Scandal: Apollo 15
In June 1972, a scandal broke over the behavior of three of NASA’s astronauts. The Apollo 15 postal cover scandal seems little remembered today, but it rocked the nation at the time, destroying the careers of people who had been hailed as national heroes.
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Script by THG
#history #thehistoryguy #nasa
Several viewers have made comments over the pronunciation of Gemini. Yes, NASA has always used an idiosyncratic pronunciation said to be pronounced the same as "Jiminy cricket." In 2018 a NASA official told the New York Times that the “knee” pronunciation "is part of the agency’s culture, and serves almost as an insider’s shibboleth - a word whose proper delivery identifies you as someone in the know."
Not "Sheer-uh" ... "Shi-RAH" Your welcome.
@@randb4865 Getting to the bottom of the pronunciation of Wally Schirra's name was a long ride. The name seems to be universally pronounced as THG pronounced it, except that the astronaut himself said it Shi-RAH when introducing himself in a 1987 Actifed TV commercial. The commercial is shown on the YT video, "COMMERCIAL Actifed - Astronauts (1987)" Thanks for the adventure!
Southern accent from Florida and Houston? When will the internet learn that there is no 'correct' pronunciation?? The World is a big place, full of people.
Ya'all say pōTAYtō, I'll say puTAHtō ... 😂
How do you pronounce shibboleth? Shib-Boleith? Shy-bo-leth? I want to work this world into a conversation at work tomorrow.
Does anyone else see the irony of a Congressional or Senate committee investigating the issue of someone benefitting financially from a public position?
i wish i didnt. 😞
Presumably you do or you wouldn't have mentioned it. Who would you prefer to look into it? The local cartel? Would that be better?
Irony? Or hypocrisy?
Quit picking on crazy Nancy Pelosi! She's just like Pedojoe, just a lovable, likeable elderly person that a jury could NEVER take seriously! Right?🤣🤣🤣
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 You realize you're defending people who out perform the best stock traders in the world but only after they get to congress? The truth is the cartels may be criminals but they don't lie and pretend to be "public servants". As Harry Truman once said "show me someone who gets rich in politics and I'll show you a crook"
I’m sure glad politicians never profit from their positions in government.
Fair point
One of our farm reps used to work for an oil company and lived in Kenya in the 90s he said that the corruption out there was so blatant eg the government departments would skim so much off the police budget that there was not even enough for pay so they would then go out blockade a busy route it two and charge people a toll for using it to pay their wages then you had others filtering down the line though the everyday people were some of the nicest and kindest he has met it seemed like it was never far away He said when he left that industry and returned in 97 to Heathrow he was greeted by the smarmy grins and smirk of Tony Blair and John Major on massive election posters. He said it made him realise the West is just as corrupt ours are just better at hiding it.
What's really sad is quite a few of the career politicians still try to push the narrative of 'public servant' and the mere pittance of the millions they get for the influence of their position is adequate compensation for their 'unwavering service and sacrifice' TERM LIMITS Now!!!!
Vote only for challengeers not incumbent. It's an imperfect solution, but it will send a message. There are more good people than bad, in my experience. Just a thought.
😂😂😂
I had the honor of meeting the Apollo 15 astronauts during an event in Salt Lake City in the fall of 71 when I was 11 years old. When their schedule for the day was announced my mom actually wrote to Gov. Rampton lamenting the lack of opportunity for just regular folks to see the astronauts that day. In response he arranged for me to spend the entire day with one of his aides travelling with the astronauts around the city to some of the events where the astronauts would be. I got to shake hands with all three of them and have a large print of their mission patch signed by each one of them. One of the most memorable days of my life thanks to my wonderful parents; my dad for getting me interested in flying and space and my mom for making the impossible possible. Thank you mom and dad, RIP
Fantastic. You touched American heros.
That is awesome! Your parents were exceptional people. What a wonderful memory. Thank you for sharing. 👍
I'm in the UK. Can hardly imagine. Cool story, linking you with those who made it to the vacuum of space. People have a romantic view, but for me, the cold, the radiation, the vacuum, the blinding light and heat, it's a medieval version of hell, except centuries ago they could hardly imagine it. Regardless, it's equivalent to a religious experience, whichever god or not you believe in.
How were they?
Aren't you special ? How does that justify the complaint registered by your parents ? Your governor increased his PR by privileging the child of one person who managed to have her complaint acknowledged. Wasn't that the point of her complaint ???
This "scandal" seems pretty insignificant considering the conduct of our government and its waste of taxpayer dollars today.
... especially when a former president is at best a common criminal, and at worst, a traitor...
People complained about John Young swearing as the Apollo 10 LM nspun out of control after the abort test....stupid.
@@samsignorelli Actually...astronauts were expected to conduct themselves in a professional manner...Something sorely in need with today''s elected leaders.
@@alantasman8273 Truth. But put yourself in the same situation.
The times sure have changed
the transcript of the corned beef sandwich incident is one of my favourite bits of space foolery
Don't forget the floating turd incident on Apollo 10. That audio is a certified classic
Space foodery.
Let them eat corned beef sammies! - King Louis XVI and Marie Antoinette
Minor point, but Schirra pronounced his last name as …sheer ah…rhymes with hurrah. Most You Tube videos seem to get it wrong.
OMG, Bread crumbs in space...the humanity!
And now there is zero accountability OR embarrassment within the U.S. Government
As a 15 yr old, I figured out that if I sent a self addressed envelope to the aircraft carrier that picked up Apollo11 capsule I could get a cancelled stamp back with the date the astronauts were on the carrier….. still have it.
That is cool. Sorry I like stuff like that. I wonder how many people did likewise.
I was 16 when Neil stepped off that ladder. I had, as a Young Brit, fully expected them to say how great the USA was in those first words. Even at that age, Neils' words brought me to tears as it was such a poignant statement. Now at 70, they are still my greatest Heroes. Niel, Buz and Michael took the greatest of risks to do what they did and for me personally, these guys deserve to make something out of such a dangerous mission. It all seems so petty to me. I get the point but even so. These guys were the right stuff and always will be in my eyes. I might also add that I love your channel and your accurate factual narrative on many subjects.
My dad joined the R,A,F, at 15 years old in 1947. Flew and rated for many DH jets and after many children, I was born. The fourth boy, in 1958. Mum and dad talked and dad left the R.A.F. After many jobs and two more children; In September of 1964 we arrived in Melbourne, Australia, where dad started his career in Air Traffic Control. Sydney Oliver Liquorish helped to formulate and write the training processes and practices that protect us everyday, in the air or on the ground. My dad was the right stuff.
and after all these years you still believe it happened. shame on you. but heh, you're part of the lie after all. itz not your fault that you believed it
I landed a summer internship at Grumman Aerospace in my sophomore year (1967] at New York Institute of Technology. I managed to get a full time job and finished my bachelor degree going to night classes. I wrote a Fortran software battery simulator program for the LEM (Lunar Excursion Module). Best job I ever had.
Best job you ever... what, man, what?? Don't leave us hanging!
Did you design the great HVAC system that kept the modules temperature at a comfortable 72F for a week and powered only by a 12 volt battery? I wish they released that technology. My energy cost for running my ac leaves me eating mayo on white bread sandwiches.
@@IDNHANTU2day Voltage is not related to energy. Besides, it was a 28 V system supplied primarily from fuel cells fueled by hydrogen and oxygen, not batteries. They didn't need heating and the cooling was done without a heat pump via radiators pointing away from the sun. It's nothing secret or mysterious but you don't have the opportunity to use radiative cooling as efficiently here on earth.
@@skunkjobb the guy is trying to surreptitiously suggest the landings were faked.
Their “indiscretions” hardly make a dent in the fact that they never went to the moon in the first place ! See how bold they became in the hoax ?
We live in a country where money is king yet we begrudge our heroes for needing it. We pay millions to men to play with a ball yet risk your life for peanuts. Upside down world.
Look at the compensation packages of top tier racing drivers. Many multiple millions of $ every year. Michael Schumacher was earning $100 million a year
I fully believe that at some point in the past, we jumped into an alternate reality. It could be worse, somehow, I suppose.
Hang in there, and pass this message on, it's going to get better for all...stay safe& positive...🙏✨👌🦉🐲❣️
BS. They knew the contract when they signed it. You remain a hero, if you don't sell your integrity. Playing with a ball in a stadium is not even close to the same thing as serving in the military (all of them) and flying Apollo. You are off-base. It is a privilege, not a job.
We pay millions to people who play ball because that entertainment sells tickets. On any given day 100 000s of people are in the stands cheering their teams on and many more watching from home. The reason those people are paid those salaries is because they have a Union collective bargaining agreement. Total every single players contract and that is only 49% of the money involved. The owners get the other 51%. Which pays for the organization, marketing, etc.
Considering that James Irwin became so dehydrated during the mission that he picked up a heart murmur that plagued him for the rest of his life, this scandal seems so petty. Every Apollo astronaut was in peril from ignition to splashdown.
Training is equally as deadly
If it had happened on earth, he'd been in the ICU treated for a heart attack. Luckily for him, breathing in a 100% pure oxygen atmosphere (though at 5psi), and being in a constant state of free-fall (weightlessness) reduced the load on his heart drastically. It probably saved his life then and there. Then there was the parachute that failed after deployment (The Apollo CSM was actually designed to only use 2 parachutes, the 3rd was for redundancy). As a matter of fact, Al Worden saw that one other parachute was in the process of collapsing shortly before splashdown as well. They got lucky indeed!
@@NghilifaThe thrusters fired when they weren't supposed to and the hypergolic fuel came in contact with the parachutes. They started to burn away.
Not according to the latest joe rogan guest 😂😂 he knows for certain that it was fake. Just looka t his website 😂😂
Dehydration don’t cause heart murmurs lol
The "myth of the perfect astronaut" was shattered for me by reading the book "The Right Stuff". After all, at the end of the day, they were just men doing a very dangerous job.
A few guys, like Glenn, never took advantage of their high position in NASA. But only a few.
@@mitchellhawkes22 Would John Glenn have been a Senator if not for being an astronaut or get to space again at age 77?
@@pauleohl How did he "take advantage" of the situation by running for office? The voters put him in office... And can you verify that he used his new political clout to hitch a ride on the Space Shuttle?
@@mitchellhawkes22Glenn? Former astronaut known for his role in the Keating 5 scandal? That Glenn. Yeah he's a total alter boy. 😂
These infractions kind of pale in comparison to todays infractions by politicians... and there are no repercussions nowadays.
NASA:"we're going to place you into some serious lufe or death situations that you certainly may die from" Also NASA when you take some stamps to the moon:"HOW DARE YOU???".
It isn't about the stamps, it's about honesty and whether you're cashing in on your privileged position. It reflects back on NASA and could damage it's image, and reduce future funding. Sometimes it's not the thing itself, but how it looks. If you work in a store is it OK to help yourself to things because others do it and it won't break the company?
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 Do you really think the astronauts were taking things for financial gains? They absolutely weren't.
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 Taking something somebody else owns is not the same thing as using your personal weight allowance for profit. It wasn't illegal, and nobody was harmed. Sounds like NASA and the Senate were just mad they didn't think of it first.
@littlefluffybushbaby7256, If many of these people's parents aren't completely ashamed of themselves, It's because they're not intelligent enough to know that they should be.
My initial thought was that they knew better as former military officers, but as I thought about it more, it's not like people in the Presidency and Congress don't profit from their former positions in office by giving speeches for substantial profit. These people put their lives in harms way far more than politicians do.
Not to mention all of those in congress allowed to trade stocks with nearly zero limitations. These guys should've had no more than a slap on the wrist. Getting paid 7,000$ on the side after risking your life for your country is nothing.
@@SuperCatacataInvesting by buying stocks that Nancy Pelosi buys is better than following Warren Buffett. Hmm, I wonder why.
The key word is, "former." These were active government employees/ active duty military.
@@WALTERBROADDUS. Current members of Congress can make stock trades based on their knowledge of upcoming legislation and regulations even though they’re still in office.
@vociferon-heraldofthewinte7763 that's bad of course, yet not the same and not really relevant.
Being 62 i remember this. I also remember the majority of the public thinking it was not that big a deal. Good video, by the way. You put a lot of research into this.
So brave, thank you for your service boomer
@@Mr._Burns28 What is that supposed to mean, other than showing your bigotry.
@@Mr._Burns28 Really. I'm 65, remember this too. You have a problem with older folks remembering stuff? Called Ageism. Best part, you'll get to experience it.
@@JamesAllmond I really don't understand these punks bigotry towards older folks. They don't seem to realize that they themselves will get old.
I'm 63. I remember it also not being a source of scandal to the public. And the punks who try to "okay Boomer" us only do so because they're weak and frightened.
I'm willing to bet that if we held that same yardstick against the politicians of today, not one would be left standing. Not one!!
Why just "of today?" Politicians in the '60s and early '70s were more corrupt than now. They did more insider trading based on their knowledge of federal procurement then than now, because there was far less oversight.
That is another issue. Because there are crooked people out there doesn't mean it's ok to be crooked. Is it OK to kill a few people because others have killed millions?
@@brianarbenz1329 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 no. Literally EVERYONE I KNOW who was alive in the 60s and 70s agrees politicians are FAR FARRRR more corrupt NOW than then. You're literally insane if you think there is less corruption now and that how much "oversight" there is now makes any difference whatsoever. Extra-ordinary claims require extra-ordinary evidence and you sir... well like I said. You're literally the ONLY PERSON I HAVE EVER SEEN claim that politicians are LESS corrupt NOW than in the 60s ad 70s. Now go home, get sober, and think about what you just said.
I asked Al Worden about another little known factoid...did Jim Irwin have a heart attack on liftoff from the moon. He did, sort of. Jim had a heart condition manifest on the way home from the mission (a bigeminy) which is treated as a heart attack. Al said it was blamed on low potassium due to the extended high protein, low residue diet they were on. He later died of a heart attack in 1991 at age 61 (the youngest astronaut to die at that point).
Huh
True. It wasn't just due to low potassium though, they worked a 23 hour day that day (they had their 3rd and final EVA, as well as the rendezvous with the command module) as well. So both him and Scott were exhausted by the time they had docked with the CSM, then after that, they had to do more work (transfer the rocks) as well as conduct other experiments/tasks in the command module before their scheduled rest period. Amazingly, mission control noticed (through the telemetry gathered from their biomedical sensors) that Irwin was in serious trouble, but they neglected to tell Scott that important piece of information. If he had known, he would have ordered Irwin to rest immediately (at the very least, immediately after having docked with the CSM), instead of having him work alongside him and Worden to finish out the tasks remaining that day, before their rest period. On Apollo 16 & 17, not only did they include more potassium in their diets (through enriched orange juice), they also scheduled their stay on the surface so that they had an 8 hour rest (sleep) period after their 3rd and final EVA on the surface of the moon. That way, they'd be in much better shape the following day, when they rendezvoused with the CSM in lunar orbit.
Wow… I had never heard that nugget before.
The story goes on with the corvette leases astronauts received costing only $1. Thanks, great story
How ironic.
I was in the airforce as an aircraft technician and for several years I worked for the Aerobatic Team (I wont mention country or team). The pilot's would sell hats, T shirts, stickers etc and sign them before and after the show. They would use the money as "slush" money for the pilot's to buy meals and alcohol whilst we were away on trips, dodgy as. On one trip we were at a country airport and one of the pilot's who ran the sale of the memorabilia pointed to the big box of team hats and said "see if you can get rid of them" and he gestured to the large crowd behind the fence who wanted to watch the aircraft depart. I knew he meant that I should sell them, but instead I went to the fence and gave away all the hats to any kids that were there. When we got back to our base, he asked me for the box. He looked in and saw it was empty and then cheerfully asked me for the money. I just said "what money? I gave the hats away to the kids". He was absolutely enraged. I said "I assumed this was merchandise provided by the airforce to give away". I then said something along the lines of "Do you guys sell this stuff? Do you issue receipts or anything?". He just turned and walked away and it was never mentioned again.
That’s by far the most innocuous “scandal” I’ve ever heard of. People’s careers were destroyed over some envelopes?
pure gold
But your and my tax dollars subsidizing a private business venture? We all hate thatwhen it's called "corporate cronies." But we'll make it out to be innocuous in this case?
No. The issue was whether they were profiting from their privileged position. The amount or objects involved are not the point. If you allow it where does it end? Sponsors names on their suits? Nike flashes on their boots. If I did something similar in my job I would be dismissed. Corruption, however minor, reflects back on the organization you represent.
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 I understand the issue. I also understand that corruption, however minor, doesn't MERELY reflect back on the organization but also rots the organization's function from the inside. That being said... you couldn't pay to me care. Half our country is screaming for war and destruction and hate and the other half want to illegitimately throw the other side in jail just because they don't like them. You can guess which half is which. The truth is both descriptions apply pretty aptly to both sides at this point. Corruption simply doesn't matter when both sides of the isle are so ideologically driven and INSANE that you might as well throw out the truth entirely because nobody cares. Solving corruption is for a world where truth matters to more people. Solving corruption in a situation like we're in now will solve NOTHING sadly and if ANYTHING will just drive one side to attempt to declare tyranny over the other for having solved it. Corruption might just be the social lubricant that is currently saving us from civil war. And that's pretty messed up. But that seems to be the way it is. And I don't see a feasible way out at least within the next few decades.
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 Agree. And we also have to remember that the Lunar Module engineers at Grumman racked their brains for years to comply with orders that every once in weight reduction that could be achieved for the LM be done so that the vehicle could possibly get to the moon. They would spend months finding a way to reduce the weight of a component or a tank by a few ounces. That was the only way to make the moon missions happen. Then to see that astronauts added weight, no matter how little, by breaking the rules for their monetary gain was an insult to the whole project.
For the early Apollo missions, the astronauts were unable to get life insurance policies due to the danger in their line of work. So crews would sign a number of postal covers and leave them behind on Earth, with the idea being that their family could sell the signed covers in the event the astronauts died. These “insurance covers” are highly collectible today and routinely trade for thousands of dollars apiece.
This story seems so quaint in today's era of normalized, ubiquitous "privatization." It's nostalgic.
I agree. Great comment. Was there ever a time that heroes didn't demand to be paid money?
The ultimate stamp of disapproval.
Ha...Clever!👍
Touche'
pure gold
I think 90% of us started typing the same thing..
A sticky case requiring a team of gumshoe detectives to investigate. 🔎 🔎
I think NASA really fumbled the ball on this one. How much would You pay for an artifact that has been to the Moon? NASA could have paid for the whole Apollo program if they had officially sold stamps or coins or anything that had been to the Moon.
Yeah, overly cautious, but after the fire, can you blame them?
@@roberthevern6169 That fire was due in part because of budget constraints... How much would you pay for a dime that has been to the Moon with Apollo 11 or 12? One pound of stamps, a special issue for Apollo 15, would have sold out before the mission even launched!
Cuzinevil "That fire was due in part to budget constraints" can you expIain that statement. Because of the space race and out of respect for JFK, I don't think NASA at that time had any budget constraints. That fire was due to having a pure oxygen atmosphere in the capsule. Something intuition would tell you costs significantly more. Someone at NASA should have recognized the significant increase in danger for the astronauts posed by using pure oxygen but apparently no one did or maybe they just weren't listened to.
Despite this scandal, Apollo 15 accomplished more scientifically than any other Apollo mission. I forgive a bit of minor profiteering when compared with what Scott, Irwin and Worden achieved.
- If good science came from these missions, that's all I care about. Hand the rest off to Keemstar 1971 Edition. - It's awesome that the memorial included the names of cosmonauts as well as astronauts. Motivations and propaganda aside, we could all learn from this simple gesture.
For all the competition of the Space race, astronauts and cosmonauts always seem to have recognized a kinship.
That hit me, too. In Cold War context, that was brave and thoughtful.
Indeed. We should be more like them and less like our so called leaders.
@@TheHistoryGuyChannel It's like sailors. The medium that they work in is unpredictable and dangerous, and so breeds a special community. Like when the Royal Navy sailors risked their ships and in some cases their lives to try to rescue German sailors following the sinking of Bismarck.
NASA = No Astronaut Souvenirs Allowed.
Or, morbidly...need another seven astronauts. Both Challenger and Colombia had 7 crew members
NASA: Need Another Seven Astronauts. This happened twice, eh?
To this day, ROSCOSMOS has lost four cosmonauts: Vladimir Kamarov in Soyuz 1 and Georgy Dobrovolsky, Vladislav Volkov, and Viktor Patsayev in Soyuz 11. We lost 14 in the Challenger and Columbia disasters. So Russia has a better safety record. The one record they can take pride in.
Military secrecy being essential. Never A Straight Answer
@@EricCoop Yeah. If you want to be "anal" about it, the number of US nationals lost is 13 (Ilan Ramon on Columbia was Israeli). It's 16 if you include the Apollo 1 mishap.
Remember when Richard Nixon called the moon with a rotary telephone?
Their is this realy cool bit of space age tech that made it possible, it's called the radio. Also it wasn't a rotary, they were a bit old-fashioned by then.
In 1971 a guy from NASA visited the school I was at. He had a satelite connection to the NASA computer cluster, Beowulf, with a rotary telephone.
Not even an iPhone 15???
NASA: We havent gone back to the moon because we lost all the technology for the space suits
yes, with time delay at all. amazing how far technology has gone backwards.
But yet Congressmen and women can use insider knowledge to profit in the stock market!
I smuggled a couple snickers bars on board .
Will you share? I'm feeling a bit 'hangry'?
This kind of accounting for the Apollo program bothers me. A significant portion went towards infrastructure such as the pad 39 complex, which is still in use today. I'm not an accountant, but this is a pet peeve of mine.
Thank you for the lesson. As a note to the costs. NASA was created in 1957. From 1957 to 2020 the entire budget of NASA was less than the 2020 defense budget of 700 Billion dollars. The yearly budget of NASA represents less than 1% of the Federal Budget. NASA's mission does not only include missions in space but also, as referenced by a History Guy video, working with the FAA to keep commercial and military aviation safe.
National Air & Space Agency. They've developed so unbelievably much for air travel. In contrast to space travel developements, where they seem to go backwards.
"I'm even gonna give you one of these dimes I'm takin' up there with me tomorrow, so's you can play with it in your pocket, and dream about outer space." Fred Ward as Gus Grissom to Dennis Quaid as Gordon Cooper in "The Right Stuff".
Thank you for recounting that great scene from a great movie, directed by Philip Kaufman!
Absolutely hated what they did to Grissom in that movie. Grissom was a hero and their portrayal of him borders on slander, imho.
I am privileged to have photographed Niel and Buzz. Got to shake Buzz's hand. One of few times I was star struck.
As mentioned, Scott's watch in question was an automatic Bulova chronograph. Bulova sells a modernized quartz versions of the watch that has become very popular.
Good to see that The History Guy is a Lego fan! 😊👍
The pettiness of the government when considering the risks that these men were subjected too is simply a joke, and a bad at that.
I was in X Division as were the 2 Postal Clerks of the USS Okinawa on the Apollo 15 recovery. In the months leading up to the Apollo 15 mission the ship started receiving hundreds and then thousands of requests from around the world for envelopes to be cancelled on the day of recovery, August 7, 1971. After a while the volume of requests became so large that they were processed in a warehouse in Pearl Harbor and not on the ship at all. Anyway, after the recovery we were all hanging out in the Okinawa's personnel office when the ship's Public Relations Officer (also the ship's dentist) asked one of the postal clerks to go with him to the ship's post office to cancel some more envelopes. I don't recall if he told us they had been to the moon but undoubtedly they were the ones that Scott had taken with him. If this scandal "rocked the nation", it was news to us, as the USS Okinawa spent the bulk of 1972 off the coast of Vietnam. Good times!
The Bulova Lunar Pilot is still a classic.
Excellent story HG, I enjoyed it very much.
Out of al the videos I've watched on your channel this is the best and my favorite one so far. Good job!
I appreciate you and thank you for making content.
Walter Schirra's name's pronunciation can be gathered from any of a number of CBS videos of him working with Walter Cronkite.
The Vintage Space pronounces Schirra correctly: kzhead.info/sun/ftt_Yd6XgKhuio0/bejne.htmlfeature=shared
I don't see anything wrong with taking small tokens along. I have problems with civil servants going to DC broke and never leaving or leaving millionaires.
See Clarence Thomas.
@philgiglio7922 See almost every senator while we're at it. The Dennis Hastert story was another fine example of WTF? From serial pedophile gym coach. To millionaire and speaker of the house under Bush. Kinda makes you wonder.
@@philgiglio7922ALL OF THEM.
The issue wasn't taking small tokens along. They had a quite generous allowance for that. The issue was whether they should be profiting from their privileged position. This has nothing to do with civil servants in DC or politicians, unless you thing because there is corruption in one area then it's OK everywhere. That's a child's excuse.
@@littlefluffybushbaby7256 I think they should have been allowed to profit. I don't think politicians should.
THG, wow and I thought I knew all there was to know about this matter, this was an eye-opener. Thanks, THG.
This is the first of me hearing this. Great job, always love your content.
If I could go to the moon, I would wave my right to carry along a half pound - If I could carry home a half pound moon rock as personal property.
Ooh, bad, bad commenter!
Bring a half pound hydration bag, drink the water, and fill it with moon rocks for the trip back!
@@theussmirage Perfect!
Once again we see that greed is embedded in the human heart no matter who you are.
Hell, this ain't got nothen to do with greed Buba...It's the thrill of it all 😛
I have vague memories of the scandel, but was young at the time it happened. Thank you for this episode
Well told! One of your best!!
Never underestimate the propensity of a bureaucrat to get his panties in a wad over "not much"....
Ironically, the chief physician wanted only female astronauts as it would save 40-50 lbs for each astronaut just in body weight. The entire Apollo could have been about 25% smaller and less weight.
Thank you. Good as always.
I saw/met Jim Irwin when he came to our school in Brooksville, FL around 1990 (shortly before he passed). I was in the 6th grade. We were all star struck and all received personalized autographed photos of him on the moon. Mine said, "Danny, reach for your dreams. Aim high!" I still have it today. It's one of my favorite possessions. He arrived on the school grounds in a helicopter to our amazement. I remember him being tall and well tanned. I snapped many photos of him and the helicopter and may still have those photos somewhere. He made a short appearance at the school during the day and then gave an evening speech at a homecoming event. I never knew about the scandal until just a few years ago. Just as well. We all admired him so much back then. Just looking at the photo has sometimes encouraged me and made me feel some kind of connection with him. Only a few years ago I found and cheaply purchased a large print of the exact photo at a thrift store here in Japan. I now have two. One large, unsigned. One smaller, autographed.
Great job as always THG. A couple of points: Wally Shir - rah is how his name should be pronounced. Jim Irwin left the astronaut corps and became a Christian speaker who explored Mt. Ararat in Turkey looking for Noah's Ark. I am not sure if he discovered any remnants but subsequent explorers of Ararat (with the help of a lot of glacial melting) have found something sizeable up near its summit! Lastly, if the movie "The Right Stuff" is at all accurate, the concept of the "perfect astronaut" definitely went out the window! Best,
Great video!! A piece of history i was unaware of. Check those Lego astronauts for contraband before they blast off to Mars!!
I don't keep up with your channel enough, so I just wanted to leave a comment here to say, thank you. I do enjoy your work, sir. Godspeed.
These three very brave, smart men deserved our gratitude and are heroes in the true sense of the word. I was a teen during the Apollo missions and they all remain the greatest of heroes to me. Two of the most dizzying moments of my life were meeting Frank Borman and Mike Collins.
Weather they went or not is still lots of work on and off screen it would be exhausting I’m sure.
Back in the Saddle Again Naturally!
Personally I think NASA should have not have been so rough on them they didn't hurt anything and actually raised awareness of space by there actions ❤
Dave Scott did 'hurt' something. In order to have an excuse to wear his Bulova on the Moon ... he had to break his issued Omega. The NASA test conditions, that only the Omega's survived, were MUCH worse than anything the actual missions ever subjected them to (look it up). I have no problem with the stamps and envelope 'scandals, considering the traditional scandals of politicians ... but I do have a problem with Dave Scott's intentionally breaking his issued Omega to fulfill a contract with a competitor that would enrich him personally. What are the odds that the 'Only' Omega to 'Ever' fail ... would belong to the 'Only' astronaut who was under contract to make sure he wore a different watch on the moon?! I don't believe in those kinds of coincidences. Occam's Razor ... Dave Scott broke the faith, in a way unbecoming an Officer and a Gentleman. ^v^
Thank you Lance
Wow, never knew this happened. Good job.
I remember a Golf Ball and Club Head being brought to the Moon and the speculation by Walter Cronkite of the cost to take them there and if the Astronaut would face punishment for the stunt.
That was Alan Shepard. The club (actually just a club head attached to a tool used for collecting rocks) was approved as a scientific “experiment.”
@@TheHistoryGuyChannel Thank You for clearing that up. I remember as a child watching him on my family's TV set and hoping that he didn't get into trouble.
Alan Shepherd was the first American in space. He peed in his spacesuit (after that they wore diapers) due to delays. His was a suborbital flight. He developed inner ear issues and didn’t fly Gemini or early Apollo missions but he was very involved in the programs. By some miracle he recovered and commanded Apollo 14. They say he was a difficult man, but his will and determination made him the only one of the original 7 astronauts to make it to the moon. Sadly he bumped the original Apollo 14 commander who never made it to the moon due to the cancelation of Apollo 18, 19 and 20.
I find it interesting that this is the first of your content that KZhead has placed a 'context' reference. You must be over a target that they don't want to discuss.
Huh- that is odd
Probably just because of the science deniers that claim there were no moin landings.
@@TheHistoryGuyChannel Anything that mentions the Apollo program gets it, due to people who state the moon landings were faked.
Scott dropped the ball. Brought the deal to his crew and then when it blew up in their faces, he let them take the fall. It seems he was more worried about his future than showing real leadership and responsibility.
Thanks again this is a great story
I need to look in my safe deposit box. I might have one of those covers. I have several from Apollo and Skylab that was given over the years. Never thought they were worth more than sentimental value to me.
First day covers, which is what they are called, can be worth considerable $...depending on several factors. I have a first day cover: postmarked and dated 2 September 1945 Tokyo bay. My grandfather was there for the surrender ceremony. His ship, the USS Wilkes supplied the flag for the second Iwo Jima flag raising
Quite a few years ago, at a previous bookshop I worked in, we had a call from a publisher's PR person, who was in a nearby hotel in Edinburgh with David Scott as he was meeting the media there, and would we like him to walk over afterwards to sign copies of his and Alexi Leonov's new book? Naturally we said yes, and suddenly an ordinary work day became a day where I got to shake hands with an Apollo astronaut and chat to him (yes, of course I still have my signed copy!).
Just want to appreciate the pace of this video. I've noticed a few times the narration can be quite fast, making it sometimes difficult to follow. But in this case, the pace seems just right...at least for me.
I have a very vague memory of this scandal. I was not quite 4 years old at the time. My father was an avid follower of the Apollo Program and always made sure that I watched the launches and other broadcasts. I have one clear memory of him discussing the Apollo 15 scandal with one of his professors at Black Hills State Teachers College (Now BHSU). I am curious why you did not mention the fact that Jim Irwin's PPK is STILL ON THE MOON, as he accidently left it in the LM ascent stage. It contains the wedding ring of a friend, along with several photographs.
I didn’t see that in the research. Good to know.
@@TheHistoryGuyChannel It is a fact that I stumbled across several years ago while writing one of my novels. I have my main character retrieving Irwin's PPK from the Lunar surface and returning the ring to a fictional granddaughter.
@@ubergeek1968 If it were left in the ASCENT stage, it might not have been retrievable from the lunar surface after the ascent stage CRASHED INTO THE MOON.
@@stevevernon1978 That is what I said. The PPK was left in the ascent stage and is still on the lunar surface
@@ubergeek1968 at best its "back" on the lunar surface at worst its scattered in to fragments scattered over miles.
I feel sorry for the astronauts, since they couldn’t get life insurance. Many (or all, I don’t know) signed a bunch of autographs before each flight so their widows would have something to sell.
Great video at 72 I followed the space program from Alan Shepard to Apollo 17. They were my Heroes.!
Fascinating video!!
They would not have been astronauts if they didn’t take chances. Brave men and women they are.
the big question in my mind is ..... where did all the money really go..
If I get your meaning? Money can be so tempting to the weak. Is 7k going to solve your problems? Are you on easy street?? Why do people sell their reputations for a bit of lucre?
@Redmenace96 well the whole Apollo thing is fake so where did the billions go
@@Redmenace96 the apollo thing is fake so where did all the billions go
So "if'n" the money made its way to your pocket, would there be any question 😛 Moreover, you can't tell me you wouldn't have done the same 😎
i was referring to the idea that the missions were faked so where did all the money go
Your last comment about the myth of the perfect astronaut sums up exactly why their behaviour right or wrong has tarnished their reputations.
Fantastic m8 well done
Fabric and wood piece from the Wright Flyer, 96k? I would pay a million, at least. It is interesting and good.
Pretty sure Wally's last mame is pronounced Shir AHHH! If I'm wrong then so was every news cast during his career.
Love your videos
In the mid 1970's my father was gifted one of the “first day of issue” commemorative envelopes that you talked about, that we were told went to the moon with the astronauts. I think I was about 13 years old at the time and he let me put it in my stamp collection. After watching your video I found it - it was an envelope commemorating Apollo 11 and stamped on September 9, 1969. It wasn't signed by astronauts though.
One of the most important items carried to the lunar surface was a piece of fabric from the ORIGINAL Wright Flyer. Think about that: 66 years.
It's amazing to think about the fact that the Apollo 11 mission was almost 55 years ago. The progress in technology in the first half of the twentieth century was astounding.
One example of profiteering from the civilian space program that I found particularly repulsive was the Toyota truck ad "pulling" Space shuttle Endeavour through the streets of Los Angeles. The goodwill procession had to stop, the truck pulled up and got hitched to the front of the crawler, then got filmed for the tv ad. It was made possible because Toyota paid the LA Science Center to use this precious NASA spacecraft for the privilege of such corporate grandstanding, and with a space program for which Toyota had absolutely zero to do with. (and apparently the truck wasn't technically pulling it anyway)
.. What you talk'n about ! 🤣 Lol...I remember that add...hell...it was great !!
@@ltdees2362 I was outside witnessing history, you were inside watching truck ads on TV. Evidently we have different perspectives on how best to spend our individual lives.
@@erfquake1 😛Your "perspective" is fantasy...I could comment further, however, not worth wasting my time to sarcasm... I was "outside" My family and myself, were at the Cape for the launch of Apollo 15 in July of 71...I've most likely been "outside" longer than you have been breathing...
I was a small child then, and had never heard of this before. Interesting stuff.
The only 'lapse of judgement' was NASA allowing Challenger to launch sub freezing, and not inspecting the exterior of Atlantis in orbit. People should be swinging over those avoidable debacles.
I think it's great they could make some extra money. Realistically they didn't make alot for risking their lives.
I don't know, $200K USD is a pretty hefty compensation package if you ask me!
Not compared to professional athletes. And athletes aren't really risking their lives.
@@Sportserjeff Most professional athletes will make next to nothing and risk everything short of their life. Most professions are like a pyramid and have a small number at the top with 90% just about getting by. They risked their lives but so do firemen, cops, the military etc. and they don't get anything like the money or fame. It is not just a sacrifice to be one of the few that get to go into space but also a huge privilege. If any one of them stepped aside there would be a thousand ready to jump at the opportunity. There are millions who would love to be in their position and Billionaires who pay millions to be in that position. It's a sacrifice but also a gift.
My thinking is if the Astronauts made some money off of side hustling so what? I think they deserved a bonus for spending years preparing for and then completing their extremely dangerous missions as volunteers. The Astronauts who died only got a tombstone or a school named after them..
So let them have sponsors and raise the flag of Coca Cola and plug products in their messages back to earth? Why not have marines go into action with product slogans on their camo and have the tanks covered in advertising like Formular One cars? Like pregnancy, you can't be a little honest. It's difficult saying you're doing it for your country but making a little on the side. It wasn't about the money involved, compared to their salaries it was a small amount, it was about their judgement. They were in a very privileged position and represented NASA. I think most employees who did a similar thing would not be moved to a different position but would be fired. Lots of people work in jobs where they spend years preparing and many work in jobs that are dangerous. For every one of them that made it to actually go there must have been hundreds or thousands that would have given anything to be in that position.
I don't think I'd heard of this before... but it puts me in mind of D. D. Harriman's lunar postal covers scandal (in Heinlein's "The Man Who Sold the Moon"), the scandal that time being that the covers didn't really go to the Moon. History echoes fiction, sort of.
I had never really thought about the items coming back the moon before. It is a very interesting tale indeed.
Pause for a moment, an astronaut flies the most famous mission, never to fly again. Where else would you prepare for years but only benefit from the training just once? John Glenn basically too valuable to ever again fly in space. I'm glad I grew up following the space race.
But John Did fly again. I can't confirm it, but I'm willing to bet a great deal of valuable medical data was garnered. The man was in superb condition, a result of his Marine training and esprit
Olympic athletes
John Glenn, one of the original Mercury 7 astronauts, was the only to go into space (again) on the Space Shuttle.
@@BrilliantDesignOnline Alan Shepard flew on Apollo 14. Deke Slayton flew on Apollo-Soyuz.
Glenn benefited greatly his entire life from his training and that flight... Got him elected to the Senate and all that comes with that, made him a multi millionaire and famous worldwide.....
Another mystery is who let fly the bizkit in the Apollo X lunar module. The LM is still in solar orbit...
By bizkit, you mean poo right? 🤣
@@Nghilifa Yes...they pointed fingers at each other, so we'll need to capture the LEM and do a DNA test on the floater.
Sounds to me like the Nasa admins went a little postal...
This reminds me of how NCAA athletes aren't allowed to profit from their name in any way. The difference is that student athletes don't get paid and have little time to hold regular jobs while universities make thousands, in some cases millions from athletic programs, which is why I always thought this policy was unfair. Astronauts are a bit different; they have high government salaries plus whatever hazard pay they get on top of that.
Do you remember the cardboard lander model from jack in the box?
Important legacy items, the money just a vehicle.
I collect CS Anderson first day covers and wasn't aware of this before. Not sure if many philatelist would actually be interested these "moon" covers considering the history, as it were. Every episode is a pleasure to watch. - Todd in Rochester NY.
I read that all the Apollo astronauts autographed thousands of photos and other items of memorabilia before their missions for their widows to sell if they didn’t make it back - a form of life insurance because they were uninsurable beyond their meager SGLI.
Never thought I would do this to the history guy but his name is pronounced scha-Ra!