Ranieri 🙏 Thank you! Your social media content didn’t just helped me to get better at English pronunciation, but taking the initiative to learn Latin and Latin languages. Moreover, discovering knowledge, philosophy, informative content I have not had a clue about it. I appreciate you!
I’m glad my videos have been of help!
Fantastic presentation, and quite a snappy suit there!
Thanks!
Nice suit. Glad to see that the tie and pocket square are different patterns and colors
I think they match well enough. Thanks for noticing.
The metre and I have been friends ever since I wasn't forced to recite it as a stress accent in school anymore :)
You talk about the phonemic syllables length, which is probably the first thing you can learn through the poetry. Can you also use it to understand what rhymes with what on the author time and place, and thus recreate the pronounciation? For petry types with rhymes of course, like say Shakespeare.
Classical Latin poetry has virtually no rhymes (where they occur are essentially accidental).
Hi Luke! You are one of a kind! Rara avis! Greetings from Claudiopolis!
Darmok is my personal favorite episode too. I love it to bits.
Fascinating, just fascinating. Thank you for sharing.
Darmok And Jalad At Tanagra! A favourite Star Trek episode of mine. As for Latin poetry I have a fondness for Catullus but I like Virgtil too. I learned Latin in high school in Toronto, Canada at Humberside Collegiate Institute from Miss Wilson and I later did my BA at U of T in History and Classical Civilizations. Love this stuff. And I miss the days when Radio Finland International used to do its news in Latin.
Me too!
Nice! Never heard of news in Latin. Someone could read the concise news flash from @S2_underground in Latin, or maybe just the Weekly Roll.
I saw Patrick Stewart here in São Paulo, Brazil back in 2014 when he was divulging the premiere of the then new X-men!
James McAvoy was together with him. Both Professors Xavier.
I learned latina lingua 20 years ago on the study. Nice memories go back :-)
I love this guy! His videos are so cool. I love the ones in which he speaks with Italians. Also, Star Trek Next Generation reference was awesome!
Great presentation. Ideas and ... the speaking arts !
Thank you kindly!
He is THE most smooth talker on the planet. He can literally speak about anything I'd listen.
Thanks for posting this!
Thanks for watching, my friend!
I'm very excited, Luke! This is exactly what I'm looking for in this phase of my learning! Also very excited for the "Coming soon!" items!
Thanks! I’ll be working on those this year
When I was in college 50 years ago I was not doing well and so took a class in ancient Greek just for fun. One day the teacher was musing about how lots of our languages have these concepts of subjects and verbs and objects and so on, and what might a language be like that had none of those, if it was even possible. Some decades later I saw that Star Trek episode and thought of that, and taped the episode and sent it to him, to show that someone else had wondered about that also. Off topic, a few years ago before I retired I was in a bit of a computer support crisis at work and I popped off a line from the "Airplane" movie that I had picked a bad day to give up amphetamines. Some time later it crossed my mind that maybe there was some potential for a language based on references to movies. I did not pursue it much further than that one example of "I picked a bad day to give up amphetamines" meaning that things are not going well and I am having a bit of a struggle dealing with it.
I should give this a go with quotations from the Vulgate translation of the Bible and the Mass. One personal favorite I could stand to use more often comes from the Preface to the Canon - “vērē dignum et jūstum est.” Tricky to properly pronounce though - look at those final M’s begging to disappear into a nasalized ũ, or the way the terminal -um lends itself so well to elision with following “et” or “est”. Sometimes I catch myself saying “fīat lūx” when I turn on the lights. Helps me fear the dark less.
The only line of Latin poetry I remember from school is "Quid quid id est timeo Danaos et dona ferente." The rhythm of the syllables is unavoidable in that one. Unfortuately, I rarely heard Latin spoken in that way. It was typically reduced to Received Pronunciation patterns of British English. I do like your emphasis on using poetic metaphor and idioms as key components of everyday conversation.
Very smart suit!
I can't believe you got that shakesperian accent from back then down.
Gratias tibi ago tanto huic pelliculae, magister mi! Adoro illam tantopere! Egomet mihi iam legi quinque fabulas Plauti et vero tibi dico me conari facere prorsum quid nobis hic suadeas cum sententiis Plauti quae oppido mi placeant! 😁
I was thinking of the …at Tenagra episode just YESTERDAY, when someone made a cultural reference!
That's awesome!
Loved this! Have just bought your new audiobook 😉. Is there any chance you could provide us with a link to the Hermaneumata book you mentioned? Please and thank you. 😃
I heartily agree that high literature should guide the study of classical languages. That is, really, the greatest thing to be gained from them.
Quite so!
Looking extremely sharp in that suit! Lūca tē in optimīs mōribus exhibēs
I like English without the stressed accents. Listen to the episode of Fran is engaged (the Nanny) from minute 4:00 when the French tutor speaks.. You will hear the teacher speak English without any stressed accents. Lovely 😊
I often add some lines of Horace in my speech, such as "non amplius addam" from one of his satires. Great talk!
That’s a good one! I hope to continue this series in the future for audiobooks
Luke, I just want to say that even though I’m not learning Latin, I appreciate than in general for languages, you are quite mature and don’t have beliefs of inferiority or superiority. I like how you acknowledge dialects and accents as dialects and accents, not inferior or superior. For example, the language of ecclesiastical Latin according to you, is not better or worse than classical Latin, which is a really healthy mindset! I’m studying Spanish (im also interested in medieval Spanish, but I love the sounds of modern Latin American Spanish!) but have studied 5 languages before (aiming for fluency tho and I’m already intermediate) and every accent has something I like in it :) Someone else might prefer Italian, but it’s preference. It’s beautiful that the romance branch spawned so many beautiful ways of speaking, just like the branches of Germanic and Semitic, respectively part of PIE and Afro Asiatic :D
Very kind! Thanks for the generous words
@@polyMATHY_Lukethanks! I feel like so much of the world is opened to you when you put away preconceived notions and prejudices. It’s like “this is different, not worse” and once you adopt that mindset, things get richer historically! My friend and I would debate over Greece and Rome as kids, but obviously like most young adults, we realize each had their own particular qualities. I think open mindedness is really important for intellectuality, not sure how to describe it. Ever since I have viewed history and language as not this quantified measure of cooler or lamer, suddenly everything is cool!
👏
Finally an American pronouncing Latin without an American accent. Oh, his name is Ranieri
"Vincit" pronounced that way sounds more similar to "win". "Omnia vincit amor", I guess that every anglophone who doesn't know Latin could guess what that means! (En)amour(ed) is an English word as well in the end.
Latin AND star Trek. I'm so sad I didn't go.
I was expecting him to speak in latin and open my subtitles.
I live in Pietole, where Virgilio was born, in Georgiche street . You are great!
Che fico!
Tell us the number of your house, and we'll be your guests hehe
37, what's the problem? My Pietole is closed to Mantua a beautiful old town built by the Etruscans abput 2.300 years ago. You should come and visit.@@g.h.milanboseblut5616
Hey Luke, do you happen to know an author who's name is Frederico Lourenço ? He wrote 2 books to teach latim, Latim do Zero and Nova Gramática do Latim the first one is supossed to teach you latin from the beginning (struting on Virgil's Eneida and Vulgata) and the second one is for grammar itself built based on the first book.
Interesting; sounds like a grammar-translation book.
@@polyMATHY_Luke Yep !! Nothing compared to LLPSI but it's Interesting.
What that episode of ST makes me wonder is who were the poor people who were immortalized as the meme examples of fighting over doing the dishes.
my favorite Latin joke: Semper ubi sub ubi. LMFAO 🙂
I learned that from an episode of Frasier.
@@polyMATHY_Luke if you like that joke then I think you'd love to know that there are versions of Dr. Seuss books translated into Latin. I think the best part is that the translators managed to maintain the same rhyming meter. Guenevera Tunberg and Terentio Tunberg are the translators if you want to look them up. 🙂
😊
As a native spanish speaker, I feel like I'm doing myself a great disservice in not learning Latin. Given my inheritant understanding of some of the nuances of the language. Im going to go for it
Temba, his arms wide
The River Temarc! Haha
Just a small nitpick, but the German language DOES have phonemic vowel length! It's not too common, but there is certainly an audible difference between 'Aachen', the city with long 'a', and 'Achen', a made-up word, but with a short 'a'. In German, native speaker would definitely complain the you're pronouncing it wrong if you didn't pronounce the long 'a'.
The word 'Achen' actually exists, would be the plural of an old word for streams found in 'Salzach' for example 😄 And you're absolutely right about phonemic vowel length in German, compare e.g. 'Schall' with 'Schal' to cite something more common
I addressed this specifically in the video - did you watch till the end? The rarity of this in German, English etc. makes it not very helpful when trying to understand the concept in Latin. Moreover, it’s usually only in stressed syllables. A better modern language to compare is Finnish or Hungarian.
@@polyMATHY_Luke Yes you're right, I commented before watching all the way to then end, I'm sorry😅. I totally agree with the point you made and that made much more sense than just the statement "German has no phonemic vowel length".😅
What was your major in college, if you don't mind me asking? Did you study linguistics?
Geological Sciences: kzhead.info/channel/PLQQL5IeNgck0AP7zERyrucrujED9OoB4m.html&si=VWi1-Xlo1yZ3Paar
@@polyMATHY_Luke How did you get into languages, especially Latin and Ancient Greek?
So that alien was basically speaking in Chengyu. That's cool.
Primo.
Completely off topic, but it might be worth asking a tailor to make a small adjustment to the width of your jacket, so your clothes, which are already very good, will look like a million dollars.
Well, back in 2014 this suit was professionally tailored in Korea while I was stationed in East Asia. The problem is that I’m no longer the same shape hehe
@@polyMATHY_Lukereally seems to be, that's why the comment, if it looked like a cheap suit, I would have ignored it.
Et si aujourd'hui je vous dit "Legio Patria nostra !", à quoi pensez vous ? Bel exemple non ?
Now you look like a professor
Refragatio cassum est. Nos Borg est. Vestara vita perditissima est. Servietis nobis.
Borg sumus. Communioni nostra qualitates vestras assimulabimus. Refragatio futilis est.
I feel Latin sounds to me like certain language spoken in the movie " Lord of the ring".
Tolkien knew and loved Latin (and Italian, a little), but the real deal among his languages is the Elvish Quenya, that he made to sound like Finnish, a language with a lot of wovels of different length and with words that end in wovels, so maybe that's why it sounds a bit Latin (and Tolkien thought of it like a sort of "Elvish Latin" in its kinship with the other Elvish languages that he also created).
@@Laurelin70 He made it to sound like Welsh, but to be structured like Finnish. Tolkien said that the English word "Cellar Door" sounded rather beautiful, especially if you pronounced it as a single word "Seledor". And that Welsh was filled with such Cellar Doors. Quenya keeps far more Finnish phonotactic influence tho', especially when compared to Sindarin, which leans far more Welsh.
Small side question: where is your American accent from? I noticed that you pronounced 'wh' (e.g. in what, when, etc.) differently than "standard American". Just curious where that is the case. :)
I’m from Pennsylvania. Because I think about pronunciation in ancient languages, I incorporate a few older sounds in my English. Interestingly, until a few decades ago, pronouncing wh distinctly from w was the only standard American and British way to utter them. So it’s not even that archaic, and I’m bringing it back for my own speech haha.
Just found this guy. Why does he look like the nostalgic critic? Lol he's way more interesting though
Why using pronuncia restituta?
Perché la pronuncia restituta è di fatto la pronuncia di Virgilio. È anche lo standard internazionale. Solo in Italia rimane la pronuncia tradizionale italiana (detta ecclesiastica) nel campo accademico.
@@polyMATHY_Luke ...che è esattamente quella che ci fanno studiare dal liceo in poi 😅 la pronuncia restituta ce la fanno usare, all'università, solo per gli autori più antichi, come Plauto.
Lingua latina pulcherrima est et quamvis eam non loquor, una est linguarum gratissimarum et re vera et lingua mea patria Lusitana et Hispanica, Gallica, Italica, Sardana, Galiciana, Romaniana, etc. Omnes hae linguae filii Latinae sunt, evolutionis vulgaris Latinae pro populo loquentis et valde superbus sum hereditatem meam Latinam.🇧🇷🇪🇸🇨🇵🇮🇹🇵🇹🇦🇷🇨🇱🇺🇾🇳🇮🇵🇪🇪🇨
But many times we're given rhymes that are quite unsingable.
Latino no grazie.
Ti capisco. Imparare il latino nel modo in cui viene comunemente insegnato può essere inefficiente e noioso. Ecco perché persone come Luke (Lucio) insegnano il latino e il greco antico con metodi naturali.
Latin spoken by English people is quite unlistenable, a part the accent that is relative for everyone beacause no one know in reality how Latin sound spoken by Omero, Virgilio, Lucrezio, Augusto, ecc. But for me the fun fact is that there are a lot of letters that are speak wrong, for example the C or the couple AE, the consonant are always to soft, they have to be mor sharp and hard! C'mon anglosaxons you can improve, but we can apologize you, you were the outskirt of empire. 😂😂😅 🎉