Kawasaki H1 & H2 Triples - WIDOW MAKERS or NOT
2023 ж. 3 Там.
9 714 Рет қаралды
Do the 2-stroke Kawasaki Triples deserve their horrific reputation?
Let's find out.
All 1/4 mile times are taken from period road tests.
Do the 2-stroke Kawasaki Triples deserve their horrific reputation?
Let's find out.
All 1/4 mile times are taken from period road tests.
As a 67 year old rider, owned 3 triples back in the glory days, and still riding today. Had two 1972 H2 750's, and a 76 KH400. Loved them and never had trouble, and totally agree with your summations.
Thats probably because you were a good rider and could handle such machines and its good to hear your still riding buddy. Cheers!
I've loved these bikes all my life. When I was old enough for a real bike at 17, i got my first KH250 in 1981 brand new. It munched plugs at a huge rate, but I loved it. My friend has an S1C, and his was faster than as I found out later that Kawasaki had dropped the power on the older bikes from 32 to 27bhp. Once I passed my test, I was talking to a neighbour who said his brother had a 500 that looked similar to mine. I asked my neighbour if he thought his brother might want to part with it, and he said yes, I'm sure he would, but it's in a right state being left outside for years. I went to see it, and it was just as bad as I was told. I got the bike really cheap, and it took me 6 months to rebuild it, but again, I loved it, and it was quick, and I used it for 3 years until I ran into a man who had a H2 which he had blown up and and said he was sick of 2 strokes so another triple was mine. I loved them all, and I used to ride them energetically, shall we say but never crash them. I think your assessment is spot on, and I think people bought them for the same reason they buy a huge powerful dog it's about ego and that can get you hurt on a Kawasaki triple..any of them!
H! Great video here. I wonder if you can tell me about the difference in performance using expansion chambers. (I love the look of the Stock pipes more). @@motorcyclecafe
Loved the powerband of the h2 750 but you had to be ready !
Brilliant video, really enjoyed it. I love Kawasaki triples, ever since my elder brother bought a '72 H1-B here in South Wales back in the '70's. When he bought it, the dealer issued him a warning, 'you do know what you're buying here don't you?' I used to go pillion on the H1 regularly, and we had a little signal - when my brother was going to accelerate hard, he used to tap my leg before doing so, so that I could lock my arms against the sissy bar and not fly off the back! On one occasion, as we were filtering traffic a car driver objected and put his foot down to stop us going past. My brother whacked the throttle full open, next thing I remember was the bike flying forward, front wheel skyward! When the front wheel eventually came down, the bike wobbled like goodness knows what as we disappeared up the road, the car in question a dim memory. We both shat ourselves I think it's fair to say. Did the bike kill him, well, he came off it quite a few times but no it didn't, in fact he celebrated his 70th birthday a couple of weeks ago. We both look back on those days and that bike with great fondness...brilliant, exiting machines.
No way in hell would I get on the back of one of those things now 😉
@@alant383yes, I remember Kawasaki of Cardiff, City Road wasn’t it? My brother’s H1 came from a dealer in Newport, Ken Roberts. 👍
Great job on your videos but I have to correct you on 1 thing you said about the triples that’s coming from my 51yrs 1st hand experience owning,riding,wrenching & restoring kawasaki triples & big fours. At 67 yrs I still own & ride 2 h1’s & a kz1000. You said the h1 & h2 triples could pull the front wheel up/wheelie in the 1st 3 gears,yes the h2’s esp earlier ones with shorter swing arms & more power could in fact wheelie in the 1st 3 gears when you hit the powerband. But the early h1 500’s with most power & short swingarm would wheelie nice in 1st gear and in some cases with proper tuning & light rider pull the front wheel off the ground in 2nd gear when hitting the powerband but not normally in 3rd gear. When deep in the powerband in 3rd gear at higher speed the front end would feel light but wasn’t actually coming off the pavement with an h1 500 though it felt as though it was the case it wasn’t. I have owned 1-71/1- 72/3-74 & 2-75 h1’s & 1-73 h2 over the yrs & worked on & test rode double that # of h1’s for other people over the yrs too & that’s how they all reacted for me when it came to pulling the front wheel off the pavement. Happy motoring! Then to make the triples safer kawasaki extended the swing arm length on both the h1 & h2 (in either in 73 or 74) & they slso rubber mounted the motors & detuned them a hair by a few hp to make them more tractable too. But in 76 when the h1 was changed to kh500 they really detuned it to 52hp from 60hp in 69 it’s 1st prod yr. Imho you could call the early H1’s widow makers when inexperienced riders rode past their abilities with earlier H1’s handling poorly going into wobbles & or tank slappers in certain riding cond which injured & in some cases killed people which was truly the case with more so with worse handling early H1’s vs the h2 little better handling. Happy motoring! Scott
G'day. Thanks for your feedback. I don't doubt you are correct for 1 second, buddy. The later models did gradually decrease in power. Thanks for watching.
I had a 350 triple , needed more so went through 2 500s and 2 750s. Loved them as we were racing them on the street daily lol and at the track. I'm 70 now and wish I had one ..anyone as they were so much fun to ride.
You're pretty much spot on with these comments: I knew the H1 fairly well through mates who had them, and so I got to either borrow one or ride pillion on quite a few occasions. They were standard-fare Kawasaki - full stop. I owned an A7, so dodgy brakes and handling were normal to me. One thing I will say: they were NOT widow makers! None of the riders I knew had a girlfriend, let alone a wife - only drunks and idiots wanted infamy - at least, that's what we saw: that 3:55 sound track brought everything flooding back!!
Thanks buddy, appreciate your conformation. Sure in the wrong hands they may have been dangerous. I'd have an H1 tomorra if a decent one turned up, even with all their flaws they were still a great bike.
I bought a new 71 Mach3. I had a friend on the back when some muscle car wanted to race. At launch the bike stood up so far my buddy’s helmet hit the ground. The passengers weight was directly over the rear axle causing instant wheelies at 6 grand. The fact that I’m about to turn 76yo means the triples weren’t that bad. I traded it for a 73 Z1, a much more refined bike.
Good memories. Just wondering what bikes did you ride before the kwaka's
@@motorcyclecafe started in 1965 with a Honda S65, then a 67 Suzuki X5 Invader (200 twin), then a 68 Honda CL350 scrambler. That’s the bike I started racing on. Then a 1970 CL350. Then the Mach3 and 900. In 70 I switched from racing scrambles to motocross on a Yamaha DT1MX, 72 Kawasaki bighorn and a 72 Yamaha 250MX, and a 74 kawasaki KX250. Stopped racing and went to work for IBM. Kept the 73 Z1 for 6 years and 70,000 miles. Traded it in 79 for a kawasaki KZ1000ST. Sold in in84 and took a 20 year break from motorcycles.
I had the 250 and the H1 500. The 500 was an amazing bike, light switch power band, wheelies, but you did take your life in the lap of the gods over 100 mph. But i loved it for 12yrs. Great fun.
Had one 750 and it was awesome, great tourer, great on fuel, friends used to ask me why I am not fueling up, still had 1/2 a tank I used to say. What I know now with a few tricks to the suspension and way better tyres now, would have been just fine. A few things that were standard, a chain oiler, hydraulic and screw in or out steering damper, throttle screw, so you could lock the throttle when highway riding, and CDI was perfect. I used to ride it pretty hard, used to aviate the front wheel a lot, great bike.
In 1973 as a 17yr. old I bought a slightly used 71 Mach III that I used for my main transportation for the following 4 yrs. Plastic swingarm bushings and poor wheel alignment from the factory were major factors in that era of Mach III's poor handling reputation. IMO "flexy-flyer" is probably the most accurate nick-name but I still managed to survive about 30,000 miles over the 4yrs. as a teenager! Surprisingly that bike was major fun on a dirt road as it would throw wonderful rooster-tails once it hit the powerband. Many found memories!
I should have mentioned the swing arm bushes in the video. They were fine while new but they suffered wear very quickly and you obviously know what the handling was like then. Still they are a great bike even with all their flaws!
My '76 KH500 did have front disc brakes. My bike was always initially hard to start (thanks to dealer prep). The next year when I had brought it in for service, the NEW service manager made the proper adjustments and it behaved much better.
Yes the later models had disc front brakes and a bit less power too, probably somewhat better than the H1's.
@@motorcyclecafe Yeah. My friend had a '70. I still remember him quoting the specs. 60 hp and 386 lbs. I had a '76 with 52 hp and 430 lbs. Everyone had the 500 and 750s. I didn't even know about the 250, 350 and 400s. I got to ride a 400 and I was impressed. Although it didn't have as much power the lighter weight made it very quick and a much better handler.
I always remember an ex colleague of mine who had kh500 .It was his pride & joy ,until it locked up an the subsequent crash took his left leg below the knee & altered his life forever.
I have a ‘74 S3 400, a ‘71 H1. 500 and a ‘73 H2. 750, The early 500 was the Widowmaker, it had minimal power below 6000 RPM, then you got all the power it had to offer above 6000. They had a short swing arm and a weight bias towards the rear. Coming on the pipe was very dramatic to say the least. The H2 in stock form is stronger at low and mid RPMs, and the top end is relatively mild. The 500, especially the early models, are the consummate triple. “Bog… Howl…..Shriek!”
Excellent buddy. I am glad you can confirm what was mentioned in the doco. You can even see the rear biased weight just by looking at the 500. Still I do think they were/are a great machine even with all their flaws. It was all part of the learning curve for manufacturers at the time. As long as you were aware of the bikes flaws and power it was not that dangerous. For a beginner sure it was but who would put a beginner on a Ducati Panigale these days, its the same thing.
I miss my H1-500... very fast and wheelie it did!
Great video!! I've been planning to make a video on the origin of the "widowmaker" name for the triples. Not anymore...you nailed it!
Thanks mate, legendary motorcycles, maybe not perfect but what bike is.
To be honest, M8 - you got me hooked with your "History of the Minibike", because once upon a day I had a Bonanza 3.5 HP bike when 12 year old kids could ride trails all over the bloody daylights in San Diego California. I recall there was a "Texaco" gas station near where I could get on trails by the ill fated San Diego (Spreckles) railroad and ride all day long on dirt trails between La Mesa and Lemon Grove. It was a young mans paradise back then; 1970 It was the BULTACO and HODAKA era of 250cc offroad racing, with the BAJA 500 right around the corner ~CHEERS! You reminded of of some fantastically good times...
ahh, the old days were so great ay? Everything is so over legislated these days. You can't even scratch your own ass without getting in trouble.
@@motorcyclecafe Look at California now, they have homeless squatters being driven off the beaches for crying out loud. The lands that they once drove all the off road bikes off of are now becoming increasingly inhabited by people who discard litter and worse with total unconcern. What makes it stranger still is that most of them are graduates of the often lauded "California School System" that is (allegedly) very superior in their educational methodology... They say In fact, CALIFORNIA Property is increasingly less desirable than anywhere else in the USA except possibly New York City. It is OVER VALUED regardless of the climate, come to think. And even THAT is not guaranteed anymore it seems... ~ Sorry for ranting, but I'm sure you feel my pain (?) Oh yeah, I got out of there years ago M8.
@@PapaDutch its fine buddy, it made me feel so much better about where I live, Lol
@@motorcyclecafe Where I live now it's a lot different! In Tennessee I can ride a four wheeler to town, but back in the day in California the cops kept trying to catch me riding my minibike on the street.... 🤣 It almost makes me feel like an "Adult Delinquent" but this IS farm country and people here think in a practical way🤔
First unbiased report I have seen. Owned a 71 H1 and 72 Honda 750. Also rode H2 at the time. H1 was most dangerous, but fun bike I have owned. Wobbly forks, lousy brakes and a powerband that went from about 10 hp at 4500 to 60hp at 5000 rpm. Front wheel was just used occasionally as a landing gear. H2 was much easier to ride with broader torque range, good brakes and better forks. Replaced fork oil in H1 and realized that Kawasaki used fish oil when new. No kidding! Still a lot of bike for $999 cdn.
Wow! Im so glad you took the time to confirm the stuff I mentioned. In those days the Kwakas were great. Certainly not for a novice, but great! The 500 was a crap handler even by 1970 standards but who cares it was as 'coo'l as you could get. You could certainly improve their handling now, even tires back then were crap. It was just the era! Thanks for the feedback.
Yes I had a H1 500. Drum braked 71 model. Great bike, rode it everywhere. You needed to know your own capabilities. Still ride motorcycles today but do not have the H1
Good video telling a lot of truths. I production raced and modified production raced one in mid 70's in NZ. There were some problems. The 750 was a master of vibration to the extent that mine broke its frame many times around the headstock down tubes area. Weirdest thing I found was that it vibrated a lot less with one .5mm ( experimental exhaust/piton seizure damage ) oversize piston in the right hand cylinder. Eventually rubber mounted motor with TZ350 mount bushes. You couldnt get rid of the vibes completely but adjusting the torque on the engine mountings could move the vibration around to different RPM ranges. Street was looser mounts-lower RPM vibes. Race was tighter mounts - lower high RPM vibes. Of course removing the bracing effect of the motor on the frame did make handling a bit more interesting, but the tighter setting didnt seem to affect the handling in race use.
Thanks mate, it is good to get some validation from someone with a lot of experience with these bikes. Vibration is something to be honest that I forgot all about mentioning. The early Kwaka triples may not have been perfect but they are still awesome motorcycles and an important part of motorcycling history.
Yes, i remember seeing you racing at Pukekohe, i used to have a S2A, then a couple of Z650's, then a couple of Z1R's. A couple of mates i rode with had H 1's and H2A's. Was a great time.
You must have a good memory mate. I had a Z650 too. Ride it all around UK,Ireland ,and Europe. Great times indeed. My brother Paul has a big collection of over 50 bikes most from the 70’s all in mint condition. He had the full suite of Kwaka triples.
Finally…………….someone who knows what they are talking about !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Well done.
Maaattee!!! Thank you for taking the time to leave that positive comment. It's probably one of the best comments I've ever received. And yeah I just got tired of seeing the same old comments on these bikes by people that just don't have a clue.
In 1972 Kawaski's 2 stroke 750 did not have valves, camshafts, push rods or rocker arms so it cost less and weighed less than any 4 stroke and was cheaper than any mass produced motor vehicle that would do 130mph and had a quarter mile well over 100mph ! ,So if you had a need for speed and liked to take risks, that is what you bought.
My first ride on the 500, it wheelied at 85mph. It was scary. It was also my last ride on a 500.
Lol, it gave you a lasting memory so it cant be all bad. Imagine a novice on one 🤔
@@motorcyclecafe A friend bought a 500, kept it about 2 weeks, then sold it. He was a new rider and the bike terrified him
I'd agree with the riders being the cause, but 1) the powerband was explosive, 2) the brakes were marginal at best, and 3) they had a wicked unpredictable speed wobble. All of these combined, could easily get an unskilled or imprudent rider in way of their head with potentially disastrous consequences. In my 6 months of ownership and 11,000 miles, I had a number of close calls. So many, whenever I would fall asleep I'd immediately have a nightmare of a recent event ending badly. Ironically, I traded my H-1 in on a Suzuki 400 and never had so many injuries in my life.
Lol, yeah any bike can do u harm no matter what it is.
The "Widowmaker" thing still gets me when I go out now, I have even commented on KZhead "experts" who were not even born when these bikes were around who now do videos about the "fact" that they wheelied at 100 mph, or the frames actually deformed in corners, and still get it in my ear every time I pull up somewhere on my H1F which I still own now. Great legends, but unfortunately often really over exaggerated as almost any serious period road test will testify, the early ones with the A series forks and drums / short swinging arms and high bars were a revalation to road riders of the time because of the totally alien (to most road riders of the time) powerband which meant the front would lift on the throttle in first, and a tad into second, dip the clutch and balance and you could keep it there. But anybody with any off road or MX experience wondered what all the fuss was about with wheelie thing, but in 1969 a 500cc bike usually meant a 85mph cooking single or 95-105mph twin in the main of 30-40 bhp, with the Goldie having a bit more, so 60bhp was a big deal in a 500, that was Commando or Trident Power, but they were 420lbs and 460lbs respectively vs the 415lbs or so of the 500. A very few Duke 750's were about, and they were quick AND handled in the day. Actually pretty close specs in the case of a Commando, and a 500 and one of these were a pretty even match on A roads once the 500 was sorted, and that is the whole point of this post, but do the sums, over 400lbs wet, 60 bhp at the crank for the H1, it's a docile flabby pussycat compared to even a 250 KR or Rs /RgV of just a decade later. Like ANY medium sized Jap bike from the late 60's- mid 70's bikes back then did not handle well when pushed hard, the second incarnation of the H1 with the H2 forks and disc (H1B) was much better, then the subsequent C/D/E and finally KH versions (really pisses me off when folks say "Oh a KH" to any triple regardless of model, back in the day that was a big deal to an owner) were actually a far better device than the original dynamically, if slightly less raw. Look at any period race program, the 500's came in top places in many production races and even endurance races like the Bol D'or etc. not really what a "killer bike" would do. Simple fact was, with some basic workaday mods any keen rider of the time would do, they would handle well enough to edge the tyres, scrape the footrests to half length and wear though even raised chambers on A and B roads. So TT100's or Roadrunners / Konis or Girlings / Careful attention to nuts and bolts and swing arm torque, and head stock bearing etc., shim engines properly to frame (as per Z1 which also had this had a weak spot), and learn how to use the steering damper properly, plus take off the stupid cowhorn bars, and maybe do the fork oil. Most folks binned the indicators and rear mudguard and one mirror back where I rode at least, you used hand signals in those days and traffic was far lighter in rural areas where I rode. The secret is a light touch and getting used to the bike moving about, if you ride something to the limit a lot, you find out what nasties are coming a lot earlier, so susequently no suprises, a lot of folks (like a mate of mine) bought them, went howling off flat out and came unstuck because they did not give the things respect, and this can happen on a moped even, you have to suss out the things before going for it. Did have a couple of moments in the 15,000 miles or so I had it (used for commuting to work as well), only dropped it at slow speeds twice in Winters, but when the Z650 came out and my mate got one of the first, they were quite hard to keep ahead off, or stay with if the rider was handy as handled better than most bikes of the time, so yes a couple of scary wobbles but we are talking 3 figure speeds on Glos B roads, which to be fair is bleedin' stupid anyway, but hey ho, again survived (just) to grow up from that daft 19 year old. Also rode A1/A7 and H2a back in the day as well as my original H1E JMB 921N , which was my favorite, It was lightly ported with chambers and a 1969 style intake rubber (the larger type) and no intake air horn to give that intake howl.
you are pretty much on the money with everything you said buddy. good comments!
Another great video mate. Plenty of really good video footage too. 👍
Thanks I came across that old factory footage by sheer accident.
Mt personal experiences on the 500 --- at about 4200 rpm it suddenly felt like it was trying to climb out from under me. A real rush! Making a u-turn the front wheel could hop off the road. seized center cylinder at 90 mph with a sickening noise. speed wobbles were frequent and scary. Smoked like a freight train and the neighbors hated it. One oddity was you could get liquid gasoline puddle inside one of the crank chambers when cold starting and it faltered, coughed, and chugged until it burnt off with a huge cloud. Wheelies might be unexpected. You didnt have to drop the clutch, it just torqued up. sitting forward helped. Forget knee dragging type riding. But it was a thrill and made an awesome sound. owned five, and also an s3 400, which oddly has points ignition. but is still cantankerous. I bought these until they were unavailable.
Own a 1975 H1-F 500 since day one . Saw tons of guys crash the triple Kawi 2 stroke bikes not respecting its handing or instant horsepower at 6000 rpm . I loved it and rode it like I stole and still do lol . Yes , I still have it . Restored it in 2010 .
Yes buddy, it wasn't the bike it was the lack of skills. I mean you're still kicking after all these years 😉
My 1970 H1 was a good bike , after boring it 40 over and putting forged weiscos in add Bill Widges chambers and she did come alive. I never let anyone else ride my Kaw.
Thats actually One of the most comprehensive and accurate reports that I have read in recent Years!!! - - Oh, and you are welcome to use my photos at the end . . .
Thanks for the positive feedback buddy... and for the photo permission ! Very nice quality photos indeed !!!
157mph on a Triumph of that era would be genuinely scary. My T140 will probably do that in km with a tail wind if I felt crazy enough. They reckon they could get 120mph out of the 650 in ideal conditions. You’re 100% right on the accident rate being a rider problem, I knew a few monopedal blokes back then. But coming from what was available to these rocketships required good judgment and some advanced skill. These and the Kawasaki 900 were largely responsible for the introduction of beginners restrictions in NZ. Even my late brother’s RD350 would provide a “fascinating” experience if you weren’t prepared. I could get into enough trouble on my 1971 Commando Combat. 👍🏻
Yes restrictions started happening in Australia in the mid to late 70s for beginners.
My north triple clocked 147 mph at brands hatch back in the day, did have 80 bhp and everything lightened though.
Not just the H2s but all the triple 2 stroke's that came out during the 70s its not an alarming top end but the speed getting there and mostly the speed was too fast for the brakes after multiple accidents broken arms and legs ankles and so on im lucky to still be able to walk and function if only we had the large disc's of today back then???
Chapeau for using a Joe Bar cartoon at the start of the video. I too was told all the legends about the H1 and H2. Oddly, I didn't know anyone who'd had one. There were a lot of sickles out there in the 70s that could cause consternation under brake or throttle or on a bend or on a straight... or on the wet or maybe on the dry. A lot of it was due to tyres... although we only found out when tyres got better. 😮
that's right tires throughout that whole period were not that great.
They were good bikes powerful boy racer bikes I called them. I clearly remember racing a guy on one up and down Arthurs seat on my old CB350-4. Uphill he had me done as soon as it hit the powerband and could wheelie away uphill away from me. Downhill well different story good brakes, great power but no ground clearance. Had him by the third tight corner and on the faster sweeper he couldn't get the power on because of the speed wobble was coming on stronger if he did. I enjoyed riding my 350-4 flat out everywhere where he couldn't ride his H2 flat out anywhere and didn't enjoy trying as it was always threatening to off him!
I've owned 13 triples, I loved them.
I have a 1969 H1 & 1974 H2, and fully agree with you w.r.t. the H1's handling and the H2's brakes 👍
I’m one of the people who only thought the H2 was the widow maker. Today I’ve been educated. Cheers, & a great video 🏴
Thanks mate, glad you got something out of it.
I would love a H2
They are actually a very nice bike to even just look at.
I bought a 1969 H1 ( The Original ) in May of 1969 after retuning home from the Army. It had the Power and Speed. What it didn't have was 1. good brakes and 2. Good Suspension. I was very careful to not play "road racer" handling at speed was scary.You needed to be careful when corning at speed.On August 16th 1970 was accelerating onto the freeway ( San Diego Ca.) and had a car just a little bit in front of me with cars bunched behind it. So I just gave it some throttle (from 65 to 75) and when I crossed over the Handle Bar had a slight "Shake" and then went out from lock to lock - high speed wobble. Being August 1970 so no leather jacket but I was wearing my Bell Helmet with saved my life ( My Dad was CHP) - I rolled over 100 ft and as I was able to stand up and walk to the side of the freeway and I'm checking for broken bones and "Nothing Is Broken" , my shirt and jeans are shredded. A Guy comes running up saying He has set for help and ambulance. Tells me He is CHP and saw me go down. Hard to believe I didn't die at that speed but more unbelievable is how I managed not to break a single bone in body. They made some changes to the suspension over the next few years. I like how a lot of written articles today credit the 69 750 Honda as the first Super Bike But it was the 69 Mach III. The 69 Honda 750 was powerful and handled better and rode better BUT not the Fastest ..............
Your right buddy, the H1 ruled!
The 250 triple was bad enough had one at 17 straight from a yammy fs1e !! Scared the hell outa me !!
had a 500 in the seventies had a blast with it just had to be a where of the extreme power curve. hang on!
I called the 1969 H1 the $995 meet God machine. I owned a 1971 and 1975 models. Great fun!
Motorcycling was a lot simpler back then. Its all to serious these days. Too many laws.
I owned a H1 and have ridden a few H2s. The H1s weight distribution was all wrong with too much weight to the rear. Also the throttle was like an on off switch with the power jumping from about 30bhp to the full 60 at about 3000 rpm. If you were in a corner and were not expecting it the front wheel would lift creating a brown pants moment. The handling of the 750s was tamed with a 2 inch longer swing arm and the power came in more gradually. The stock shocks were crap. I replaced mine with Konis. God knows how anyone rode them on the original ditch finder tyres. I currently own an RD400 which is still a fun machine but handles a lot better. Great video by the way.
Firstly, thank you for your last comment. Secondly, every single thing you said (which you obviously already know 1st hand) is 100% accurate! "Brown pants moment" God I wish I used that comment it the video LOL. I also owned an RD 400 years back, I loved that bike so much!
@@motorcyclecafe Thanks for writing back. The H1 was a good bike with a few flaws. Funny the main thing I did to it that made it handle better was to put a set of flat bars on it moving the weight distribution. I did some work on it and sold it to a Japanese guy that shipped it back home. This was when no one wanted them. The Rd400 is a paragon of virtue and I love it the more I have it. Ive owned a few old RDs and the first bike I rode was a 250 coffin tank in high school that belonged to a friend. Its probably my last stink wheels and Ive had several. One over rated piece of junk I had was the RZ500. Wow People wax lyrical about them and honestly it was a rattly, ill handling, gutless piece of poo and mine was a good one. Anyway keep it up.
If I remember right the 500 H1 had 59 hp, the 750 H2 had 72 hp, the Z1 had 82 and the CB 750 Four had 67 up to the K6 which was lowered to 63 hp as the F1 "had to become more attractive" with the original 67 hp and the later F2 with 73 hp (it's quite some time back but I guess that were their official released power). ... But hey, great video, enjoyed every second of it!
G'day, glad you enjoyed the video. As far as the HP is concerned all the figures at the crank did come from official factory brochures which I have. I guess the variation comes from different countries who may round the exact decimal numbers up or down. For instance, the exact power for the 500 H1 was 59.15 horsepower so technically it didn't make 60hp as Kawasaki claimed. They just rounded it up. I have had issues on many bikes finding out figures such as this as the exact figures do vary from each model year in many cases as well.
Very nice. Greetings from Triple Klinik GL
Thank you!!!
I started riding in 1969 and wanted the Kawasaki H1 but fortunately the dealer refused to sell me (16 year old) instead I got an A7 Avenger. I did buy a 1973 S2A a few years later and crashed it many times road racing in 1974. I kept the S2A until 2017. The H1 and H2 were beast as eventually friends let me ride theirs. I did a lot of drag racing at the strip and never saw an H2 get better than a 12.2 or the H1 get better than a 12.5 ET with excellent riders. However, these guys were not Tony Nicosia or motorcycle journalists. In the 54 years of riding I've ridden 200 horsepower bikes including a 260 horsepower Rocket 3 at Bonneville in August but none have scared me more than the H2.
Those 1/4 mile times you mention seem pretty right from what I gathered. Times can vary a lot as you no doubt know, there are many factors involved. Factory claims particularly in the 60s were pretty over the top. The A7 was a great bike!
1st time i went a ton was on the back of a neighbours kh 400 always loved two strokes always will.still have a a7 avenger its as fast as a 500 and same frame.hi from New Zealand 🇳🇿 😊
Gday from aussie. The A7 may be as fast but i bet its now where near as quick 'as in acceleration'
Great information, I'm in the process of getting my 1969 H1 running, bit reluctant to ride it, as you said they could turn nasty at a drop of a hat.
You'll be fine buddy they dont handle that well but are great bike none the less.
Great video and much common sense spoken. Surprisingly economical when ridden out of powerband. Rick Brett's words and he knows!
Thanks. Thats interesting I didnt even look into fuel consumption, I just assumed it would be horrendous.
@@motorcyclecafe It WAS horrendous. The tank held 4 gallons, as I remember. Once I got just 64 miles down the M4 before very the last drop was supped (after shaking the bike from side to side). That's 16mpg. You're an Ozzie, so I don't suppose you're aware that UK motorways have hairpin bends. As I slowed down after one motorway excursion I heard a Tornado jet right behind me. Frightening. The bike had blown two of the three baffles clean out. I had bought new one of the first six 750 H2s imported to UK. A crazy, crazy wonderful bike. With not much encouragement it would wheelie in just about any gear. Front-end light, it took no encouragement at all to induce heart-stopping tank-slappers. That's why so many owners sought out steering dampers. Now aged 72 and riding an 1000 Rebel. Only 86 horses, however, so I've traded it in for a CB1000R Black Edition.
Stock for stock, the H1 500's were lighter, higher tuned and a bit quicker around town than the 750 version. Though nearly half a second slower in the 1/4 mile, the 500 was a tenth or two faster in the 1/8th. I grew up on H1's. I got my license on my 14th birthday, wheelied away on a blue 1971 model with drag bars and chrome J&R Power Pipes, and never looked back! I had spent the previous couple of years on a 100cc dirt bike, and then pole vaulted straight to the top! My Dad was older and already retired, and bought it for me to ride to school and back so he could sleep in and go fishing and stuff. He didn't know a thing about motorcycles, and I convinced him it was a "scooter". LOL!. The law held that I was supposed to be restricted to 10 HP until I turned 16, but I decided that 70 HP {with the pipes) would be okay if they couldn't catch me 😎. Over the next 20 years or so, I also had a white 1969 model, a red 1970 model, a peacock gray 1970 model, a green 1973 model, a red 1975 model, and a rootbeer 1975 model, all of which I bought myself, with money from mowing yards and working various full and part time jobs until I got old enough to start a legitimate career. I also owned several Yamaha RD 350's, which were not quite as fast, but were lighter and a bit more "refined" than Triples, and with better brakes and superior handling in real world situations. And they were plenty exciting enough, especially in the hands of a capable tuner with a die grinder. One of the sweetest hot rod bikes I ever rode regularly was a friend's perfectly built and tuned 1974 RD350, in the gorgeous purple metalflake with white stripes and lettering paint scheme. I even bought one just like it, and spent a small fortune trying to replicate its wonderful and unique power characteristics, but never quite got there. The 1975 rootbeer H1 eventually got a stage 3 engine, compliments of a friend who was a very competent builder/tuner/racer of world record-holding Kawasaki Triple drag bikes, and it was truly an unholy beast. It was what we called a "sleeper" back in the day, meaning it remained street legal and looked as stock as possible, so you could lure unsuspecting suckers into a race and take their money. And oh my! When it came on those black FBG Pro pipes, you had better be hanging on. A few months after I sold it, a fellow nearly died on it when he looped it over backwards in 3rd gear. Apparently he had convinced the next owner - who was much more of a "collector" than he was an experienced or capable rider - that he had ridden lots of Triples, and talked his way into riding it up the street and back. I was told the first thing to hit the ground was the instrument cluster, immediately followed by the headlight and front fender, and that it just got worse from there. The rider left in an ambulance, and the bike went to the motorcycle grave yard. Unfortunately lots of Triples ended up like this, often in the hands of unprepared riders. They didn't call them widowmakers for nothing! I preferred to call them "sprocket rockets" myself. 😄 Sometimes in the early 1990's I moved on to 4-strokes, and am now on bike number 45 or so, but I still miss the old 2-strokes, and I sure do wish I had hung on to a few of them. $$$
And just too think after all that you are still alive, lol. I used to ride my brothers cb750 when i was 16, I thought I did well but nothing like a H1 😉
@@motorcyclecafe There was nothing like the 1970's and 80's for cheap fast motorcycles. Even Kawasaki Triples were a dime a dozen. Today's youngsters can hardly believe me when I tell them that I never gave over $500 dollars for a near-mint condition, super low mileage motorcycle that could outrun anything on the road until I was well into my 30's.
Crickey bloke, so good to hear facts instead of repeated bullshit. Bringing back memories of my miss spent yoof. My main comment is I wish we still had fair dinkum ads like the ones here, probably just upset the politically correct 🏍😎👍🤣🤣
One had to and still has to work to get a stock H2 to wheelie in second gear and so very predictable in that gear. 3rd gear wheelies are nothing more than legend unless going over a steep crest of a hill. A good H2 will wheelie easily in 1st gear no doubt but it is simple to control with the throttle plus it has a special rpm when it hits, making it welcome and anticipated. As far as the widow maker term, it depended where you lived as to which bike got that name, H1 or H2, that's how slang works. It is simply a fun and easy bike to ride while having a bit of respect to what it has with a road going motorcross type hit in 1st and 2nd.
Our nickname for them back in the day was the rolling coffin.
Never heard that one before but its a good one!
Thanks mate, I´m from 1960, and had my first 500 in 1974. I think you are right about the youngsters writing today, to much repetition of what they have heard, and no actual knowledge.. Btw, I almost got myselfes killed on a H2 in 1976... ;o)
Oh well you are still kicking thats the main thing. Yer people just keep on repeating something they heard or read, thats how history gets twisted. God I had so many problems making the Burt Munro docos it was insane how much wrong info was out there. Thanks for watching and the feedback buddy.
Coolist bikes ever built, not the best ,not the fastest, but the coolest, only other Triple riders can understand !
Back in the day there were pretty much the fastest, which is why so many unskilled riders suffered I guess 😉
Yeah, I going with NOT and whole lot of "I was sure I could ride it but found out I couldn't". Better to claim that you somehow survived the Widow Maker than to admit that you weren't quite ready when the power hit. Far more rookies exposed than widows made I'll wager. Thanks for debunking that myth. I've always hated hype.
At least you are honest about your riding ability back then buddy. Those bikes would be beyond the capabilities of most riders really.
i became a stunt man on them
Ha, I reckon most did at least once 😉
If they didnt beat you, they smoke you to death..only triple i had owned was a 350 S2a. I loved that bike. Should have kept it! I moved up to Z 650, then Z1R'S. A couple of my mates had H2, and H1, they didnt have any problems with them. I rode a early blue H1, it was alright, a lot more grunt then my S2a. Didnt quite stop as well..S2a had a disc front brake.
Yes while far from perfect they were fun. Thats what its all about. Cheers
Kamikaze 500 😆
You know what, I've heard that one and its prob one of the better ones too, but I totally forgot all about it.
We rode and raced these bikes for for 20 years or more nothing quicker. Not many people know that the 5oo clutch basket fits the 750 with one more plate plus the 750 motor fits the 750 frame. The 500 has a better rake than the 750 I ran 9:60s qtr mile 136 mph.
under 10s impressive... on the 500 or the 750?
@@motorcyclecafe that was a stock frame with bars.
750 in a 500 frame
@@motorcyclecafe btw we ran a cycle salvage at least 500 bikes of all kinds.
I had the 500 it was quick in the day but i wouldnt have called a widow maker.maybe somebody jumped off a triumph 500 and realised how slow it was after riding a kawasaki😂 50 years on i ride a fireblade and that is on another planet. ok tyres chassis etc have come a long way but i rode the kawasaki like a nut case and never felt scared. ffs you couldnt do that with the fireblade it would eat you and spit you out😱
You cant prove the 500 was called widow maker. If you can show vintage articles calling it that, before the H2 came out Ill believe it. No one called the S1 or S2 a widow maker. Your 1/4 mile times aren’t accurate either. The 500 was high 12’s but usually 13’s. Ive owned and drag raced these since the late 70’s. The guy I bought my 71 H1 off was a professional drag racer and held the record for fastest H1 for a long time. It took major mods to get an H1 to run high 11’s.
All the 1/4 miles times are from period road tests, every single one of them! You also might want to listen a bit better as I clearly stated in the video the times are 'absolute best times' the quickest ones I could find! And I don't have to 'prove' anything its all the truth, anyone that knows will know that.
I also thought the H1 was the widow maker, with that description being used before the H2 came out, but I'm not going back through hundreds of late 60's / early 70's magazines to find the reference. Unless somebody else does it'll have to stay as a difference of opinion. However I have a red '70 H1 and knowing from experience how easy it is to get the thing out of shape, if it wasn't given that title it ought to have been. Re straight line performance, I have a friend with a 69' white H1 and a couple of H2s. I'm seeing him later so I'll have to ask him what he thinks about how they compare. I suspect he'll say they're both cr*p compared to his modern stuff 🤣
There's been a few widow makers Kawasaki kh 750 Yamaha rd 400 suzuki TL 1000r Vincent black shadow.
@@stuartholding6067 I'm fairly confident your buddy will confirm that the early 500's are a tad more 'sloppy' so to speak. The tires back in those days wouldn't have helped much either. Cheers
@@motorcyclecafe We spent quite a while in the pub earlier talking about the differences. His opinion was that as far as straight line acceleration is concerned there probably wasn't much between the two (this is seat of the pants stopwatch tech of course), but the H1 is far more frantic and it's all top end. The H2 has much more mid range torque without the cliff face power band of the H1. Ride them both 'normally' and the H2 is far quicker, it's just that the H1 has what feels like a second engine in there when you wring the last bit out of it. On handling the problem is the weight shift that comes with the power band. It's if the suspension is busy doing something else when you hit the power band that you get issues. That's been my experience with my H1 - ride it below the power band and it feels flat with ok for the era handling. On the road keeping it above 6k revs is not only hard - especially if there's other traffic on the road - but it feels unpredictable. Yer takes yer money as they say.
So true, ill informed comments on machines based purely on what someone else says, so annoying!
With the reputation these bikes have now you'll probably be my only supporter lol.
Almost every test i've seen on the triumph speed twin, the tester says you need to change the rear shocks, even if he didn't exceed 100kph. Maybe on a track you may need something better but for normal road riding, at least it doesn't break your back every time you go over a manhole cover. So annoying
@@jeremyharris5102 ha! I remember back in the 2000's reading a road test on a Moto Guzzi the bloke complained that the bike didn't have angled valve stems which made checking tyre pressure a tad hard. I though damn that must be a great bike if he only had that to complain about so I bought one (sight unseen)
Think I've opened a can of worms here, I meant the modern speed twin 🤭
I had an H1 in the 1980s. It was a cheap used bike then. It was a monster and I loved it. Unfortunately the CDI module burned out and the dealers no longer stocked it. In those pre-internet days I didn't have any means of finding one. I junked the bike for pennies. Actually I don't think I got anything for it except the dealership forgave the bill for the shop time to diagnose the problem. I would have another but they are very rare and expensive. Maybe after all the baby boomer collectors die they will be cheap again, if I'm still alive.
My 500 and 900 were both great bikes, yes they had issues as most bikes did. But this Video shows the true reason they were widow makers. Too much for the average or below average rider.
Yep thats right buddy
I still have a 750 h2 a 500 h1 and a s1a250 and I still ride I am in my 60’s and I ride zz1400 😂😂😂😂😱
Bad handling.poor brakes....the rd400 was far better and did evreything not far off perfect
I had an RD400 myself and yes it was a very good machine but it's rear brake was overkill on a bike that light. Yes the H1 did have very poor brakes but this was not the case on the H2.
And sold it lmao bought a cb 750 me I loved my wheely monster
Me and my dad had a 500 .... dad layed his down
In UK biker folklore of the time (I worked at a Kawasaki dealer) for widowmaker status, you needed to have an H2 750. The H1 500 didn't cut it.
It must of for 69 70 and most of 71
I mean that only the H2 had the Widowmaker nickname here. The H1 didn't get a nickname. It was known to be rapid, but had no fearsome reputation attached by riders. You had to spend the extra money to attain the notoriety. The H2 was notorious, The H1 was ignored. (Just for info ref. UK market.)
@@jackwood2328 good to know