What Baldur's Gate 3 is Like For Someone Who Doesn't Really Play Games
2024 ж. 25 Нау.
622 900 Рет қаралды
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Baldur's Gate 3 is a game with an unprecedented amount of player choice. There are so many ways to interact with the world, and that made me wonder: what would it be like for someone who learning the ins and outs of video games? So, I had my wife play it to find out, and now you can watch to also find out.
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hope you enjoy this entry of my wife's journey in her gaming education. been a lot of fun to see how she has grown as a player and applied logic learned from other games to this one, and yeah, we had a lot of fun making this, so I hope that shows! anyway, we're gonna have a second kid any day now, so until I'm back, have a good one.
The more the merrier
I will enjoy it
Thank you for creating this series. It is very helpfull, insightfull and fun. I wish you and the Lady you life with relaxing sleep whenever you can get it and as little suspicious silences as possible
Congrats for the child!
@razbuten I would be interested to see her play Dragon Age Origins. I believe it has both RT and pause time for tactics and the party can have AI sat up to determine their moves based on situation. I also think it has a relatively straightforward quest line.
Can’t believe the Lady You Live With has finally evolved from someone who doesn’t play games into someone who doesn’t _really_ play games! Big step!
it is my weak defense to people saying "can you really call her a non-gamer anymore?"
@@razbutenObjection! That's a strong and perfectly adequate defense.
@@razbutenif people actually say that then they are silly, having a partner willing to partake in your interests is great and sure your way like you said way back in part one wasn't the nicest way to introduce her, but she's still playing so it seems like she doesn't hate it, so it worked out, and us as an audience get a great series out of it win/win/win
@@adamevaskevich5528 Its just people making a joke about how many times hes done this formula
@@razbuten i love this series. It shows, what mammoth game developers have to accommodate for when designing for new players and...well, us. We will complain that it's too much handholding, but new players need that hand. Maybe it's time to design difficulties not by making the game easier, but the hand holding more prominent in starter difficulties, and turn them off for higher. Definitely more work but it could help
- Likes space to think - Enjoys creative freedom - Likes non-violent solutions - Wants occasional bursts of adrenaline I think your wife is a Hitman player
Or maybe Dishonored? Perhaps just a stealth gamer in general lol
@@magicianvv489 I think Dishonored falls more into fantasy and she doesn't like that genre. Hitman seems like a better fit.
this was literally what i was thinking, especially with "needing clear directions" and how hitman literally will just highlight your target for you (most of the time) even if theyre quite far
I don't think Hitman has much in the way on non-violent solutions. Indirectly violent solutions, sure, but violence definitely has to be done
@@TheThunderbirdRising you're absolutely right, you can't not kill the target and there's no way around it.
Wait, Lady did not pick up Gale, Wyll AND Karlach???? She was stuck with the whole Mean Girl clique as a first impression of companions, oh no!! D:
the mean girl clique is my main loadout lololol
Same for me. I found those other guys way later. Shadowheart looked like a lawful good compared to the others lol
❤@@ashtondean3548
Oh my god they ARE the mean girl clique, aren't they...? I love them with all my heart, sure, but oof... That's is a rough first impression indeed. XD
Well, that's the ones the game gives you first.
9:27 The answer is simple. Faces made with sliders are almost impossible to animate properly. You can notice that basically all games with sliders for character creation have little to no face animations. As opposed to BG3, where your character's face and expressions take the central stage in basically every conversation.
Fallout 4 is a good example, the faces look fine when they’re static, but half the NPCs and the player character look like creepy wax dolls during dialogue
Came here to say this. With the mocap for Tav/Durge, it’d be almost impossible to capture the facial expressions if a slider was used.
Also, honestly, back in the day we had literally zero customization for playable characters and we were all fine with it. Like, is it cool that I get to design my character the way I want (aka someone who’s completely different from me because this isn’t literally me… this is a character I play)? Yeah. But if I was playing this game with a pre-made character and get to interact with all the others the exact same way, I really wouldn’t mind. I feel like expecting a main character to look exactly like you kinda misses the point of playing videogames.
Even ignoring the technical aspects, I much prefer a broad range of preset faces each with their own distinct look to a maze of sliders for cheekbones and nostrils and eyelash length. It lets me consider the character as a whole and choose a face that suits the character concept and “vibe” I’m going for, rather than tinkering for hours just to create a face that looks “ok”. It would have been nice if BG3 had a few more faces to choose from (though with 8-10 options for each combination of race and gender, that’s almost 200 total), but it has a nice variety, and I appreciate how it provides both traditionally beautiful faces and some that are a bit more rugged or unusual.
But BG3 has a silent protagonist with few facial expressions. If any game would be fine with sliders it would be this one...
The actor who plays Lae' Zel has a series of herself playing bg3, and she does not know much about video games. It's a really fun series to watch and made me realize how many things can be confusing about the game that I hadn't even though of.
I will have to check that out! I imagine that is a really interesting experience as not only is she new to games, but also has some understanding of what went into making it.
I have a moderate familiarity with RPGs and SOME familarity with D&D/fantasy stuff in general, and it's taken me 100s of hours to learn to play the game properly lol I keep restarting because some way along into the story I find some new tactic or piece of information that I weirdly feel will change my whole experience of the game and I want to use it right the way along.
@@razbutenActually quite a lot of the VA's have videos on them playing the game, even down to Rolan's VA too. Shadowheart's and Lae' Zel's playthroughs stand out the most due to their lack of experience in gaming, as well as volume of game time uploaded. Astarion and Wyll on the opposite side of the spectrum, do have gaming experience.
Same for Mizora and Shadowheart (she might have more experience with games but I'm not sure), they even stream it on twitch
@@marmeusKarlach and Astarian's VAs played it for a bit as well.
The Lady >I< Live With has just discovered Stardew Valley. I had to explain WASD controls to her, which of course I didn't realise would be unintuitive to the uninitiated. I'm excited to see how she grows.
*cries in alone*
It took me so long to figure out the I there was a letter and not a face, I was so confused xD
Are you going to give us an informal experiment video too hfm?
And the journey down the rabbit hole begins.
Haha...that's a gender-flip of the usual cozy game story (my girlfriend at the time got me into Stardew in 2017; I hadn't played a Harvest Moon-like since HM Friends of Mineral Town on the Game Boy Advance in 2003.)
It's so funny to me that while playing BG3, removing the parasite clearly felt like a McGuffin plot device designed to move the story forward while you enjoy the game, but your wife very much viewed it as a singular task she had to accomplish
And yet, here I was avoiding taking long rests, as I assumed after 3-4 my character would just fall over dead...
To be fair -- it's literally put to you as like your 2nd objective of the whole game right in your journal. There's this repeated emphasis on how little time you have and how wasteful it is to take too many long rests. Without having played a Larian game before you don't really know if its got kiddy-gloves on or not. I know DMs who would absolutely kill your character for taking long rests with a mindflayer parasite.
@@norats122 I played DOS2. I just expect to role-play in a dnd-style rpg. Most of the hints about the mindflayer parasite being strange don't come up, or don't make sense when you actually take the threat seriously, and this is a flaw with how the game presents information to the players. Even after I found out that it didn't actually matter, I continued to avoid long-rests because I am role-playing, that's kinda like the point of an rpg. like, would you actually take that kind of risk, even if it is slower than normal, less-seriously? I think most people would bee-line a solution if it was really happening to them.
@@StolidLiquidYeah it’s just like how in Act 3 there are tremors that shake the entire city and stop you in your tracks, yet everyone just goes about their business, asking you to mow their lawn and save their cat that’s stuck in a tree. Not to mention the Absolute soon coming to ravage the city that everyone’s fully aware of.
@norats122 Yeah I agree, it's totally understandable that she thought that. I haven't played a Larian game before but just having a lot of fluency with video games I figured the parasite would be naturally resolved in the story and wasn't really a genuinely pressing issue
Its crazy to me that older players hate games for hand holding, but like this lady, every person i try to get into games there first comment is "IDK what to do its not telling me a detailed to do list of objectives." Kinda leaves game designers fumbling.
Games shouldn’t be made for everyone
@@Mike_DubayouElaborate on that?
@@taelib1425 if you try to make a game that appeals to everyone then in the end it will likely appeal to no one, gamers are too varied in the things they enjoy and some gamers have completely clashing ideologies when it comes to what they enjoy
Make it optional. Literally start the game asking the player how confident they are and give them the appropriate amount of handholding accordingly.
@@tankeasy8180 That's definitely a point I agree with. Games should have a creative vision and stick to it as much as they can while making an enjoyable experience. The reason I asked the other guy to elaborate is because given the context, it makes it sounds like he thinks games shouldn't be accessible to people who didn't grow up playing them, which I think would eventually insulate and strangle the hobby, so I wanted to give benefit of the doubt.
I didn't even think about controlling the other party members...as a DM, I was just grateful that someone was doing the numbers for me.
god yeah, that’s how i felt. the biggest thing for me was “holy shit the computer just, does all these calculations for me. this is awesome!”
THIS. I was sooo greatful the computer was tracking all the damn Conditions...lol
I think Dragon Age Origins has the best implementation of this in RPG history. You can order every command, or you can let AI do it for you, or you can edit the script if you think the AI is stupid. 3 options that cover everything. No other game has done this. Yes some games have AI but you cannot edit their stupidity. I hear FF 12 has something similar but it's still in my backlog.
@@TomCruz54321 Pillars of eternity games are very good at it.
The idea of the option to let the Origin PCs be auto played by the computer would be super cool. Playing single player is so daunting on re-playthroughs and an option to have to adapt to the chaos and make the game faster paced would be so awesome. A Mod or Update I'd wish for really badly.
Lady trying to knock the tieflings unconscious as to not kill innocent folk and then Lae’zel just killing them anyway is so in-character for her
I will say as a woman who grew up playing video games I never really understood how hard it was to learn video games until I played Civilization 6, Crusader Kings 3 and Planet Zoo. The kind of system knowledge required to feel confident while playing those games is immense and for some reason my knowledge of most video game genres just didn’t transfer over very well.
It’s a woman problem u woman aren’t able to think critically or learn very well. You only think about how you feel and how whatever you’re thinking about makes you feel
Playing Crusader Kings 3 was my most humbling gaming experience. The first few sessions felt like me trying to drive a spaceship.
I felt sooo overwhelmed when I started playing Planet Zoo. I was like "eh, I played Wildlife Park, this'll be similar" and NOPE it was NOT. It was so much. I was so grateful for the tutorial levels.
Yea the whole Paradox library is like oh great even if I know how the other games work i’ll have to remember all the mechanics for this game somehow if I want to play it.
Swapping this to coop was a really good idea. It shows another side of the experiment and it really brings out the best of dnd.
Your wife's sudden epiphany that she married a massive nerd made me laugh so hard, my partner was the same when we watched the D&D 2023 movie together and I was pointing out all of the easter eggs XD
When I first invited my boyfriend to play DnD, he basically only gave it a go because I like it, but it was very explicit that he probably wouldn't like "that nerdy stuff." It is now 4 years later, and we have been playing every week since, and if it's called off one week because someone is sick or away, he is DEVASTATED. He literally looks forward to it all week.
bro, I'd be worse. I'd be pointing out every inaccuracy, ESPECIALLY the "wildshape into owlbear" thing.
@@chukyuniqul Ironically not an inaccuracy if you go with older editions which seems to have been the case for the D&D movie. It was a 5e shift but in both 3.0/3.5 and Pathfinder (which is basically 3.75) you can take abilities that allow you to become one. It's part of what I love about the movie since it lets you know what abilities they have on their character sheet.
@@TamaraBloodhoof In addition, a huge part of D&D is homebrew and imagining that a player would write a character who's "just a *very* special druid who actually CAN transform into an Owlbear!" is not out of the realm of possibility either
I take strong offense to the word "nerd" when directed at me. I play a lot of video games, but I'm not into the "nerd" pantheon of comics, anime, Star Wars, and whatnot. A former girlfriend of mine took great pleasure in many "I thought you said you weren't a nerd" moments during our relationship because I have a lot of cultural osmosis with geek culture from being a gamer, however...
"Please don't put that in the video." I hope like any good, and loving husband your very next thought was. "First thing going in the video" and then built the whole video outward from the squirrel death. lol
Finally someone understands my process
@@razbuten"don't put that in" "don't clip that" and any other instruction to hide something always results in the opposite. I think that's one of the hidden laws of the internet.
@@Bobbias It's called the Streisand Effect, actually, and it's been around for a long time. It's basically drawing attention to something by the mere act of trying not to draw attention to it.
@@Bobbias same rule applies to playing dnd. you ask "oh no, is there a werewolf behind that door?" and you KNOW that in his head, the dm is going "well there is now."
@@iota-09shh, don't spoil it for the non-DMs
when a new player joins my campaign, I tell them to think of a character entirely based on aesthetic. It's impossible to expect someone to parse the countless small but important decisions they make when actually making a character sheet. It's much easier to start from vibes, then steadily learn the mechanics after. Something like "I want to be a thief prowling through the night, stealing from the rich to give to the poor!" is one of the sweetest things to hear from a new player.
While I appreciate the lessons we can learn from someone new to gaming, the lady you live with doesn't strike me as someone new to games- she strikes me as someone who doesn't enjoy them. Maybe they're just not for her, and that's okay.
My mom, who hasn't played many intensive games, picked up BG3 a little while after released, and now has more hours in it then me and everyone else I know who plays it put together. It took her many, many hours to understand how the game worked and all the options at her disposal, but now she's probably better at it than me. Also, the floor markings from the smokepowder satchel are where it would spread to when it broke. The explosive radius isn't shown, and extends a meter or two from the powder in every direction. The throwing animation doesn't actually move your hitbox.
so? who is she romancing?
@@juanjuri6127 Haha, she's romanced basically all of them at this point. She actually went through and got every achievement though, including Foehammer.
@@Shuddarundamn, your mom rocks! 😃
This reminds me of my mom a little! My sisters and I all grew up playing games with my dad but my mom was never really into it but the one game she did LOVE and would always play with us and eventually went through and beat it herself was the House of the Dead on the Wii of all things 😭
This also happened to my mom she put in 400 hours in 2 months and it was insane
I think the biggest take away from that not all media can be made for everyone. Baldur's gate is the most approachable CRPG but it's still a CRPG, very mechanical hevy, very choice-heavy, and usually very violent heavy. It's not a genre most inside vider games play. But that's fine.
Yeah, I was thinking this while watching the video. I wouldn't WANT to play a Baldur's Gate 3 that was meant for a player like this guy's wife. And that's okay.
Heavily disagree that 3 is the most approachable, a significant number of the the things brought up in this video are made more of a problem to accessibility in bg3 than dragon age games, as just a very quick modern comparison. BG3 just wasn't made to appeal to a casual/non gamer audience as much. There's a reason dragon age went from origins, into what inquisition ended up being (and mass effect into what andromeda ended up being). I'd also argue that bg1 and 2 are more accessible in a mechanics sense, than bg3. Though the dated graphics, and lack of a controller option knocks them down a lot.
@@aurovisuals7925I’m shocked that BG3 had the reception that it had. I loved it, but I also watched about 8 hours of tutorial content to prepare for it. There were sooooo many points that I would think normies would bounce off of.
BG3 is easily the most accessible CRPG... It's incredibly straightforward, especially compared to Divinity 2, and is MUCH more immersive due to the dialogue and cutscene system.
@@aurovisuals7925 But the problem is that Baldur's gate DID make it to the normie/non gamer audience, which is how it won GOTY. It's incredibly popular with non-CRPG players. I'm not sure how you miss that.
As somebody who plays D&D, I never really encountered any of the problems that the lady you live with did. Character creation and role play was intuitive and the controls, while a little rough at first (mouse and keyboard), quickly became the most natural sounding way to play this game. At the same time, I convinced my sibling, who, while still dabbling in games like Stardew Valley and playing D&D occasionally, isn't really a big gamer, to pick up the game and try it out. They didn't know what half the stuff did and required a lot of guidance. At some point, I left them on their own for a bit, and they somehow instigated a civil war in the druid grove (which I never knew was even possible) and caused the death of Wyll before recruiting him. We rewound time to before that happened, of course, but it amazes me that a player who doesn't know as much about this kind of game can not only have a different experience, which is expected, but also play through a different *story.* In some ways, BG3 is basically actual D&D - you don't know anything when you start, and you're going to mess up a lot. But, when you're able to get past the steep plateau that starts the journey, you can enjoy one of the best experiences out there.
I am really sad Lady missed out on meeting Karlach, Wyll and Gale. They are so much more likable initially than Laezel, Shadowheart and Astarion
I missed everyone except for Shadowheart. Later my friend told me there are other companions in the game lmao. I thought I had to finish the game with shadowheart alone
The game was originally supposed to be narrated in the first person. People didn't like it and they ditched it really early on. There's quite a lot of dialogue recorded for all the Tavs and origin characters.
I really appreciate the way they did it for origin Karlach. Having the character talk to herself beyond the narration does so much to make her feel alive.
yeah it was pretty bad tbh. there were a ton of other issues besides the first person narration too. the released audio by chublott was MUCH different than how the EA experience was at the time. edit: not only was the narration in the EA at the time bad the dialogue options were past tense indirect so it was unnerving.
It wasn't really first person, but it was a weird "2nd person" like DOS2.
2nd person does fit better, being based on D&D
I actually prefer the silent protagonist. Before voice acting, games like Fallout 1 could put all the dialogue options that they want without much overhead because it's all just text. With voice acting, having 6 options for every dialogue means more recording sessions and more salary to pay for voice actors. Voiced protagonist is the reason why we got the awful dialogue wheel and fewer dialogue options, which means fewer ways to roleplay. That's why I don't mind silent protagonists in indie games.
5:50 "They all sound the same!" I am reminded how I taught my boyfriend Magic the Gathering, and how he found joy rather in story and characters, and then gameplay later. I made two decks based on Ravnica only, and he loved both Gruul and Rakdos, the fun art with the immediate red gameplay - and then learned colours and strategy later on the go. Aesthetics and story is what makes things accessible, so in the case of "What is the difference between Wizard, Warlock and Sorcerer?", scrap all the gameplay stuff and go into the characteristics of it, easy and nice, down to one sentence: Wizard - Person who learned magic through books, the academic type, went to magic university Sorcerer - Person born with magic, imagine a family bloodline, like someone born with Ice or Fire Magic Warlock - Person who made a pact with a powerful devil to get powers, they can be strong, but there might be a downside making pacts... That is something beginners (and everyone else!) can vibe with, imagine something with! Always go with story and characters first, even within explaining gameplay! :D
Bards: shred so hard they magic.
100% this.
Underrated Comment, this is exactly what got me more interested in D&D
Literally how I introduce classes to my beginner D&D players! I never go for mechanics, I just tell them what the core fantasy of the class is, sometimes going in-depth into subclasses they might like. One of my players wanted to play a fighter with magical capabilities, so I told them about Eldritch Knights, how they "pick up" spellcasting after some time fighting "like when Captain America gets lightning powers when he picks up Mjolnir", and they were SO IN from the jump. If I just told them "Yeah, Eldritch Knights can go bonk, but they also throw around some very limited spells", I know they wouldn't have been as excited
Yup, the "rule of cool" is important. I got into Warhammer because I thought the models looked amazing. I still only play armies if I like the way they look (I spend much more time building and painting than I do playing), and I don't like the way all of them play, but I never would have stuck with it if I didn't think my stuff was cool. I'm similarly just now getting into Magic (Commander), and am 100% sticking with a thematic deck based on something I think is cool, rather than what I think is strong. I can always adjust later if I figure out there are mechanical deficiencies in what I end up building.
I really think that BG3 is also very reflective of people’s personalities in how they play and choose their characters. For example like the How she follows directions and isn’t really one to explore and take action and it just really passive
"Astarion's kind of a jerk." I mean, she's not wrong... but like... that's why we love him so much. 😅
Nothing is quite as miserable as watching someone you care about not understand how to interact with a medium that means so much to you. Ive had games destroy me and there are people i care about who will never be able to empathize with why.
For what it’s worth I understand 🫂
Exactly what I feel trying to make my sister play Yakuza 0, but she's progressing, the problem is tgat she simplu do not try to understand how combat and other mechanics work, she basically just "throw thing to a wall and see what sticks" yk? But she is loving the games story, is just that simply refuses to stop and leran how things work hahahahaha kinda like how Raz girl do not try things just for trying, like not experimenting things.
It's worth having the patience to see through but I understand the frustration lmao
@@tashigikuina6332 i wouldn't say it's refusal to learn but like not really accustomed to learning via video games. Those of us that have been gaming our entire lives, we are use to having to learn mechanics, moves, conditions, etc. We know what to look for it's obvious for us.
@@lordblazer You actually have a really good point hahahaha. I saw it as like, hey why don't you take your time and try to understand how things work? But yep, maybe some people just do not perceive things this way
About the dungeon ruin doors- it's not that her character couldn't break doors, it's just that those two doors are one of the very few doors that cannot be broken. In general doors that lead to other sections via loading screens are not breakable due to system implementations.
As much as I understand that, there are doorways which could be used to load sections. If they wanted to, they could add a very basic background on the other side which would lead into the section if people wanted to break it open.
in my second playthrough as a bard, I dumped a ton of skill points into dex and sleight of hand and somehow managed to roll a 25 on that lockpicking check. Shadowheart was like "you won't be able to get through there" and I was just like "all done!" 🤣
@@K.C-2049 A game telling you that you *can't* do something is such good motivation. Of course it's nice if the game still lets you do it, rather than just going 'lol nope' even if you've filled the success conditions just because they thought no-one would or could do it (looking at you, first boss fight in Ghost of Tsushima).
I think the key is making it clear to the player whether something is or isn't possible. Like are you pointlessly throwing yourself at an obstacle that isn't meant to be overcome OR have you just not found the right solution and need to keep trying. While you (and I'm sure many others) understand how it works, for a new player learning "you can't break doors - I tried everything" when actually they just couldn't break *that* door makes this an example of accidentally teaching the wrong lesson..
1.) It was ironic when you said it's a shame there's no tutorial mode where players play a few combats as origin characters before making a custom character, when players literally have the option to choose origin characters. My GF was super interested in BG3 but generally hates video game RPGs of any kind. She jumped right in with an origin character and learned by doing. After a few hours, she went back and started a 2nd parallel playthrough with her own custom character. 2.) On a related note, it's sad to me how many TTRPG players insist that all new players simply must suffer through a tedious 1-3 hours experience of putting a custom character together before they even understand the implications of all the choices they're making during character creation. When a pre-gen character would let players get in there and learn by doing. Like seriously, let them learn and a few hours later, they'll be chomping at the bit to make their own character.
That's literally how my boyfriend reacted to this part of the video. "Why not just make a random character to test out if she likes the playstyle?" Plus it's not like you have to spend $2 to make a new save, the main menu is right there lol.
point 2 sounds dumb, didn't dnd and most ttrpgs start from the idea of modules which also included pre-made characters SPECIFICALLY so new players could get their bearing s without feeling bad if they failed to the point of losing the character?
I hope you realize starting the game as an origin character in no way works as a "gameplay tutorial" before making a tav. I'm sorry you struggle with this idea lol.
// "....didn't dnd and most ttrpgs start from the idea of modules which also included pre-made characters SPECIFICALLY so new players could get their bearing...." Common culture in TTRPG space is often dismissive of pre-made characters. Frequently, DMs & experienced players assume that learning the mechanics of games like D&D requires new players to suffer through the 2-3 hour process of making a custom character from scratch, before they really understand the implications of all the choices they are making. I wouldn't say that's "dumb." It's sad and human to be so self-absorbed in one's own preferences that one overlooks what might be better for others. // "I hope you realize starting the game as an origin character in no way works as a gameplay tutorial" I literally say *"you (Razbuten) said it's a shame there's no tutorial mode."* So if you have an issue with that phrasing about "gameplay tutorial," take it up with Razbuten, genius. And I will have to assume you fail to realize that origin characters = premade characters. Or that you and 4 other people can't read. Good talk.
@@FeebleAntelope "sounds dumb =/= is dumb" but you're right, it's more sad than dumb...
5:40 "One gets their magic from studying and practice, one is born with it and it comes from their bloodline, and the other gets their magic by making a deal with some kind of powerful being"
She clearly doesn't care about the lore difference, only what it changes gameplay wise.
@@xidroke6982 I feel like she actually cared about the gameplay differences even less, but he said he found it difficult to explain the differences in simple terms, what I said are the differences explained in simple terms. If you insist on being pedantic though, "one gets less spells but they recharge more often, the other 2 get more spells but you don't get them back as often." better?
She threw the smokepowder satchel atop a firewine barrel, so she probably got hit with both. Didn't realize exactly how much D&D got me through a) the character creator, b) the nonspecific and ever-moving target of the tadpools, c) dealing with the party characters. (I kinda shrugged when Astarion held us at knifepoint, because *of course* the emo rogue was going to try to stab us before becoming best friends. It's just how angsty rogues say 'hello'...) I wonder what her playthrough would've been like if she'd found Karlach...
I was gonna say this, its also an explosive which wont lay exactly where you want it to since it expands depending on the environment
I know at least parts of that floor are also covered in grease.
I got that it's typical dnd stuff but it annoyed me and made me think in character i should really kill him. Got his comeuppance when i pimped him out for 2 str.
I believe the "pick something that looks cool" strategy is a great option for a game where you have zero clue what any of the character creation options mean. I've done that, and then changed or restarted when i felt i knew what I'd actually want
The door thing leading to your partner being disappointed that her character was ineffectual at that sort of thing is an interesting point. Since DnD is a game meant to be played with a party, characters tend to have strengths and weaknesses, and when something is a weakness, they aren't just soso at it, or kinda bad, often, they just can't do it. I think this encourages teamwork and thinking about what the party can do when faced with a situation, not just a single character, but for a gamer just getting to grips with one character, I can see how those types of hard fails can be disappointing😅
It's funny that she listens to the game. For me, if someone in a game tells me not to do something, I will find every possible way to do that thing.
This is me and my wife's favorite video series! It does make her feel better about her gaming skills which have improved exponentially over the 6 years we've been together. She started out with Lego Indiana Jones, and now she has conquered the Witcher 3! Now we're about to have our first child and I can't wait to help them with their own journey!
Congrats to both of you! I'm sure that'll be a certified god gamer in the making :)
My wife underwent a similar journey! I just got Hogwarts Legacy for her and she is having a blast. My six year old is also obsessed with Tunic and almost singlehandedly solved one of the hardest puzzles in the game. Gaming isn't a huge part of our life as it kind of takes a backseat to raising tiny humans, but it is a joy to share in the hobby as a family.
Lego Indiana Jones is one hell of a way to get into gaming
My husband and I (both gamers and D&D players) started our daughter on LEGO Star Wars a year ago, right now she's an avid fan of Minecraft and Dragon Quest: Builders 2, acts as her dad's cheerleader when he plays PS4, and we've started running D&D games for her too. It's great. You'll have a blast - congratulations to you both!
On the note of overwhelming character creation stuff, i found that the game "vampires the masquerade: bloodlines" did a really interesting thing for new, inexperienced players by instead of forcing them through the crunch of the full stat creation, giving them a personality quiz of sorts to help them make a character to their liking, though still with the option to change the stats if they decided differently
yeah, Mount and Blade does the same, as well as others. You can also always just offer it as an option
Ooh, that's a really cool approach, I'd definitely be into that!
There are tons of these online for 5e character creation, so would have been pretty straightforward to add it as an option. I think the ultimate reason they didn't was because they knew that the vast majority of people who played BG3 would have some level of familiarity with either 5e or RPGs in general. Not that that's a good excuse, mind you.
Same with various Elder Scrolls games. It's a pretty interesting option to have and I do wish more games would have it, if only because it's fun to have the designers and writers come together for this little initial peak into the game's world, writing and general tone. Merely reading a lot of the questions and options in the Bloodlines or Daggerfall quizes can give you a good first look at what these universes are gonna be about, from studying under a sword-master and helping your mother with cooking to confronting your drunk ex-roomate in a dingy bar and choosing what B-movie tier late TV program to watch.
@@thosebloodybadgers8499yeah except unfortunately, those quizzes in early Elder Scrolls games usually give pretty awful suggestions like "Bard" and "Acrobat" which are mediocre at everything and good at nothing, because a lot times the sum of the answers ends up being somewhere in the middle for someone who isn't familiar with common fantasy archetypes or tropes. Say what you will about Skyrim, but I think the way Skyrim encourages you to lean into a playstyle is great for new players. It is, of course, understandably infuriating for fans of more "prep and numbers" style RPG games like ES II-IV.
22:10 plus there's the whole thing of "the protagonist is me!" and trying to find enough voice actors or versatile enough voice actors to not only say all the lines, but to do so with enough voices to be satisfying. Keep in mind that you criticized them earlier for having preset faces instead of sliders. The same issue would happen.
Love this series ! Not a surprise that she didn't take to BG3. cRPG are one the most nerdy genre (behind only grand strategy and management sims I think), D&D (forgotten realms) is a very fantasy-heavy setting and BG3 even more, starting with illithids and half-demons everywhere.
29:45 she was standing in adjacent flammable material. So even though she was outside of the range it shows when throwing the item, it ignited the surrounding area
Yeah. It's weird that he misunderstood that. From the way he spoke in the videos, he's supposed to be familiar with DOS 2 and BG3. 🤨
@@9308323 whats your problem
waking up and having no clue what to do is kind of lore accurate
Wizard: Studies magic Sorcerer: Inherits magic through bloodline Warlock: Is given magic by a powerful entity There you go.
I had to pause the video and just say this....I love that you laughed and said that IS as good a reason as any to pick in a case like this. All the classes offer something different and fun and she has no preset biases the way you or I do from our years of playing games and knowing our favorite archetypes. My mom once picked her choices for the winners of football games by who's color scheme she liked better. At the end of the season, she had a better win/loss than my stepdad and brother who were stats/sports nerds.
Overwhelming character creation is that when introducing a new player to TTRPGs, I always just ask them to do "whatever you think is cool". On request I sit down with them and walk through the character creation together and maybe point out some synergies or bad choices. I also have a house rule that while figuring things out, any change goes so that players don't overthink.
Perhaps something like Persona would be a good fit for the lady you live with. It's a linear story, however it offers several options to increase your "power" meaning it might be the best of both worlds. And while it does have some fantasy elements, they are explained through the story pretty early on and generally are added onto a more grounded, realistic setting. Plus, it's turn-based, but still has those adrenaline moments where you find the enemies' weakness at the exact right time.
I love how thoughtful your reflections are! Got me on board with this channel!
I propose that you do an inverse of this concept! Raz should do one of his wife's hobbies but as a newbie! IDK what his wife is into but it could be fun for a video!
Like crochet or clay sculpting 😂
They already did with baking awhile ago.
@@MrWhygodwhy That just makes me think of whenever Jon from Many A True Nerd attempts baking on his channel, and his poor, exasperated (and French!) lady must bear the indignity...
I love your wife calling you a nerd, and your quippy comeback. Y'all are adorable.
He broed her back, so they are equal^^
Honestly she sounds trouble. She must not be easy to live with.
@@lastructchure389ragebait much
@@MazTheMeh16 not sure how it's ragebait when every clip of her talking is her complaining about something in the game haha
@@yveltalsea I mean, her complaining about struggling with the game is understandable, considering it's not something she's used to. But she still tried anyway. Its fair enough for you to point it out though. The way the other person phrased their comment, that her reactions or whatever means living with her is probably troublesome.. feels like a strange leap to make. It gives the vibe of 'this woman is voicing her opinion too much/talking back too much, she must be soo annoying, she should know her place 🙄' I'd like to hope this isn't how they meant it but I have little faith 😅
just wanted to say that, as a master's student just getting into qualitative research, these videos have been an incredible demonstration of how to conduct observational research, analyze/interpret/make sense of findings, practice reflexivity and flexibility to modify research methods, and generate insights that have implications on game design. I never thought about your videos in such a way until I had to conduct qualitative research of my own; I'm not sure if you ever thought of your work in that light too. But I think it's cool to make that connection and see qualitative research + analysis practiced in a "non-traditional" way. Keep it up
I definitely disagree, a lot of his "findings" was just him coming to conclusions for the constant complaints she had. He over analyzed a lot of parts but failed to recognize the most important thing, her disinterest with the game itself. It's very obvious that she wasn't enjoying the entire process from the beginning, but was pushing through for the video.
The lady's experience with the game is how I imagined the game would be received by most people, I'm still amazed it got the reception it did.
Me being the lady, a gamer and a huge DnD nerd was so extremely excited for the lord I live with (slso a gamer) to be introduced to my biggest hobby. And he was happy to have a walking manual right next to him. We took 2 hours creating a character because he wanted to understand all the mechanics. 😄🥰
this is so sweet
You calling your husband/boyfriend "lord" awakened something in me.
Regarding 21:52: There is another big reason as to why having spoken voice lines during conversations for the protagonist could have been cut, because originally origin characters did actually have voiced lines while playing them during dialoge scenes. That reason is projectability. Fallout 4 is a great example. There is often a huge disconnect between what the player is doing and how the MC sounds in that game, especially regarding the search for his son. BG3 avoids that problem, but in return asks you to fill in how you would envision saying it. It requires more from the player for a potential bigger payoff, because I can was better project myself into the world, thanks to stuff like the protagonist not being voiced. That character is my vessel so I project onto it how I would react as that character.
Cyberpunk did a great job I feel like. MC speaks but doesn't break the immersion. I personally would have prefered a voiced MC in BG3
@@MrKylljoyi loved 2077 but i hard disagree lol. V is not your character, they are a person you step into the shoes of... kinda like geralt. like idk V doesn't feel like my character i've always done fem v but she's not my creation. dnd is usually your character. Like you even have premade backstories in 2077. You are a blank slate in bg3 and that's a good thing. if my dugre and my goodie two shoes ranger had the same va i'd be a little miffed ngl.
@@MrKylljoy essentially with RPGs there's two routes, the blank slate or the preexisting character. The blank slate allows the players to decide who their characters are, whereas the preexisting character is a fully realized character that the audience can emphasize with. There's a trade-off and Voicing leans a character more towards the preexisting character side, which isn't what BG3 was going for.
Fallout 4's dialogue option are awful because it just says "sarcastic" or another 1 to 3 word explanation of what you're about to say. And when you do pick the option your character blurts out a whole sentence which might be vastly different to what you were imagining. Bg3 doesn't really have this problem since the whole sentence is just right there.
@@MrKylljoyTo me it's simple; Either we get at best Mass Effect 2, that lets you roleplay in a very limited capacity but you get to hear a great performance, or you can have Fallout New Vegas, with so many dialogue options that roleplaying is inevitable. For an RPG, I think the second option is the best approach.
7:11 is such a funny and charming exchange, thanks for including it!
Love seeing MCDM books in your collection. Currently playing the Beastheart, and it is my favorite class.
It's funny, being accustomed to CRPGs / RTSs / TRPGs, I would never have imagined someone struggling, or rather preferring not to have to play their companions. But now that I see this video, it seems obvious to me. Especially since, as you said, the game knows very well how to do it, since it often plays allied NPCs. Moreover, they sometimes perform incredible actions, I remember during my first run discovering the game, having a character down in an AoE, without healing and without potions, and if I used 'Help,' he would fall again. The NPC used 'Shove' to get him out, and I felt stupid aha.
the first time I watched an enemy use shove to wake up his companion from a sleep spell I was like :O
You could adventure solo. Even if the game could control the companions, i feel like some of the finer set up actions would be lost, like using someone elses heroism to help set up your attack.
I'm going to play baldur's with my girl who isn't a gamer and I was thinking on going coop explorer difficulty and only 2 characters to not confuse her with us controlling 2 characters each, would you think it's good or should we go with 4 and let computer control others?
@@vilmiswow That's exactly what we were discussing, it's impossible to have companions led by AI. However, I think we lose a lot by not having background characters. Whether it's for the story or for the connections with them. I think I would try playing each one 2, and if it bothers her that you play 3, something like that.
@@vilmiswowthere are mods that enable AI control (there’s probably also mods to buff up origin characters so that you can play on a normal difficulty as a party of 2 too).
Liking having a clear task with freedom over the way a task can be done... Sounds like you should have her try out some Immersive Sim games.
let's see prey
This is coming from someone who has played consoles their entire life and loves controllers: I think mouse and keyboard is the way to go for BG3, even if it takes some getting used to. Edit: IMO it's pretty clear the devs had some other plans that didn't come to fruition. Rope for climbing, surgery kit, etc. In my first run I had so much rope before I finally accepted it was useless.
such a sham you cannot use ropes ieven in areas where you normally wouldn't be climbing on a cliffface but just from a platform( the area near the elevator in the druid grove is a good point, also many spots in the goblin camp)
They should have done it how Pillars of Eternity did, in which you collected tools and various odd items and then had prompts (sorta like Choose Your Own Adventure books) which gave you vast ways to do things like climb a wall or cliff or something and had different options that included the tools. I would have loved that to be in BG3.
Hard disagree on only mouse and keyboard being viable. The controller implementation is absolutely great and way less overwhelming while still giving the same amount of control even if you have to navigate through a few radial menus. I am in my second playthrough (hard custom mode) and haven't had a single problem playing with controller. It's honestly so nice and comfy to be able to play without having to sit right in front of your screen :)
This series is so excellent. You do a wonderful job of paying attention to your wife and communicating her experience accurately. I really enjoy how you explain all the things gamers (and myself) take for granted about the unwritten rules and expectations of a video game. I think this sort of journalism has been tried before, but I feel that it usually it takes a mildly more hostile approach. The 'new player' typically has their faults highlighted and is usually scorned or ridiculed for their inexperience. The 'new' players lack of enjoyment is often painted as their own fault, never acknowledging potential flaws in the way video game media is presented. You communicate the experience of a new player much more empathetically than anyone else has done before, and you have provided deeper insight and context for the rest of us to understand the positions and expectations of outsiders to this hobby.
I find it annoying when somebody doesn't immediately understand why something is the way it is, they just say "that's stupid".
Stupid is perspective. I find it annoying when people get offended that someone doesn't find things they enjoy appealing to others
@@kylespevak6781 It's not about whether they enjoy it or not, you can not enjoy something while realizing that just because you don't enjoy or understand it, that doesn't make it stupid.
Yeah I agree. A big problem with introducing people to games is that people, in general, are incredibly short sighted and self centered, and if they don't understand something immediately, they assume it's either bad or impossible. Think about how so many people have relatives that absolutely cannot check their own emails, or how in the 90s it was stereotypical for older people to refuse to understand how their VCR worked. Humans, as a species, generally do not WANT to learn new things, and so when presented with a situation that requires learning, if they can leave, they will. It is PHENOMENALLY frustrating. I am a curious woman by nature; I like to learn new things and ask why things work the way they do. And almost everyone I have ever met is frustratingly incurious.
@@kylespevak6781 Also I'm not meaning to imply it's a dig on her character or anything like that, she's done nothing wrong. I just find it annoying.
That's 80% of the human population, encounter something you don't understand and rip it apart. Shit on it, spout disgust and be as dismissive of it and it's fans as much as possible.
As fun as this series is, it’s kinda become clear that more than an inexperienced player, the Lady You Live With is an uninterested player. So many of her recurring struggles in these experiments seem to come from being incurious or unengaged by the media she is being asked to sit through. A new player who actually wants to be here and engage with the game is far more likely to push all the buttons and be self motivated to learn and explore, because they’re were self-motivated enough to pick up a game themselves. I want more games to be more accessible to new players, but I don’t think the solution to that is going to be the same as making them more accessible to people who do not want to play them in the first place. I hope this doesn’t come off as insulting anyone involved, just something I’ve observed as this series goes on.
Pretty much. I know a chick who literally got a desktop computer (she isn't a gamer and only had a shitty laptop) to play BG3 after stumbling across it on KZhead and after listening to me gush over it for one too many times. She loves the game and even wants to join my DnD group for our next single session campaign.
I had some trouble putting my finger on it, but that's exactly it. Not understanding a game's mechanics and limits is completely understandable, but there's something extremely frustrating about someone just refusing to engage with what the game is presenting them.
The lady Raz lives with seems to wants to play games to engage in his interests, not here own. Which there isn't anything wrong with that, I actually find it quite endearing that she wants to be a part of his world, but I think this series should either have an episode where they actively search for a game that would suit her best, instead of analyzing how a game might play out for her, or look for a different approach entirely...
Hope you don't think I'm rude either, but this take is kinda elitest. Inexperienced players don't want to engage with a game that refuses to help them, even when they really really want to play the game. It's frustrating and painful to be wanting to like this game because everyone says it's so good and you think you'll get something out of it, only to find it doesn't _want_ you to play it. You spend hours trying to get used to everything, which is slow and frustrating and painful, and no matter what you do you can't enjoy the game because it's constantly punishing you, overwhelming you, and it's _not fun_. Pushing every button doesn't work because even if one does something, you don't know what. Exploring and trying to put in effort to learn what the buttons do doesn't actually teach you anything. I agree that games don't need to be accessible to people who don't want to play them, but that's not a thing! People who don't want to play the game but stick through for multiple hours are EXACTLY the people who wanted to play but can't understand anything. They aren't playing because they want to hate the game (usually, and that type is just in bad faith so ignore them), if they're really playing through against their will but lasting that long it means they're doing it for a reason, and probably would LIKE to enjoy the game, because they're spending so long on it. Why is it their fault that the game doesn't let them enjoy it, regardless of the reason they started playing? You're just saying you don't want games accessible to people who aren't willing to put in the hours reading wikis. You've created an argument for yourself so when anyone dislikes a game because it was confusing and overwhelming, you tell them that it was only because they weren't willing to learn. That they didn't _want_ it enough. I really like Warframe. My friends really want to play Warframe with me. They find it confusing and overwhelming and things aren't explained at all. I'm not going to blame them for that, the intro is ass! It sucked to play! You need a mentor to get anywhere! I stuck through it because I'm STUBBORN. Not because I was any more interested in the game. It's not fair that my friends don't get to enjoy this game, just because you think they didn't try hard enough.
If anything Raz' Lady has already found her game. Watch the Minecraft episode. That's the only episode i can feel a genuine excitement from her with the game.
The more I watch these and the more I reflect on my own past, the more I think old generation of gamers teaching new generation how to play is very important of gaming culture.
Love the edits with the music in the intro!
About 13 minutes in and you mentioned about her passing by Shadowheart, that isn't a problem like you pose it to be. Shadowheart will almost always survive the nautilioid. There's just unique dialogue regarding whether or not you decided to help her(and a little affinity boost if you did). That's the beauty of BG3 for me, you *could* play the game like a checklist but oftentimes even missing content is making you explore new content.
Even though I suggested it, In hindsight Bg3 isn't very beginner friendly so it probably wasn't a great suggestion. Also it kind of makes sense that a game with so many options, just makes the few things you can't do, that much more frustrating.
I disagree i think it was very beginner friendly for me, but i have a rooted interest in fantasy media so I’m going to put more effort into reading the guiding text
@@shelbypbj I think compared to real D&D it's super beginner friendly, but compared to a lot of Video games there is a lot of terms to learn, and very little in terms of tutorials. Don't get me wrong it's my favorite game of all time, but at least a tutorial with some examples would be nice. Like maybe a little arrow pointing to different parts of the UI like where it says if it's an action or bonus action when they're first explained.
@@shelbypbj it's beginner friendly if you've already invested itself but even compared to Larian's own RPG system used in DOS, D&D is quite a huge ask for a beginner, with all the concessions included. Like, it's just not that intuitive to have this one character class apparently be specced into dexterity but then their weapon doesn't hit and deals no damage if it does? Well, I guess I'll either use the bow or get a lot of strength. Oh, except that doesn't apply to certain weapons and they use dexterity instead of strength when you take a certain feat. So, apparently this class used wisdom for casting spells while this one uses charisma and this one uses intelligence? What's the difference? Why do wizards even need high constitution, apparently? A wizard isn't a marathon runner, is he? What's "concentration"? You very much have to meet the game at its level and learn the rules, "winging it" will likely not take you far. That's very much a critique of tabletop RPGs in general - they're sometimes too complex for their own good. Except they're also sometimes too shallow for their own good. Kinda like when 5th ed brought a lot of newcomers but when these people got acquainted and very much familiar with the system, they found it lacking in comparison to even the previous editions and other alternatives, which went for more depth and complexity at the cost of further alienating newcomers. Balancing act and all that.
She might like Dragon's Dogma's pawn system. Which lets you make one npc in your party, and you recruit two more. Controlling none of them except for giving simple orders. You learn to rely on them, and they learn from your behavior.
The Lady You Live With has a main character syndrom xD
Slowly watching it through. Just wanted to say that in regards to faces its because every face was 3D captured by larian to provide the best support for how voicelines should be delivered with what facial expressions, which they did started doing way back in divinity dragon commander, its a big reason why the cutscenes looks so amazing and "realistic" as from what i understand almost everything was recorded with facial trackers on. It does lead to the case of not having a ton of facial customization, and its pretty obvious that gnomes to dwarves to elves all have the same preset face to work around.
The faces aren't motion captured. They're hand animated. Only the bodies are mocap. BG3 could have made full customization available... hence why there are a f*ckton of head mods and the animations work just fine with them. The reason the devs gave for not having sliders is that if they are available players tend to make very similar looking faces and they wanted all npcs (including Tav/Durge) to look unique.
@@DM-nw5lu You are right about it not being motion captured animations, the bodies are motion captured for most of the npcs and characters in the game, and the face is 3d scanned into the game. but you are completely wrong about the reason. It was in community update #8 they talked about it that they used facial scans to provide more "realistic" features. "Our character creation features photorealistic fantasy races, based on 3D scans of actors and models (blemishes and all), selected because their features roughly resembled the direction for each race in the game, as well of course for diversity and variety in the human-like races. Our team spent much of pre-production carefully selecting, scanning, and moulding these scans, to become the base heads for character creation. [snip] We decided to use scanned faces in our production to create characters that were as realistic as possible. We scanned 40 people of different ages and ethnicity. While scouting for models we focused on features that would fit our fantasy races and we looked for faces that either had something unique about them or were very versatile to fit different characters." So you are correct, i mixed the two of them together, as i was thinking of the video from 2012 on larian studios youtube called "dragon command motion capture try-outs" Alongside the gif of community update 8 in the "camera dome"
@@zoulsgaming9455 To quote an 80 level article here from July 2023: "She then added that in her experience most fine-tuned characters that players spend hours making look very similar in the end. "So we wanted to avoid that. And if we would make sliders, we needed to make it into something that would be truly unique and wouldn’t look the same."" She being Alena Dubrovina, BG3's lead character artist. They 3D scanned the faces to make them more realistic.. it had nothing to do with the animation. That was my point. They could have easily added sliders but decided against it because they wanted Tav to look unique and not like generic hot person No. 5219.
@@DM-nw5luThat seems like an extremely dumb reason. They wanted characters to look unique so all of them get about 6 face options and 4 body options? You can just achieve the same thing with presets and still have sliders.
@@tortoiseoflegends4466 did you play the game? just curious
They also want the dialogue to feel open to role play, she should have role played out something when selecting dialogue, like eat dirt gobos to intimidate them, she says something cool irl and the game plays off it, even if she fails the game vibe would play off the goblins responding
Great video - so glad to see a fellow first-time gamer who also got stuck on doing the "logical" things and expected more from the world's topography (her strategies to try and open doors were brilliant, by the way!). It was also validating that even you as a gamer found the MC never vocalizing to be a tad distancing. It was the first thing I noticed when my partner introduced me to the game.
ive gotta say they way yall communicate how she feels during the games is amazing. really gives perspective. I like to teach people games ive enjoyed for hundreds of hours, and i love find that "ah-hah" moment where it all clicks.
It sounds like a great deal of your wife's problem with her approach to playing video games is that she is in a hurry to accomplish the task and get it over with. These games are art pieces meant to be enjoyed. If she is not taking the time to appreciate and enjoy them and their experiences as she experiments and explores what they have to offer then she's going to have a bad time. Yes, the game gives you some objectives and that can be helpful to get you going. But if you focus like a laser on objective X (finding Haslan) and don't care to do anything else, then you're not really taking part in the experience as it was designed to be played. If it feels like work, you just want to get it done and out of the way, then you're setting yourself up for lackluster enjoyment at best.
Well said, people who play RPG games like it's some kind of checklist simulator are NOT going to be having any meaningful enjoyment in a game that is designed to be played a slowly.
Who in the world is Haslan? 😂
You're right. Most people play games due to some spark of interest, and unfortunately she was playing because she was asked to, so it was by nature a task. She was looking to complete that task. I am always happy when more people are able to get into games but if there is no intrinsic motivation or interest then there's not much chance it will be enjoyable for them.
@@9308323Halsin when he wildshapes into a lion
And of course that isn't the only solution to this "quest". It totally misses the sidequest of Kaga's deceptions. Or siding with Minthara. or siding with Minthara and then betraying her at the gate. There's a lot to experience.
I think the best way to make character creation fun is looking at it from a roleplaying perspective. Do you want to shoot lightning bolts, use a one handed weapon with no shield and be really good at insight? You can do that without worrying if it is "good" or not. Many people worry so much about minmaxing and here I am having a Fighter wood elf who dual wields daggers and uses no armor because I rp as a blood fury from heroes of might and magic 5.
why fighter and not barbarian? (genuine as i didn't play might&magic)
@@iota-09 They are all about athletics, hitting hard without being counterattacked. They are also very fast so I figured champion fits them the most. I tried 1 level of barb but the combat suffers immensly in the midgame. Good intimidation checks though.
I love this series so much. Shoutout to your wife for being so patient and such a good sport with these incredibly complicated games
i love this series so much!! thanks for another great vid raz :)
A lot of her issues seem to stem from her impatience to experiment and learn what the game is telling her. Yes games can be ambiguous but at the same time you arent meant to just fly through every part of the game. Her getting discoraged from talking to NPCs is a good example, yes not all NPCs are useful but at the same time they help to build a more full world as not everyone is linked to a main objective. Taking your time in games is very important and not being able to do that will hinder someones ability to connect to the game. Also when a character tells her something especially in game like BG3 she should have been told that not everyone is acting in her best interest, a character saying something isnt the same as a prompt in the game telling you something. Which for a new gamer i can understand, i guess but at the same time not every game can be holding everyone hand as if its their first ever experience in the genre. Overall this is an amazing series and i admire both of you for doing it, but at times i feel as if things could go a bit smoother if you helped to fill in the assumed blanks for her when the game doesnt expicitly spell it out for her.
I feel like she is playing worse then a game journalist, she did 0 actual exploration in a game basically about exploration. I wonder if she was playing the game on her own if she would just refund it the first 20 minutes...
@@DinantZSomeone who doesn't play video games plays worse than someone whose job it is to play videogames? What a shock!
@@jemandetwas1 You haven't been online long enough to hear what the people think about the skills of a game journalists?
@@DinantZ I know what people *think* of the skills of game journalists. Even though all those thoughts are based on one guy being bad at Cuphead, one guy being bad at Doom Eternal and one guy being bad at Sekiro. It's a stupid thing to be mad about considering just how much real issues plague gaming journalism
I wonder if choosing an Origin character would have helped with the info-overload of character creation and also with having a clearer direction of what to do. For my first playthroughs of both Baldur’s Gate 3 and Divinity Orginal Sin 2, I chose an Origin character because I wasn’t familiar enough with the world and story to know what place I wanted my own character to have in it. So I found that picking one to play as worked really well because the game was able to tell me my general goals and motivations in situations where I wasn’t 100% sure how to act. And in BG3 of course their classes are locked when you select them so you don’t have as many options at the beginning to understand.
I totally forgot you do this videos! I happen to be starting a research regarding video game design that ends up being entry barriers for inexperienced players, or game-alliterate users; so your videos provide interesting insight in that regard. Thanks a lot!
I love each of the videos in this series, they've been such an interesting insight into how some people can view games. Also love those MCDM books on your shelf at the end :)
13:26 "Then don't. It's fine!" The way you said that made me laugh so much. I sat through an entire playthrough of Elden Ring with my friend who hasn't played too many games before, and I really felt like that was so relatable haha.
6:30 I think the best way to help someone new find what class to play is to figure out what character fantasy they want to fulfill. If they've consumed a lot of fantasy media, that can certainly help ("I want to be like Legolas" = elf fighter with a bow), but asking what sort of playstyle they want in a sort of flowchart manner really helps. Do you want to focus on using magic, using weapons, or a mix of both? If magic, do you want someone who has a wide variety of spells like a big toolbox (Wizard, Bard) or a small amount of spells, but can vary their usage (Sorc)? If focusing on weapons, do you want someone who is an expert with all weapons but has fewer talents outside of combat (fighter), someone who uses fewer weapons but can also has special abilities when they hit people (monk), etc. I DM'd a D&D 5e one-shot with my parents and this was how I helped them build a character. For BG3, where racial stat bonuses aren't a thing, I'd honestly tell a new player to 100% ignore racial differences and focus entirely on the aesthetics of what race they want to play. Similarly, few classes get their sub-class at level 1 (only Sorc, iirc), so it's kinda not worth it to even bring it up, unless its integral to developing the character.
actually bg3 does have ratial bonuses, with some classes actually having fairly substantial ones like drows and elves in general giving access to spells later, nevermind things like darkvision, weapon proficiencies, skill profiiencies etc, the only real missing bonus is stat bonus, but i actually kinda prefer that.
@@iota-09 I specifically said “racial stat bonuses,” since you can use the +2/+1 however you want, regardless of race. Outside of that, I agree that there are racial bonuses, but their effects on the game are minimal enough that I wouldn’t include them if I was worried about overwhelming someone with info. Most of the game is lit well enough that dark vision doesn’t matter, and the spells you get typically aren’t very impactful. Weapon proficiencies also barely matter, since you’re going to get whatever proficiencies you need from your class, tbh
Thanks for a really stellar video as always, Raz! :D
Great video, as always! And congratulations on your second child!
oh hell yes
we all love a razbuten upload
I love these types of videos, its great seeing people open up to things they haven't tried much or at all before. One game she may like for a more casual and a little silly experience may be miitopia for the switch. Either way I wish you both all the best!
I can't stress enough how this is a really good video, editing quality, audio, narrative Really fun
A lot of issues you brought up is due to unclear expectations, baldur's gate is an enjoyable experience if you just go with the flow and just look at what the game has to offer, the goblins don't have much informations about Halsin, but they are pretty funny, if you are not adamant about finding Halsin, same for the cure
A lot of her complaints are that she cannot do X thing, which is something we all probably wish could do in a videogame, but isn't a realistic expectation and it is directly affecting how much she enjoys a game.
@@Omen_aMeh. I think she actually raised a great point here. The Tav should be trying to ask any and everyone about Halsin at this point in the game. It’s bizarre that the option doesn’t exist, even if most of the responses wouldn’t be fruitful.
honestly her problems are why i don’t like playing rpg games. i like role-playing, but these games always create a barrier between the player and the character. if the point is to have lots of options but there are none for me, what’s the point?
I always assume that my character DOES ask about stuff like that, but that those npc's don't have anything to tell me about it. Maybe they're all just tight-lipped because they've been forced to be by the brand, who knows. But it would be even more boring and time consuming to have a text option for EVERY npc that says "Do you know Halsin?" and every single one of them simply replies grumpily: "No idea."
@@chesspiece4257you probably have weird expectations, I guess. Lol. Op made the best point he could, if you don't expect the game to let you do whatever YOU want, and instead expect the game to allow you to do whatever IT wants you to do, then you'll enjoy yourself more easily.
Nice vid ! As someone who's been playing on tactician with a mod that has the AI control your companions, I'd love to share a bit about that experience, though I'm only midway through act 2, but don't worry I wont spoil anything. (mods in use are "AI Allies" and "Party Limit Begone") You get access to a bunch of cantrips that apply different archetypes to any character, "melee damage" or "ranged healer" etc. You can even cast them on the PC as well, and they only effect things during combat, outside of combat you have full control of everyone. I've noticed quite a few things about the AI, no matter what it's archetype the BG3 AI will heavily prioritize certain things, like burning through spell slots and abilities as fast as possible. Probably because the AI is designed for enemies the player should be fighting, so there's no reason for them to conserve resources. Another thing they prioritize is shoving their allies out of negative AOE's, regardless of the consequences. I learned this the hard way when Wyll tried to save Laezel from an AOE... by blasting her with a few repelling eldritch blasts. To his credit he got her out of that area that would have damaged her on her turn, and she was at like 5 health so he saved her life... by dealing 27 damage. Overall, I found myself yelling at my computer screen at least once per combat round. "Why would you do that ?!" etc. 10/10 would recommend. Protips if you want to try this; treat your party like the herd of sheep that they are, especially during level up. Don't give them tools that are too easy to waste or backfire like Haste, because Gale will cast it on you, then cast another concentration spell on something else making you lethargic. Oh and they like to trigger opportunity attacks from enemies like it's going out of style so, you've been warned. I can't wait to try this on honor mode. :D
So it actually sucks, but you decided to have fun with it. Like "any bad videogame". Interesting
@@tydendurler9574 nailed it. this tactician run is practice for an honor mode challenge run. I got hard stuck on a certain puzzle though, the FLT. Cheese doesn't work, and I can't do it legit, so I've shelved the game for now until I can figure out a method that's reliable enough for honor mode.
@@eugloopydilemma "shelved it for now"...like...any bad videogame. ;)
@@tydendurler9574 I actually agree with the sentiment going around that it's one of the greats, but that one puzzle is a huge flaw in my opinion, I'll absolutely pick it back up and keep enjoying it once I find a reliable solution for FLT on honor mode.
@@tydendurler9574 wait youre not joking, you actually hate BG3.... lol ok then
My husband has been trying to do the same thing with me as you with your wife, and BG3 hit the nail on the head. In the first 5 weekdays we played 24 hours, and it’s on my mind all the time now 😅
You should absolutely extend this series to include your D&D game - Always good to see someone play for the first time!
I can relate a lot to this video. My main interest in playing BG3 was I wanted to try D&D but I didn't have any friends. I first played BG3 a couple of years ago and I had no knowledge of tabletop or any of the mechanics. I was very overwhelmed for the first 30 hours and I would say only just started to grasp an understanding of the game after like 60 hours. Larian had a monumental task of implementing a tabletop game into a digital medium and making it digestible for the broad audience. Now that I have a few more hours under my belt my favorite aspect of BG3 would be player agency, I find it very enjoyable that there are many solutions to scenarios and it's super fun collecting exploding barrels (I keep that smoke powder satchel for special occasions) Thank you for the lovely video
Funny that you act like Divinity Original Sin 3 is the only way to play D&D alone via a videogame. Marketing is everything these days, guys.
What are you doing here? Don’t you have stuff to do with shadow cute?
@@tydendurler9574I don't think the arbitrary hostility is warranted here...
@@DanKaschel i don't think your pretentious white-knighting is warranted here...
@@tydendurler9574 you're confused. I'm not protecting them, I'm annoyed with you.
I'd like to see the Lady You Live With play an RPG that matches aesthetically with films and TV she's already interested in, rather than a realistic gritty style. Tone is a massive part of what makes or breaks an RPG for a player, and so far the ones you've shown are very samey. I'd also like to see something that frontloads character and story and holds off on game mechanics until the player is already invested. One of my first games was Chrono Trigger, and I'm so glad it was because I had no skill with a controller and zero understanding of game conventions. (I didn't start playing games till I was 17.) It's great because you're already invested in Crono, Lucca, and Marle long before you get into any combat with real consequence.
You may have already done this but Mass Effect might be up her alley especially the latter two. Character always talks and combat is quick and has the that pause feature and it’s not too overwhelming.
Idk because playing the first one is rough for someone who wasn't playing games like that when they first came out and also because the inventory control is trash and nonsense. I can't imagine how they would go. But if she did enjoy the first one then the rest of the series would be smooth sailing.
@@MarieMaia445 starting on two probably the safest. 1 is definitely a bit more complicated
I love these videos, and i've started to always check if you've got a video like this on a game before i buy it if i'm scared it's too hard or confusing for me. Thank you both for doing these!
dropping the difficulty down to explorer has really helped me get into the game as someone with a limited understanding of D&D but a fairly good handle on turn based games, fantasy character types, RP etc. etc. it really does take a minute to not only understand what all the spells, attacks, rolls, skills, and items do, but to remember that you have them at your disposal and utilize them in the appropriate situations. like I went through several big fights getting frustrated at concentration spells from enemies, only to repeatedly remember and then forget that I have arrows specifically designed to disrupt concentration spells I've been gathering in my inventory for hours of gameplay lol
Can relate to the "forgetting things in inventory") took me a while to start consistently using them. But I have successfully developed the opposite habit of "do I have something for this specific situation in inventory?" and I hoard all kinds of arrows religiously 😂 they exist for a reason) I feel like finishing the first playthrough and starting the second, I am hoarding less and spend things more often, because now I know more or less what to expect. I also now know which objects to buy/keep around and which I don't need as much.
@@katerynasirko1832 and keeping all of your characters prepared can be tricky too. no item hoarding with this game (though my Bard DOES tend to end up with an excessive amount of scrolls lol)
She picked the Dark Urge and you didn't even mention it before she kicked the squirrel?
I sincerely hope you wife feels so valid as a player, because she brings up SO many good points I'm not even cognizant of, whether they affect me as an experienced player or not. Thank you for always letting her be authentic, whether she's in love with a game or loathes it!
Even understanding the basics of party trinity (from other games) would be a huge advantage. Knowing that warriors and paladins will likely tank, clerics will likely heal etc, is a useful shortcut to understanding roles.
I think one of the best ways to describe the difference between the spellcasters is the difference between how and where they get that magic from. Warlocks get their magic from a higher being, Wizards have to study and read from a book, and Sorcerer's get their magic from birth with no need for any (purposeful) effort to be able to use it Hope this helps you in the future
Vibe is more powerful than lore to new people. Lore only starts to tickle most players after a while of engagement. Wanna be a nerd or have a bit of a high society feel? Pick wizard Wanna be a witch or like the idea of following a strong theme like fire or ice? Sorc Bad boys and bad girls you go for Warlock. I personally like lore and deep character exploration, but most players I find prefer personal expression, and that starts with visuals. Plus BG3 being a video game and not a DMed campaign, you can only RP so much anyway. The class restricted dialogues are neat little candies but you are never gonna meet your Warlock patron and be asked to do something you would never do like Wyll is.
Does magic come from: A - a book B - your soul C - satan Now all the game has to do is make that obvious, visually.
My brother who is an avid DnD player is starting to get annoyed by my baldurs gate 3 jokes when I haven't played a single second of the tabletop game. 😂
Tell him dont gate keep. Unless he wants to do a WISDOM CHECK. lol
its an introvert!
5:12 that is a genius idea! I think this could be interesting if they had something along the lines of a “class test drive” feature that gives you a mini tutorial fight to try say a level 5 version of whatever class your interested in, not only would that give newer players a basic rundown of the combat but also allow them to try out different classes and mechanics to see what they like and don’t like, what works for them and doesn’t, if they did the trial at level 5 as well (arguably the biggest power spike, also not such a big leap in the levels to the point it ruins the excitement of new abilities to try) it would give newer players an idea of how the classes would work later down the road and what they could expect from said classes in terms of movement, range, damage output, resistance and health
22:06 honestly I find a silent protagonist to be more immersive. It makes it feel like I just said it.
One thing that I am already noticing is the discrepancy between what a fledgling player knows and what someone with DnD knowledge knows. Like laezel telling you to not touch anything makes sense, if you know what a mindflayer and a githianky is. And I think larian did the right thing in leaning towards those with some base knowledge rather than putting in more explanations of stuff you either can infer or may already know. And it makes second playthroughs for new players so much better since they really benefit from the heap of new info the have.
I mean, I guess??? Like, I played BG1/2 and other RPGs because I had no D&D knowledge nor did I know anyone who played it. I got into these games and kinda learned from them and became knowledgeable of D&D just playing them despite never getting to try the tabletop edition until just recently. And surprisingly I learned pretty good D&D stuff from these games which included how bad Mindflayer and Gith stuff was; without having my hand held like this game kinda does unlike the other 2.
But laezel tells you that she is a gith with knowledge of the mindflayers as soon as you meet her. I had virtually zero knowledge of DnD when I picked up BG3, but I've played a ton of dragon age/DOS2. When laezel told me not to touch anything, my immediate reaction was to roll my eyes and explore everything anyway, because it's a video game, I wanted to gather information, and she'd already established herself as a deeply cautious person. The characters in an RPG don't usually speak for the devs, they just share their opinions as individuals. A new player taking everything the NPCs say as gospel from the devs is never going to fully enjoy an immersive RPG where your primary objective is to be curious and stick your nose in things. It seems like every issue this new player had with the game would have been resolved by investigating the fantasy world within the game, rather than trying exclusively to apply real world logic to it. Any game would be frustrating and not fun if you refused to suspend your disbelief a bit and meet it halfway.