Everything you need to know about the new Prusa MK4!
Get the Prusa MK4 go.toms3d.org/MK4
Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
1:03 Load cell autoleveling
2:05 Live adjust Z?
2:28 Nextruder toolhead
3:14 Cold-swapping nozzles
3:26 Nozzle options
4:06 Why not Revo?
4:52 Stock hotend performance & modding options
6:25 Third-party nozzles (patents?)
6:37 Input shaping
7:41 Input shaping challenges on i3-style printer?
8:04 Printer performance goals
8:57 New motors (VFAs)
10:05 Additional wear from higher speeds?
11:33 New touchless user interface
12:34 New bed, compatibility to MK3
13:22 New extruder & suitability for flexibles
14:45 Filament sensor
15:40 Potential future use of the load cell
16:31 Additional sensor on toolhead
17:39 Toolhead daughter board
18:35 New mainboard
19:44 Networking features
21:11 Offline printing options
22:44 Still using TMC2130, more VFA fix details
23:56 Issue 602
24:37 MK3 upgrade options
26:20 End of life for previous machines
27:41 Multi-use firmware
28:09 SMT line tour
28:56 Pricing and product goals
30:38 Why still use printed parts?
32:23 MMU3
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Their reliability is almost a problem for them. I would get a MK4, but my MK2.5 is still going strong as ever.
But this also means they maintain some resale value. Maybe you could upgrade to a used MK3.
how much print time do you have on it?
I have a Mk2+ with a 2,5 upgrade that I have not yet installed 😄 I have used the printer since 2017 and it never failed in anyway 👍 But it would be fun to have a Mk4 :)
Yes and no. If they have private investment or were publicly traded then yes the pressure for infinite exponential growth would force them to make crappier products until they implode or get bought out. The idea of shareholder supremacy that took hold in the 70's and has been f-ing us and the planet over ever since. If not then the only reason to grow is to help as many people as possible. They can grow organically as needed and keep doing their thing slow and steady. I don't know if they have outside investment. I don't think they're publicly traded though. I hope they never are because it will destroy the company. As it stands, I assume they don't need to sell more and more printers every year as long as they break even financially.
@@cupbowlspoonforkknif I might take you seriously when you do one or more of the following three things: 1. Start your own company and decide you don't need to make any money at it. 2. Invest all of your money in companies that decide they don't need to make any money at it. 3. Try to work for a company that decides it doesn't need to make any money at it. Any company that ever existed without startup investment, or decided that it didn't need to provide a decent return to whatever entity made an investment in it, didn't last very long.
Thanks to everyone who submitted questions on Twitter and Mastodon!
Thank you very much! ❤
Gigop pp hpppppoo😊😅😊
And well done to you Thomas . This video I found so much more informative and easy to watch / listen to than the prusa live stream announcement - which was double the length . You add a real, huge amount of value by working out what to ask, asking those questions, videoing showing detail clearly, and lastly editing it into a whole. Also well done to Josef and esp Mikolas who have such deep knowledge and are so clear in their explanations. I have nothing but admiration for how clear they both are in English - not their mother tongue, they like yourself are far more expressive than many native English speakers in English. Very impressive. Thank you.
Backwards compatibility is a good thing. There's nothing wrong with V6 style nozzles
@@dggcreations How does dragon HF manages to be high flow when it still uses V6 nozzle? Though my dragon is still waiting for rest of the Voron to be assembled. So not speaking from experience.
I Push 30mm^3 with my Dragon HF and a 0.6 CHT nozzle. I don’t need higher flow rates. Voron 2.4R2.
@@dggcreations they said nozzle, not the entire hotend. The vast majority of nozzles used are V6 specs, and the top selling high flow setups use them (Dragon, Rapido, etc)
Unless you have a Revo, and then you don't want to go back.
@@dggcreations Damn that's crazy but the fact the Bondtech CHT exists makes everything you said a blatant lie.
And I really love their stance on priorities. Producing locally and fair, as well as keeping everything open and self testing all the parts constantly are values I really like. I'll stick with Prusa for these soft factors alone. I don't need one. But I really want one now. :D
Wow, I really appreciate the efforts you put in the video and the editing! Looks cool!! Keep up with all the good work Thomas!!! Wish you the best!!
Really great interview. Answered some questions I had that didn't seem to be clear in any of the published media to date. Personally, I'm a fan of Prusa's focus on a solid workhorse of a printer, so I'm glad they are sticking with that and not trying to get too crazy. Placed my Mk4 order after finishing this video.
Thomas can't help but tidy up the filament that's coming off the spool after he's been moving the head! That would be me too.
I expect anyone who's had a print fail due to a tangle after it's more than halfway done will develop such a habit.
@@TrueThanny yes. For me it's an source of paranoia.
Thanks, Tom, for a fine video. Your questions were incisive as usual and have helped me make up my mind to upgrade. My Mk3 will become the support machine, still reliable after 1000's of hours work; all the upgrades are done, including Revo, but now's the time for change. Although faster prints are attractive, I still worry about the speed versus structural integrity of printed engineering parts, so I hope the Mk4 exceeds the MK3 in this field.
Another thing too is you can make the old V3 into an Open5x Machine, and still have a standard 3 Axis Machine with the New Mk4 !
It seems that Josef Prusa is quite proud that they are printing all parts on a farm made of their own printers and I really like that. He has a point here. Edit to add: It’s just as if the tone of the replies gives away the writers opinion on the topic.
It's idiotic because much more expensive than molding
@@testboga5991 not the point. by printing all parts on their machines they prove their reliability and form a brand identity...more valuable then the cost savings by using injection molding...
@@testboga5991 It's not idiotic because at all because of psychology -They sell at high price because they are Prusa and it's all open source "hand made" printers (not some chinese factory where everything is efficient to get the lower cost), so, they can pay the expenses (and they make their own filament) -3d printed parts sometimes are not as good as injected ones, but you know you can reprint it exactly the same in your house or at a frinds one -3D printed parts have some notorious artifacts or specifics details of the printer used. You will know if a Prusa MK3 was printed originally from Prusa or with a cheap ender 3 without linear advance, blobs or glass bed. That's why people like to see the printer they buyed from Prusa will print at the same quality as it's printed parts (or better)
@@derrogers I believe this was said in the video, but it also allows them to experiment with many different designs and make adjustments even after the launch of the printer based on user feedback.
@@testboga5991 it provides 2 grounds of conversation; 1) The message it provides 2) where his priorities are. Yes injection moulding is far cheaper on a mass scale which allows him to replace that entire room with just two or three injection moulding machines, and allows him to sell more printers at a cheaper price. However, that does not support the 3D printing message. Josef is a designer and a maker, his design is so important to how we the public, the rest of society, views this design he has created (with or without help is irrelevant, it's ultimately his design and his decision). If the parts were from injection moulded parts, even if you went the further length to added artificial print lines into the moulds to replicate the effect of printed parts, it loses it's value in the sense of a '3D printed' 3D printer (do you see my point there? It's more about the message). Secondly, the fact that he is invested in those machines so much, shows you a few things: He does not care about the cost of his design, as he publishes his design for free for you to make yourself, but he charges you the labour and time it takes to make the parts himself. Secondly, he cares more about positively proving to everyone, "yes you can do this, if you have a design you truly care about, look, this is what I did, and here, if you would like some help to make your design, I'm happy to help :)", not in a malicious sense, but in a friendly and encouraging way. Injection moulding has an association stereotypically consisting of China, cheap quality, quick to break, bad colouring, replaceable, 'throw-away'... however 3D printed parts and products have a different association, stereotypically consisting of modern, *the word that describes a lot of time has been invested into something *, skilled, personal, well-thought out, well designed... We as a world have given these labels, and so Josef sees that if his parts are all 3D printed, the community knows that they have been a part of his journey to help create the new form of manufacturing we have been seeing since the 00s. So I don't believe he's idiotic for 'wasting money' on his chosen manufacturing method. There's a lead time on most products you buy new today, that's why you either make it yourself or buy it 2nd hand; like cars (I think lead time of 2 years for Tesla? Not sure on that). Feel free to critique my perspective, but as a design engineer (what an oxymoron amirite?), I feel it's important to analyse all factors from beginning to end to truly see the reasons why one takes decisions they take. :)
Thomas, just wanted to say how much I've appreciated your videos over the past year -- I purchased a Prusa MK3S+ as my first (and only) FDM printer last year, based partly on your abiding confidence in the printer (despite the many printers you have access to). I'm so glad I did. I enjoy your approach to providing rational analysis of these products, and measured recommendations where appropriate. This video was no different - you invited Prusa to engage on a variety of potentially uncomfortable questions. Keep it up!
Thanks for hopping in your car to quickly get us this quick look into the MK4! Much appreciated.
Excellent questions! I really appreciate everyone involved in the interviews taking the time to give such excellent answers and descriptions of the new Mk.4! Very well done =-D
Good engineering will always be respected, even though not understood by most! I have the utmost respect for the choices done by the Prusa team. From their commitment to open-source and open hardware to their attention to backwards comparably. I never bought a Prusa, but their long track history will be the main reason why I will buy one.
Finally, a Prusa I'm interested in.
Nice job, Thomas. I have been waiting for a video from you before making a decision . Your insights are very welcome. Questions I wanted answered you covered thank you for your efforts.
I just received my MK4 and everything about it has been mind blowing. Well done, Prusa!
Wow you really bought an upgraded Mendel in 2024? You aren't interested in bridges by chance, are you?
The Mk3 is one of the best purchases I have ever made. I am very happy to see Prusa continuing to innovate at roughly the same price point!
Which is? hope you don't say bambu lab, as they innovated nothing, just copied.
@@SkeeterPondRC lol prusa never innovated? Lmao he practically invented the i3 design which is the most copied printer style on the market. He also invented the heated bed, which hey, 100% of 3d printers use today. Also, segmented heat bed on the XL? How many printers have that? None, just the XL. Meanwhile here is Bambu lab ripping off every open source innovation, then slapping a proprietary label on it. Then contributing literally nothing to the open source that they steal from. Sit down and learn.
both of my MK3s+ have over 365 days of total print time and they still power through my projects like a champ. Its really impressive how little maintenance it really needs with the amount I print. If thats an example of what Prusa can do, I am so excited to try one of the MK4 machines once I purchase one this coming year.
Top class technical analysis Thomas. You made my mind up to upgrade to the MK4 👍
Cracking video as always Tom. Cemented my desire to buy one (assembled so I have zero issues) and sell my MK3S on.
Thank you for the great interview. It's nice to see how carefully and responsible Prusa develops its products.
And I would add: with excitement but unexcited
I think Prusa is a great company that makes great 3D printers. I was fractions of a millimeter from purchasing an MK3 when I ultimately decided to go with an Voron 2.4 - not at all due to the printer's ability, but my desire to get a CoreXY system (an architectural choice as it were.) It is highly likely I will still get a Prusa printer for smaller print jobs in the future because it is just so reliable and easy to set up a print on. Great interview!
There is no going back from a Voron and the price is right. If you want a second small printer I would go with an LDO 0.2 kit. It's cheaper and way better than this IMO.
When you factor in that Prusa printers retain their good resale value much longer than the competition, Prusa definitely "pays for itself" (like the iPhone in the world of 3D printers, but if Apple were Open Source and if it genuinely cared about the needs of users 😅)
@@__K__B__ Yes and no. I have both (actually I have 2 Mk3's and a 2.4), and the Prusa's are a LOT more reliable. So, as I virtually always print for work, the Prusa's are normally my go to because I know they will work. That's not to say I don't love the 2.4, I do, and it's massively quicker once it gets going, but it does require a lot more tweaking.
Ended up going for a MK4 after months of mulling and even cancelling my Bambu preorder. No regrets. I love that it needs so little maintenance, and that when it does, I know I'm in good hands. Also, the kit felt like a tour through the minds of _really_ talented engineers. It was super fun.
Great interview! I appreciate that you don't just ask the questions that could be answered in the article. Like the #602 one :D
The new MK4 is looking like a great set of improvements. I hope to get close to one and give it a run some time! We just pushed new Cartesian fixed-time motion planning with advanced Input Shaping to Marlin bugfix-2.1.x - which includes resonance variance based on Z height. This implementation was contributed by Ulendo for the open source world to use freely, and Prusa Research is certainly welcome to adapt it to their own firmware, which is based on Marlin 1.1.x. The fixed-time motion planning system itself replaces Marlin's just-in-time motion planning, but allows for switching to either motion system with a G-code (M493). As a separate motion system it has its own Linear Pressure Advance as well. (Ulendo is most famous for Filtered B-Spline -FBS- but this is not included in their open source contribution.)
Can you explain the advantage of the fixed time motion system vs the jit motion system..
I have a few 32 bit boards laying around, and now a MK3S+ that is seeing limited use. looking forward to putting it all together, while hopefully keeping my palette 2 pro compatible in connected mode.
@@ahmetcemturan Presumably the stepper pulses will be more regular, whereas with JIT there may be some irregularity. In situ it's hard to notice the difference, but some have reported that Fixed-Time subjectively seems better. I think we'll need to put an oscilloscope on both of them and see for ourselves. I'm still on Team JIT, as it uses far fewer resources and works great on slower AVR boards, but we'll continue to improve Fixed-Time Motion and it may become the preferred choice for faster boards with lots of memory.
Great to hear from Prusa direct what their thinking is about their printers and their value proposition. I'm new to the 3D printing scene, looking for my first printer. I'm seriously considering a Mk4, having gone full circle from thinking of getting a Prusa Mini Plus to looking at the Bambu Labs P1P and being seduced by their speed and value for a core xy machine (but not their cloud-based print servers, nor their fast growth-related production and customer service problems). I've come round to valuing the reliability that Josef Prusa spoke about as worth paying for. HOWEVER, it would be nice if the doubled productivity they expect from their print farm was passed on to customers in the form of lower prices... I seriously worry that their prices are becoming uncompetitive in the face of the new core xy machines coming out now - and especially Bambu seems a real threat to their long term core Prusa market. Personally, I've decided that quality, sustainable manufacturing and open source development and transparency are all things that I value and so I should put my money where my mouth is. But not everyone can afford that, and therein lies the danger for Prusa.
Wow, was that ever an info-dense episode! Thanks Tom. Would love to get my hands on a Prusa at some point.
Great video! Thanks for traveling and getting some questions answered!
The MK4 was one of the fastest new-release products I've purchased. I had a feeling that this wasn't going to be a Mini launch and all the new features just solidified it for me. You can obviously tell the sheer amount of testing that went into a product.
And even if not, we'll get updates quickly… :)
It seemed like they finally did a “mostly good to go on release” release (jynxing it now, and they don’t have the input shaper / advanced use of the loadcell data but anywho) which is refreshing.
At least the waiting for electrical components to be in sufficient supply for mass production was good for something. They had enough time to polish the MK4 and test it properly.
@@MartinWolker I think that's the main reason they were so long tbh
I got excited about the new MK4, but then I have a modified MK3S+ with a Revo hot end, and I'm not sure I would want to give it up, it's such a great design. And if I'm going to end up dropping more than $1K on a new FDM printer, I would want to go larger size and Core XY, like the XL or Voron. Although Prusa seems to have been having trouble getting the XL to market and fulfilling orders, backlogged until the end of the year. So I'll wait, let the early adopters work through the kinks.
I guess a MK4 has so much less parts to source and is much simpler overall. That has to be a big part of why.
I just want to say I have also had audio issues on large projects and I appreciate how much work it would have taken to mix this
I am stoked to see everyone's experience with this.
Glad you provided real information about the MK4 instead of the (PDT) speculations but I wanted more information about the MMU3 ... I stopped using MMU2 not because it was unreliable but it was to loud in my studio appartement so I am looking forward to any review of that and if it is as silent as the printer
Same here, for me there was a reliability aspect as well though as the blades kept misaligning and sometimes I would need 4 or 5 cycles to load, which is a little much imo BC, as you know, MMU2s homing is LOUD :) looking forward to the new kit and for about 100€ it's an alright upgrade and I hope prusa adds the feature to either select the colours on print start or confirm the slicer selection. :)
What?????? unreliable from Joe Prusa!!!!..... WTF! i don't believe you ! it must have been some thing you were doing wrong, Lets get Tom to ask Joe i'm sure he will sort this out next time he chats with him :)
Can't wait until the Kit is finally available 😃
Thank you for this interview - great one!! Awaiting for mine :/
I really like how these guys approach the interview: They know what their machine(s) can do, even though it's (they're) in a higher price bracket than most of the competition. They've got a bunch of improvements, stability, reliability and QC going that they don't even bother bringing up... Just because they take it for granted. They have this thing of "ask me anything, and I will give a straight answer on the fly because I'm soaked through and through with knowledge about these devices. I don't need no prep or scripting" That kind of attitude / mentality speaks volumes!
The MK 4 looks awesome, seriously thinking I might replace my faithful MK2 with one. Great video Tom 👍
Much cheaper is a Bambulab P1P.
@@jakabgipsz4788 it's not about price
@@jakabgipsz4788 yes, because it is made in China and not Europe.
@@jakabgipsz4788 Very true. But I love the whole Prusa experience, open source, customer support and the continuous upgrades and innovations, to name just a few. Just my personal preference.
@@SB-100 Assembled in EU, but all parts is made in china...
Amazing video Thomas. I was super skeptical about this printer until this run-through. This answered all my questions and convinced me that this is for sure something I need to look into saving for. Thanks again Thomas.
Being able to see a thumbnail and print settings is great. Would love to be able to retrofit that onto other printers!
I like it. I mean, no more Z level adjusting, the printer does it. Speed much more than doubled, potentially. If I hadn't already gotten a Revo, the nozzle system would probably wow me more, but it's a nice system utilizing the older style part. Still need tools, but not a lot of them, so that's progress. The drive gear etc looks great and super reliable. Motors are more precise, so prints should be smoother. All in all, a great evolution of the MK3. Probably the best printer on the market if all you want is a machine that will work when you get it home and reliably print you whatever you tell it to print, without any modifications required.
Ya, once you get a Revo, it's hard to go back to anything that requires tools and more than a few seconds to change a nozzle. And once they come out with the Revo ObXidian, it will be even harder. (pun not intended)
@@ScytheNoire But the Revo has a hugh problem with the thermistors. From smoking hotends to burning extruders, we've seen it all. And the whole thing seems to be a design problem. I don't want my hotend to always the printer shows at least a 10 degree difference from reality.
@@ScytheNoire You can already order the ObXidian Revo though I thought? Shouldn't they be shipping soon?
I will buy one, I had a cheap 3d printer, put tons of work in it, a new Duet Board included, but the amount of work needed to come close to a Prusa is huge... Was a huge mistake to cheap out in the first place, I won't make that mistake again lol
Mk4 looks cool. Nice work walking the line.
Great work Thomas! Thank you!
Would really have liked a little explanation around the accelerometer, and not having it as part of the extruder... Any reason for that? Thanks for a great video, Thomas! I've been a Prusa user from the MK2 days, and have a MK3S+ at the moment. Just ordered the MK4 today.... Can't wait!
Great video, I would love to see a review comparing it to the Bambu labs x1 as both look to offer great quality but doing it different ways
This I was very excited for the MK4, but it feels like it's launching 2 years too late, the Bambu tech feels way ahead, I was holding out for the MK4 and anticipated hitting the buy button straight away, but I'm genuinely thinking of going Bambu instead now I've seen it.
@@LordCreo5 years
Seems this is Prusa pushing out something to compete with the Bambu carbon. But the Bambu still wins overall. Bigger area, enclosure, multi-material, accelerometer built in,faster. You can get these on prusa (and some will be "coming soon" like the multi-material), but it would end up costing more with less functionality. I still holding off till the carbon 2 comes out to fix any problems that so far as I can see are few. And it will be cheaper hopefully. I guess it's good it has been introduced as everyone else has to up their game or reduce their prices.
@@mrfoameruk not to mention there’s a ton of extra functionality in the Bambu the the MK4!
What an excellent video Tom. Thank you very much for putting it together. And thanks to Joseph and (I don't know his name) for taking time out of their busy schedules for participating.
Prusa
Never mind.
This new levelling should also allow you to easily print on tulle, cotton and other niche materials
i would think that cotton might squish a bit and throw off the probe
@morbus from what I've seen, the load cells are so sensitive they don't even touch the bed. That was in one of the videos.
No, since those materials are squishy and there doesn't seem to be a way to calibrate the load sensor?
@@AmixLiark that doesn't make sense... How does a sensor that measure force activate before force is applied?
@@morbus5726 air pressure
I appreciate that the new heater block design takes a page from the E3D Volcano. Hot-tightening the old V6 _and_ worrying about where to grasp the 200+ degree heater block so I don't break wires was not fun, and it's why I ended up with a leaky block and later an upgrade to a Revo hotend. It would be super nice if either Prusa or E3D come up with an adapter to Revo nozzle-breaks and hotends, but given the different location and size of the threads, I would be fine with just using the stock system and the V6 adapter. As someone who has 3 printers with touchscreens... PLEASE DO NOT USE A TOUCH SCREEN. If there's expansion capability for the mainboard, might I suggest things like a camera input and a few headers for things like LEDs? Even though a couple of the printers in the office are cloud-only, I kinda want to see a Prusa solution where you install the management software for Prusa Connect on a server in the office, then that manages the printer fleet connected on the LAN. This is one of those situations where Prusa can charge some serious money, I'm thinking that if you're running an active print farm, you probably have the money to invest in something that will save time and manpower.
I don't mind touch screens if they keep a knob. Hybrid gives convenience of both.
Whats the bad thing with touch screens?
The juxtaposition of this video vs the review video is just bliss. I can't wait for the XL review. I am sure it will be juicy. If he ever gets one.
a really nice video with details that we wanted to know! now i want mk4 upgrade on my mk3ss..
Thanks for the video Thomas. Will you be doing an indepth review in the future?
Looks like there's quite some interest, so, yes, probably!
@@MadeWithLayers did you bring one home with you on your drive back? 🤔
For a second, I thought it was an April Fool’s joke. I generally don’t trust any video that comes out on April 1st. 😊
Thanks tom
appreciate how tom doesn’t throw prusa softball questions but is willing to disagree with him and question his decisions
like when he said it's been tested for "millions" of hours and tom just lost eye contact and looked down........
My next one is the XL 5 heads 😊 It’s seems to me those Prusa guys are honest and give you the right time it worth something to me 😊
I'm tempted to upgrade my mk3s to a 3.9. The extra speed would be nice. Probably going to wait a while, see how the whole high flow nozzle situation turns out.
I'm tempted to just use that money toward a MK4 kit and also keep my MK3S+. Maybe upgrade the 3 later on.
I’ve been a loyal Prusa supporter/ customer for over 8 years. 10- Mk s. Few minis. I really like the nextruder concept and some other features. 4 mo ago I purchased a X1 Carbon ( with AMS ) since then I replaced all of my Prusas with X1 Carbon s and P1P s. Surprisingly after literally thousands of hours in total I’ve had zero issues that were the printers fault. The ams system works great ( you have to learn what spools / adapters work and don’t work). A couple years ago I bought an mmu2 and I could never get it working properly. Prusa says that they’ve put tons of testing into the mk4 , and I believe them because they have the man power and resources to do so. My only concern is I hope new printer was not rushed to market . To compete with the obvious Bambu Labs market. I’m a little disappointed it looks so similar to the mk3 , with not enclosure and no multi media. Speed is a big deal to me ,as long as the resolution of the print is not effected. The Bambu lab P1p and X1 both perform to another level. I understand the whole open source Prusa promotes and I get it , but there are quite a few aftermarket Bambu parts already to market. Im still rooting for Prusa, they are a great company. I think they relied on brand recognition until another company released a printer that blew there’s away. The XL was a interesting concept I’m assuming more geared towards industrial use due to the pricing . The long long long wait time turned many customers away. I’m hoping this works out.
I'm still rooting for Prusa too ppl obviously are very emotionally attached to them.... It's just not here to compete with the X1C, hell not even the P1P , you don't bring a pickle to a knife fight. It's solely here to compete with the Mk3 and that's exactly what it does and wins!
They use the same bed. The mk3 and mk4 So ya Bambu gets my money
regarding this open Source thing.. the MK4 is not open source. Prusa don't want go to the gpl open Source license anymore....
@@Flashy_DE That's a false statement. People want nice, fast, closed source systems, untill they break.......see Apple for example
Absolutely appreciate having a solid workhorse over a speed daemon - thanks for not going down the path of competing on speed as the most important selling point...
By accident I used a Prusa MK4 profile for a print on my Artillery Genius printer, because I wanted to try the Prusa slicer, instead of Cura. It reduced print time more than 1/3 with same layer height and infill, and the print came out fine. At the second print I realized that I was using the wrong profile, but I tried again with good result. So - Prusa MK4 profiles makes quick and good print on Artillery Genius 🙂
Thank you Thomas! Now I'm waiting for is your in depth review, especially if you could compare it to the Bambu printers. It's actually not a bad upgrade feature set overall. The problem is that it's very close in pricing to the Bambu printers which offer an enclosure, all metal parts, the lidar based auto calibration, and some more. What makes me still consider the Prusa is the sound difference and the better part compatibility. The Bambu seems very loud to be used in an apartment, though it finishes much quicker that's true. Also I wonder if they managed to stabilize the MMU3, because if it's not much better than MMU2 then the Bambu AMS is ahead again this regard. I'm thinking about moving forward from my MK3S around the end of the year so I'm really interested in what the long term usage will show.
MK4 is also open source and has a history of good support and QC.
@@carlosjosejimenezbermudez9255 well, the MK4 is new and doesn't have much history yet, you mean prusa I would guess? And that may be true, but Bambu has done what no one else was doing for 3dprinting... So much so, that this Mk4 came out of no where to compete
+1
Also not to mention sustainability and fair manufacturing labor!😊
@JohnSmith-rt5yq You mean how their DJI engineers pulled from Voron engineers and new buyers called it "innovation"? And ECRF is still miles ahead of AMS and the MMU systems. And actually, it does multi-material better than AMS, which is still only adept at color change. Bambu only made a closed-off Voron you don't have to build. There's nothing new there. CoreXY had been a thing since before M3D. And M3D is a dumpster fire.
I'm very interested to see what the input shaper can do for print quality. Pretty much the only gripes I have with my mk3 in terms of print quality is the occasional messy first layer and the slight ghosting on parts. Looks like the mk4 addresses both, so looks like it's time to grow another kidney.
You going to upgrade or go for a new one? A new one is only US$220 more than a full 4 upgrade(which you’d need to get the new motors) but then you don’t have your old printer after. I think it’s worth it to spend a bit extra and not have to get rid of your old printer.
@@jaredf6205 I'm planning to get a new one, but that's at least a couple month away. I want to make my own little print on demand business, so multiple printers is the way to go anyway in that regard.
@@genericcommenter1148 Wait some months, it will be cheaper (kit)
@@pauserratgutierrez No. It wont be cheaper. Thats prusa. It will only get cheaper when the Mk5 comes out
@@Neo1983m I meant that the kit is cheaper because you assemble it, compared to the built version. Price won't change until a new machine is announced, as you already said!
Was just to close the deal on a MK3 but I think I will wait a month or two then go for the MK4, this will be my first 3D printer
Cant wait for a video to compare MK4 vs. Trodon 2.0 vs Bambulab X1
I have a lot of respect for the goal of reliability over max performance. I hope one day to own a 3d printer which is as boring to use as my regular paper+ink printer.
As if the paper+ink printers weren''t the most unreliable things you can attach to a computer :)
@@Validole Hahaha you are right. Maybe I should have said 'laser printer'. The one I have has been smashing out prints without fault for over a decade. Maybe i got lucky.
I preordered the XL, but Bambu has blown me away so much now I have 4 P1Ps with AMSs and 1 X1C. It's the first time I felt like paying more than $200 for a printer was worth it due to the speed. I'm glad Bambu has pushed Prusa into making faster machines.
I started with an Ender 3v2 in March of this year. I did a handful of the common mods for it and it was really just an entry point to kind of grasp the process of modeling and printing my own parts. I bought the Bambu P1S last month and the degree of separation between the two in terms of speed and quality is gargantuan. I mention this because I had considered moving to a Prusa mk3, however the hard fact is that the "bed slinger" as a design concept is inferior to "core XY" in its basic premise. Moving the mass of a print bed will always be a setback. However, Bambu does not have the track record of Prusa, and I would likely recommend a Prusa to someone who was looking to make money with their prints.
@@RYTHMICRIOT I've used a 60 Ender/CR print farm in the past for selling and making money with prints. That has been completely replaced with 7 Bambu printers. I suggest them over Prusa.
Thomas, you left one thing that you did not show us. Where is the MK4 that you took for yourself from Prague??? 😊 thank you for the quite informative video! Well done as always! 👍🏼
Vielen Dank für dieses Video!
Im only about 9 minutes in but I really appreciate how he openly acknowledges that sure, they may not be on the cutting edge of 3D innovation but thats not their focus. They're trying to make a printer that *works*. I really appreciate that. I think the innovation is cool but I'm not at the point in my life where i want to be messing around in uncharted waters just to have "the best." I just want a printer that I can start and walk away from without a knot in my stomach. So far my MK3s+ has been that for me. My neighbor loves to talk about how he saved $600 more dollars that I did and his printer can print the same stuff mine can. But he's constantly down and his prints suck cause he doesnt want to put in all the work to get his printer... working. I've never experienced that.
I mean bambulab is both features and reliability. But I am so glad that there's finally some competition from prusa.
@@52thephotoshop I think you should take the statement that bambu is reliable with a grain of salt. This can only be said when the Bambu has been on the market for 1.5 - 2 years. Because if something works for the first few months, it doesn't mean that it will always work. Besides, I have heard of the exact opposite as far as that is concerned. You can be lucky and the Bambu works or you can just have problems and difficulties. The spread of quality is way too high. With Prusa, it is always consistently high as usual. That's what I appreciate and love about Prusa. And strangely enough, you Bambu owners always let out the same envy.
Why not both? Other manufactures are crushing that, this still feels likes 2016 tech
@@Neo1983m I have multiple X1 and P1P's Bambu are far more established and reliable company then Prusa ever was at this point int here existence. There are already 3rd party parts. The argument that Bambu hasn't been around long enough really is no longer valid. They are not going anywhere soon
@@scotthancock8225 what utter nonsense.
30:33 thanks, this is what I need
After losing my MK3 in a move a few years ago, I’m looking forward to rejoining the Prusa family when the Mk4 kits start shipping
Wow their own SMT line! I'm impressed! Nothing helps supply chain issues like having you own board line! I'm a Prusa supporter for life. The Mk4 looks impressive. I love my Mk3 and prusaslicer. Great work guys! Using your own printers to make and test your printers is a great strategy.
Already ordered one. If you look into the speed of some of the machines that are claiming more speed, the part quality is not there. Excited to see this new machine in action.
Much cheaper is a Bambulab P1P.
Much louder, too!
@@jakabgipsz4788 Heck for basically the same price you can get the Bambu X1C.
@@jeffhaas9577 Actually speed for speed it's not and considering the mk4 only has a 4010 cooling fan you might wanna consider a louder 5010.....
I'm a Bambu carbon x1 owner who has never owned a Prusa. I am very content with my purchase, but now that I have watched this video, I have a profound respect for the mark 4. I think this is a very remarkable printer, that I will seriously consider.
Great video!! I'm very tempted to upgrade. I wonder if they are going to bring out a smaller Core XY though, the way Josef Prusa said they were going to experiment with other models made me think they might...
Yeah, they way he said this mk4 was going to be a workhorse and they may experiment really makes me think they already have some vorons in their lab and are considering a proper voron competitor...
Thomas, excellent video.
Reading the comments it’s clear that a lot of people don’t understand the cost implications of building printers in Europe vs made in China. Also the mk4 is exactly what it was always going to be and evolution of the mk3, they have bought it up to date with a solid feature set, while keeping the whole thing open source (i find it funny how quickly the community seems to be shunning open source considering none of these printers would exist without it and yes that includes the Bambu printers) This looks like a solid printer, that takes us one step closer to one click 3d printing where you can set it and forget. And yes that means a focus on reliability and repeatability while maintaining quality over outright speed, so for many this printer will make a lot of sense.
We don't need to understand what makes it expensive or cheap. I am the buyer and I am looking for the best value for money. The development of printing was indeed initially due to Prusa and that is why it is disappointing that it has fallen so far behind. There are now communities and printers that are ahead of it (Voron, Ratrig, EVA etc.) And Bambulab's innovation has also raised the bar considerably. It offers more at a lower cost. What I just click and print (it will never be that easy) Bambulab can do.
@@jakabgipsz4788 I completely disagree it’s really important to understand what makes a product expensive or cheap otherwise you can’t properly asses value as cheap doesn’t always equate to value. when I was talking about open source I wasn’t just referring to Prusa there were lots of others as well, and a lot of the innovations were only possible after patents held by stratasys expired, now we have all these companies ditching open source, patenting stuff and once again potentially hamstringing consumer 3d printing. I would also argue that they aren’t behind, the mk4 is right on par feature wise, I am sure they would like to have bought it to market earlier but that’s just the supply chain reality right now. Bamboo might offer more for less but right now it’s realisability is an unknown, as is it’s long term customer and product support. Another factor that has to be considered when assessing value.
Did some one say Mendel
@@wardy89 I completely disagree... I want the best and i want it now and if Joe cant give me that i'll go elsewhere regardless... I don't care if its creality tronxy voron ratrig, I don't care about open source. Cause Joes certainly milked it for all it's worth. He is fat and filthy rich thanks to open source. I don't buy a product from emotion or catchy jingles or false claims (and all the makers are doing it now not just Joe) I'm analytical clinical and decisive in my decision making I have no emotional tie to how or why a printer is made. I'm more than happy to toss it in a bin when i'm done and move onto the next best thing when it comes along...Even if it is a Prusa down the track.
@@Defyant123 I agree with you. When I plan to make a purchase of this volume, I don't choose based on ideology, I look at value for money. I look at what I get for my money. If I didn't do that I would be damaging myself. Prusa printers have been overpriced devices from the beginning. The same machine if you put it together, you can build it for half the price. If Jozef doesn't pay attention to the market now, he'll be in trouble soon.
Nice restomod. Its a big freaking achievement for them. I guess, we'll still see the same machine after even 10 years
It is a big achievement and Joe is very very proud of himself, you can see it in his body language. The confidence he uses while throwing the "millions" of hours testing statement and seeing Toms eye contact hit the deck was all very confidence and trust inspiring.
Looking forward to the new Prusa printer iteration. I have been using mine for over 4 years now and I only now had my first issue with it where i needed to replace a heater. Otherwise it's an amazing product and it can reliably and repetitively produce excellent prints. Upgrade cost is rather high though considering that you almost getting whole new printer. I don't use my printer that much to motivate the upgrade, but i will consider it or just get a new printer as a kit and sell my old one. Considering the cost of upgrade or new kit it might be motivated to get an SLA printer instead when Prusa releases an 8K version of it.
Actually quite interested in the mk3 to mk4 upgrade path. I own two Prusa MK3 printers (A launch MK3 upgraded to S+ and a purchased MK3S+ years later) and they are going strong, but funny enough I find my MK3S+ I bought doesn't print as well as I want (weird artifacts when the printer gets near the top of the print Z range). Rather then selling it and buying a new printer the MK4 upgrade may be perfect for it, and really not too expensive for what one gets as I was thinking most of the replaced parts are causing the issue. I can save the parts for my original MK3 (which is a rock solid workhorse) and experiment with my second one, but also staying in the Prusa ecosystem.
6:37 As for input shaping, I'm extremely skeptical and it seems to me that they put that in on short notice. Unfortunately, you can't calibrate input shaping in general, as you want people to know in the video, because it varies from printer to printer, depends on the current belt tension and the location of the printer. Especially since the mass of the Y-axis changes constantly with a bed slinger. And because Prusa doesn't send an acceleration sensor with the printer, it unfortunately makes the impression that they only decided to include it shortly before the release. I would be glad if someone could explain to me exactly how Prusa wants to implement this with Input Shaping.
I think there is a connector for a accelerometer on the board. My guess is that it will come with a default profile and the option to recalibrate yourself with a accelerometer sold separately.
The variation from one printer to another should be close to zero if you don't change the moving parts. The belt tension can vary but the printer can estimate it by measuring the current passing in the motors, this is already on the MK3. So I imagine that the input shaping can be tuned automatically with these values. And there is an accelerometer port on the bord for advanced users to calibrate more precisely their printers
@@twanheijkoop6753 I hope so. Yes, there is an accelerator connector on the board. But why they dont give one with the printer or dont assemble one in the Hotend like the XL? In my opinion, Input Shaper was an very late decision.
@@bastienx8 But the belt tension is not the only thing. The Place where the printer stands, the feets and underground and some more things. It all makes a huge difference. I think the port is only there because its the same port as the XL has. And the XL has an accelerator on the hotend. You just need to ask experienced users who know about input shaping. They will all tell you the same thing, namely that it has to be adjusted individually for each printer.Nevertheless I am looking forward to my MK4 🥰
@@bastienx8" Advanced users" LOL 👍
I want to see how this compaares to the bambu carbon x1 in print quality
It dosn't compare it wasn't made to compare (you heard Joe) it wasn't built to compete with the X1C , you don't bring a zucchini to a knife fight.... it was made to compete with the Mk3 which it does and wins! hands down. It was produced to get MK2/Mk3 owners to upgrade to Mk4... Which it obviously does extremely well too.
@@dggcreations No offence pls...I don't see it that way.....The ppl who buy machines like Bambu's think different to those who buy Prusa... red blue left right "lets go branden" swj's etc. You see it here.. a microcosm that's representative of the real world. Sure Prusa may have looked @ the features of other printers.. not just bambu but everyone. Taken those ideas and put them into the Mk4 (Joes been doing this since the Mendel)but they know the person who buys a creality a Bambu lab a voron a ratrig ...90% of those ppl are not going to buy a Prusa and vice versa. What they are banking on is the core supporters. When you pitch this to a board what's your guarantee of sales for the expenditure. Your core audience. You always bank on your core. And they will wait patiently.
@@Defyant123 I don't understand this blind brand loyalty, its a company, it doesn't care about any of you really. but thats beside the point, why buy a printer with a name when you are getting inferior tech for the same price. Speed is not the end all be all but like do none of you value your own time? I find I can get through projects faster when I'm not waiting overnight for a part that could be done in half the time.
I don’t own a prusa. But lulzbot I do own and they were very large in supporting the ability to i upgrade there printers. I went from a lulzbot taz 4 and built it up to a taz 6, and when the lulzbot taz pro released in which was a complete re design now allowing me to upgrade. Lulzbot came through with a buy back system at a reasonable price to allow me to purchase the taz pro, prusa has a grade system going and maybe one day when they completely change the design they can too offer a buy back program. At some point I’ll own a prusa product, just waiting to see the XL in action.
Thank you for very in-depth review/information! I love it when a company has their own ideas on what they feel is best and then they run with it. That way there is great choice in the market for different ideas.
I see the price, not seeing the value....
Nice video man, really cool to see them talk about it and seem excited. I am not a Prusa fanboi as I think they are just overpriced for what they are but I really like the new leveling system they showed and they are mostly reliable! I still think this was made as a stop-gap because of the XL having so many delays and problems they wanted to make people see they are still working on projects and not giving up. I started laughing as the little jab he made about the 3d printer landscape would be a different ballgame if all the manufacturers used their own printers to print their printers parts :) He is right about that. I used to work in an injection molding plant and from a cost standpoint they can be more cost effective when you have a FINAL design AND you are going to run that part millions of times. Machines are expensive, molds are expensive, maintenance is expensive but the pellets are cheap. I would love to see Prusa tackle the pellet feeders for 3d printers but I imagine the cost of the machine would outweigh the savings on plastic.
1:15 Oh my... so this is exactly the issue I was thinking about, since I don't see a wiper like on the Bambu, I was wondering how it was going to clean the nozzle tip prior to using it for probing. And now we see it, dripping filament as it tries to probe the bed. That can't be very accurate, right?
It does a small wipe action as it reaches the bed, so spreading any small amount of ooze before measuring; it also repeats probing at that point if it senses an anomoly until it gets a stable result. A slight retraction may occur to reduce hotend pressure too, but that was not mentioned in the release video.
@@Mike01Hu I guess given the backwards compatibility (in order for ease of upgradability) requirements for this printer made it hard to solve this in a new way. I tried adding a scrub brush idea from some models off printables, but never really got it to work. We will have to see how well this works in reality. Especially when you end up using stringy/drippy filaments like PETG.
@shenqiangshou I have used both brush and blade wipers, without great improvements being achieved. With them, I found more issues of filament accumulation around the nozzle and wear of the full-nozzle silicon socks. I use PETG most of the time, with minor excursions to XT-CF20 (Amphora based) and ASA. Most of my PETG printing is with transparent filament to avoid changes in structural integrity due to colour fillers.
I like it, a big step up from the mk3s
With the load cell I wonder if it can do a purge and detect if there is sufficient enough flow rate to see if it has the right nozzle installed. Then in the future we have audio adjusting gcode that changes speed (flow) to make sure you don't underextrude. And detect clogs
I couldn’t tell where prusa would go as far as improving the mk3s but these changes look really amazing. I was already very happy with my printer. On another note. What went wrong with the audio in this video? Lots of strange cuts and noise
I think the cuts were all while Josef Prusa was talking and I am pretty sure it was the beard's fault.
Sorry for that, too much beard noise needed a lot of reworking. My fault.
Made in EU is a no-brainer. Less dependency from China is good
True but a lot of the components (mostly electrical and metal) still come from there as its realistically the only place you can get some of it.
At best most parts are tested in EU.
XD the parts are not Made in europe, do not be naive
@Broski Snowski the motors are from Trinamic, we use this a lot in our automation products. They have excellent performance and features, I dont think there is an equivalent Chinese make for this motor
@Buzás András So tru.... Go team blue! lets go branden!
Wish we could get a video like this for the Prusa XL...
Looks like a great printer. I have a kp3s and it’s cheap, but does what any can do. All the best
That new display looks nice. But can it run Doom?
The right question is, "Can it Run Crisis" ^^
Since my old 2007 mp3 player could run Doom, I'm cautiously gonna lean toward "Eyup!".
32:56 I believe that a substantial amount of users HAS an MMU. Seeing how reliable the thing is and what a hassle it can be I doubt that so many people are practically using it. While the MK3S has been quite reliable for me (except for the LCD display being unreadable due to discoloring), the MMU has never worked reliably. It's a great idea but it the implementation is very poor... I hope the MMU3 makes it much better because it's not even close to the quality of the MK3S
From my experience the new filament sensor on the Extruder should finally fix things. For me, working with 3 different machines and 3 different MMU2s, there are 3 (to 4) consisten failure point to them, 2 (and the fourth one) being easily fixable. 1) Point one was the selector sensor- sometimes strings of filament could jam the ball bearing. This could be fixed theoretically through better ram settings and sensor calibration but the permanent fix is just printing a new selector with a 2mm magnet slot below the filament path. 2) Point two was the tube, which in it's default form had too tight of an ID, resulting in some ball-ends being too difficult for the motor to extract when unloading. This is fixed with a 2mm ID PTFE tube, as slop in the tube isn't really an issue on an MMU2 as the Prusa is still direct drive. 3) the Third point was the unfixable one, which was the IR filament sensor in that stupid chimney. It needs recalibration basically after every other print as the chimney is eventually flexed out of position by the bowden tube, being secured by only a single screw, and it almost always would do this sometime into the print when you would be off doing something else. Since the Mk4 uses a spring-loaded ball and hall effect sensor inside of the extruder instead of an IR-chimney on top, I'm 80-90% sure that issue will have been fixed now. (the fourth point relates to multi-material prints, specifically PLA and soluable BVOH. Towers would sometimes delaminate and fall apart, which actually wouldn't often make prints fail somehow, but was obviously not ideal. This was solved by simply putting the transition tower inside a solid PLA object that was a little larger, which was jank but did work). Two way coms between the MMU and the machine itself will also help make errors more understandable, instead of the Mk3 only being able to tell you that the MMU is throwing a fit, and you having to look up the light pattern the MMU is flashing at you. I'll still wait but hearing that the filament sensor was changed on the machine itself makes me pretty hopeful. I just hope they incorporated the other improvements I listed out too, though they were more fixable for a regular person.
@@dggcreations everything outside of actual toolchangers have some issue or drawback, really. Single Hotend setups will have issues of purging and load-unload, but multi hotend setups tend to more usually be direct drive meaning they're heavier (idk why that is, back in 2014 the ones I saw were mostly Bowden, but that was back in the early days of consumer printers). I don't think Single Hotend Multiple Extruder set ups are all that bad, issues with them mostly have to do with loading and unloading. Personally the easiest time I've had was a Neptune 2D, after inserting a correctly sized liner (they put in one that was too short) and switching it to PrusaSlicer which is better set up for SHME set ups, and I've converted a Multi-hotend Multi Extruder printer to the same kind of set up. The main difference is that with these SHME setups things are much simpler, the filament is simply parked by it's own extruder motor in a bowden tube 20ish mm from a 2-way splitter. Compare this to the MMU2 and the AMS, which are separate addons that have to "hand-off" the filament to the printer itself, meaning that, at least in the case of the MMU2 (I've not had the pleasure to work with the Bamboos or an AMS), the machine doesn't actually have any way to fully utilize the MMU2S, just ask it to load and unload, without even really having an idea what was going on with the MMU2S. On the MMU2S this was exacerbated, like I said above, by poor sensor design on the extruder. On the AMS from what I gather things are similar, with issues relating to spools not being able to be tensioned or parked correctly (from what little I know on the AMS' operation). By the nature of the Addons being Addons, the introduction of "handing off" the filament adds a point of failure. One thing I wish I could work with is the MMU1, which essentially does a similar thing to the Neptune 2D in that different filaments have their own extruder motor, and all are fed through a 4-way splitter into the hotend. It makes me wonder why they switched from that to the MMU2S; if I had to guess, maybe having a companion board for the four motors was as hard to implement as the MMU2's buddy board. I guess though my main point is that the SHME set ups work better if the printer is designed that way to begin with. I also agree on the Palette also. Working with the Palette 2 specifically, sometimes different filaments of the same type didn't play along well, and for what we were doing (PLA+BVOH support interfaces) it just didn't work. It tries to get around the "handoff" problem by splicing everything into one filament, getting rid of the load-unload issue, but makes everything more complicated by introducing a 3rd machine (the pi, and an underpowered pi at that) and having 0 recourse for you if the filament broke (at least with an MMU2 load failure it is possibly recoverable- just make sure you use a heatgun or blowdryer to heat the top layer of the print quickly and carefully).
Good idea with adapter. I'm worried, but now I know how I can easily use Hardened steel nozzle.
Personal opinion.. own a MK3S+ and it’s one of my goto printers. Kind of opposed to an ‘upgrade’ so I’d have parts laying about so more than likely I’d shoot for a full kit. That being said at the end of the day it will always come down to availability. Don’t want to wait 2 months to two years for something I am needing for projects
3 day turnaround for a X1C !
Love my MK3S+, I won't be upgrading but this does look great. I appreciate that they have focused on reliability, I don't want to spend time tweaking my 3D printer, I already have a hobby in repairing old devices, I use this printer to print replacement parts.
The deal breaker for me is the price, 1200 euro is way to much.
It's €889 if you buy the kit.
lol what?! They can't be serious...
Why this over a p1p? Just being honest here. I see no advantage over the MK4
Very nice interview. Thank you very much. I'm very interested in looking at their new motherboard. It's the only open source item I can't readily replicate on my own.
That's a nice and informative video! Thank you. (Subscribed and liked)