BMW E31 850i "Glacier" - Complete Restoration - V12 Running Woes - Episode 11
2022 ж. 10 Қар.
23 070 Рет қаралды
In episode 11, I tackle a whole host of jobs, including the repair of the main speedo cluster, EML module, rebuild fuel pumps, replace oxygen senors, perform timing correction on the engine, replace the stem seals and more!
As the EML is not the original one, bad idle could result from unsynchronized banks. Please read the description on how to synchronise correctly: Synchronisation of banks of M70 engine cylinders The following information is important when replacing the Motronic control units or the EML control unit. Each control unit is programmed with certain basic values, which are only mean values. A control unit receives various input values depending on engine load conditions and compares them with the stored values. An adaptive system compares the input values with stored curve family values, after which corresponding orders are put out to the concerned control elements. If, for example, the EML control unit were without current for a long period of time (more than 1 hour), its adaptive system would lose the stored values. The adaptive system would have to read in and store the input values of a certain engine after restoring operation of an erased control unit or installing a new control unit. This procedure could lead to erratic idling of the engine after starting and disturbances in overrun. Consequently there must be conformance with the following procedures before an EML control unit is replaced or after restoring operation of a disconnected control unit. -run engine to operating temperature. install (new) control unit and drive car. During test drive have the car coast three times from speeds above 5000 RPM to the idling range in transmission range 1 (approx. 10 seconds). -Have engine run at idle speed in transmission range P or N at least 5 minutes! These measures serve immediate and precise synchronisation of both banks of cylinders in all operating conditions.
That's just heartbreaking to see that after you've done so much work on the car, tons of troubleshooting, and the car still doesn't run right. I am rooting for you and this car. I believe in your capable hands, you will sort everything out and I can't wait to see you driving this beautiful car. Love the long vids!
Ahhh.. top comment is a spoiler :-)
@@AndreiRebegea Oh shit I'm so sorry lol! That wasn't my intention
I swear when I saw Sreten wrenching on his 850i and it just went all so perfectly I was like, well, this is not how things would've went if it was me with my car. This example is definitely more fitting, everything going wrong even though everything is right lmao
@@henrik1743 Hahaha! You are right. I think he either gets lucky or just knows which car to buy and what to look out for. However I think Steve bought (in sreten's words) the turd of the highest proportions on purpose so he could sort everything out himself. Which, to be fair, he's already done for the most part.
Not rewarding at all, indeed
Please, I can't wait any longer. It is the third time that I see the complete series and the intrigue is killing me. I want to see the video, it's been 5 months and this is almost a pregnancy. I send you a hug from Argentina, the ass of the world.
YES STEVE! YOU'RE BACK!
What a real joy see you working back on the E31. Tks, this is a good day, missed it honestly.
Ask Shogun on bimmerforums to help you. He is truly the samurai warrior of the v12 engine
Sreten from M539 Restoration channel knows his ways with e31, good restoration bmw channel, either way i see you have done quit a bit of trouble shotting, just Keep walking! Nice color e31!
Was wondering when the e31 would resurface - glad to see it back and look forward to it’s renewed progress. Hope you have deep pockets Steve!!
Blimey Steve that's a kick in the teeth. Look, so many would have given up by now but you haven't and you'll get there in the end I'm sure of it. Good luck Steve 👍👍
FINALLY!! When I got the notification, I almost couldn't believe it
Brilliant video. You have the patience of Job. Love the E31 and best of luck with the trouble shooting - you’ll get there in the end.
Thrilled and delighted to see the 8 series back, just such an interesting project and wow what a journey! Good luck on the troubleshooting, can't wait to finally see the missing piece of the puzzle.
Great to see you working on Glacier again. Don’t feel bad about having to take down the M70 again to the valve covers to check timing. I did the very same thing with my E31 because the idle was off and like you replaced and rebuilt a ton of parts. Funny thing was my timing was good, I ended up replacing the valves seals since I was there….a very methodical process…almost relaxing. I found a small air leak from my throttle body shafts during smoke testing which I think is the cause of my car small idle issue. Definitely check your grounds, also the sequencing is important too, and calibrating the TBs with driving. Looking forward to seeing more of your excellent progress!
YES ! I HAVE SEEN ALL YOUR RESTORATION VIDEOS ! PURE JOY !
KZhead algorithm brought me here - SUBSCRIBED !!!!
So excited to see you back on Project Glacier!
Great Job Steve!
Been waiting for this for so long! Thank you so much for the upload, so excited!
Just found your channel... Brilliant content. Really love the e65... subbed and hello from Tipperary 😁
Was wondering where this went! Happy to see it
Super series, with lots of useful info that I can use for my project (BMW850Ci). Good luck with the restoration Steve.
It sounds very electrical - are you sure you have the correct plugs and HT leads - have you checked the resistance of both? If a bank shuts off without EML intervention then it will be the lack of a Cylinder Identification signal. More details here: kzhead.info/sun/laecpMmvjJ-Mg2g/bejne.html
Your smoke machine is brilliant! :D Good to have you back with E31
Nice to see ur back...fingers crossed with the resto:-)
Great idea on the computer power supply.
All your work will be worth it, the E31 is such an amazing, beautiful car! 🤩😍🤩
Hey Steve, in one of your last videos you swapped the left right fuel breather hose which connects to the throttle body. This will not prevent the engine from running, but could add to a rough idle. And great channel. You are doing an awesome job.
Anyone thinking of buying a classic should watch this. I have no doubt you will get there but it requires a mix of patience, skill and funds that few have. Most people would have given up by now. Really looking forward to the next update, best of luck.
Maybe reach out to m539, Streton over in Germany. He's got a lot of experience with these cars and that engine.
I feel your pain , but carry on regardless you will get there 💪
I had the exact same problem, bad idle, low power and running on 6 cylinders. I had refurbed the throttle bodies, but the lead tracks in one of them had a bad section. I put in a used throttle body and synced them and that fixed the issue.
Paitence of a saint
Have my E38 V12 sitting in the shed through the winter but not looking forward to the maintenance next spring. I’m not far from where you are either!
I have the exact car and have done just about all u are doing to it. Mine was doing the same thing and it ended up being the fuel pump and the fuel lines. After I flushed the lines and changed the pump all 12 started working. Good luck
Steve, i got grey hairs just watching... hope you get to the bottom of it soon. This has put me off those big cylinder BMs, ill stick to my E34 V8 for now. Great channel BTW...
Wow. No way would I have this level of patience considering the time and cost already invested. Respect! Looking forward to the next installment. Love the E31. New subscriber here 👍
kzhead.info/sun/pNOpcZeGmZR8aJE/bejne.html
Hi Steve with the car running pull the injector caps off 1 at a time note if the engine changes tone, its very likely that cylinder is ok, if it doesn't change pull the spark plug out for that offending cylinder see if it is wet. (or change it for a proven good one) there could be more than 1 not firing. hope it helps.
Have done this often, unfortunately because the misfires are so random and often slight, not much conclusion can be drawn from this test.
Hi Steve, I recognise your problems: my 850i is still often running on just 6 cylinders after 5 years (!) of trouble shooting (I did everything you did and more). Few remarks: 1) Why did you not use DIS to let the DME's tell you what's wrong, and monitor all kind of engine parameters? I keep on getting error 16 pointing in the direction of ignition problems like bad CID-signals. And finally just ordered crazy priced OEM sensors, hope this will solve it. 2) High compression but high leak test losses is weird, and can in my view only be caused by sticky hydraulic valve lash adjusters. I also noticed hissing at some intake valves during the leak test I did, valve covers were off after oil seal replacements. Compression was 12x good so I blamed the hydraulic adjusters and placed 24 new ones, easy and not that expensive.
Been wondering..... is Steve winning with the engine issue? Been ages sunce an update, and I have been watching the progress since inception. Would be a pity If the project has stalled permanently. I recall a famous line: It is always darkest before the dawn. Come.on Seve! Give it another whack!
Good luck
Hey, I don't know if it is a thing on BMWs from this era, but on Volkswagens of that age it is very important that ECM has good grounds AND stable power supply. On these things, if a ground or the ECM relay goes bad, it can cause all sorts of weird behaviors! I assume that the technology in these ECMs is probably very similar, so I would definitely check grounds and voltage!
Ah Steve, don't know why, but I have only just watched this excellent video all the way through. As many are saying, top marks for determination. Obviously, you have to sort it owing to the amount of time and money you already have invested. Incidentally, your car looks more like mine in every video, i.e. a kit of parts! I am dedicating May to September to try and get mine back on the road. Just a question, I can't remember, how did the car run when you bought it, before you did any work on it? If it has always had this fault, then it eliminates everything that you've done. As many have said, Streten is unbelievable, but never replies to queries. I have had dealings with Ed from 777 Garage, he has been very helpful for me and knows a lot about V12's, maybe worth a punt? Anyhow, looking forward to the next instalment.
Try swapping the throttle bodies and see if bank deactivation follows it. Our E34 Alpina B10 (M30) had the same throttle body if traction control was specified. I serviced one myself 20 years ago, could be a bad track. The shaft on our was crazy stiff due to gunk but you've sorted that. Could it be a blocked cat? You can check by looking at pressure difference. What can cause bank deactivation? A faulty cylinder identification sensor or its wiring could, try swapping. If you can find find the Bosch specs (I MIGHT have them) it'll list what causes deactivation. Have you listened to each injector with a stethoscope? Are the Motronic relays new? A bad one will kill power to the ECU, might be intermittent.
2 bar is way to low fuel pressure steve , common fault is the centre pin on the fuel pump connector burns as it carrying twice the current . check that connector steve . it could also be wrong or faulty pressure regulators . are you coil pick up donuts oem ?
Hi mate where did you get the wee ramp and keep up the good work
where you been man??? :) Looking forward to watching this later this evening
Caaaaaaaming up
Bad ground for injectors perhaps on bank 2?
I have the same isue on my e32 m70 engine. I did/checked almost everything the same as you. Additionaly chenged coils. Consumpsion is insane, around 25l pr 100km. Car is hibernating now. Waiting for spring. Hope you will find problem fast :)
If it's running that rich I'd suspect a MAF.
Hi Steve, great video, but sorry to see all the trouble your having. I remember in a previous episode you changed all the spark plugs, genuine ones from BMW, but also remember you saying they are not necessarily the correct ones. Perhaps try sourcing the original spec NGK plugs which I believe are 1 kOhm and work with this ignition system? Just a thought, good luck!
Thanks for the comment, in a subsequent vid I changed them to the NGKs.
@@voodoomelons sorry I clearly missed that...
Hmmm I noticed on the ignition on the coolant was already at proper temp. Had you run the car before or is that a glitch?
Seems odd that you can plug the bank 2 harness into bank 1 and the injectors fire ok, but you plug them into bank 2 and they don't - Seems that the injector drivers are working ok on the computers, but its almost like there's high resistance on bank 2 causing a drop in voltage to the injectors, and since you tested bank 2 on bank 1 and its fine, I'm thinking its a ground/earth strap or something which is on bank 2...
did you calibrated/synchronized throttle body? coz you did pull them off and apart. From the BMW 850 repair manual: Step 1 - Run engine to operating temperature Step 2 - In 1st gear run the engine up to 5000 rpm and then let it coast down (still in 1st) down to idle and let it idle for 10 seconds Step 3 - Do Step 2 two more times for a total of three times Step 4 - Place the car in neutral or park Step 5 - Idle for at least 5 minutes Step 6 - Shut the engine off for 10 seconds Step 7 - Restart the engine
Hi Steve, the CHECK icon in the cluster is NOT the Check Engine light (CHECK ENGINE is a red icon in the left area of the cluster and seems to be not fitted in yours... Only US models came with it from factory). The yellow CHECK indicates that there is some issue displayed in the Check Control Display. As the Display is not part of the cluster (as in E32/E34) the indicator informs the driver to take a look at the so called MID (MULTI INFORMATION DISPLAY).
Thanks for the comment, yes I figured this out many months ago after various clips were recorded. :)
@@stevesbmwbarn5706 Perfect ☺️👍 By the way: some DME versions make it possibile to retrofit the CHECK ENGINE light (as I did on my EU spec '92 E32). This gives you the possibility to always monitor if there are any faults stored in the ECU(s). Further those then can be read out by performing the stomp test. I just had to put one wire from the DME to the cluster and plug in the missing bulb. Were you able to find any stored fault messages in your DMEs with the diagnostic program?
OMG, an hour long video? Let's do this.
Surprised to see twin valve springs in a M70. Is that standard? Have you thought about taking it for a long drive as its sat for a long time?
Hi Steve now u have a Diagnostic Laptop, try to get the BMW DIS in a VMware, the Software gives a lot of Troubleshooting!
Did you replace fuel injectors ?
I guess it's pre-obd2 where a diag device might report which cylinders aren't firing right
Good luck man... I have the same issue in my E32 with the same engine. On idle you can hear tehre is a misfire, it sounds like your engine at the very end of the video. I explored many option but never managed to get this sorted. Runs like a beast, it has the proper power, but on idle she is just not right. Hope you get this sorted, then maybe I know what to do with my engine :)
Head valves is worn and not seal proply.
@@arkadiusztysler8240 was my first guess, but I checked and they are fine
@@jajoosp Hi. How You check?? Compression test?? This is only 50% results becouse then Yu dont have explosion and very high pressure jump. Head seals on the valves is very standard story in m70. Valve rings after years is worn, pistons have Carbon and other dirt from years and from oil…. Sorted a both heads and valves, then yur missfires issue gone. Where Yu base?
Any good news?
Hi how are you. Why don't you ask -M539 Restorations- He has experience in this and seems cool. Greetings from Argentina.
Sreten doesn’t like inquiries, unfortunately.
@@nachocabeza why shouldn't he from a fellow youtuber?
@@f.k.3762 call him and ask. I’m not his manager
Doesn't hurt to ask, and he has published his email address on his channel. You never know, he might surprise you and reply with assistance.
You should maybe talk to Sreten who does same kind of thing on his YT albeit a bigger one.
I looks like a job for M539 Restorations
Good morning steve I know your a very clever Enginneer but why not take it to BMW for a designated check.
Most BMW dealerships are going to charge a prohibitively high labor rate, are extremely busy with more modern vehicles, and additionally, most BMW techs are not the least bit interested in these very old, long out of production BMW engines. I highly recommend taking it to an independent BMW shop instead, preferably someone with experience with these legacy engines.
Eish typo:Steve!
It is no wonder why your car is such a problem, the steering wheel is on the wrong side!
Why attempt to debugg 1990 software or hardware? There's numerous updated aftermarket ECUs that not only allow better fine tuning but quicker troubleshooting. Aem or fuel tech..problem solved
This is an extremely old engine, long out of production, and I would be very skeptical of using aftermarket chips. A lot of these aftermarket chips are actually pirated Dinan or Wokke software. Dinan and Wokke will generally not honor or service pirated chips or software.
Your right your not a mechanic.but the answer is right in your face and you don't see it.its a bad valve or valves listening to the exhaust you hear it and see the pulses coming out quick and easy test instead of doing all that you did in the video is take a sheet of paper and place over exhaust you'll see it pull the paper into pipe that's bad.the piston is sucks the paper into exhaust
Give it to Sreten at M539. He'll get it sorted.