The Damage is Done (Its too late)
2024 ж. 24 Сәу.
4 936 Рет қаралды
In this video I cover the very quick response that Watcher made after releasing their announcement video that was highly disliked by the entire KZhead community .
#Catchupchips #watcher
Hey all! I realize there are a few sections that have issues with the audio in this video so bare with me! A feature of KZhead meant to remove a few copywrited audios actually messed it up more than it fixed it.
I understand what they wanted, but what they want and what their fans want are two different things. We don't want TV KZhead. We want just them and their hijinks. So to me as a guy that has been watching these guys since the beginning. It's not too late. They did exactly what they needed to with the update apology.
noone was complaining about the quality upgrades they just didn't ask for them. they could have achieved this all if they didn't try and charge monthly like that.
I remember noticing that the watcher channel was overproducing their videos and being confused. Shane and Ryan's personalities are why i watched, not the set design or whatever. It actually got worse because of the more expensive production in my opinion.
I agree to some extent. I don’t like ghost files because they’re trying too hard in it. the off handedness and random weirdo conversations they had was what made it so awesome and classic now. but i also understand them personally wanting to make higher produced content if it’s what they want creatively, although that doesn’t justify their dumb decision last week
I feel that a huge portion if not the majority of their fan base didn't need the upgrades to production and in a way they served as the personable content people were looking for , kind of like how found footage style videos seem more real.
I find it weird that they didn't just make a new channel for higher production content if they want to be known for that the other channel would eventually surpass the old one and they then would have a place where people want highly produced vids.
I’m a senior citizen who can’t afford to actually retire (we don’t all own homes, and as y’all know rent is expensive). I do earn enough to have a good sized subscription budget - but it’s not infinite. If I decide to support a new creator, I have to unsubscribe from someone else. So even I raised my brows at ‘$5.99 is something everyone can afford’. It tells me they’re living in an economic class so removed from the rest of us that I’m underwhelmed by the apology. ‘Sorry y’all are so poor - we forgot about poor people’ would probably have been more honest.
hey! thanks for leaving a comment, very valid point you bring and I bet if they were to read this now they would feel the impact of their blatant oversight.
In that same leaky boat with you... I only support one podcast on Patreon, for $2 a month. But these folks (Well There's Your Problem) have bonus content that is worth that amount to me. They are also low-fi, and unpretentious. This whole situation is just so insulting...
The reason that I'm not resubbing is because they spend so much time during the video talking about how much they love and respect and are grateful for their fans just to turn around and admit they never even considered the fans in their initial decision. That is the opposite of showing love, respect, and gratefulness. They didn't do a bad job of explaining things. Its just the things they were explaining were bad things. And their apology did not address the 2 biggest complaints about the first video. 1 Steven's total disregard for caring about expenses when no one cares about his shows, and 2 that no one cares about the production quality except for their own egos. I'm a youtube premium member, but if i'm going to ever watch anything on their channel again it will be on one of my other accounts with an adblocker. I don't even want them to get a nickel of my support, because they will just waste it.
seems accurate to me! what on earth do they need 25 employees for? lol
Yeah , I'm still lost on the whole Steven Lim wants to do everything that is super expensive . I don't watch for his content - him spending an exorbitant amount on ONE meal holds no appeal to me . I watch for the camaraderie between Ryan and Shane . I'm also irritated about hearing about paying their employees fairly when they are out taking trips to places most of us could NEVER afford . How about not hiring so many of your old friends ,be honest with your friends and say you can't afford it . Also Shane's wife putting her 2 cents in after going on and on about how much they spent on their wedding and some stupid $125 purse I DO NOT CARE ! I'm not sure of what his wife does but Sarah Rubin was also not the draw to watcher so she should have just stayed out of it ! I'm hoping that they keep with the plan to make things right but if Shane's wife was so interested in their staff to be payed a "living" wage she maybe could have used that$125 to go see a justice of the peace and done a quick court house wedding like my husband and I did . Don't be greedy and fake then act like all the fans complaining about it are the "bad guys"
Oooh which ad blocker do you use? KZhead got cranky at my original one and ads are driving me up a WALL
Sorry is a nice sentiment but they meant their first video and thats why it feels hypocritical. 😬 Their team and wifeys bad mouthed us to for not having enough money too..
they threw mad shade on their supporters haha crazy to see happen
I can't remember where I heard this, but someone paraphrased Harvey Dent with, "You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourselves become three somber guys on a couch."
Its becoming a pattern for sure! That's a funny one lol
It's a common phrase
They really thought they could completely mismanage their own company and force their fans to pay for their mistakes. We aren’t lemmings and now they know that. I’m not going back to watching them. After over a decade, seeing who they truly are was pretty heartbreaking. I think they all took on too much personal debt *cough* Shane’s 55k wedding venue *cough* and hired all of their family and friends. That’s on them. So much for Shane “Eat the rich” Madej 🤦🏻♀️
I think its a valuable thing in life to know how to find a few friends and grow exponentially within the grasp of who they are instead of trying to hire 25 people and make as much content as possible. thanks for leaving a comment!
The apology is nothing. The only thing they apologized for is the *way* they said things. They never apologized for saying it, the intent behind what they said, or the decision. This DOUBLED DOWN on all of that.
*true colors starts playing on the radio* thanks for the comment!
Yup. It's the "l'm sorry you feel that way." classic non apology.
I only cared about the ghost series. Once I saw high production quality, I knew something was wrong. I just didn't know it was 25 people team wrong.
if the KZhead community didn't step up it woulda been 50 people wrong haha
Found out during the course of all this that they had 8 investors in 2019, before they even launched. Registering in Delaware to avoid taxes. Which is pretty normal, but strange for people who joke about eating the rich
I don't know why but the KZhead algorithm seems to be showing me content from smaller creators lately which is great! This is fantastic content and you have a lot of potential! Love your catchphrase too "Yip, yip, yip, yip, yip!" - Very catchy! :-P
thanks so much for that! I love to see that my unusual quirks are entertaining to some people!
I call BS on the entire apology. It wasn't to pay all of these people. It wasn't to produce better quality. It was all about themselves. I watched penquin, and his channel says it all. A guy in a white tee shirt being real. And, he has expanded into multiple other businesses because of his free youtube platform. I even love his answer about the name of his channel. He said he made the channel when he was 11, and he thought penquins were cool. He has kept to his roots, including his channel name, and continues to care about them. ( thanks for telling me about him.) See you on the next one. ~ k
I love helping you discover how deep-rooted the community on KZhead really is. it truly is a culture all of its own and funny enough parrots society in every way accept extenuates every emotion beyond what is normally accepted in public. It is a place for people to go to trigger others and simultaneously is a place others go to calm down the people that are triggered. KZhead is a lot like free speech, you may not like it and that's the point.
@CatchupChips I'm loving every minute of youtube. I have learned how to care for cattles' feet. How to treat Jiggers in the feet, knees, and hands of the poor in Kenya. I've watched some shows of the past and some from britain. Feel free to make other suggestions. I live with the amazing Katie who seems to be attached to me like i am to her. That makes a great partnership. I also have a close friend who comes 2 or 3 days a week to help me stay living at home. I am homebound at this point but working towards getting out one day. My life was beyond anything i could ever have imagined. I am still surrounded by all of that within myself. But, i now have a different life, which i have made both very fullfilling and without much stress. I have learned to be grateful for all of my blessings, and KZhead is a big part of that. I still am mostly a lurker, but i do make the occasional comment like i did with you. I felt comfortable right out of the shoot to leave a comment on your channel. That says a lot about you. As always, i send you blessings ~ Karen
Well said. I will never resub because, financial bshit aside, the sheer arrogance and egotism their initial video revealed disgusts me. Remember, any video you watch of theirs on KZhead now, they didn't want you to see. Because they think they're Too Good for us.
Maybe the reason why they hire a lot of people is because they don't want to do the things they are doing before (the behind the scene editing, script writing, research etc.) since they feel like they are the star of the show. In their minds, they are celebrities, actors, etc.
its fine to hire people, but within your means not the viewers means
I actually do think a lot of people share your opinion on the true intent behind their apology and what would’ve happened if they didn’t get that backlash
yeah, its kind of hard to take everything they said back especially since they had everything in motion before letting everyone know. If they simply asked their community if this was a good idea with a poll this all would have been avoided but because everyone was met with no choice, I'm not surprised this was the outcome. I'm even more surprised they thought they could get away with it.
The issue is, people are scared to say it since the apology. The true parasocial fans will come for you if you get too loud about it
It's absolutely a sorry excuse of three money-hungry guys wanting more, but as long as they keep on uploading to KZhead, I'll tolerate Lim's idiotic idea of "this is how to run a company!" Side note, I LOVE the carrot necklace!
I agree their content has always been good! and thanks! its my 1 karat gold chain I like to say to people haha
They are a causionary tale of believing that you are greater than you really are.
I think the sky is the limit as long as they don't try and step on heads to get there
I had been a fan since Buzzfeed. They lost me with this. I won't be resubscribing. Just a note, they have more than 3 tiers on Patreon and their highest is $100 a month.
wow! I should have took a peak at that! that's absurd that they would even let that be an option. like casinos willing to take money they shouldn't be taking
A couple things - of the three in the apology, Steven (far left) is the CEO. He's supposed to be part of the talent but he's just not that good. And as CEO, he drives a tesla and is launching a show where he travels around the world eating the most expensive meals. He also was so unbelievablein his part of the apology. Fine it was scripted but Steven looked almost pissed. The one in the middle (Shane) at one point in the initial announcement suggested that people share subscriptions while the other 2 did not look like they liked it. I got the impression that Shane was not fully convinced on the plan but with Steven as CEO and as a friend, they trusted him. They have too many staff...too many of them are friends or family. Do I accept the apology...from Shane, yes...from Ryan...maybe. from Steven..no.
That is extremely well thought out! Thank you for giving this input!
Steven is CEO, Ryan is CFO, Shane is Secretary (according to CA business filings) So Ryan is technically in charge of the money
@@Elle-elle-elleJFC Ryan is CFO? No wonder Ghost Files costs "hundreds of thousands" per episode. The creatives should never have unfettered financial control over their babies.
@saralovelace7219 good point but then I would think then that the newest show on WatcherTV would be Ghost Files. But it's Steven's show? And they hire two new talents to do the show with him? I got the impression that Ryan and Shane have those positions in name only. Could be wrong on that one though.
@Elle-elle-elle and I just found out they are on a Live Show tour...they will be in London soon from what I heard. What? Wonder what those shows will be like after all this.
No, they can keep their apology. They aren't who I thought they were and I don't trust them. I will subscribe to you though.
I wont let you down! thanks so much for the sub!
I hope the boys go back to the basics on how they became popular in the first place, I just love yellow and blue text on a black background way back in BUN (Buzzfeed Unsolve Network) tbh..
I have a feeling they are listening to the comments more than ever!
I dont even think this is an app. Watcher seems to only be available on lap top and maybe a smart tv? I don't know what the numbers look like but how many of us actually sit down and watch them like its a real show? I leave them on in the background
for real its sound to mask tinnitus for most haha
But Ryan is a Real Hollywood Producer on a TV now!!! You'll watch that right???!!
@saralovelace7219 Yeah, that's the other thing that's delusional. They're talking about their shows being Netflix quality. I love the guys and I love the channel. I do think it's overproduced and that they have beautiful sets. But ignoring that their show concepts are not that unique, they're simply not Netflix quality.
I would not be surprised if in a couple months it gets taken down and they eat their words because I get the impression that majority of their fans either can't afford/justify this expense or simply will not support it on principle.
Everyone will just wait for them to trickle onto KZhead
They got enought initial subs to not back out at all so prolly not
@@PrinceDyspo I'm very curious to know how many people actually signed up
The best thing to come out of the whole Watcher fiasco was all the cool smaller youtubers I found covering their shenanigans
Thanks for that! I'm glad I decided to cover this topic because it allowed me to realize just the kind of content my audience and I can both resonate with :)
Eloquently delivered content, Mr Catsoup, sir. You're one of the recommended small creators my yt algorithm surprisingly started suggesting me since this Watchertv mess went live. Subscribed and looking forward to more of your videos.
I love reading that! thanks for the sub and a new video will be posted tonight!!!!!
@@CatchupChips looking forward to that with notifications set to All 👍🏻👍🏻
I had never heard of Watcher before this. What a WILD way to be introduced to KZheadrs. Their “Goodbye KZhead” video absolutely crashed and burned. Yes, they apologized, but what rubs me the wrong way was that they thought their first video was great to post. What a way to metaphorically slap their supporters in the face. They will not be getting any views or time from me.
They are a textbook example of Darwinism
When they see that they no longer see gold leaf on their food in the future, yes they will come out and crawl back to their viewers.
Its funny you say that, what a good analogy. id never order gold on food but then again I also would never charge my viewers for my content haha.
But also running a video streaming website is NOT cheap so many factors determine pricing. But like their explanation makes no sense cause running a website is completely counterintuitive
For real!!!!
That yip yip audio mask on the apology video was very well chosen 😂
Hahaha! thanks, its all I could think of
Looking passed the audio issues, I see great potential. You earned a new sub bro. Hope to see more content soon.
thank you so much for that! it was sure rough realizing an echo effect was at 1 percent for a bit after I posted it.
Dead Inside hits bro, love it
I agree!
Ego and money had something to do with this decision and I'm glad the fans responded the way they did.
yeah the fans really had a hive mind for this one
I was an avid fan for shane and ryan since buzzfeed unsolved and ngl not even their apology will make me watch them again. the "good bye youtube" has shown me enough how important I am for them. :) so so so disappointed. steven really is a bad idea to combine with them. im sorry to say this but Im truly feel like Im nothing but a stepping stone for them :)
luckily for us there are so many people who wont do that to their community that made them who they are. glad to see people still look for relatability in a creator cause after all KZhead was never meant to be super high production it has always shined in its personable content.
@@CatchupChips yeah agree! 💯🥺
i’m pretty sure everyone sides with you on how they def were trying to make more money off of their subscribers and they were hoping everyone would go along with it and the patreon members wouldn’t notice, it’s a shame too because they seem like cool people
Who knows why all of this went down but I suspect they spent too much money, life became more stressful and they lost their initial path in all of this
@@CatchupChips yeah most likely, just a few things that doesn’t make it sound good is them saying how things are pricy to make videos and all that, and then them saying they hired 2 people from buzzfeed for more shows and want to hire more, they probably should of not talked about the future things they will do while asking for people to join their streaming
Seemed * yeah but now I wonder how much of that was just so much b.s.
So.... anyone else hear that the patreon members are technically getting a free pass to watcher tv. For exactly three months.
really? just 3? when did they say that?
a basic cost benefit analysis would have told them that launching a platform is a bad move. Like they could do it in a much less shitty way but I'm sure the cost of the platform maintenance and development is unnecessary.
I think absolutely so many things are unnecessary they they spend their money on. lol
Because it was never about money, despite what they insist. It was about ego, thinking they have become Too Good for KZhead, and thinking their content is more professional than it is.
I'd love to have been a fly on the wall when these three figured out that this was an absolute catastrophe. I also would love to know what went through their minds when they figured this out because I guarantee you they really really did think that this was going to work out. Maybe flying too close to the Sun?
My guess is that the original two were convinced by the third fellow. they probably got pretty mad at him after it came crashing down
If the Watcher Boys are so hung up on the "TV experience" why don't they remember that cable tv has advertising? These guys would absolutely have double dipped on their paying audience and l could have definitely done without the repeated assertions that it's "for us" it's definitely for them and them alone. It's disingenuous and manipulative to say that there would be no more Watcher if they didn't make this move. They thought they were Worth It until the audience solved the Mystery File of the Greedy Guys. They flew too close to the Sun because they thought it was made of gold leaf and Steven Lim wanted to shoot a segment for "Travel Season" (with at least 2 new employees they can't afford). Anyway, l won't be re subscribing to Watcher. I just subscribed to you. Great analysis of the situation.
Thanks for that input, Very valid point about the TV experience. Thanks for the follow BTW!!! Helps me alot!
@@CatchupChips You're welcome! Happy to be here.
My fave comment was “I just spent $300 on groceries get bent” lmao Anyways, I was one of the og watchers and I love it when it was just the 3 of them. But then I noticed how elaborate everything was getting and the sets were getting “better” with more employees and higher end equipment. Basically the more money they sunk into the channel the less I enjoyed it. Eventually I just stopped watching because Shane and Ryan weren’t the same really. Their interactions, their personalities, their overall vibes, felt off and a lil hostile at times. So when I saw they were saying goodbye to KZhead I figured they wanted to go their own way or were even going bankrupt because they had so. Many. People. But nope. They just wanted to get their bag. There’s no coming back from this as far as I’m concerned
well put! They can take this lesson and treat new comers with more respect moving forward hopefully. Just like in relationships sometimes Creators gotta be a little shitty to realize how to be good and maybe they screw up with some followers, learn the lesson and treat the next ones better.
I had the same impression, the passive aggressive stuff never seemed funny to me ☹️
I didn't know who these guys were before this. I agree with you though. I think they are just sorry because they got caught...They looked terrified of losing everything because of their greed. It was a mechanical apology at best.
Like a knee jerk reaction, thanks for the comment!
Shane Ma-Day is how you pronounce his name
thanks for the correction!
@CatchupChips for sure, great video btw 😊
Great video and very realistic POV !! I am a huge Watcher fan and am reluctant to forgive them just yet 😟
I guess they just have a thinner line to balance for a while, but they can still make the right moves going forward. thanks for the kind words btw!
I've only just started viewing Watcher after years of watching Ryan and Shane on the other channels' original shows. The first thing I noticed when viewing Watcher was how different Ryan's personality had become. It seems to me that success has changed him in a negative way - he's done the classic thing of turning from someone who lacks confidence to someone who is over-confident. Shane doesn't seem to have changed at all. As for the Lim guy, I hadn't even seen him before! I thought, "Who the hell is he?" I feel that Lim has stoked Ryan's fragile ego to a point where the latter has a totally out-of-touch sense of reality. Why Shane has gone along with it all is what baffles me. I guess that while in front of the cameras, he seems to have the stronger personality, off-screen he's actually not that pushy in his opinions and has let the other two take control. JMHO. Whatever, it's very sad. I really liked their original shows. Just the rapport between Shane and Ryan was what made the show. Watching them was like an evening at home with friends. They clearly don't understand what their popularity is based on.
Time for them to make some smart changes and revert to what connects them back to their fan base. Alot of transparency needs to follow this debacle in order for people to gain trust in this. First off they need to admit just who is putting pressure on them to expand, I have a feeling it was Lim that was leading Shane and Ryan down a pipe dream. But IMO any one of them entertaining the idea of charging their viewers, convinced or convincer, is at guilt.
Double charging the patrons wasn't an overnight, a mistake, or an oopsie. Their patrons are coming out and saying they were offered 40% of WatcherTV. The double charge was on purpose.
like I said I don't think it was oversight, I think it was neglect. thanks for the comment!
Yip yip yip yip yip yip... 🤣
haha Im so glad others found that funny!
I was a watcher fan til they pulled this. It’s a good apology but I don’t accept the explanation. Hiring too many people is not a me problem. The answer is right there. You have to fire some people you shouldn’t have fired. You’ll lose some face with them but you lost way more face by trying to keep them on. And I don’t thing Steven, the guy to the left, is sorry at all. He’s too robotic in this.
I can see this too, super animated in his movements. others guys looked like they seen a ghost.
I share your opinion. I’m not convinced that they have learned their lesson. I think they might try this again.
Ill be watching closely to see if they are actually making changes
I hope that promise you made at the end doesn't include never starting a Patreon. There's absolutely nothing wrong with doing that and it's completely different than the bs that Watcher tried to pull
if I was to make a patreon it would consist of fun hour long videos of me going on adventures and stuff like that. extra content that would be like 1 buck a month just to show support and in return get to know about me on a much more personal level. the videos would probably also include step by step guides on how to make videos like me as an inside look into how I edit, that's a hypothetical though because all I care about for the foreseeable future is just being distracted making videos for anyone who may wanna listen :) thanks for commenting btw
This was such a bone headed idea to start with. Putting aside the greed, they are years late to the streaming game. And they claim to want to make tv caliber quality tv that you watch from a website??? No app?? Such dumbasses, I'm embarrassed for them. They even stopped using the word streaming, and keep calling it platform in this video, which is more accurate. This is ridiculous 😂😂😂😂 anyway, you make very good commentary, again, I'm glad I found your channel!
thanks so much for the kind words :) I hope to see you in the comments of future videos!
Couldn't agree more. Spot on and subbed 👍
thanks! and thanks for the sub!!!!!! your one of the OGs now :P
👍 ❤️
:)
new sub! you're right: the math still doesn't math!
welcome! thanks for the sub!
Great Vid! Subscribed!
hey thanks so much! and thank you for the sub! cant wait to deliver more videos soon! like editing one right now soon!
Great vid! Enjoyed your opinion
thanks!!
yip! made me laugh 😂
:P thanks!
I had never even heard of these guys before this. Get over yourselves!
Same!
I get it. Making the same KZhead videos and not growing as a creative can be boring. You want bigger better things etc. I empathize. Don't make it my problem though
for real, everyone wants to grow, but don't use the heads of the supporters as stepping stones.
Come on guys don't know you that Steven has to keep up with the joneses? He has celebrities like Simu Liu to hang out and play baseketball and impress. How else is he going to rub shoulders with other celebrities...by being poor?
Defiantly not by the Ramen noodle lifestyle haha
I would pay $5.99 a month to watch Puppet History….
That says a lot about the value you got from it, that's awesome!
It’s not too late. People need to be able to correct their mistakes. Otherwise why not just do the wrong thing all the time if nobody will accept it when you fix your mistakes?
I don't think it was a mistake in their eyes is my point, I think they got called out for a very intentional thing. They didn't accidentally try and overcharge, they intentionally did.
@@CatchupChips I think you just need the drama to keep going so you can get views on your video. And you refuse to accept the apology because you can’t milk the drama for views anymore. This is a very shady practice the internet does where no apology ever gets to be accepted because then you wouldn’t be able to get clicks from someone else’s mistakes. If you think this is content maybe KZhead isn’t the career path for you. You’re just making the world a harder place to live in.
@@ayjay579 I'm not sure who hurt you, but it wasn't this content creator. Feel better soon.
I dont agree. Most of the people ive seen comment on the apology have had the sentiment of forgiveness. I think this creator is being honest in that its more than a mistake. It was a very concious choice watcher made, with full understanding what they were doing to their fanbase. If it was a sincere apology in my opinion it wouldnt have been them just apologizing about "how they delivered the message." It would be on what they did AND how they did it. @ayjay579
@@megansutherland9450 That says more about you than anything. The fact that some people can never forgive is truly sad. What a horrible way to live
It's not too late lol. They tried something, realized it got terrible feedback and then went back on it. They did the right thing. And we're still getting their content. At the end of the day if you watched them before you'll still watch them now.
Im glad you have such a forgiving outlook! I am impartial to the watcher, I just found the situation extremely interesting. I didn't watch them before and Its not really my preferred style of content, but from what a lot of people are saying here in these comments, they feel used as a stepping stone and indeed did unfollow them. if you look at social blade they have lost over 100 thousand followers just 2 days after they announced their change so they indeed did loos a good chunk of their viewers already.
GREED
For real!! Heads up! new post in 30 mins!