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About Gregor
Suh, dudes? This is my official KZhead channel. I cover Rainbow Six Siege.
Why Rainbow Six Siege maps NEED To Change
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What is weird about plane is that it used to have MORE destructibility. It had more vertical play but Ubisoft removed a lot of it
Really, when did that happen?
@@Nova32x it's been a few years now, worst part is it wasn't even in the patch notes when it happened
Either way plane was and still is a shit idea for a map, its so defender sided it hurts, a map thats just a tube is always gonna suck.
They removed a bit of it about 5 years ago and then when they hid Easter eggs leading to outbreak they nuked almost the whole vertical destructability
Oh how I miss being able to nuke literally every obj but basement's (and the little office towards the front) as Fuze. No map gave him more free picks.
i miss old house for the same reasons you talked abt plane. its a fun, non serious map that should stay because its a completely dif vibe from modern competitive siege. i wouldnt mind them changing other maps like favela or fortress to make them more comp ready even tho i do like them currently as casual, but house and plane were always so different in terms of stupid that its a shame we had to lose old house...
no one had to lose anything, UBI just hates you
I've been playing siege from beta and I miss old house and plane so much. I know they're not the most comp friendly but they're fun and feel closer to the original vision of the game
Real! One thing I dislike about all the reworks is that the maps don't feel like real buildings anymore. They just don't feel right for some reason. On the other hand Coastline, old border, old house, and old clubhouse feel like real places and were so much more fun to play in
The house remake is a tragedy
@@adrianvasquez4351I think new clubhouse still feels relatively real, but other than that, I feel like you’re spot on. All of the new maps just feel disorganized and chaotic mazes with rooms placed randomly
I miss playing hostage on Plane. Rushing up those stairs as Blitz, flashing the guys playing in the president's desk, grabbing the hostage out of the conference room, and sprinting back out to the tarmac before the roamers in the back could rotate to front. Plane was also the only map where it was fun to play against spawnpeekers, because it was balanced out by Glaz being able to snipe through the entire first floor.
"Flashing the guys"
I don’t even remember the last time I’ve played hostage, is it still even in the game?
I think my only issue with new siege maps is the aesthetic department, ever since they started reworking the maps to be better maps they kinda started losing their believability in terms of convinving me that people lived and worked in these spaces. But thats only if you look at the layout and how everything connects, if you don't pay too much attention there are plenty of decorations and set dressing to still give that impress, and more importantly make each room look different from each other. Lair, does not leave me with this impression. it just feels like a shoothouse without wanting you to think its a shoothouse. Deimos is eccentric enough to put 5 identical masks in display cases in a weird empty corner of his office, but not enough to decorate skybridge at all for some reason. Nighthaven has better visual diversity but I still can't believe that people work in that building.
Consulate also does not leave me with the impression that it’s a real building, or Oregon, or the ones you mentioned
@@Vitamin_jp me neither its like ai art for me. If im squinting at it then im like "yeah that looks like a government office" but if you look straight at it then it starts to feel silly
I appreciate the reworks that we get, even the bad ones like Hereford. My only gripe or wish, depending on how you want to look at it, is that I wish the old, classic versions of maps were playable along side their reworks. Either in Quick Match or at least in Arcade.
exactly, back in the day i did sledge meyers on old house, that shit was so fun. and Id like to visit old hereford and even Bartlett uni
I feel like the biggest excuse they give for that is file size, and to an extent I can understand that, but they could also simply add all of the maps to a free DLC package that you can download, and have a mode that uses OG maps, maybe even old school OPs and call it classic mode or something. This way for anyone who doesn't care about that the file size is smaller and more acceptable, but for those who do want it they can make that choice to take up more storage space in order to play those maps.
i like the approach they've been taking with the new maps. emerald and lair both have that old-school siege uniqueness while nighthaven feels like it was made in a lab (pun intended) to be the ideal competitive map. Giving us that mix helps keep a balance between competitive and fun
Labs is ass
emerald is so underrated, me and the boys are always yelling when we finally get it through banning and roll it
Emerald and night haven labs are very good maps and underrated but this new maps lair is dogshite tbh 2f on any other map is easiest to defend but this map 2F sucks in every aspect lighting is dull and similar , no unique designs all rooms looks same with same design and 3 total 90 hallways total mess
@@DocKv yeah the design of the map is honestly so boring. But 2f is definitely good, all of the points where you can attack it from are scary af with long angles from defenders and there's a ton of mira spots. The outside breach is also so cringe if you lose/don't have control of the hallway because you'll just get shot from behind. The east side of the site is so easy to hold cause the only way in is some windows where attackers can get peeked from two angles.
@@hachikuji_mayoi ive not seen such a bad map design for 2f ... Some of the og maps like fortress Tower look better aesthetically and competitively (to hold)
New consulate has gone from a top tier map to an instant ban. They just made a bunch of boxes with no flow. All they had to do is cover the spawn peaks, the layout was fine.
To me consulate needed the kafe treatment. A few tweaks to make it perfect, now I find it’s so different than before, I hate playing it. I miss old consulate now. I also miss old theme park. New theme park is too bright and all the rooms feel boring.
@@benjammin5252this. The new layout feels like a maze and has no logic behind its design
@natewilkes1200 most maps don't and it sucks especially the new ones ie night haven like imagine having to work there the floor layout looks like it was designed by a rat on speed
@@natewilkes1200seriously, the visa stairs being gone, the top floor and 1st floor rooms being way too crowded and new callouts to remember. The exterior wall on top floor, shouldn’t have a hallway it should just be the reinforced wall out of meeting. I kind of miss having 3 reinforcements in garage. Just overall I don’t feel I’m even playing the same map. Kafe just changed a few things and became one of my favorite maps. I think consulate should also have hatch on the roof to get into admin.
i like new theme, old theme sucked
This is literally the exact kind of video I was searching for an hour ago. I really wanted to see if anyone had made like a game-design analysis of Siege's maps (particularly an autopsy on Tower and where it fails) because I find it incredibly interesting to analyze Map Flow and what changes are made and why (for reworks). Like, almost every map rework added a staircase for better flow, or removed some doors or windows to buff a site.
I like Tower as a map, even though it seems to be almost universally reviled. I think if balconies were added to the S/N entries to enable vaulting entry instead of rappelling entry only or if a tunnel entrance was added (maybe into the 1f E walkway under the stairs) then it would be top tier. I think people hate the map because one has to drone their entry because it can be completely treacherous to be caught entering, but all of the leadup to access points are hidden, there are so many entries to choose from (so they can't all be covered), and there are 3 entire stairs to choose from. It seems to be well balanced between attacking and defending even if that balancing is completely opposite the philosophy of the other maps. I guess that means that only people who understand the entire map can really have fun with it but I like it.
@@rileywebb4178 While it is partially a matter of personal taste to me, I can also see the goods and bads of Tower. On the good side; it has a unique entry-point system unlike any other map that makes it essentially impossible to spawnkill. This does also contribute to a negative, but more on that in a bit. For the bad, it is just flat-out too big. The office-side of the map isn't utilized as much as it could (and in my opinion should) be, which is a shame as I find it to actually be quite interesting. Also, the map lacks any soft floors at all, which leads to certain operators being almost obsolete (Fuze, Buck, Ram, Sledge, all those sort of ops that thrive off of soft ceilings). It also has a few spots with weird flow, like the balcony outside bar being a dead-end when it could easily be connected to another spot to improve movement capabilities. The map also struggles from having almost too much soft destruction for walls, with practically every site having too many soft walls to reinforce all the walls (which is unfortunate as most of these walls are critical to keep closed). To touch back on that earlier point of the top-down entry system, while it is unique and it's nice not to see spawnkilling on at least one map, it does also hold back the attack, forcing them to clear the entire 2F to attack the 1f (unless they enter the myriad windows, which is a fair counterpoint I suppose). Unfortunately for the attack, their main avenue of assault is the elevator shaft, which is one of the biggest death-traps in all of R6. The top floor is also incredibly open, and aside from the weird rib-walls by the windows, there's remarkably little cover. Also, this map is almost unplayable on Secure Area, as the 2F Office site is potentially one of the worst Secure Area sites in the entire game (not to mention the main desk has poor Azami collision, but that's just a nitpick and a bug). Now, despite how it may seem, I don't actually hate Tower as much as some other maps in this game. While it's not usually that helpful here, hard-breaching does feel particularly interesting on Tower, and I like doing an extended Gallery Annex hold with Castle for the Gift-Lantern site (with a rotate on Gift-Annex wall). All told, it's not Siege's worst map by any means, it's just got a lot of glaring design flaws holding it back.
@@lazygravy_brookYeah, the most obvious entrance through the elevator is a death trap and the second-most obvious entrance on the rafters can also be a deathtrap to unprepared attackers. I would love a rework that keeps all of the unique charm, aesthetic, and one-of-a-kind layouts with everything else made more playable.
"Autopsy-Of" is a great title imo
@@MegaClogger FR! I wanna see a video from somebody titled "An Autopsy of Tower" and just have them break down that mess of a map
i hear what you're saying. but i'm fuckin sick of all these new maps and reworks turning everything into a damn maze of rooms for what should be a simple layout most of the time
Agree. Coming back to the game after a while, I can't help but feel like every new map or reworked map has just become a maze. Nightbaven is a map that will take me lots of time to learn, and what happened to consulate? They added so many random rooms it's barely the map I remember it being.
What I also hat is that they cut off soo many long lines of sight, Kanal, consulate you can't have many mid range firefights anymore, it's like they need it to only be close range.
con is by far the worst maze
for me it just feels like I'm playing a liminal video game arena and not an actual location
Its kinda funny how close quarters early siege was yet everybody in that era was fiending for acogs
you are killing it lately with the content. thank you!
They rework every map to be fucking massive and a roamers paradise. They need to keep the old maps in rotation as well as the new ones.
Old siege maps used to have so much atmosphere. To me, these new maps are too clean and devoid of character. While they may play better than the old ones. I miss when they felt like real places dirty, gritty and dark. I would love to see this aspect of the map design come back.
Fortress and Tower are better than Lair and Labs
Honestly I like the older maps, consulate rework and lair both just kinda feel like there's walls where there doesn't need to be walls
Agree 100%
I'd say the full reworked lineup of maps was a net positive overall, most of the reworks did objectively good things to strengthen the actual competitiveness of the map, hell, even Hereford, although it is a horrible map to attack even to this day with more tools at attackers' disposal, it does play better than the old Hereford, but then you enter the argument of "yeah, but SHOULD they have changed a legacy map that brings us nostalgia to this failed experiment?" Maybe not. Maybe it should've been in the small rotation with Plane and Yacht to forever be a "museum", as you said, of Siege maps. Speaking of Hereford, I think it could be a pretty good map if they address the main issues of the map, chiefly among them: putting tractor room on the ground floor, how the hell do they have a tractor in the attic? Also, Fortress has always been a good map that received an ungodly amount of hate for reasons I still don't understand to this day. I would 10-to-1 rather be having Fortress in ranked than that one time when they shoehorned stadium into it.
My only issue with fortress is a severe lack of vertical. Yes it does have some. But most first floor sites don't have much vert
Stadium is better than at least 2 of the maps currently in the pool
@@guitarandgames1386 Seems like a very simple fix in a potential rework. Nothing major like Theme Park, simpler like Bank. Although I think part of the charm of Hammam is that it kinda sucks save for the fact you can't play vertically on it, so that's a plus. I never saw the long corridors as a big deal like so many people complained about, it was a very straightforward and easy way of navigating as attackers, with all the sites on the map on their own island in a strange sort of way, but defenders have other means of rotating without having to use them, but it was optional. The new map Lair is much more guilty of what people were mad about on Fortress, the long hallways are not really optional in this one, you get caught out a lot I've noticed.
@ROFLBOB24 true your absolutely right. See I love both fortress and lair. But I still have ptsd from when fortress was in ranked lol. It's a fun casual map tho
@@guitarandgames1386 I'm getting the hang of Lair, but I think the design is fundamentally not very competitive. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.
plane is the most fun map from running out at the very start to trapping your teamates in the room by using rook aromour to lure them in and reinforcing
Despite not being the oldest I think Yacht is a better example than Plane, considering Plane used to have a lot more soft floors that they actually reworked to hard floors about 4 years ago. Server (top floor) had soft floors all over, bedroom had softfloors everywhere too. Some floors still let you shoot through them despite being "solid" and you could still fuze charge through them too until pretty recently.
Really liking these ‘video essay’ type videos on r6, Gregor. Can’t find to much other content like this surrounding this game. Keep up the good work!
it would be neat if we could see the legacy event return or the old maps being part of an arcade mode could call it museum pieces or something like that.
i think a major issue with the maps is that they don’t keep old versions of the maps, not even for custom games. And surely they should allow us to play all the seasonal gamemodes in customs, it feels like they cut so much content from the game.
You sure about maps focusing on longer sightlines? Lair and consulate are built like they belong to a maze runner movie now, and it plays like a maze too.
honestly im starting to like lair, its just the basement that makes no sense to me, similar sized boxy rooms with random ass corners with no thought put into why.
@@zzFlare The thing with lair is that on defense top site is overwhelmingly good and the other too maze like which is both bad for attackers and defenders at times
Honestly, consulate does that annoying thing where tons of windows/doors have walls or screens in front of them to prevent any sort of long angle.
Love the vid, keep it up. Also to mention too I’m glad they put Night Haven in the map pool I saw that it was a decent map and if anything there’s a few spot that need to be touched and maybe try to make the 1st floor less “mazey”, but all in all best new map they’ve released in a while still haven’t played to much of liar so I can’t comment on it. Edit: also to add on to your I don’t know how to make siege maps comment, I would like to know your opinion on a community map maker tool. If it’s even feasible in the engine, which that’s another discusion entirely but do you like the idea or no and what would be your reasons why?
I like every competitively viable map the got reworked. On the other hand, I do not like the reworks to casual maps like House, Hereford, Favela, etc. Those maps should have their old versions playable, since the original and reworks are entirely different maps.
I literally use the exact Castle hold you mentioned on Lair in the server room. I feel validated now lol
I just want Classic Maps to come back every weekend. Start it out with Classic House, put it into Ranked Rotation. The next week Classicn Hereford, etc.
Monaco is a claustrophobic track full of tight corners and no run off areas in case of crashes. Its been around for a long time and is considered a classic. Id say Plane is the Monaco of Siege.
I mean considering that Quali is the most exciting thing for the race weekend at Monaco for like the past 10 years explains it all 😂but ngl the 2023 race was pretty decent for the most part
I think a lot of old school fans of Tom Clancy titles, especially Rainbow Six, are disappointed and that many of these maps don't feel like "real" buildings because they're not, these days most siege maps are just "never happened/no one architects like that" buildings and the esports angle makes them unappealing and feel immersion breaking to fans of old school rainbow games. It has become a game where only winning matters, no one remembers, especially younger fans, of why this game series even existed in the first place. It was always supposed to be about honoring CTUs and players having fun "playing" as a CTU operative. Nowadays you feel like you're being watched by people on their couches as a sporty, unrealistic imitation of Rainbow. It's almost borderline parody at this point...
fortress and tower are real good and beautiful maps
Do whatever you guys want with the maps but leave legacy game mode in with all the maps. Yeee old house was crazy dumb but I had fun. I miss that. Bring it back ?
I still wish I could play the old versions in a custom game
Most Siege maps could be classified as Location SCPs, with how confusing they are. The new map lair had to have been designed by Dr Seuss, or M.C. Escher or something, because god damn, i can't figure out how the hell to navigate it. I swear the layout changes every round or something
They forgot how to do good maps/reworks. Club house and Chalet reworks were peak, now they're quite bad at everything
Yes 100% consulate shoukd be like Kafe
Ubisoft should definitely bring back the old hereford base i never got to play the original aside from the tutorials and that mafia themed event. The reworked hereford is an instant skip for me hell i'd rather play Tower at least thats got some charm
100% its so grim and not at all like it was before the rework
Plane is a bad example for your point about destructibility because Ubisoft removed most of the destructible floors and made them hard in the map around year 3 (memory is hazy). It was a super lame decision. You also make a point that you can usually tell older maps from newer maps by the lack of destruction in older maps, but you forget that the original House was so open and so bad for defenders that the rework added a lot of hard walls and cover. Even Bartlett University (I bet most people here don't remember it) had huge lengths of destructible floors and long sight lines due to destroying walls. I'm not claiming that either of these maps are good maps, but that your points about old map destructibility are invalid.
Yes
Man I haven't seriously played this game in years, but I still watch all the content you make on it. My guy's got some of the best takes in the community, o7.
They need to bring back all the old maps Bartlett uni, yacht, fortress, plane, house, everything they might not be the most balanced but honestly are any of them balanced now? no definitely not but some more diversity in matches would be fun maybe not in pro play but please ranked needs them
The old design of seige maps was more realistic,i liked it.
Was nice to meet you at the event man and this is a really well thought out and informative video
Taking the old maps out will always piss me off. Those old maps were fun, and your reasoning as to why maps need to change could easily be used to kill off plane in the future. Ubisoft has been killing off remnants of old siege for years now under the guise of “file size limitations” and if they decided to go that route you being a more competitive oriented player would probably be mostly on board with that decision because Plane doesn’t fit in with the current Siege ecosystem and is therefore less valuable. Monacco is still used in competition, plane isn’t; players who enjoy those older maps casually are just completely screwed over. As time goes on and Ubi adds more maps I’m sure they’ll consider removing maps that are quick play only because they’ll be seen as obsolete and take up space in the same way night maps, Bartlett, tactical realism, and t-hunt did and you’ll be able to justify it the exact same way while casual players are left holding the bag.
Agree 100% Fortress should be in ranked
I respect you having sponsors but, I'm bit disappointed the choice of ad you did on your video.
Nobody kares
I don't wanna see the whole video but i probably agree, all the older maps aren't exactly bad, but my current take is that the map variation is very small in ranked and could be incresed. The amount of maps in the game is crazy and 90% go unused
I remember club house you could shoot the top of the reinforcement and peak into site from the other roof. Was pretty cool but if the attackers had all the utility they do now it wouldn't have been fun
I could appreciate a gamemode where you can play standard or unranked on the old versions of the maps
I say the only thing that I could really complain about when it comes to the reworking of maps is that they completely remove them. Let us have custom games on old consulate house hereford. I will say for the newcomers playlist old consulate should have stayed. It was the perfect map to teach people as what you said verticality holding the staircases window play. Maybe they should have reworked the outside to prevent the spawn peaks that became prevelent.
Finally a video that combines both F1 and R6, my favorite things!
Why are competitive maps more important? As if Siege's esports scene is or ever was as popular and important. I miss many of the old maps without their rework. These still had a soul and something unique. Now many maps are very unrealistic and identical. Everything has to be as labyrinth-like as possible. And getting bigger and bigger... Just like the same spots are always get votet in Ranked/Standard. It takes away the game's origins and all this with the justification that it should be fairer for esports. What about the casual players? I think there are enough players who don't play the game in tryhard mode. Just want to enjoy it too. And yes, that also means that you should still have access to the original maps from years before. There's a crappy team deathmatch mode. Why not a permanent nostalgia/original mode? And it is claimed that “change” is equated with “better”. No, not true! Of course it's good when new variations come into the game, but that doesn't mean the old ones are bad. I miss the old days... really!
Tower and Fortress are beautiful and unique maps
Reworks should be limited to closing off / opening windows and changing around destructable walls, floors, hatches etc. I took a ~2 year break and Consulate for example is just a mess, the time they take reworking I would rather have them put in to finetuning maps and most importantly, new maps.
Not going back on the house change still hurts
I'm still mad how they reworked favela. Like i don't imagine this being perhaps the most competitively pleasent map but having a map that had a building was almost completely destructible made for some absolutely tense and even hilarious moments/plays in casual
Man I love this type of content. It's like a podcast about the game. Super interesting!
As an F1 sim racer and avid siege player, you nailed the connections
0:40 we’re ready when you are
Harriford base rework is the siege equivalent of Barcelona-Catalunya adding the chicane in the middle of the Europcar corner: a good map/track element being placed very poorly
I personally really like defending plane, attacking it can be a nightmare but if everyone you have the skill you can get on glaz or an op with a dmr and really punish the rampant spawn speakers.
I feel like it went like this: in the beginning they had competitive maps (example clubhouse and bank) and fun maps (example house and plane). First they added a bunch of maps for new content because it was still fresh. Eventually they came to the idea that adding a map every season would lead you to too much maps very quick. This is when they started reworking/finetuning maps. First they started with the competitive maps to give a more fair playground in the competitive playground. But eventually as the seasons went on, they ran out of maps to fine tune and they couldn’t add maps too quickly either. So they started to rework things just so they had new content, ruining everybody’s experiences as they went on. This is when we get house, outback and consulate rework. These are just reworks because they need new content, not because a rework was needed. Im all for reworks but Ubisoft need to start seeing the line between fun and competitive. For example, fortress is a huge map and definitely has potential in competitive play. The problem is that the sites aren’t very playable or versatile for both attack and defense. If they fix that, boom, u got a new map for ranked and pro play. But for example: house should’ve never got a rework. Every game has that small yet competitive map. For Modern Warfare its shipment, for Black Ops its nuketown, and for R6 it was house. Yeah it had some flaws as in spawn peeks and what not. But fixing that merely needs an upgrade, not a rework. Same for outback and consulate. Sad to see that Ubisoft is completely focussed on content while the playerbase is completely focussed on the issues and problems with the game. Lets be honest, during these first two weeks of the new season, i have barely heard anyone talk about the new content, all i hear is nades this, system that, map this, fix that. Its just going in a downwards spiral from here, its like Ubisoft is doing crack and they are about to hit rock bottom.
Outback and Consulate were reworked due to community frustration with the maps and the fact that they needed them. Old outback was hated so much a whole movement was started to get it out of ranked... Twice. New Outback is good enough to not get insta-banned.
I notice that it's the people who give the least callouts are the same people bitching about the maps the most. Learn the maps people, a regular Z ping will tell you what the room is called. The more you learn the map the more fun you'll have.
The only crucial thing that needs to change is fcking 3 3 OVERTIME RANDOM SIDE CHOOSE
A casual classic playlist could be fun
the monaco track in the past must’ve been even crazier with overtaking than it is now this guy just said exactly what i was thinking one sentence later 😭
I think lair and emerald plains are good (although lair does feel a little uninspired on the inside but the outside is certainly cool). I do not like the nightheaven labs or stadium. But all the maps from before i liked. outback, villa, and reworked Hereford. Even fortress. But the small ones are my favourite ones. Like bank, consulate, chalet, clubhouse, Oregon, border, kafe, kanal and coastline I definitely do miss old house, university, plane, tower, yacht, and favela
Not a fan of the DraftKings sponsor, advertising gambling to an audience of mostly minors isn't great G.
Me personally i havent gotten to play old hereford aside from situations and ive had a passion/nostalgic feel for the reworked hereford for a while And found the situations hereford confusing for a while
didnt know youre a car guyy too, respect G
i think comp and casual should have different available things like bring night maps and stuff back to casual
Lair and the r6 tournement map are brainfucks. Theh do too much at one time. Having smaller, higher quality rooms that are eash to learn, fun to straregize, and masterable for higber levels of play are way above maps that are too large to traverse across in a single round.
I still dont know why they haven't reworked Bartlett university or tower but they ruined skyscraper
Just add map variance of the same map but different layout. Example’s Oregon. construction Spawn could be switched place with big tower or something like just change around.
Isn't that the exact idea of the stadium maps?
Oregon and house are/were the Monaco of r6 they were small tight maps but super fun and great for custom games or just ranked games
What i enjoyed most of the original maps is that they felt real! Actual locations that me, as an operator, have been deployed to secure the mission. Now, they all feel like rainbow six maps that have to follow a criteria: multiple soft walls, small boxy useless rooms, and enormous outside awkward portions
siege and f1 was the collab i didn’t know I needed
Man I wish plane was still fun and in standard/quick match 1.0 instead of this csgo mode
They could rework plane and make it like an airport or something, have a terminal that links to the original map
Still waiting for Bartlett’s triumphant return💪🫡😤
Only 29 minutes late and playing the mobile version is frustrating in that I cannot figure out the map despite playing so many times.
I get your point, but some of the new maps like Haven Labs or The hideout youst have wax to many angles and walls and tight corners. Which makes them confusing and not fun to play on. Same for the Consulate, i kinda liked the original. (I'm a huge plane fan)
Whatever they do, they need to stop fucking putting mezzanines on new maps. The split elevation aspects of the new maps are easily their weakest components.
nighthaven and emerald are constantly banned, no one likes the new maps, especially lair
For someone who dont care too much about rank it kinda frustrate me that there is almost half the map we dont play. And i wish they would make more map with more relatable "terroriste/hostage" situation. Even if plane and house are note balance they are fun to me just by the designe id like for them to create more map like those. Like a petrol platform or à train station or a cargoship etc etc. To me kafé/bank are 2 map realy well done. They are competitive and fit the thematique of the game. So to me, good map should be like that. Im not connecting much with the last 3 map. Not that they are bad map. Juste feel bland and not much personality if it make sense
Siege is the worlds most complex geometry problem is what i told my buddy when i was introducing him to the game
I don’t think we need longer sight maps some of the tight fighting is so fun making shield play and attackers carrying shields is a fun style to have mixed in sometimes
Didn't expect you to talk about formula 1 for an analogy but that's cool. I guess if we're going by those terms Monaco is the map that never got updated with the rest of the game but everyone still plays it for nostalgia like plane Spain is the map everyone plays to the point it becomes extremely predictable and boring like oregon or clubhouse Belgium/Spa is the map so fun that everyone could play it for forever and never get bored (people would probably throw riots if it gets removed lol) idk any particular R6 maps that carry this status but TF2s Upward is a timeless classic.
id say like chalet and bank for timeless classics
I dont understand why we cant have some attacker sided maps like plane or old hereford. Not saying those maps are perfect, but the whole game since launch is defender sided. Also really hate how they chose to remake 6/10 maps like Consulate instead of 2/10 maps like Yacht.
Yacht is essentially the same issue as Plane. Tube. “Rework” isnt viable
Lair has a horrible flow, primarily because you have to swing your mouse and check crosspeak-viable corridors and angles every half a second as you go through the map. Holding a floor or room as an attacker if you want to play vertical is practically impossible as there's so many angles to get peaked from by roamers, and not enough anti-flank attacker gadgets. Even more so if you lose a drone, and the last one is helping the team, can't really move it, gotta get the floors, so you have to face check. And there's so many tight angles that it feels like lair has been designed specifically for shotgun play. There isn't a floor where you can't peak and duck behind cover as you move forward or down a corridor, doors left and right, free flowing rotations every, needless hidey holes and cover objects that shouldn't be there, etc.
To be honest, I rather miss the tighter, smaller maps.
Need more smaller realistic maps like Oregon, House, Clubhouse and such. But nah they keep pumping out these goofy oversized maps like Emerald and Evil villain ah lairs.
I'll be honest, I don't like the map ban feature. I don't enjoy how great maps like Nightnaven Labs and (so far) Lair are going to be banned just because Kapkan Kyle didn't take some time to learn it's layout and will play the same 5 maps on repeat. So far I am hoping that once we get enough new maps there will be too many for both teams ban and it will balance itself out, but right now I'm not a fan. Edit: Unexpected typo (😮) between ban - and removed. Also I'm not blaming the developers at all, the map ban system itself is a great feature. I just don't like the community's direction.
Labs is ass
The mechanic itself felt like a "good on paper, not in execution" type beat. I was among the naïve few who thought people would use this ban hard maps or bad ones. Instead it's being abused and used exclusively to ban Nighthaven, Emerald, or any new maps. Any other time and it's just used to ban maps that aren't the meta/favourite comp picks.
The direction the game is going is so sad. No I don’t want to play chalet anymore give me labs, give me lair, give me Emerald Plains! I want to learn, I want to have fun! Edit: I mean the community direction. Kapkan Kyle was a good way to put it.
Insert epic get flanked rant. The community is pathetic they’d rather ban a map than learn it. Even tho learning a new map is one of the easiest ways to level up ur siege skill.
I want a plane rework, I want the plane to be mid flight and maybe we descend onto the plane from another jet flying above it? Maybe they could add a balcony/platform outside for the attackers to spawn from too. Since it’s a presidential plane, they could totally get rid of all of those passenger seats and replace it with a series of medium-small rooms. They could also revamp the plane itself and make it bigger (Note: Ubisoft PLEASE let the community create and upload their own maps to some sort of community workshop for custom games or something! I would love to see what kind of siege-like maps the community would come up with!)
I personally love Lair. Now this aint to argue it being a good map or not.... but iv won every match in lair on ranked. Me and my buddy have the perfect synergy on it, we have our strats planned out, and often times causes extreme difficulty for the enemy. Iq, Zero, and Jackal (if available) really work well for my playstyle. And Azami, or Kapkan (if he's not banned) really work if i wanna ancor, while cavi or Oryx if i wanna roam. For my playstyle, it works well for me and i appreciate it for that. I hope it stays, as there's a lot of play to happen here. I think an update on the design itself can be improved, especially making the stairs stand out as different colors, add some obvious uniqueness to the different rooms for easier callouts, but layout wise, i like the map
bro some of the maps feel like mazes tho. Like I am a returning player and I quit at around the end of year 2 and all the new maps just feel so confusing.
attacks are impossible on the new map if I solo q. people just dont wanna take the time to open walls and do vert. they all try to push through doors and die.
Ah idk. I see that there is a far larger market for competitive shooters obviously, as it is more accessible and understandable to the masses, but they really did change the DNA of what Siege was when it was released. It just isn't the same game anymore. Specific hard points used to control whole halves of maps, certain operators had roles that must be fulfilled, etc. I guess it makes sense now that I find myself really enjoying more sim-like games with the likes of Squad, Insurgency, and other tac shooters making up my current habits. I just really miss what this game used to be. My friends and I still hope about the potential of an event where the launch build of the game is released. I see that it saved the game, but it left the OGs in the dust.
Tower would be perfect for a remake
Most of the maps in the game are just OKAY. There is really only 1 map that I LOVE but it ALWAYS gets banned. its Emeral Plains. so many rotations and lines of sight. its an amazing map. I do run into some problem spots here and there dpending on the match so its not a perfect map, but its just fun to play on. Seeing as how its banned EVERY time this map shows up, I guess my opinion is unpopular, but the friend i play with also thinks its the best map. Some how ppl would rather have Stadium than Emerald Plains? why? a little insight on this would be appreciated. I think everyone can agree that Hereford change was bad. its a maze. even after playing on it a decent amount, its still confusing to navigate. its kind of like playing Guitar hero if u have actually played a real guitar: its close enough to the original that it feels familiar, but different enough to mess with u. You say Chalet is a "good" map? the changes helped a little i guess. but upstairs is basically unplayable. basement and middle floors are fine. For me, Oregon is my most hated map. the rotations are terrible and basement is basically impenetrable as an attacker is the defenders set up correctly. rotating takes FOREVER to do b/c u have to cross the ENTIRE map. To me, its rework did more to hurt it than help. i would have been more happy with just a wall protecting spawns; maybe making the big window a solid wall instead and keep the original layout for the rest of the map.
I agree, attacking options are completely limited in Oregon, attacking the basement has few entries
What a hook! Siege and Formula 1 tracks!? Now I legally have to finish the video.
My gripes with the maps are, that they are fucking huge, most maps in old siege were at least learnable, like oh you die from a certain spot, you catch a different person using that spot, you get a kill now I feel nervous entering most maps even if I droned things out and I don't feel like I'm learning anything other than "put a hole in this floor to catch attackers off guard", I think maps should have big tweaks maybe not a full rework, example of a map that remains good, you need hardbreaching, window play, flank coverage is Kafe, and clubhouse
I loved plane, house, border, even bank. These maps were well within the lore of the game. the story has to stretch to justify/accommodate the gameplay now
Lair had the Fortress Effect
What i like about these essay videos is that you actually play the game you talk about. 99% of gaming "hot takes" come from people that only play twitter discourse rather than video games.
Tbh i don't like Ubi ways of reworking a map, but Border is a perfect example how you can rework it. Add something here and there, don't change the visuals of the map itself like they did Oregon. I didn't played old maps cause i hopped in Y4S4, but i tried them on older versions of Siege and i really like old maps, they could've just add something here and there, change bunch of brick walls to soft, etc, but they went another way that i don't really like.
I still do want a more arcadey schooter like the old siege miss the crazy run outs like going on top of the roof on clubhouse and theme park