Why I stopped buying real estate (and why you should too)
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My takeaway was early in the video...focus on improving the property or properties you have until they're where you want them before buying more real estate. Each property should have some type of improvement plan, which is really an ongoing process, because trend change. I think that makes sense. Focus on the improvements until you're ready to expand.
Unless of course, 2019-2021 happens again, then build your portfolio just like Rob did.
Great to see you back on KZhead Rob. I love the one-take, stream of consciousness type edit (non-edit) style. Do more of these. As far as the strategy you are espousing in this one, I'm with you 100%. I have 8 doors and I've been upgrading them continuiously since the pandemic. My revenues are up on a yoy basis every year and nearly every month on a mom basis over 7 years. I continue to think of things I can do to improve. I hired an interior designer - something you never talk about on this show but for me it has been my best investment along the lines of what you're talking about here - particularly in conjunction with professional photography. I tried it for one unit at first and was so blown away with the uptick that I did all of them. Now I'm focused on outdoor spaces and experiences. No more units, just better units. No additional management overhead, just more revenue from the existing management. No more hassles with STR permits, etc just optimizing what I already have. As of yet, I'm not seeing an end to the potential of this strategy. I'm sure someday I will. Then when I buy another property I'll go all in right from the beginning, confident that all the upfront improvement cost will produce a return. I think you just graduated from a host to a developer. You are developing property to increase your return.
Thank you for this video. Makes a lot of sense to max out your profits with less properties. Less headaches and less debt. I'm not a huge fan of the idea of collecting a mountain of debt to receive a trickle of cash flow. Lately I'm leaning more towards owning rentals free and clear - no more debt and max cash flow.
The honesty is appreciated Rob. We do the best we know until we know better. Market conditions have changed and as you guys have mentioned that business plans need to change with current market conditions and you are doing just so. Cheers!
Absolutely right Rob. I came to same conclusion ... I enclosed a porch and converted to bedroom to drive a 30% increase to the bottom line. Worked so well that my next project is an attic conversion at same property.
Same. I have a rental where I already converted the basement into a 1br while still able to rent the second floor as a 3/2. Now I'm looking at this back yard that I PAY ppl to just cut the yard. and I'm like why don't I add a carriage house unit there and rent the top unit as well as the garage spaces. It would be cheaper doing this than buying a new property.
Attic conversion! Great idea!
Check rules…my husband is an appraiser in Virginia and ceiling must be a certain height to be considered square footage. He recently appraised an 800sqft house and well over half couldn’t be counted in the square footage!!! This rule went into effect a few years ago in our state. So check your rules before converting so you don’t loose out on that square footage when you go to refinance or sell!
One of my favorite videos from you Rob! I would love to see more videos from you analyzing what you're doing at each of your properties and why you decide which option for each property. Seeing the direct reflection in the numbers is very enlightening and reassuring.
You’re right, I would also add that people get sucked into using the business income to support their lifestyle, rather than maintain or upgrade the property. I’ve learned patience in investing, and to take what the market is giving you. Truth is, you can make 15% yield or more on dividend investments now, and do nothing for it. When I was able to finance at 3% and make 50% to 100% cash on cash in real estate, I went all in, but now, people are buying property at zero cash on cash return. Makes no sense.
Excellent presentation, Rob. Thank you for the transparecy, and valid next steps,
This is my favorite KZhead channel. Thanks for adding value every time, Rob!
great video rob, i enjoy the funny editing style videos but please keep making more of these casual/direct uncut style like todays. keep it up love seeing you on BP too
It is interesting. I read some articles showing that in the 1980s when interest rates peaked last, real estate investors found the best ROI by building extensions to their homes to add more rooms or guest houses. This is instead of buying new places in high interest rate environments. If contractor prices continue to get more reasonable then this might be reflecting in what you are preaching here as well.
BEST ADVICE I ever heard! Amazing! Thank you Rob!
Love the information, Rob! Thank you!
Rob has never talked about the inevitable STR killer and that is community pushback. Every city that is plagued by STRs (Coachella valley is the best example) ultimately chooses to ban or limit STRs. The fact is local communities get fed up with homes operating as motels in residential areas. Once locals start pressuring govts to enforce zoning laws, this will truly be the end of STRs. No one wants to live next to an STR.
Hasn’t he said he prefers mid-term rentals? Are those as vulnerable to that kind of pushback?
@@s.flandersStrs are typically 28 days or less (target are vacationers). Mid terms have a different target, typically professionals like traveling nurses (this is very niche group of renters). Rob only mentions pivoting to mid term due to economic slowdown. But the biggest looming threat is community pushback and I’m surprised he had never mentioned it. In the CA desert area of Palm Springs where I live, the resentment is so high nearby cities have voted to ban them in large margins. Neighborhoods have also put rental caps on contracts per year. There also enforcement officers with 24 hour hotlines for noise and parties. 3 strikes and ur license is suspended. All the neighbors know exactly which homes are STRs and they do get banned after violating 3 noise complaints.
Thank you Rob to share your experience as you go, at the end of the day the one who adapts the fastest survives, thank you for sharing, this is gold!!
Thanks for the info, Rob. What you talked about was exactly what I've been thinking with my current STR and the next.
Bro everyone stopped in 2022 you were the only one left 😂
Huh, Care to elaborate on this. Please provide your podcast that showed that you did differently
Now is the time to buy theres no competition. Now is the time to dig heels in and let the her buck
@@cjspencer5396 You area are you in? The prices are the competition.
@@joop912 Montana. Ya I agree I don't see how you could turn a profit with these prices. Bozeman just hit 1 million average single family. Also Montana is very hostile towards STR and Bozeman has gone as far as banning them altogether. I think more towns are going that route
Agreed. Most deals have t penciled for a while.
Enjoyed this, Rob. Good take aways with a genuine feel.
Excellent content Rob. Marks sense for every market condition. Get the full potential for every property first then on to the next if possible. Thanks
good job on the one take, all the info was just as valuable as a cut up version. appreciate this!
Totally agree. We add game rooms and hot tubs to our units in Colorado. They outperform our competition. I’ve been trying to figure out what other types of amenities to add. Sauna, pickleball, mini golf?
This got me thinking. Thank you
Good points here and I appreciate the honest ❤
Good information. Thanks!
Love the approach and love the content. Keep making these "Rob-take" videos!
Productivity! Work in all fields. Great video!👏
Awesome video! One take videos are good. They are low maintenance and feel more down to earth rather than being overly flashy.
Good info thanks!
Love it Rob, well said! I totally agree!
Great Advice, Rob! It absolutely makes sense, squeeze the profit out of the assets that you already own.
Very smart move. Thanks for sharing.
WOW!!! The real Rob is back. Where have you been buddy. Finally some real content.
no more content about how great airbnb is. airbnb jocks done!!!
Hope he stays
Thanks for the video Rob Good stuff
Go Rob! Thanks for the honesty.
Solid transparency! Do you buy all your properties in LLC using DSCR loans?
Rob what program or software do you use to keep track of your properties cash flow and expenses. Great video.
Great video and spot on with what we have found in our business as well. Improve and do more of what’s already working before adding more.
This was a very interesting video. I especially liked the insight into AirBnB. Short term rental acquisition has always been a mystery to me because of ongoing transistion of the investment type as well as ability to exit the property. Your video was very helpful concerning the challenges you have faced in this space.
Rob, you are 100% on the money! We've been investing back into our "Farmstay" for the past two years. We're doing great compared to our competition in Northern AR.
Always good to see your videos, keep it up! Btw, are you currently seeking any thumbnail designer. Can I will share some previous work
Thank you for being transparent! This is a real dose of truth and honesty. Greatly appreciate all you do for this investor community. It’s good to hear how you are pivoting and strategizing as the market changes for your portfolio!
Adaptation is the key to survival. It's great that you recognize the need to pivot.
Your cash on cash comparison (adding amenity vs adding door) is interesting but you’re not considering the long term appreciation of adding another door. Adding an amenity may have a superior ROI in the short term, but adding another door will allow more portfolio appreciation in the long term. This math might be worth considering.
At 40 doors its probably not really an issue. At some point limiting your downside becomes more important. You can always put another loan on the same properties if you really want to leverage more. The extra income will help you qualify for it.
If you’re doing that math, you need to factor in the time value of money too. How much is a five year $100k appreciation worth month on month in today’s money vs the additional monthly revenue you generate and reinvest by optimising your existing portfolio?
That is a good point, but adding amenities can also increase your property's value, therefore increasing, or forcing appreciation further.
Thanks for the suggestions #Robuilt... How about for the test of us with HOA'S and condo/Apts style props.? I heard your photographer ideas... That was a good suggestion.
Rob, thanks for sharing your change in strategy. I'd love to hear more about your shift in feelings on arbitrage. I hope you'll do a video on this.
I’d love a video on this too. I was totally against doing Arbitrage for the first 5 years I was buying properties. I decided to finally try it via mid-term rentals with nurses last year with 2 apartments in a 4-plex. Did ok for the first year and then travel nurses stopped coming. So unfortunately I gave my 30 day notice at the end of February and as soon as my nurse leaves the other unit in May unless something changes I will be giving notice on my other arbitrage unit. It sucks it didn’t work out but I don’t want to start losing money if they stay vacant. At least if I have a bad month with a property I own I’m still building equity in MY property. So no more arbitrage for me. I’ll stick to just buying. And even then I’m doing what Rob’s doing and concentrating on the properties we already have. Especially with the outrages prices and the high interest rates. The STR market and mid-term market have really changed over the past year.
great stuff!
Great shared experience for those who have the patience to hear him out. I definitely agree with this sentiment. Way less work and way more profit
I'm wondering if there is a tipping point in terms of doors, where itt makes more sense to improve what you have rather than buy another door. Does this strategy make sense when you have 1 door? How about 5? Its unlikly that I will double my revenue with an improvement to the one door I own. Its is likely that I will double it woth another door. So where is the point at which it makes sense to stop aquiring doors, and just improve what I already have?
I pulled my money out of the stock market to get into real estate and starting to wonder if I made the right decision. My investment made 20% last year and I didn’t have to lift a finger. This real estate stuff is a lot of hard work!
I've been a professional RE for 15 years and I wish I stayed in the stock market. The juice isn't worth the squeeze.
What material did u do for the court. concrete or asphalt?
Excellent! Wendy and I are on the same track. We are nearly done renovating the main house on one of our glamping properties, a $12k investment. It most likely will earn all of it back by June.
I like the idea of porperty optimization. What about a duplex? Would you add on square footage to lets say a 2br/1ba?
We were planning to rent and then buy property and build ourselves a house this summer. Renting part of a duplex from an elderly couple. They decided they wanted to sell and offered it to us to rent to own for $350k at a reasonable interest rate. We jumped at it. They are basically charging us what they paid for it in 2018. Various websites like Zillow etc put the value over $450k. If we can still buy property and build this duplex could bring in $60k annually on Airbnb.
Totally resonates with me. Thing is, I have fun with real estate when I'm setting it up the way I want, more than just the money. Fun is underrated.
Always good to see your videos, keep it up! 🙋♂️ Btw, are you currently seeking video editors or a thumbnail designer to enhance viewers, retention, or CTR? If yes, May I send you a previous work sample?
This is great information! The past few Airbnb's I've stayed in were so tired looking and dated. I walked into one thinking someone had gone to a yard sale to furnish the place. Also, the wall outlets were loose and the deck (which had a beautiful view of the ocean) was splitting and cracked all over. We had a wonderful stay for the most part, but I left thinking that the owner(s) really didn't care about the place and wishing such a beautiful location was reflected in a beautiful home. The house had terrific bones overall, but the inside left much to be desired. So many opportunities there. Another house, the offsite owner stored his car (under a tarp) in one of the two parking spaces, so we had to park on the street. What?
What were your nightly rates before & after the pickleball and tree house additions? And did your occupancy also go up?
Great video!
Are there any ways to fund a treehouse build on your property without having all the cash upfront? How did your treehouse builds go?
Kia ora Rob, this video is awesome. I totally get what you’re saying and where you’re going with this model. I have 3 bed 1 bath house on a 45,000 square foot R20 zoned property in Hawaii that I’m in the process of subdividing and at the same time I’m adding a ADU to the front lot where the existing house is. I’m doing exactly what you’re describing. The equation is simple, I can owner build a 800 square foot ADU on my land for less than $200k or I can buy another investment property for about $400k, Hawaii prices, and get the same return. No Brainer. I would love to connect with you if at all possible my friend. Nga mihi, Andrew.
Great insight!
Buena idea Rob y información. Es lo yo estoy asiendo con mis casas. Saludo a tus padres. Cuídate…
I'm in the process of buying a property, but I've never ever cared about door count. What I care about leveraging existing assets and NOT overlevering them and building a house of cards. Love your podcast but always feels like the advice is overleveraging which can build a fragile system that if the economy drops, everything you have collapses. I'm building a stable portfolio that brings in stable funds, but won't collapse if we have another COVID event, or 2008 financial crisis. I like what you're saying in this episode. BTW another tactic I have is to take my cash/funds and put them into high yield dividend ETFs that provide enough monthly cash to help pay down my debts, or carry them if times get tough. I call it the circle of life, because it one area has an issue, I have a completely different area to back me up to keep my life going. :)
Really good video, Rob. I’ve been thinking the same thing for the past several months. Wondering what I can do with what I have to increase revenue and occupancy. I still work my W-2 job which pays me really well, raising a family with two small children and still trying to keep up with everything else in life. To your point it’s always a time crunch because so much of my time is spent with work and raising my family to where all of the things you described to just acquire and then kick off a new property is a lot. I do think you’re in a different situation than the best majority of us though. With 40 short term rentals, you probably should pay more attention to your portfolio and optimize it. For those of us with five properties or less, Then I think we still want to scale just a bit more. Again, great video, and it really resonated with me. It is extremely hard to find the balance with running my short term rental business, staying successful in my career, being a husband & father, and staying on top of myfitness.
Finally a kindred soul! That's all I think about - optimizating my income with what I have.
It is very smart to squeeze the last drop out of your portfolio before jumping into another property. It is just hard when we are all engrained with the growing mindset.
Funny you mention this now. I just had a similar realization as to why I don’t leverage what I currently have versus constantly scaling new things.
Rob, I completely agree with your strategy of reinvesting back into your existing portfolio instead of purchasing additional properties. I do long-term rentals only and have been applying the same strategy. As far as investing in more long-term properties, I believe that investers should be ready to forgo msking any money for a year or two, which is ok if you can afford to do that. It takes patience, and the invester will be well rewarded if they can hold for the long term. Thanks for the video.
Loved the video
Do murals or wallpaper add any value? I know they’re not anything major like a pool or a tree house but is it worth adding it?
Yeah I think so!
Where you get that cool lamp in the background?
We're in a pickle like this too. We have a 2/2 cabin that we bought for 469k in Gatlinburg that does ~70k annually. We've kicked around buying another place, 1031ing this one into a 4 bedroom, or just adding 2 more bedrooms to this cabin. Looks like upgrading the cabin we have is probably the cheapest and easiest way forward.
Hey saw your comment…I grew up in Knoxville so ofcourse visited Gatlinburg a lot. I bet your rental does great there. My daughter and I visited the area around Christmas and it was crazy!!! I moved to Virginia and live in Virginia Beach and I would say here, Sandbridge and the Outer Banks are also great investments if/when you decide to pick up more!
I’ve been saving up for an airbnb and note the cities near me have banned it. I really had My heart set in one particular city 😢
What is the name of the photography company you use For your short term rentals. Thank you for your great info.
Eric Barkhurtst! His Instagram is @barkhurststudios.
Such a great watch! The section on understanding cash on cash return in real estate investing for optimal financial gains really got me thinking. For fellow multifamily investors, our channel is packed with invaluable insights and strategies.
I love this❤
Great video
👏👏👏 good job Rob.
Curious what you think about buying condos with a lot of amenities like a condo hotel. Too high HOAs to be profitable?
Thanks for the info! Is it hard to find someone to maintain a hottub? I would think those could be a headache with all the issues???
I had neglected rent increases and was focused on adding. I took a step back and worked on rent increases and things are a lot better. Small portfolio but very healthy
Yupppp 2024 is all about guest experience, amenities, being cost efficient to have extra margin to stay occupied while making those bands
So add pickleball courts, MiniGolf, or tree houses ? How about if those are not options due to location or space ? Any other ideas ?
Better design, better photography, better indoor amenities like game rooms, theater pools, pool tables, foosball tables, shuffleboards, Pac-Man barrel arcade, murals, etc.
I want a tee shirt like yours. I come for the terrific info and insights but then get wowed with the merch. The Restoration Hardware airplane desk has been a fave of mine since it came out. But who is the player and where can I get the shirt. I play guitar ever single day.
I'm so thankful that you made this video, Rob. I've loved your content and the passion you bring to STR investing. Having secured an STR in 2023 that I'm still fixing up today, I'm finding a lot of joy in the DIY contracting my partner and I are putting into this venture. And while I believe in diversifying a portfolio, when I got honest with myself about the life and wealth I want, it doesn't involve many doors. I have unique skills as an artist and hospitality expert that transcend acquisition. I bought in the right market, and if I raise these doors I have to the level of competitive excellence I think they can be, I have no doubt the income will come. It's really the integration and alignment that I'm looking for in investiing... it all syncs with my life goals and natural talents. I'll probably never have a big portfolio, but I don't think I'll need one for the financial freedom I have in mind. Thank you for being an inspiration in this space; you're absolutely phenomenal!
the online community of real estate investing as a whole reminds me of high school popularity clubs. it's become about clout and followers rather than actually helping other investors grow.
Great video.
I love the pickle ball court! How much did your insurance rate increase?
Hi Rob, I'm curious if you've invested in any STRs in Central Florida? Particularly in gated communities, that offer "Hotel Accommodation" amenities? Obviously they get their cut in the range of 25%-40%. Maybe you've invested in something similar in other locations other than Florida. My wife and I are out-of-state from where we are looking to invest. So we felt, since we can't be hands-on personally to do the housekeeping, handyman, property mgt jobs, we felt it necessary to have a facility that does it all-in-one. Than having to look for an outside mgt company to do all the jobs needed to run an Air BnB. Any suggestions on how to do this without losing our shirt and wanting to sell the property after a year? Thanks
My boy here finally realizing the trap of the "more" mindset. It's a trap, it never is enough, bro.
That's very common in any type of business; real estate is no exception. It's an investment philosophy; reinvestment.
Some portion of that revenue increase was because of the Airbnb search algorithm boost that happens when bookings pick up. Basically I mean each future year the return on the pickle ball court will be less than the increase at first couple of months.
Interesting takes and some good info to be found on your channel, thanks. I'm looking in the future to further expand my holdings internationally. Bought a condo in a MX tourist destination that caters to boomers a couple years back to learn the STR business and doing ok with it. The biggest challenge is the area is highly seasonal and drops off a cliff hard to the point of making LTR or seasonal appear equally attractive.(?) Anyway, the seasonal snowbird or retired person LTR market seems underserved internationally with the increasing numbers if people looking to escape political/cost of living issues in the states.
Hey Rob, I don't know if you answer questions in comments, but I'll give it a shot. I'm curious what you would do in this situation: We have a 2 BR/1BA house in Florida that we do STR with. There is an optional HOA in our neighborhood that only costs about $250 a year to join and we would get access to the community pool and fitness center. When we bought the house it was not part of the HOA and I was told that once you join, you can't "unjoin." I'm very leery of HOAs so I haven't joined but I feel like this fits with the kind of thing you are talking about in terms of getting the most money out of existing properties by adding amenities.
Test if your rate would significantly increase by offering the community pool and offsite amenities. I have found that it only increases significantly if it is adjacent (walking distance by teens, etc) or on site (private pool). I'm not usually a fan of HOA's and try to avoid them but I do own some properties in the Gatlinburg area with HOA amenities.
I like your lightbulb lamp.
Maximizing doors was a good objective when financing was super cheap. Most important overall though is how much time the income will cost the investor on a recurring basis. That will be the ceiling of scalability until you employ good help. I don't pay much attention to gross income because I don't think of it as income until the expenses are deducted. Otherwise, like door count, it can introduce extraneous emotions to my decision making
One of the advocates for getting more units instead of increasing margins for your existing properties, is risk diversification. If you have 200 units making $300/month, having a few units being down for maintenance or other issues wont impact your revenue as much as having 60 doors making $10,000/month and then having a few units being down for maintenance. There's a balancing point of course, but I agree that solely focusing on quantity over increasing return on existing properties is not the ideal route, especially since it costs a lot of overhead and time to source new opportunities than just increasing margins on existing properties.
What is good advice you can give for a new client at this interest rate 😊
"Everybody has a plan, until they get punched in the face." -Mike Tyson
We all know that real estate is an amazing way to create wealth, but we all need to also understand that there is no quick way to become millionaires. Everyone is looking for that easy and quick way. It is very disappointing and sad to see how people want to "SELL their own strategy" for THOUSANDS of dollars, honestly that is not right. So many people in despair falls for this MASTER CLASSES......It is just SAD :(. I love videos like this, you are sharing something that is working for you, and may help other people. My husband and I, for example, have been adding a few amenities to our portfolio for a few months now and it has helped us to increase revenue :)