Is Spider-Man the greatest video game hero of all time? • What Makes Spider-Man ...
Through the years we've seen many Supervillains appear on the silver screen. Through every Marvel or DC movie there has been a vast array of Villains that have been great and others that have fallen short. But in 2002's Spider-Man directed by Sam Rami, Willem DaFoe gave us one of the most terrifying Supervillains ever, The Green Goblin. DaFoe's Green Goblin was sinister, evil, and could only be brought to life by Willem. Even appearing in the latest Spider-Man No Way Home, DaFoe's Green Goblin stole the show once again.
#Spider-Man #GreenGoblin #Nerdstalgic
Written by Dave Baker
Edited by David Sadvari
Is Spider-Man the greatest video game hero of all time? kzhead.info/sun/g7CDdNp6bnmQmGw/bejne.html
Hey, I know this is kinda weird, but can you tell me who narrated this episode please? The voice sounds so similar, like I’ve heard it on a different channel before...
yes he is
He ain't a game character
@@retardman5193 There are versions of him in video games but I get your point
No.
I find it also fascinating how in No Way Home he acted with his every single facial muscle and yet it was very simplistic and never came off as being too much! Even after a 20 year break, he stole the show in each scene and was maybe even more menacing than ever. Willem Dafoe truly is an acting powerhouse!
EXACTLY! It's like he never left the role
AGREED WHOLEHEARTEDLY HE'S THE GREEN GOBLIN GOAT MARVEL NEEDS TO REMEMBER
If MCU ever has a Green Goblin be introduced I want Dafoe to play him again, I don't care about rights and other things I just wanna see it happen unless the actor can't because of health or personal issues
Yeah he absolutely killed it
@@jellymatsuryuka6853 he will die before then
what really gets me, personally, is that he drives the double personality angle of his character so well. When he's Harry's dad and a businessman, you really fell for his struggles, and its also very believable when he goes full on crazy. You can actually feel that he is a threat.
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL
As Willem himself said, "I took the job because I was getting to play two roles"
@@SparrowIZ Get out of here
@@SparrowIZ no marvel is better than dc
@@SparrowIZ Liking DC more than Marvel: Normal Commenting stupid shit like this on a Marvel video: Miserable human being
Another little detail that is seldom acknowledged is that Dafoe wore prosthetic teeth when playing Norman, but had his natural tooth gap on display as the Goblin. This detail returns in Spider-Man: No Way Home.
Wow didn't know that at all. Never saw that detail. Good to know!
Oh?? I had no idea! But thanks, now I'm gonna rewatch the films and see!
I never noticed it until i saw it in a different comment
0:05 norman 0:38 green goblin
What? 0-0'
Willem Dafoe's Goblin is so underrated overall as a villain. He understood the assignment for both Raimi's First Spider-Man film and for No Way Home. Finally he is getting the props he deserves for the Goblin role.
He is very underrated because nowadays people just look at villains to see their relatability instead of looking how threatening, entertaining and competent they are
He’s never been underrated dude
@@MaxAndCheese0917 He always was until NWH, he would always be in the bottom of the list of spidey villains And the reason is "He just wants to kill spidey and nothing else, he doesn't have a good motivation" It was after NWH that people appreciated him more by his scary and threatening presence
Hes not underrated , according to lot of people he is #1 spiderman villain
@@artguy7992 Doc Ock and Sadman: Are we a joke to you?
The fact that he woke up in an entirely different universe, caused absolute fucking havoc for a version of Spider-Man he doesn’t even know out of spite, is pretty terrifying I would say Edit: Hey Spidey Fans! Thanks for all the likes and love. Please keep this thread positive and no bashing others opinion if you comment.
exactly. Him destroying that spell containing box made Peter having to wipe everyone's memory of him, ruining his life
@@rudrasingh6354 Yes. It always HAD to be this way.
@@rudrasingh6354 so yeah, he almost caused a multiversal crisis. Up there with Loki and fricking Scarlet Witch.
Seeing him with Peter is scary. He so easily falls back into acting like how he did with his own Peter. He seems to genuinely like MCU Peter and connect with him. And that just makes the Goblin more determined to ruin him
@@carlycrays2831 Well I'd be determined to be a demon like thing in terms of causing chaos too if I saw another me just enjoying life while I can't do anything but watch and take over sometimes
Willem Dafoe doesn't get enough credit for his role as the Green Goblin. He set a standard for his villain role in the movie.
he is something of a great actor himself
I agree. To me, he is the epitome of green goblin as Hugh Jackman's the Wolverine.
i think he absolutely did with no way home
Absolutely. I frequently find myself using his performance of Green Goblin as a sort of measuring tool, that threshold that needs to be crossed for a villain to go from fine to great.
I was a kid when I watched this and up until my twenties I always thought of Dafoe as The Green Goblin 😅. So iconic 🙌🏻
This is exactly the kind of stuff I've been saying about Dafoe's performance for 20 years. Also, casting James Franco as Harry was perfect, the resemblance is uncanny.
I know! Why does nobody talk about this?
They did really look alike.. even down to the hairdos, perfect casting.
The fact that Dafoe looks still looks exactly the same as he did in the 80s is a little terrifying.
Maybe the goblin formula worked after all
it looks like he's born a 40 year old man
80s? When the fuck do you think the first Spider-Man movie came out?
@@duddyfacial3827 Spiderman: To live and Die in L.A.
Really he looked far too old for a 46-year-old at the time lol. His age finally caught up with his looks. Tobey Maguire in NHW is the same age as Willem Dafoe in 2002. It's crazy.
What really got me was that his last words were, "Don't tell Harry." He could have apologized, he could have threatened, but instead that last line showed a large part of Osborn that was hidden away. The part that cared what his son thought.
agreed
I remember that the game adaptation had a different take on his last words. In that game, his last words were "Tell Harry that I'm sorry.", different, but still show his care for his son.
I felt like that line showed both sides of Norman's split persona. He wanted to protect his son from the horrible truth, but not entirely out of caring about Harry: he also didn't want to lose that elevated status Harry gave him. Egomaniac till the end.
It’s also still so messed up, that he couldn’t tell Harry himself, he could only tell Peter to tell Harry for him That last line just has so much of the character embedded in it
I think that he maybe knew that Harry will blame Spider-man for all of that, maybe it was a plan?
The "don't tell Harry" line is also great. In his final moments Norman comes out again and pleads with Peter to not reveal how far he's fallen. So that at least the one person he cares about the most will remember him as a good man and not the monster he's become.
Alternative theory: that was still the Goblin persona, knowing full well that it would torture Peter further to keep such a significant secret from Harry.
@@faded1to3black holy shit. That’s genius. I’m gonna start looking at it this way. Much more dastardly
@@faded1to3black Ok that's just depressing I'm gonna go with the first option, thank you very much.
@@faded1to3black I think it's possible that you are right, but to expound further, what if it is the goblin saying "Don't tell Harry" because the Goblin wants Harry to become him and knows that telling him at that moment would cause that plan to fail?
It's genius in general because it establishes the future conflict between Harry and Peter (Harry hating Spiderman and by extension Peter for killing his father - Peter being unable to explain himself without shattering Harry's memory of his father)
The duality theme in Rami’s trilogy is fascinating. All three villains and Peter struggle with the choices of their two possible sides
I do like that. Interesting is it lost on our culture now where someone's either good and we idolize them or bad and we 'cancel' them (whatever the hell that means). People can choose to be either and we all make good and bad choices.
this.
Only Aunt May didn't have a double life.. MJ, Harry, Norman, JJ, Otto, Flint, Eddie have dualities
I remember when I was a kid seeing this for the first time, goblin genuinely terrified me. Especially the scenes when Norman was talking to the mirror. It was my first time seeing a superhero movie and at the tender age of five, this was my first Introduction to what a great (and terrifying) villain is supposed to be. And honestly, a lot of villains even in the MCU don’t come even close.
no villain in any Superhero movie has ever scared me. Except for the Green Goblin.
Same. Saw this in theatures, and this was the series I grew up with. No villain seemed to come close to his amazing acting skills!
Haha I kept away from this movie as much as possible till I watched it at home. Heading Goblin's laugh right after Doc Oct literally sent shivers down my spine.
....you were 5, a person jumping out at you going "ah!" would scare you lol
@@mac1462 I mean you ain’t wrong lol honestly every movie scared me as a child even kids movies but I guess Spider-Man was watchable since it had a colorful hero that gave me a sense of comfort while watching a terrifying villain
I remembered him more than any other character in the movie. He was legitimately frightening, but so captivating.
Frightening and hilarious
I can appreciate his performance so much more 20 years later. I was 7 when this came out and even then I was stunned. I can’t even describe the feelings that came over me during his NWH performances; God bless ‘im
More than Jameson???
Tbh i already find him cool and scary since spiderman 1 but they even made him more terrifying in NWH, i mean jezus.. i never knew how strong he is when it comes to hand to hand combat, and not to mention his insane durability not even shedding some blood or bruises from Peter's punches
Listen to the erina face zoomed in
I loved Dafoe in NWH because his portrayal of Osborn was almost like someone with dementia. They know something is wrong in their moments of clarity. There's also fear in loosing themself to this "other" self that acts differently than them. It's heartbreaking to see and it immediately made me feel something for Osborn.
And the thing is, this is exactly what makes him so dangerous. The Goblin knows Norman is exactly the sort of person May is used to helping.
Damn I never thought of that comparison, that's actually genius and you're 100 percent right. Really makes you feel bad for Norman
It is very much like a dementia patient. The scene where Norman goes to Aunt May's work and is all confused really hit home for me because I work closely with dementia patients. It is very heartbreaking sometimes. When someone has duel personalities like Norman Osborn and Green Goblin, there's moments where they will black out. This ties into the confusion as seen with dementia. It is hard to differentiate reality.
I also loved him in nwh as it showed his true acting skills without the mask
I'm glad this time he didn't kill himself and we seen an alternative route with Toby.
We just watched the Tobey Maguire trilogy (my bf and I) and he covered his eyes during the scene with the Green Goblin in the burning building. It was the scariest scene of his childhood. The Green Goblin scenes were definitely the most impactful of all three movies. Him talking to himself in the mirror, crawling along the floor to get the mask. Such a great villian. His face is up there for me with Jim Carrey in terms of the way he can manipulate his features. Really an incredible actor.
Your boyfriend sounds like a pussy..
The "Don't let him take me again" line reminds me so much of the most impressive thing (in my opinion) that Mel Blanc ever did. In one episode of Looney Tunes, Bugs and Daffy are making fun of each other, and they do it by impersonating each other. Mel voiced Bugs pretending to be Daffy AND Daffy pretending to be Bugs, creating four distinct voices instead of just going into his original voices. Similarly, Dafoe manages to make a distinct voice for when the Goblin is in control but is trying to sound like Norman, and we can tell exactly what it is.
It was Rabbit Fire (part one of the "Rabbit Season/Duck Season" cartoon shorts) that had Bugs pretending to be Daffy and Daffy pretending to be Bugs.
Everyone keeps saying that they want Willem Dafoe to play the Joker, but after watching No Way Home, I realized that he doesn't need to. Dafoe mastered the Green Goblin so well that I believe that playing the Joker would feel like a step down for him. I think he would be a fine Joker, but he embodies the Goblin so well that it would feel redundant for him.
Well put
Plus, the Joaquin Phoenix portrayal of joker already established who will be great for the role.
@@mr.vansjohnson7469 he is good for THAT interpretation of joker. It's very hard trying to see Joaquin Phoenix joker fighting batman at any point.
I'm sure it wouldn't be that hard to see him go toe to toe with rob Pattinson's Batman,plus joker relies more on his clever thinking and wits, he literally has a cult.
@@mr.vansjohnson7469 I cannot see that at all. Robert pattison batman even just from the looks of the trailers would annihilate arthur fleck.
I think the bigger appeal is that, unlike comic Norman, who’s always rather cold to Harry for his underachieving, Dafoe’s Norman actually seems like a decent dad and inventor. So there’s far more tragedy involved when the Goblin persona causes him to become an agent of chaos. Also Dafoe’s face is scarier than the Goblin mask. That’s just a fact.
He's not really a decent dad, he still shuns Harry for being a slacker and having to drop out of private school, and he treats Peter like a son because he's much more impressive, even offering him a job and then being pleasantly surprised when he turns him down because of his old fashioned views, even then telling Harry he should get his fun out of MJ and ditch her because she's a poor public school girl with no connections.
@@Whiteythereaper He basically told Harry MJ was a golddigging whore which she was He also was under the influence of the goblin then
@@Whiteythereaper Ok maybe it’s been a while since I’ve watched. But compared to the comics or like, Spectacular Spider-Man, this Norman isn’t played with belligerence or arrogance as top qualities. They’re there, but I always felt Dafoe played then more subdued.
Nah hes pretty dismissive of Harry, literally ignores him at his own graduation just to congratulate Peter. Harry's entire existence in the first movie is him trying to prove something to his dad. As if he's never been enough.
That’s why his mask was destroyed, because the creators of No Way Home knew this
The score during his first Jekyll and Hyde scene is super dark and terrifying, and it establishes his arc in the movie impeccably
This guy is such a beast. He just plays the green goblin so perfectly. Like in the movie no way home you can just feel how evil he was.
"The heart, Osborn. First, we attack his heart" That line still terrifies me. Because Goblin really chose to attack the ones closest to Peter just to make him realize that messing with him was a bad idea...
Its more fucked up when you realize he succeeds with just that with Tom's spiderman
Willem Defoe? I thought that was Rachel Maddow
@@ssupermario92 Eh, I dunno. Considering it doesn’t _actually_ stop either Spiderman from coming at him with the runback, it’s less that it “works” to dissuade them and more that it cuts directly to making them have to _really keep that effort_ to not just knock his block off. Which, in its own way, is simultaneously impressive, and a stinging reminder why secret identities are a “thing.”
Norman Osborn:"Understood!" *later* "Hey Peter! Wanna go to McDonalds?"
@@alecLogan its not to stop them its to break them make them break from being the goody too shoes hero its to make them show him there rage there fear there pain
We don't deserve how good william defoe was as green goblin. He even managed to terrify you outside the mask. He's the best villian in the MCU
The MCM now
That's because he was made before the MCU lol
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL
@@SparrowIZ huffing the copium
@@SparrowIZ Dc is better than Marvel at certain areas, like animation shows, games, solo/independent films but Marvel easily beats DC for making a successful franchise that is continuing up to today and with some good live action series connected to the MCU
Green Goblin without a mask in NWH is easily the best thing ever because we _really_ see how terrifying his expressions can be without it. An example being when Tom's Spidey was punching him and he then laughed in his face. THAT was epic scary stuff
Nah, the mask looks waay more menacing. He looked like a joke in NWH compared to 02 version.
Well I thing that both his face and his mask are each uniquely scary (especially whenever you hear his goblin voice with either one of them)
@@ZestySoul i mean can you really blame him he didnt have time to make a suit or anything he just got transported to that world right before dying
@@bullymaguire206 He had his suit, but Norman broke the mask. “Coward! We have a new world to conquer. You make me sick. Hiding in the shadows. Hiding from who you truly are! You can’t escape yourself!”
When my husband and I watched the scene with all the villains at Happy's apartment in NWH, my husband immediately heard the change and knew that Norman had switched over to Goblin, even though his back was to the camera. The fact that something that subtle clued us in is a tribute to how amazing Willem Defoe is as an actor.
Ok now I gotta watch the movie again!
I watched the first Sam raimi spider man movie as a kid it was very good the best spider man movie in my opinion but the goblin mask did scare me but I was fine it was a good movie
I was the same as your husband; I noticed both the voice and how he held himself changed ever so slightly as soon as Doc Oc mentioned to Norman that he was about to lose "his darker half". Meanwhile my husband didn't realise until Spidey shot the web in the living room at Goblin's hand to restrain him. Dafoe and McAvoy are the only two actors I've seen so far that can pull off multiple personality characters as if the actor actually has them themselves (Split wasn't a great movie but McAvoy was incredible in it)
I loved how later in that fight he switched back and forth while Spidey is beating him. Dude is just incredible. That laugh before seeing him after Doc Oct. He will be the laugh of GG for decades.
My eyes got so wide, I didn't think other people didn't notice it until the person I was at the movie with gasped when Spidey shot his webbing across the room
The scariest part of Goblin in NWH for me was how he has a glider, and pumpkin bombs, and this genius intellect, and yet he didn't need any of them to trounce Spidey in the second act. All he needed were his bare fists and his smile. That's all it took for him to nearly kill Peter, and that gave me chills.
Same thing for his final fight against tobey maguire. It really sells how much of a intimidating threat he is.
Well norman always was in a different weight class without enhancements spidey barely won when norman wore carnage
"Chills"
@@justaguywithagoodphoto4801 he didn’t win he had to trick him away from carnage
Norman Osborn in the comics is really strong. Glad we got to see a bit of that in NWH.
i loved how they broke the mask in nwh so we could really see his facial expressions, i think if he had the mask it would have been less scary
As the Weird Al lyric goes, "Now he's wearing that dumb Power Rangers mask, but he's scarier without it on". Dafoe's performance as the Goblin was truly frightening, both because he did so well as the Goblin who himself is frightening but also because of the moments of Norman who is horrified by what he's done. Oddly, the scene of arguing with himself in the mirror (in the first movie) kinda broke my immersion. Dafoe's performance was just SO good that I found myself thinking "WOW, He's good". For me that's what sold it. Lots of actors could play two different personalities in the same movie, and lots of them could play someone who changes from one to the other and back, but to whipsaw back and forth like that, to have the two characters having a conversation, ... That's why you get someone like Dafoe.
If I remember correctly, they did that because DeFoe wanted to use his own expressions rather than the mask.
Dafoe was the perfect choice to play the Green Goblin imho. His ability as an actor truly bought the Goblin to life and Dafoe really made this villain not only seem real but really captured the inner turmoil Norman faced when he came to the realisation of his dual personalities created by the Goblin formula. Dafoe played the Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde character to perfection.
I swear in now way home he was even scarier. In the hallway fight, Tom's Spiderman repeatedly beats his head in, but Goblin just LAUGHS IN HIS FACE after every punch, completely unfazed by the blows. And Willem Dafoes facial expression while doing that was absolute nightmare fuel. THAT was a perfect rendition of how Green Goblin is in comics.
lol Are people high? Why do people constatly sleep on the Goblinmirror scene in the first Spider-Man, I swear.
I loved the whole sequence. From Peter Spider-sense going into overdrive to Goblin not giving a fuck about the damage he was taking
@@petermj1098 "The heart,Osborn...first we attack his heart!" Just amazing writing
Omg that really was the scariest part
Goblin was a monster in the first film itself. He vapourised people, set a building on fire to get spidey's attention, put aunt may in the hospital, that cable car incident, nearly killed peter and even was even gonna rape Mary Jane.
While I absolutely love his performance in this film, I actually think it was elevated by No Way Home. The way that Dafoe portrays Norman is just so hauntingly sad and reminds me of dementia, he's able to be so sympathetic as Norman and so absolutely vile and hateful as Goblin. While there are a number of iconic castings in these types of movies, I do truly think Dafoe is one of the best and I'm so thankful for his return to take my new favorite Spidey to the next level.
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL
@@SparrowIZ Nobody will care about you
@@SparrowIZ No
You can talk about performance all day but as a character and writing Norman in the first movie is still the best. Norman in NWH doesn’t work without the first movie. It gives you everything about his character and his ideals. Norman in NWH is pretty much just fighting the whole time while it is a good acting portrayal the video is mainly talking about his character.
@@Karma-pq9fi Norman was given more time to fight back the Goblin in No Way Home. In Spider-Man 2002, he was unable to do anything about the Goblin. He is just helpless against him and he was never given closure to Tobey's Peter. Tobey just accused him of his crimes and then there's that. He never knew that Norman is suffering from a mental disorder.
Willem Dafoe stole the show as The Green Goblin in No Way Home 😯! He was really terrifying in Spider-Man when i watched it in the cinema back in 2002 . He nailed it in No Way Home .
This is always one of the best casting decisions they made. While the first film didn’t always give Dafoe a chance to flex the dual personas (since it is an origin story for Peter-Spidey first and foremost), the newest MCU film really leaned into letting Dafoe play with the personas even more especially near the climax and during the fight with Tom’s Peter
I also love that unlike 99% of MCU villains, Green Goblin is just plain EVIL, and that makes him absolutely terrifying. He isn't "misunderstood", not mind controlled, not corrupted from good intentions, there's no "grey morality", not a "random destructive force of chaos". He is simply Evil, set out to hurt the hero as much as possible just out of spite, and he is smart and capable enough to do that. Marvel needs more villains like that.
I feel like they make villains too "gray" nowadays, borderline on being anti-heroes themselves. Sometimes a bit less ambiguity is alright
Hard pass. Without any humanity or something for the audience to connect with, a villain is super boring. See Voldemort. Or, and I'll get crucified for this but its my opinion....Heath Ledger's Joker. Both roles were fantastically portrayed with what they were given. Contrast this with Hannibal Lector (Either Mikkelson or Hopkins) or Waltz's Hans Landa. Also well acted but those villains are far more interesting. Think of it like adding some sea salt to a sweet dish. The contrary ingredients make a better experience. But why should I care about Voldemort or the Dark Knight's Joker? They are nothing more than rabid animals that need to be put down. That's it. Boring.
@@stopmathrage You shouldn't need to care about the villain - you should be caring about the hero. If you are bored - the problem isn't that the villain, it's the hero. Good villain is the one that makes you root for the hero. There's a great graphic novel that explores the whole "rooting for the villain" idea, called Wanted.
That's honestly my biggest issue with the MCU. Their villains started to blend with heroes. Every villain had heroic intent. And while I loved it in Black Panther, by the time Spider-Man Homecoming came out, I was bored of it. Sony let Goblin be a villain. Norman's intent didn't subtract from any moment where Goblin was there. He was terrifying.
@@stopmathrage I agree with you but i don't think is that black and white. It depends a lot on the story you're trying to tell and if the villain is the focus or not. Let's say you're telling a story about a group of protagonist interacting or something like that, then it doesn't really matter if the villain is morally grey or not. Of course its a specific example, but i hope you get what i mean by that
I just can't get over the fact that Willem's response was, "I wanted to do it very bad," And, "It would be cool!" When he came back for Spider-Man 2 he wanted to try on the Doc Ock suit because he said, "It would be fun!" 😁
Usually, I see things about the Green Goblin and they tell me how campy DeFoe was, and I've never thought that was true. I was always fascinated by his performance. Are some of the tricks cliche like the mask on the chair and the mirror? Yes, I can agree with that, but the cliche is executed well. I spent the whole movie drawn in by how he used the elasticity of his face to convey the Goblin. You can see it even when he has the mask on. And his smile is a perfection only matched by Tim Curry fading into the Grinch in Home Alone 2. So thank you for a positive take on this performance. It deserves more praise.
What i love is that the “Dont let him take me again” line starts as Norman and by the end of the sentence it takes on that “goblin growl” towards the end. It’s amazing that DaFoe, intentionally or not, was able to show an audible version of Norman being dragged away against his will instead of ways being one persona or the other
The “Dont let him take me again” line starts as Norman and by the end of the sentence it takes on that “goblin growl” towards the end. It’s amazing that DaFoe, intentionally or not, was able to show an audible version of Norman being dragged away against his will instead of ways being one persona or the other.
The “Dont let him take me again” line starts as Norman and by the end of the sentence it takes on that “goblin growl” towards the end. It’s amazing that DaFoe, intentionally or not, was able to show an audible version of Norman being dragged away against his will instead of ways being one persona or the other.
dont
Wow I actually wanted to actual comment not just copy pastes
DaFriend
No one could ever play Green goblin as good as William did
For me it's his throaty raspy snarly voice and cackling, after watching A Nightmare On Elm Street at 9 Willem Dafoe got scary cause he reminded me of Freddy in the first movie
This role really scared me as a kid. Seeing his transformation in the lab is actually one of my oldest memories. I remember seeing it on a TV in daycare. Although I loved the trilogy growing up, that scene always spooked me.
The fact they were playing this in a daycare is a 🚩😂 don’t make day cares like they used to.
for me is the scene with the mirror, i remember seeing on tv and be so scared and disturbed
I wouldn't say it spooked me back then, the abrupt noises definitely contributed to that. Willems performance in that scene is literally the basis for any captivating super villains birth.
Oh! And tbh, I think we all can admit that in a way, the sandman's origin story in 3 definitely makes you feel something...
Wait that really isn’t scary at all
Glad someone else agrees...Willem’s incarnation of Green Goblin is easily the perfect villain in a Marvel movie: He begins with tragic motivations (the fear of losing his business) and as a result the “Goblin” personality emerged from his own mind (Norman Osborn was still a normal person but like everyone else he had dark feelings). Then Spidey shows up and first seeshim as an equal (“You and I are not so different” line is actually meaningful) and when Spidey refuses he then proceeds to attack everyone he cared for (Aunt May, MJ) even expressing his much inhuman side (like when he claims going to abuse MJ). Then during the NWH storyline, the Green Goblin still only cares for one thing: keep ruining Spidey’s life (doesn’t matter if that’s a different one) even to the point of destroying a total universe only to ruin Peter Parker (of course he even stabs Tobey’s Peter just because he can). So finally seeing Norman going back to heal his own mind fits entirely with his storyline, he was only a victim who got to be redeemed.
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL.
@@SparrowIZ lmao
Thank you, this is why to me NWH is one of the greats and top 10 best Marvel films, I put it up there in the same breath as Logan.
@@SparrowIZ Image comics better than both of them.
I gotta disagree I think vulture is a better example imo
Willem Dafoe is by far my favourite movie actor ever. I just adore his "Let's do it" attitude. In his own words, he's not interested in doing a job, he's interested in making sure a director sees their vision executed. He's a creature on their canvas and he loves that. That's WHY he's such a good actor and why he seems down for anything. Because his first priority is always making sure the director's intention is seen.
Dafoe has always been a masterful actor. His work in the lighthouse is honestly the best I've seen all my life yet. Glad to know that people recognise him because of the mainstream role.
He is also one of the only villains that effectively use physiological warfare. He tries driving the hero to insanity to where they lose themselves. As he tried making Peter kill him. He knew if he started, it wouldn’t end. As he told Peter, “strong enough to have it all, but too weak to take it” he knows if he dies, there will the birth or a worse villain.
Same thing for joker
Psychological
Tbf that is jokers entire shtick
After seeing William Defoe in No Way Home, I am convinced the man deserves an Oscar for his portrayal of the Green Goblin. *"Strong enough to have it all, too weak to take it!"*
Ayo it’s the guy I see everywhere
He already got awards for his work on The Lighthouse though. Not saying GG is bad, but his acting skill has been recognized by many.
Godspeed, Vader-Man
He was fantastic as green goblin and scary as hell in a simultaneously weirdly comical way. The way he laughed and cackeled was priceless...and his facial expressions haha. Omg. Totally underrated. 10 out of 10.
In all honesty, I really didn't find Dafoe's Goblin scary in the Raimi film. The image of him crawling on the floor talking to that Power Rangers-looking mask never fails to make me chuckle. But in No Way Home, once he ditched the mask and just started acting with his own face, he actually started to get intimidating for me. It also helps that he wasn't the only villain in the movie, meaning time usually spent on him making bad jokes or quips can be used for more important elements.
I think Norman being in an alternate reality made him even more insane. He's already struggling and then being thrust into a completely new environment where Osborn doesn't exist, makes him succumb to the Goblin even more easily
Yeah even Electro was more powerful and confident
He's terrifying because he's something of a scientist, himself
If I had been drinking something while reading this, I would have spilled the whole drink out my nose
This deserves to be top comment
Well put together but you can't fool us. Everyone knows what makes Willem's Green Goblin so terrifying is his unobtainable levels of drip.
The last fight in the abandoned building really is the chef's kiss on this whole film. Raimi directs that scene with a grittiness and a physicality unlike any other Spider-man film since, you really feel every hit and every blast exchanged by Spidey and Goblin, and the acting performances by Tobey and Willem capture all the dramatic weight that's been built up throughout the film perfectly.
I’ve always said for years the Green Golbin was one of the most terrifying villains in all of Marvel and it’s because of William Dafoe! He played his part so well I both hated and loved him in the movie. The part where he fought Spidey and nearly killed him in No Way Home truly terrified me. The way he looked at Peter with such hatred, and ferocity literally gave me goosebumps in the theaters! Gotta love Dafoes Green Goblin!
Yo i keep thinking about the part where Peter was punching him and Dafoe?goblin kept laughing...that's scaryt, how do you defeat a foe you can't hurt? or who doesn't care about it? be bodyslammed Peter and I was thinking how is he gonna get out of this??
I commented at the end that he can make a scary as hell character in a hoodie just with the hood up.
yess, seeing him again really made me realise how good of a villain he is. you don't get many villains like him these days
You know, when you think about it, Spiderman 2002 really did pave the way for modern superhero films. Technically, this means that Sam Raimi, Tobey Maguire, and Willem Dafoe are the biggest contributors to all of the MCU, DCU, Amazon's Invincible Series and many other popular shows of similar nature.
Blade saved marvel not spidermam but spiderman was the start of amazing marvel movies
The first two Christopher Reeve Superman movies are what paved the way for superhero films…then the first Micael Keaton Batman movie helped keep the genre alive…the Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies showed that Marvel also had good stories to tell
Well, one way or another those movies in each way contributed: -Cristopher Reeve's superman movies in particular first and second stablished bases to give a more respectable way after the camp from the sixties and silver age would come to an end - Michael Keaton's batman also made their good foundations to retake a darker atmosphere and a better way to be accepted Tragically, both Superman and Batman had to experience dark eras wich nearly caused the end off the superhero genre however... -Blade helped Marvel to get a better sucess and Spiderman had a proper debut with Sam Raimi. How each one paved their ways helped the MCU, DCU and many others to have a better idea off how to make the movies work.
I haven't seen Raimi's Spiderman in years and I don't remember a lot of the details, but I have always always remembered so well the line "Don't tell Harry" just before he dies. It really stuck with me, because the words he chooses to say, when he knows they'll be his last ones, tell you what he really cares about. He cares about his son. He cares about how his son will view him for the rest of his life, when he's no longer around to change that view or make amends for his deeds. He can't be there for his son anymore, but he can protect him from the torment and the stigma of knowing his father had turned into a monster. That's his final gift to his son, the only one he has the power to give in his final moments.
Definitely how you do a mad scientist. He was even impactful after death, for the characters and the audience. So damn good.
I always liked him the most of any villain from the original trilogy. After NWH I’m so glad it was able to solidify that he’s by far the best on screen Spider-Man villain and to me personally one of the best on screen comic book villains ever.
Willem Dafoe’s Green Goblin used to scare me as a kid. I was 4 at the time
I like how in NWH Norman is nasty af, like he's *scary* and Willem Dafoe conveys that perfectly
What I find really interesting is how Norman breaks the mask in No Way Home to get rid of goblin all together but this somehow reinforces the goblin persona. I say this because I think that Norman thought that the goblin persona came from the goblin mask but when there is no mask , norman has no way to rationalize the acts he does when goblin takes over and no way to switch to Norman (which he does by taking off the mask) and this convinces Norman that goblin was inside of him rather than in the mask( Goblin says there is no escaping me after the mask shatters in no way home) . Or maybe I'm just reading more than what's there idk !!
That’s fascinating (not sarcasm)
It was, just like Darth Vader mask made him Darth Vader. When Luke remove it, he become Anakin again. Problem with Goblin, he play role to much with his mask like in the 1st movie and let the Goblin persona take over.
I like your profile picture, love beyblade
This new Disney/marvel movies arent nearly as deep as the old movies, the broken mask was just an excuse to be the goblin without the mask since the original movie was criticize by his mask a lot. Nothing more to it .
Nice
Excellent analysis and brilliantly presented. Bravo!
Dafoe also insisted on wearing a "perfect" set of teeth for Osborn, and would remove them when he was playing the Goblin.
The original Spiderman trilogy is just pure gold. Even if you ignore nostalgia and the memes, you just can't deny how objectively good those movies are. People might prefer other modern versions but Sam Reimi's take will always be my favorite
The third is actually not that great tho, Spidey 2 was the best.
1 and 2 were incredible. 3 was just good.
First two are great. The third one is legit infuriating. Peter's relationships with Mary Jane and Gwen are SOO frustrating. Third would've been better if they spent more time fleshing out Venom and the Sandman instead of focusing on how much of a awkward, rude virgin Peter Parker was.
I think 1 and 3 were the best. 2 was boring to me. Ppl just remember the memes but Tobey taking on a bad boy persona and doing the part well is so memorable. On top of he and harry reuniting. Part 2 was just generic "superhero turns bad because of accident and gets defeated at the end."
@@Melissamms Venom was never supposed to be in it that's why it's messy also watch the editor's cut it kinda makes 3 a little better
One thing I've noticed recently is that Norman wasn't a victim, he is scared at first but eventually accepts the goblin's power. It's an analogy of how Peter was using his powers before Uncle Ben's death.
Norman is suffering from split personality disorder caused by the experimental serum he took, his original personality is just a normal guy, but the goblin personality he developed after the serum is a complete psychopath, and Norman is very much a victim to his other personality.
@@Klaital1 Yeah, it's easy to forget that this isn't the comics where Norman really is just an awful person all around. This Norman had his faults, but he wasn't an absolutely awful person.
it's more like goblin is dragging him along with him reluctantly. he's still wallowing around on the ground when he caves and goes along with goblins plan to go for "the heart, Osborn!!!"
@@carlycrays2831 The original 60's Norman was a worse person than his movie counterpart, but still cared for his son. It is very close, albeit more relatable on screen. Modern developments in the comics have slowly stripped him of any redeeming traits, though.
For both of the first two Tobyverse movies, they did a great thing. The villains were relatable, and actually kinda likable. We had Norman, a guy who was struggling with his company, who showed courtesy to Peter and to a point was a very sympathetic character. He makes a bad choice and that gives rise to an alter-ego who subjugates him. We still root for the good guy that's buried in there somewhere. It helps that WIllem seems to be having the time of his life. Cut forward a bit and we have Doc Octavius, a guy who initially begrudges hosting Peter, but is quickly surprised and impressed by his intellect. What starts off as a forced interaction becomes a joyful one that turns into dinner and electric conversation about Otto's work. He's a good man, aiming to do good things, but again this good persona is subjugated when the tentacle harness takes control. Instead of paper-thin villains, we got villains with depth played by talented actors who put in great performances. They're villains, yes, but they're also both victims. That's interesting. That's drama, and many other films could prosper by taking note of that.
Such a great analysis for the first movie. Still remember seeing it in theaters. Thanks for this.
Now i can use this video to explain why i love Willem Dafoes Green Goblin instead of saying "He is to the MCU & Green Goblin what Mark Hamill is to The Joker & DC"
That other thing is %100 true though. He is as good as mark hamil. Hes awsome.
I fully agree.
@@Kinseliplier Couldnt have made a better comparison
@@Tandor97 actually Royal Kitsune made the comparison. I was just agreeing with him. But yeah.
@@Kinseliplier i was agreeing with you, but didnt make it clear. My bad
Defoe's acting was so good that even I as a kid understood Norman and Goblin were two different characters with different personalities. I loved his acting and still do.
The mirror scene is so amazing to look back on, William really felt like different people
6:41 well not exactly 'moral quagmires', it is relative;y simple
Willem Dafoe is such an incredible actor. He’s easily the most talented actor in the Spider-Man film series.
He is indeed. Dafoe is easy one of the best actors ever
Watching this after seeing no way home, you can really see the dedication that he put into his roles.
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL
@@SparrowIZ of course it's this guy
@@SparrowIZ how?😂😂😂😂 y’all can’t even keep actors
@@JustFost0203 ignore him, he writes the same thing on dc vids, he just wants attention.
@@NoobryYT Exactly, like I enjoy both... I love both... as much as i am a fan of spiderman that much fan I am of batman... but come on i dont write these things... these guys are just attention seeker
That lower register shift in Dafoe's voice when he asks for Peter's hand after you explained that. Shivers
That scene where both the goblin and Norman are talking to each is just masterful...Willem is, was and always will be a brilliant actor.
When the movie came out in 2002, I thought he didn't get enough recognition. Take note how he was able to play both green goblin and Norman SIMULTANEOUSLY when he was walking towards the mirror. Underrated scene.
Andy Serkis took notes
Facts, Sam's Spidermans have the PERFECT casting of every character. That's what I love most about this Era, it stays true to the comics in nearly every way
Even when Sony got too big headed on Spiderman 3 insisting Venom be in it despite Raimi not being big on the villain, you still believe it has a bunch of Sam's touch still?
@@Thomasmemoryscentral yes.
Except on the ways that are Mary Jane being his first love interest that was a complete garden hoe to Peter most of the time
Topher Grace as Eddie Brock 😂
@@urethrafranklin5981 ditto on topher
Excellent! I so loved this rendition of Spiderman. So much more depth and nuance that we see now in the hero flicks!
WILLEM DAFOE's face is scarier than the Goblin mask he wears. 😮🤤😨 Plus his voice was wicked witch kray-kray even without the insane cackle. It was perfect casting. 🤗😍😎
I'm so glad they made the change to have Green Goblin without his mask in No Way Home because Wilem's crazy look is better and more convincing than any mask.
I got chills in the movie when he shattered the mask but the goblin laugh was there . Such a good movie
Forget the Green Goblin, I think Willem himself is terrifying. His “crazy” is frickin off the chain. Love that guy in anything.
What other movies would you recommend with Dafoe?
@@vietnamd0820 boondock saints
@@vietnamd0820 the lighthouse. Dafoe was genuinely making me concerned about who to trust in that whole movie
@@vietnamd0820 100% go watch The Lighthouse! Willem DaFoe at his best!
@@BrogMan1 Will do thank you!
How did I miss this video!!! SO GOOD!
Thank you so much for giving words to the feelings I had as a kid watching this, but didn't know how to describe at the time. Hell, I had even forgot this movie struck chords with me as a kid. I think the dancing SM3 scene made me put all those Toby MacGuire spiderman stuff in the memory vault
Simply: he was born for this role. He insisted on being in costume as much as possible. A lot of actor hate being in costume(hides their face), so their performance shows.
Dafoe knew the brand new audience that this movie would get him. He was extremely wise with his choices
He absolutely KILLLED IT in no way home Best villain in the MCU
I love how Sam Raimy took a risk because Dafoe looked *nothing* like what he looked like in the comics yet Willem still made an ASTONISHING Goblin.
In my case it’s because he’s in the same stance as otto. Their both still great men under that affliction. It’s just the affliction brings out the worst and most distraction in them. The only difference is unlike Otto, Norman can hide it because the green goblin can hide in plan site while tentacles cannot. The green goblin can fake being the kind, caring and virtuous Norman and that fact makes him even scarer then Otto could be.
The thing is, his Norman actually cares and is trying to be a good father to Harry. He cares about his employees and his company and he took it upon himself to the be the guinea pig for the testing. When Norman yells "You know how much I have sacrificed?"...it does not refer to what you think; but it refers to how much time he sacrificed by not being as a father for Harry. This can be seen in another part of the movie when he tells him "I haven't always been there for you, have I?" Unlike the comic book version and the one shown in spectacular spider man where Norman is cold, cunning, selfish and calculating while the goblin is a slightly dialed up version of those traits....I like the duality/split personality here, even though it may sound basic it makes him a lot more sympathetic.
Basically the thing that makes him better here is how he actually makes you feel empathetic for him when he can't control the Goblin
Everyone is saying that he should play Joker but Dafoe would be perfect as Two-Face.
He’s more based on the 90s Spider-Man animated series than the comic version.
He was amazing in No Way Home. Dafoe himself said that he wanted to go all the way, for the character, or not do the movie at all. And it clearly paid off so well in this new movie!
Dafoe continued his magnificent performance in No Way Home too. He was fantastic. It was great seeing him influencing the other villains and that evil cackle when Spidey kept punching him in the face was frightening. It was/is great seeing such an accomplished actor actually want to play this role in Raimi's spider-man. Because back then super hero movies were obviously not viewed the same.
That 'dont let him take me' line made the hairs on my neck go up. I didn't realise it at the time, but you're right- that's the GOBLIN pretending to be Norman, and I only realised it subconsciously. Willem Dafoe is truly amazing. The Raimi Spiderman films were a little cheesy, but boy they did so much right
Such a well thought out and well put together film character analysis, I'm forreal, like I'm impressed, I'll be 22 years old in just a couple weeks and probably like just about any person in my age group, I grew up watching the Sam Raimi Spider-Man films probably more times than I've gone to the bathroom in my life (not literally but you know what I mean lol) and I learned new information in this video that I had never even thought about, I'm impressed, keep up the good work man, I want more 💪💪💪👊👊👊🔥🔥🔥
You are so right on with this! I really didn’t know how to put it so eloquently, but you said it beautifully! I’ve never really been a huge fan of Defoe, until this! He was fine before, & maybe I just haven’t seen very many films with him, granted. But this performance put him on the map & on everyone’s radar even if they didn’t like him before! I’m amazed when an actor can call upon nothing more than their own strength and talent for a breathtaking performance! That’s what he did here. His magnificent performance would have been the same without all the camera angles & such! It reminds me so much of the beautiful performance Leonardo DiCaprio playing in (\_________________) where he was twin kings…1 horrible king currently ruling & 1 kind king who had been hidden away in a cell all his life to hide his identity! When they “switched” you could honestly tell that he was the good guy, pretending to be the bad guy! This is 1 man playing all these parts! That’s talent! Same as we see with dafoe when he begs for his life to be protected from the monster! We can see when that monster enters back into him & its well before he finished his sentence! It was as if his eyes are bright with hope, then a dark cloud goes by and suddenly his eyes look dead. SPOOKY! It seems the eyes are the windows to the soul…people in real life would do better to look into a person’s “windows” to see their true self!
The scene at 3:05 uses his voice as the Green Goblin Goblin in Surround Sound at certain times and it’s one of the few and best uses I’ve heard of an actor’s voice being used like that. It really complements the performance of the actor and pulls you into his world where he can’t escape this voice in his head or everywhere he looks/goes. It might just be the Goblin laughing on your left and then your right but I remember it being one of the reasons I was happy that I had just gotten a Surround Sound setup.
How much does surround sound cost.
@@fireblade696 If you have headphones, you have enough surround sound for that scene. KZhead compresses it to Mono though, so you can't experience it on youtube.
@@fireblade696 starting $300 for a low end system like mine but you can spend a lot more a get a much better system.
Every time that spider man has fought green goblin I've been genuinely afraid for peter, it's a feeling that no other villain can conjure in me, Goblin is just terrifying.
One of my favourite things about this Green goblin is that Norman is a good guy. He isn't evil, it's the goblin that's evil, where as in the comics Norman.. ain't a nice guy. Same with Doc Ock! Love how he's kind in Sam Raimi's Trilogy!
Even as someone who only recently got into these movies it’s amazing just how impactful it felt watch Willem DaFoe’s duality on screen and believing he was genuinely insane
What showed me how much Dafoe understood his character was the scene on the roof when Peter is sitting in the floor and the Goblin gives him the speech. The way he mocks Peter at the same time he is being serious and trying to convince him, that felt very human, like he connected with Peter. He was not just playing a standard evil character, he was playing a person with real feelings
I watched this in theaters in 2002 and was a huge Spawn and Spider-Man fan growing up. This movie outside of Blade actually showed early on what a good a comic film could be like, and represented Spider-Man and Green Goblin incredibly well like how they are in the older comics. Such a under appreciated movie now with all the bloat of super hero movies out there now.
Don't forget X-Men
Agreed, these so called "fans" aren't more than simply mcu fans who will attack any other kind of comic book movies just because they are not part of the mcu. Spiderman along with X-men and blade were the films that revived this dead genre at the beginning of the 2000s, and these people have no respect for these films, something incredible sad and pathetic when you get to know the reason of their dislikes and hate towards the other films.
DC BETTER THAN MARVEL
@@SparrowIZ I mean it really depends there are things I like from both and things I do not. At the end of the day I am just hoping when the spawn movie comes to fruition that it will actually be good.
@@eliasfigarzon9813 bruh not all mcu fans suck . I like the OG movies more than the mcu and i myself believe that Spider-Man 1, 2 and spiderverse > entire mcu . NWH is close 2nd tho.
I rewatched this movie yesterday just for his preformance and it was SO SICK
This was so great to watch, had to watch this video twice.
Think Dafoe's performance highlights how important it is for the actor playing the role to be passionate and have a genuinely fun time. The Green Goblin portion of Norman's duality is like Dafoe having the chance to put every macabre and maniacal detail he's ever wanted to work with on screen - mirroring the ACTUAL Goblin persona. And that just _works._
When I was a kid, I remember that he didn't terrify me, but one thing about him inntroduced me to mental instability, and _that_ was amazing to me. Like, when I reached the last scene in which he pleaded for his life, I could _actually, seriously tell,_ thanks to the movie's work, that he hadn't lied for a single second when he'd say that there was another person inside of him. And to my child self, the idea that it's even a thing was just... supremely mindblowing.
So true. I felt the same
That’s always been the appeal of Green Goblin for me. The way he’s trapped inside this evil persona, and you feel so bad for him and yet fear him at the same time.
Dafoe is a great casting for lots of villains, he can put himself in that character perfectly and make anyone feel really against the villain as if you are Peter in the end of the last movie