Even a Numbskull Like Me Can Learn to Fly a Gyroplane
2020 ж. 11 Жел.
341 968 Рет қаралды
It's a gyroplane, not a gyrocopter and it's nothing at all like a helicopter. In this video, AVweb's Paul Bertorelli explains what's involved in getting a gyroplane add-on rating or even starting from scratch. Whatever the hell you call them, gyroplanes are a ton of fun to fly.
This video was shot at Blades Over Me in Sebastia, Florida last winter, before the COVID-19 pandemic.
Thanks Paul, another AVweb classic! Am I the only one who was wondering if the geese would fly into the rotor on the animation?
I've hit one bird with the rotor on takeoff. We saw it on the runway when landing and thought it had been hit by a recently departing jet but found the remains on the rotor blade. Fortunately it was a small one. I've dodged a couple larger ones when practicing maneuvers.
@@stevecrawford8645 11111
i know I'm kinda off topic but does anybody know of a good place to stream newly released tv shows online?
@Curtis Jude Definitely, been using Flixzone for since march myself :D
@Curtis Jude Thanks, I signed up and it seems like they got a lot of movies there :D I appreciate it!!
That's what happens when you park a fixed wing and a helicopter in the same hanger overnight.
LOL. Here's the one I trained/soloed in. Um, the little one. www.flickr.com/photos/stevecrawford/50296258251
Sorry but... *Hangar
Autogyros predate helicopters.
6:00 “Helicopters aren’t for those who can’t walk and chew gum at the same time.” HILARIOUS.
Making the weird, easy to understand, as usual; well done Mr. B.
A ton of research and hours went into making this YT video. From an educational point of view on gyroplanes, this is the best on YT. Congrats to Paul and team 👍
Watch a few first
Always love the way you interject humor into your videos. Thanks Paul :)
The animations crack me up every time!
I've been fascinated with these machines for years! Great information here that is easy to understand even for me.
"Dad, I want to be a doctor" "What? Too good to open a gyroplane school like your old man?!"
Beautiful explanation, and I'm glad nothing bad happened to those cartoon geese. (Your animation team has way too much fun - much to my delight.) Thanks for the great overview.
Great job Paul. One of the best Avweb videos.
What a fantastic video . . . I have been seriously interested in Gyroplanes for many years and do intend to pursue a license and the purchase of a plane. This is the first video I've ever seen that actually gets into the meat and potatoes of the knowledge needed to be successful - excellent, excellent video. Greatly appreciated. I will watch this video dozens of times
Always well done Paul. The animations really helped me to understand the differences from fixed wing!!
To me in the UK it'll always be an 'autogyro'... or, alternately, Little Nellie.
In 7 days to die it will always be a gyrocopter
Little Nellie is like a flying Moto X bike!
This was fascinating. I've learned lots about gyroplanes, and also that there IS an aircraft that has a power off glide angle between that of a Piper Cherokee and a sewing machine. :)
Thanks Paul - Your videos are always extremely informative and helpful
As someone who already holds a PPL rotorcraft, glider, and ASEL, this looks like a lot of fun! The big trick is finding a school near AZ that trains in them.
Dang... that stick vibration would get old fast, it seems. Looks like a lot of fun, though.
Yea, I’m picturing any nut and bolt on the that thing that might vibrate loose and come off “will come off” because that’s what it wants to do, get the hell off that unbalanced washing machine.
Yeah you would think that would be solvable in some way.
@@tropicthndr they are poorly balanced or stringlined. Many are it's hard to get rid of completely but really inexcusable in blades and machines this expensive. Some machines have much better set up blades
@@cameronlapworth2284 this is a training gyro. You can imagine just like in the GA Cessnas they are always 10 hours from their annual.
@@krotchlickmeugh627 indeed but it's not uncommon many of these machines have poorly set up blades. Don't know why people put up with it considering the cost
Thanks for the exposure Paul.. nicely done. 👍
OK, I have never been interested in Gyro's until KZhead recommended I watch a video when the Covid lockdown started. In the last 9 months, I have watched every video I could find as my fascination with these is just crazy. This is hands down the best video to describe what is going on. Great job and excellent video, thanks!
Get an rc one. It will either nip the curiosity in the bud or push it over the edge of buying one.
Thanks for the very clear explanation of the flight dynamics
Great report, love the comparisons! good job!!!!
"I doubt you want to go over 10,000 feet in them" LOL - spoken like a true Floridian (max elevation 345 not including antennas).
A gyroplane provided aerial security for the 2002 Winter Olympics. A large portion of that had to have been at or around 10,000’
@@quincyskis Amelia Earhart reached 18,415 in a Pitcairn gyroplane in 1931. More recent records in the 26-27,000 foot range have been set in Autogyro MTO sport and Magni M16. That's gotta be cold.
@@stevecrawford8645 "World Record for a Gyroplane: 27,556 feet above the ground" by Donatella Ricci is on my reading list!
I went to 11000 ft in my Magni 16, I was in shorts and short sleeve shirt I was freezing!
@@stevecrawford8645 yes Wallis did something like 24 000ft but had to come down due to cold. His flying jacket froze
Again I am watching , enjoying and still learning from this video...
This was very interesting, and a good explanation for us lowly fixed wing folks. Looks like a heck of alot of fun.
In some countries they are legal to drive on roads (if you need to hop to a gas station or a garage, say).
I'm a simple man. I see Paul, I click the video.
8:55 Thank you for "damp", and not "dampen"! As always, P.B. is an exemplar of clarity and humour.
The first day of 7th grade, we learned that our gym teacher would be a no-show because the day before, he dropped 100ft onto the desert floor when the main rotor of his Benson gyrocopter flew away, leaving his to deal with gravity on his own.
Interesting video, thanks! I'd heard of these, and never really looked into them - nice to see under the hood of how they work :)
That vibration looked pretty serious on the sticks!
With Greg Gremminger I was flying my Gyro around 10 hours, it helped that he is a great instructor and that I have a fixed and rotary prívate pilot license with some hours. I would say my Magni flew like a Cessna 172
The goose looking down at the crash made me choke on my coffee. Genius!!!
very cool video man, thanks for this. all new respect for gyroplanes.
Excellent information and video. Thanks.
thanks -- it so different yet cozy
Great video, nice job! FYI on a tiny clarification point: a 2:35 it was said that a fixed-wing pilot seeking to add the cat/class of gyroplane has to take a written test. That is actually only true if you are, say, a private pilot ASEL wanting to upgrade to a commercial (initial) gyroplane. If you're already a commercial pilot, no written test required per 61.63(b)(4).
Welcome to the gyrofamily, Paul. I just added gyroplane to my certificate. The "gyro grin" is real.
It's called an autogyro, autogiro, gyrocopter, gyrodyne, rotaplane. Gyroplane is only the FAA's nomenclature.
Very good. Seems like the perfect craft.
Even I can learn to fly one?! YAY this is wondrous news! 😂
I wish this video showed more aspects of gyro flying, over all great educational video
love the animations :D
these always remind me of the helicopter cap (especially the open ones).
Excellent video. Ever since the Mad Max movies I have been intrigued with gyroplanes. This video explains a lot. Thanks. 👍🏽👍🏽
Thought the same thing! Quite the difference in models, but same principles lol
Oh yes ...as u say i remember now😊I thought it was a regular mini helicopter. i think James Bond had the first Hollywood movie with a gyro which was a WA-116 model .... originally develoved for the ritish army far more than 60 years ago 😊 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wallis_WA-116_Agile#:~:text=The%20Wallis%20WA%2D116%20Agile,film%20You%20Only%20Live%20Twice
Excellent video. The graphic animation explained nicely the uplift, driving and rollin forces (and risks).... do you have a link to specific literature about gyros which is also helpful to prepare for the weitten examen ?
'Little Nellie got a hot reception . . . but she defended her honour with great success'. (Sean Connery's Bond, with a little help from Ken Wallis's flying. Thanks Gents : )
I actually remembered that quote. Yeah, I'm old.
Great upload! Thanks!
Regarding 'walking and chewing gum simultaneously'...😉 _"Helicopters don't really fly. They just vibrate so badly the Earth rejects them."_ -- author Tom Clancy 😊😊😊
Flew one for 10 years had a lot of fun!
did you fly GYROCOPTER or GYROPLANE for 10 years?
remember looking at kits in magaizines in the late `50's & early `60's and of course they were called gyrocopters then with very little instrumentation
Great concepts video
Raul was doing all the dang flying!
Hats off to the animator, who sadly doesn't even get a credit!
amazing flying machine.
The takeoff was interesting because full power was only applied after unsticking. There is a school of thought that says on the ground roll the sticks is moved slightly forwards as the rotor RPM increases. At the same the power is increased to takeoff thrust. This apparently significantly decreases the takeoff performance. I was also slightly concerned that on each take-off and landing there was roll and yaw. I would have though that an instructor could have anticipated these effects and immediately applied a correction before they became apparent, rather like taking off in crosswind with “crossed” controls.
That corrective roll on the first takeoff though... My eyes went wide.
Right to be concerned imo.
Agreed and the landing at the end ……. Looked Hard I’m not sure why they are adding power right before touch down That adds a layer of additional control at a very important moment I would recommend a steady throttle all the way to the ground or none at all
Great video!!
My dad was a high time ATP but never got a chance to fly airlines. He was considering getting type-rated for a gyroplane for doing power line inspection for the local power company.
Really informative video..jam packed👍. One thing I think should be mentioned in all of these (great videos) is there should be more attention drawn to physical on-the-ground easily airborne hazards on take-off and landings.. especially on windy days where a first-analyzed safe landing area has objects blown in from a long distance at the worst possible moment. I'm thinking things like plastic tarps and cardboard etc..even small pebbles on the bigger heavier birds..due to prop wash.
I love the animation.
Bahahaha love your vids! I have ADHD so the flock of geese animation totally distracted me from your narration. I rewound it 3 times until I could stop laughing at the geese and finally got it. Also, yes I’m old or I wouldn’t have used the term rewound. 😂😂
The entire Gyroplane industry should consider rethinking referring to anything related to it that uses the word 'sport'. Realistically this aircraft is the 1100cc VW Bug of the skies. Reliable, excellent handling, cheap with no performance pretensions. What it offers are the panoramic views in flight. The statistics indicate that risky activity close to the ground will eventually trap the 'sports-minded' into something tragic that will merely reduce sales by bringing the plane into disrepute. STOL-ready people need the appropriate plane. For us landing and take-off are disciplined processes that should become boring in their lack of choice. At 55kn and above a couple of hundred feet they are a continual joy. Here in Australia they aren't nearly as common as they should be given our distances and the availability of land. The same is probably true for the mid-West US and northern Canada. BTW Bureaucrats try to kill everything they touch; but that's a long-term problem.
I'm not sure what license categories you have in Australia but in the US, "sport" is one of many ratings (recreational, sport, private, commercial, air transport). Many gyroplane pilots have a sport-pilot rating - myself included because it only required (with training/experience fulfilled) a CFI checkride to add the rating to my private certificate. I plan to upgrade to private but that requires a checkride from an FAA pilot examiner of which there aren't many for gyros and one is only in my area occasionally.
@@stevecrawford8645 I was referring to the marketing side of things Steve. For it is when pilots try to show off or 'go outside the envelope' that can chalk up another statistic. From its inception the gyro has no such pretensions as mentioned before. If asked I would suggest combining the US private, sports and recreational licenses into one (keeping the 'private' tag). Please forgive me, it's my personal gripe about the industry as those unfortunate 'statistics' do a lot to suppressing what it could become. Mainly by inviting in the well-meaning, hand-wringing bureaucrats to bury us in paperwork and timelines. Best of luck on your upgrades. Cheers.
Very thoughtful post. I get it..
Great video, thanks!
Great info! Thanks
Well explained!
Really interesting - loved the graphics too, hilarious! Back in the day a family friend flew them, but they tended to be single seaters back then (no chance of a passenger ride along). Ideal if you've only a small field and a shed, now there's more two seaters, more interest must follow?
Those things always strike me as the smallest powered aircraft you can fly and must be brilliant fun.
They are, especially the open single-seaters. Like flying a motorcycle.
12:27 that dip had me a little paranoid lol
It's good to know. I may try to fly one sometime.
thanks for sharing. Would scare the hell out of me. I will stay with my fixed wing, thank you very much.
This is interesting yet oddly terrifying. When do we go?
That was really interesting....and it cements my non interest in flying them. Besides the extremely high price of admission, they don't carry much weight and have fairly short range, just not my personal cup of tea. Absolutely great job explaining it Paul, I really love it when you make the tough to imagine accessible 👍
They definitely don’t seem like great cross country aircraft… although man it looks like it’d be a riot to buzz around the area for fun on a nice afternoon.
@@lekoman Igor Bensen develops GYROCOPTER just for that purpose , to buzz around the area for fun, not to cross country flys.
@@tadgyro Well, there you go then.
I have zero flight experience but I have become quickly obsessed with gyroplanes.
You see little Timmy, when an airplane and a helicopter love each other very much... 😉
These look like a lot of fun. Kinda makes me want to learn to fly a helicopter tho.
Gyrocopter is also correct name as well, gyroplane been called since 1923. Mr Igor Bensen did came up with gyrocopter name for his unit in 1950s. Both names are good to use.
Damn you must get all the girls.
😆 This generation is not giving up that easy.
@@EsotericOccultist You voiced what a few of us were thinking. Super funny..but I'm enjoying the hell outta this thread. Love the details, the takes, gives, debates..and corrections (the other guy, sorry forget name 👍). It's all gold!👍✌️
When i was i middle school, we lost a student who just got his license fo fly gyroplanes. I believe he was 15. This was near Cocoa/Rockledge Florida in the mid 1990s. Not sure what went wrong, Im guessing age, lack of experience, obviously were factors. Because of this, I always thought gyroplanes were unnecessarily dangerous, watching these videos have changed my mind.b
Pretty good analysis however while there is a small amount of two per rev shake it's small very small and it is possible to remove almost all of it. Many modern machines pay way too little attention to this. Look at enough video of different gyros and you'll see some do much better than others. Two per rev is often absorbed by the mast as I'm teetering hinge choppers like the r22. But it's small if the blades are correctly balanced and stringlinned. Manufactures with sub par blade set ups blame this on 2 per rev.
Looks like fun.
I wear my seatbelt under my arm and around my neck
Gold! 😅
Made in poland?
A lot of extra forward body on this one.
Cause of death would be specifically from the safety restraints. Ewwww
Awesome video! My wife is fine if I get one of these with the agreement that I get a very large life insurance policy...😎
I fly a Magni gyro simply because I think it’s more fun than the typical general aviation fixed wing.
Does it vibrate as bad as this one?
@@krotchlickmeugh627 All gyros vibrate because of rotor teetering. After a little while you hardly notice it.
@@syramento Really? I couldn't get over the amount of literal shudder movement in that left A pillar. Or maybe it was a previous video I watched. And a few vids back there was a yellow machine, can't think of name. It looked much easier to fly than this, and the guy even commented that he likes to "tune" as much imbalance out as he can. Spends wrenching time with that goal. And he must know what he was doing cuz it had very very little stick movement. Plus..as for looking easier to fly...mighta been purely all pilot. Seemed like a great unit. If I find it again I'll mention. Not to compete against this one, but just for interest sake. This one too may be able to be massaged a bit.
What airport is that
But where did the Velocity U video go? 🥺
The regulators KNOW these are safe and easy, so they'll try everything possible to keep you from the sky.
Ahhh I always wondered what Danni Deveto did after movies 🎥
That was totally awesome! I always wanted to know more about, Gyro planes. You see. My dad became a private pilot of fixed wing Piper aircraft. And starting at 13 years of age. I also learned how to fly. By the time I was 15 I could have soloed. But my folks got divorced. And I never flew an airplane again. I tried to join the US Air Force when I was 18 to become a jet fighter pilot. But you needed a Masters degree. And I was a high school dropout with nothing more than a GED. So there would be no, jet fighter pilot career for me. Good thing I was already an engineer. To have something to fall back on. Without crashing and burning and death. And since I have been flying motorcycles. Since 1979. I arty know how to bank and yaw and go airborne. Which I didn't like doing on my motorcycle too often. Usually that was inadvertent. Like a gust of wind or windshear. Or, you blow a rear tire at 60+ miles per hour in heavy highway traffic. And usually you will die. I don't know how I managed to keep it under control and make it to the shoulder? The tow truck driver said that was a miracle. I said I'm a good pilot. And I wasn't trying to force the motorcycle to my control. I was just letting the motorcycle guide me as to where it wanted to go. And was able to keep it under control without going down. Which is usually the case. When you blow your rear tire on a motorcycle. Apparently. I never found out firsthand. Because I didn't go down I kept it upright. And the tow truck driver thought that must've been some really great maneuvering skills. In heavy traffic going 60+ miles an hour across three lanes. I managed to avoid them. They all managed, to avoid me. It was amazing! I can imagine what they were thinking? I was thinking I was going to die. Nope! I would live to ride another day. Tomorrow. And for 20 more years after that. I couldn't fly anymore if I wanted to. I would be 4F. I had brain surgery 15 years ago. And I have a hole in my head. Maybe that's why I learned how to fly, ride motorcycles and record rock 'n' roll? Ya think? I sure can't. And the doctors don't know how I'm doing it? So neither would a flight surgeon. And so I won't kiss my ass goodbye just yet. And though I must say. The video is great. And with my observations. Watching you guys both. While you can fly slow or at 65-75 mph. It doesn't look like it's as smooth a ride as when I was flying the Piper Cherokee 140, 180's and an, Arrow, just one time. And really cool it had retractable gear. So after not flying for 30 years. I also found myself, contracted drug video camera. As I am in NBC-TV engineering broadcast professional. Also taking on freelance work here and there. And for seven years running. At one of the big DC hotels. They have held the Air Force Association Convention's. And as one of the contracted media professionals. I was able to wander the convention room floor. Where military brass and foreign dignitaries from other countries. Could choose a McDonnell Douglas, General Dynamics, Lockheed, Boeing, jet airplanes of all sorts to purchase. Except for the F-117 and B-2 bombers. And the just entering service, Lockheed F-22 fighter. And here was Boeing. Debuting the brand-new cockpit for the F-22. The F-22 would be supplied with. And not the original one from Lockheed. Go figure? But. They had this $12 million simulator or something like that. And I was watching some American fighter pilots trying out that new Boeing cockpit for the Lockheed F-22. And it really looked like you had to know what you were doing to fly that incredible bird of prey. So at the end of the day of this weeklong convention I was covering. I asked the Boeing guy if I could try that F-22 simulator? And he asked me if I had flown, F-14's, 15's or 16's? I said no. Nothing like that. Just a Piper Cherokee 140 mostly.. When I was a young teenager. And he said okey-doke. And started to point out things to me in the glass cockpit. But before it came out of his mouth. As he began to point.. I would just be calling things out one step ahead of him. And then he asked me again about the 14s or 16's. And I'm like, nope. Not even close. Single engine four-cylinder prop. 30 years ago. So this thing was awesome. And then one of the six, $1 million plus Silicon Graphics computers with the preprogrammed flight plan, glitched. And that got the Boeing guy, quite concerned, quite alarmed. And said they hadn't had that problem flying this simulation the past 4 days. So apparently I caught something? Which she was very concerned about. And I over flew the target. When he asked me what I wanted to do? Since I was only flying straight and level. I said, well I over flew that target. I'd like to go back and take it out. He said he would have to switch off the bat computer to put me into full manual flight. I said sure. He said okey-dokey. So I put the thing into a steep bank to do a U-turn. About 70°. When he said you can go further. And I went to 90°. But I was losing airspeed. So I shoved the throttles up equally. But I was still losing airspeed. When he told me to push them further. I told him, they stopped. He said push harder. And I did. Then the sound changed the gauges all went screwy and I was like what's this? He said afterburner. You're in afterburner. I didn't know it had afterburner. I had heard about its supersonic, Super cruise without afterburner. I didn't know it also had, afterburner.-Oh my God. You really have to be a fast thinker.. I was about 45 years old. And I leveled out and took it out of afterburner. What a rush. I was able to double back and take out that overflown target. And I came to the end of the simulation. What a thrill! I was in the real cockpit. This was not a videogame. This was not Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020. This was the multimillion dollar real deal. And oh my goodness. I didn't know that I could fly twin engine supersonic glass cockpit jet fighters? Without training. And when I got out of the cockpit. This Boeing guy shook my hand and congratulated me. And I turn around.. Only to be met. By about five American military fighter pilots officers. That were watching me. And they asked me. If I had flown, 14, 15's or 16's? I said never, ever. They asked me why I didn't join the Air Force? I said I tried. They said you missed your calling. I said no. The U.S. Air Force missed a great pilot. And I went on to garner 4 major music award nominations. And so I have been flying sophisticated cockpits a.k.a. Control Rooms for over 50 years now. From little civilian consumer studios. Two huge multimillion dollar major airline Recording Studios. If you follow? My control room has always looked like a 747 cockpit. A plane is just another control room to me. With less knobs and dials. Actually less! So flying twin-engine, glass cockpit, fly by wire, supersonic jet fighters, no big deal. For an actual engineer. To grasp the concept of. It's kind of all the same shit. Just faster. But hey nobody realizes this. I had been breaking the sound barrier and going at the speed of light. For over 50 years. And a plane that only goes 1500 mph-2100 mph. You just can't get all that excited about. That's so slow. I do a minimum of 750 mph at sea level. Every day. I mean I'm going at 1100 ft./s! Every day. And so a supersonic jet fighter only goes a little bit faster than that. I had a great nearly hour-long private social conversation with Buzz Aldrin 20 years ago. What an incredible thrill! Now there is a pilot! Oh my God what a pilot! And would take it to the limit like Chuck Yeager.. What incredible heroes these Americans be! And such an honor for me to have met Buzz Aldrin. Oh my God! And then also Sir George Martin. Another God of mine. I don't think I should be flying anymore. RemyRAD
Interesting!
I think you wudda had to have flown right outta your mother's womb, man! Regs, welfare and society in general are always positioned to the lowest common denominator. Not everyone is easy to slot. Their loss man..fly safe..so-to-speak.. Oh..your rear flat on the bike? Me thinks it had to be tubeless. Tubeless tires on bikes is safest transformation of tech since disc brakes..👍✌️
What took you so long ? I first flew a gyro back in 1986.
Greens Niiiiice..👍👍❤️
I am an above knee amputee on my left leg. Do I need use of both legs? Can I modify it to only use my right leg?
Very interesting information. Now is a gyroplane more unforgiving than a fixed wing airplane or a helicopter, having in mind the effects like 'bunting over' or slow speed high pitch take-off's ? Then there are gyroplanes able to do a jump start, jumping into the air from standstill, but are they still subjected to the same slow speed high pitch dangers?
It all just depends on if the flux capacitor is set to warp drive or not. In standard mode it's a little more forgiving which means the pilot has to compensate for the lack of dorsal tension by recalibrating the spin angular momentum of the gyroscopic magnet as opposed to warp drive where the pitch is automatically calibrated by vibrating quartz crystal attached to a hamster on wheel. I hope I was able to clarify and make some of the science behind it a little easier to understand.
All aircraft are unforgiving of being operated improperly. Bunt-over is all but eliminated in modern gyro designs. But pitch up at high airspeed and low rotor RPM and you will crash - so don't do that. Get slow and uncoordinated in a fixed wing and you will stall/spin - don't do that. Fail to detect/correct a vortex ring state in a helicopter and you will crash - don't do that. They are terribly fun to fly but, like anything that flies, you have to respect the characteristics and limitations. I wouldn't classify them as intrinsically better or worse - just different.
I love these planes, but I would rather be inside out of the weather than sitting in it. Nice video. I think you could have made a video of your instruction or a flight in a Gyroplane.
I don't know, but I think it's a bit unsettling that a self-proclaimed 'numbskull' is allowed to fly a heavy chunk of machinery in the airspace above my functioning skull...
Thanks for this great explanation. I got all but something that really confused me is…. Why in the world is necessary to close any door, from the freezer, cars, planes to gyroplanes that hard?????
Actually, the regulation for Private Pilot Gyroplane does NOT stipulate instrument time (as claimed at minute 3). Refer to 14 CFR § 61.109, subsection (d).
Autogyro is a rudimentary helicopter, Ken Wallis would say its a combination hybrid, Geese ?
That was fun
Was the green one built by Bad Chad?
I love em
Brave lad!
I'm pretty sure I saw the inventor of this machine crash during an airshow - that put me off them for life.
Juan de la Cierva died in 1936. Maybe you're thinking of someone else.
@@j_taylor Clearly! I thought it was the guy who designed the "Little... " something for one of the Bond films. They still scare me to death though.
@@marcdraco2189 Little Nellie, in "You Only Live Twice". Ken Wallis designed that particular machine (WA-116), but didn't invent the concept. Ken died at age 97. Unlike Bensen, Wallis didn't sell kits, plans or complete aircraft to the public.
@@richardjenkins4182 Thanks Richard, I guess this is on the Interwebz somewhere but I was working from memory (it's an age thing). I wonder who the hell I saw get squashed horribly when his auto did a 360 on take off then? It's a famous (infamous) accident or it was at the time.