Wealth tax is trying to get at the 'fundamental unfairness' of our current tax code: Kitty Richards
2024 ж. 11 Мам.
18 964 Рет қаралды
Mick Mulvaney, former White House chief of staff and Actum Strategic Advisors co-chair, and Kitty Richards, former President Biden Treasury official, join 'Squawk Box' to discuss the debate over a potential wealth tax, whether the wealthy in the U.S. should pay their fair share in taxes, whether IRS funding cuts should be tied to any potential aid package for Israel and Ukraine, and more.
She seemed nice. The Road to hell is paved in good intentions. Government just wastes money. Flat tax and get rid of IRS.
It’s good to have an actual discussion with two people from opposite sides of a real issue!
I don't think we need a "side" of moronic thinking being represented by a young lady.
@@arthouston7361 better to debate it in public than leave 2 sides to exist separately in sealed bubbles, never talking to one another and growing ever more angry in their polarization
@@matthewrobinson2172 I think in order to qualify for being a “side,” you have to have some level of fact and integrity. Otherwise you’re just somebody occupying space on a screen.
wealth tax makes no sense to me, what if you own house that used to cost 400k now government prints bunch of money and house price goes to 600k. Now you have to pay like 20k taxes because your house went up in value. What if you don't have 20k? Now you have to sell something or go to jail for avoiding taxes. Basically government can then legally force everybody to sell their assets by printing money
I think wealth tax on homes where you live make no sense or indeed for people with wealth below what might be considered seriously wealthy. The idea of a wealth tax seems a bit like Henry George’s single tax on property . The idea that you incentivize people to make use of their wealth by making it productive. If you tax wealth at say 1% per year there is an incentive to make sure the wealth is invested productively rather than left idle, say in the form of gold or antiques. As with all taxes the difficulty is in assessing wealth and making people - with access to resources well geared for avoiding tax - pay.
336 million Americans, 72 million are kids, 264 million are adults, 130 million are taxpayers, 134 million get government for free. She's right, it's not half. It's 50.7%. Roughly of course.
How about the government spending less as a starter?
Mulvaney won that. Kitty comparing apples to oranges. But yes, if you use your unrealized gains on assets to get loans, there should be a tax.
More tax is a great incentive to drive all wealth out of the country.
Exactly, but these radical left-wing lunatics don't change their ways and continue to drive this country down a ditch.
They aren’t going anywhere
And go where? To Germany
And go where? China? Europe? They’ll tax way more of it.
There are plenty of tax havens for 7 figure individuals but it costs money to move there. Europe and China are silly examples, think more about Carribean havens where you are granted a citizenship for a real estate purchase and then have zero capital gains tax. When taxes in the States reach a certain point for the wealthy, they will spend money to save more money and move to these havens. They aren't going to sit around and get screwed when they have the means to adjust. Then most of the burden falls down the ladder to the middle class. I think its best to keep taxes reasonable for the wealthy so they remain in the states and help generate more overall tax revenue. Thats the logic but its really more of a social issue I think. All of us are naturally envious and we just don't like the idea of someone having more than us so we want to punish them for it. That seems to be the deeper issue. But when people think like this and vote for legislation that does so they do more damage to the country IMO as per the description above. The issue is much more complex than this and the wealth gap is a serious indicator of previous nations destabilizing, but maybe my example from the other perspective combine with your thoughts brings us all closer to the center for a more healthy and much needed solution. @@justamaninTN
Another Affirmative Action hire. Please give us Competence and Merit. This will help the country greatly
I love when she says “The American People Understand”, as if they all got in a room and came to a decision. There is no such thing as the “American People” in the sense that all 400million of them think the same thing.
“The American People Understand” , who are they? A bit hypocritic
She read the talking points to a T.
The Revolution was fought over "no taxation without representation". Today, the reverse is true. We have representation without taxation.
you are delusional. public spending is full of spending for the public good. Show someone who is not taxed, except maybe half of Americans.
Kitty acquitted her herself exceptionally here. If regressives are serious about debt then they should be giving full throated endorsements for investing more in IRS staffing and tax code reforms. We've let billionaire class run roughshod over us for far too long. We're not envious, we're furious that they're suppressing wages, busting unions and not paying their fair share. Tax code must be just but be nimble enough to keep up with efforts to circumvent the system.
You're delusional and Kitty is a lawyer attempting to promote a 'legal argument' for a supposed economic problem on false pretenses, spurious correlations, and intellectually dishonest math, that she doesn't appear to understand herself. The day Americans want to pay $3000 for an iphone and $9 for a coffee at Starbucks, then companies will stop outsourcing jobs overseas, then the middle class won't be hollowed out.
Kitty is a bit of a commie at first glance
I am very fortunate to be well off (8 digit net worth) and it really upsets me to hear guys like Mick complaining about how 50% of people don't pay taxes. I'm sorry but I take pride in knowing that my tax payments pay for services that others can't afford. 50% of people don't pay taxes because they are barely able to eek out an existence as is. They can't afford to pay taxes. Also, do those 50% of people not pay sales taxes? If they pay rent the landlord uses their rent money to pay property taxes. Stop shaming the 50% of people that can't afford to pay federal income taxes because many of those people make our lives so much better and they deserve respect. I hope money doesn't turn me into a blood sucking vampire like Mick Mulvaney. What a creep.
Sounds like you think you pay your fair share. Not sure Elizabeth Warren agrees. Also we know that everyone pays other taxes. However the topic was FEDERAL taxes, not all the other ones.
I wouldn't mind paying 24% marginal federal income tax if I received services for it and I knew everybody including the rich were paying it. But that's not how we do it here
Unless that 24% is gonna cover your housing costs there is virtually no basket of services provided by the state that could ever equal the value of 24% of your income.
And 24% is marginal, effective rate is 15% so def would be worth it
@@edilee5909 the total tax burden though, including all levels of government, is 35%. And considering the indirect costs of money-printing and gov borrowing, there’s a good case to be made that the real burden is spending, which would put the cost then at about 42% I believe, effectively the amount of money we were spending during the world wars. It’s gotten way out of control.
@@Cotswolds1913 Idk how to calculate that burden but I agree spending is obviously a problem with $2 trillion/yr deficit. When compared to Europe overall, we offer very little public services and spend outrageously on military, while taxing the wealthy very little and the average worker a bit less.
@@edilee5909 Ofc it will vary from one European country to another, but the bigger difference in how the two continents tax is actually moreso on the ordinary earner/household. The wealthy here pay a more similar proportion to Europe than do workers. You’re right about services, but I would submit to you a big reason why that is is bcuz we sunk all our infrastructure costs into car-dependent wastelands. The suburbs in America with their endless expanse of ultra low density housing (which is enforced by law; enormous lot size requirements, set-back requirements, very large street requirements in residential areas, etc) meant that ever more pavement, electric lines, sewage & so forth, had to be layed, so effectively the services you would see in a European city all went to Suburbia, creating an isolated, anti-social, discombobulated blob of people with no sense of community, who can’t go anywhere outside their home except in their car & thus no life-oriented exercise, that saddles our healthcare system with the most unhealthy populace in the developed world. And ofc then there’s the military.
He’s right.
Avoiding taxes is the favorite American sport, no matter what stratum you’re in. Nobody wants to,pay for anything and the federal government can print all the dough we need so why worry? (actually, we really don’t need to actually print very much - just post it to our accounts).
Why do they always ask, "do the rich pay their share"? The ones that don't pay their share are the poor. Usually they don't pay any share, they take without contribution.
It’s so many logical problems with this woman argument that is almost no point to argue it.
The top 1% pays about 40% of the Federal income taxes…. Maybe we should audit the government and find out where the money actually went
We never should have taxed income in the first place, we should have taxed property/assets right from the beginning (1913).
That's insane. It literally means ownership of assets has decaying value and would cause a massive deflationary panic and higher inflation long-term for things that are consumed like food or gasoline.
@@imtryinghere1 That argument doesn’t seem to match reality. We’ve already had property taxes in this country for generations.
The problem here is not the government needing more money. The problem is government doesn't know how to spend it. If you have a child with bad spending habits do you think giving the kid more money will fix that?!?!?!
This reporter tend to ask tough questions on contravertial topics like Bitcoin. How about plan on 'cutting down' on spending and addressing the debt ?
Why is Mulvaney ever a guest? He hitched his wagon to 45. Enough said on credibility and who he actually represents…corporations and the rich. She called out his ass and his lies. Brava!
he used facts, she used emotion. typical right wing vs left wing argument.
It's not constitutional. Debate is a waste of time. Article I, Section 9, Clause 4: "No Capitation, or other direct, Tax shall be laid, unless in Proportion to the Census or enumeration herein before directed to be taken."
remove all income tax and add a little more to consumption tax on non essential goods. that will hit people who consume more while not detering work/productivity
Her argument wins!
That lady has no clue how the tax system works, no matter how adamant she is with her beliefs. The VAST majority of taxes are truly paid just by a small percentage of the population.
no they are not.
How? In 2019 Bezos got a 129 million dollar tax refund and paid no tax. They are not paying. You have no idea how many deduction they use to shrink their taxable income. Learn something about the tax code before regurgitating republic talking points.
@@Bradgilliswhammyman yes they are. cry about it. the poor pay no taxes, even most of the middle class pays very little towards the tax revenue. its the upper and upper middle class that carry the tax burden of this country. we need to lower taxes on the wealthy (they are the ones who create jobs and sustain the economy) and increase taxes on the poor (they are the ones who unfairly benefit from services that they dont pay for). its as simple as that. theres no denying this.
She is also condescending and pompous in her demeanor. Humble is not a word that would ever be used to describe Kitty. At some point, she came to believe that she is fabulous and smarter than everyone else in the room and she sadly and clearly believes that to be true.
Miss Kitty was all indignation and thin on facts. About everything she said was either slanted or just plain wrong. The “rich” already pay most of the federal taxes in this country and about half the population pays nothing at all.
Flat tax is fair and get rid of all the deductions.
What administration and party put in place the current tax breaks for the wealthy in 2017?
For those of you that have been around long enough you will recall that the reason why stock options began to be granted in such fast quantities was because the government decided to penalize companies who paid executives over $1 million a year. Talk about unintended consequences.
if you want a fair tax, then you're talking about a flat tax....
what about a minimum tax?
@@Jake-pf4kv we already have the Alternative Minimum Tax.
@@lakeguy65616 in terms of income tax, billionaires rely on unrealised gains
@@lakeguy65616 Problem with a flat tax is it’s usually based on income taxation, which is the most damaging form of tax to an economy. Land value taxes, consumption taxes, excise taxes, inheritance taxes, tariffs, any combination of these is much more efficient at not discouraging productive activity, than an income tax.
This likely would never pass but I would institute a 20% flat tax on income, the first 25k would not be subject to the tax, and then I would eliminate all deductions. Everyone would pay the same %, and the lowest earners would not pay.
This is actually a really good idea. So for married couples it would be 50k.
lower earners still don't pay cause they get their money from tax refund. Current tax is ok but you need a way to tax the wealthy when they have the loophole where they can borrow against their stock assets. Flat tax doesn't work because people who make less pay the most.
@@davel4143close the loop hole then. Sounds simple enough. You shouldn’t be able to borrow against and unstable asset anyway
Lowest earners need some skin in the game. Set the flat tax at 15% and subject all income to it.
As a UHNWI, I think both sides have valid points. I think if we can have a mature bipartisan discussion that reasonable solutions can be found and incorporated. I don't agree on a wealth tax. Not every wealthy person plays borrowing games or other games to avoid taxes . I pay the sand tax rate as others. But don't tax me a wealth tax on top of what I pay.
shes absolutely wrong.
100 percent right, Goooo Kitty!!! Also, whomever disagrees should get their taxes looked😊 over by the IRS.
Whoever agrees with her needs to have their citizenship and immigration status reversed.
I file them with the IRS every year, no problem. I have nothing to hide. It’s all on my W2 and I give them my 1099b’s from my investment accounts, too.
Tax, tax….spend, spend. More big government
I think any kind of "wealth tax" is incorporated in taxing the loans into those specific loans. Though should incorporate incentives (deductions) on investments. At the same time personal income taxes, based on growth in the economy. Would raise the threshold and bracket upward. Ie 14k threshold would be raised to 15 year 1 16 year 2. Brackets from say 15 to 23 a x % to 16 to 24% on x%. While balancing the budget. It can be done, if done in incriminates. Current philosophy is cut and grow into the cuts instead of as the economy grows.
If only the little girl knew what she was talking about!
She was honestly mixing things up left and right,
property tax isnt an IRS issue.
How about defunding the IRS. I would begin there.
Let’s try it and see if it works
No such thing as gimmicks...it is called tax law.
What about the underground economy who get paid cash?! Really .. the elephant in the room.
yea, the strippers aren't paying their fair share! That'll fix this
Wow shes amazing. Thats truly the most attratcive thing i"ve ever heard.
This chic has swallowed a big Blue Pill. A product of our liberal educational system.
3:39 bravo
Flat Tax 10% done everyone is in the game
Former treasury official is smart and on point. Just don’t like the ‘excuse me’ righteousness.
I got nothing out of that debate... I do like pay fors.. 🙂
@who decides what is fair share? and is taxing rich more to bring them down or bring up the poor? California is a classic example were higher taxes didn't benefit the people much than low taxed states. San Francisco budget is 14 Billion plus but still struggles for money for many things... A similar size city like Denver... the budget is 4 Billion and still manages...
1% tax on each party in any asset transfer.
One of the problems with our tax code, a small number of people pay the vast majority of taxes. So roughly 50% of Americans don't pay Federal Income Tax. Because they don't pay taxes, they don't care how much money the federal government wastes. Everyone should pay taxes. Then everyone would have "skin in the game" and they would care more about how their tax dollars are spent/wasted.
They are poor and students
@@teebone2157 some but they are far from the majority of people who don't pay federal income tax.
@@teebone2157and retirees
@@teebone2157 50% of american adults are not poor or students.
If I'm going to pay tax on borrowed money (e.g. credit cards, pay day advances, 401K loans, HELOC, etc.) I shouldn't be charged an interest rate as well...................................
woooooo she was waiting for a while to say something and then let the hammer go on that guy
Everything that woman said is either incorrect or seriously stretched to fit her points
Riiight…let’s force every ceo to sell a certain percentage of their shares every year so that the stock market crashes annually!
There was no debate over the use of QE which made asset holders a lot richer compared with non asset holders for no effort or skill. The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away; so far we haven't had the later bit.
Both of these people are too emotionally invested to deal with this topic our representatives.
Wow she torched him at the end 😂
Seemed kinda desperate to me.
He brought facts and she brought emotions. One plays to people interested in a serious discussion and one to dumb people. Unfortunately America has a lot of dumb people.
The reason why half do not pay any income tax is not because they aren't taxed, but because of tax deductions and credits that lower their tax liability and might result in a refund. However, Mulvaney knows that and it is just simply dishonest. Tax deductions and credits are just as much spend as the national parks and the department of defense from the perspective of the Treasury Department. Every person that gets a pay check sees the amount of federal taxes withheld, so I have no idea where this impression that *half* of the population gets to pay nothing.
Mulvaney is not being dishonest at all. When you either (1) don't earn enough to pay income tax, or (2) get deductions or credits so that all money withheld from your paycheck is refunded, then by definition after all the calculations, these people have not paid anything towards Federal income tax. And that describes nearly the bottom 50%. That part of what Mulvaney says is true. The one part that most people forget however is that NO ONE escapes paying social security tax which is technically different than income tax. And even if the bottom 50% don't pay much at all to the feds, they still have property tax (whether they own or it's part of the rent), and state income and sales taxes (most states). So the bottom 50% do pay something in taxes somewhere. But for the federal budget, it's actually the top 1% that pays about 40% of the tab. The top 10% pays about 70% of the federal tab. That bottom 50% pays less than 4% of the federal govt cost.
Rich folks borrowed against their assets for use as income because interest rates were 0% in real terms. Maybe the issue was that 0% real interest rates were the thing causing distortion and unfairness.
That is certainly part of it. Margin interest today is above 10% (maybe as high as 13%). Someone like Elon would be better off selling stock and eating the cap gain if he intends to have the outstanding loan more that 2 years. That interest he pays is picked up as revenue by the lender who then has to pay corporate tax. BTW, margin interest is deductible but securities LOC are not (securities based LOC has a lower interest rate but that money can not be used to purchase other securities).
Flat tax is the way ❤
So if every $ we put in the irs generates more money why don’t we just put infinite money into the irs?
Why are we even entertaining the idea of Mick Mulvaney giving a balanced view on anything considering his allegiance to the federalist society and service under Trump? I'd rather have a CPA give their two cents
Because he's correct, that why!!!
Don't tax ordinary income until $51,000.01 and tax all investment income at 25%, get rid of most corporate deductions and deductions for loans against investments excluding your primary home. That would flip the script in a heartbeat. Those at the lower end would benefit and those at the top would pay their fair share.
They would reduce their investments since other countries would out compete the USA, also the government is going to waste all that money that's being removed from the private system.
Why exclude the primary home? If that is done, there needs to be an equivalent lack of taxes on investments equivalent to the value of a home for renters.
@@supermash1 why would renters need an equivalent deduction? They’re not getting one now.
@@celdur4635 USA environment and infrastructure trumps all other countries when it comes to investing. Investors (of which I’m one) get a whole lot and pay next to nothing.
Is it not obvious? Mortgage payers are getting a tax deduction. Why should renters not be getting one? And why allow exemption from capital gains taxes on houses? Why shouldn't renters be allowed exemption from capital gains on an investment amount equivalent to the value of a house?One group of people is being privileged while the other is being punished.@@spatty2589
Rich people monopoly on CNBC has to stop. Good on this lady for push back because the hosts always let these liers ramble on lying.
there needs to be a minimum tax!!!!!!!!!!!
Yes!! Set at 0%!!!
I have ZERO confidence in how the government would use the money they would raise. Better the billionaires keep it, invest it or expend it, buy products / services, etc.
FJB and the DNC....
Of course they play music and cut to commercial when she speaks truth to power
This woman is unhinged.
Mulvaney and magical thinking (being charitable)
Please no more pearl-clutching Karen’s who are *gasp* SO OFFENDED on the show.
Or fundamentally change the voting system with votes weighted by how much tax you pay. Someone who pays a great deal in taxes should have their votes mean more than someone who pays no taxes. If we must have a progressive tax system, then we should weighted voting. The people who pay the taxes should have a much greater say in who gets elected. We currently have the worst system, people (50 of voting age) who pay little to no taxes determine the outcome of too many elections.
The solution is to eliminate income tax for those earning under $100,000. Then figure out how to tax those making more than that to pay for the government. If you just increase some taxes and give to the government they will spend it on something we don't need and because their revenue increased they justify in their brains that they can borrow more because they can afford to.
You’re describing a progressive tax, which is how it SHOULD work
Does Mulvaney look like Harry Potter or what?
no, they don't. there is no reason that people that earn in excess of 10 million can't pay significantly more in taxes.
According to Google, 23,456 people in the US made more than $10MM in 2018. I don't think anyone would argue that those 23,456 can and maybe should pay a higher rate. But it doesn't accomplish much. It's not that much money.
its a couple billion dollars, thats a lot of money. @@cozyslor
Hell Kitty!
The tone of the government beurocrats voice in the video removes all of her credibility.
Kitty is too smart for meathead Mulvaney.
She was impressive.
Easy day of work. Mulvaney is dense.@@Everestabc123
Way too late for this
This woman is easily triggered 😂
So he says 50% of ppl don't pay federal taxes? Wait til I say this to the next person who complains about their tax money pay for illegals. Lol
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Massive experiment is too nice a word for what has been allowed to happen in the US economy. It should be, and often already is, criminal but is rarely enforced and almost never discussed as such.
What, exactly, has been done with respect to the economy by legislators that is against the law?
A tax on assets that you use as collateral to another loan is not a good idea. Imagine getting taxed on taking out a mortgage on your home or home equity or refinancing. That’s horrible. Tax the wealthy should be the way to go and give the middle class some tax breaks.
A straight forward wealth tax is a stupid idea. Europe tried this already and walked it back, it's simply too easy to just move wealth out of the country. Now an inheritance tax or a land value tax, that's another matter, worthy of consideration, but the Supreme Court I recall ruled against the Feds using any property-based tax over a century ago. Constitutional amendment could always fix that ofc.
I fully support wealth Tax especially on those who own a house that is more then say $400,000. We need to make the rich and the wealthy pay up. They should have to pay a wealth tax.
Stop being so poor. I can tell you've never taken chances to ever be in that category
here come all the poor people defending the uber wealth of billionaires.
No one wants to pay only take! That’s what makes America 🇺🇸 great! But this new generation most of the people don’t want to work hard just take others hard earn money! Go and live in other countries and see! God bless this great country 🎉!! Spirit of laziness and greed is from the devil! I rebuke it in Jesus name!! 🙏
Mick Mulvaney is right, 50% don't pay federal taxes. Kitty is beating around the bushes.
Part of the 50% are billionaires and millionaires.
That's what happens when you got the 1% holding most of the wealth in the nation. Nobody can afford to pay taxes. Shocked
Want a fair tax system? Take the government's budget, divide it by the number of adults in the country, and that's what each person pays. Can't pay it? You can either renounce your citizenship and go somewhere else, or go to prison.
Dumbest thing I’ve ever heard
No idea how Kitty kept composure, I would have had to laugh in his face.
Go @kittyrichards you give me hope!
The IRS doesn’t need $80 billion….we should take a big chunk of that back.
I can't speak to the amount of money funded to support the IRS, but it makes sense to me that more agents would generate more revenue. That's how businesses generate profits. You pay your employee their salary and get their salary and then some back from the employees productivity. Mick Mulvaney made an interesting point that the intended target(the wealthy) may still avoid paying taxes and small businesses may see higher tax bills. I do think it's flawed in the sense that the tax rate is not changing. The IRS would simply be enforcing the current tax code. People would not see higher taxes, they would simply pay the appropriate amount. You wouldn't see an impact if you are already following the tax code.
What I "see right through" is that she has spent more time with women's studies in college than she did learning how to think. The topic is federal income tax. The topic is not real estate tax, or payroll taxes, or even sales taxes. I am not surprised that she immediately felt she had to introduce a straw man argument. The man in the left is completely correct, that half of Americans don't pay any federal income tax,😮 because the tax service has become a method of distributing benefits to poor Americans in order to keep them to continue to vote for democrats in Washington. You want offensive? That's offensive, missy. If you want tax fairness, then we should all be paying the same rate. I'm picking 10% .....and if the nation can't live with 10% that's too bad.
I don't know about you guys but i pay almost 10k on payroll tax lol thats still a tax. Lol
This lady is COMPLETELY wrong😑
no she isn't Mulvaney is the trickster here.
I hope my taxes don't pay for Kitty's salary. She's acting like a child
what happened to her eyes?