This Plane Could Even Land Itself: Why Did The L-1011 Fail?
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When launched, the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar was the most technologically-advanced widebody commercial airliner ever. This aircraft made leaps forward in efficiency, comfort, and safety. 50 years ago, the L-1011 even had the capability to land itself at certain airports in zero visibility weather, when other planes like the Boeing 747 would have to divert.
Yet the L-1011 is the same aircraft that nearly bankrupt the company that built it. Lockheed incurred billions of dollars in losses on the L-1011 program and only ever sold half the TriStars it would need just to break even financially.
The L-1011 program got off to a rocky start. Rolls-Royce was to manufacture a new kind of highly efficient, three stage turbofan engine to power the Tristar. But Rolls-Royce had difficulty developing its new engine. During the development of its RB-211 turbofan, Rolls-Royce filed for bankruptcy. This created delays and uncertainties around the L-1011 Tristar Program.
An even bigger challenge for the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar was that it had to split the market with its rival, the Mcdonnell Douglas DC-10. This aircraft was in many ways similar to the L-1011. But Mcdonnell Douglas was a proven manufacturer with a track record in civil aviation. Lockheed on the other hand, was the new player. Newly formed Airbus would also soon introduce the more efficient twin-engined widebody A300 that would take sales away from both the Lockheed L-1011 TriStar and Mcdonnell Douglas DC-10. #L1011 #Lockheed #Trijet #Airplanes
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James Havenga 3 hours in and counting
Same
Totally
Me too, and im not disappointed
Yesssir, 6 episodes in
DC-10 "blowing out its cargo doors and sprinkling the midwest with its engine parts." As savage as it is accurate
soaringtractor NTSB investigators found that the DC-10's cargo door design was dangerously flawed. They made several recommendations, including repairing the faulty cargo door design to make it impossible for baggage handlers to close the cargo door lever without the locking pins being fully engaged. Many carriers voluntarily modified the cargo doors, though no airworthiness directive was issued so the changes were not mandatory. McDonnell Douglas did make modifications to the cargo door, but the basic design remained unchanged and problems persisted. Overall though the DC-10 was a reliable and safe aircraft.
Shaun Mc Laughlin it's cousin the MD 11 is carrying cargo from one country to another and they still fly today, because it's more capable of of taking goods from another airport that is international to another International Airport.
If you do your homework you'd discover that the DC-10 issues, primarily the noteworthy American crash in Chicago, were attributed to American's maintenance procedures and not the aircraft itself. My father worked at Douglas Aircraft worked his entire life and I worked there for 4 years myself. Douglas made quality aircraft, so please don't bad-mouth the DC-10 without being well-informed.
Concorde killer.
And yet that was not enough to deter sales of the DC-10?! This aircraft should have blown it for dust!
My mom wired all the cockpits in every 1011 that rolled off the production line.
Jeffrey Middlebrook Well, that's interesting. How many did she work on? Just asking. :) - Lincoln's Aviation Feel free to stop by some other time! I highly appreciate it.
Not sure. She's dead so I can't answer that. All I know is that she was the lead avionics engineer for the 1011.
Are you Shure of that statement ? 1968 - 1984. 250 were manufactured.
That's awesome. She must have had some very interesting stories.
@@thereallincolntakanashi why the spam tho
Lockheed: Marketing ❌ Technological innovation ✔️ Mcdonnel Douglas: Marketing ✔️ Technological innovation ❌
😂
Plus, Lockheed wedded itself to Rolls Royce and took longer to get a longer-range variant to market, while McDonnell-Douglas offered one very soon.
Airbus: Both
Boeing : Both Airbus : None
@@BadassBobY Boeing: marketing ✔️ Technological innovation ❌ Airbus: Marketing ✔️ Technological innovation ✔️
I flew from Boston to Los Angeles in 1985 in one of these. A very strange flight with only eight other passengers. The best flight ever for me but horrible for the airline. I had a floppy frisbee in my carry-on and myself, two flight attendants, and another passenger played catch over Kansas.
that is the strangest experience i've ever read damn
That’s awesome! Good way to kill some time.
That must have been hilarious lmao
best era to live in, lucky bastard
I flew a red eye from Boston to SF one time in the 80s during the winter, after 5 hour delay most passengers left and were re booked, only 100 people stayed for the flight. It was great. They could not cancel because they needed the plane at the other end. So they just left with the people that stayed around.
I flew the L-1011- 500 at Pan Am and followed her to United with the purchase of the Pacific Routes. Far and away the finest airplane I have ever flown- including the excellent 747-400, 757, 767, and 777. Lockheed didn't- as did a foreign manufacturer- try to build an airplane that would "fly itself." They built an airplane that gave the Pilot every tool possible to fly it safely and efficiently. And, in my opinion, they succeeded at that better than with any other aircraft I have ever flown. Lockheed's engineers seemed almost to have read future accident reports. The cargo doors had panels attached to the latching mechanism so the airplane wouldn't pressurize unless the door were properly latched- the Leading Edge Flaps were extended by Jackscrews rather than by hydraulic cylinders, so they couldn't be blown up in the event of a hydraulic failure. The Rolls Royce engines on the earlier L-1011's gave some problems, but the -500's originally had RB211-B3's- pretty good engines which were replaced by RB211-B4's, great engines. Most large Jets have "Two Spool" engines- a smaller compressor and turbine section inside a larger one. The RB211 Was three spool engine, which gave it superior acceleration.
My father flew the Pan Am L1011 too, to Europe. He loved it and said it was the best plane he ever flew. (Apparently not every pilot checked out on it so easily!) He went back on the 747 after they sold them. Lol!- Herb, my father knows you well, he just said.
Your should have done this video. Really enjoyed reading your post.
My father was a Delta A&P mechanic and the L-1011 was his favorite aircraft - not counting the the P51 Mustangs he worked on after WWII (B-24 crew chief during the war.)
You people are legends
I Had The Pleasure Of Flying On This Magnificent Plane Four Times Each From S.F. To Dulles And Subsequent Returns. Only One Trip Back To S.F. The Pilot Had To Avoid Storms By Flying To L.A. And Then Up To S.F. We Arrived On Time Despite The 500 Miles Out Of The Way. I LOVED THIS PLANE. BTW, I Was In D.C. When This Baby Went Down In Florida. Needless To Say I Was Scared Out Of My Mind Since I Was Flying Home The Next Day!
For a time, I was a flight attendant for TWA. This was my favorite plane to fly/work. It was roomier, there were four or five bathrooms in the back of the plane for coach passengers which left us a decent sized galley in the middle of the plane where the elevators were. Those led to the big galley downstairs. I loved working the L5 position (the galley wench!). You got to be downstairs prepping all the drink carts and food carts during boarding. This was the workhorse on transcontinental flights. SFO or LAX to JFK/BOS/DC - this was the plane.
I’m certain I must have flown with you on those very routes. Great plane and great TWA service.
@@tomtemin5946 Where were you based? I was in SFO until it closed and then LAX.
Boston, flew often to SFO and LAX. My favorite first class dessert was orange sherbet in a frozen orange peel. The Ambassadors Club at Logan looked like an olde English pub. Whatever happened to those single-serve little Manhattan nip bottles?
@@tomtemin5946 Was that dessert on international? I just remember the ice cream cart (no sherbert), cheesecake and something chocolate. And I never went into the Ambassadors clubs.I rarely flew international (occasionally London). I do miss Boston though!
@@tomtemin5946 Oh, and do people drink Manhattans anymore? I doubt they put that one out now
That video is accurate. It's ahead of its time. This aircraft is one of the most spacious, comfortable plane I worked with. They even have a cute mini elevator (lift) that goes down to the kitchen galley! I don't know any Crew member that did not enjoy working with L1011. The plane designs these days are too commercialized, seats getting tighter & the only comfort a passenger can have is if you pay business class.
Yeah but flights are also cheaper
Ahhhh another Delta employee
@@gavcom4060 because we're delta airlines...
@@penny1029 Lots of airlines flew the L1011 It just took a back seat to the 747 at the time.
@@scotttild I was referencing a joke from a comedy show, "because were delta airlines! AND LIFE IS A FUCKING NIGHTMARE" lol
My Grandpa flew this in the early 70's. They called it the "Five Star TriStar". He once told me he and the co pilot read papers and a book for a whole flight (likely across Africa) and barely touched the controls.
What airline did he fly the TriStar for? I'm guessing it was the long range version. My grandfather flew the standard L-1011 for Delta from when they were introduced until his retirement in 80. He loved that plane about as much as the Convair 880 he had flown before. Now, only the Stargazer still flies...
your grandpa is a g
The Airbus A380 comes with a pilot and a dog. The pilot is there just to feed the dog. The dog is there to bark at the pilot in case he tries to touch any buttons.
Is that like the chrome dog on a Mack truck? I've often wondered if it's really the _dog_ that drives, and the truck driver just oversees things. Hmm
Pretty much, tbh.
didn't know I'd see you here
Didn’t this aircraft kill a bunch of people when no one fixed the cargo hatch blowing off at high altitude? Or was McDonald Douglas.... I think it was then actually, wasn’t it?
Cole Smith That's a DC-10
I flew on one of the last L1011 American flights. They were ferrying it from Chicago to Dallas. I got lucky as my original flight was overbooked. I got standby and was one of only 15 passengers on the whole plane! The crew told me it was leaving service. The thing climbed like a rocket! So stable, quiet and roomy. I also loved how much of the wing transformed when full flaps and spoilers deployed. One of my best commercial flights to date.
Everyone else : *builds generic airplane* Lockheed: hold my blackbird sr-71
Please, Lockheed weren't even close to first with this. The Tident did it long before.
Well the generic airliner design has actually been pretty good... standard 2 engine airliners are getting a lot of sales sine they are easier to fill up cause less space and they take up a bit less fuel then 4 engines does.... so things like A 350 777 787 737 A 320 A 330 etc are doing pretty good in the sales...
Antonov: *hold my vodka*
And also maybe the 72
@@Post_Stall_Maneuver Hahahahahaha
"And that's where skill share comes in..." Smooooth
my dislike is for this shill shit. need an ad? say its an ad.
Ekakwa Bwkake no shit, it says there's a paid promotion included at the start, are you blind?
One hell of a transition there.
Porglit With KZhead getting stingy with ad revenue sharing, KZheadrs have had to resort to these ANNOYING in video ads..........
I'm paying for KZhead Red to avoid ads....
Such a beautiful aircraft too, should have been a winner!
737 MAX, HA HA take that Lockheed I won. *Takes Off and Flies over an ocean.
If obviously they offer other type of engine to operate & have more options of frame than just the passenger & military cistern, it would have been a different story.
@@axl1632 It was a political plane in several areas To convince European purchases the design was such that only the Rolls Royce engines could be used. Lockheed had not had a competitive plane since the Model 14 Electra of the 1930's. Being that Lockheed was the largest budgeted company in the Defense Dept, the government wanted to disguise this fact. The Gov told Lockheed to build something that looked civilian. They did and failed.
It's still my favorite in terms of looks!
@@Marinealver **Immediately nosedives into the ocean because of the failure of the 2 sensors**
The book "Destination Disaster" gives a good background of the DC10/L1011 development. Douglas started later than Lockheed and had a mantra of "fly before they roll". And the DC10 did indeed fly before the L1011. The shortcuts Douglas took showed up later.
Flew on a DC-10 one time….I remember hearing that top mounted engine nearly the whole time, very annoying. L1011 also called a Tri-star….one of these got hit by wind shear in Dallas, pushed it down onto a freeway, one of the engines taking out a small car and the person in it unfortunately. That in turn took out one of the wing mounted engines, he was on the throttle trying to get it back up, but took a left turn because of the missing engine right into a big water tower. Needless to say the water tower won. They left that damm thing sitting out there and everyone coming into Dallas landing or taking off could see it.
@@topmech71 I know. I traveled for a living back then and had a flight out the following Monday. If you think it looked scary driving by, imagine taking off and looking at it. I had been doing an expense report for work when it went down. I looked down at the report I was working on and the flight for that trip was Delta 191 - the flight that went down.
I recall the joke going around back then, "How do you catch a DC10? Buy 5 acres and wait."
@@johnstreet797 LMAO
@@johnstreet797bro💀
Delta flew the L1011, I loved the plane. Flew it from LAX to Atlanta, with coach having a champagne flight. That was the late 70s nothing like it since.
Lee Balansag stfu
God wish I was there
@Lee Balansag shut up
Now idiots fly wearing pajamas and bring dogs on board.
@Someaceguy1937 You first, snowflake
My dad was on the drafting team at Rolls Royce for the engines in the late 60s early 70s. Whenever he'd see a Tristar he'd point it out all excited like a little kid and shout "there's my engines, *chuckle chuckle*." In 1972 we moved to Canada so he could take up a job at Pratt & Whitney in Montreal. I never knew it was because he lost his job over a bankruptcy.
thats really sad sorry to hear that alexa, play despacito im sorry
My dad was a draftsman at Royces too, in Derby, around the same time!
@@shigokin13 So, you assholes on the web now think that 100 carriage returns makes for something funny.
logical Octopus Oh that's nice. Is he still alive? Just asking. :) - Lincoln's Aviation
Thats interesting but dig this, I'm the love child of Kirk Douglas and Marilyn Monroe
I was working for Rolls-Royce when the RB211 was being developed in the late 1960s in test bed instrumentation design but not involved with that particular engine. The failure of the Hyfil fan blades was very traumatic for the company's pride as well as for we engineers. The replacement with more expensive titanium-skinned blades fortunately has proved to be a lasting success. I left the company in late 1970 but rejoined 3 years later and stayed until I retired. I was involved at one time with designing the control and instrumentation for blade off tests similar to the one shown in the video which I suspect took place at the RR Hucknall site. It's both worrying and exciting deliberately destroying such an expensive piece of engineering to satisfy certification requirements. Thanks for the video.
Well... better destroy one engine on purpose, than let one engine destroy an airliner in flight ;-))
I guess they were "High Fail" fan blades.
I thought the titanium skin leading edge was also a non starter. The production blade was solid Ti.
@jadidweto en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_gun 'Nuff said.
I read a great series of interviews with Stanley Hooker about his career including this episode. They were *so close* to a real breakthrough with those fan blades, essentially what is now known as carbon fibre, but it wasn't to be. Thanks for the post
Ok that skillshare transition was SMOOTH
I've been searching for that
At the age of 12 in 1977, an Eastern L-1011 flew my family and me back from Disneyworld. (On the way down we flew in a 707.) I loved the widebody and orange color scheme of the Lockheed. Great memories!
At age of 12 in 1974 took an Eastern L-1011 from PHL to San Juan. First plane ride I ever took. Got cockpit tour too. Did you get the flying wings pin for your shirt? 😁
@@jamesp13152 no flying wings for me. Now I feel robbed! 😄
The first flight of the 1011 was in 1970, so it could not be 12 years old in 1977.
@@TinLeadHammer He was 12 years old
@@jamesp13152I remember the Eastern wings, they were awesome. Also flew EAL jets to Florida and Puerto Rico back then. They pumped Disney movie songs over the PA.
Can I learn how to build an 10 engine commercial aircraft on skillshare?
Nuclearation no but you can learn how to build your own DIY atom bomb
A B-36 airliner?
salt boi that would be a long cross country flight.
Nuclearation na but you can make a fake bomb like saif and hijack a plane and fly it to the country your ex life’s in and send her a message
yea you just need some plutonium super easy
6:13 'even as the DC10 was losing cargo doors or shedding engines over the Midwest' oh boy did that sting ! the flying coffin, indeed
@@77l96 except for that fast landing speed problem, that caused 2 FedEx MD11s to crash
Dick Crusher 10
Flying is a strong word.
Ironically its the best freighter jet than the TriStar or your beloved & Fragile Airbuses, smartass.
@@77l96 the landing speed was a contributing factor
Flew on a TWA L-1011 from Miami to LAX back in the early 80s. We hit some terrible weather and the ride wasnt the best. I remember the LA Dodgers were on board going home from Spring Training. Ill never forget Tommy Lasorda and the main team stars walking around talking with all of the passengers to get their minds off of the turbulance. Great guys. Ran into Tommy at the luggage turnstiles and was able to thank him in person for the teams efforts.
Landed in one at LAX. I'm a pilot, yet I literally could not tell when we touched down as it was so smooth.
I got to ride a few times in an L-1011. Yes, smooth is an understatement. It was smooth like riding a sedan with great suspension. The DC-10 was a brute. It felt like raw power, which was cool. But it’s landings? Every one was hard.
As a passenger, I had the same experience. The plane was so smooth, I couldn't even tell we were moving. We took off from the runway without so much as a tremble or bump, the plane handled turbulence like a boss, and the plane landed so smoothly you didn't even know you were on the runway. Wonderful!
This video looks better than the professionally done stuff you get on tv, congratulations!
because they don't have to make a 60min video with 8min of content
This is also professional, they get paid for these videos you know, you mongrel.
thanks to Skillshare...lol
They even got the ads before and after the video ;d
Video quality sucks! Don't know what you're talking about.
I was a Flight Attendant on this spectacular Airplane
omg what has happened to humanity?
Cool!
You're iucky!
My dad used to pilot L-1011s. He still sings their praises and says they're the best airplane he's ever flown. He's even got several model L-1011s around the house. I miss that airplane. It was comfortable, I could stand up straight without hitting my head, I could sit comfortably without feeling squished in like a sardine, and it was quiet and smooth.
In the 90’s I was returning from a ski trip to Italy. When we got to Turin airport it was covered in dense fog. All the flights on the board were marked as delayed with no expected arrival time. Our flight the appeared with a notification of on time. We didn’t believe this until the notice changed to landed. Getting on the plane in this dense fog was a little spooky and even more so going down the runway with no visibility at all. Absolutely amazing.
That transition from the plane to skillshare was so smooth i think i fell on the ground
You ACTUALLY fell in the ground. The transition was so smooth that when you got up you felt as if you were not so sure if you fell or it was only a dream or maybe just you thinking that you did . It took me 3 day for me to realize the same ting when i watched the video for the first time about a week ago . Funny but still kind of creepy .
homeroyomero WTH
I feel violated
Shockwave Shockwave Skillshare would have been better off talking about its own success stories (if any) than talking about the failed Lockheed. I thought the video would focus on the engineering features of the plane. Just goes to show profits override passenger safety for airlines
That and the plane theme and I actually thought I was watching Wendover for a minute there.
My dad was the Art Department Manager at Lockheed/Burbank, and the L-1011 was developed on his watch. But when it was cancelled, he had to fire half of his staff. It was a debacle for Lockheed, as told in this video.
John Prothero Sad, revolutionary aircraft never make it.
Yes very sad. I had the honor to be a flight engineer on the L-10 for Rich International Airways in the mid 90’s. It’s still my favorite bird. The modern day birds, mainly the airbuses, bore and sadden me. I guess I’m old fashioned.
Yes and with the addition of the geared turbofan engines, they don't even growl at high thrusts anymore.
I call bullshit on the two who claim to be related to the project.... what are the chances that two people who are related to the project directly are in the same comment about a KZhead video. Sick of you morons making outrageous claims on KZhead videos for likes
I flew for Eastern Airlines as an F/A 1976-1989 and this was by far my favorite A/C out of the whole fleet. Just loved everything about it, including that throaty roar of the RR engines. The DC-10 was not nearly as good. A300's and 757 & 727-200's were OK but the L-1011 was still the best. We did a cat111A landing in almost zero vis. at Bradley CT. on our way to Toronto,Canada.
I flew on the inaugural flight where they allowed the TriStar to land itself. Boy was that thrilling.
Just found this interesting entry. I had the pleasure of captaining both the 1011 Tristar 200 &500 and before that Tridents 1,2 & 3. The Trident was a pilots aircraft in that it handled like a jet fighter, very responsive and a delight to fly. We initially cruised .88 mach but in the interest of fuel economy this was later reduced to .8. Only two aircraft to my knowledge were ever certified to use reverse thrust in flight, the Trident and the Corranado. The Tristar was quite different, much more commercially orientated, technically well ahead of its time, handled well enough, cruised at .82mach and with triple INS the machine virtually flew itself. Both were autoland capable but the Triistar being 2nd generation, did it better, even in a moderate crosswind. I retired 34 years ago and looking back I preferred shorthaul flying with the Trident to longhaul operations in the Tristar.
I'm curious why you'd use reverse thrust in flight-was it so you could dump a lot of altitude quickly?
@@almostfm Maybe they just wanted to taste earth in their mouths. LOL
C-5A and B can use reverse thrust inflight. They do NOT have inflight spoiler/speed brake capability.
The DC-8 with CFM-56 engines used 2 engine reversing in flight for routine descents. The planes after market CFM-56's were putting out too much thrust at idle to allow routine steep descents without overspeeding the airframe. Putting the inboard engines in reverse allowed a slower airspeed, yet steeper descent.
I recall when BA was having a go at Boeing for giving them new 757s which were going to replace the ''obsolete'' autoland certified Tridents which were being scrapped with ''new'' 757s which didn't even have Cat I at the time!
I flew in L-1011s including in the jumpseat. Pilots talk about that plane like it was their mistress.
I flew both the 1011 and the DC10. The Tristar was vastly under powered, when full, it's rate of climb was embarrassing. It's so called ergonomic "Dark Cockpit" made finding push button switches very difficult during night hours.The DC10 series 60 with GE engines was a delight to fly. I would be surprised if any of my colleagues who flew both types preferred the Tristar. As a retired Senior Captain with around 24000 flying hours I know which trijet I would chose.
Back in the day I was flying the red eye back from Vancouver in an l10-11 and there were about 15 people on board. Flight attendant said go sit with the pilots. So I did. Then they said do I want to steer the plane around a huge storm... So I did.... Was absolutely amazing.
As a passenger, flying in the Tri-Star was a wonderful experience.
maxsmodels it’s a sexy plane that works well and if you get sick as a pilot you aim For instrument localizer
@@arthurblack9097 Your opinion is certainly credible considering your experience; and I've never heard the "Dark Cockpit" thing before. When I think about it, I don't think I have ever heard a DC10 or 1011 pilot really criticize either plane...although you're the first I've heard that actually flew BOTH planes. Thanks for the insight.
L1011 was an amazing plane. I remember flying on it and marveling at the spaciousness of the cabin.
I am a TWA flyer from longer ago than I would like to admit. I took several L-1011 flights both trans-Atlantic and domestic. In my opinion it was the best of the wide-body planes. The 787 comes the closest to the comfort and smooth flying. I have always felt the 747 and the wide-bodied Airbus fleet to be serviceable, but clunky feeling. Thanks for the video, it's too bad that economic problems caused the 1011 to not be a success.
Wendover's cousin?
Carlos Matute Same kind of video, same advertising, very similar voice... I really think so haha.
you said it :D and both love planes!
I find it pretty suspicious that he already has a sponsor with just 26K subs and less than 2mil total views. I point to KZhead's invisible hand.
Maybe he “shares skills” with wendover? Surprised he didnt link to Wendover’s ETOPS video.
TBH I dont care, its good quality stuff
I swear 80% of Air Crash Investigation episodes are DC Series 😂
DC = "Definitely crashes" ;D
LOL damm.
Adam Messmann 70% DC-10 and MD-11 POOR TRIJETS!!! I still love them XD
Illusionyary MD=Mega Death
Adam Messmann curb your enthusiasm theme plays
I love this aircraft. I was a TWA ground operations crew and I enjoyed working this airliner. It was a thrill to see it land and takeoff from the airport I was stationed crowded with many other airliners from many eras painted in varieties of color schemes of reds, oranges, gold, blues, purples, chrome, grays, yellows, greens, white, etc, it was so picturesque. All that is changed now, today, generally all the airliners look the same two engines on the wing mostly painted in white and blues.
In the late 90s I used to fly regularly between Toronto and Vancouver BC. One night-time flight out of Vancouver I boarded a plane that had a weird seat layout, and I had so much leg room I could stretch without touching the seat in front (and I am over 6'). This was one of the last L1011s. Although the plane looked old, I never forgot how comfortable that flight was. From wikipedia - "Following the end of the early 90s recession Air Canada needed to increase its capacity and so three Tristars were returned to service and used exclusively on routes between Vancouver, Los Angeles, Montreal and Toronto."
I thought the L-1011 was the most beautiful passenger plane ever made.......
In the least, one of them!
The l-1011and the concord
i think you'll find that would be the vc-10, yank
jemimallah MD-11
@@Bosstron5000 lol hell no
As an entrepreneur, I cannot thankyou enough for the wealth of knowledge I'm gaining from this videos the dynamic romance between ingenious designs/engineering vs economics always makes for a steamy story and a lesson to take home, the fact that this failures are from huge well established companies really makes you stop and consider that economics respects nobody, great stuff as always
My old man is a Tristar pilot, and he was flying them up until only recently. He maintains it is one of the best aircraft ever, though unbelievably complex.
@Saad Nabi Cheema A lot of odd airlines in the middle east, I can't remember the name of the companies.
@Saad Nabi Cheema it might have been, his name is Damien if that helps.
"Why did the L-1011 Fail?" Boeing, and lobbying by Boeing probably.
More likely Airbus offering more efficient 2 engine liners, relaxing the ETOPs rule and the fact airlines could purchase 1.5 "10s" for the cost of 1 "11".
Fast forward 10 minutes and you realize Boeing was only mentioned twice in the whole video and one of those was to establish that they had nothing to do with this.
Boeing literally had no interest in the triengine market after finding that a triengine 747 wasn't viable. Boeing hadn't been ruined by the MD board yet.
As far as I know, DC lobbied for its DC10 airliner. This is not the first time that we see that story: DC8 was a much better plane than the Boeing 707, but this latter won a contract with the US government for 1000 units, that's how an airliner becomes successful. In the other hand, the regulations said that any long range airliner should have at least three engines, DC and Lockheed did it, and the winner was... the Airbus a300, because it had two engines...
I worked on the L1011 and it was the least favorite aircraft I ever worked on. First the engines were poor and needed constant maintenance. The Apu was problematic with insufficient inlet airflow. The hydraulic system fittings always leaked. The growing fastners sucked as you could tighten with more torque than loosen. Corrosion at butline zero on the fuselage was a problem as well. I could go on and on.
Another advanced airliner of the time was the Hawker Siddeley Trident, the world's first tri-jet airliner, went into service in 1964, eight years before the Lockheed TriStar. It featured the first automated pilot system which landed successfully in '65 and a fully 'blind landing' in 1966. Fun fact: the advanced Trident wing was also used in the development of the Airbus 300.
I cut my teeth on avionics engineering at Smiths, and remember seeing some vintage "Let George do it!" Adverts. Thanks for the memory refresher....
Remember, the 727 went into service in 1963. Both 727 and Trident were narrow-body single aisle aircraft that were not competitors to the DC10 and 1011.The cool thing about the Trident was the nose gear that was offset and retracted sideways (this was done to accommodate the autoland system)
Only things i really knew about the Trident was what I learned during the BEA Crash after takeoff way back when...
beeney2 yes, that was the Stains accident
Sorry dude, the 727 entered service a couple months prior to the Trident.
In 1995 I got to fly and tristar from Atlanta to Manchester, UK. It was one of the best flights I've ever had for such a long distance.
John Wyatt Excellent, I was born in 1995 in Manchester. Still living there now.
When they were towards the end of their service life, my favorite plane was the L-1011 to ride. Huge cabins, so smooth in the sky, and when they landed it was putting down on a pillow. I miss that plane.
I rode a Tri-Star to Nassau from Miami on Eastern Airlines for spring break in 1985. First time on a wide body. I'll never forget how cool it was.
A widebody for such a short flight?
“The L-1011!” *shows 25 seconds of a DC-10*
...even as the DC-10 started blowing out its cargo doors and sprinkling the Midwest with engine parts 😂😂😂
At least the DC-10 is in a rural area, not the a380 in an urban area
I flew one with my grandma in the early eighties to England. It was impressive but we were in coach near the back bathrooms. I had never nor seen since the number of seats in one isle. It was kind of miserable but what an impressive plane. And at least the leg room was better than we have now.
Planes have a rail to put seats on so the airline can tailor the cabin for the number of passengers they want to carry. Ergo the shrinking legroom even though a lot of the planes are not new. It's also why the windows don't line up with the seats. Don't know if this was practice in the L1011's day but either way, broadly it's the airliners' economists doing this and not the plane engineers.
@@carsonm7292 The other thing I remember was there were men hanging out, smoking (because you could back in the day), and socializing. They were all dressed in what I think is middle eastern clothes? But I was young and 6ft tall so what do I know, but at the the time the bathrooms seemed to be a hangout. Was strange to me at the time but I am 60 years old and what do I know. Still the plane was impressive.
I've got a giant British Airways TriStar 500 model on display in my home - it must be about 1/70 scale.
Sorry, not applauding until it's a 1/1. You may need a bigger shelf to put it on. 😂😂
Lit
I have a spitfire model
And a Warhawk model
And a Tomcat
I grew up with divorced parents between MN and FL. I grew up flying by myself over summer and Christmas vacation. I was able to choose the airline I flew on and always picked Eastern because of the L1011. But my most incredible experience with that plane was flying it out of Trinidad on its first flight to Miami one beautiful morning before sunrise. It was parked out on the tarmac and all lit up in those amazing Caribbean colors of the old BWIA. The contrast between the black sky and that white and yellow Tri-Star is a memory I feel fortunate to have experienced.
I flew bwia from Heathrow to Grenada in 1991 there was only about 20 people on the flight! I remember everyone stretched out across the aisles with plumes of smoke rising giving away there positions 😂 even the cabin girls lighting up! Crazy to think you could smoke on an airliner😂
@@chiefbrody3406 their* --- & watch out for big sharks !
Amazing production quality, packed with information but it's not so much that you lose interest. Well done!
Douglas Berglund microphone quality not that good :(
f266101463 Hmm I didn't seem to notice that even though I was wearing headphones :/
Very good quality, but not enough information for me, just waffling around...
Well it all depends on prior knowledge, I never knew about what he mentioned so
Thats a fair point. I have to clarify my statement I think it is either not dense enough or he repeats himself too often. I found myself getting bored at the end because of this unfortunately
Flew on one of these as a kid. From what I remember, 2 isles, 5 seats in the middle row and 3 seats on each side near the windows. Was crazy big!
okay!
right?! i remember working as a ramp agent and being dumbfounded at the size of this beast and even more so when I went into the cabin. and the flight deck was dang near the size of a studio apartment lol. Tristar was legit engineering at its finest.
Even the 747 had no more than 10 seats across.......no way the TriStar or flying coffin had 11 across
@@billjoe39 another Boeing fanboi
From memory...i counted 7 seats in the middle!
One of my favourite commercial jets of all time, I always liked the look of it and the fact I had my first long haul flight on one means it'll always have a special place in my memories
Flew on an L1011 in 1975 from Phx to New York and it was the steepest takeoff I've every experienced and you could smoke in the back section.
James: Good research, you are correct. Another memory that I hadn't thought of in years was that we had to board the plane by stairs that were rolled up to the plane out on the tarmac. Ah, life was much more simple back then or at least more interesting.
I spotted this too! That distinctive flat wing of the DC-10 that made it to the MD-11. I think they slipped the DC-10 video in as a subtle nod to the reason for the L1011 failure!
well it isn't really the reason for the failure
This is one of the best KZhead channels around. Amazing visuals, tight score. Well done.
Sad, because the best flights I ever made were on L-1011s. FWIW, I'm a child of the 50s and flew on piston engine planes, propjets and jets. I flew New York to Paris and Paris to New York in 1982. My mum met me in New York and for the only time in my life, I flew with her to Detroit Metro on a 747. Now, the 747 was really nice, but I still liked the L-1011 better. When my ex flew out to the West Coast to visit me, he told me before leaving from the Midwest, he would be on an L-1011. I told him that he'd love it and he did.
The L-1011 remains one of my all time favorite planes. I went to Navy boot camp in one these planes (TWA). We went through storm while going over the Rockies. She handled it like a champ! I continued to fly her on Delta all the way up to her retirement. I miss seeing these planes on the tarmac at Atlanta.
I flew the L-1011 to boot camp also in March 1978 out of Atlanta, a nonstop flight & I was able to have a few last cigs b4 landing to have a Marine D.I. welcome us to Hell for the next few months.
Indeed! I flew in a L1011 only once, but it was an amazing trip. A fine aircraft.
Listen dude, I don't know who you are and why you do this... but your content is outstanding. I'm subscribing, right now!
Gorgeous aircraft; we must bring back the Lockheed L-1011 at all costs. Cheers!
@Tom Evans yeah
Given how old and inefficient they are, I doubt that even FedEx is still flying their fleet.
@Tom Evans and the 720B. Cheers!
to the guy asking for coughing engines to come back perhaps you should stop smoking so much
@@Zawmbbeh Smoke 'em if you got 'em. Cheers!
I loved the TriStar and was fortunate enough to fly on it as a child in the early to mid nineties
love the documentary - I grew up on the jump seats of these things when my dad flew them for BA - he always said you could land them on the tips of your index fingers and handled like a beautiful lady
*I want to build a trijet airliner -- I need Skillshare!*
I remember when my sim used to look just like his.... Now I use P3D V4, a bunch of add-ons and now it looks something like this: kzhead.info/sun/l7OMeaqxkHNqhYE/bejne.html
No. You will need an act of God...
You want to *build* a trijet airliner? OK, not impossible. Now, you want to *sell* one in 2017? Then hell will freeze over before you sell the first unit.
I used to fly a 1962 Sud Aviation Caravelle 6N (Alitalia) with autoland. Nothing new here.
I guess a few billions to lobby ETOPS out of your way, need to be budgeded too.
“McDonnell Douglas has a proven track record” Oh those sweet words
My first flight ever at 15. Flew from Toronto to Vegas for a hockey tournament. Seemed normal. Second flight was in a 737 and thought it was a sardine can!
Having flown on the L-1011, I really miss it. I first viewed this video about a month ago, but it's definitely worth a few views. Your research into the history of engineering is impressive. Cheers.
I flew on one of these when I was visiting my father in Florida from California in 1997. I fell in love with this plane.
Smoothest landing I ever had was an AIr Canada 1011 touching down on the computer at Toronto - could not fee a thing
Next video coming on Tuesday!...hint: it floats... and there's a lot of 'em
Mustard I bet the next video is about cloud
floats on water I should say
Trains??
Pennywise
solar panels
The L1011 truly is one marvel of a plane. I wish airlines still flew it.
Hossain Khan I wish airlines still flew the plane in your picture.
Qasim Mir Same. And coincidentally, today was the day Concorde retired from commercial service. 😔
That's absolutely correct, this is the anniversary. I remember it flying over my house. Thankfully my local airport has the flagship Concorde on display.
while this plane was a marvel, newer planes (like the 787 for example) run circles around it, due to being designed 40 years later, in a time where you can have twinjets fly across oceans.
yea no, modern planes are waaay nicer. get real man!
Flew back from the US on a Tristar as a kid. To this day it was the most comfortable aircraft I have ever flown on. Quiet cool and spacious.
There's a Cafe in Thailand that has L-1011 turned into a cafe called "Niagara N Garden". The bare body was still interesting to see especially the 3rd air intake internal framework looked like a work of art.
The l1011 is, without a doubt, one of the greatest designs of its day and the pinnacle of the trijets. For whatever reason, the DC-10 held more fascination for me but i think that was because of its awesome, menacing ramp presence. That being said, anyone who knows anything about airliners will tell you that the l1011 is by far the better aircraft.
Not anyone who worked on the L-1011. Not anyone who financed or brokered L-1011s. Not anyone who payed to operate the L-1011. That’s why they are extinct. Economics is as important to the success of an aircraft as safety and performance are.
@@Bartonovich52 no
@@Bartonovich52 worked on? no mate. United's engineering department for example, evaluated both and recommended the L10-11, advice which was promptly ignored. (232 anyone?) given the issues the DC-10 had, for a time, Pan-am was able to generate extra seat sales just by using the 1011 rather than the DC10 on some routes. As for cost, the 1011 was better on fuel, I don't know about maintenance but the S-duct admittedly would only have complicated things. List price for both was the same in 1972, though after discounts that could be different.
manifestgtr What an incredibly comfortable aircraft !!! Eastern Airlines names it The Whisper Liner
@@Bartonovich52
For years, I was an expat working all over the world. Literally flown hundreds of thousand miles. The L-1011 was my favorite airliner of all times. Even flying coach was comfortable. Wide, quiet, and roomy with sofa's to stretch out & sleep on.
7:29 Damnnn that was one of the smoothest sponsor plugs I've seen 👍
I love tri-jet planes. They look so space age.
I would like to know more about these Thrifty Thursdays
Easily some of the highest production quality I've seen on KZhead. Lots of fascinating information but still interesting without becoming too dry, very well edited with a great pace and Flow. Can't get enough of these videos especially the ones related to Aviation. Such a pleasure to learn things I never knew I wanted to know, keep up the great work!
I miss the L1011 tristar one of a kind jet wonderful experience
My first flight was on a magnificent TWA L-1011 from Boston to Chicago in August '76. The best flight ever.
I worked on this program, it was problem with the S duct, the fit of the door and the engines. The class three autopilot was amazing, it was timing in the market, the DC10 was junk but a junk that was in the market, Electra had gray engineering gear housing which harmonics was in tune with the wing rep rate, five bad engines killed that, but we did produce 800 + P3. It was a great aircraft both the TriStar, Electra and the Viking. I used the class three autopilot AFLS on the S3A perfect. Sad.
I love the L1011. She's absolutely beautiful!! Especially wearing "red". #TWABrat ❤😎😉
even if it was a commercial failure and stuff, it still looks really dang cool
3:37 it's important to note that while they never had a _jet_ they had made the very successful piston driven Constellation in the 50s! Edit: It's definitely a unique story though and it was presented very well. I'm glad there was an A300 follow-up, and every now and then I try and come back to rewatch these videos because these two planes are so unique!
Sprinkling the midwest with engine parts :D made me laugh :)
And Paris with body parts.
The DC-10 was very unlucky with regards to the CF-6 engine as they were also on many 747, 767, MD-11, A300, and A310 but never had issues on any of those aircraft. And, by the way, the "body parts" in Paris were from the starboard engine cowling.
Tragic story of a great airliner. L-1011, always my favourite!
I've flown 3 1011s in the past, and they were undoubtedly the best flight experience I've ever had. Super comfortable plane!
I remember taking an l-10 from Pittsburgh to NY, which was rare at the time. This 7 hour drive is usually an hour flight time. The lock did it in 40 minutes and I never forgot that. Will always be one of my favorites. Thanks for the video!
When you introduced skillshare at the end... That was smooth.
dudes a fucking god, he’s got my sub
That's when I stopped the video!
Lockheed was selling L-1011s but not making any money. They had an audit performed and found out they were charging less for the aircraft than it cost to produce. The joke around Lockheed was "We'll just sell more of them and make it up in volume". The same thing happened, on a much smaller scale with the Globe Swift.
These videos are so well done I'll find myself rewatching them every few months or so
Oh man, I remember those great planes too well. I flew both the L-1011 and the DC-10 many times in the eighties and had great trips. I miss those days of relaxed traveling very much. Thank you for this beautiful and interesting documentary.
Amazing video design, really something worth the time between releases.
You never talked about the autopilot
Speirs 333 How many times did they mention that it could fly and land itself................... Watch the video.................... It's a video about the L-1011 overall history. NOT the tech of it's auto pilot. Again, watch the video and read the title.
David Horgan you're a stupid idiot, the sarcasm flew right over your stupid little head right!
A stupid idiot... as opposed to a smart idiot... mmkay lulz
An L-1011 Captain told me he took off from Chicago, engaged that auto-pilot at 1500 feet, and the plane flew itself to London. The pilots then landed.
Thats every autopilot tho lol
As a kid I never managed to fly on one BUT always wanted to. I love the way the engine melted into the tail, something different... it made the L1011 special.. I finally managed to fly on a fairly old one from London Gatwick to Naples Capodichino in the late 90's. Great flight - lovely cabin - superb handling aircraft... One of my favourites
Every time i got on that machine it seemed special and became a friend of sorts. The kitchen and the nose up attitude while in cruse flight were so memorable. Video projection screens and water coolers on the wall. Last time i flew on one was in 2000 (1988 to 2000 BWIA). The all flying stab was amazing too. The ladders...it also had better pressurisation than the 747 and caused less ear discomfort. The engines had a very different sound....i loved it.
Please make a video about the DC-10 and MD-11
he already did the DC-10 lol