How Great Leaders Fire Someone (Navy SEAL Tactics) | Jocko Willink | Leif Babin |
In this new video, Jocko Willink and Leif Babin, the authors of the NY Times #1 Bestseller, "Extreme Ownership: How U.S. Navy SEALs Lead and Win", explain when is the right time to let an employee go.
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It's so important when they talk about being honest with people who are struggling. A fire chief whom I know used to say "If you don't want to be honest with people, you don't need to be an officer." I have limited experience in that but it's tough. But having those difficult discussions early is much better than waiting until you're ready to fire someone.
True. But use the indirect approach
@@leifbabin1512 Yes. Great point
" But having those difficult discussions early is much better" 100%. You have so many people walking around having absolutely no idea they're doing a sub-par job and then bam out of leftfield they're fired. Whereas some of these could be salvaged if you tell them early and work to improve the problem areas. Not only does this reduce the amount of times that people need to be full-on fired (and then you have to go through the process of hiring a new person and training them all the way up), but when the firing does have to happen they aren't completely shell-shocked and probably won't take it as bad because they knew they were already on thin ice
@@EB-bl6cc exactly
My one resentment with management is their lack of accountability in helping me do better. Too often they'll just wait for the reviews or employ PIP rather than ask "how can I help you do better?" When I used train people, their success was a reflection on me, as was their struggle. It was my job to make them do their best.
Many times people don't need to be trained. They need to be led and mentored. Good job taking ownership over your team and the role you play in their success
It's been said that a person's willingness to have uncomfortable conversations is directly correlated with their propensity for success in life. HOWEVER, Jocko is completely correct to say that being "direct" and being "a jerk" are not the same things. If you are direct BUT YOU ALSO approach the situation in a genuinely supportive and improvement-focused way, then people will not simply listen to you, but they'll respect you as well. This can often result in the team member not just begrudgingly improving to the point of minimum viability, but instead, you could actually inspire them to take a real shot at being the best they can be, which will serve everyone, leadership included, better in the long run.
It’s definitely a dichotomy you must balance as a leader
Glad to hear Jocko use construction trades as one of his examples, because in the trades, generally it is very small teams, a boss and one or two guys usually all working together. Far different from most fields that have much larger teams or groups.
I wish that in the (and I’m speaking in general terms here) current workforce we had leaders that had the mindset that as being espoused here. I truly believe the world will be a better place. Unfortunately the average human being doesn’t pack the courage to be able to look at themselves first, and see where they fail before they point the finger at somebody else. Jocko’s comment about writing himself up is something that nine out of 10 human beings could never do on a consistent basis. Much respect to Leif & Jocko on this topic. Well said.
Good leadership is hard to find. The good news is, there are good leaders out there striving to get better.
Not only is good leadership difficult to find, most work cultures do not support great leaders. Great leaders often feel ostracized by upper management which results in that individual separating because the work environment becomes too toxic.
Could you also talk about what to do on the side of who’s being fired? What if the boss is trying to use you as a scapegoat for their f*ckups? Thanks!
Good question. We'll add to the list of questions to cover in the future.
I feel like the first 2 minutes says it all. The rest is good supporting detail. Great content. Great delivery.
Thanks for the support, Chris.
Crazy timing. I was literally firing an employee at the time this video was posted. My boss and I went through every point cover in this and made the decision to fire the employee.
Glad it had a real-world impact for you and your team.
Perfect timing. Tomorrow is the day I've been dreading for about a decade.
Ask God for guidance and wisdom
Roger that. Let us know how it goes.
Makes me want to work for these guys. I don't think I've ever heard of someone actually taking that levelheaded of an approach to dealing with problematic employees.
True leaders who knew to lead and mentor their people versus when to fire them.
Really? How I handle business on a daily basis.
Solid insight.
Improve love is growth
I understand that there is a time that leadership needs to cut ties and move on but leadership is not a "ball up and throw in the trash operation" till I get someone that can do the job. Leaders need to mold and develop individuals. Rome wasn't built in a day and individuals that are guided through their own experiences and expectations from supervisors develop not only into managers down the road but leaders that shape the future of any association they are working with. Shape and cultivate leaders to one day take the helm with confidence. Great video.
Right on. Leaders have to take ownership of the success of the individuals on their team. Most team members need direction and mentorship to shape them into the next generation of leaders
This is where attitude is everything If someone makes a mistake I observe how they respond It is not the mistake that tells me about them It is their response to it And that doesn’t take long to determine Just like a relationship It doesn’t take long to know It’s either there Or it’s not❤
Spot on. We are all going to make mistakes, but you can see how humble and prepared someone is to lead by their attitude. Takes ownership of their mistake is the most powerful response.
Ending a voluntary work relationship with someone does not “take the person’s ability to make a living away from them”; if it seems to, they actually had none to begin with. Government jobs can be like this, because the fundamental relationship -between the taxpayer who has to pay or face prison, and the paid employee- is imposed by force, not voluntary mutual benefit.
The sandwich technique. 🥪
Unfortunately my boss failed to follow any of these steps. Cowards fire someone on a whim.
Reminds me of Just Culture
I came here looking for a job, I'll leave here looking 4 a job. 😂33
My old job when I was in sani at this vegan plant, the manager would give people a week and then cut em. Every week was a reset dude it was stupid. He had a purpose with that but it was fucking stupid
Hello ! Is the Echlon front podcast available in apple podcast ?
This series is only available on KZhead, but the Debrief Podcast with Jocko and Dave are available at the Jocko Podcast
People fire themselves. It should never come as a surprise to the individual. If it is, YOU have failed as a leader.
Exactly. We should only fire someone after we've exhausted all options to train and mentor them.
What the hell is going on with the drinks on his desk. In front of his left hand. They disappear and reappear.
Mirror image, look at the microphone position.
I sent you a link
Most people fire themselves
when its time to fire your boss and you are bound by contract how is a good way to fire them?
This situation is difficult to come across - when a leader is being detrimental to the team. You may not be able to fire them if you are bound by contract, but you can step up and lead to replace them.
10:13 Humiliation is a common workplace tactic and abuse. I’ve experienced it and seen it a “million times “ and doesn’t work!
Well, if the social media platforms actually encourage 'humiliation,' then ppl in the workplace will become conditioned to believe this is a perfectly acceptable form of behavior and leadership. It's going on constantly in the newsmedia between both extreme political parties. It wasn't that prevalent a decade ago, but if the most powerful people overuse exploitative humiliation tactics, it gives regular people working "average" jobs the false impression that it's ok and normal to treat people like that. It's a sad commentary on our current culture.
@@elisabeth4342 I’ve even gotten desensitized to the political jargon and find myself in the name calling business but never really feel good after doing it. But professionally it’s unacceptable and yet more than abundant! Finding a fine balance between “being human “ (which “human is “your Momma “jokes” and “ being too honest “(which makes fellow employees not trust you in a lot of cases. ) . Integrity requires a lot of strength!!
@@Doodlefisher To add to this, integrity requires, at the very least, cognitive empathy. When you're conscientious, you always think before you speak - you DON'T want to deliver honesty in a tactless blunt fashion. At the same time, you realize the value of being honest and upfront with people. It doesn't help lying to them about important subject matters. So yes, it's a delicate balancing act communicating with honesty and facts, but with genuine intentions, emotional empathy, class and tact. It's not easy to do 24/7. But people love, respect and appreciate genuine character and compassion. It makes everyone's lives easier - especially in the workplace.
@@elisabeth4342 thank you! Makes a lot of sense!
@@Doodlefisher You're welcome!
Up
20 years in management and I've never fired anyone or right anyone up, seems mean.
I've had to explain to my own boss I don't want his aspects or job... but I'll take less so I can be there for my children. And I compete against American civilians.
This is all great in theory, until you get a terrible micromanager in government work, and there is a lot of them.
GET UNCOMFORTABLE to understand folks . Impulsive behavior is not good but correctable . Ignoring lazy workers is also non productive behavior just makes the hard chargers have to work harder or they quit making the team weak n ready to fail . Explain Offensive yes consequences of the Why . How to correct ✅. Then also give them something you noticed they are doing well before they leave after discipline talk truth don’t be a dick 😊be nice disciplinarian with wisdom not wisdumb of a know it all they know nothing
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Yeah. Definitely not easy to get incompetent people fired is it, Jocko? SMH.