Are Heat Pump Dryers Really Worth It? Miele Dryer Review
Are Heat Pump Dryers Really Worth It? Miele Dryer Review. The first 100 people to use code UNDECIDED at the link below will get 60% off of Incogni: incogni.com/undecided Heat pumps are starting to catch a lot more attention for heating and cooling your home now than they have in the past. The same is true for other uses, but … this one really surprised me … what about putting a heat pump in your dryer? There’s some insanely cool, or should I say hot, engineering inside this dryer that doesn’t require a vent to the outside or a high voltage outlet. This thing runs off of a standard 15 amp household outlet and will use four to five times less electricity than a typical electric dryer. So if they’re that good, why aren’t they used everywhere? Well, I’ve been living with this Miele model for a while now and I have some thoughts on that. It’s one of my favorite pieces of new tech in my home. It’s kind of genius, but not perfect. How does this thing work … and are heat pump dryers even worth it?
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A sheltered clothes line for when it's wet out and a clothes horse for when it's below freezing.. Minimal manufacturing and transport cost and 0 running costs (Beyond heating my home in winter) Everything drys in a few hours especially when there is decent air-flow.
You can stack miele washing machine and dryers as well. Volume i think is only depending on the volume of the washing machine.
Question: I built some custom cabinets and a table top in my laundry room and currently my dryer doesn’t have a ton of airflow becuase its boxed in left and right by 3/4” plywood. Is a lack of good airflow going to be a problem?
@@stefanbuscaylet: Conventional or heat pump dryer? For the heat pump dryer, it’s not much of a problem as long as some heat can convect into the room. But a vented dryer needs 100+ cfm (¼+ ton) of continuous intake air while running.
@@stefanbuscaylet the GE is built with this in mind you just need air in the front and for it not to be touching the wall at the back
As an ex Miele technician, it pays to keep on top of the maintenance with the heat pump dryers. The mixture of lint and the condensed water makes a lovely gooey mess that loves to block everything up so make sure you clean the lint filters regularly. Pull that condenser box out, take it outside and hose it out then let it dry on a regular basis and you should get a long life out of the machine. And yes, that was the most common complaint about them, that they didn't dry like the old machines, that will take some adjustment.
Amen. This tip is valid!
"didn't dry like the old machines" is a euphemism for "they use 3x the total amount of electricity overall because of how long they have to run and still don't get your clothes dry at all so they rot and mold in your closet".
@@superslash7254 They might take longer to perform the same task, but they are something like 70% more efficient. Also, having a milder drying cycle should mean your stuff lasts longer.
you can't remove the condenser box so Miele added an additional filter so you should never have to touch the condenser coils, unlike most other machines which require the owner to vacuum the build up off.
@@superslash7254 your comments makes it apparent you've no idea what your talking about, is your last name Trump? Europeans are far more civilised than yanks and have used far more efficient appliances (like the rest of the world) for decades. Its blatantly obvious you need to listen more.
Hi. As a European, I have a few considerations 1. Here it is much more common to find heat pump machines rather than electric resistance machines. In fact there are only one or two brands that have resistance machines in the line up and they are low cost brands. 2. The heat pump is all the more efficient and powerful in drying the higher the room temperature is. If you place them in unheated areas they will be much less efficient. 3. The heat exchanger has to be cleaned constantly and at some point it will be necessary to disassemble the entire machine to get to every point. 4. The cooling circuit is complicated, buying cheap machines does not pay off in the long run. With the electric resistance, on the other hand, everything is simpler. 5. The Miele is calibrated for the European market, especially here in Italy we iron everything. The residual humidity is also calculated to favour ironing. 6. It would be better not to place the dryer on top of the washing machine, the washing machine vibrates a lot during the spin cycle and is not very good for the refrigerating circuit. 7. In my opinion, the future is heat pumps and gas dryers for those who want more power. At the moment they are not very common in Italy, I think the only one officially sold is Rinnai. 8. Maybe in the future we will have more powerful dryers with an external heat pump, but this means having them installed by qualified personnel. 9. Your Miele is pricy but you can buy their bottom line machines for a 1000$. 10. Nice video.
100% true. I didnt't even know that they still sell any non-heatpump driers in Europe. At the lower price range you heatpump driers (Siemens or Bosch) start at ~500€.
In the washing cellar we share for the whole house, two months ago the last resistive dryer has been removed. Here they usually vent through a filter into the room. Boy, was that a change to room temperature / humidity. Those old ones ar awfull.
Miele is ok i guess, but Siemens/BSH really catched up. For 700€ you can get the lower high end stuff, like 8L volume and the extraklasse logo
so should one invest in a ehat pump dryer?
@@randomrazr If you are going to buy a new dryer anyway, then yes, buy one with a heatpump. Reason may be you are moving, your old dryer broke down, or you have a really old, crappy dryer and you are unhappy with it. If you already have a conventional dryer and are happy with it, then keep it. It's not like with conventional light bulbs, which you should replace with LEDs immediately, even when the old bulbs are still working. Because the Return of Invest is very fast with LEDs and rather slow with a heatpump dryer.
Love our Bosch heatpump dryer. I never had the feeling that the clothes are not dry enough. One big advantage, besides the low power consumption: Due to the lower temperatures used, it is a lot more gentle to the textiles.
I think Bosch owns miele?
@@mrsoccergod5001 I dont know, but the Bosch branded line at least targets a more price/performance minded customer. So they arent as high quality as Miele but much more affordable. same as DaNiePred I own a Bosch heat pump drier, working great. Cost me around €800 a couple years back
@@mrsoccergod5001Certainly NOT
@@mrsoccergod5001 Both Bosch and Miele are German brands. But not otherwise connected. Miele is its own brand. Bosch a big BIG firm making a lot of stuff
@@mrsoccergod5001 Bosch and Siemens are working together (mid class segment or a bit higher) while Mile is a separate company and considered as a more premium brand.
I have had an LG heat pump drier for over three years and one of the characteristics that surprised me was how the clothes feel after drying. They do not feel "hard and cooked" but feel soft, towels in particular which now last longer but that applies to other materials/clothes as well. Highly efficient and quiet. More expensive but worth it and a good warranty.
I had one since 2005, quite good! Still can't beat a clothesline or drying rack when the weather permits using it.
Thats with all dryers, its due to the mangeling in the drum. If only those machines had a mode that only rotates the drum without heating. To soften your already dry clothes.
That's how all dryers work, nothing exciting about it.
@@stevenvanpelt486 not true at all. I have a heat pump and vented dryer in each of my homes. The fibers of the clothes dried in the heat pump dryer are substantially softer and clothes are nearly as hot leading them to lasting much longer.
My old dryer used to draw 3.3kW for roughly an hour. My new one (a Sharp heatpump dryer) draws a bit less than 360W for 1 1/2 hours. Dryness is as described in the video, BUT I can now run the dryer six times and still be a little more efficient than before. And that machine only cost me 400€, so it'll be payed off in a reasonable time frame at my current energy cost.
Does Sharp sell it in North America? (I didn’t attempt to Google it yet.)
@@gregp.7148 I think they sell world wide. They at least sell in Europe. It's a KD-GHB 7S 7 GW 2, so maybe you can find it aswell.
Alright... But if you run it 6 times at 1.5 hours, that's 9 hours right? I don't have that much time to invest in my laundry
Do you just wait around for your laundry to dry?
@@evandwrightyou know.... You don't need to be there looking at it and waiting for it to end. You can go and watch your favourite show or go and eat some McDonald's or whatever and it will be done when you finish
We installed a 2 way vent on our electric dryer so that during colder months, the dryer vents into the basement (it has a filter on it to prevent lint going everywhere) and in the summer you turn it to vent to the outside. This provides additional heat and moisture to the interior of the house in the winter and vents to the outside in the summer. While it may not be as efficient as a heat pump, it still helps utilize the energy more efficiently than just constantly dumping it outside.
Is condensation a problem in the basement?
@LoreTunderin Ya that would be my only worry, they have been around for years but wonder about all that humidity being pumped into the house
I used to live in Alberta, Canada, and in places like that, this is a great idea. It gets so cold during winter that humidity drops to 0. During those months, we ran a humidifier or two indoors at all times, otherwise you'd wake up with nosebleeds due to the dryness. Using a byproduct to humidify and heat is 💯
Yep! I do something similar in cold months. "Free" humidification (and some heat). Because why expel humidity and heat straight outside while sucking in cold dry winter air inside? People think I'm nuts, but I say I'm practical LOL! But I live alone and do just one medium-ish load a week. Just a modest 1,000ft² bungalow. I never had an issue. This idea might not work in a busy home. Don't tell my arrogant condescending maintenance guy (I rent) 🤪
Good Idea. As others have said, in the winter the air is extremely dry where I live. A little warm moist air won't hurt.
One more absolute big advantage is that you can dry clothes that usually cant go in a dryer. I have some uniqlo t shirts for example where the label says that I cant put it in the dryer. But because the machine doesnt run as hot it is absolutely no Problem. I recently bought a Miele dryer and it is an absolute game changer. Also, before that, our apartment used to be very humid when we air dryed our clothes, which is now no problem anymore.
I'm considering buying the Miele heat pump and was told by the salesperson that you can also put sweaters inside. I would be a bit apprehensive with my cashmeres, but would definitely consider more delicate stuff that I usually hang outside.
@@WaterfallTech There is an accessory (maybe it’s even included, I’m not sure), a rack that goes inside onto which you lay items that shouldn’t be tumbled. This way you can dry things like cashmere. The low temperature of a heat pump dryer is very gentle.
Yes. I live in Japan and have used a washer/dryer for the last 10+ years that uses heat pump tech. It is awesome.
I’m a Miele veteran from the UK. One aspect you didn’t touch on Matt is longevity: Miele build quality is legendary and as new technology arrives even for an existing Miele washer owner of nearly 26 years and counting, I can see when new products are a convenience or a real breakthrough. For comparison my washer cost just shy of €580 in 1998 imported from Germany. At the time we’d pay around £300-350 for a regular model. Later in life I did just that and it died after 6 years in a rental property. I’d happily pick a Miele heat pump dryer if I had the room, and your video does a great job of giving an honest pros and cons review. Love it, thanks!
Indeed! My Miele washing machine broke down after 8 years and the Miele-mechanic offered a new one for half the price since that part shouldn't have broken. They didn't even charge me for the transport! A Miele washing machine is apparently supposed to last for 10.000 hours of running and I was only halfway. I don't expect that service from Samsung or LG!
Thanks for sharing and the feedback.
And.. Miele is the only brand that you can place in the bathroom and it will not rust. I have my washer - and dryer - in my bathroom for 13 years, they still work fine. And will for another 20, since I do not have kids. And I can hang more clothes in the same same room, that do not (or can’t ) be in the dryer , so it will dry the laundry , from the heat from the dryer :) Twice as efficient
Another thing is: Spare parts. Like Bosch here in Europe they have plenty and they are easy to order. On my second fluff-filter after 10 years (and a3rd is just in storage until I need it)
You won't see that from Bosch either. I had a table saw that only ran for a few, (less than 10) hours and because I had it for over a year they did ZERO for me. My big Delta saw is on the same motor for over 50 YEARS so far.@@chris_14959
Stacking the Dryer on top of the washing machine is common here in Germany for at least 20 Years. Saves on floor space Combo washing machine Dryer thingies are common in Europe too and available from many different manufacturers, but they are not as efficient as their single purpose counterparts Miele is a German company btw. so there is a good chance they have a stacking kit available for your machine too. Also: We measure capacity on washing machines in kg, not m³
I agree to all that but began to wonder why are we measuring the capacity of a dryer in kg and not m³ or liters. So I asked ChatGPT: Measuring the capacity of a dryer in kilograms (kg) rather than in cubic meters (m³) or liters is a practical approach that reflects the real-world usage of the appliance. Here are a few reasons why this is the case: Relevance to Laundry Loads: When people do laundry, they think in terms of the weight of the clothes rather than the volume. Clothes are usually measured by how much they weigh when dry, making kg a more intuitive unit for consumers. Variability in Fabric Density: Different types of fabrics have different densities. Lightweight, airy materials like chiffon take up more space but weigh less, while heavy materials like denim or wool are denser and weigh more. Measuring in volume (m³ or liters) would not accurately represent how much laundry the dryer can effectively handle. Efficiency and Performance: Dryers are designed to handle a certain weight of wet clothes, which directly impacts their efficiency and drying performance. Overloading a dryer with too much weight can strain the motor and reduce efficiency, while underloading leads to energy waste. Therefore, the weight capacity is a better indicator of how much the machine can handle without compromising on performance. Standardization Across Models and Brands: Using kg as a standard unit of measurement allows consumers to easily compare different models and brands of dryers. This standardization helps in making informed purchasing decisions. Global Understanding: Weight is a universally understood and used measurement, making it easier for people around the world to understand and use their dryers effectively, regardless of where they are manufactured or used. In summary, using kilograms for dryer capacity is more relevant and practical for everyday use, reflecting how people typically use these appliances and the nature of the items they dry.
You can stack most modern frontloading washing machines and dryers without a stacking kit. The dryer doesn't move at all and unless the washer is broken then it doesn't move either.
I had one of those old washer/dryer units but it never really dried the clothes. And it wasted water by running the cold tap through a set of coils for the moisture to condense on. These heat pump dryers are brilliant, though I don't think I'm ready to buy that $2700 one!!
Stacking is common in the US too.
In the us stackables are more common in cities but fewer people live in small spaces here. That being said, ge may have cracked the code with their ultrafast heat pump combo. It's not huge but larger than most European models, runs on regular voltage, and speeds up the process by using ultrafast spinning. While it takes an hour longer than two separate machines , you don't have to transfer, and it actually works. Like most heat pump dryers though, it's expensive
As an owner of the GE Profile washer/dryer combo (often referred to as the "One and Done") I can tell you it's an absolute game changer. Here's what makes it great: - Occupies half the space (width wise...it's slightly taller than a standard washer/dryer) - Doesn't require a 240v line - Doesn't require a dryer vent line (all the excess moisture goes down the drain) - Uses a fraction of the energy of a standard washer/dryer due to the heat pump drying - Creates very little lint, is much gentler on clothes, and your garments will last longer - Doesn't heat up the room/area that it's running in The downsides: - Somewhat pricey (but essentially the same price as a premium washer/dryer separates) - Somewhat untested tech...longevity, long-term maintenance, and reliability are yet to be seen but 3 months in and so far, so good - Slower to dry clothing...GE claims most loads should take 2 hours but in reality it's usally 2 1/2 to 2 3/4 hours per load - Clothing appears slightly damp when cycle is done but just take it out, give it a shake and it's fine (Matt discusses this in this video) - While it has a larger drum than similar European units you can't wash/dry as much at one time as you can with a standard setup. If you have a large family or tend to do all your laundry on one day of the week, the all-in-one may not be for you. For me it was a no-brainer and so far I'm absolutely thrilled with it.
The big issue is how long it lasts and how much it costs to fix? There is a reason you do not see those in every laundromat and home
That isn’t an issue to everyone. I’ll gladly pay more for convenience and space savings. As electricity and gas continues to rise, it might even make economical sense.
@@majist0 The new GE ones might be good, but I have old machines that are easy to repair with cheap available parts. I save so much money on initial and maintenance cost that I can purchase tons of energy for them. They do not make appliances to last multiple decades anymore.
Combo units aren't terribly new. Splendide washer dryer combos have been the norm on rv's and boats for decades.
@@mgkleym Combo units with heat pumps are around a year old.
I am a appliance technician who has worked on units from LG and GE (not meile), I do not expect these dryers to last 15-20 years. The average refrigerator is good for ~5-10 years and the 'heat pump' is really just a refrigeration loop. I have already seen several GE units have their loops fail. The other issue people forget about is daily maintenance. You must be very studious in cleaning the filters on these units or they very quickly loose their efficiency. If you are not willing to thoroughly clean the filters (much more thoroughly than on a traditional dryer) EVERY LOAD then these machines will not work well for you. Slow drying cycles is the number one complaint we get on these and it is almost always due to improper cleaning of the vents.
Miele is an old German appliance company that, unlike some German car brands, has an excellent reputation. At least in Germany.
We have a 8 year old Miele heat pump dryer and it still works as when it was new. I have changed the filter once and i'm going to change it once again in the near future. You off course have to clean them regularly.
5-10 years for a refrigerator??? What kind of fridges are you buying? I have one from at least 20 years ago that is still alive and kicking today. Also what bout A/C units? Those are just heat pumps too and also last years and years. Much longer than 10 years if there were no mechanical defects.
@@1234567895182 : There is a world of difference between a 20 year old machine and a 5 year old one. I would pay to fix the 20 year old one twice before the 5 year old one. Try taking your window shaker in for service... the parts for that are not even available, it's a thro away. Outdoor units are another animal completely as far as build quality. But no matter what machine you talk about the cost to maintain a unit is directly related to it's complexity. And these washer/dryer units are the most complex appliance in your home, so they will also require more (and more expensive) maintenance.
@@ariorobotics8583 : Meile is a good brand, but rarely seen in my area. Never seen a combo from them, so I won't judge. I was speaking mainly about the GE (seen to many of those brand new units go bad already)
I have the exact same set as you. The energy savings from the dryer is insane, not to mention no more BS dealing with a dryer vent. I have a king size blanket that takes a decent bit longer to dry in this thing, but otherwise no complaints.
Thanks for sharing!
Do energy savings really matter, when you have solar and your electricity is free?
@@aevangel1 TLDR yes. The more efficient your appliances, the less energy you need to draw from the batteries, which mean more allowance for other things to run. If you're grid tied and using a smart meter for electricity buyback programs, you get more credits per year, which means you recoup the cost of the solar system earlier. Efficiency is actually really important.
@@aevangel1Night time is a thing you know?
@@aevangel1 Yea, i have solar and before i got an electric car i broke even almost all year, now i only break even 3 months in, and now that rates went from .04/kw to .17/kw it makes a big difference.
Our GE combo is hands-down the greatest appliance in our house. It wasn’t cheap, but for ease of use it’s unmatched. It’s got hoppers for detergent and fabric softener which adds to the ease of use. We now just put a load on at night, then fold laundry in the morning, life changing
We also just got the GE combo a month ago, and couldn't agree more! Being able to just toss a load in, have it run by itself to completion, no messing with detergent, no swapping clothes over is unbelievably nice. If you are calculating your time as money - even just 5 minutes per load - that will far outpace any electricity savings! Just for anyone considering it, the biggest negative of the thing I experienced is how HEAVY it is, the unit is over 300 lbs. We had it delivered and not installed, and luckily my wife and I are both young and strong and could install the stand and get it into place, but I recommend having it installed. That is an awkward 300 lbs to move around without the right equipment. It also has sensors in it which auto adjust the cycle based on the weight of clothes in it, so unless you have a load of delicates or something, you don't need to mess with any of that either.
We share a house with another young family and got a GE combo last summer. It’s been such a blessing! Toss a load in and two hours and change later it’s done and dry - no needing to shift the load. I really hope it lasts!
We really love the GE combo. So nice not to have to remember to switch appliance to dry. You do need to clean the filter more often, but all of that microplastic would have just been vented.
Sell the Mila and get the GE. So far it's been awesome. Now we need to put some shelves in where the dryer used to be😊
@@davidkclayton I put a utility sink in where mine was! More work than shelves with the plumbing and all, but totally worth it.
Hi Matt, I have an LG heat pump dryer and with a 9kg drum (the exact heat pump dryer at the end of your video). It comes with a washing machine stacking tray, so it is stackable, wifi connected to my phone and comes with a wool drying rack. It has a similar water collection tray but also has a water outlet hose. My cloths don’t feel damp after a drying cycle and it is rated A+++ in the U.K. The dryer also uses the water from the drying process to clean the condenser. All in all I have no complaint with my heat pump dryer.
Hi Matt, we purchased a Bosch 800 series heat pump dryer (and washer) about three years ago due to a lack of existing venting in our home and would never go back to a traditional dryer. Another reason for switching is that you don’t have any duct work so no fire risk with lint build-up!
Just to add my 2ct to this: Heat Pump dryers and "regular" ones venting to the outside are NOT the only ones out there. There is at least a third option which operates a heat exchanger for the water condensation but no HP, using the air in the room in a "closed loop" to back-cool the heat exchanger. We have opperated this kind of dryer for many years and only recently upgraded to a HP system. The improvement in this case is not that significant, but it is there. 😊
That's a condensing dryer, had a cheap one for nearly 14 years and a 2 hour dry costs me a little over £1.00. edit: was actually doing some laundry watching this so checked how much my dryer used. 100min, 2.73kw for a total of 73p.
The observation about "problem #1" and changing expectations of what "dry" feels like is a huge point. It should almost be printed on a big sticky note on the machine when you buy it.
Once again a situation where things seem to be very different between the US and Europe. The idea that it's revolutionary to tip out a bucket of water does seem very odd.
Condenser dryers (non heat pump) are energy hogs..
Condensing dryer heats the room where is located really intensively, we had one and it was clear the it pulled 2,3kW from grid and that all was out as heat. HP unit is way less noticeable when it heats the same room with 650 watt power draw.
We've had one, on this side of the pond, for 9 years. Its typical power usage is around 300w. Our old condenser dryer was around 1.3 kw. The previous vented was 2 kw.+ Everything comes out dry well inside the time stated on the start screen ( around half.) It's a max load of 8 kg. Leaving the clothes in the dryer after the cycle allows the dryer to tumble the clothes every minute or two to prevent creasing. This avoids you having to shake them afterwards to get that dry feel. It's built in! We're on around 30 pence per kw and around £450 for a decent hp dryer. £800 for a Meile. We wouldn't bother with any other type of dryer now.
I'm looking forward to replace my el cheapo candy condenser with a heat pump dryer. One concern I have is the dryer will be in a cold unheated utility at the corner of the house, do you find any variation based on lower ambient temperature ?
I really can't give an opinion without knowing a bit more. The average temperature in the room for one. Ours works well in 10 to 15 degrees C. Near the back door, with dog in and out. Probably not for somewhere like the shed or garage at 3 deg C but I've never tried so it's just speculation. However, people use heat pumps to provide household heating in sub zero conditions without issue. Maybe some further tech based research?
Well I call 100% BS to your numbers. Repairman here on YT put Heat pump dryers on an actual power meter and they used ~2kWh. Still ~50% more efficient than a normal dryer. But your numbers are WAAAAAAYYYY off unless you have a useless micro.
Typical figure from smart meter. Same as currently being drawn by house parasitic load , around 120 w and washing machine (not heating water). .
Thank you for the balanced review and covering the tech so clearly. Have always had great experiences with Miele whenever by family have bought from them. Presumably as electricity prices are likely to climb over the longer term, the annual payoff may well improve over time.
I have this dryer and am very happy with it. In my area it's about twice the price of regular dryers and this would contribute to the slow takeup. but we wanted the efficiency, water capture and the lack of venting. we toyed with the odorising feature but ended up not continuing with it when the supplied addin was spent. As to the higher moisture at the end of the load, We find it useful when we dry shirts that the slight moistness helps the garment stay relaxed when transferred to a hanger. thus minimising wrinkles out of the dryer.
Our old condensing dryer ran at 1.4kW and took 3 hours to dry a relatively small load. At our off-peak rate (0.09p/kWh) that works out 37.8p/load. But recently we've been hanging washing on an airer and using a Dehumidifier in the room, it can dry a load of washing overnight for 5.76p. Outside of Winter we do tend to use the fully renewable solar and wind option of line drying our washing.
Dehumidifier works great for us
Hanging clothes over a dehumidifier is a very efficient way to dry them, especially in a warm climate. I did that for 30 years living in an apartment.
Condensing dryers were the norm here in Norway when I worked in electrical goods retail 15 years ago. I started in 2007 and left at the end of 2010, and during that time we only had one vented model in the store (not one at a time, I only ever saw that one model, and I think we only sold one in the 3+ years I was there). It made no sense for the Norwegian consumers to dump all that heat outside; the energy spent by your dryer would just result in less heating needed for eight months out of the year. In warmer climates, this would mean adding more load on your cooling system, so I can definitely see the reason for vented ones being popular in the desert states 😄
A heat pump dryer is effectively a dehumidifier with the dry air ducted to the drum.
@@MalinDixon Basically, but look at the power rating of a good heat pump tumble dryer. The ones I've checked are 1kW or more. A good dehumidifier takes 250W to 400W. How fast will they dry? My experience is the dehumidifier is a bit faster, and keeping the clothes in a hanging position they end up less creased. A good quality quiet reliable dehumidifier, like a Mitsubishi, is cheaper than a heat pump tumble dryer. Of course, you need a suitable area to hang the clothes, but if you have one a dehumidifier is a good choice.
I own this dryer for 3 years now. It’s critical to keep the path clean - clean the lint filter (both of them) after every load and the foam filter as the dryer tells you. We absolutely LOVE this dryer. It runs on a normal 110v plug. The size may not be great for a large family, but then again maybe you don’t need to wash clothes as much as you think you need….
Lol, get this dryer but make sure you don't wash your cloths as often as you used to. Sounds like heating your house with a heat pump, works great but also make sure you have blankets and space heaters
@@ColCurtis Not saying that - I'm just remarking that many Americans (myself included) were raised to wash their clothes every time we take them off when in reality they can typically be worn far more than that before they need washing. I don't think questioning the resources we use equates to living in less than ideal conditions, it means we are living smarter. Do you really need to wash a pair of jeans that you wore around the house and to the mall one day? Probably not, but I did for years. That's all I'm saying
European and American family should have a average size and so it should be enough aswell for Americans
@@ystebadvonschlegel3295 speak for yourself. i was raised to not do that and have met a good amount of people that are the same. I wear jeans for days. Yea under clothes get one use. But even shirts get used more than once. where i live, electricity isn't cheap and all we have is electric sall my life. Now that we have solar and it doesnt matter, but once a week is the most i ever wash clothes. sometimes every two weeks.
@@ColCurtis Not if you have a properly insulated house. Or at least not one or two days a year. Doesn't seem like a bad deal for all the energy you save. And you could also oversize your heat pump. And if even that doesn't solve your paranoia you can get a ground loop. That way the source is always 12C, irrespective of the time of year.
I have the GE all-in-one washer/dryer combo you mentioned and it has been the most satisfying purchase I've made in some time. It's $2500 at home depot now, but we got ours for $2000 on sale. Not having to move your clothes is a game changer and it comes with all the advantages of the other models and more (2 hour total wash/dry time, 4.8 cu. ft. capacity, standard outlet and no vent required, 136 kwh/year, smart home connectivity). It even stores and automatically dispenses detergent. I can't imagine going back to a traditional split washer/dryer setup.
I’ve been eyeing these units for a while, and recently got lucky and found a barely-used returned unit from Lowe’s for only $800 - an absolute steal for the set, low enough that even if I had to fix something with the unit (unlikely, given it was bought and returned within a month), I’d still be out ahead. Given Miele’s reputation for absurdly good build quality, that was a risk I felt comfortable with. In that vein, the staff at the appliance store were gobsmacked when they lifted the units into our car, as they are FAR heavier than you’d expect for their size: there’s a lot packed into these units, and it’s almost entirely metal or dense plastic. You’re right that they’re smaller than typical US wash/dry units - but, in our case, that’s a huge advantage. We’re renters, and don’t have a dedicated laundry room. But, at only two feet wide and stacked on top of each other, they fit nicely in our kitchen next to the fridge (Which we also own - LA Renters can tell you all about how weird landlords are about fridges here), and can run on the same outlet without issue given how little power they draw. Compared to what we were using before (a cheap Panda-brand portable washer we got of Amazon for $300) and air drying, this is VASTLY faster and easier to deal with. Compared to going to a laundromat or using the coin-op units in our building (at $5 a load), it’s an even bigger deal, and pays off that much faster. Honestly, that’s the market Miele is going for here, I think: If you live in a house in the burbs, no doubt you have big units already, or at least have the hookups and vents that you can get a larger, cheaper setup. But, if you live in a smaller city apartment where space, power, and limits on things like _drilling a hole in the wall for a dryer vent_ because landlords…these are perfect, and the tech just makes them that much cooler.
Problem isn't heat, it is the recycled air carrying lint and dust across the heat ex-changer. The heat exchanger gets dusty, then moldy, and then clogged. Eventually you have to disassemble it to clean the aluminum. Also, the sump pump that carries that water up to where it can be emptied get clogged as well.
@@noleftturnunstoned With the models we have here you just open a small door on the front and get access to the heat exchanger. Never had glogs in the water line.
We picked up a Stirling HP dryer from Aldi a couple of months ago to replace an old Simpson vented unit. As a home efficiency nut I knew it was a no brainer but was also a size upgrade (8kg vs 5kg). I'm loving the energy savings, but I'm also loving not having the laundry end up hot an humid (dryers not typically vented in Australia) but that the dryer shortens the cycle length once dry. No more arbitrarily cooking clothes to a crisp for 2 hours at a time!
Condensing dryers have been a thing in Europe for years. If fact it's the standard, it's way less common to find traditional venting dryers. We've used these dryers here in Europe in both Netherlands and Germany for many years. Where they really shine is that you can put one anywhere you have an electrical outlet (which you mentioned). This means you can put one anywhere in the interior of your home, in a place that doesn't have the ability to use a dryer exhaust hose. (Setting aside the fact that most Europeans don't have clothes dryers, the clothes drying rack is king here!). My favorite feature is that you can use an "eco" setting which runs the cycle longer with lower heat, so your clothes don't come out baked like you get so often in US dryers, and the efficient motor means that your cycle takes less energy and your clothes come out with less wear. Note that the relatively small capacity of the dryer (compared to US monstrosities) is not really an issue because typically the washing machine is matched in size so you wash smaller loads. And the cycles typically take longer than Americans are used to. Generally with condensing dryers, you need to periodically clean the condenser, unless you get a model that has an auto-cleaning condenser, like our LG dryer has. In that way unless you hook it up to a drain for the condensate, the only maintenance is to dump out the condensate from the collection bin every couple of loads (and keep that lint trap clean!).
It's not a condensing dryer, it's a heat pump
@@dansands977 .......which condenses the steam into water instead of venting it out. So it's a condensing dryer. The fact that's it's heating through a heatpump instead of a heating element doesn't change that.
So far my favorite piece of tech in our new house is the fact that all warm water plumbing has a return line to the warm water buffer tank. By turning on a circulation pump before using hot water you get hot water instantly and avoid wasting many liters of water.
Then you waste energy instead. The plumbing is heating your house.
Put a timer on the recirculation and you can have hot water all the time, in the normal hours of operation
@@kodez79 the pump is triggered through the home automation. When the light in the bathroom is switched on the pump starts. So it only runs when it's needed. I believe the overall result is positive.
@@BramMertens NIce
@@kodez79100%! People just want hot water fast 😂. Conservation is a BS marketing gimmick to get people an excuse imo. Also - I personally believe water “waste” is relative to your own area. Clean water going down the drain is not necessarily ‘wasted’ if there is no issue with water availability and treatment.
we recently finished a major renovation of a 1950, 2-story bungalow and turned it into an all-electric, net-zero house using a ground-source heat-pump. Not only is THE favorite piece of tech, it's magical!!!! I know the heat-pump concept, but to really see it's effectiveness is quite amazing. To get to net-zero was not easy (especially when we did it thru thew pandemic - high costs, hard to find labor), but now we just love it. Our power bills are $1.40 each and every month.
Until the electricity goes out…
@@justkiddin1980 Most net-zero homes have solar systems designed to offset 100% of their electrical use. It's easy enough to have such a system that auto-fails over to using battery power during outages. For example, our batteries are sufficient to run our house for 3 days, which is 53 hours longer than a typical long outage around here.
@@lianeallen6461 ‘net-zero’ never ever truly is net-zero it’s a marketing term and a bad one at that.. I think it’s a good thing homes are integrating with technology only problem is repairabillity..If one of your battery packs goes bad do you have the knowledge or parts to repair it or does it get thrown out and replaced?? Driving old cars and using old appliances that still can get fixed is more ‘net zero’ than all the modern alternatives..There needs to be a push for less waste and better maintainability of stuff we have.
Got an LG Heat Pump dryer, love it. Put new bearings in at 6yrs after Heavy use - at least 1 load a day, avg 2x daily. Well built machine and I love the smart features. Only time we have an issue is mixing dense items with light ones. There is a favourite cycle button so you only have to press power, favourite then start. Also has a shelf you can put inside to dry shoes or delicates on. No lint or damp air blowing around the laundry coating everything. Also almost no fire risk - No heating element anywhere. Never going back to old school dryers.
My wife and I had seven kids and were used to our large Maytag Neptune set that served us well for almost 20 years. The Maytag gave out and I didn't want to rebuild it again, Looking at new machines, they were all so large in depth that we would have been blocking our laundry room entry by several inches. I looked at these efficient "european" models and we selected the Electrolux set that fit our space requirements back in August of 2020. With all seven kids moved out on there own, it has really been ideal for us. We noticed a large energy savings as well as the moisture issue you mentioned as one of the two draw-backs. We also figured out that hanging the clothes up or shaking them out did have a very quick positive effect. I am a maintenance person and know that for it to remain efficient, regular cleaning of the removable condenser coil on ours is mandatory. Thanks for the video and education of how the system works.
I chose the Meile heat pump dryer to put in our bedroom closet. Only needed a 110v connection and no vent. It's been great. It's very easy to keep up with laundry when it's in the closet. Read about the not quite dry feel prior to buying. We've had for 4 years. Love it
good bot
The Technology Connections channel 2-parter on home electrification covered these a while back also. That led me to look into available models. I found the ones that use a 110 outlet were limited to the 4.x sq ft size. The larger ones needed 240V, mostly because they are hybrids that also have the traditional resistive heaters to augment the heat pump if you need it. Rather like the Rheem heat pump water heaters, and like those you can set it to heat pump only mode and either not use the resistive elements at all or just reserve them for special cases.
Very cool review Matt! We purchased a Miele heatpump dryer just a couple of months ago, after our previous one (an AEG) broke down. I continue to amaze myself at how much better the Miele is designed compared to the AEG. Oh, and living in Europe, I never noticed the size of the drum. 🙂
I'm trying to convince my landlord to switch out my heat-pump Bosch combo for something more reliable. All the symbols I have to translate and fixed dial presets I have to override leading to unexplained error shutdowns is really irritating.
Great topic Matt. We are currently living in Europe as a family of four and went through shock phase of how small the washer and dryers are. However, whenever we move back to states we will look for a heatpump dryer. We love them, despite their small size. They double as a great source of heat in the winter for our house. I also reuse the water into our gray water tank.
I wonder why they are soooooo expensive in the US, when even, uncommon larger models, like a Haier I-PRO Serie 7 HD100-A2979 or Haier HD90-A3959 I-PRO Serie 5 are just ~500-600€ with 19% Tax here. When the market for driers is objectively a lot bigger in the US (in Europe a lot of people, me included, don't even have a dryer).
@@DooMMasteRI think they have both bigger ones and more premium models, so it is not s direct apples to apples comparison. And they might have some taxes for the ones made in Europe.
There is always the optipn yo switch to the European-style of drying (hanging or so the clothes). I am honestly curious why that is not an option.
@@FlorinArjocu Line-dried clothes have a lot of lint that is otherwise removed in a tumble dryer.
@@alsavage1 I think it is exactly the dryer making more lint.
Bought a new Miele washer in 1990, used it for 5 years, then it sat for 10 years (it didn't work in the US @ 60hz). In 2004 I used it in Germany for 2.5 years and after that my parents used it until 2018 and now it is with a nephew, still running. 🙂 Miele is in a class of its own. I have never understood the US obsession with living room sized washers/dryers. When I arrived in the US in 1995 most washers were using tech from the 1950s and could destroy any garment in half a dozen washes.... We have always used US spec Miele washer and dryer and never been let down.
I had the one-piece LG unit in a condo and it worked great. The wash/dry cycle is longer than a typical washer and dryer, so patience is required. One additional benefit you didn't mention was that because the drying doesn't involve as much 'blowing' of air to dry the clothes, your clothes last longer, which is important to me. But as you said, you do sometimes have to hang towels for a few minutes to completely dry them out.
I have the same one. I love I don't have to remember to advance the laundry. I have some rubber backed bath rugs that still look brand new even after probably 50+ times. It's also really nice to start a load before bed and have it done by when you wake up. The LG is the same size as a normal washer/dryer so we don't lose anything to size.
As we moved into our current home 5 years ago, we got a combo LG washter/dryer. It is a heatpump dryer, and uses much less water and electricity than our old washer dryers. We love it. We are a retired couple and don't need a huge tub like when we had kids at home. It cost a little more, but is great. Our HOA doesn't allow drying lines outside, but we are tyring to get that changed. My parent in the '60s had a combon washer dryer from Westinghouse it had a slanted front and worked well for us. The great thing was not having to move wet clothes between washer and dryer. In the day that was a big deal. We find that really nice for us too, even a retirees. The convenience is worth it. We try to be frugal with our enrgy use so this washer/dryer has come a long way in helping us in that. Our water cost is high but electricity is low (served by a TVA supplied utility), but we are still working to get solar and batteries installed for some additional energy independance.
Have had the same dryer for over a year and have basically the same experience. It’s more about changing your behavior than shortcomings of the machine. I have a family of four with a lot of laundry and I discovered that I’m more likely to do small loads when there’s enough to fill the smaller washer instead of waiting for enough laundry to justify running my huge old monster. Also my old electric dryer used 6,600 watts while running instead of 900 watts max with the Miele. Living in a very cold region I appreciate the heat savings too!
My wife and I have a Gorenje heat pump dryer that we’ve been using for a few years now. It took us a couple of cycles to get used to the fact that the clothes still feel damp when you first take them out, but outside of that, we’ve not had any regrets buying ours. I don’t know the size of the drum, but we intentionally got one that has a higher weight rating than our washer (the labels show a weight capacity, not a volume capacity), but it looks to be a pretty good size (it can handle a 9KG load)
We've had the Miele set for about 2 years now. The concern about the size of load is overblown. you can still shove so much laundry into the washer/dryer, the loads are almost as big as what i used to put into my huge Samsung's. Also, the cycles seem to go faster, and so easy if you get the twinDos system too. family of 5, and the W/D pair has absolutely no issues keeping up with all the laundry in the house. And yes, I love the fact it's not tossing my conditioned air outside every time we do a load.
Also have these units, and for those wondering: for a typical laundry hamper like what you see Matt use in the video, the washer and dryer will easily accommodate a full hamper of clothes. On average, our dry cycles take about an hour and a half at the longest - the machine has some clever tech to help it detect when things are truly dry by measuring conductivity - and at that speed you can easily power through several loads in a day.
Great reveiw and insight. Two comments: 1. I'd be curious how the operational cost compares to gas dryer. I've run into the same challenge comparing forced air gas heater to a heat pump (there are ways to calculate but I'm not sure they're accurate). 2. Regarding up front cost - don't forget to look at local, county, state and fed rebates and tax credits.
It really depends on how much gas costs in your area. In some areas it's very cheap whereas in others it ends up more expensive than heat pumps. Gas is going to just keep getting more expensive over time, whereas you can offset increasing electricity prices by installing solar panels.
Our old vented dryer is dead for years now, and the duct has been blocked off to prevent critters from getting through. We recently put in a ducted Gree Flexx heat pump in the house, and the tech definitely works. Would definitely consider a heat pump dryer when it comes time to change it out.
Thank you for the video. I realised that it's been a while since last time I watched one of your videos by looking at the weight loss of yours. Cheers handsome friend and a happy new year.
Another great in-depth discussion, Matt. I really enjoy your approach. Back in 2021 I was already committed to roof-mounted solar power supplemented by a Tesla PowerWall, and had purchased a Kia Niro EV. So when our vented clothes dryer needed replacement it was not a great stretch of imagination to purchase an LG heat pump dryer and dispense with the wasteful vent. This particular model takes a 9 kg load, which is plenty big enough for us as a retired couple. It cost us the equivalent of US$1500, and has a 10 year warranty on the inverter and motor. So, as you say, it will not be long before the savings reach the breakeven point, after which it is money in the bank. But even though I was already a convert, I have learned something else new from your presentation. I had chosen the option of the condensed water going directly to our drain, since our LG washing machine already had a standpipe for this. But, living in Wellington New Zealand, we have recently had warnings of a hot, dry summer because of El Niño, with the likelihood of water restrictions and even waterless days! So I will bear in mind your sensible suggestion about keeping the condensed water for watering plants. When restrictions kick in, It should be a simple matter of switching over to harvesting from the water reservoir built into the machine. This will be a useful supplement to our pair of rainwater tanks and other water storage we had set aside against the possibilities of a major earthquake here. Thanks for your good work, and keep these videos coming.
You should filter the water if you do this. If you look at dryer water you will see fine lint floating in it. There will also be a small amount of detergent and softener if you use it. Not good for plants.
We remodeled and opted to go with a BOSCH heat-pump dryer as part of the stacked W/D. Took a bit to get used to it but would never go back to the old ones. They're both quieter & cheaper to run. We put an induction stove in the kitchen and are very happy with it, too.
Broo you got money 😆
Oooo... I just bought my first portable induction "hot plate" to try the technology out. I'm already sold. It's fantastic! Would love to eventually replace my gas range with induction. We'll see.
Thanks for this video, I bought this Miele washer and dryer over a year ago, and I have no complaints it works great. From my experience, if you remove your clothes after the dryer finishes, the clothes will finish drying through evaporation in about 15 min. I don't have to drain anything on my dryer, mine has a drainage hose (a newer top end model). The reason it's so small it's because they expect you to run more loads each being specific to the clothes your washing. Yes, this is annoying but we got use to it. Also, I can't get my online network and app feature to work.
I bought a heat pump drier 6 years ago. Never a seconds problems and it has paid for itself many times over. Had a 5 year warranty and I worked out it would pay for itself in comparison to a condensing model in 5 years. But the price of power has tripled so it’s doing great work!
I’ve been using the GE Ultra fast since its release in June, do recommend. I got it on sale for effectively less than $2,000. My only problem is the automatic dispenser isn’t calibrated for Tide club/box concentrate so I needed to find a workaround. Just so everyone knows when the combo unit is drying I see the power useage fluctuate between 300w, 500w and 1kw at the wall. I’ve never seen the unit use more than 1.1kw at any time and it is using 500w for a good amount of the dry time. Maybe 1.2kWh for a complete wash/dry load on average.
i have experienced the small combo units that have a heat pump. It worked pretty good, but it was kinda musty or not so fresh smelling after. I really wish they'd just have a vent that for a few min at the end of the cycle we'd blow the air outside to get rid of the last of the moisture and get some fresh air through it. Great video as always.
I also some experiences with small combo units, my guess is that they need good maintenance, as the detergent and softener residues affect the freshness of the clothes after drying. Frequent rinse cycles, careful dosing of detergent and softener.
I'm in Europe and have a large household - We use a Miele Washing Machine and a Miele Dryer. Yes, they were expensive to begin with but we have noticed the cheaper running costs. The previous dryer without the heat pump merely heated up the room (and the clothes) but the heat pump dryer now dries the clothes. The washing machine works very well with the built in washing powder (auto dos) facility. We do a maintenance wash in the washing machine and have purchased new filters for the large air filter in the dryer. The WiFi addition tells us when the dryer/washing machine are ready.
I’ve had my heat pump dryer for 3 months. I absolutely love it. I live in an apartment so having no moisture escape into the apartment is perfect. I bought my dryer from Aldi.
I live in Norway so air drying isn't great a lot of the time. I've had a Siemens heat pump dryer for a decade and it works great. It can also steam clothes and such. One very handy thing with it is that it has a water pump to remove the condensate straight down the same drain pipe as the washer.
Same here (UK). It recently died and was replaced by a BOSCH model. So complicated to operate. I want my old Siemens back.
I live in an area with high air pollution, so drying your clothes out in it would probably be a poor choice.
It's funny how something the EU has as defacto state of the art technology since about a decade now, and had that technology for well over 20 years, is so amazing for the US. All big manufacturers are on their way to offer stand alone, full size combos and full size dryers with that technology in the comming year. Enjoy it!
If they didnt import nearly all of their fossil fuels and had a surplus as we do in the states, they would not be so heavily dependent on all electric everything.
I have the GE Profile that is wash and dry with the heat pump. As you pointed out it took some re-adjusting of expectations but we love it.
I've had a Bosch 300 ventless dryer for 3 years now. It's almost perfect and has the same "shake test" as you described. It has one flaw, though, the lint trap doesn't seal well and I have to clean out the condenser a few times a month. Annoying, yes, but it's efficiency makes up for it.
With top-loading washers & dryers from the 1990s still being so reliable and affordable to maintain the space efficiency, energy efficiency, and versatility of heat pumps might be the sole reason to invest in a combo unit 😁
Front load washing machines are awesome, not too sure on a combo unit - a lot to go wrong. Have a front load washer and a heat pump dryer stacked and I like that if one machine is out of action, at least you have some functionality.
It would be interesting to see some kind of home setup where you could have appliances that hook up to an existing cold / hot loop from a bigger external heat pump. Would probably be way more complicated, but might work really well for some bigger setups like hotels or what have you...
I've had this idea for a long time, a hous that has a thermal battery Captures the heat in the day and use it whenever u need thermal energy
This kind of exists for commercial environments, although rarely used for the heat recovery benefits unfortunately. They can have a chilled water or glycol circuit for the A/C and then things like refrigerators and ice makers and server racks can also connect into the system to all release their heat into the loop. The heat is then typically released outside via the chiller, BUT there are systems where that heat can be recovered and used for heating needs. It would be cool if it was more common and if that technology existed in the home too.
I have seen a video about a retired heat pump installed who built a system like this. Would love to see that in mass production. But indeed it requires a lot of extra plumbing. But I believe it would be worth it.
I have this Miele washer and heat pump dryer pair in New Zealand, and installed them for the reasons you mention: they needed to be installed in a stack formation in a small internal closet in the bathroom. Given it’s really difficult to get them in there, I bought Miele, as my previous Miele washer lasted over 20 years. Metric countries usually measure laundry loads in kilograms, and mine is a 7kg machine. Your ”small” machine may actually be a larger model ;) I, too, have also been frustrated by the damp feeling when the cycle finishes, so I’m going to try following your advice.
Thanks for this info, as I was sitting on the fence as to what type of dryer to buy. Now, it,s going to be a Heated Dryer,
I've had the GE for 3 months now. I was skeptical (but curious) at first, but have really been impressed. My biggest challenge has been the time it takes to do a cycle, about three hours and you can't wash one load while the previous one is drying. I've had to adjust to laundry day taking about twice as long now.
That is my biggest challenge with converting - I have thought that it might require two units to replace my standard washer/dryer set now since there is no opportunity to run a load while another is drying
I got the GE combo also. It has been great for my family. I have a family of 7 and originally thought we would need 2 units also, but the one unit has been enough. We went from a high capacity LG washer and dryer to the combo unit. On average, our laundry is washed and dried in less time than it took to wash one load before. This unit has made laundry less work; we don't I have to manage switching loads anymore. This has changed our laundry habits. Instead of waiting for a full load to build up, we now run laundry in smaller batches. Also because the laundry come out dry, we can throw it in overnight and it is ready to go in the morning. I think the biggest down side is that drying something like a large load of towels can take significantly longer that the time advertised on the display. They come out dry but it can really mess with a schedule.
Great video! I had an experience with full heat pump dryer a few years back. And you are right that it's good for about 2 persons. It did cost more than the standard dryer but also consumed a lot less electricity. My household has 5 people and the full heat pump dryer ran 6 days a week and died after 5 years of use. I switch over to a standard dryer, and for my use case, I'm good with it. The other downsides for the full heat pump dryer that I had was the extra lint cleaning so that it wouldn't clog the radiator fins and thus reduce performance. Great video, Awesome channel !!
I just got the smaller LG model you mentioned and everything you said is spot on, up to and including integrating the "smart" functions with my home automation software to blink a light when the drying's done. I was in the market for a new dryer anyway (I was sick of fixing my old one over and over) and electricity is one of my biggest costs, and my dryer was one of the biggest users. There are only two of us living in my house so the smaller LG was sufficient. It was more like $1300 for the base cost and closer to $1500 with taxes and delivery charges, though.
We have the LG model and after a year, our renters reported towels taking 3 or 4 hours to get "dry". LG service warranty eventually replaced the entire heat pump components. Then a year later, 2 towels took multiple hours again. Now we're going back to electric resistance dryers. How's your LG dryer doing?
Purchased a GE Combo washer/dryer that uses a heat pump this year. Our previous washer had broken. We kept our electric dryer, but now seldom use it. The combo makes the heat pump more worth it as you can throw clothes in before going to bed or when leaving and come back and they are done, washed and dried. I imagine as these heat units get better and less expensive, they will replace traditional driers because of the energy savings. Currently, the up front cost is too much for most people, but the long term savings is worth it.
My parents have been using a similar Miele unit in their apartment for couple years, the fact it's ventless is an absolute game changer for people living in apartments. It is annoyingly complicated to use though, if you need to change some settings in the menu it's a multi step process. Overall very happy with the unit and the power savings alone is worth it (they do their washing almost every day)
Not trying to be offensive but this is a very dumb idea. In the long run you will not save one penny because when the heat pump breaks down you will have to pay more than what the system is worth to fix it. You will not have the money to fix it and 99% of all techs won't be able to fix it. It's a very very bad idea. And all the carbon you think you kept out of the environment, is a lie because the amount of carbon going back in to fix or replace the system is 100s of times worse than the less efficient systems. Very bad idea.
@@WallaceRoseVincent Seems an odd claim. They've been in use in Europe for decades - ours is 19 years old, never had any issues yet. If it breaks it can get fixed. Even if it was unfixable, the money saved operationally absolutely eclipses the replacement cost. Add in that we keep our humidity levels lower, our clothes last longer, we have a lower fire risk and it's a pretty one-sided decision for me.
@@asharak84 Recent refrigeration units I've serviced in the US are not longer repairable; evaporator leaks render the unit salvage only. Try buying a wine cellar today that will last more than two years! Small refrigerators are the same: 2-5 year lifespan. Even the commercial stuff I've serviced have service life of under 10 years now. Today's appliances are not built to the standards of yesteryear.
I'm from Ukraine and size seems decent for me. It's slightly bigger than my current washing machine and I had no issues with it. I'll give this tech a few years to evolve and probably consider to use one in my net zero home when I'll build it =) Thanks Matt, very informative video.
Its already old tech. Its just these US people who are baffled with its "new" ness.😅
there are adults buying these dryers today who have literally grown up with the technology, and have never used a different type of dryer.
@@tommihommi1 yeah, but they also use same chems as fridges(freon in most cases), it's toxic if leak, not so good to environment and expencive to refill. Iv'e seen heatpumps that works on CO2, but they not so effective. At least for now.
I have a Miele W1 heat pump dryer. I usually use the sensing "Extra Dry" option. Must try it on the "normal" setting and see how it is after the washing has been "aired" a little at the end. As for size - it's plenty large enough! One nice feature of heat pump dryers is that you can actually use them for many clothes that you wouldn't consider putting in a "conventional" dryer, as it doesn't use the stupid high temperatures a "once through" conventional dryer would use. Much lower chance of fires as well! (there was a spate of house fires caused by tumble driers in the news a few years ago over here in the UK).
I almost purchased a combo washer dryer in one unit with heat pump drying. What stopped me is the much longer wash/dry times. You not only have to factor the moderate increased drying time, but also the fact that you can't dry one load while the next is washing. You've now doubled or trippled the time it takes to do laundry. This does assume that your previous washer and dryer capacity was comparable. If with the new unit you are able to wash more in one load then the cycle time difference decreases a bit. All still very cool technology.
My parents bought a Bosch HP dryer 15 years ago. This is not a new technology, but it's great to hear that people in the US are catching up :)
It's not that they are catching up. It's because for the past 20 years we are paying a premium for energy over here. Gas fired dryers are the norm in the USA.
@@FerdinanddeRoo It depends on your perspective. One might say europeans have been paying premium for energy, others would say folks in the US have had a discount on it. At the end of the day, it is still way too cheap to produce GHGs and pollute the environment, and everyone is going to pay premium for it, no matter if they want to or not.
@@MrMarapro You will find not everyone agrees on the Eco issues with GHG. Depends on where you live. Hydro-electric power, natural gas, etc. are all plentiful in the usa. Electricty is expensive in Europe due to a lack of abundant domestic supply and poor legislators coupled with policy makers who have an agenda that artificially increases the cost of electricity in order to push an agenda. Heat pumps are catching on here due to simple math. It makes logical sense to save money and the cost of the machines has come down coupled with not needing a vent has made these appliances attractive.
@@notmethanks816 Hard for me to say for other EU countries, but in Finland the electricity cost is quite reasonable, around 10 c/kWh. And it's not a matter of opinion if GHG emissions and climate change are going to be costly in both ecological and economical senses. It's an uncomfortable, hard, science based fact. Tobacco industry questioned and spun the scientific proof that smoking is harmful to your health for decades while the scientist had hard evidence for it. It's so sad that the same thing happens again concerning the GHG emissions, orchestrated by the fossil fuel industry. They have a lot to lose, and they are happy to use unethical methods to defend their bottom lines at a cost so unimaginable to the whole planet.
Unexpectedly interesting, thanks for posting
We Have a New LG Front load washer and dryer and I love them. All the different cycles on the app and the fact that I can run an onboard Smart Diagnostic Test on them will make it easy to find the problem and fix it and the notification that they are fine through the App
I'm actually mostly snickering that you are finally discovering heatpump dryers in the US - we have had them for over 20 years in Europe. Our Bosch and older Siemens are a bit bigger than the Miele but I agree on the drums being slightly smaller than the old-school. Price in Europe is from $500 and up for the heatpump models.
Same here in eastern Europe: currently great Turkish heat pump driers are about 350€ and out Siemens gas been working for 12 years almost of daily use. Allowing to get dry clothes in an apartment.
NZ also has most brands providing dryers with heat pump models as well as condenser and vented dryers. Not 20 years old. But they have been around for at least the better part of a decade
The United States is backwards, and we waste energy everywhere. So I don't think it's funny. It's pathetic.
Part of the issue is economics. When energy is abundant and cheap, paying more for technology to save it doesn’t make economic sense. The abundance of cheap energy has a lot of origins, but one of them is that our oil fields give off natural gas as a waste byproduct - we are literally flaring it. The conflict in Ukraine has pushed the U.S. to invest in capturing the NG and liquifying it to sell to European markets. But it wasn’t economic to capture it before - the pipelines and infrastructure were more expensive than the natural gas was worth in the market. A lot of waste (or “deadweight cost”) in our economy is due to distance, transport, regulatory frameworks. It’s not that Americans just crossed their arms and like a spoiled child said, “No!” The Europeans have had incentives to be more efficient for much longer due to the fact that energy must be brought in from outside of Europe. This isn’t to say that inefficient use of energy in the U.S. is a good thing. We now have a political climate that is pushing efficiency for the sake of ecology and environment. I would argue that Americans’ embrace of efficiency in energy is laudable, because it is occurring when it doesn’t really have to occur. There are few economic forces making it happen, and a lot of government policy and subsidy.
What about maintenance costs and maintenance the home owner needs to do?
I thought you'd finish your laundry with your dry sense of humor.
Heyooooo! 😂
We have a heat pump dryer / washer combo, we love it! Amazing to put clothes in and come back two hours later with them completely done.
I have had a large samsung heat pump dryer for 8 years and it has been great and very low cost. Clothes don't get to hot so they last longer and transfers don't get damaged. It auto detects when to stop this seems to work well for most combinations of clothes but can stop to soon with certain fabrics even at max dry leve (Maybe there is another setting option for that specific fabric)l. You do need to clean the lint filters often oftherwise the lint gets drawn past the filters and into the heat exchanger which ruins effeciancy. Ive had to do 1 major clean of the heat exchanger since owning. It creates zero condensation inside which is why i puchased it. In the 8 year period it would have done over 1000 loads I had a house hold of 6 adults and weather is not always the best in New Zealand. Love this channel and the info.
They are definitely worth it, I've had my for few weeks now, and I'm still amazed at how little electricity it needs, less than 1kWh per smaller load, I make 50x that amount in a day with solar. I don't know about prices in the US but here in Europe it's relatively affordable and I'm even tempted to use it even in summer since i wouldn't have to iron clothes that much afterwards and it just uses so little electricity.
Since you got solar not using it in summer is kind of strange. We got a heat pump dryer and my father was so against it until I bought it. Now we only use the dryer being it summer or winter.
We also got solar and I work from home so I only use solar for washing and drying for 95% of the cases.
@alexandruilea915 Yeah, up until now we only had a normal electric dryer (without codensator) so we would only use it in the winter when all our home radators for clothes were full and in the summer we used drying racks outside. That's one question I have, why don't Americans use drying racks and rather use gas dryers, at least in California where it's always sunny you have free and really fast drying outside.
@@antonio_fosnjar insects and smell from neighbors I guess. I live in Romania in a small village and burning crap is something my neighbors do pretty often.
@alexandruilea915 yeah I don't think anybody is burning anything in california suburbs 🤣, but smell might be the reasons because of car pollution, and gas is cheaper than in Europe
Thank you for being a guinea pig for some of this new tech for homes. It can’t be cheap; I appreciate you making the investment and reporting back to us.
I have had both a GE and and a Frigidaire/Electrolux dehumidifier. I have never had one last over 5 years. Compare that to the last gas drier I disposed of that was 30 years old. I would worry that a heat pump drier would be similar. Dissimilar metals, corrosion, and eventual failure. Once the dehumidifier gets old you can see orange stain in the water. Of course old refrigerators last for 30 years, but not so with newer ones.. I have a high efficiency setting on my gas drier. It leaves the clothes damp. I always make sure we are not out of clothes, because I would never want to put them on right out of the drier. I have never had a problem wearing them the next day. Thanks for the great video.
AEG/ Electrolux now also have heatpump washed/dryer combos. I got the AEG one this year and am really happy so far.
I have an electric dryer that is 30 years old. The only repair I had to do was replacing a $5 belt, and it was very easy and straightforward. My concern with the heat pump, and many new appliances, is that they're not designed to last as long as older appliances. I keep looking at newer dryers cuz I like the bells and whistles, but I keep seeing so many reviews about them dying within a couple of years that it makes me very hesitant.
Keep your old dryer. Even new vented dryers wont last that long😉
Excellent point. I'm in the market for all new appliances and every salesperson I talk to universally says "they don't make them like they used to." The only exception to this rule is when you make the jump to ultra-luxury stuff like Sub-Zero, but that's also at $15,000 USD fridge, with some models pushing the $20k mark. The fridge, washer, and dryer at my parents house are 20, if not 30 years old and still working like a charm, with nary an issue. They don't have all the bells and whistles, but you put your clothes in the washer and they come out clean, and you put your clothes in the dryer and they come out dry. Stuff in the fridge says cold. And these are/were all "no frills" models from 20-30 years ago.
@@blendtecbrah5761 To do a fair comparison you need to factor in the amount and cost of energy used by these old appliances, which is often significantly more than the new models. But then to be completely fair you should also factor in the impact producing these appliances has on our environment. It can get pretty complicated that way.
Miele surely is an expensive brand, yes - but even today they are famous for their unmatched reliability and long-term availability of spare parts and repair service. :)
@@WerHatDieKokosnuss Today Miele is also famous for pcb faults, software faults, leaking Autodos systems and the list continues. It’s sad but it’s the reality
I added a solar powered hybrid (AC/DC driven) mini split air conditioning to our home. It also is a heat pump. DC solar energy directly feeding the DC heat pump and brushless motor = very efficient (no AC to DC inverter loss). Our 2 central air units run much less often when it is 110° out, and they don't run at all once we get into the 90° range. Our existing rooftop PV system solar energy can be directed to charge our EV. Here in Phoenix it runs from sun up to sun down almost completely powered by the same energy source that is baking our desert home! At night it runs off AC with our banked solar kwh credits back from the utility.
Great video, and appreciated the brief summary of how heat pump tech works in a dryer. NB: Samsung makes an affordable heat pump dryer, though needs 220/240 v. We bought one a couple of years ago as part of a small stackable system and it works great. Your wife’s epiphany about the dampness issue exactly parallels ours! A few shakes and the feeling of dampness largely disappears.
I have a 2022 Samsung heat pump dryer, and I hate it. Not because of the heat pump (which is great), but because it always forms the dreaded "burrito" when drying bedsheets. Drying any bedsheet is pain, because I have to open it every 5-10 minutes to untangle it. It's so annoying, I often just 3/4ths dry the sheets and then put them on my bed anyway because they'll dry by bedtime.
Funny how you talk about it like being something new, in Sweden we have had heat pump dryers as the standard option for more than 10 years. Great it’s coming to the us as well! Keep up the good work
Been using a 30 year old Amana washer and dryer since i moved into a house that had them already. Honestly they work great, haven't broken down, and very simple internals that are readily replaceable with a bit of electronics knowledge and they even came with a schematic that you can reference. Sure it might be a tad less efficient and use more electricity, but if a display panel board or control board breaks on those newer ones, its easily another 100-200 bucks replacement. Go ahead, try getting a detailed schematic of how to fix those things... With the older models, I just feel they last longer since this has been kicking for 30 years now with no issues, even drive belt hasn't needed replacement either. Sure 240 volt outlets make for restricted placement of them, but you should really just design around these larger appliances when it comes to outlet placement.
Sounds like a Speed Queen.
@@titanispi1998 Amana was once built by Speed Queen, now they are built by Whirlpool.
@@titanispi1998 while speed queen earned its reputation, most 30 year old appliances were built repairable and serviceable... i am running an old Maytag that i repair myself without a vacume pump and some unobtainable refridgerant... i love the idea, but dont have the money to chase future pennies. I really would like to see how far into 15 years that unit gets...
You'd think Miele, being a European country, would be subject to right-to-repair laws or something. Sad that the most progressive part of the world hasn't caught up to what American companies would just do voluntarily as a matter of course 30 years ago.
@@stevethepocket reason why parts are tricky to find in Europe is because of “environmental purposes” since the governments in their infinite wisdom think that if everyone has the newest and latest and greatest, it’ll keep emissions low but as we all know, it takes a immense amount of energy and resources to smelt and process steel along with plastic. Most companies in the US many years ago used to provide parts voluntarily to gain trust from consumers along reducing pollution as well, not so much the case anymore since parts are NLA after a few years.
One thing that wasn’t mentioned: lint. Drying clothes creates lint. Lint creates clogs and air restrictions. This is a massive problem for closed loop dryers and a maintenance nightmare. Why did you not at least mention this as a potential issue for these units? I too am a fan of heat pump technology. Just this past week I helped a homeowner install a heat pump water heater. But we have to be serious about their limitations and maintenance issues, lest we set people up for expectations that will create remorse long run. I appreciate your mention of the clothes feeling damp. Great honest point! But please address the lint issue.
This is exactly my concern. I wonder how they hold up long term. Some of them have really good filters that capture most lint, so it’s not an issue, but some don’t have filters much better than a regular dryer. Where does all that lint go? (Because it has to go somewhere.) It goes and sticks to those wet refrigerant coils which have lots of tiny holes in them and then it clogs up. If lint buildup and cleaning is such a major issue with regular dryers, I cannot imagine how it would be when you are now directing that lint into tiny airways. It would be a nightmare to clean out those coils. I already see this with the fridge coils that already collect so much from a “clean” airstream.
The lint clogging up the heat exchange system is real and serious issue. I have been using a Whirlpool 7.4 ft3 HP dryer for a couple of years now and can see that some of the lint has gotten past two filter systems despite frequent cleaning and careful attention. Looking at other videos this will take many hours to tear apart and clean and not looking forward to it. However, I still think the benefits of HP dryer - particularly home air exchange and vent fire risks outweigh the drawbacks.
The LG Washtower advertises that is will use the water to wash the coil and thus remove lint. It also has two lint filters before that. Question is, does it work? It hasn't been on the market long enough I think to answer that.
LG and Bosch/Siemens use condensate to automatically rinse the coils. Miele uses a super fine filter. This is a very much solved problem.
Have one of these since 10 years and they are brilliant.
I've repaired mine multiple times, primary the rubber supporting rollers around door. Recently, it was the spring wheel that holds tension on the belt.
I have the exact same model and it is great. It is engineered to last 20 years and they give a long warranty. It is gentler on clothes and pairs well with the Miele washer which has the highest spin rate available which extracts more water shortening the dryer time. I have had it since July and so far so good. Oh and the app is not junk and actually works which was a pleasant surprise.
"Why are they not used everywhere" - they ARE used pretty much everywhere, at least in Europe! Other makes are also great, with AEG being quality close to Miele. A big plus is that they don't damage clothes which excssively heat. Also, Miele does make *far* larger dryers than yours (right up to laundrette models) but these might not be available in the US market.
German here, using that exact Miele model (EU version), exact same experience. I wasn't aware of the hidden costs of getting outside air; and also that thing with the extra moisture. I think pro's and con's are explained here very well.
And with your solar panels, the efficiency of low electricity usage adds up even more! It'd be pretty cool at some point if you do a video breaking down how you get that sort of stacking effect between your new house and all the effcient appliances you have going on (even if it's rough ballpark figures). Maybe point to things those of us who can't build a new house, might look into as 2-3 thing combo that would improve our electricity usage and save money together. Thank you again for all of your videos, I love your honesty on the drawbacks or limitations that some of these things have, it helps people have realistic expectations.
Considering your super geek status Matt, I was surprised to hear that you had not heard of heat pump dryers before. We’ve had a heat pump dryer for about five years now. It is large by Australian standards at a 9kg load. We measure washing machines and dryers by the weight of clothes they hold. It happens to also be a Miele. Other than purchase cost, not sure why everyone isn’t saving lots of money with a heat pump dryer.
Thanks for the content, very interesting. You did say one thing I found odd … you had a dryer that has lasted 17 years and you expect the same from this new one. My experience with all new appliances (regardless of how expensive) including hot H2o tanks, refrigerators, furnaces, washers /dryers, toasters, microwaves etc is they don’t last nearly as long as older appliances. I attribute this to several things including planned obsolescence, inherent vice and motherboards that simply do not last (heat?cold?moisture ?). Every salesperson and repair tech seems to share the same view that new appliances last a fraction of the time. Am I out to lunch in this thinking?
I have heard that appliances don't last as long too. I had a new dishwasher break after 18 months. I bought a new one with and extended warranty from Home Depot. It broke as well. I asked the technician and he recommended to get a surge suppressor as the computer boards were a bit delicate. No problems since then. I realize that this could be a coincidence.
I've been using Electrolux washer/dryer with heat pump technology for the last year, and it's really great to just set the washing cycle and later remove your clothes clean and dry.
im using heat pump dryer in europe (Ireland) where weather is rather rainy most of the year, it cost me in July 2021 450 Euro which was about 50-60 % more expensive than standard vented one. I love that it has humidity sensor so when clothes are dry to set level and it is not fully loaded it will finish drying cycle quicker or if you put more clothes and heavy like towels it will extend the cycle until it is dry to set level which there are few to chose from, for ironing after, wardrobe dry and drying outside dry. water that is collected is used for watering plants or to mop the floors.
When we moved from Canada to Germany many years ago, we were surprised by how much smaller appliances were here. I joked to people at work that the fridge in my apartment was smaller than the one I had in the back seat of my Cadillac. We have been using a Bosch dyer with this type of system for years without any issues. The water has to be drained out in the sink after most loads.
In a Bosch unit (well BSH) so applies to Siemens also you have the drain hose behind the machine that you can connect to drain and skip the emptying then.
Thanks for the tip@@Karjis
@@KarjisNot in all models. Also, the models with self-cleaning condenser coils use the condensate to flush the condenser. I’m not actually sure how the BSH models with the drain option handle that.
@@tookitogo we have one with the condensate flush setup (Siemens IQ500 series one), it keeps condensate in the reservoir and performs the flush from time to time while the cycle is active but at the end it drains the condensate to drain, so at the end the reservoir is empty. But it is possible the option (the detachable hose behind the machine) is not available in all models in all regions.
@@Karjis Ah I see! (Mine is an iQ300, so it only has the reservoir.) Thanks for the info!
Hi Matt: Great video! You can tune the 'drying levels' on the Miele HP driers. We have the base model and adjusted the levels from factory up to 'even drier' . It's on page 88 of the manual (in the Settings section).
I use the extra dry setting on my Miele heat pump dryer and it always comes out dry. I love this dryer, and the room that it is in doesn’t turn into a hotbox when drying.
I have the GE Profile Combo. After 2 months, I find it to be doing a good job. What I like most is that I put a load in, come back later, and the clothes are clean and dry. It does take a little longer to do a load, but I do not have to transfer clothes from the washer to the dryer. Energy usage is about 1/4 that of a typical washer and electric dryer. Most of my loads are done in 2 hours' average time. Some take longer like towels. I don't like any soap residue, so I run an extra rinse. Still, they are done in about 2 1/2 hours. (4 each bath and hand towels and 4 wash cloths.)
After having owned 2 (and used plenty of) different modern washers and dryers I finally upgraded to a set from 1990. What an absolute dream. It uses enough water to actually get the clothes clean. And enough power to dry the clothes in a time efficient manner. Best home appliances I have ever owned.
A product of times when utilities we're dirt cheap and people didnt really care about saving, cause they we're making money hand over fist still. That all ended around early 2000's. Its true though. A mielie from 90s is going to last like 25+ years with maybe one or two cheap repairs. Making them last another 20+ But damn are old appliances power hungry and noisy. Bulky reliable motors but not efficient and loud. The other cons are no modern technologies so you get what you get, nothing else. The old miele was 2 to 3 times louder too. The new samsung one is so quiet you can turn it on and go to sleep and not get woken up. There are pros to both but i'd go with the new thing. Also new mielies are so damn expensive. I wonder if theyre still as good as old miele stuff.