'Clough came into Leeds and ruined the club' | BRIAN CLOUGH VS DON REVIE w/ JOHN GILES
Leeds United legend John Giles discussed the infamous spat between Don Review and Brian Clough on Thursday's Off The Ball.
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Very few people, players or managers were well treated in that era. Bill Nicholson who won the first Double of the twentieth century with Spurs had to sign on at the Labour Exchange the week after he left Spurs.
This is one of the saddest things I’ve ever read
@@markrutter4576 Yeah sadder than the holocaust
The big mistake was the Leeds board appointing Brian Clough. I have a lot of respect for both Clough and Revie, but those 44 days at Leeds were a disaster! HoweverI think few can dispute Revie at Leeds and Clough at Forest were both superb managers.
The simple fact is Revie was a genius manager, a professional who took the game seriously and showed other people up through preparation and dedication, which is why he was disliked. It didn't work for England of course, but he's not the first to fail in that role.
Most managers failed in that role
Thought Giles spoke well. Leeds was a rugby city and he (Revie) made it a football city. Found good players and stuck with them and supported them through thick and thin. Became too close to them and let them dictate training. Big mistake. Let them eat junk food morning noon and night and smoke like chimneys. Leeds won the main title in three different eras with three different managers. The last (91/92) being the most impressive, because nobody expected it!
Great segment
John Giles is such an eloquent and intelligent man. I do think though it's a shame it didn't work out with Clough - I'm sure Leeds would have had the same success with him that he brought to Forest.
I sincerely think Johnny still feels bitter towards Brian Clough to this day.
Giles enjoyed a legal victory v. the David Peace book but Dave Mackay also enjoyed one v. the film version. As a Hollywood lawyer called Fred Leopold used to say, "If you have real people as characters they can have lattes and muffins but they can't say, 'Let's go for a f**k in the bushes'."
Every single team played like Leeds have been accused of playing; the only reason they get so much vitrol is because of the London press at the time who hated Northern teams and wanted a team to pick on. Revie was a fantastic manager, but only for Leeds, which is fine, as it suited him and his personality. Clough needed Peter Taylor to have any success, which is also fine, as it suited him and his personality.
Clough.."We want to win the league but we want to win it better...you can understand that can't you".. Revie.. "Oh you can't win it better".. Clough "Why not"? ..Revie.."We've only lost 4 matches"..Clough.."I only want to lose 3"....When Cloughie won the league with Forrest that's exactly what he did...lost 3 games! Both great managers in different ways...Cloughie was a genius.
Don't forget Clough also said he wanted to win an European cup and he did it with Forest, so it didn't work at Leeds but he got his revenge a few years later... The beauty of football...
@andresgonzalez-ci8gr he did indeed. He knew what he was doing, when he was at Brighton he liked the club and chairman. He knew Brighton were in a bad way financially, he was approached by Leeds and went to them knowing that Brighton could sue Leeds, which they did and won! That put Brighton financially clear! Clough also had his contract paid up after he was sacked. Leeds were then struggling...Clough was a genius and extremely in tune.
@@LordFlashheart.11 oh I didn't know he helped Brighton in that way. Thanks for sharing that!
@andresgonzalez-ci8gr well...Reading between lines, Clough knew what he was doing and I'm not saying that was definitely but if you read the books and watch his interviews then we can make our own mind up. He hated Leeds and how they played. Liverpool at that time were an honest team...Leeds not as much even though they were good. When Clough was sacked by Leeds his remaining 5 years were paid in full...he was financially secure. Then he just sat and waited for the right team...Nottingham Forest cam in.
@@LordFlashheart.11that makes a lot of sense!
With all due respects to Giles he's overreacting a bit. When Clough came to Leeds he certainly upset a lot of the players with his outspoken and often undiplomatic behaviour, but to claim he 'ruined the club' is a bit over the top . Most of the players were coming to the end of their careers but they still managed under Jimmy Armfield's tuelage to get to the 1975 European Cup Final. Hardly the outcome of a 'ruined' club.
Clough never let people settle or become too close. Lots of those players didn't even bother looking at the team sheet on the board because they thought they would automatically be on it! Nobody knows what he would have done with Leeds because he wasn't there long enough. The Leeds players of the day nearly all went on to manage and non of them did anything special. Not one of them.
@@peterh1353 Jack Charlton did quite well and Johnny Giles had his moments
Bremner, Clarke, Cooper, Hunter, Giles, Charlton, Yorath and Cherry all won promotion as managers. I wonder if there’s ever been one team that’s produced that level of managerial success
Poor show from the FA not to attend the funeral
john Giles still cannot get over Brian Clough getting picked and not him
The style which people didn't like was the surrounding and harassing referees!!
Giles def sounds quite bitter and sore in this interview XD And you know it's because Clough had major success after the Leeds job. There's no point dissing Revie because his record proves his success as a manager, it's impossible to ignore. Clough was a better manager, no argument, but Revie was still important for the English game.
Clough didn't win anything once he split with Taylor. If I remember right the team he was managing got relegated.
I watched Leeds once. Against Everton. If I am correct it was Trevor Cherry debut. Leeds won. There was a very strange cold atmosphere in the ground. I remember when Leeds scored there was hardly a clap. Elland Road. Some lads we were with waited outside the changing room to get autographs and certain players just said “f off”
Kevin Keegan and Joe Fagan attended his funeral didn't they? He wasn't totally abandoned.
As did Alex Ferguson , he also attended Billy Bremner's funeral.
Don revie was one of the great mangers shouldn't have took the England job should have stayed at Leeds I think they would have won the European Cup Brian clough was from the same area as Don revie but they didn't get on he went there to destroy Leeds
Clough was also brilliant at winning back to back european cups. The first British manager and probably the last to ever achieve that feat. The problem is he wanted that Revie team out so he could build his own team that reflected his personality. That meant poor old jonny giles getting the boot!! If Leeds went with Clough they would have a European title in there trophy cabinet. Thank god they didn't; instead they went with the players. Phew!!
He wasn't the first, Bob Paisley was.
@@geraldowens3426 your 100% correct. Brian Clough did it the following two seasons after Paisley. Then Paisley did it again next season after Clough. Phenomenal!
@@williammcnamara5190 Paisley had one more time after. Not another double. But he is probably the most underrated managers. We talk of the ol greats from 60s-70s, it seems we can't mention Paisley as we have to only mention one from any one club
Giles was an all-time great but his later years saw him move less-and-less and involve himself less-and-less. At WBA he looked like he was developing rigor mortis!
clough was probably first manager to deliberately get himself sacked🤣🤣🤣 Brian said getting sacked by leeds made him financially secure🤣🤣🤣. the f up was by board hiring him
Mighty LEEDS UTD, GREAT DON REVIE. RIP
If i remember the interview, Clough didn't say (correct me if am wrong) you did not win it well, e said "I wanted to win it better". Not the same
@Jaredpalmer don't need the Damned United. You can get the actual interview on KZhead. Maybe I'll check it out again, but from the actual interview (the one after his dismissal, not b4 appointment), I remember he says to Revie: I wanted to win it better. Revie laughs and says: you can't we only lost 4 games. Clough: Well, I'd try to lose only 3
Clough was the better manger two European Cups.
Yes but only one league title. Revie won two and he won two FAIRS Cups too which you could argue are harder to win because there was more teams in the FAIRS Cup.
@Jaredpalmer both the European Cup and the FAIRS/UEFA Cup had the best teams in Europe competing. But the UEFA Cup 4 or 5 times as many clubs competing. That’s why they extended the European Cup to include more than just the champions and of course change the name to the Champions League 🤔and limited the UEFA Cup, now Europa League to rebalance that so the Champions League is now undisputed as the greatest football competition in Europe but back then, not so much.
Or to use your analogy. Is it harder to beat 5 Man City’s or 20 Liverpool’s?
@@johnwheatley5641 Eg If the European Cup had Barcelona in it, the UEFA Cup had Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid and Seville. Which would you prefer Jared?
Revie had 10 consecutive top four finishes including two titles and five 2nd places. Clough won two titles but can’t touch that consistency, it was beyond him. The league is a far truer and rigorous test of a manager’s quality, sustaining high performance over nine months, year in year out. No luck of the draw, no winning a glamour trophy by beating a Swedish team, no Peter Taylor to prop him up. Just relentless determination to succeed and result after result after result.
He's right Johnny Giles Old big head had a big chip on his shoulders.
And a load of medals in the cabinet. It still amazes that Forest have two European Cups
Revie was a crook and the Leeds Team at that time were dirty - a reputation they still carry. Clough was too large a character and Leeds were a team of large personalities massaged by Revie
John Giles one of the greatest football minds of his generation . Clough was a bully , alcoholic People commenting with a biased anti Irish views . Most successful English manager was Dons time time . Clough was a great manager Revie was a great manager Paisley was a great manager FA didn’t respect these people
You dont say things like that to players the n expect them to play for you end o story
clough did it on purpose surely everyone knows this