No such thing as correct English | Kellam Barta | TEDxFargo
Most English speakers who notice differences in pronunciation, grammatical structure, or word choice believe that some of these variants are "correct" and others are not. Differences in spoken English (and other languages) often encode local or social identity, and ideas about correctness create groups of people who are "othered" because they "say it wrong." This phenomenon is highlighted in Fargo, ND, by local speakers' unique pronunciation of North Dakota State University's athletic moniker, the Bison, with a [z] sound in the middle. They insist that people outside the region don't "say it right." While this is a fairly innocuous example of linguistic subordination - using attitudes about language to marginalize entire demographics - Barta explains how African Americans, women, and young people can be marginalized based on their speech, though the pronunciation, grammar, and vocabulary used are intricate, systematic, and communicative. There is nothing "incorrect" about them.
Kellam has an MA in Sociolinguistics from North Carolina State University, where he led the Diversity Ambassadors, an outreach program aimed at spreading awareness of language variation and promoting celebration, instead of subordination, of different ways of speaking English. Kellam is currently a Lecturer in the NDSU English Department and the founder of the NDSU Language Diversity Ambassadors, a fledgling group cast in the mold of NC State's program. Kellam's goal is to carry the message of the Ambassadors well beyond the boundaries of college campuses, so that those in positions of relative power may recognize the privilege that comes with speaking prestige varieties of English and so that we all may take care to respect mere differences - and not deficits - in English pronunciations, grammar, and word choice.
This talk was given at a TEDx event using the TED conference format but independently organized by a local community. Learn more at ted.com/tedx
Anyone else here because they have to be here for a college assignment.
yes! lol
Mine is Year 11 homework lol
Eat your Cereal same but 8th grade
High school
yeah, ill have to make an essay about this 🤷♂️
Here because Kellam is my professor currently and he assigned this! You're the best, KB!
"English does not merely borrow words from other languages. It mugs them in dark alleys and goes through their pockets looking for loose grammar." From Amy Poehler's Harvard commencement speech.
That was awesome! I really liked what you had to say and how you said it. Also, your presentation on the material was outstanding. Thank you so much! I had to watch this video as an assignment for my college English Comp class and I will be thanking my professor.
This discussion is outstanding Kellam. Made me feel much better aboowwt my accent when I travel.
Patrick Ralston Is this a canadian joke?
I don't make mistakes when I speak English, I just innovate the language 😝 (I'm Italian)
English is my second language. What he exposed also happens in Spanish language. Nevertheless, we use to correct non-acceptable conjunctions or non-existing words, sometimes grammar structures, because it is the only way to preserve the language. Now, when it comes to pronunciation, we are aware that demographic fences carry different pronunciations and what is right in Colombia could be incorrect in Costa Rica for example. We can deal with those differences when they are not destroying grammar or the language itself.
I don't think that safeguarding the language is a role normative/traditional grammar is supposed to play, as if language was something that can be destroyed. Natural languages (all of them) go far beyond what normative grammar prescribes in terms of what is right or wrong, cause language functions by itself in real life and changes organically, whereas there are various types of grammar. What normative grammar does is basically to idealize the language. Using grammar as the main reference about preserving the language is a discourse that comes from a place of elitism.
There are developmental and cultural influences behind many of these dialects which form the basis of everyday speech for many different people, but when you are teaching written english these habits need to be set aside in the hope that someones speech patterns will not prevent them from being able to accurately express themselves regardless of their generation or cultural background. And I'm from Maine , ah-yuh!
People accurately express themselves in all dialects... The failure is usually on The listener who's too busy focusing on how the speaker is talking and not WHAT they said
It really depends on what type of written English they are taught, once English is not restricted to America and Britain.
There's no such thing as correct english. However, if you cannot say what you mean, you cannot mean what you say.
I'm done with having pursuit of perfect American accent. I just become far away with any context, communicative skill, articulation and so on. I feel like I'm really into learning language when I become better and better in articulation. Thanks for this video!
I assume Vocal Fry is another term describing Jersey accents.
Meaningful takeaways
Some good points here. Definitely differences should be celebrated and sure language changes. But, it’s a bit extreme to say there is no such things as proper English. We need agreed upon standards, and there is social value in being able to signal your education and sophistication with speech, grammar, and vocabulary. If nothing else, you will be able to express yourself better and you will be more widely understood and, therefore, (rightly or wrongly) respected if you can speak properly, and know the difference between the casual and the formal use of a word like “epic”, for example.
Who agreed to make the that dialect more "academic"? Nobody. People are forced to conform to it because they are seen as illiterate if they don't. The problem is in the idea that any one dialect signals an education. "Being more widely understood" is also not true. If that was the case then we would use a more simplified dialect. The point of academic/"proper" English is to exclude people.
@@zephyrschiesser5408 the whole story he told about the trial was a problem that came up precisely because the witness was not widely understood. Maybe she was speaking in a valid way for her sub-culture, but in that instance it would have been helpful to speak in a way that is more widely recognized. It’s the whole reason that lingua francas exist, because if cultural groups drift too far apart in language they have to have some kind of agreed upon standard of communication. You don’t have to speak the “lingua franca” if you don’t want to (no one is “forced”), but it is obviously helpful if you do.
Fundamentally, a good message, but overstated and oversimplified.
Next level talk by a next level teacher.
I wish i had a teacher like him
English as a second language, I have suffered from linguistic discrimination. I was terminated because I have poor structure writing skills.
"linguistic discrimination" that's a new one. Everyone has some way their a victim... it sure seems to pay these days.
@markrenton2421 yes, because it's bad for people to speak out about about their bad experiences
If you're in a privileged position, the idea of equality will seem like oppression to you, Mark.
Fantastic talk! Really sends out the correct messages!
This is very old problem at least 2500 years old. In Both Greece and India there was the concept of Barbarism. Indians and Greeks both used to say Barbarians to those who could not speak properly. The first grammar probably was written in Sanskrit before Buddha (6th century BCE). Buddha chose to give his sermons in local or folks languages rather than in the standardized Sanskrit. The History and Evolution of languages are the proof that that there is no such thing pure or correct language as there is no such thing pure race. Every thing changes in time and space.
Caminhos das Índias Músic
How do fully grown adults not know the difference between "you're" and "your"? I figured it out in 1st grade; it's not that hard.
There is such a thing as "standard English", read "Word on the Street" by John McWhorter. Anything can be labeled as "standard" in a language but not everything all at once.
I strongly disagree with the conclusion.
PCOMM student here
Standard English is used in most instructional materials. You are wrong!
You have it half right! There is another half to this......Good....better.....BEST! Go Bizon! Class of 1983!
Fresh avo cadoos
fre sha vo cado
periodt king purr
This what i tell everybody who tries to correct me
Yesn't
I respect what he says, but it doesn't change the fact that people don't know how to say Oregon.
Informative and true. The "Standard English" phenomenon is both socially and politically driven and should go down the drain!
I will tell that to the examiner when I take the Cambridge FCE B2 exam
Shoutout Risa and Ash HAHAHAHA Major 8 LOL
BISHHHH *FRY VOICE* assignment here we go!
Hoy HAHAHHAHAA
@@amjslyrics HAHAHAHHAHAHA
Correct? Waiting for 2020 to see you
Having an accent is emotionally painful because americans won't take you serious if you don't sound like them. At work, having an accent is a setback that may cause you to be passed over for a promotion.
which is weird because at the more interpersonal level I'm def attracted to certain accents.
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sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh
Also theres no thing as standard english
So you're telling me that someone who say's Nevahda instead of Nevada shouldn't be told they're saying it wrong cause they're technically not wrong? I refuse to believe that. XD
I cant i cant watch a ted talk high this is too weird i cant
college assignment.
Save yourself 7 minutes. Misleading title, makes an assertion which opposes his view but doesn't back it up, and he also regurgitates old info.
It's ok to have an accent when you speak another language.
Well there is a correct version of English, British English
thats wrong to cause it's still not correct it is no such thing as a correct way of talking its opinion
You think everyone in Britain speak one dialect of English? 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
@@13579hee that dude is a troll the same way people say the quote of proper english which I take it as talking proper but the way people say it means as talking a so called correct way which was taught to us in school which is flawed cause its opinion it is no right way to talk english or any other language it's all opinion
@@cmoneytheman exactly. People don't even realize what they learn in school is not "proper English" it's just how to correctly speak the dialect of Standard American English... Nothing more nothing less LOL
@@13579hee its proper like I said saying words the exact way it's spelled or spelt like I would say brainwashed followers on this KZhead always say im not talking proper I dont want or have to I will talk proper when I'm doing business but i never feel its correct it's just talking proper
sheeesh
The thing that I noticed about this whole lecture is that the guy does not show enough respect to tuck in his shirt, so I guess it does not take much stretch of the imagination to expect he would not endorse the correct way of speaking English.
Lmaoo who cares if he didn’t tuck his shirt
No!
So Trump's English is just a dialect? lol
So, i guess there's another subject in indoctrination Centers (Public Schools) that will be butchered or removed.
Indoctrination centres? Man there's no limit to the hyperbole on the internet.
@@EuropeanQohelethyeah the commenter sounds like those people who want to remove teaching about racism and queer people in schools lol
excetera,nucyuh ler,as per,true facts true history,past history,prior plans,prior history,future plans,various and sundry,excape,point n time,outer perimeter, loose lose,lossed lost,choose chose,,preboard prepay prequalify,prepay,preorder,preregister,regester, we'll,well,your,you're , would of,libary, to,too close proximity
This person is of hebrew heritage
So, literacy needs to be redefined, because right now it only means literate in White English.
Your English is difficult English. Should you use simple English.
Vocal Fry or Glottal Fry is TERRIBLE for the vocal chords. It is an awful habit that can contribute to vocal nodules. It is also a way of speaking that has little power and can cause the listener to disengage. Think Elmer Fud. Funny but a very bad habit. This is NOT the same as a dialect. It is unhealthy. Take it from a reformed Glottal Fryer who went for Voice Therapy. Glad I did, as it helped to save my voice, which is still in very good shape. I am celebrating close to 40 years as a full time, professional singer, and still going strong. I will think about retiring when I am in my 80's or 90's. And so IT is!
der engliche polizei,elmer fuDD,,muchas danke
Elaine - - Thank you for your comment. Glad to hear you recognized a problem and then did something positive about it. Everyone needs help in one way or another.
Hi Elaine, I'm pursuing a PhD in linguistics and am not aware of any studies showing that vocal fry is bad for speakers in any way or that it can cause listeners to disengage. In fact, English speakers across genders and age groups (not just young women) use vocal fry now, without people even noticing and without an increase in vocal cord injuries. I would be interested in knowing where you got this information from, as this may be more along the lines of hearsay rather than actual science. On the other hand, perhaps you are mistaking vocal fry for something else that actually does hurt the vocal cords.
Boooooo!!
Extremely oversimplified. Of course, there is correct English, for if there wasn't, we wouldn't be able to form meaningful sentences. Languages would be chaotic monsters no one could ever hope to learn to conversational proficiency. What he is talking about is discrimination against varieties of English. One variety is not better than another. But using one variety it is easily possible to make mistakes. If there were no rules, there wouldn't be a language.
wrong it is no correct way of language its opinion I can say the way u talk is wrong using big words instead of just simple words wont mean im right it's a choice it's no right or wrong
There literally isn't 😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣 The failure is on your half because you make the assumption that people who speak dialect different from standard American English arent conversing "proficiently"... they are, you just don't understand them because YOU don't understand the dialect they are speaking 😂🤣😂🤣 I don't think he's arguing that there are "no rules". The vast majority of the rules that people follow in varying dialects of English go back to its west germanic roots and quite possibly beyond. The vast majority have subject-verb-object sentence order. Many of the rules are pickup through talkin to people and not in an academic/educational setting. Ask the average person where an "object" is meant to be place in a sentence or where adjectives or adverbs are meant to be and they won't provide you the answer.... despite them understanding the rule and using it every time they open their mouths to speak
There is a difference between "correct English" and Standard English.
@@literallyunique782 no such thing as correct I said that uptop troll
@@miltonstevenson4817 what do this mean
dude is full of it,sum says sum ting wong,world famous linguist who hangs out in saigons' phu anh yu cafe,sipping espresso and monster power drinks,carefully pondering world affairs,in 4 languages, standard english,printed,cursively written,correctly spelled,prevails across the net,on subjects from A to Z,spelling grammar,diacritical marks,syntax matter,either kiddies poor grasp of it owes to biology, teaching deficencies,,perhaps kids who are taught & drilled in script writing,tracing letters, a process that engages more hand arm,finger muscles,thus imprinting more brain circuits.barta you finna makemewannafallout.
When blacks say AKS instead of ASK 🤬
Well then they should bloody well learn how to say it the correct way.
The title and description say it all; I'm not even going to watch this video. I sense the white guilt and minority-worship are strong with this one.
Do you speak the Queen's English? If not that your opinion clearly does not matter.
Waste of time
You're on TED - Tuck your shirt in god damn it!!!!!
This is an excuse for lazy pronunciation(s) and ignorance.
Renaissance - - - I agree with you.
So Americans are lazy for not speaking the Queen's English?
I have to agree, even though some of the points he is making are thought provoking and have some truth in them, you shouldn’t conclude that there is no such thing as correct speech. That means no need for education or instruction and no common standard to discern meaning
@@AWriterWandering gotem
More postmodernist nonsense.
Seems to run in The Tribe
Wrong
What a load of nonsense? He can't even dress himself properly.
sheeesh