DISCORD: / discord As a follow-up to the last tournament, I used FE Builder to make a massive tournament to test which promoted class in the gba fire emblem games is the best fighter.
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What tournament shall we do next guys?? 👀
@BadAtFireEmblem23 күн бұрын
I'm the lunatic that wants to see how many classes can Lyn -crit- squeeze by
@bvd_vlvd23 күн бұрын
Couple of thoughts: Class mini tournament - all the guys of a particular class group (e.g. bishop tournament with Elen, Saul, Lucius, etc) to find the best in class Boss tournament - could pick one game or could do all three games and then have the winning boss from each game fight each other For balance you might have to not include the special class bosses (or only do the special classes?)
@VampireofEmotion23 күн бұрын
@@VampireofEmotion both cool ideas, thanks for sharing them 😊
@BadAtFireEmblem23 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem You could also re-do the original tournament to see if this new rules could have any impact upon the placement of some classes.
@toumabyakuya23 күн бұрын
Would enjoy seeing the classes use the optimized weapons and tomes available for the class like S rank weapons to see how they perform according to loadout options. The weapon access really carries classes. Mages unsurprisingly did awful but if they had their unique tomes they surely would have been more competitive. Basically competitive link arena utilizing average stats for specific characters rather than generics in a brawl across GBA games using their best options. FE8 paladins would just not equip axes if you wanted to allow it for 6 and 7 pallys. How tomes differ in each game would be a little tough to differentiate among GBA but would be cool to see FE7 Luna Canas vs FE8 Ewan etc. Swordslayer and reaver options should be included in some kits and some chars in FE8 would have 2 to 3 classes to test to make up for their smaller roster. Brave weapons etc. Would be a lot of work but if you did that you'd create an entire genre and meta and then someone would make a playable link arena sim to fight friends like in the good old days. TLDR GBA Link Arena Tournament with optimized weapons and tomes for each character to enter with branched options for those who have them to see who the GBA champion would be. The toughest part would be to implement the class and weapon changes.
@ThatGuyThai23 күн бұрын
This just goes to show that an assassin without a Killing Edge isn't really an assassin.
@SgtSupaman20 күн бұрын
None of them really stand up to Jaffar with his 19 str.
@grantsamson238420 күн бұрын
15:07 the hero has lived long enough to become the villan
@charsage103623 күн бұрын
So what you're saying is we have scientific proof that General > Great Knight > Paladin ? 10 YEAR OLD ME KNEW IT!! AMELIA GENERAL TOP TIER CONFIRMED WITH SCIENCE
@PatJamma23 күн бұрын
Gilliam General along side Amelia
@elbromas22123 күн бұрын
In terms of Raw Combat? It's always been that way, General has better promo bonuses and stat caps than Great Knight, which has the same over Paladin. The problem that makes them get tiered in the opposite direction in Sacred Stones is a combination of it being a game with generally weak enough enemies that those higher stats don't matter too much, and that in basically all FE games Movement Is King. Just the utility of a Paladin being able to move 8 spaces compared to a General's 5, while also having access to Canto, makes up for the slightly weaker combat and lack of axes. Similarly, Great Knight is just a General with horse access and 1 more movement at the cost of being weak to the two whole horseslayer weapons in the entire game. That said, if we start talking stuff like post-game Ruins of Valni and infinitely buyable stat boosters and farmable boots, well... then Generals become pretty crazy, no doubt about that.
@McFluffles0122 күн бұрын
Yes to all of these comments :P
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@McFluffles01 I always play to beat Lagdou/whatever extra challenge is in the given FE game, so I do often feel a little let down by some of the more popular classes in terms of what is considered 'good'
@jacksonhorrocks428122 күн бұрын
@@McFluffles01 you know i actually never really got cavalry to work well for me. like usually they either get too far ahead and get ganked to death or they solo everything and my other units don't get EXP, they get stopped by every forest there is and god forbid there's a map with sand on it. the one thing they do very well for me is to charge ahead and rescue vital allied units, but even that becomes obsolete once you get access to flyers.
@windhelmguard529522 күн бұрын
I wish the child would have become an adult as it's version of a promotion. Still a very good video tho.
@thefunnistreamerman23 күн бұрын
Growths in taxes and bills 😂
@timce922022 күн бұрын
That's such a good idea, I'm gutted I didn't think of it!
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem use the "Citizen" class, it's used for Eliwood's father and it represent an adult
@AzumarillConGafasBv8 күн бұрын
Swordmaster is definitely going to start his villain arc after seeing his longtime rival Hero not only outplace him but win the overall tourney. Season two is going to be crazy.
@hank281523 күн бұрын
The mfs that promote Gerik to Ranger have now been proven wrong. Thank you Mr. Bad A. Fire Emblem
@iseegreen529723 күн бұрын
That means that Ross berserker is wrong too and hero Ross is right. Which I also agree with.
@ma.209923 күн бұрын
@@ma.2099just run three heroes. If y'all want extra crit, killing weapons exist
@andreescalona890223 күн бұрын
@@andreescalona8902 they are all soooooo great. One of my favorite things to do for sure!
@ma.209923 күн бұрын
Sorry, I gotta get that water walking.
@shellpoptheepicswordmaster75523 күн бұрын
@@ma.2099 Well, who's going to replicate the water crossing niche that isn't weak to bows?
@michaelgum9722 күн бұрын
I thought Swordmaster might win because they generally have the highest speed and good crit rates, but I was also guessing the Mage Knight since the combination of 1-2 range, a good magic type, and good speed would be enough. While the Hero winning wasn't a big shock, it *did* surprise me to learn that he beat the Swordmaster both times. Also big shoutout to Wyvern Lord for taking a full point off the Hero. WTA prevails.
@theyneverlearn367921 күн бұрын
As soon as you said you were giving them all silver weapons i knew Hero was going to win. Silver sword heroes are some scary units in hard mode.
@Machaotake22 күн бұрын
"Once there was a brave Bael in Chapter 6 who was on a noble mission to fell the wickedness of a great horror known as the child. But on his quest he was unjustly slain by a demonic red haired man on a horse and a cruel pegasus enslaving woman with sickly green hair. But one day, when the ancient childrich horror descended upon a tournament with it's ear piercing screeches and all seemed lost, a Hero appeared..."
@Kurayamiblack22 күн бұрын
Childrich Horror is actually hilarious 😂
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
"Locked to the lower-might light magic" is indeed a tongue twister, but also fun to say
@brockmckelvey732722 күн бұрын
Also, RIP Bishop! I love my Monks & Clerics, but yeah they really don't get much out of promoting.
@brockmckelvey732722 күн бұрын
Yeah unfortunately it's slayer that makes them good as playable units in fe8, and that doesn't help them here
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Great lord Roy is the strongest for the simple fact you no longer have to use regular Roy anymore
@SHR777822 күн бұрын
Would like to see a tournament that featured one class from all GBA games. e.g. all mercenaries against each other. Just scaled to 20 using their base + personal growths.
@oHRKo23 күн бұрын
Great idea. I wonder if HM Bonuses would be included, as those make a huge difference in many cases.
@aBlackMage23 күн бұрын
I like this a lot, I'll probably do that :)
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem If you do that be sure to go off their expected stats at 20 so we can see for sure who the greatest mercenary is. Don't even need to port over the Mercenaries - only the stats matter from the standpoint of who is the best. Can even take this to its logical conclusion - All mercenaries in the series, scaled up to 20, no skills, fighting in the arena - who is the best mercenary.
@jacewarbeck968422 күн бұрын
So now we can ask can Seth beat every fire emblem class? Let's see if it is really the best unit (in general it would be funny to test all the pre-promotes that are considered the strongest in their game in a normal playthrough)
@jarco112123 күн бұрын
Can Dozla beat every Fire Emblem class? His non-zero Crit chance MIGHT help!
@timpolson707223 күн бұрын
I think Duessel, Salah, and Percvel could be top tier for pre-promots
@youvegotmailed19 күн бұрын
Honestly, the only placement that surprised me was the wyvern lord. I wasn't sure if it would've won, but I didn't think it would be so much lower than it's knight counterpart.
@isuckatgaming187323 күн бұрын
pierce is op
@TWitWoW22 күн бұрын
@@TWitWoW it was more than that- the speed difference mattered a ton!
@isuckatgaming187322 күн бұрын
Speed was definitely a massive factor, but I did enjoy the pierce procs, they're very satisfying
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
There's a lot more difficult competition in the Promoted classes, especially when it comes to Bow and strong Magic classes. Warriors, Rangers, the possibility of not even being able to dodge the Sniper, plus having to fight its own alternate version... Wyvern Lord was up against a roster that not only had more challengers, but ones tailored to knock it down now with better tools against its weaknesses. Honestly I'm just happy it did as well as it did. It's still a fantastic class. Glass half full mentality.
@0ctopusComp1etely22 күн бұрын
As it turns out, Glen never really stood a chance against Valter from the get-go.
@theyneverlearn367921 күн бұрын
My guess before watching, Hero and Paladin/Great Knight have to be pretty high. I bet the highest magic class is Sage, I’m curious to see though. Edit: see now this is why I’m not a gambler
@illialidur824422 күн бұрын
I love the prize at the end. Not enough games let a player do such a thing.
@mayonaise00023 күн бұрын
I aim to please
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Good to see the General get to 10th place feels good XD Good video all round my guy good job!
@Scotts_GamingWorld23 күн бұрын
Thanks Scott, yeah fans of Oswin and Wendy will be very happy lol
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
I’m so glad to see Hero get first! I honestly am surprised about Mage Knight and General for their place in the ranking, but it was really fun to see! I hope to see you do a tournament with all the Grado Generals one day, or just all the post game FE8 Characters. I think it’d be fun to see how well each one performs with their base equipment and current stats.
@AskadProject18 күн бұрын
I've got the next tournament planned, and then after that I'll be doing something similar to what you've described 👀
@BadAtFireEmblem17 күн бұрын
It's like when Age Of Mythology players make myth units fight each other to see who's the best.
@imafreakinninja1222 күн бұрын
Thank you bro, I really wanted to watch this video :D
@carmonix114321 күн бұрын
Well, Hartmut the leader of the Eight Legends of the Scouring is supposedly a Hero.
@Krenisphia22 күн бұрын
Messed up that they falsified history
@nelisezpasce19 күн бұрын
Great video, cant wait to see more.
@crab668623 күн бұрын
Finally! Thank you for your hardwork
@salvadorchavezc23 күн бұрын
I feel like pegasus knight would of done a bit better if given lower weight weapon, but great video !
@arcraid968123 күн бұрын
Gotta do the promoted lords now
@jokeractual523923 күн бұрын
This is the first of your videos I have watched. I was completely caught off guard by the way you announced the reward. XD
@novella-inaba52302 күн бұрын
I appreciate how you titled the video with "strongest" instead of "best." As you pointed out in the video, a class's utility is more than just raw power.
@TheGuzeinbuick2 күн бұрын
If the classes were at their stat caps I imagine general would be a lot higher
@KiasCole23 күн бұрын
Huh, I now know what generic assassin, rogue and wyvern knight portraits look like now. Had never seen them before. I kinda figured the wyvern knight with its pierce skill might come out on top but seeing hero at the top does not surprise me in the least. They are just THE combat foot unit.
@renegaderaven377722 күн бұрын
Hero winning honestly surprised me. Idk why but I always seem to think General, Berserker and Sage are some of the strongest classes. Necromancer probably my favorite but its hard to test its op viability with summons and luna in a "fair" way in the tournament. Good video!
@Grey_370821 сағат бұрын
I didn't realize the base paladin had such low speed. I was also hoping the general would have placed a bit higher.
@louisherman598421 күн бұрын
Bad At Fire Emblem, Your videos always make me happy, so I subscribed!
@pjdava17 күн бұрын
Happy to hear you enjoy the videos 😊
@BadAtFireEmblem17 күн бұрын
Loved the swordmaster with the +crit sword during the campaign
@sukrpunch12 күн бұрын
Makes sense. Paladin is a generalist class with solid utility and mobility. It should lose to dedicated combat roles.
@deadlypandaghost21 күн бұрын
General on the other hand...
@craigyeah105220 күн бұрын
This is proof that Amelia is good in general. (Just forget about the movement speed. We don’t need it in the arena.) Despite placing third in combat performances, Wyvern Knights are still my favourite. Can’t go wrong with great combat while having 8 flying movement :D
@solarstorm524222 күн бұрын
Swordsmasters with silver swords always destroyed units in the arena, so I thought they would win, but Heros also make a lot of sense with the sheer might of axes in their favor as well as triangle type advanced
@halcyon_echo4223 күн бұрын
In the arena they get silver swords a lot, but your unit has iron weapons so it's a mismatch. Plus the in-game arena you only get to lose once, which is why the swordmasters are so terrifying with that crit chance 😅
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
There is also the fact that many of the Arena units seem to have altered stats not based on existing class caps. Notedly, they alter them based on the unit you send in, so it is entirely possible to see a Swordmaster doing 10+ damage even though your defense is maxed and their STR cap + Silver Sword should be doing scratch damage to you. Swordmasters are balanced around their lower damage, so seeing one so such high consistent damage makes them terrifying.
@DemonVermin21 күн бұрын
Man. What a crazy and extremely revolutionary idea for a follow up video.. I Wonder where he got it from.
@lspuria844023 күн бұрын
What's can i say, I'm just a creative genius
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Before I watch - my money is on Heroes. Amazing in all stats really. Tend to be the ones to beat in the Arena.
@jacewarbeck968423 күн бұрын
Sacred Stones made me love the Wyvern Lord, Druid, and Hero classes so this totally didn't surprise me. I really need to level up a Wyvern Knight and Mage Knight to see what I'm missing. Also I really wish we could see how Assassin or swordmaster would do with Killing Edge.
@Evilmarshmallow11610 күн бұрын
Now we need to see the performance of the units considered the best and worst of each class!
@sanoga201123 күн бұрын
I found the old video like yesterday or something. Nice.
@justanotherweirdo1123 күн бұрын
Next up you gotta do monster classes and/or promoted lords
@GayBowser2535 күн бұрын
Love the content BAFE! What if we gave our weapon users two range weapons?
@joshmcknight177123 күн бұрын
Then hero would win even harder 😅
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem haha yeah probably. I’m just thinking about my lance wielders. Javelins and hand axes are so easily accessible throughout the game, and I use them quite a bit. I wonder if that would force magic users to win less and for the lance users to win more
@joshmcknight177122 күн бұрын
@@joshmcknight1771 yeah for sure
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
That was a fun experiment, but could you test your changes with unpromoted units next?
@Bellicosy23 күн бұрын
If I'm honest the amount of effort that goes into tournaments, I probably wouldn't do that much effort just to redo an old vid. This took 380 combat tests and hours upon hours of editing lol
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem Fear not, it wasn't a serious request, I was only teasing you.
@Bellicosy22 күн бұрын
Now that it's done, let's see which characters can beat them all, and for the first couple of suggestions, Seth, Percival, Duessal, and Milady.
@michaelgum9722 күн бұрын
bless papa bafe
@khan669023 күн бұрын
Hell yeah, I already knew that the hero was the best class, but it's good to see my suspicion validated by this inarguable, completely conclusive study. Nobody can ever try to tell me that any other class is anywhere close to being as good as the hero without being objectively wrong, hahaha
@fullmetal92922 күн бұрын
You have the evidence to back up your claim :P
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Tana and Vanessa: Hmmm should I promote into the 3rd worst combat class or the 3rd best combat class...? For real FE8 was quite unbalanced in promotion branches sometimes, Mage Knights get better combat and horses. Further notes: -From game feel I don't remember Summoner's combat being THAT much worse than Druid's... if you're using the same tomes. I have to imagine that because Thunder is actually good in a general use case and Druids get anima they absolutely destroyed them. -Using FE8 classes has its ups and downs, but especially effects classes with proc skills and crit bonuses as far as randomness is concerned. I could see rerunning this leading to general, swordmaster, serker, and wyvern knight scoring differently most of the time. Druid w/o anima and Valykrie w/ anima would be interesting too. - Obviously the one thing this doesn't account for is horse, wyvern, and armor weaknesses, although they aren't super prevalent throughout the game, but even without them funny to see a unit without weaknesses come out on top by a large margin.
@craigyeah105220 күн бұрын
I was expecting Swordmasters to win given how powerful they are in the Arena. But in hindsight their placement makes sense; other classes have 1-2 range or weapon triangle advantage over them and don't need to get lucky crits to score kills. Also, I'm surprised by how low the Paladin scored. Playable Paladins usually have good speed. I didn't know generics had such an underwhelming speed stat.
@micos382022 күн бұрын
I was surprised by paladin as well, but the generics apparently have bad stats 🤷♂️
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
very good content
@abcdefghijktt11 күн бұрын
i'm curious to see how these promoted classes do with some actual character stat's and growths
@dyjost5 күн бұрын
interesting concept
@layachaz73187 күн бұрын
GOATED KZheadR ALERT GOATED KZheadR ALERT
@exploitablee18 күн бұрын
A hero can save us🎶
@starpowerel717216 күн бұрын
I predicted sniper to win at the start cause i thought it was gonna use Link Arena rules. There, the sniper goes uncountered vs 1range enemies when attacking, but 1-2 range enemies always attack snipers at 2 range.
@wirelessbaguette899720 күн бұрын
I love my bow classes, don't get me wrong, but seeing Hero come out in 1st with Mage Knight in 2nd is such a gigantic serotonin boost as someone who loves these classes :D
@nerothewateruser803020 күн бұрын
Glad the video had a positive effect on you 😊
@BadAtFireEmblem19 күн бұрын
I like how you have justifications for the placements unlike with the base class tournament. Like yea obviously utility units like the thieves and specialized unit killers like archers and bishops aren't gonna come out on top against the super OP stuff like wyverns, it's a lot more interesting to see the performance between generalist combat units closer to the top
@TheSm132718 күн бұрын
Especially in terms of purely generic enemies, thieves almost never attack the player, so they're never really meant to be combat threats, moreso meant to get you moving across the map
@TheSm132718 күн бұрын
would have liked to see every class being allowed access to more than just one silver weapon of each type they can use. like especially the sniper feels shafted in this because one of their key advantages over the ranger is being able to use longbows, which might have made a difference in some match ups against 2 range enemies, but also weapon users not being able to use their 1-2 options is a bit of a downer, especially when having ready access to these weapons is what makes axe and lance users so much stronger than sword users in most of the games. also i'd throw the ability to use items into the mix. like perhaps a suggestion for a video in the distant future: every class gets three weapons that they can use then give them one elixir each and one other item that benefits them based on what they do, like giving pure water to a general for example.
@windhelmguard529522 күн бұрын
Rangers and warriors can use longbows too. I think giving ones that can 1-2 ranged weapons might be kinda fair actually, but i disagree on the items. Pure water would just shaft all mages, and healing would prolong every match.
@hajoeijgenraam29521 күн бұрын
Winning when attacking second should award more points, like 0.75 instead of 0.5 Because of winning even after a disadvantage.
@tiarabite4 күн бұрын
Going second isn’t as much of a disadvantage despite what you’d expect thanks to counterattack. It depends on how many hits each unit needs to defeat the other. For example, in a situation where two units fighting each other at the same range (i.e. they can counter) take 2 hits to kill each other, the unit that goes second will win ignoring misses and crits and doubles Unit 1 goes first, attacks and is countered. Unit 2 goes second, attacks and defeats unit 1. If a unit takes an even amount of turns to defeat the enemy than is it advantageous to go second since it will defeat the enemy while being hit less times since it will be that units turn when it defeats the enemy. This isn’t taking into account crits or misses though This is actually a decent strategy to use in regular fire emblem. Baiting the enemy into attacking first if you need two turns to defeat them so you only get hit once rather than twice Now that being said, if the units don’t fight at the same range (i.e. a sword master and a sniper) then yes going first is just objectively better. And I do think in most cases going first is better, just in my opinion not by enough to justify it being 0.75. Just my take though
@TriAzFКүн бұрын
@@TriAzF Hm you are correct. And yes, I was mostly thinking of the sniper and swordmaster example. I guess I would edit my proposal to be to only have the 0.75 for those cases where the unit can't counterattack.
@tiarabiteКүн бұрын
@@tiarabite That’s pretty fair
@TriAzFКүн бұрын
I think it would be interesting to see what happens when you repeat the experiment 5 times and take the averages.
@edu-action607121 күн бұрын
I'm surprised general didn't score higher considering their gimmick are big stats but no res or mov!
@HanakkoLove23 күн бұрын
No speed. No speed no dice. You saw this yourself in the arena - nobody really picked generals to win and the only one who did well was running a cheese build, without wary fighter to carry them generals cannot hope to be the strongest class so long as a mage knight draws a breath in their body.
@jacewarbeck968423 күн бұрын
If it was Wendy instead of a generic general, she'd have beaten them all
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem so true lmao
@HanakkoLove22 күн бұрын
Silencer likely didn't proc because of how low the Assassin's crit was with silver weapons. Its chance is half their crit rate in the GBA games. Sad to see it so low, but without Silencer it makes sense.
@ivelchild23 күн бұрын
Really cool video as ever! But is it just me or when I try to join the Discord server, they tell me the invitation has expired or is invalid? 🙁
@deimos148423 күн бұрын
That's weird, I'll do a fresh link
@BadAtFireEmblem23 күн бұрын
Thanks, it worked!
@deimos148423 күн бұрын
Dark magic users are so busted that they have to nerf in the tournament. Otherwise, druid is gonna be the first place.
@IAARPOTI23 күн бұрын
Yeah but if you allow druids nosferatu+luna then you allow Heroes to have brave swords and axes. Heroes stay winning.
@jacewarbeck968423 күн бұрын
Hero does make sense. Mage Knight was unexpected.
@nategraham694622 күн бұрын
I didn't see mage knight coming
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Grado Generals ranked really high with the expection of Dussel
@vinnycent007Күн бұрын
I would not have guessed that the ____ would win! It kinda makes sense though, those base stats don't lie
@MegaTomPlays21 күн бұрын
I love the hero class and for years ive heard, Swordmaster is the better choice so I'm glad to see it win
@Count_Vampz22 күн бұрын
Yes, Heroes! Great all around stats and the constitution to handle higher level weapons!
@SuperHeroR3 күн бұрын
I remember when the thief class was buns in combat. Now in Engage maddening they’re the unit I fear the most. (And use the most)
@mjbrownii22 күн бұрын
Never played engaged so it's interesting to hear they're so good, what makes them so op?
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem they have amazing speed so they often double and have high avoidance, 1-2 range daggers (daggers cause poison on hit), they all have a passive skill that gives them double terrain effects (so if a forest gives a unit +30 avo the thief gets +60 so they’re virtually untouchable on forts and stuff as they’re capable of having over 100 avo), and their dmg ranges from average to abnormally good as they’re capable of 1 rounding a good portion similarly leveled nontanky units. P.S. Think of poison as a DEF debuff not like real poison, so every hit they land lowers your defense and they stack.
@mjbrownii22 күн бұрын
@@mjbrownii Also daggers are just really strong. They get like +2 might with every forge which you can do like 5 times. They end up being some of the strongest 1-2 range weapons
@hajoeijgenraam29521 күн бұрын
I think you’re highly overrating them. Think they’re good on normal and ok on hard but fall off a cliff on maddening. For starters if the enemy has 0 hit on you they just won’t attack you, so using them to enemy phase doesn’t work well. Also enemies have really high stats on maddening of the low strength base of the class and low might of knives make the class deal awful damage. So what you have is a unit who can situationally have good durability but does awful damage and won’t be attacked on enemy phase anyway when they have the strong durability. Also Wolf knight is just better, it has more movement and it has cav type which is far more useful since if you have any dagger user you want they to use Lucina. The poison on her chain attacks is a nice perk but the main use is if you’re stacking avo you can use them as a bonded shield user so they won’t be targeted by the enemies and they will hit the unit who is besides them. Why being a Cav matters is because it will give bonded shield a 100% activation rate on a mage knight, which is a great class for offensive power and will let you keep them safe while they double and one round on enemy phase. Even if the enemy lives the mage knight still survives the enemy phase and heavily dents them to be cleaned up on player phase. If you’re looking for another enemy phase unit vantage wrath is just far better in nearly every way. It’s more reliable since you can add hit to the weapons you use and you’re killing enemies instead of barely denting them. You can even do it at 1-2 range with Lief at bond level 9 (don’t go above otherwise he’ll sometimes pull out the master lance) and use adaptable on a warrior to switch between a killer axe and killer bow. Anyway think Wolf knight is just better, if you’re looking for enemy phase there’s far better options, and the damage thieves do just sucks compared to alternatives like Griffin knight, Wyvern knight, Warrior, Mage knight, etc. Think you can make use of them a little early game, but after chapter 10 they fall off a cliff in term of utility and Yunaka’s stacks are also just bad compared to Zelkov’s (she only wins in res and luck at equal level and he’ll be a higher level than her when he joins unless you literally dump every enemy kill into her). Zelkov is decent, but prefers to just reclass to Warrior as it’s just a better combat class. Enemy thieves can be hard to kill since they’re hard to double with their high speed, but wolf knights are also more annoying in this regard. Daggers start strong early but don’t keep up at all once your other units start promoting and using killer, brave, and silver weapons. Even steel weapon alternatives will often do more damage, especially with the massive str difference the classes have. Also other classes can one round, so you don’t need to make the enemy take 1 more damage from all sources. Even if you don’t one round the 1 more damage isn’t going to be the difference on whether you can 2 round, unless you’re using thieves which is why you’re struggling to kill enemies. Of course if you like using them to each their own, don’t think you’re making the game easier by doing so though.
@twigz321421 күн бұрын
@@twigz3214 sorry I think you misunderstood. I’m talking about fighting them not using them. They’re still useful on a playthrough but encountering them can be annoying
@mjbrownii21 күн бұрын
My only issue with the new ranking is that surely they should get more points if they win, since it's harder to win when they attack second, but that seems like a fairly minor issue. My prediction... well, last time I went with Mercenary, and Merc came 4th, but that was because I forgot about Wyvern Riders. So, this time, I'm going to go Wyvern Lord. The Wyvern Knight was also a tempting choice but I'm not sure if the chance of pierce occurring overcomes the Wyvern Lord. Edit: I should have stuck with my guns and gone with the Hero x.x Yeah, I'm not surprised by the Assassin doing so poorly. They either need a Killing Edge or Wo Dao (I think Assassins can equip the Wo Dao in FE8, since they promote from Mydridons as well?) to excel, because Assassinate is their main trump card. Without it... you just have a glorified thief. Also surprised that Berserker tied with Warrior, because most people say "Berserker is the best class and Warrior is one of the worst". And I'm surprised that the Swordmaster performed well, because usually swordmasters have a fairly low strength. And crits don't mean anything if you're dealing 0 damage.
@ShadowdaHedgie1114 күн бұрын
Hahaha you talked yourself out of backing the winner
@BadAtFireEmblem13 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem I know x.x
@ShadowdaHedgie1113 күн бұрын
I like this question and my answer can only be berserker, axes have such a high ceiling
@gavinnelson340216 күн бұрын
Was expecting Hero to make top 5, but never anticipated top placement. Hey Swordmaster! ...Eat your heart out.
@ResurgentRaven13 күн бұрын
It surprised me too
@BadAtFireEmblem13 күн бұрын
can you do one with maxed stats and legendary weapons?
@weseetheligt17 күн бұрын
For these Every Unit videos I wonder if it would be better if the thumbnail had them split half and half since it's more like a battle royal rather than the 1 vs Everyone the unit gauntlets are. I don't know if that would look as eye catching though.
@velvetbutterfly22 күн бұрын
Yeah exactly what you said, I think it's more eye-catching this way haha
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
how did you get the class stats to use for the battles? Very neat to see though
@MarkofWisdom10 күн бұрын
Febuilder autolevels then to level 20 based on the classes inbuilt growth rates the same as the game would when it normally works out enemy stats in the game
@BadAtFireEmblem10 күн бұрын
how many times did you test each matchup?
@lloyd0117215 күн бұрын
Super trainees are technically promoted units so it's sad that they aren't here.
@Nitosa20 күн бұрын
I forgot about them to be fair. Rip
@BadAtFireEmblem20 күн бұрын
based on the battle shown, it seemed the valkyrie won against ranger since the AI prioritized 1 range combat, meaning no bow counter attack. did you notice that in any other classes?
@MsrApple21 күн бұрын
if they prioritized the bow, Valkyrie would just fight at 1 range and not get counter attacked. Ranger just never gets to counter against a 1-2 range weapon
@valarmis21 күн бұрын
There was definitely a couple of cases of interesting ai choices that weren't optimal, but it mostly played properly
@BadAtFireEmblem21 күн бұрын
Woohoo hero number 1
@rustommukherjee865123 күн бұрын
Wow, who would’ve thought that priests/clerics even promoted were bad… Didn’t expect the Wyvern lord to be in 5! I had guessed it to be first. Mage knight being high is impressive! Zero to HERO!!! Nice!
@fireembros116515 күн бұрын
You really hate those priests and clerics haha! Yeah I thought the top 5 wouldn't look exactly how it did, I was surprised
@BadAtFireEmblem15 күн бұрын
@@BadAtFireEmblem I just feel vindicated that’s all ahahhah! Yeah, surprised with the results, but happy to see some magical classes up there
@fireembros116515 күн бұрын
Would you ever consider doing this with each units best in slot weapon? Giving a brave weapon to some classes or like the Wo Dao to swordmaster?
@natebrennan182521 күн бұрын
Unfortunately, Brave Weapons (or Legendary Weapons) are every classes' best in slot. Only the Assassin benefits enough from wo dao to offset this because they can only win off of getting lucky with their personal.
@craigyeah105220 күн бұрын
The anticipation for hero was killing me, wanting not to see it until last because its my favorite, each reveal hurt me because of anticipation, yet made me releaved. But finally the sheer glee i felt when it won. Also if you make and design corrins strengths and weeknesses that of a hero. Corrin solos the game.
@monkeymangamertm251218 күн бұрын
Silver weapons are not the BIS for every physical class, the assasin NEEDS the killing edge.
@KaiserX409 күн бұрын
I’m just here for the villager murder
@GODHAND4222 күн бұрын
I actually did guess the winner. Mostly because I fanboy over their crit animation since my first fe7 run haha
@thestaubmob687720 күн бұрын
"Dark mages with Luna and Nos would have been busted" That's the point. Let them be busted.
@midnalight641922 күн бұрын
Maybe in another video 👀
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Had a feeling the Hero class would win. They are so good. Didn't expect Mage Knight in 2nd place though, I thought that would be Wyvern Knight.
@GreatAether5822 күн бұрын
I was surprised by mahe knight too, but it makes total sense in hindsight
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Yeah I didn't realize Mage Knights were that good.
@GreatAether5822 күн бұрын
Only having played FE7, it's a little mind boggling how low the paladin got, he was my best guess for #1 (aside maybe for the Wyvern promos).
@Ghi10223 күн бұрын
No, Paladin is good for their movement, not their combat. Now if both parties had elixirs and the paladin was allowed to run and heal up between skirmishes? Then the paladin would score much higher. Higher move = you get first hit, and first hit after you regroup.
@jacewarbeck968423 күн бұрын
In pure combat, sure Paladin ranks pretty low… but Horse Emblem is a meme for a reason. The high mobility units are king since not many maps have things that can slow them down. One or two desert maps and maybe a few FOW maps, but their excellent ability to reposition and canto basically wins them the day. In Fe8, enemy quality is low enough that Paladins are enough. Everything higher is overkill. In Fe6-7, they got Axes, which means both Javelin and Hand Axe spam for an effective 10 threat range with good weapon triangle advantage. And… we shouldn’t forget that these are based on the generics of each class. And… well… in every GBA FE game, the top 10 are SCARY. Heros with Silver weapons are tanky, Druids usually hit like a truck and Swordmasters can fish for crits to wreck you even with weapon advantage. Bern’s Wyvern Lord spam is stuff of nightmares too. Thank god only Valter can be an enemy Wyvern Knight.
@DemonVermin21 күн бұрын
That intro was too funny
@TrulyXenon21 күн бұрын
Glad you enjoyed it lol
@BadAtFireEmblem21 күн бұрын
Honestly, I never use anything other than killing edge and wo dau with the assassin and swordsmaster
@definitelynotsarcasm21 күн бұрын
I wonder if it's just a coincidence my favorite classes tend to be the best.
@GURGLEGUY1234521 күн бұрын
Seeing General in the Top 10 feels weirdly emotionally validating
@FarCritical19 күн бұрын
A couple of people have said the same thing, there's a lot of general fans out there
@BadAtFireEmblem19 күн бұрын
What Is The Strongest SWORD In GBA Fire Emblem?
@khan669013 күн бұрын
Bishop’s weird because it’s really OP in fe8 since so many enemies are monsters. But it’s got bad stats vs human enemies.
@dialzza490218 күн бұрын
Yeah exactly, and light magic is ass
@BadAtFireEmblem17 күн бұрын
I was surprised that the Paladin scored or ranked so low.
@frankybee920 күн бұрын
I was too
@BadAtFireEmblem19 күн бұрын
Did the Hero had a killer weapon for a guaranteed crit on Deathica or was that coincidental?^^
@aureliodeprimus801823 күн бұрын
No just a silver sword lol
@BadAtFireEmblem22 күн бұрын
Druid is the most reliably strong class IMO during actual gameplay.
What tournament shall we do next guys?? 👀
I'm the lunatic that wants to see how many classes can Lyn -crit- squeeze by
Couple of thoughts: Class mini tournament - all the guys of a particular class group (e.g. bishop tournament with Elen, Saul, Lucius, etc) to find the best in class Boss tournament - could pick one game or could do all three games and then have the winning boss from each game fight each other For balance you might have to not include the special class bosses (or only do the special classes?)
@@VampireofEmotion both cool ideas, thanks for sharing them 😊
@@BadAtFireEmblem You could also re-do the original tournament to see if this new rules could have any impact upon the placement of some classes.
Would enjoy seeing the classes use the optimized weapons and tomes available for the class like S rank weapons to see how they perform according to loadout options. The weapon access really carries classes. Mages unsurprisingly did awful but if they had their unique tomes they surely would have been more competitive. Basically competitive link arena utilizing average stats for specific characters rather than generics in a brawl across GBA games using their best options. FE8 paladins would just not equip axes if you wanted to allow it for 6 and 7 pallys. How tomes differ in each game would be a little tough to differentiate among GBA but would be cool to see FE7 Luna Canas vs FE8 Ewan etc. Swordslayer and reaver options should be included in some kits and some chars in FE8 would have 2 to 3 classes to test to make up for their smaller roster. Brave weapons etc. Would be a lot of work but if you did that you'd create an entire genre and meta and then someone would make a playable link arena sim to fight friends like in the good old days. TLDR GBA Link Arena Tournament with optimized weapons and tomes for each character to enter with branched options for those who have them to see who the GBA champion would be. The toughest part would be to implement the class and weapon changes.
This just goes to show that an assassin without a Killing Edge isn't really an assassin.
None of them really stand up to Jaffar with his 19 str.
15:07 the hero has lived long enough to become the villan
So what you're saying is we have scientific proof that General > Great Knight > Paladin ? 10 YEAR OLD ME KNEW IT!! AMELIA GENERAL TOP TIER CONFIRMED WITH SCIENCE
Gilliam General along side Amelia
In terms of Raw Combat? It's always been that way, General has better promo bonuses and stat caps than Great Knight, which has the same over Paladin. The problem that makes them get tiered in the opposite direction in Sacred Stones is a combination of it being a game with generally weak enough enemies that those higher stats don't matter too much, and that in basically all FE games Movement Is King. Just the utility of a Paladin being able to move 8 spaces compared to a General's 5, while also having access to Canto, makes up for the slightly weaker combat and lack of axes. Similarly, Great Knight is just a General with horse access and 1 more movement at the cost of being weak to the two whole horseslayer weapons in the entire game. That said, if we start talking stuff like post-game Ruins of Valni and infinitely buyable stat boosters and farmable boots, well... then Generals become pretty crazy, no doubt about that.
Yes to all of these comments :P
@McFluffles01 I always play to beat Lagdou/whatever extra challenge is in the given FE game, so I do often feel a little let down by some of the more popular classes in terms of what is considered 'good'
@@McFluffles01 you know i actually never really got cavalry to work well for me. like usually they either get too far ahead and get ganked to death or they solo everything and my other units don't get EXP, they get stopped by every forest there is and god forbid there's a map with sand on it. the one thing they do very well for me is to charge ahead and rescue vital allied units, but even that becomes obsolete once you get access to flyers.
I wish the child would have become an adult as it's version of a promotion. Still a very good video tho.
Growths in taxes and bills 😂
That's such a good idea, I'm gutted I didn't think of it!
@@BadAtFireEmblem use the "Citizen" class, it's used for Eliwood's father and it represent an adult
Swordmaster is definitely going to start his villain arc after seeing his longtime rival Hero not only outplace him but win the overall tourney. Season two is going to be crazy.
The mfs that promote Gerik to Ranger have now been proven wrong. Thank you Mr. Bad A. Fire Emblem
That means that Ross berserker is wrong too and hero Ross is right. Which I also agree with.
@@ma.2099just run three heroes. If y'all want extra crit, killing weapons exist
@@andreescalona8902 they are all soooooo great. One of my favorite things to do for sure!
Sorry, I gotta get that water walking.
@@ma.2099 Well, who's going to replicate the water crossing niche that isn't weak to bows?
I thought Swordmaster might win because they generally have the highest speed and good crit rates, but I was also guessing the Mage Knight since the combination of 1-2 range, a good magic type, and good speed would be enough. While the Hero winning wasn't a big shock, it *did* surprise me to learn that he beat the Swordmaster both times. Also big shoutout to Wyvern Lord for taking a full point off the Hero. WTA prevails.
As soon as you said you were giving them all silver weapons i knew Hero was going to win. Silver sword heroes are some scary units in hard mode.
"Once there was a brave Bael in Chapter 6 who was on a noble mission to fell the wickedness of a great horror known as the child. But on his quest he was unjustly slain by a demonic red haired man on a horse and a cruel pegasus enslaving woman with sickly green hair. But one day, when the ancient childrich horror descended upon a tournament with it's ear piercing screeches and all seemed lost, a Hero appeared..."
Childrich Horror is actually hilarious 😂
"Locked to the lower-might light magic" is indeed a tongue twister, but also fun to say
Also, RIP Bishop! I love my Monks & Clerics, but yeah they really don't get much out of promoting.
Yeah unfortunately it's slayer that makes them good as playable units in fe8, and that doesn't help them here
Great lord Roy is the strongest for the simple fact you no longer have to use regular Roy anymore
Would like to see a tournament that featured one class from all GBA games. e.g. all mercenaries against each other. Just scaled to 20 using their base + personal growths.
Great idea. I wonder if HM Bonuses would be included, as those make a huge difference in many cases.
I like this a lot, I'll probably do that :)
@@BadAtFireEmblem If you do that be sure to go off their expected stats at 20 so we can see for sure who the greatest mercenary is. Don't even need to port over the Mercenaries - only the stats matter from the standpoint of who is the best. Can even take this to its logical conclusion - All mercenaries in the series, scaled up to 20, no skills, fighting in the arena - who is the best mercenary.
So now we can ask can Seth beat every fire emblem class? Let's see if it is really the best unit (in general it would be funny to test all the pre-promotes that are considered the strongest in their game in a normal playthrough)
Can Dozla beat every Fire Emblem class? His non-zero Crit chance MIGHT help!
I think Duessel, Salah, and Percvel could be top tier for pre-promots
Honestly, the only placement that surprised me was the wyvern lord. I wasn't sure if it would've won, but I didn't think it would be so much lower than it's knight counterpart.
pierce is op
@@TWitWoW it was more than that- the speed difference mattered a ton!
Speed was definitely a massive factor, but I did enjoy the pierce procs, they're very satisfying
There's a lot more difficult competition in the Promoted classes, especially when it comes to Bow and strong Magic classes. Warriors, Rangers, the possibility of not even being able to dodge the Sniper, plus having to fight its own alternate version... Wyvern Lord was up against a roster that not only had more challengers, but ones tailored to knock it down now with better tools against its weaknesses. Honestly I'm just happy it did as well as it did. It's still a fantastic class. Glass half full mentality.
As it turns out, Glen never really stood a chance against Valter from the get-go.
My guess before watching, Hero and Paladin/Great Knight have to be pretty high. I bet the highest magic class is Sage, I’m curious to see though. Edit: see now this is why I’m not a gambler
I love the prize at the end. Not enough games let a player do such a thing.
I aim to please
Good to see the General get to 10th place feels good XD Good video all round my guy good job!
Thanks Scott, yeah fans of Oswin and Wendy will be very happy lol
I’m so glad to see Hero get first! I honestly am surprised about Mage Knight and General for their place in the ranking, but it was really fun to see! I hope to see you do a tournament with all the Grado Generals one day, or just all the post game FE8 Characters. I think it’d be fun to see how well each one performs with their base equipment and current stats.
I've got the next tournament planned, and then after that I'll be doing something similar to what you've described 👀
It's like when Age Of Mythology players make myth units fight each other to see who's the best.
Thank you bro, I really wanted to watch this video :D
Well, Hartmut the leader of the Eight Legends of the Scouring is supposedly a Hero.
Messed up that they falsified history
Great video, cant wait to see more.
Finally! Thank you for your hardwork
I feel like pegasus knight would of done a bit better if given lower weight weapon, but great video !
Gotta do the promoted lords now
This is the first of your videos I have watched. I was completely caught off guard by the way you announced the reward. XD
I appreciate how you titled the video with "strongest" instead of "best." As you pointed out in the video, a class's utility is more than just raw power.
If the classes were at their stat caps I imagine general would be a lot higher
Huh, I now know what generic assassin, rogue and wyvern knight portraits look like now. Had never seen them before. I kinda figured the wyvern knight with its pierce skill might come out on top but seeing hero at the top does not surprise me in the least. They are just THE combat foot unit.
Hero winning honestly surprised me. Idk why but I always seem to think General, Berserker and Sage are some of the strongest classes. Necromancer probably my favorite but its hard to test its op viability with summons and luna in a "fair" way in the tournament. Good video!
I didn't realize the base paladin had such low speed. I was also hoping the general would have placed a bit higher.
Bad At Fire Emblem, Your videos always make me happy, so I subscribed!
Happy to hear you enjoy the videos 😊
Loved the swordmaster with the +crit sword during the campaign
Makes sense. Paladin is a generalist class with solid utility and mobility. It should lose to dedicated combat roles.
General on the other hand...
This is proof that Amelia is good in general. (Just forget about the movement speed. We don’t need it in the arena.) Despite placing third in combat performances, Wyvern Knights are still my favourite. Can’t go wrong with great combat while having 8 flying movement :D
Swordsmasters with silver swords always destroyed units in the arena, so I thought they would win, but Heros also make a lot of sense with the sheer might of axes in their favor as well as triangle type advanced
In the arena they get silver swords a lot, but your unit has iron weapons so it's a mismatch. Plus the in-game arena you only get to lose once, which is why the swordmasters are so terrifying with that crit chance 😅
There is also the fact that many of the Arena units seem to have altered stats not based on existing class caps. Notedly, they alter them based on the unit you send in, so it is entirely possible to see a Swordmaster doing 10+ damage even though your defense is maxed and their STR cap + Silver Sword should be doing scratch damage to you. Swordmasters are balanced around their lower damage, so seeing one so such high consistent damage makes them terrifying.
Man. What a crazy and extremely revolutionary idea for a follow up video.. I Wonder where he got it from.
What's can i say, I'm just a creative genius
Before I watch - my money is on Heroes. Amazing in all stats really. Tend to be the ones to beat in the Arena.
Sacred Stones made me love the Wyvern Lord, Druid, and Hero classes so this totally didn't surprise me. I really need to level up a Wyvern Knight and Mage Knight to see what I'm missing. Also I really wish we could see how Assassin or swordmaster would do with Killing Edge.
Now we need to see the performance of the units considered the best and worst of each class!
I found the old video like yesterday or something. Nice.
Next up you gotta do monster classes and/or promoted lords
Love the content BAFE! What if we gave our weapon users two range weapons?
Then hero would win even harder 😅
@@BadAtFireEmblem haha yeah probably. I’m just thinking about my lance wielders. Javelins and hand axes are so easily accessible throughout the game, and I use them quite a bit. I wonder if that would force magic users to win less and for the lance users to win more
@@joshmcknight1771 yeah for sure
That was a fun experiment, but could you test your changes with unpromoted units next?
If I'm honest the amount of effort that goes into tournaments, I probably wouldn't do that much effort just to redo an old vid. This took 380 combat tests and hours upon hours of editing lol
@@BadAtFireEmblem Fear not, it wasn't a serious request, I was only teasing you.
Now that it's done, let's see which characters can beat them all, and for the first couple of suggestions, Seth, Percival, Duessal, and Milady.
bless papa bafe
Hell yeah, I already knew that the hero was the best class, but it's good to see my suspicion validated by this inarguable, completely conclusive study. Nobody can ever try to tell me that any other class is anywhere close to being as good as the hero without being objectively wrong, hahaha
You have the evidence to back up your claim :P
Tana and Vanessa: Hmmm should I promote into the 3rd worst combat class or the 3rd best combat class...? For real FE8 was quite unbalanced in promotion branches sometimes, Mage Knights get better combat and horses. Further notes: -From game feel I don't remember Summoner's combat being THAT much worse than Druid's... if you're using the same tomes. I have to imagine that because Thunder is actually good in a general use case and Druids get anima they absolutely destroyed them. -Using FE8 classes has its ups and downs, but especially effects classes with proc skills and crit bonuses as far as randomness is concerned. I could see rerunning this leading to general, swordmaster, serker, and wyvern knight scoring differently most of the time. Druid w/o anima and Valykrie w/ anima would be interesting too. - Obviously the one thing this doesn't account for is horse, wyvern, and armor weaknesses, although they aren't super prevalent throughout the game, but even without them funny to see a unit without weaknesses come out on top by a large margin.
I was expecting Swordmasters to win given how powerful they are in the Arena. But in hindsight their placement makes sense; other classes have 1-2 range or weapon triangle advantage over them and don't need to get lucky crits to score kills. Also, I'm surprised by how low the Paladin scored. Playable Paladins usually have good speed. I didn't know generics had such an underwhelming speed stat.
I was surprised by paladin as well, but the generics apparently have bad stats 🤷♂️
very good content
i'm curious to see how these promoted classes do with some actual character stat's and growths
interesting concept
GOATED KZheadR ALERT GOATED KZheadR ALERT
A hero can save us🎶
I predicted sniper to win at the start cause i thought it was gonna use Link Arena rules. There, the sniper goes uncountered vs 1range enemies when attacking, but 1-2 range enemies always attack snipers at 2 range.
I love my bow classes, don't get me wrong, but seeing Hero come out in 1st with Mage Knight in 2nd is such a gigantic serotonin boost as someone who loves these classes :D
Glad the video had a positive effect on you 😊
I like how you have justifications for the placements unlike with the base class tournament. Like yea obviously utility units like the thieves and specialized unit killers like archers and bishops aren't gonna come out on top against the super OP stuff like wyverns, it's a lot more interesting to see the performance between generalist combat units closer to the top
Especially in terms of purely generic enemies, thieves almost never attack the player, so they're never really meant to be combat threats, moreso meant to get you moving across the map
would have liked to see every class being allowed access to more than just one silver weapon of each type they can use. like especially the sniper feels shafted in this because one of their key advantages over the ranger is being able to use longbows, which might have made a difference in some match ups against 2 range enemies, but also weapon users not being able to use their 1-2 options is a bit of a downer, especially when having ready access to these weapons is what makes axe and lance users so much stronger than sword users in most of the games. also i'd throw the ability to use items into the mix. like perhaps a suggestion for a video in the distant future: every class gets three weapons that they can use then give them one elixir each and one other item that benefits them based on what they do, like giving pure water to a general for example.
Rangers and warriors can use longbows too. I think giving ones that can 1-2 ranged weapons might be kinda fair actually, but i disagree on the items. Pure water would just shaft all mages, and healing would prolong every match.
Winning when attacking second should award more points, like 0.75 instead of 0.5 Because of winning even after a disadvantage.
Going second isn’t as much of a disadvantage despite what you’d expect thanks to counterattack. It depends on how many hits each unit needs to defeat the other. For example, in a situation where two units fighting each other at the same range (i.e. they can counter) take 2 hits to kill each other, the unit that goes second will win ignoring misses and crits and doubles Unit 1 goes first, attacks and is countered. Unit 2 goes second, attacks and defeats unit 1. If a unit takes an even amount of turns to defeat the enemy than is it advantageous to go second since it will defeat the enemy while being hit less times since it will be that units turn when it defeats the enemy. This isn’t taking into account crits or misses though This is actually a decent strategy to use in regular fire emblem. Baiting the enemy into attacking first if you need two turns to defeat them so you only get hit once rather than twice Now that being said, if the units don’t fight at the same range (i.e. a sword master and a sniper) then yes going first is just objectively better. And I do think in most cases going first is better, just in my opinion not by enough to justify it being 0.75. Just my take though
@@TriAzF Hm you are correct. And yes, I was mostly thinking of the sniper and swordmaster example. I guess I would edit my proposal to be to only have the 0.75 for those cases where the unit can't counterattack.
@@tiarabite That’s pretty fair
I think it would be interesting to see what happens when you repeat the experiment 5 times and take the averages.
I'm surprised general didn't score higher considering their gimmick are big stats but no res or mov!
No speed. No speed no dice. You saw this yourself in the arena - nobody really picked generals to win and the only one who did well was running a cheese build, without wary fighter to carry them generals cannot hope to be the strongest class so long as a mage knight draws a breath in their body.
If it was Wendy instead of a generic general, she'd have beaten them all
@@BadAtFireEmblem so true lmao
Silencer likely didn't proc because of how low the Assassin's crit was with silver weapons. Its chance is half their crit rate in the GBA games. Sad to see it so low, but without Silencer it makes sense.
Really cool video as ever! But is it just me or when I try to join the Discord server, they tell me the invitation has expired or is invalid? 🙁
That's weird, I'll do a fresh link
Thanks, it worked!
Dark magic users are so busted that they have to nerf in the tournament. Otherwise, druid is gonna be the first place.
Yeah but if you allow druids nosferatu+luna then you allow Heroes to have brave swords and axes. Heroes stay winning.
Hero does make sense. Mage Knight was unexpected.
I didn't see mage knight coming
Grado Generals ranked really high with the expection of Dussel
I would not have guessed that the ____ would win! It kinda makes sense though, those base stats don't lie
I love the hero class and for years ive heard, Swordmaster is the better choice so I'm glad to see it win
Yes, Heroes! Great all around stats and the constitution to handle higher level weapons!
I remember when the thief class was buns in combat. Now in Engage maddening they’re the unit I fear the most. (And use the most)
Never played engaged so it's interesting to hear they're so good, what makes them so op?
@@BadAtFireEmblem they have amazing speed so they often double and have high avoidance, 1-2 range daggers (daggers cause poison on hit), they all have a passive skill that gives them double terrain effects (so if a forest gives a unit +30 avo the thief gets +60 so they’re virtually untouchable on forts and stuff as they’re capable of having over 100 avo), and their dmg ranges from average to abnormally good as they’re capable of 1 rounding a good portion similarly leveled nontanky units. P.S. Think of poison as a DEF debuff not like real poison, so every hit they land lowers your defense and they stack.
@@mjbrownii Also daggers are just really strong. They get like +2 might with every forge which you can do like 5 times. They end up being some of the strongest 1-2 range weapons
I think you’re highly overrating them. Think they’re good on normal and ok on hard but fall off a cliff on maddening. For starters if the enemy has 0 hit on you they just won’t attack you, so using them to enemy phase doesn’t work well. Also enemies have really high stats on maddening of the low strength base of the class and low might of knives make the class deal awful damage. So what you have is a unit who can situationally have good durability but does awful damage and won’t be attacked on enemy phase anyway when they have the strong durability. Also Wolf knight is just better, it has more movement and it has cav type which is far more useful since if you have any dagger user you want they to use Lucina. The poison on her chain attacks is a nice perk but the main use is if you’re stacking avo you can use them as a bonded shield user so they won’t be targeted by the enemies and they will hit the unit who is besides them. Why being a Cav matters is because it will give bonded shield a 100% activation rate on a mage knight, which is a great class for offensive power and will let you keep them safe while they double and one round on enemy phase. Even if the enemy lives the mage knight still survives the enemy phase and heavily dents them to be cleaned up on player phase. If you’re looking for another enemy phase unit vantage wrath is just far better in nearly every way. It’s more reliable since you can add hit to the weapons you use and you’re killing enemies instead of barely denting them. You can even do it at 1-2 range with Lief at bond level 9 (don’t go above otherwise he’ll sometimes pull out the master lance) and use adaptable on a warrior to switch between a killer axe and killer bow. Anyway think Wolf knight is just better, if you’re looking for enemy phase there’s far better options, and the damage thieves do just sucks compared to alternatives like Griffin knight, Wyvern knight, Warrior, Mage knight, etc. Think you can make use of them a little early game, but after chapter 10 they fall off a cliff in term of utility and Yunaka’s stacks are also just bad compared to Zelkov’s (she only wins in res and luck at equal level and he’ll be a higher level than her when he joins unless you literally dump every enemy kill into her). Zelkov is decent, but prefers to just reclass to Warrior as it’s just a better combat class. Enemy thieves can be hard to kill since they’re hard to double with their high speed, but wolf knights are also more annoying in this regard. Daggers start strong early but don’t keep up at all once your other units start promoting and using killer, brave, and silver weapons. Even steel weapon alternatives will often do more damage, especially with the massive str difference the classes have. Also other classes can one round, so you don’t need to make the enemy take 1 more damage from all sources. Even if you don’t one round the 1 more damage isn’t going to be the difference on whether you can 2 round, unless you’re using thieves which is why you’re struggling to kill enemies. Of course if you like using them to each their own, don’t think you’re making the game easier by doing so though.
@@twigz3214 sorry I think you misunderstood. I’m talking about fighting them not using them. They’re still useful on a playthrough but encountering them can be annoying
My only issue with the new ranking is that surely they should get more points if they win, since it's harder to win when they attack second, but that seems like a fairly minor issue. My prediction... well, last time I went with Mercenary, and Merc came 4th, but that was because I forgot about Wyvern Riders. So, this time, I'm going to go Wyvern Lord. The Wyvern Knight was also a tempting choice but I'm not sure if the chance of pierce occurring overcomes the Wyvern Lord. Edit: I should have stuck with my guns and gone with the Hero x.x Yeah, I'm not surprised by the Assassin doing so poorly. They either need a Killing Edge or Wo Dao (I think Assassins can equip the Wo Dao in FE8, since they promote from Mydridons as well?) to excel, because Assassinate is their main trump card. Without it... you just have a glorified thief. Also surprised that Berserker tied with Warrior, because most people say "Berserker is the best class and Warrior is one of the worst". And I'm surprised that the Swordmaster performed well, because usually swordmasters have a fairly low strength. And crits don't mean anything if you're dealing 0 damage.
Hahaha you talked yourself out of backing the winner
@@BadAtFireEmblem I know x.x
I like this question and my answer can only be berserker, axes have such a high ceiling
Was expecting Hero to make top 5, but never anticipated top placement. Hey Swordmaster! ...Eat your heart out.
It surprised me too
can you do one with maxed stats and legendary weapons?
For these Every Unit videos I wonder if it would be better if the thumbnail had them split half and half since it's more like a battle royal rather than the 1 vs Everyone the unit gauntlets are. I don't know if that would look as eye catching though.
Yeah exactly what you said, I think it's more eye-catching this way haha
how did you get the class stats to use for the battles? Very neat to see though
Febuilder autolevels then to level 20 based on the classes inbuilt growth rates the same as the game would when it normally works out enemy stats in the game
how many times did you test each matchup?
Super trainees are technically promoted units so it's sad that they aren't here.
I forgot about them to be fair. Rip
based on the battle shown, it seemed the valkyrie won against ranger since the AI prioritized 1 range combat, meaning no bow counter attack. did you notice that in any other classes?
if they prioritized the bow, Valkyrie would just fight at 1 range and not get counter attacked. Ranger just never gets to counter against a 1-2 range weapon
There was definitely a couple of cases of interesting ai choices that weren't optimal, but it mostly played properly
Woohoo hero number 1
Wow, who would’ve thought that priests/clerics even promoted were bad… Didn’t expect the Wyvern lord to be in 5! I had guessed it to be first. Mage knight being high is impressive! Zero to HERO!!! Nice!
You really hate those priests and clerics haha! Yeah I thought the top 5 wouldn't look exactly how it did, I was surprised
@@BadAtFireEmblem I just feel vindicated that’s all ahahhah! Yeah, surprised with the results, but happy to see some magical classes up there
Would you ever consider doing this with each units best in slot weapon? Giving a brave weapon to some classes or like the Wo Dao to swordmaster?
Unfortunately, Brave Weapons (or Legendary Weapons) are every classes' best in slot. Only the Assassin benefits enough from wo dao to offset this because they can only win off of getting lucky with their personal.
The anticipation for hero was killing me, wanting not to see it until last because its my favorite, each reveal hurt me because of anticipation, yet made me releaved. But finally the sheer glee i felt when it won. Also if you make and design corrins strengths and weeknesses that of a hero. Corrin solos the game.
Silver weapons are not the BIS for every physical class, the assasin NEEDS the killing edge.
I’m just here for the villager murder
I actually did guess the winner. Mostly because I fanboy over their crit animation since my first fe7 run haha
"Dark mages with Luna and Nos would have been busted" That's the point. Let them be busted.
Maybe in another video 👀
Had a feeling the Hero class would win. They are so good. Didn't expect Mage Knight in 2nd place though, I thought that would be Wyvern Knight.
I was surprised by mahe knight too, but it makes total sense in hindsight
Yeah I didn't realize Mage Knights were that good.
Only having played FE7, it's a little mind boggling how low the paladin got, he was my best guess for #1 (aside maybe for the Wyvern promos).
No, Paladin is good for their movement, not their combat. Now if both parties had elixirs and the paladin was allowed to run and heal up between skirmishes? Then the paladin would score much higher. Higher move = you get first hit, and first hit after you regroup.
In pure combat, sure Paladin ranks pretty low… but Horse Emblem is a meme for a reason. The high mobility units are king since not many maps have things that can slow them down. One or two desert maps and maybe a few FOW maps, but their excellent ability to reposition and canto basically wins them the day. In Fe8, enemy quality is low enough that Paladins are enough. Everything higher is overkill. In Fe6-7, they got Axes, which means both Javelin and Hand Axe spam for an effective 10 threat range with good weapon triangle advantage. And… we shouldn’t forget that these are based on the generics of each class. And… well… in every GBA FE game, the top 10 are SCARY. Heros with Silver weapons are tanky, Druids usually hit like a truck and Swordmasters can fish for crits to wreck you even with weapon advantage. Bern’s Wyvern Lord spam is stuff of nightmares too. Thank god only Valter can be an enemy Wyvern Knight.
That intro was too funny
Glad you enjoyed it lol
Honestly, I never use anything other than killing edge and wo dau with the assassin and swordsmaster
I wonder if it's just a coincidence my favorite classes tend to be the best.
Seeing General in the Top 10 feels weirdly emotionally validating
A couple of people have said the same thing, there's a lot of general fans out there
What Is The Strongest SWORD In GBA Fire Emblem?
Bishop’s weird because it’s really OP in fe8 since so many enemies are monsters. But it’s got bad stats vs human enemies.
Yeah exactly, and light magic is ass
I was surprised that the Paladin scored or ranked so low.
I was too
Did the Hero had a killer weapon for a guaranteed crit on Deathica or was that coincidental?^^
No just a silver sword lol
Druid is the most reliably strong class IMO during actual gameplay.
Which fire emblem awakening class is strongest?