Viking Women: Warriors vs Fighters
Sources Below
The historical existence of shield-maidens has been debated. The most recent scholarship, including that of archaeologist Neil Price, argues that they existed. Some scholars, such as professor Judith Jesch, have cited a lack of evidence for trained or regular female warriors.
Online shop
norse-combat-sportswear.mysho...
TOP suggested books to learn more!
www.amazon.com/shop/norsemagi...
Insta
/ thormmadj
Patreon
/ norsemagicandbeliefs
Sources
Tacitus germania
Gesta Danorum
Hervarar saga ok Heiðreks
Poetic Edda, Atlakviða
Saga of the Greenlanders
Laxdaela saga
John Skylitzes
Grettis Saga
Johan Stiernhöök's De iure sueonum et gothorum vetusto
A shield-maiden was a female warrior from Scandinavian folklore and mythology. Shield-maidens are often mentioned in sagas such as Hervarar saga ok Heiðreks and in Gesta Danorum. They also appear in stories of other Germanic peoples: Goths, Cimbri, and Marcomanni. The mythical Valkyries may have been based on such shield-maidens.
The way you describe women coming to battle to cast spells and encourage the warriors sounds like a precursor to the modern concept of cheerleaders in sports.
I never thought of that connection but that's actually very interesting
Except the cheers went up when someone's head was severed from the body by a sword 🗡️. So It wasn't exactly the same.
They'd also allow livestock to leave with the women and children. No sense to slaughter the animals in a fight that society depends on.
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
@@taylorfusher2997The seers of Old in all cultures would speak about developing senses that would allow them to see creatures in a world all around us that exists beside the world we inhabit. Deeper into our own natural world we would be more aware of the creatures in these parallel planes, where multiple species of entities are said to have existed. Kosta Danaos talks about this in his own books.
To Dragon of Hateful Retribution: What is the appearance description of Ogmundr in Odd Saga?
Romans used to have baggage trains following them around with their families keeping camp and they knew they'd be captured and enslaved if the Romans lost it made them fight harder. Love is the most powerful force...
You might be thinking of the Celts, who definitely did this. They were often slaughtered by Romans after the “war”. The family and community being present was what made these conflicts, in ancient times, the stuff of BATTLES. Glory and all that. The Romans, with the professional soldiering career, devoid of family and community, made it into WAR and began the decline of humanity away from all decency. All their fights that I have read about they won with underhanded, sneaky tactics, or even let auxiliaries do all the fighting and took the credit.
@@thegreenmage6956 lol in what world did German barbarians have decency because it sure wasn't this one
@Freki Bodgaedir I’ll explain; the advantage is that those people supporting the warriors are the equivalent to non-combatant military personal. They feed, clothe, patch up, support the warriors, because a war party was actually, in those days, a large family. This is the capacity in which women went to war; non-combatant support roles. You went to war BECAUSE you wanted to protect your community. You ARE the community.
@@thefutureisnowoldman7653 I didn’t mention ‘Germans’ (not a term which means anything specific for this period in hisot try beyond the Hermiones tribe). A barbarian is simply a person who doesn’t speak Greek, which some priests actually did, like the Celtic Druids (according to Caesar), but I don’t know about the Germanic tribes, if that’s what you meant. Now, yes, they definitely HAD aspect of _decency_ , because they had their own culture, civilisations, communities. Without respect for laws, this is not possible, they would have been basically living in the Stone Age (Palaeolithic or Mesolithic, that is, because Late Stone Age starting between 6000 and 4000 Before Common Era actually sees the introduction of farming, division of labour and agriculture). So, yes, they by definition must have had decency, or, they wouldn’t exist.
I actually really liked how they presented it in S1 of the Vikings... that Lagertha was a shieldmaiden fierce and strong enough to stand and hold her own alongside Ragnar and his company was something worthy of mention because of how unique and exceptional it was That they made it so integrated in later seasons kind of cheapened that... I wasn't against them showing women fighting alongside the men, and seeing them be badass and kicking ass was amazing, but they lost that emphasis of how exceptional the female warriors were by showing so many of them standing equal
Yeah I'm 6'0 tall and one of the physically strongest female most people I know have met...and even women like me are nothing for the average man to physically over take or harm if they so wished.
@@dal8963This. It’s why men who LARP as women to enter women’s sports are misogynistic cheaters.
@@dal8963 My spouse is a shade under 5' 10" but she was told by a Chiro after an X ray that if her spine had developed optimally, she would have been around 6' (she wears size 11 shoe), plus she has thick, strong bones and a strong body for a woman. On the other hand, I'm a shade under 5' 7" and at least 40 lbs lighter weight than her, and don't lift, or even exercise a lot. She is also more in touch with her inner Yang/masculine side than the average woman, and I'm more in touch with my inner Yin/feminine side than the average guy. With all that said, when we wrestle, it isn't any contest most of the time unless she gets a scissor lock on me (she has ridiculously strong legs/thighs). I'm just considerably stronger, especially upper body wise, than her (9 out of 10 times I can pin her pretty easily and quickly. We've been together for 22 yrs so it's not just a couple of times). Male bodies just tend to have significantly more muscular development and density, and that is a hard thing to overcome or counter balance. Woman can *somewhat* do it now with the advent of steroids and SARMs, but even then, it is hard to compare because of the surge of testosterone at puberty for most men facilitates stronger, denser bones and musculature at an earlier, *developmental* age that has long term effects/ramifications. Long winded way to say that I strongly agree with you based on both general science and experience.
Ty for continuing these amazing videos my friend 😊
Very cool stuff! And thank you for your kind words😊💜
great content,never gets old.
Binge watching yiur videos. Great stuff. Dude, your are a wealth of knowledge.
Thank you for the thorough information! 😊
Thank you for your unending knowledge. I appreciate you beyond words.
Great video & content as always brother.
Also love your videos and outlook on life and beliefs keep it up, you are one of my go tos for this kind of knowledge.
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
Okay
I always learn new history, thank you so very much.
You should make a Video about the Jomsvikings and Varangians in Vikings Valhalla
Yes, the past is hard to be 100% sure about. But, you described a fascinating interpretation of the likely divergence from - then return to - traditional gender roles. Perhaps on the modern battlefield, with rifles and radios, women can be highly effective. But in ancient battles it was a slug fest of upper body strength. Women are simply no match for men in that arena. That may be a non-PC un-woke attitude on my part. But I prefer truth and fact to misguided sentiment.
I don’t think that people in general fully understand the Woman’s role. She’s the second line of defense for her children if her husband goes down. She’s still expected to protect her children and is capable. The goal (and primary purpose of a Man) is that she has a husband to prevent her from having to do it. And if she HAS to, the enemy is softened up for her.
I agree with your overall sentiment, but I would disagree with your comparison between ancient and modern warfare. It reminds me of a college professor I had who overemphasized the athletic and strength dependent nature of ancient warfare. He also tried to make modern warfare an exercise in calmly squeezing triggers, almost as if it were an intellectual exercise. My years of experience in ancient martial systems convinced me of their focus on mechanical efficiency, while my Army experience was intensely physical. Carrying a rucksack, wearing modern armor, carrying modern armaments, and learning to shoot/move/communicate is exhausting. Anyway, sorry for the rant, and I do appreciate the essence of your point.
Women are still not as effective in modern combat roles, you still need a lot of strength and endurance in modern warfare, which women do not have. The Israelis tried this with an utter disaster of a result, same with the Russians during the World Wars no matter how much Soviet propaganda that tried to portray otherwise.
Thousands of men have been ruined from modern warfare as shellshock and stress is far worse in modern warfare than ancient. No true man would ever support women going through that hell which have wretched the minds of thousands of men.
Even in modern combat there's factors at play. Can a woman pick up a wounded man that weighs 200+ pounds? Does she have the strength/cardio to walk/run/fight with all that gear? I doubt it considering they have to lower the physical requirement for women far lower than the male requirements. Then we have gender dynamics at play that will obviously be at play the second you start mixing women in with men in a unit. You would almost have to have a male only unit and a female only unit.
Good video, great extro music.
My son and I are going to Bergen pretty soon. Do u have any points of interest for viking settlements that you could recommend? Love your videos man learning alot from you just read the book the viking way. Great read.
I'm willing to bet there were a considerable amount of female warriors back then - not including all of them which defended home. My mind jumps to the Valkyrie that are said to always stand with and fight beside/for Odin himself - why would such a prominent deity be surrounded by female warriors if the culture did not see females as highly competent and dangerous adversaries on the battlefield to some degree? That bit of info reflects some sort of value in female warrior prowess. There were likely almost always a handful of women, maybe a bit more or less, on a large battlefield. That's just my thoughts and opinions based on my perception of likelihood! 🤷🙏
I agree with you, plus Freya took the first slain- not Odin.
The archeology just doesn't support it. If there were a large amount of female warriors at every battlefield then we would have a plethora amount of female bodies found at battle sites that have been excavated but instead it's been mostly male with a female grave with a sword here and there
What about the high ranking Birka shield-maiden circa 950 AD ? Not Just a shield-maiden but a commader of warriors. No sagas or stories ,but the archaeological & dna analysis are factual. Maybe they'll find a rune stone some day.
it's a testament to just how fragmented and minimal our primary sources are when covering a 400 year period of history and a population of probably tens of millions when talking about the viking age; any historian will tell you that the primary and secondary sources we do have only really cover 1% of 1% of the story, that remaining 99.99% gap is why there's been so much interpretation and artistic license when depicting that period
I saw that docu on her. She was buried with her , weapons, shield, jewelry and her 2 horses 🐎 🐎 . The bones were proved to be a female. I believe name of town Bjerka in Sweden . 💪
I think military tactics are a bit different than physical fighting, but this is fascinating.
I loved it when you imitated the Norse accent 😁 sorry for asking, I'm new to your great channel, but are you from Scandinavian origin? Edit: har set andre videoee og har set du har norsk baggrund. Tak for din erfaring 😊
i was wondering how about the the daughetrs of king augvald from avaldnes in the six hundreds do you have some info on them ? they were said to be shield maidens that would fight in every battle beside their father. it is said they were turned to stone. the stones said to be them are still on karmøy actually.
What about archaeological evidence, we can agree that there were very few women who were warriors, but we have several warrior graves from the Viking age that contain female skeletons, among others in Birka, and in Solør.These skeletons show a life in battle and warrior graves were only for the very best warriors.
Those are not evidence of anything, lots of women were buried with weapons, that is still no evidence for there being "warrior women". Women aren't strong as men especially with hard sword combat of those days.
@@fyrdman2185 They are not just buried with weapons, they have the grave of a warrior chief, with all that goes with it, and for that reason were considered male graves until recently, when closer examination showed that they were women, their skeletons clearly show signs of combats (plural) . That most women are physically weaker than most men is not up for debate, but the fact that there were a few female warriors is no longer up for debate if you stick to the scientific evidence.
@@bernadetterubin4892 That's not true, that's what the archaeologists who a bunch of beta feminist made up, look at what Judith Jesch said about it, women are weaker than men period, it's impossible for an even stronger than average woman to survive in battle against male warriors. Even today women are totally useless in war, nevermind back then
@@fyrdman2185 Today there are about 10,000 female Kurdish soldiers in the YPJ and there are plenty of other women who excel in combat, but just keep closing your eyes to reality.
@@bernadetterubin4892 lmfao imagine believing in those photo ops, they did the same thing when the Taliban was taking over Afghanistan after the Americans pulled out, photos and videos of these women holding guns preparing to fight the Taliban and the next day the Taliban swooped right in that same town and nothing was heard next about those "brave women". They're doing the same thing in Ukraine too with these women with makeup posing with guns and there not being any evidence whatsoever of them fighting. It's all feminist propaganda for delusional women like you and beta males with a weird fetish.
Bottom line I've met strong women in every way and I'm only 42 years old. Life was very hard and different back then. But the instincts have seem to have passed on through their blood. Just like us men.
I agree. Mostly met them in the 70s, 80s, now married one for thirty years and she’s still fighting anyone who dares to tangle. She doesn’t lose.
Strong by what metric though? Compared to other women? Because most women are not stronger or equal to most men even in modern day with male test levels at an all time low. Then when thinking about back then when men would've had a very martial culture I find it very hard to believe there'd be many women on par strength wise with those men
@@ed.z. thank you for not helping to not turn this comment section into "men tougher, woman weaker = men better"
@@MrFredstt Each gender has its strengths and weakness sir. I hope you have daughters.
@@annanuss2041 dear Anna, I have learned, after 35 years of marriage, that women are smarter, more intuitive, and emotionally stronger than men. Errr, um or is that about my dog? No. Nope. It’s true only for woman. I can’t trust my dog to drive my car away from our block. He confuses left and right turn signals and I’m starting to believe he’s colour blind because on traffic lights…ooh, sorry we’re supposed to be talking about women. Obviously, they are better than me in a bunch of ways ( but, not every way). So, Thanks for the reminder!
"Many of THE GERMANS, too, from across the Rhine, advanced as far as Italy and inflicted many injuries upon the Romans. They were in turn attacked by Marcus, who sent to them his lieutenants Pompeianus and Pertinax; and Pertinax, who later became emperor, greatly distinguished himself. AMONG THE CORPSES OF THE BARBARIANS THERE WERE FOUND WOMEN'S BODIES IN ARMOUR.” - Cassius Dio
Did you ever read Aleister Crowley - Magick In Theory and Practice . The original writing is almost 100y old , it has things in it that a worth reading about magic .Would like to hear your opinion if you did . Thanks.
Crowley was a sick fraud, that's why he fled Germany.
Welcome. I have a huge request. Can you add Polish subtitles to videos. It would be much easier for me to focus on the content than to translate sentences that I don't really understand. I would be grateful
Well done.
I know you have probably had to answer this a million times but what is the song in your intro
Have you done a video on St. Helga aka Olga of Kiev? It needs to be a movie.
Awesome story. She was a boss for sure.
Det har vært snakk om at det muligens bar en kvinne begravd i Jellestadskipet her i Halden
oh yeah also want to point out: in high school wrestling, we were technically coed but you'd only ever see a few girls throughout an entire division because of weight classes they were always wrestling someone with a physically similar stature to them and they KICKED ASS, like it didn't matter whose team they were on we'd root hard for them (ok some of that was cuz they were always hot and fit and we were simping... but also any girl kicking a varsity wrestler's ass and feeding it back to him is obviously one girl you don't wanna mess with); we even saw a few at state championships win medals, there are definitely women out there who can stand toe to toe with men of similar stature, and obviously a Norse woman who spends her life working hard on the farm back home surviving long winters and dealing with the rowdy men with a global reputation for their fierceness, even if they weren't 1 to 1 with the men in a battle I'm sure they were still pretty exceptionally tough and any average dude finding himself in a Norse village would be a total idiot with a death wish to try to mess with any of them
3:41 darn right thats what we are missing today!!!
What kind of people do you think would come from a mix of Pagan Norwegian vikings, Langobards, Salian & Batavian Franks, Saxon & Angle Anglo-Saxons, and Brittonic/Gaelic Celts that lived in an environment like a mix of the West Oregon cascades, and Bavarian alp foothills
Solør, Birka and a few more have been found, including women with injuries from battle and with everything a viking would be buried with 🤷♂️
I really do think there were some women warriors but not to the extent that people made them out to be. For instance a woman going to battle if she was a widow with no children or they are grown. Maybe looking for little adventure or if she didn't want to stay behind at the village. I can see that being possible ⚔️
Same
@@lilykatmoon4508 I know right. I could really see it going that way for women back then especially in certain cultures
@@-RONNIE No evidence for that pal and certainly not in Germanic culture
@@fyrdman2185 There are some woman that fight he even said it in the video. Don't give me wrong there's not a lot but there is still some evidence. I mean think about it even back then - maybe some women didn't want to get married or have or couldn't have children maybe they wanted some adventure. Look at other cultures of the same time period plenty of women fought. You really can't close the book on it because it could maybe be possible.
@@-RONNIE There's no evidence though, women are just not as strong as men, even if you find the odd one out who's stronger than the average woman but when faced with actual warriors back then they wouldn't stand a chance. This is basic biology, there is no equality in nature.
i sure that back in the darkest of all times out there in some woods, a woman was forced to grab an Axe in the name of everything that she hold dear to heart am also sure it happened more than just Once all those unknown names with the essence of a Valkyrie
What about the grave in Birka, with a woman buried in a sitting position together with a sword and a shield?
The response I was looking for.. what about this grave really?, is it an unusual case or what?
Could it not be that they were prominent females, perhaps nobility or some sort of ruler over a clan, and thus that's why they were given such an ornate burial instead of necessarily being a warrior? Plenty of noble people get nice graves with all sorts of treasure/items due to their social status regardless of if they were warriors or not. Lastly I'd like to ask if there were any indication of battle damage on the skeleton? I think that would be very indicative because if she had blows to the skeleton that indicated past injuries from battles then I think that would definitely lend the argument an incredible amount of weight. If not then I think it's up in the air with so many possibilities
@@guyasor1 Since this is the only grave site people point to I'm assuming it's unusual. If women warriors were a common occurrence then surely there'd be plenty of female remains at actual battle sites as well as female warrior burials
@@MrFredstt There were no treasures and no jewelry in her grave. It could have been plundered, of course, and only the sword and shield left. I have not seen or heard about any injuries on her skeleton. But flesh wounds are enough to kill you, especially in ancient times. Women warriors have been proven to exist in more cultures than the viking era. Female Samurais in Japan, for instance. Takeko Nakano is famous for her exploits in war in the 1800s. She started her Samurai training as a 6 year old, and body strength can most certainly be compensated by technique, agility and intelligence. Just think of David and Goliat, and don't forget about highly skilled women snipers.
@@MrFredsttIt’s amazing the level of cope contained in a single post.
and what about the warrior tomb found a few years ago ? By investigating the grave they found out that the corpse used to be a woman and and a war leader.
It is one thing to give commands than swinging a axe she most likely was a nobles daughter in desperate times
Warrior is a way of life. You live, breathe and die by being a Warrior. They’re are always perfecting their craft, and it is a craft to them, and they are usually only/primarily known as such. They differ from soldiers in that they operate independently from other Warriors in battle. A fighter is a person who is willing and able to see a fight to the end, but does not pursue or look forward to the fight as much as the Warrior. They are usually known as something else with the caveat/warning that they are not to be trifled with as they are willing/able to fight when necessary.
I can very much see this. By day I'm a mother of six, tenderly caring for my kids and being thoroughly domestic. I'm also a 2nd degree black belt in Tae Kwon Do. I've thrown a schoolmate across a table and onto chairs on the other side, then the floor, because he wouldn't stop groping my friend. I've laid my husband out on the floor with a well-placed kick when we were dating because he charged me and my training kicked in (ha). I've shouted down a knife-wielding assailant and bossed a mob of onlookers around while administering first aid to his victim. Maternal as heck, but I can become absolutely WILD when I see someone hurt or am attacked. Now, back to baking these yogurt cheese and fruit tarts...
@Freki Bodgaedir never said it was; I was agreeing with his summation, in particular that 99% of the time I find myself in domesticity and a wild 1% (if that) in such a state, which is something he talked about as women seeing their loved one attacked on the battle field.
Cap
@@Sarahofthewoods You comparing two completely different scenes. You wouldn't see anyone die or fighting because you go into a battle that is, if your are not raided, somewhere away from your home. If you get raided then ofcourse the women needed to fight too, to protect their own life or that of their children. So ofcourse your fighting skills would come in handy by protecting your home, but that is what women always did and need to do if the situation appears. So ofcourse women always were fighting throughout history against attackers, but a warrior that goes into the battlefield a completely different story. Like i said it is good that you can defend yourself, a women should be able to do so in my opinions, so she can defend the family when the men is on battlefield.
@@Leodachef1 I'm not claiming to be a warrior, nor am I disagreeing with his historical analysis. I'm simply stating that I can understand from a personal level how a woman can become fierce when it is necessary.
@@Sarahofthewoods your husband must be wimp then if gets laid out by a woman lmfao
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
College classmate argued Shield maidens, my counter was if they were an offensive force then they should have been Axe maidens
I say this a lot to and we have a lot of maidens bar maidens being a term we use a lot still it means to carrier and deliver so a shield maiden most likely when there and probably rarely was brought shields weapons water etc to the men kinda like the pitcher carriers for cannons and every other point in history if woman where there in a battle they would bring up supplies and treat wounds
Women were too important to societies to fight. It's not like they were banned from it, but everyone had societal roles to ensure survival. Women had to take over men's jobs and raise children while the men were gone. Men are simply, sacrificial by comparison. Women simply need to survive more than a man does for the sake of the whole of society. And men are better built for the punishments of a warrior's life. It's simply nature. But women who've taken part in any battles or have any combat roles through history are awesome to read about. Amazon cultures of Eastern Turkey for instance... or Celtic (and Norse) women. Women throughout history, always have provided support and picked up sticks to fight. The Revolutionary War in America was a big one for that. Many women took part directly. Russia, during World War 2, saw mass amounts of women volunteering for the military and even dying as teenagers in combat. Women aren't to be underestimated or left out of the history of warfare, for sure. Warrior Castes have always existed throughout the world. The ancient Indians Castes placed people in particular societal roles that befit them best, to serve the whole of society. The original Caste system of the Indo-Aryans was pretty pure and all levels were respectable; everyone had their role and was useful. People who were fiery, aggressive, energetic, they were the warrior Castes. Then you had craftsmen/artisans, those who served because they didn't prefer to have a skill in anything, and then priests who were always the top of every civilization. Later the Caste system became corrupted (what still exists today). There are always professional warriors and then there are the militia. Professional warriors take the leadership roles in the worst of times, where everyone is forced to fight. Conscripted peasants and slaves never work out well. Training, discipline, willpower, endurance, courage, control... all attributes of warriors.
A warrior is a war maker
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
In many Native American Tribes female warriors were the most feared because womens magic was stronger than a mans. Warriors from her own Tribes wouldnt even get too close to the women in battle for fear her magic would over power his own and he would fall during the fight.
🤣🤔many thanks for perhaps in the 9th and 10th centuries they were placed differently..great video..much love..one love..respect.
it seems plausible that women found themselves "on" the battlefield more often when a tribe was feeling "pressured". for example while migrating, when losing a battle, after a loss in manpower, etc.
Wow must remember to never ask a question on this channel again. Oh boy some people just wow. 🤷🏻♀️🤦♀️🤣🤪
.One who is engaged in or experienced in battle. One who is engaged aggressively or energetically in an activity, cause, or conflict. A soldier; a man engaged in warfare; specifically, one devoted to a military life; in an especially honorable sense, a brave or veteran soldier. The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition. More at Wordnik
We can see in modern western militaries women only make up about 20% of all forves and it's even less for the army or marine corps. Even now that they are allowed in combat arms their numbers are even more miniscule.
And that's only because there is a concerted effort to put them in there. Lowered standards, increased recruiting etc.
Maybe it’s because women don’t wanna die for Israel
@@MaximusThraxYeah, because the military has been notoriously selective in the past. Oh wait, no they weren’t, they just wanted cannon fodder to blow up Arabs.
I *definitely* agree that the Norsemen wouldn't want their women to be in danger and having to fight if at all *possible* , but since in *nature* , only the *strongest* survive, it's also only natural that men in Viking Age Scandinavia would be attracted to women who *could* in fact fend for themselves if they *had* to. I absolutely *agree* that women needed to be kept *safe* if at all possible back then because they needed to be *alive* in order to give birth to the next generation, and it's true that women are *extremely* crafty, and that's allowed them to overcome a *lot* of challenges, but women *do* have physiological strengths compared to men that allow them to be effective fighters *if* they know *how* exactly to play *to* them rather than going *against* them. That's the *huge* problem with the modern *western* idea of a woman warrior, they show them fighting the *exact same* way as *men* , which doesn't play to *their* physiological strengths. Women don't need *lower* standards in this field, just *different* ones.
Just like today
women & men worked together for the benefit of their people & sometimes that requires a change in gender roles at certain periods of time but usually certain gender roles exist for men & women because those roles are the most fit for upholding & maintaining the people but some flexibility does help in ensuring the equal importance of men & women within ancient Germanic societies.
Warrior to me is a lot. Unafraid, doesnt kill by pleasure, but necessity, disciplined etc. But I want to make distinction between soldier and warrior. Soldier is a mercenary, hired gun. Regarding women.. Remember this one girl I grew with, same age. Goddamn she could beat almost all the guys in arm wrestling, and she wasnt very masculine even (a little, but not much), just pure strength. I actually was a bit afraid of her until I hit puberty myself.. Haha. But that was 1/100 pupils in that generation or what you say. Edit: That epic music at the end speech.. Hahaha Wow
I read that the "Women found buried with swords", were royalty, or close to it.. That even most men couldn't afford a sword, much less let the sword be buried if they did have one,..but every household had a good axe.
This is what I think. Nobility were always afforded burials with items like regardless of being a warrior or not. It's very likely these females were buried with a sword simply because of them being part of the nobility
Over the last 100 years
I´m not an expert at nordic sources, but out of the top of my head I could think of a few other sources written past 800 AD that feature women in warrior-like roles, at least partly. For example Snorri Sturluson mentions in the Saga of Harald Fairhair in the Heimskringla a person namend Gunnhild, mother of kings, who was trained in martial arts and took up a sword to defend her brothers. She predominantly ruled as a queen, but she was defenately involved in military affairs. The same goes for the Saga of Hrolf which features 3 queens, two of whom are mentioned to be militarily active. This ongoing pattern also continues in the Saxo Grammaticus. Alongside Lagertha, which you mentioned, it contains accounts of 3 women leading their own warbands under the danish King in the Battle of Bravellir, and also persons like Alvid and Rusila, who individually took up the role of a warrior. Of course, the accuracy of all of these sources can and should be debated, and yes, most of the accounts are from the early viking age around 800 AD, but I think that there are too many of such descriptions to rule them out as a historical phantasticism. Whether they actually fought or not, they definately seem to have occupied a social position that we would most likely refer to as military strategist, which is especially fitting for women of higher social ranks. We also see this pattern in archaeology: Some female viking burials exhibit weapons or battlewounds, like the burial of Solor. In another grave of a genetically confirmed woman buried with weapons, the Birka Burial BJ581, this person was found with a Unefatafl game, said to have been used to train military strategy. Even though it was just a small minority of women who obtained this more strategic role in battle, this path was most likely accepted for women of higher standing at least under certain conditions. That does not mean that warriors were not predominantly male, but I think it is interesting to look at the conditions that bring forth the opportunities for women to occupy a role outside of their gender.
👍
The fact that you had to say "before anyone gets upset" before talking about this subject 🤦🏼♀️
On this one, I disagree. Christian historians would not hide the actions of women, but all of the religions of the God of Abraham consider their Mom's, sisters, wives, daughter's, anything with a womb as second class creatures. Study of the Edda's will show that the Deutsch cultures considered them as equals. There are many women warriors in the Edda's, and you think no woman or girl was inspired by this? I grew up in Japan (Nippon) and one of the most difficult titles to achieve was Senshi Samurai, a sworn warrior. To achieve the title of Senshi you had to be a master of all the forms of combat used at the time you held that title. There is accurate historical record of hundreds of women holding this title. There are even some photographs of them. Though I agree that they were well breasted, I doubt they were merely observers.
There are also trolls and other monster in the Edda's it does't mean they were real. You have to have actual evidence for there being "warrior women", there isn't any. And it makes sense since women are a lot weaker than men. The army which allows women to fight in their ranks would get wiped out easily.
ave Hmmmm. You seem to have forgotten about the many forms of combat that don't require face to face actions, such as archers. I also remember that though I worked with the Afghan army 6 days a week, for 2 years, each time I left the gate, there was normally a female soldier to log me out. As for evidence, the largest buried longboat found to date sailed a woman to Asgard, and among the tributes she wore weapons.
@@daguard411 Women are just as useless in modern combat as they were before, they've done lots of studies on this. It doesn't work, the Israeli army tried this to utter failure. I think you just have a fetish bro, sort yourself out.
16:42 Of course there would have been some women who could have done a good job on the battlefield, and I’m sure there where a couple but I don’t think it was common though. There were also a lot of men who never fought on the battlefields. When we lived in small clans I’d imagine that everyone who could hold a weapon where needed if attackers came, and a grown woman could surly do a lot of harm to a boy in the younger teens. But as clans grew to communities it’s likely that people started focus on different things that benefited the society. Warriors was just one of those important groups. I honestly don’t think there were that many women who’d choose the warrior lifestyle, and no matter how strong and brave some women are the fact that men on average are bigger and stronger than women remains. Just look sports. There’s a reason why there’s men’s leagues and women’s leagues. How talented for example the women’s hockey team are I don’t think they would last very long if they were to met the men’s team. That doesn’t mean one is better than the other. It simply means we’re different. We’re supposed to complement each other.
Great accent.
🤘🤘
I wouldn't mind taking orders from lagertha. If factual she was intelligent fierce, bad a.., and beautiful and sometimes beautiful is deadlier then the sword.
Holy whatever- how can I remember reading that in Tacitus? Amazing- JEOPARDY next?
On tik tok I saw a young girl become a shield maiden. I'm new and was wondering if u could do a video about this and other things. Like what happens at each stage of growing up for the children and what certain things mean. I hope this doesn't offend anyone here.
Hes addressed this many times, check out his library.
You saw a modern person on TikTok become a "shieldmaiden"? You realize that role no longer exists if it ever really did, and that a lot of sad people like to play make believe right?
@@DieLuftwaffel thank u for ur reply.
@@VanaheimrUllr ok thank u. I didn’t know. I’m new to this channel but ty
@Freki Bodgaedir ummm ok. I don’t know y ur having a go at me about this. Like I said I’m new and just wanted to know something. As a woman I don’t just want to do the things u think women should do. Women are much more than a slave to men.
Your argument that there are a lot of sources showing that the Vikings went to a lot of efforts to exclude women from violence, which does not track with the idea of a society in which women warriors were permitted, seems like convincing reasoning to me. That plus common sense knowledge of biology and how it relates to physical performance differences after puberty says to me the women warriors are fun fluff for modern tv shows, but not historically accurate.
You don't have to be physically stronger than a man to kill a man may I remind you dear sir. I don't think you really care for historical accuratacy as much as you care about your own biases.
@@annanuss2041 sure, you could use a gun, but I don't believe they were available in the time period. You could poison him, but that isn't the kind of fighting we're talking about, is it? I don't think you care for reality, only transparently silly statements that ignore the topic in hand because saying them provides a sad catharsis to satisfy your discontent with how things actually work.
Is it true the Huns'Territory was todays Germany and right up to Denmark?
men in the fields of battle and women on the sidelines showing their breasts shouting for their men to fight harder: kind of like an American football match with cheerleaders...
Ja
lol Your accent change for the ancients
For anyone interested there is archaeological evidencie of a viking warrior women (not a fighter) in Birka, Sweden: kzhead.info/sun/q6asp7CwgX6onGg/bejne.html kzhead.info/sun/iNOKnNuFi2aOiqc/bejne.html I understand that you most of what you said was based in the sagas. However, and like you said, the very saga's are not always definite proof or evidence. Specially in this case. Just because it was not mentioned it doesn't automatically mean it didn't occur. Plus, we can't relay only in one type of evidence. In that sense, can we say that all the man were fighters because most of the warriors were man? I don't think so, and because it contradicts what you said. What about the archaeological findings? Although we don't have a full story with like in the sagas, we have physical proof that can be analysed with science. I not saying that I'm correct and you wrong, just point out that sagas can't be the only form of evidence to support a statement like that.
💖👍
It’s very dishonorable in Scandinavia to have women fight your battles. Yes, we had to defend our homes while you were gone, but fighting to defend something is much different than being a warrior. Women were very valuable, so you’d never think of having women fight.
What is that last phrase he always says???
Don't forget about Equality .
Amazing tv shows
gender rules are not fixed they can change overtime depending on the context the society is in
Both sexes literally exist because of biological differences that evolved due to evolution. This has nothing to do with "genderroles" from our society, that exists BECAUSE of the biological differences you Donut, you know corelation and causation are not the same.
I swear, when he said, "I want you to define....", I automatically thought " a woman" instead of warrior😂🤣
In this day and age I don't blame you for thinking that lmfao
Adult human female. Transwomen are misogynistic men acting out their favourite pornified stereotypes of womanhood.
Poisonous mushrooms, work great to
I can belive much if these myths came about from the viking age. Scandinavian culture was different than the continental european ones and I would not think it be a stretch to calim a girl growing up in scandinavia at the time would have more experirnce and if you will training with weapons such as axe and knife and others in a much larger extent than any girl on the continent. Now these girls grow up to be women and do the traditional women roles, but they sill live the hard life in their culture they are still much more expsosed directly and indirectly to weapon use than the continental women at the same time, not by much but enpugh to notice for the co tinental regular soldier who at the time was often a part time farmer/Soldier and then encuntering a hosewife in some Norse settled area, during conflict, becuse the soldier is most likely part time and the woman equally most likely have some experince and training woth weapons she will become an opponent worthy to be remembered by thsi part time soldier who can only see such "skill" being that of a warrior/soldier in his culture, wher any norse would simply a woman being at home doing her woman things
A warrior fights in war. Women in the ancient world helped with wars. They even went to war. But they nearly never fight, unless in self-defence.
I do believe female warriors existed and the ice age is a good reason for that happening. The harder life is the more equal gender roles are generally, and that likely goes for fighting as well.
Back then and even now in certain places woman are a resource they wouldn’t do much fighting because they most likely wouldn’t be killed by the enemy
🗿👍🏿
Civilians make the largest part of the military over that 100 years.
What about valkyres? Much earlier certainty.
Valkyries were mythical beings not an actual warrior society lmfao
@Fyrdman I know but intelligent people believe ancient myths arise out of reality. And thus have some truth. My question is still valid.
@@nancienordwick4169 well in this case it's not real, there were no women on flying horses, medusa wasn't real either in the Greek myths. We know what there societies were like, politics and war was the realm of men, women were relegated to domestic roles. This has been the norm in every European society since it has existed.
no. We know only what we do. Knowing doesn't rule out the vast unknown.
@@nancienordwick4169 we know women are weaker than men, even an odd one out among women who's stronger than the average woman would find it impossible to survive in a fight against male warriors. It's simple common sense.
lets be real we're all here cause we only tall woman, fk I cant feel shit for a short woman
Sure women were warriors, just try and stop us when some arsehole is messing with our kids or men, or causing some problems with the squad 😸 But maybe not entire battalions of women. That we know about. Great info! Love your channel!
Throwing objects and having a jabbing a pitch folk at the men that just broke down your door after killing all the men in your village makes you a desperate soul fighting for survival not a warrior
You mean they didn't have armies of only elite female warriors?? WwwhHhHAAaAtTT?!!??
Stop worrying about pissing women off and tell it like it is tell the truth as it is and not how they want it to be they are not as strong as men they are not as physical as men they are not as tough as men they are women and men are men the protector
My thought when he asked if there were shield maidens was: 'I hope they were smarter than this. Dying in battle is a man's job. I'd be looking for the next father to my children'
@@Femmefatale1990 Your a real woman to say that and there's not lot of them left now days you and others like you are definitely worth protecting
Numero Uno LIKE!💋 12:52PM Texas Friday 13th 01/13/23.
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
✨️👌🏻🇨🇱
The modern feminist trend is to go back in history and start retroactively adding in female warriors and this idea that women back then were no different than men until Christianity came. It's total propaganda
Your def. is very astute, but has no information. Being a caste is vague. I think tentatively that it is determined by the skill level of their use of arms. Also, I don't believe all people of the North are Germanic.
Obi wan said it best, "there are alternatives to fighting"
Obi Wan was a space monk, not a Saxon monk.
Woooooooooo first baby
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.
The DANES were warriors! Norwegians and sweeds were fighters. and when Norwegians and Swedes werent fighting,,,, they were at home.... doing.... girl things,,, :D
I think your definition is a little too strict. Only a little. There's definitely a spiritual aspect to this. I don't think you must be of a certain class either. What you're describing are soldiers.
"There definitely were some feisty maidens you wouldn't want to mess with." Ha! so who wants to spar? ;)
🥃
To Norse beliefs and Magic: please read the whole statement. Which Icelandic saga was the the she-troll named Ogmunder in? Was the she-troll named Ogmunder in the Edda’s poem or in another Norse saga? Because Monstrum video did not explain enough on which saga the she-troll Ogmunder was in? The Iceland poetry of Trójumanna saga mentions centaurs, Hercules, and sirens. But does the Trojunmanna saga mention satyrs? Some ancient Greeks would have still went to these areas that usually people did not go. Even during that time period, some ancient Greeks would have went into areas that is usually not where people go. So some Ancient Greek would have not seen no monster creatures in areas that is beyond where they usually go to. So not all of the ancient Greeks would believe in all of the myths. Even during that time period. Some Ancient Greek would have still went into the wilderness isolated areas, like the wilderness of Arcadia and the wilderness of Thessaly Greece. And none of the Ancient Greek seen a satyr or a centaur. Even during that time period. This also goes for the Norse Vikings that believed in these myths.