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Baby Reindeer might just be the biggest gut punch of the year
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Baby Reindeer
stalker
Baby Reindeer Explained
Donny and Martha
baby reindeer netflix
reacting to baby reindeer
baby reindeer review
best series 2024
Richard Gadd
based on reality baby reindeer
jessica gunning
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@@billyjolly4855 Hey bud, you doing good?
26:08....I took being paid differently. The way he cried
I'm not sure why people interpret that moment at the end, when the barman offers him the free drink, as a sign that he's about to start stalking. If anything, it must be a realisation that he didn't invite what happened; he didn't lead her on, he didn't do anything excessive, it was just a small kindness that one human should be able to offer another human without fear or expectation.
Exactly!
It's a nice Scottish way of saying mental illness is real. And suicide by cop is exploding in the US
So Martha did nothing wrong?
@@smartwater598 You're not very good at reading, are you?
@@absolfan1184 you’re making excuses for her
Richard Gadd is truly courageous to reenact his harrowing real life experience of being stalked. I hope that there were plenty of emotional support counsellors on the set to help with any possible PTSD.
Not even that. He even reenacted his own SA. I can't even begin to imagine what that must've been like for him
Unless its largely exaggerated and. Framed to mininalize his responsibility leading them on for his ego. He is the No 1 Netflix show. That an incentive to lie.
@@jeffreywillstewartbruh. The blowup of this show was UNPRECEDENTED. No other has performed this way. You can't predict something like that happening and bank on it
@@viddergrapho8488 she says on this podcast, it is an adaptive from reality , not a documentary, That's a softer way of agreeing with me His being a liar is a huge part of the narrative. . There's a line from Bedazzled. " believe me, you can't trust me." This all started from his onstage breakdown that is not online , it was well received so a comedy show, it was successful then he got Netflix. If he is gay or bi, demonizing a drug infused gay date rape, is very destructive to his community. And Dahmer was hugely successful about a gay villain, Gagg just sandwiched it in this mushy stalker story.
@@jeffreywillstewart guys, we found the guy who down plays abuse against men!!
It’s really depressing for someone to try to tell his story about stalking and a horde of keyboard warriors miss the point and try to tear apart his personal life to satiate their curiosity on who she was.
That and a bunch of the people on tiktok claiming he wasnt a victim bc he didn't outright say no as well :'(
@@Pilapuzzles Oh god, I didn’t know about that.
@@RoseKonekoIt really shows that despite all the movements and steps to criminalize rape, it hasn't really solved all the problems overnight.
I'm just waiting for someone to throw in th "it's because the lack of media literacy" comment in response.
Don't worry. The whole story shows you it's useless to search for validation from strangers. Why would he care any more? He revealed his darkest secrets to the world. 90% of people will be appalled, but the 10% resonating with you are the ones that truely accept you the way you are. Why would you care for the ones not resonating with you?
Jessica Gunning was incredibly chilling as Martha, she completely disappeared into the role, making you simultaneously pity and fear her.
That scene where she chase him maniacally laughing like if they were playing tag...
Reminded me strongly of Kathy Bates from Misery, she was fantastic.
I watched only 2 episodes and just couldn't continue because she was so fucking good making me feel uncomfortable and scared
She was great! Though I noticed her eyes still had that human warmth compared to the “real Martha.”
@@tortoiseoflegends4466 YES!
I've never seen a better portrayal of what being the victim inside of an abusive relationship actually looks and feels like. The shame, the mistakes - the raw honesty with which the show approaches things was incredible. I thought it was a masterpiece in storytelling.
Horrifically there’s another one coming out soon that is also super funny to make it easier to process called ‘I love you forever’ that covers the emotional side of abusive relationships almost TOOOO well
He fabricated a lot of the story for dramatic effect (understandable as it’s a Netflix drama), but because it says at the start “based on a true story” a lot of people think more of it is true than actually is. It’s also interesting that a man can openly fetishize his stalker (get off to images of her etc) and obsess over her, and hide certain info when going to the cops to make her less likely to get arrested, and that’s totally acceptable. But if a woman did the same thing over her male stalker, everyone would claim she was into it, seeking attention, and casting doubt on “real” victims. He is potentially facing legal trouble now as he didn’t obscure enough of her identifying info and his fans found the real woman (who has never been charged with any offence in her life, no criminal record, never been to prison etc) but with things like this it’s often he-said she-said.
@@AmandaTheJedi Honestly, keep up the good work.
I never thought I would see you here
@@VexaraxHuh? Did you lost the plot somewhere? Are you martha in disguise trying to soil him? Baby reindeer literally brought up the point that stalking most of the time does not result in jail time or even get the report in to the police at all, many people/viewers shared how they can't do anything about their stalkers in the past because they technically didn't do harm. This is literally shown in Baby Reindeer. Also the woman trying to sue netflix sent countless messages, calls, letters, and many more to him. Showing how DERANGED martha is! As is any severe stalker. Youre probably trolling and rage baiting but please choose better arguments.
it's so disgusting how people see this story and want a season two or stalk the creator to see where they can find the people on the show. like its so annoying
Not to mention traumatizing, crazy that they miss the point that hard
The only season two i can see they making, is by being super meta and addressing the making of the series, the behing the scenes and all and how people started to harass him and other people they suspect are the real people in the story... But well i dont see why people are demanding a new season, the story is over, the point of the story came across flawlessly, people need to stop demanding stories and series to continue endlessly
It's so frustrating to me, because when I finsihed the show that didn't even occur to me to try to find out their real identities because what does it matter? It's irrelevant to the story being told, which is phenomenal and raw
The man it happened to chose to share the story with everyone. He literally exploited himself. "Hey guys, I know I made an intense and interesting show about my real life. I know a bunch of people watched it...but can we please just not be curious about it? My choice to make this though."
I think part of the problem is how “based on a true story” has been misused over the years to mean any bizarre work of absolute fiction that has just a tentative connection to reality. Too many viewers stop thinking that the people on screen might actually be real people and just treat them like characters. I don’t want to see real people suffer, but I’m fine watching characters suffer. If I don’t know the difference between people & characters…
I loved this show. Unfortunately i just saw a facebook comment (exactly) saying something to the effect of "i couldn't finish the show the main character was too frustrating, he couldn't stand up for himself" Like..... this is exactly the point.
It's kind of interesting. Because like, you look at abuse survivors and you go "oh I could've done this" or "I would've done that". But when you're actually in the situation, you can't. And it's deeply frustrating seeing people say things like that. Because like sure, you would think you could stand up for yourself, but in reality, it's so much harder.
@@mxmissyExactly, and many people think constantly about how they should have done this or that.
Trauma can freeze you, and being confronted by it can do that again.
People actually believe that “Flight or Fight” are the only two responses. “Fear and Freeze” can occur also.
@@TT_09 it isn't fear, it's fawn.
Abuse changes you. Fundamentally. People who never have been abused will tell you to be strong and stick up for yourself, but it takes so much from you, sometimes you feel that sticking to misery is easier than pulling yourself out of the abyss.
Thank you for saying that. My 2 daughters were abused by their female cousin who was really close to our family. The monster is in prison now but the aftermath is horrifying trying to build my girls back after such a terrible violation. Only people who have experienced it understand how it charges you.
Thank you for such a compassionate and self aware comment.
And even after you break free from an abusive person you are never the same, forever changed. Your life gets better in many ways but you’re not the same person you were going into the relationship.
😅
So much of Baby Reindeer contains information you couldn't beat out of me. The trans chaser stuff, the fantasising about Martha, going back to the abuser after his journey of healing. But the fact that he was honest enough to write that stuff in... whew. Made the show all the better
Exactly In my head I was like “i would have never admitted that” not that telling your truth is wrong. Just. A braver person than I i suppose. The show wouldve been fine without it yet it also makes it better bc its just brutal honesty that makes an impact. Which im also happy for bc, theres prob other survivors who feel the same way & felt alone in that
I loved this show Donny's self destructive response to trauma is so relatable and this show masters the concept that there is no perfect victim. You can be a victim and be flawed. I love it.
It was so interesting because not many pieces of media would blatantly explain it the way he did. He went through something horrible and in trying to process it, he developed a dysfunctional relationship to it. It's like when survivors of CSA end up watching content where an adult engages in a relationship with a minor. Or when a person who got SA'd ends up becoming hypersexual.
the part about him watching content influenced by his trauma was so real. I've already had this discussion about coping with some fandom communities that are more open and it's something very common. this just reinforced my mindset that if someone is engaging in some kind of (not illegal) content that disturbs you, you shouldn't attack them because you don't know what they are going through
No one is perfect, lot people through alot if stuff different from us and we don't know other people what they handle, glimpses and stuff, we all go through things different ways.
It's called a trauma bond and it's the most confusing thing to go through. You know rationally that you are seeking out the abuser even though you know it's going to destroy you continuously but you don't know why and you can't stop . I've been there. It's the worst kind of hell and breaking free is akin to giving up an addiction.
@@erinlarge5649 me too unfortunately there's no rationality to it and when you look back you wonder what the heck you were thinking.
It's mind blowing, the lack of self awareness, that people would watch a show about a man who was stalked and abused only to turn around and do the same thing themselves.
You realize there might be a slight difference in terrorizing somebody for decades and waiting in front of his house everyday compared to trying to find some info about somebody on the internet because of curiosity without causing harm to somebody? It's somehow more mind blowing you can't differentiate a serious mental disorder from normal behaviour. It's obsession vs. curiosity.
@@miskatonic6210 Maybe go back and reread the comment. I specifically said did the 'same thing' which was stalk and abuse. I was not referring to those who did research out of curiosity. I was referring to the people who took it to the next level and abused the woman. So yes I can differentiate. Better, clearly, than you can decifer plain English before you lash out.
@@miskatonic6210 Harassing someone online because of a miniseries you saw isn't "normal behavior"
He fetishized the entire situation. look further into it.
@@miskatonic6210 they are both stalking. the behaviour of the media and the public is disgusting. stalking is stalking. if we have a culture in which stalking is considered acceptable (media behaviour) then we shouldn't be surprised if stalking happens irl. society does it, society encourages it.
"They can say all you had to do was tell them to stop, but if you say that after 70 emails, they know it takes that many emails to get a response." This sentence put chills down my spine and I am so sorry for whatever you've been through that caused this observation.
my own Darrien is also still walking free, so I don't think I could stomach watching this myself. Thanks for covering it
Yeah of course, they do really hone it in to that 4th episode for things that are more graphic but fully understand not being able to!
Seeing how many of us have Darriens is such a gut punch. It sucks that you have to be strong and I hope you get as much peace as you can get your hands on.
The show is very compelling and well told. I had to skip through several scenes in the 4th episode though when he introduces darrien
I ran into mine 3 years later in a Walmart and panicked and ran before they could see me
Him saying yes to the offer also feels like a 'fawn' response. Like sometimes abuse and trauma makes people enter this state of just going along with what someone is saying/doing as a safety mechanism. Like 'if I say yes, they won't get angry and I can leave' or 'if I say yes, then they'll think positively of me and that will keep me safe' (this option is particularly an issue for people with abandonment fears or fear of rejection bc the act of being perceived negatively immediately feels like a threat bc abandonment and rejection is seen as this big scary thing that can destroy them). At least, based on my person experiences as someone who frequently has a 'fawn' response in scary situations, it very much feels like what sometimes happens to me where I can find myself agreeing to something or presenting myself differently than I am but in the moment that feels like the truth (I think bc it keeps me safe to feel that way). And it isn't until afterwards that I'm like ' shit. what did I just do. why didn't I correct them, why didn't I say no? why didn't I stand up for myself?' and inevitably the answer is because it felt too threatening to do so. Because it is easier to just comply. Because in that moment it felt safer and truthful, even if I feel differently when I'm in a safer situation.
Absolutely. The other day I had an incident where a man approached me while I was waiting for a bus and started asking me personal question, I went into auto mode and answered his questions, trying to remain vague but didn't want him to think I was uncomfortable or wanting to get away from him coz in my mind he could then get aggressive. I also felt like I had no where to go because I needed to catch my bus. Afterwards I thought over and over how I should have done something different, even if I had just lied. And knowing my partners response would be "You should have walked away/ignored him/avoided him" (and I was right that was her exact response) but I couldn't react that way in that moment because I felt very threatened. I also felt incredibly 'silly' afterwards that I was so threatened by 'such a minor incident', trying to downplay it to myself saying 'it wasn't a big deal'.
I cried at how supportive and loving his parents were. ❤
I loved his dad immediately when they showed him yelling at Martha, but him supporting him with his trauma made me teary eyed
@@rachreid8746 Same here. I was expecting a horrible reaction, so seeing the stoic Scottish dad-support just... overloaded me with emotions. Happiness at the kindness and understanding. Sorrow that not everybody will get that kind of support when they need it. This show was weirdly good at closure-devastation, which I didn't know was an emotion until that scene smacked me over the head with it.
His dad confessing about his own trauma made me cry. Such a beautiful scene.
That moment he had the clear strong thought, that this man is bad and he needs to get out…I’ve never seen that portrayed before but I’ve absolutely had that moment, that thought, in that way, so strong and clear out of nowhere. Fantastic show
so true, that moment was such a gut punch for me, a bit flashbacked even. Like that moment when you're suddenly back in your body after totally dissociating for some time. ugh Amazing painful show
"sure she needs help but also she sucks" is so great, as someone who deals with a lot of mental health issues, I know full well that it doesn't absolve me of bad things I do that hurt people. I hate when that blanket of mental illness is used to excuse in media and reality
Exactly. Mental illness can be an explanation for bad behaviour, but it's not an excuse.
The "mostly okay" on this one felt very real
I feel like this mini series came out of no where and hit like a ton of bricks. What an amazing, powerful and brave way to tell his story.
The actress who played Martha was giving me Kathy Bates from Misery vibes. Absolutely chilling performance.
I think he did an amazing job displaying the complicated emotions with SA and stalking. But my god it’s was so hard to watch, I felt uncomfortable as hell watching it.
Yeah, I watched it with my boyfriend and we both just ended up crying as we were reminded of our own SAs and needed a minute to process things before moving onto the next episode
I had my own Darian, to this day he has zero clue how much he shattered so much of me, even though I literally tried to tell him. He's now happily married and I'm still dealing with the aftermath of trying to rebuild myself now 10 years later.
Same… it just feels fucking unfair to be responsible for your own healing because no one else can do it for you, but healing from something you never asked to happen in the first place. It’s now YOUR job to go to therapy and shit it’s just so unfair and frustrating knowing they’re a horrible person and no one else knowing and them not paying any price for ruining you.
@@janellefrickert6522Well, you could tell others? It's not unfair, because you could absolutely change that.
I do too, he still tries to contact me to rekindle even though he knows how much he hurt me, he did this to me several years ago and I still can't talk about it. He was my sister's bf at the time and I'm pretty positive she doesn't know, or if she does she doesn't know what actually happened. This show was hard to watch but was worth it. It helped me realize that being nice or letting someone in isn't an invitation to abuse me, and I can't let the fear of it happening again run my life.
TW: Rape My mom and my aunt were molested by their father, and the line "isn't it so magical being groomed before you know it's grooming" fucking had me sobbing. There were plenty of moments that made me cry, but I just broke down thinking about my mom and aunt. Never thought of it in that way before, that they were so young when it happened and it probably made them feel special at first (not the rape, the grooming). Just touched my soul in a way I don't think I've ever felt before. This show is harrowing but so accurate and tragic, and I hope Richard Gadd got lots of therapy afterwards for what he fucking went through.
My brother was stalked by an exchange student while he was in college and people didn’t take it seriously either. He eventually took it to the administration and it finally stopped, but they found out she had an entire photo album on her phone of pictures she had taken of him without him knowing. She would follow him around the college and would stalk him on social media as well. It all started because he helped her on an assignment. He mostly laughs about it now, but I know it was still a harrowing experience to know he was constantly being watched.
Baby Reindeer was so crazy!! it doesn't feel like your typical netflix show
Love you Chu ❤
There is no "typical netflic show". They throw money at anything and anyone delivering content. Sometimes the ones getting the money are worth it.
He fabricated a lot of the story for dramatic effect (understandable as it’s a Netflix drama), but because it says at the start “based on a true story” a lot of people think more of it is true than actually is. It’s also interesting that a man can openly fetishize his stalker (get off to images of her etc) and obsess over her, and that’s totally acceptable. But if a woman did it everyone would claim she was into it and is making “real” victims look bad. He is potentially facing legal trouble now as he didn’t obscure enough of her identifying info and his fans found the real woman (who has never been charged with any offence in her life, no criminal record, never been to prison etc) but with things like this it’s often he-said she-said.
@Vexarax nope. we don't need a season 2 from the abuser's perspective. this is why men don't open up about abuse. if this story was about a woman being stalked & assaulted, nobody would be asking for her male abuser's side to the story and acting like he's the victim. that woman did enough damage to both the subject of that show & her other victims. nobody needs to platform her so she can "tell her side".
@@jerseyjess7826people constantly ask for the man’s side💀 cuz “we can’t ruin an innocent man’s life” . In general I think people were wrong to dig into his life in the same way his stalker did. And if anything this would embolden her to feel even more entitled to force her way back into his life and victimize him again, and I hope that doesn’t happen to him :(
Something worth noting as well is how they handled male mental health. A lot of the time, men tend to not speak out about their abuse because they feel ashamed or ‘less manly’. I think showing how Donny felt like a weight had lifted off his shoulders after he confessed to his parents is encouraging, in a way, to men who may feel the same way.
I expected the dad to be ashamed of him, but him confessing that he was also a victim really hit me
People don't seem to understand what fiction or dramatization is. If someone makes a change to a story to make it more entertaining and admits it's a dramatization they still can't understand that.
yeh because netflix said 'this IS a true story' NOT 'this is BASED on a true stoy'.
@@biegebythesea6775 no, they tip toed around the true story parts for salaciousness. Anything that said it was a true story said the parts that were specific were a true story but left it feeling open. And they threw in things like specifying it was based on a true story or fictionalized or etc etc in places people are unlikely to read
@@bec7080 It said on screen 'this is a true story'. that's what it said. of course they dramatised it, which is why nothing should ever say 'this is a true story'.
The ending was the same as Misery where someone says “I’m your number one fan” the phrase has now taken on a whole other meaning because of what happened to him.
Stephen King channeled his own experiences with crazy fans and stalkers into Misery. Eminem christened those kinds of people „stans“, stalker fans.
With the darrians of the world, the best closure you can get is accepting that they won't ever admit to wrongdoing and to walk away like the queen/king you are. That person who hurt you can cant own it is so much smaller than you.
That's so sad to hear but I think that hearing someone acknowledging the bad behaviour they had probably won't fix things the way people expect
forgive your self it wasnt your fault accept your innocence back into your life let your self heal the shame you carry never belonged to you it was forced upon you don't have to hold onto it any more the longer you hold onto the shame the abuser wins over your innocence but letting go what was forced upon your innnonce will be taken back that is not never was your debt to pay but if you hold on and allow more of that to grow it will push everything else that's left out and it will never be gone and make you its owner if you seek returning that trama back t your abuser or ontot any once else don't let it transform that shame into you into the same thing that desired that innoncen you were an always been into some one else cycle don't let it force you into forfting your total innocence by a desire to be taken from another that includes seeking revenge a lust for a vilonce that you think want to experience because it was done to you will not clense you but infact insure it was taken wollimgly when if I t never happened you would never desire delivering such pain agony onto such humane .it was not your fault you deserve your own forgiveness and happiness it right there got to just let go and pick it up
Another thing that was so poignant about the series is how badly Martha needed help and just continuously didn’t get it. And then the man that abused him needs consequences but doesn’t get them. How badly Donny and Martha were failed by the justice system.
Despite how powerful, triggering and emotionally devastating this show is, there was one moment in particular that made me genuinely laugh. After Donny gets back on the train after telling his parents everything that happened to him, his dad in the most earnest way says "Good luck with the transsexual!" As a trans woman, despite this word being wildly outdated and not appropriate, I couldn't help but feel a sort of joy at seeing this father's earnest attempt to be an ally. Point being, I adore Donny's dad 😂
Yes, as a trans man I felt this too, it was also one of the only times I laughed. Such a well done scene tbh
Exactly! It was such a dad way of trying to bond. I think everybody needs an earnest Scottish dad in their life.
As a non-binary person, I cackled so loud. Like bless his heart, dad is trying 😂
Honestly I find that the people who are genuine and trying their best but don't have the language right are often my favorite. Eventually they'll get the words, but they've got the spirit, and that's what counts
Good on you for mentioning I May Destroy You. Such an incredible tour de force and reminded me so much of this series.
I feel like these two shows are in conversation with each other and both are amazing shows and I would love to see a panel with both the creators.
An underated scene is when donny is coming out to his parents and confessing everything truly ive never seen a scene in fiction that so perfectly captures the embarrassment, shame and deep existential fear of rejection as that. Truly the scene that finally made me break down and cry
i don’t think i could handle the show right now, but im glad to see media that shows that being victimized can leave you feeling broken and has real shame and can have you acting poorly in ways you don’t want. it does away with the narrative or trauma making people strong and resilient. in reality is makes people hurt and break down more easily. i have so much love for all the flawed victims.
It's just ignorant to say it's impossible to get stronger from coping with trauma in a healthy way. What do you think therapy is for? The story shows you how bad it is to ignore and push away trauma. He went into a downward spiral, because the way he tried to cope was unhealthy af.
@@miskatonic6210 I don't think they were saying that getting stronger from coping in healthy ways is impossible. I think that they were mentioning that trauma doesn't result in a linear growth journey that media often portrays. Trauma reshapes, but recovery reforms. Either way, both of you are right. I think that the show was good at tackling how trauma as a fracturing force, but also trauma as incitement towards the pursuit of wellness, could simultaneously be true. While it was largely about Donny's trauma, it was also about his reorientation in the right direction (towards pursuing wholeness after recognizing his unhealth). All that to say, I think both of you guys are more on the same page than you think.
The fact that he played himself is crazy, he's super talented if the way he was able to show his own emotions was even acting as this point. I really hope someone else who was a victim of the producer guy will come out with their story and this monster will be stopped. If he did it to him, I'm pretty certain he did this to other people. I hope Richard will find his peace and this trauma will eventually stop hunting him.
I've had two IRL stalkers in my life so far, both in college and both female. I am also female and straight, both of them stalked me because I was nice to them after seeing that they looked lonely. One girl followed me into the bathroom and tried to take creepy pictures of me going to the bathroom and she even grabbed my ass. That was what led me to immediately ask my teacher for help, and he told me he could only transfer me to a different class so I did. The other girl followed me everywhere from the classroom to lunchroom to the library and the parking lot. Once I realized I was being followed I became unpredictable and played the most intense game of hide and go seek ever, she eventually got bored of me. Guess what my parents response to me getting stalked was? "You should feel flattered that anyone finds you attractive enough to stalk." Both of the stalkings took place for about a month each. One before summer break and one after. The 1st in my 1st semester and the 2nd in my 3rd.
I'm sorry that happened, and that's how ppl responded, that's so scary...
Just binged this last night! It broke my heart and even made me think about my own traumatic experiences. It's already so insane that this was based on someone's real experiences but to think that the guy it happened to is also acting it all out? I've never seen a story as honest and vulnerable as this. It's just so _raw._ When you hear him narrate things like "Why didn't I do _this?_ " "I should've said _that_ ", you know that's what Richard Gadd actually thinks. When he yells or cries, you know that's how he actually feels. When he yelled at Martha after she attacked Teri, I wonder if those were things he wished he said to her. The fact that he basically laid his heart out for us all, even going as far as to reenacting his own SA.... it's too heartbreaking to even describe. I hope they had a therapist on set because that couldn't have been easy for him. He was a terrible comedian but my god, he's a phenomenal dramatic actor.
I saw a lot of people after watching this series were so confused on a lot of actions he took and I was completely baffled by that, because it felt so honest, raw and intimate. He laid out everything to us in such detail, the ugly and the good.
I had an ex girlfriend in high school who behaves similar to Martha. I was gr*ped w/out my consent by her multiple times. Along with that, I experienced sa by the hands of my upperclassmen in football. The struggle of thinking that I was the one whose fault it was for the abuse was so validating to see on screen. It was eerily familiar to see how he would disassociate or be set into a panic when touched in certain ways. It wasn’t until recently that I gave credence to what was done to me. I would notice that the hair on the back of my neck would stand up straight and my breath would become shallow when someone grabbed me by the shoulder, or when I felt breath a little too close on my neck. This show is a masterpiece, and Gadd is an amazing messenger for people who have suffered abuse. This unique way that this unique trauma is processed was done so well.
The moment that got me was Teri’s Analysis of Donny right down to this obsession of wanting to have Martha around (along with this other internalized issues) and how damaging it is to not only himself but to others around him being that he was in total living denial; I was like BOOM!! FINALLY SOMEONE SAID WHAT WE WERE THINKING!! 😂
Amanda flipping between talking about the show to being like “no I’ve never experienced this what do you mean” just adds a whole other level too her perspective on this show
This show.....wow no idea what to expect and mind blowing. It's something when a show has you going "they're not gonna oh shit yes they are" and then tops it.
Straight up I saw the trailer and thought "I like 'You', this seems like a British version, looks fun!" Definitely was not expecting what it was. Watched it all in one night and it's definitely stuck with me.
I have the same feeling towards my 1st "relationship," and how he was my abuser, yet, when I gathered all my courage to confront him, he was so nonchalant, so matter of fact, telling me I am strong and I can handle his "mistakes", asking me to be his friend cause it is the norm of the world, F***... It has been 3 years, and I'm still feeling the need for closure.
Think of the ending of this relationship as the closure. Just as you would with useless branches that take useful nutrients from a growing tree, you cut him out of your life so you too could grow. He doesn't deserve your thoughts but you are valid in having them. Ik how you feel, so please see this as me trying to help.
@@MyLoserBrain Thank you. I appreciate your encouraging words.
“I was busy fixing a gameboy,” God damn. That is cool as fuck!
Really? That's not rocket science...
@@miskatonic6210 I am visually disabled. So messing with electronics like that is something I’m not going to do.
@@BlindZubatName checks out Edit: I also find the gameboy fixing awesome
I am so old, I didn't even bat and eyelash when I heard that not until you mentioned it
@@gwendolenyoung4198 I still love my ganeboy. So much Pokémon was played on that thing.
I too was distracted and missed the whole “based on a true story” thing. When I found out the creator of the series was also staring in it and it was based on true events, my mind was blown. That particular mix is sometimes so driven by ego, it fails more than it succeeds. But what a powerful journey Richard wrote and acted in. His co-star Jessica is also an incredible actress. Hopefully people can separate character from actor and appreciate the skill in its own right.
(spoiler) an interesting personal thing for me was when Martha said that Teri looked like a man, while throughout the series I am amazed at how much the actress looks like my beloved sister-in-law, a cis woman. I showed her the series and we are both shocked now, they're basically twins. just to see how this "looks like x gender" bullshit isn't reality
That scene was crazy to me cause Martha didn't even know that she was trans I don't think (or at least that's how it was portrayed) which to me reads that Martha would have said that regardless and I believe it was said simply because she was prettier then her. But as a trans person, ik how much it hurt her even if Martha didn't know. Such a heartbreaking scene for so many reasons.
Throughout my childhood and teenage years people kept telling to smile more because I would look like a boy otherwise. I‘m almost 40 now, and those complexes are for life. Toxic femininity is a thing, too. Do „this“ or „that“, or you aren’t a „real woman“. Tall and wide women are WOMEN, dammit, and I don’t care if one of us happens to be trans. We’re all the same kind of awkward.
@@ArDeeMee my sister is still dealing with this. My friends used to ask her to her face if she was a girl, all because she has a more masculine face and wore baggy clothes. She constantly feels like she isn't pretty enough to dress up. Sadly I have this issue in the opposite direction. I get told how beautiful I am and how small and dainty I am, but as a trans man it ruins my self-esteem. People truly don't realize how cruel it can be to simply comment or ask about someone's appearance.
@@MyLoserBrain maybe she was thinner but she wasnt prettier at all. lets be real, if Martha was an "acceptable" weight the guy would eventually cave in and start dating her.
@@jojo-xh5ik that was a weird thing to say.
This unlocked some memories for me. I was soft stalked in high school. I say soft stalked because we were 12 and she couldn't follow me home or anything cause we went to a fancy school and in my country you're placed in high-school based on your academics. That's relevant because many people live all over the country and commute really far to get to school if they go to a "good" one, myself included. Looking back she was probably autistic or something, she was socially awkward and had some harmful stims. I'm autistic as well, though no one (myself included) knew that at the time, I felt bad for her when people picked on her. In our art class there were huge desks that sat up to like 10 people and she ended at a desk entirely alone so I went over to sit with her, talk to her about anime and share that I'm LGBT too (people picked on her for clearly liking girls as well). And from that moment she latched on to me. She'd follow me around campus all day, sometimes approaching me, sometimes lurking around corners and just watching me go about my day. Sometimes I wouldn't notice until someone pointed out she was behind me. She also asked me a bunch of inappropriate questions like about my underwear's colour, cut, size, if I was wearing any. And she touched me without consent multiple times, including ""hugging"" me from behind, her hands firmly planted on... Places, and when I screamed and told her to never do that again, she did it again, cackled and ran away. Whenever she made me uncomfortable she would just rock her head back and laugh this sickening laugh. It was like a game to her that I would legitimately scream when she touched me, cold sweat when she came near. I ended up transferring and thankfully never saw her again.
I am autistic let’s stop with that negative attitude towards my community
@@vntajones I'm autistic too, I literally said that. It's not a negative attitude towards the autistic community to not like the girl who sexually assaulted me... I wasn't saying I dislike her cause she was autistic, I was pointing out why I think people picked on her. For the things she said, how she said them, and they thought it was weird how she'd bite her hands to the point of self injury and stuff. I literally ALSO stim by biting my hands when I'm stressed. Stop it.
@@vntajonesThey were literally talking about as an autistic person, she had traits they recognized. Your attacking somebody without even reading what your trying to be mad about.
Sure, you were both autistic... Somehow anybody can choose to be on the spectrum nowerdays. Seriously how would being autistic or LGBTQ even be relevant to that story? Maybe you should think about why you need validation from strangers on the internet that much to frame somebody having a teen crush on you as a 'soft stalker' and autistic. You were 12 ffs. At that age you are in full puberty and you can't even diagnose most disorders. A 12 year old touched you without consent and had a sickening laugh. I can't even grasp how the grown adult you are right now would write something like that knowing you were both kids at that time. How didn't your perspective change? You give me serious Martha vibes yourself...
I wouldn't even say that's 'soft stalked'. I had a weird experience when I was about 9, when a 5 year old neighbour kid started up a conversation while I was calling on a friend. I thought that was it, but that afternoon she suddenly turned up IN my house. She'd let herself in. My mum was massively creeped out when we found her in our living room, watching our TV, and told her not to do that again. She didn't want young girls thinking it was okay to walk into strangers' houses when her parents didn't know where she was, or who she was with. This girl kept it up for weeks; we'd find her in the garden, in the living room, she'd turn up at my friends' house when we were there. Wherever I was, there was she. I'm also autistic, and I didn't know how to tell her to get lost without seeming like I was 'bullying' her. Eventually, I guess her parents started giving a shit where she was, or maybe she became fixated on someone else, or maybe she walked into the wrong stranger's house, idk but she disappeared just as suddenly as she appeared and I never saw her again. Doesn't matter how young they are, or how young you are. It may not be a chargeable offence if the stalker is 5, or 12, the same way it would be if they're 25, or 32, but it's still stalking. You experienced stalking, sexual harassment and assault, and it was fucked up.
At the end of the show Donny is finally able to answer the question that has been his obsession ever since Martha was arrested, and that is: he found a reason behind the "why she did it". Donny could understand and decipher just how easy it could be for someone at rock bottom to grow attached to anyone being kind to them during that state, from my point of view this isn't Donny repeating the cycle, it's just understanding what's been eating him alive with Martha, closure from her at last, now knowing both perspectives because he was the kind person and the person at rock bottom, but this isn't to say he will be like her, it's him realising where she came from (not to be confused with justifying it, having a reason for something is not a justification or excuse, just an explanation). I loved the ending, the entire show actually. Beautiful storytelling from beginning to end
I have been stalked by 2 separate men.. one very similar to this about how I felt bad for an old coworker and showed some kindness that escalated to him breaking into my parents home to wait for me with matches and a dozen chocolate roses. Very scary and the trauma didn’t hit me until a few months after the fact. This show was somewhat healing… a lot of similar trauma and coping. Mad respect.
Erotomania is so scary I studied a lot about it after one of my French teachers showed my class the movie A La Folie, Pas du Tout (to madness or death) and while that movie might seem overdramatic, things like that really do happen The man who tried to assassinate Reagan did it because he was an erotomaniac and convinced that Jodie Foster would love him and be impressed if he did so. I've also read an account where a therapist was treating a patient for it and he convinced himself that she was in love with him and stalked her to the point that she had to move and quit practicing I wish people took this condition more seriously and that we had better protections against stalking, bc these people need help but their victims and potential victims also need to be protected
“You can tell them to stop, but all they learn is that it takes 70 messages to get a response,” is a profound statement about understanding how stalkers work.
I can't imagine the bravery it took for him to make this show. It made me cry before I even knew it was based on real events
When Netflix said they're looking for quality, this is what we expect. Not another season of Love is Blind or a Squid Game reality contest. I'm also salty they never gave Shadow and Bone another season..not even Six of Crows? For shame.
Actually I loved all these shows.. 😂 a variety is good
Just gonna tag on as a British person with personal experience: the police are 1000000000% true to life. I just wanna make that clear because when police incompetence is talked about people generally think about America (which is valid too, of course). From my own personal experiences, they are genuinely that useless irl. Anyway, for some reason I thought Amanda already did a vid on this before and was real confused when I couldn't find it after watching the series. All the more confused now that there is a video lmaao. It's such an amazing series. Great vid!
Yessss as another English voice I'll add the police officer interviewing me about my own r***. The copper literally said. 'Well don't expect much its not exactly murder is it?!?
As someone in the US, I definitely wasn’t surprised to see the sentiment is pretty global. I honestly thought they were gonna tell him Martha had filed against him when they first started believing him (ya know, apart from the second time where it did happen 😭)
I don’t think I can watch the series myself as it’s - uh very relatable - but even from this I’m so glad there’s such an honest expression of how people handle their trauma is very complicated and hard ways. And how like- smooth an abuser can be that makes you feel utterly insane. It’s- very well done
I May Destroy You comparison was spot on.
I clicked on this one night thinking oh I'll watch one episode and go to bed, I knew it was gonna be good but had no idea it was based on a true story and just wasn't ready for the direction the show took (which I'm very happy about as well), I ended up watching until the morning just crying and in thought, The rawness, truth and reality of the show is amazing, the fact that he didn't try to make himself seem like an unflawed person was great, for abuse there is no linear course, theres no perfect victim. And male SA is such an important topic that you rarely see get talked about in media. So happy this show is finally getting recognition, I ugly cried so much watching this. I know with the recognition the victim blamers would come out as they always do...However I hope many people that have been in a situation similar like this are able to feel seen, heard and feel as if they can start a process of healing, especially in a world that seems to ignore you. Theres many people out there that are also willing and want to listen and be there
Here is a book I suggest for anyone who wants to understand or deal with stalking: The Gift of Fear, by Gavin de Beker. Stalking can happen to anyone, but there are ways to avoid it or minimize harm. I've been stalked twice, and it helped me tremendously.
As someone who has been stalked by someone I had an incredibly complex relationship with that person, and my actions weren’t always stellar, I think this was an amazingly relatable portrayal as art and I am sad people began digging this up. Stalkers specifically are abuser who are obsessed with boundary breaking to get a reaction. They will increasingly up their behavior to get said reaction over and over again, and engaging with them in any capacity roles them up again. The shame of being an abuser and stalker isn’t even on their radar anymore they’ve crossed that moral threshold, and often the only way to get away is a no contact boundary which also means doing your best to not give them access to you and now the possible woman who did these things has a platform to reach out and try to abuse him again
I had no idea what I was getting into with this show. The only reason I didn't finish it in one sitting was because I had work the next day.
9:07 I freaking hate this! When you block someone it should be a setting you control where you can make sure they know they have been blocked or just let them continue on not knowing. When people think you are getting things it can lead to escalating on there part. Worrying about that and what/if they are still sending and if you did the right thing just makes stuff harder on you.
Someone described him as an "imperfect victim" and it was the perfect description
Who's the perfect victim?
Finished the show today. I felt stupid for not checking the tws and the fourth episode definitely was a hard watch however it offered an insightful look on the cyclical aspect of abuse as you said. As a victim myself, I think it was very honest, truthful and nuanced
Unfortunately key board warriors are trying to uncover the real Martha. Can’t we just leave her alone?😮
Also this is just gonna cause her to go after Richard AGAIN.
There are many people who missed the point of the show.
I see nothing wrong in doing some research on female stalkers. Getting smart is not stalking.
It’s more the then harassing her online which has sparked up the behaviour. I have less sympathy for her than even Gadd seems to have but knowing who she is is very different from messaging her repeatedly for weeks across social media in some crusade for a justice that will never come and only runs the risk of making things worse for everyone involved
@@AmandaTheJedi What a thing to say (cmg from some one who usually respects ur opinion)...it doesn't matter whether u have sympathy for her or not..we simply don't have any evidence of other side of the story...I'm icked by Netflix milking this for all its worth and show creator making it incredibly easy for ppl to find her and putting a message "guys plz don't harass them" like dude what did u expect is gng to happen by casting sm one so similar looking. The whole "this is true story" rubs me the wrong way. Yes the stalker n assaulter should go to jail if all that depicted is true but don't expect ppl to not stalk after u made flimsy attempts to hide their identity. Almost like he wanted ppl to find her which is even worse..give me a break
Sometimes I don’t want to feel as intense emotions as the actual watching can provide, so I watch your commentary and still feel a lot, but it does not re-traumatize me. Thank you, it is a beautiful channel
Great video, didn't expect you to cover it; I binged it last weekend on a whim and was also surprised by it's realism and honesty about SA as well... and the addictive quality to keep watching. Darrien pretending like nothing had ever happened, or that it was consensual, double speaking and never apologizing really got me. The way he says, "We'll go slower next time" can double refer to the drug trip, or the penetration. The way he treats him, taking care of him and suggesting he shower, after the worst assault was sickening but too real. I relate to Teri in the rationale but also Donny's sympathy and leash-lengthening because Martha's clearly ill. I'm sorry you were subject to something relatable, but happy to hear you're doing better.
Thank you for this perspective. I have a lot more words but I’m just so damn thankful for you having kindness about the realities of how messy being a survivor of intense things can be. Hope you get lots of days of more than mostly ok. This one is going on my to watch list
What makes it so compulsive is just the raw honesty. Someone bearing his soul and telling the world everything he is ashamed about (even stuff he shouldn't feel ashamed for). First class performances from both actors. Shout out also to the way he portrayed his Dad trying to take the fight to the staler and threatening her. Classic Scottish Dad move. Chef's kiss.
"fixing a gameboy" Some way through the video I got Joker flashbacks. The Zazie Beetz scene.
25:00 when I tell you I was bawling my eyes out, with hiccups, when the dad dropped that line. Truly gut punching for so many reasons.
I hope youre doing well Amanda and I'm sorry about your experience. Thank you for the great coverage of this series! (:
Man I never thought this show would be this interesting and deep. Apart from everything in Richards (Donny) life going so wrong, in this case the stalking is what really got to me. It’s so sad because the circumstances Donmy is in. I mean, he totaly lacks of self confidence because all his life he was a “looser” and then he finds somebody to tell him he is doing things well and he is atractive and stuff that nobody ever told him. Even if she is a stalker and fucked up his life he really needed that and thats the sad part. Like chapter 7 shows how alone this man is and made a grown man break down here. I dont usually ever cry over some TV show but I can identify with that aprovement need feeling. I think its probably the show that made me reflect the most after seeing it and never thought it would be this deep like I said. One of my favourites ever from now on. (Im spanish btw, sorry for the grammar if its not correct)
You are one of the few KZheadrs that I will always click on a new video as soon as I see it every time. And you've got me to watch so many things I never would have known about/considered watching otherwise
Binged this yesterday and immediately went to see if you'd made a vid on this, today I've been blessed!!!
Amanda, I just wanna say that I really appreciate your content and your insights on everything. I've never been stalked, but I got a little piece of what it's like thanks to you, and I hope that can help me to deepen my empathy toward people I know who _have_ gone through situations like this. Keep being awesome :)
I literally just binged this yesterday! 😂😂😂 Thanks for adding your commentary on it!
As a victim of stalking, you never know what will trigger it. I've tried over the years to figure out why I ended up with the stalkers (yes, more than one) that I ended up with and all I know is that my first stalk was my first boyfriend who stalked from a distance after a break-up and another was another boyfriend so that happens a lot though many people do not realize that it's "stalking" no matter which way you slice it. Then I had drinks with a guy and he wouldn't leave me alone, he called my work several times a day until my boss learned about it and answered the phone for me and totally laid into the guy with threats of knowing several police officers (and the chief of police) personally so he'd better leave his employee alone. That worked but that doesn't always work for people. I still have nightmares from all 4 of the stalking incidents. I won't give any oxygen to the other one because that one was the scariest. Just know that ANYONE can be stalked and ANYONE can be a stalker. Please tell people what's going on in your life...no matter what side of the coin you're on because you need help. You cannot deal with a stalker by yourself. Keep a journal of all of the contacts. Report as much as possible to the police. You want everything documented as much as possible. Get cameras for your home (inside & out). Inform all of your friends and family about what's going on and who's doing it. Get a picture of that person to show them if you can do that safely (don't put yourself in danger). If you find yourself on the other end, where you're doing the stalking...please seek help. There's obviously something that needs to be addressed in your life and stalking another person isn't the answer.
Ive had so many people picking apart how ive dealt with a stalking situation this past year, this video has definitely helped me
It's not really "based on" a true story, it's almost just a retelling of what happened. You can see tweets from the real life stalker that says a lot of the things he showed in the show, being confirmed from seeing her tweets saying things like "meat curtains" etc.
The stuff with Darrien is where more liberties were taken. He was pretty open that the messages in the show were actual messages he received
My heart broke for the relationship he lost out on because of self hatred, and the way it seeped into the lives of the people closest to him - even tangentially, people experience hardships and we really don’t know what they’re going through
I have a strong stomach for disturbing stuff... this stuck with me though. It is wild that he played himself going through this again... Very brave.
I'm really sorry you relate to this story, thank you for the videos. Loved your Love Lies Bleeding review !
I'm sorry you had to deal with this. I had a very serious stalker off and on for 15 + years. So aggravating how little law enforcement could/would do. Eventually, I decided that he was clearly pathetic to try and scare vulnerable young women (I wasn't the only one, and one of the others had been terribly abused. I was harmed as a kid as well, and he was older and I guess loved to pretend to 'save' us then control us. Gross. I just decided to not walk around afraid, as it doesn't prevent anything ,but harms my mental health.
My heart broke for him. To those who had to go through sexual abuse, please know that you are not alone. May you find the comfort you so deserve.
The last episode just gutted me. I was not expecting that ending. Ugh. Not a show I'll watch a second time, but so glad I watched it once.
I ended up watching this because of how you spoke of it. I was … words struggle to describe how I feel but, as someone that has suffered through SA for a long period of time, episode four hit me hard. The questioning of why he kept going back, why he didn’t report anything sooner, the way his guilt and shame manifest. It’s one of the heaviest ways I’ve see the aftermath of SA depicted in media. I saw myself and for the first time I felt like the things I had been feeling were normal. I mean, not to the same degree but?? Yeah.
I cant handle serious dramas anymore so I appreciate your warnings in advance. This seems like it was a deep and emotional watch that hopefully gets ppl thinking about what stalking is really like and how we (as a society) can deal with it better. Great vid review!! Also, it sucks that you went through something similar and I hope life has gotten much better for you since then 🤞
Oh…my god. My roommate has been confessing his feelings for me lately and I told him that’s cool but I’m gay… he really took that “that’s cool” part and ran with it like this chick did. Holy hell. Things really got heated between us recently because I kept trying to tell him I DONT WANT HIM. So then he goes “fine! We’re through!” And I’m just standing there dumbfounded because we were never a thing! People genuinely are fucking insane. Now I’m stuck in a lease with someone that is unstable as shit. I feel for the guy in the show on a whole other level.
Yeah I haven’t had an incident that has gone near this far thank god, but I’ve had a friend from work that got way too intense and there’s something unsettling when you are trying to discourage someone who clearly has developed feelings for you and you weren’t aware and thought it was friendly and they message you a 10 times in a row and won’t leave you alone at work.
This was crazy o.O binged it with a friend and we googled about the background while watching
Shows like this need to exist but gosh can I never watch this. I can't personally relate to a lot but I myself have entered some almost sticky situations because I don't speak up and stand up for myself (literally made me afraid to smile when walking on the streets). Thank you for this video!
That's definitely understandable And yes, in the show, there's been many times where he doesn't say things and doesn't speak up when he should and it's so frustrating. But there's no such thing as a perfect victim and so we can't really criticize him too much
Stalkers are very scary........ be safe, everyone
Although the way police react to stalkers is frustrating, it's important to report it anyway bc, even if they won't immediately do anything about it and their main response is that they can't do anything til something happens, there is a file. There is evidence of this already being an issue, if their behaviour escalates, it gives more support to any action you take against them in that situation.
This was tough. I was going in and out of my own trauma while watching the episodes. I wasnt prepared
Another great video, Amanda. sent from my ihpon
I got a few minutes into this video and then decided I wanted to go and watch this for myself and I am SO glad I did, thank you so much for the recommendation Amanda. First time I've actually fully sobbed at a program in years when his dad responded to what happened to him 😭
God I feel like this is a parallel story to my own. A mentor who turned into an abuser that I blocked out the abuse because I was so desperate to be seen and loved. God I fucking hate abusers.
Oh jeez, that transition to the ad read, holy heck 😄
Great video as always Amanda! Could you do a haunting of hill hous deep dive next?