Roman Formations - Testudo
2023 ж. 1 Ақп.
56 597 Рет қаралды
A historic and cinematic overview of the Testudo Formation used by the Romans and throughout history.
More War Movie Content: / johnnyjohnsonesq
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Movies/Video Games Featured:
Rome 2005
Total War Series (Video Game)
Risen 2016
Asterix The Arcade Game
Asterix and Obelix Vs. Caesar 1999
The Eagle 2011
Shieldwall (Video Game)
Ryse: Son of Rome
The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers 2002
Gladiator 2000
Conqueror’s Blade (Video Game)
#history #rome #ancient
"Testudo offered great protection against missile fire." I dunno, man. I think any high explosive could easily break that formation
Missile is like a throwable spear that’s what he means, not modern missiles lol
Got a cruise missile coming in boys, form up.
This was long before gunpowder.
Fun history fact Roman soldiers were so well trained that they were known to block with perfect timing (within 1 to 2 frames) which enabled a parry that sent the missiles back at the attacker. Scientists and historians are still debating how frequently this technique was used and whether it should be given the classification of, "cheap noob s**t."
I think a Javelin might be not powerful enough
Tactics from back before guns became a thing is just so interesting and sadly we rarely see it done properly so most people just think it’s hordes of people bashing into each other with no formations or tactics.
I would say roman tactics are still alive in riot cops all over the world. In fact all ancient warfare and medieval styles went away when guns matured, and if anything vindicates roman might is precisely that its still used very similarly by cops to this day.
Accurate depictions of sword/shield combat in media are very hard to find. Usually there is no attention given to tactics, formation, or armor/weapon effectiveness. Only a few minutes in total from a few different shows and movies do it right. It's sad for sure.
Loved that you had Astrix and Obelix footage. And Hollywood gets a military formation wrong, No! say it ain't so!
In 53 BC the weakness of the testudo was taken advantage of to Romes defeat, and ultimately had a huge effect on history as we know it. At Carrhae, fighting Parthians on horseback (Carrhae is now in Turkey, Parthians were pre-Turkish nation that controlled most of the modern middle east), the Romans would "button up" in testudo under the fire of masses of horse archers, only to be charged by early armored cavalry called cataphracts (shown in the video from the Total War clip). Once the Romans spread out to fight the cataphracts, the cataphracts fled, leaving the now spread out Romans exposed to horse archers. The parthians brought many cartloads of arrows and the romans had to retreat after hours of this punishment, losing ~3/4ths of their force, having lost to a Parthian force ~1/4 their size. This force's patron was Crassus, of the first Triumvirate with Caesar and Pompey, who was there and died that day. This was the guy who was the richest man in Rome at the time. Having got rich by having a "fire department" that wouldn't put out your house fire until you sold your property for a fraction of the real value, among other less than honorable means. Even though this defeat was a massively humiliating loss of legions and their aquilas, the real effect on history was that with Crassus dead, one leg of three legged stool of the first triumvirate was gone, and the republic did not survive the following civil war, as Caesar and Pompey hated each other (also Pompeys wife/ Caesar's daughter died, ending a political marriage). So part of the reason the roman republic fell as it did, was that the testudo could not answer horse archers.
Thanks so much for this. I struggle sometimes with how deep to go into a subject. I limit myself so I can actually complete them, but I'm often sad not to have this level of detail. BUT luckily heroes like you come along and fill in the gaps in the comment section. Edit: my knowledge of ancient history is pretty limited seems you've started a debate! But that's good too.
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq its cool man, your specialty is how things are portrayed in modern media rather than historical minutiae. I had no idea some of these media existed, especially as an american this incredibly silly looking live action asterix movie The US army helmet strap vid was illuminating as I had no idea about WHY they did this despite literally having it in front of me so many times.
@@slimjim2584 hey man congratulations, excellent explanation i really enjoyed it! Also, if i remember correctly the Eagles, the "holy" legion's symbols taken by the Parths, were given back to Rome thanks to emperor Augusto
Parthia was in persia not turkey
Mostly accurate besides you saying Parthia was where Turkey is now, that made me cringe ngl. It’s where Iran/Persia/Sassanids is my friend.
There's a formation that's been on my mind All the time Testu-stu-studo
I feel so proteeeected if I just say the word, Testu-stu-studo
Makes a change from the 4 4 2 formation beloved of soccer...or a 5 3 1....could not resist that one....
"It's very cinematic" *Ngl that's one damn good reason*
Ohya, I'm often cool with eye candy formations and a good command to yell. It's just a movie, not a history textbook, after all.
@Johnny Johnson Ehh if itlooks good enough it'll work
Please do more tactics video like this, there are many tactics that you can cover!
You never cease to amaze, Johnny, you even brought up the horse-bearing use! "In Roman Empire, horse rides YOU!"
In historical documents, it was recorded that testudos were tested by aving whole chariots driving over them.
I suggest videos on: Mosin Nagant Maxim Machine Gun Mark 2 pineapple grenade Stick grenade M-67 hand grenade M-26 hand grenade
I was reading recently about how documented casualty rates from ancient warfare were surprisingly low, indicating that those "all out charges" movies love to depict likely wouldn't have happened, since that'd be outright suicide. I'd love to see a video on the realities of war-scale hand to hand combat in history (though I'm aware not TOO much is known about it)
During almost all wars upon till WW2, and the mass deployment of penicillin, more soldiers and sailors succumbed to disease and infection than being killed in combat. I was a medical technician in the RAF, and one of the very first things we did during initial assessment of any casualty was check (as best we could) if they were allergic to penicillin. Due to most of the injuries in Afghanistan and Iraq being penetrative trauma from explosions, we'd need to get IV antibiotics into them as soon as they were stable enough. Depending on the location and availability of MEDEVAC, it could be 48 hours before a casualty was on the operating table, all the while that shrapnel, plus the sand, gravel, foliage and clothing fibres forced into the wound upon impact could cause horrendous infections, and ultimately lead to septicemia/sepsis.
Your ability in getting all the relevant information into a concise, informative yet entertaining package is brilliant. Again, good research in both information and images!
Quality video as always johnny, keep it up!
"Turtle Power!" - Centurion Leonardo
The name of your video (and the formation) caught my attention: I play a lot of D&D 4e, and there's a particular build named after a high-level option you can take called a "Snapping Testudo". In D&D 4e, a Snapping Testudo is anyone who uses two shields when they fight. I always thought Testudo was just a madeup name derived from a word in another language, I had no idea that it was actually based in real-world tactics!
I seem to remember a testudo formation being used in Cleopatra (1963).
In the anime Gate the Testudo formation was used. However it was rendered ineffective against modern weapons.
Dang I never considered searching anime for this and I'm usually good for that sort of thing
There's always next time. Sometimes there are events in anime that refers to world history. Like Azur Lane, which has reference to the Allied Forces fighting the Axis Power.
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq on that note lupin: castle of Cagliostro has a example of roit police using testudo
Anonymous soldier: "Just to make sure I understand, you want me to stand here with a shield while a chariot, complete with motor, rolls across my back?"
I'd want good medical. At least they got a pension.
Well, the macedonians under Alexander supposedly had their (smaller) shields over their heads while giant carts rolled over them from uphill.. and SUPPOSEDLY none of them had any major injuries
I remember seeing it used in Risen and thinking how satisfying it was to see the coordination.
I've heard that term in a few movies about Rome and I never figured out what it meant, thank you.
And fanaly i know , i saw this countless times in Asterix and Obelix and never knew if that tactic was real . I to learned that these formations won't hold against floating menhirs (;
Cool video Johnny
Good morning, very interesting. Got part of the way through Top Gun Maverick, will watch the rest later though. Keep these coming! Take care, and all the best.
Hey Johnny, thought you'd like this - "... The principal struggle is at the upper lines, to which as we have said Vergasillaunus was sent. The least elevation of ground, added to a declivity, exercises a momentous influence. Some are casting missiles, others, forming a TESTUDO, advance to the attack; fresh men by turns relieve the wearied. The earth, heaped up by all against the fortifications, gives the means of ascent to the Gauls, and covers those works which the Romans had concealed in the ground..." Book 7, Chapter 85 De Bello Gallico (The Gallic War 58-49 BC) Julius Caesar
Nice one jj
I dont know much about the Roman Empire, but I do remember the Testudo formations. I think it is the only formation that I know about
Come to hear about Testudo, stay for the "aw'right I'm Johnny"
Cool that you showed footage from the game ''SHieldwall'' evon tho it was only a few seconds and the game has a glitchy testudo with soldiers not filling in gaps or building up a propper square
Great video, as always. Maybe do one on the North American F-86 Sabre?
I will I promise! Just give me some time on that one :)
Oh Johnny. You don’t watch old movies do you? In the movie Cleopatra 1963, Caesar’s troops, equipped with historically inaccurate Roman shields with big spikes on the bosses, used the Tortoise against Ptolemy’s attack. Cleopatra, was and remains a great spectacle of a Hollywood production. Well worth watching, particularly Richard Burton and of course the incomparable Elizabeth Taylor. Even had Rex Harrison as Caesar. 🤣
Adding that to my list! Keep trying to expand my library so I'm getting there...
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq The last Kingdom wins out for me,especially as Bernard Cornwell namechecked the wirral archeologists in his last novel, he even came here to do his field research on the great battle of Brunanburh/Bromborough 937AD...E...
The testudo formation reminds me of the English Army Square of the 19th Century. Though the British Square was a purely defensive formation it was able to move as required and served much the same as the testudo with the additional bonus of stopping calvary charges. Though the Mahdist Fuzzy-Wuzzy foot soldiers broke the English Square as written by Rudyard Kipling regarding the war in the Sudan.
1 thing you missed just as the later Scottish Shilton the Testudo it could be made even more stationary with closed ranks with pilum presented. In this configuration it was rather effective against cavalry not only projectiles but only an option if the Pillum was not already thrown from the Phoulkon formation from 3rd or 4th lines backwards throw projectiles as the 1st & 2nd to possibly 3 lines formed shield walls. their were many types of projectiles plumbata/dart, hasta/spear, verutum/javelin & the previously mentioned quite common pillum/heavy Javelin compromise between a spear & a Javelin. Cheiroballistra=crossbows/hand ballista would mix into the ranks of the Testudo cramped if desperate for defence. Arcus=bow though you ain't using bows unlike hand ballista in tightly packed legion formations. Legions caltrops dropped then Testudo in cohorts of the legion was the go to when attacked by cavalry till formed up & a plan devised. The great thing this slow defensive formation offered was time to assess the situation to make an effective well enough thought out plan of reaction. Phoulkon meaning fulcrum to the Tetsudo/turtle was near instantaneous as the front portion was already in the same formation rear lines lifted shields over head, rear & sides. There is lot more to Roman formations then people think but this is the general starting summary.
Nice episode, although I wish there was a clip or two from the game "Blood of Steel" which I think does the M&B Captains mode much better than Conqueror's Blade which seemed closer to For Honor due to the flimsy units. A legionnaire-inspired character is one of the starter heroes you can pick, among all of the characters which are mostly historical and romanticized. Really fun game to play with friends, super easy to pick up even if the main menu UI is one of the ugliest I've ever seen. Another fun topic that's more underrated would be the schiltron or even the Hussite war wagons!
Ooo Hussite war wagons! I like this idea
The Roman Total War games are awesome
Also testudo Formation in GATE :- Gets obliterated at point blank by Type-64 Battle rifle Burst mode.
There's an example that Tetsudo used in the movie The Eight Hundred saw the Japanese used this tactic to cover for sapper to breach the wall during the attack on Sihang warehouse 1937
ngl asterix and obelix comics was my first introduction to this tactic
**incoming tomahawk missiles** Romans: TESTUDO!!
The roman times were truly a fascinating era
3:27 From Up!
What do you think of the Chinese Fire lance? One of the oldest gun powder weapons.
Testudo! is one of those words that needs to be yelled. Like Charge! or BANZAI!
Very Gut :D
Why did you call helmsdeep hornburg/hornberg? 2:43
It also makes a brief appearance in the 2016 remake of Ben Hur. (here around the 2 minute mark: kzhead.info/sun/eresmpiHmahvlY0/bejne.html)
1:26 I think the Romans were trained to use their swords mainly to thrust, so might not be too bad
Crazy to think we are still using techniques, reverse engineering Roman concrete which we recently did and even using tactics for purposes they essentially are suitable in. For daily civilian life.
Testudo!
How about an ‘Arrow Storm’ video?
Soccer tactics, when winning: Testudo!!
The Testudo formation cam be used bt Riot police with Shields 🛡 to protect themselves from Stones and projectiles by Rioters.
Mondragon rifle, please.
Though the Romans did use the testudo it was, as you said, most used during sieges. The depiction of its use in the Lord Of The Rings is doubtful as battering rams were usually placed inside a wheeled structure with the ram suspended from ropes. The structure helped protect the men inside and as the ram was slung it could be rocked back and forth without the need for it to be carried by the men. As Slim Jim points the testudo could be used against missiles but this meant it had to be stationary. Once faced by the cataphracts they had to change the formation to better deal with them which left them open to the horse archers. The other problem was that the density of the troops fighting in this formation made it very difficult to to fight hand-to-hand with the enemy. Also because the men were required to move in unison this meant speed was sacrificed. The Byzantines came up with their own version of the testudo, the Phoulkon or fulcum, which played a great role in the tactics employed by the Byzantines against their eastern enemies. This was a formation in which an infantry formation closes ranks and the first two or three lines form a shield wall while those behind them hurl projectiles. It was used in both offensive and defensive stances. Before close contact with the enemy and just outside of archery range the infantry would close ranks and form a shield wall from the first two lines. As they advanced, light infantry from the rear would shoot arrows at the enemy while the heavy infantry could hurl martiobarbuli darts or throw their spears before closing in to engage in hand-to-hand combat with their swords. If faced with enemy cavalry, the first three ranks of the phoulkon would form a shield wall and thrust their spears outwards while fixing the ends to the ground, while the third and rear ranks would hurl projectiles and the light infantry shoot arrows. Interestingly during the pike and shot period when faced with cavalry they also formed a square and used their pikes to keep the cavalry at bay while firing their muskets to defeat them. This would later become the famous British Square but with the bayonet replacing the pike.
Obviously, the use of the ram is orc fiction based on their strength. I just really like that they used it directly to advance men and material for the purpose of a siege.
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq I realise it's use like that was for cinematic purposes but if the door could have been overcome so easily it would have been of little use. If you look at how these things were set up you'd realise why sieges lasted as long as they did. I have seen castles in the UK which had several gates and portcullises not to mention murder holes, holes where arrows could be shot through, and large slots where boiling hot water could be poured over the attackers. They really took keeping people out very seriously.
Honestly, I'm a bit of a castle nerd myself. Would have loved it had they added more realistic defenses, but LOTR gets a pass for most things. The horse plow scene at the end of the battle is the silliest.
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq When my children were younger we spent the day at a castle and I took them through the various parts of the castle and how they could be attacked and defended. They loved it because once you know about that you see how it was built and why it was built that way it all makes more sense.
@@bigblue6917 Never ever hard vertigo until I looked over the parapet of one of those hexagonal towers in Caernarvon castle....there is a replica of Liverpool castle in Rivington, Lancashire, by the Saxon barn ( which is interesting as it was the Angles who settled there)...Am a castle nerd too...fascinating stuff..E..
not sure if it counts but theres a scene in the 800 where the japanese use steel plates to protect themselves from grenades, so the chinese strap grenades to themselves and fall onto the japanese
This may well be a silly question, but would a Testudo formation hold up against defenders armed with medieval Molotiv cocktails. Also, are medieval Molotov cocktails a thing that existed before the modern era of combat?
Not well. Police in their formations now usually have designated fire extinguisher guys. Yes if you want to look up Greek Fire that's one example.
I think The Eight Hundred suicide bombers scene also features the Testudo formation.
If it is the one movie I thinking about with the second Sino-Japanese War, then I think they used some kind of scrap metals as to try to get close to the building. I havent seen the whole movie, but I had seen that scene
Javelins?
You know what, I don't think I've ever watched a Roman movie where they have thrown their pilae - and I must have watched four or five. Maybe it's just too hard to replicate in a movie. You wouldn't think so with all the CGI these days though.
2:42 Jeeze I forgot about the orcs just being tossed off the bridge by their own side rushing the ram up it. That seems extremely wasteful by any metric honestly - the damn gate isn't going anywhere just walk the thing up without killing your own guys!
Yah but that's orcs being orcs =)
0:58 What game is it?
Wait, wait, wait...there's an Asterix film?!?! Why did I not know this?!?! Also, this was a great video and I'm especially glad you explained that the testudo formation was more of a defensive formation and not really used for fighting.
All things Asterix are good fun.
There are several Asterix movies and even one which has just been released.
Here are the Asterix films en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Asterix_films
@@buttersstotch7981 I think that from the live-action movies "Mission Cleopatra" is considered the better one, though they all have their good and bad moments.
@@flitsertheo I personally like the animated ones. Those have that comic book feeling and are often more loyal to the source material. I was also positively surprised how good the 3D animated Asterix movies looked.
Nice synopsis on the Roman Testudo!
02:50 you mean the siege of helms deep
But in The Eagle, they used the formation in order to get their enemies into stabbing distance.
Kevin Mckidd has come a long way from Father Ted,
Darkmatter Games approves of this!
Somebody who doesn't know Asterix will be VERY confused by the clips hahaha
Yo maybe first but keep up the cool videos johnny :)
#1 🇺🇦
The Chinese, Persian and Indian armies of ancient era also mentioned very similar shield tactics . especially watch the Chinese movie Red Cliff where it was a part of a larger field formation. Testudo formation is also mentioned in a larger explanation of the epic Mahabharata .
If it works it works.
It never helps them in Asterix no matter what shape they take.
PULLO! SINGLE-FORMATION!!
Sonno Pazzi nostro Romani
That formation had no chance against a flying menhir.
But that formation didn't help the combined armies of the empire against the modern arms of the JSDF in the special region.
What the fuck did the Roman’s have to do with that kid from Akira ?
Next, a documentation about Turtles 😂
Ninjas...
It was likley used to protect from Arrows not for close combat. This asterix comic is a pain in the neck guys pls think a bit logic
Hi
You left out this one.. I wish we had THIS much fun at summer camp. kzhead.info/sun/pt2EeqqNmpZ3n6s/bejne.html
Oh man that's beyond good fun
dammit im late again💀 I KNOW YOU KNOW ME JOHNSON YOU CANT ESCAPE ME
Have mercy
@@JohnnyJohnsonEsq maybe i will maybe i won't........
Tanks before tanks
Ancients. Incendiary boars!
🗿👍🏿
Anyone who did this in school? Just curious.
In hostes signa inferre ❤️😃🥂👍
🇮🇹😎😱
First
Close! 🍺
hahahaahahahha rome 1 total war
Roman Formations, take one. 😉 Sorry man, I had to. Catch ya next time.