Whatever Happened To Anti Virus Protection?
Remember anti-virus protection? Back in the day, installing anti-virus protection from McAfee or Norton was one of the first things you would do after purchasing a new laptop or computer. But, over the past several years, anti-virus protection has largely fallen out of favor. Cybersecurity, however, is still as important as ever. So, what happened? Well, one of the main reasons that anti-virus protection software was so critical back in the day was because Microsoft very much dropped the ball when it came to security. Windows XP had a massive raw socket vulnerability while Internet Explorer had a massive VB script vulnerability. When you combined these two issues, early computers became a virus magnet making anti-virus protection software extremely popular. However, since then, Microsoft has implemented most if not all of the security checks that these software perform directly into Windows itself, largely rendering additional anti-virus protection software useless. This video explains the history of anti-virus protection software and why anti-virus protection has largely fallen out of favor.
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Timestamps:
0:00 - The Good Ol Days
2:19 - Microsoft Drops The Ball
7:31 - Anti Virus Picks Up The Slack
11:34 - The Death Of Virus Protection
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Another major thing not mentioned in this video was the discontinuance of Java and Flash. Many virus exploits used vulnerabilities from those.
Java still exists, but it's not used as a browser plugin anymore. It's used to run mostly website back end software nowadays.
Yeah, I think this video also glosses over a few other points as well. Another one that came to mind is how we connect to the Internet. In the late 90's and early 2000's, it was common to use dialup which essentially meant you had a fairly direct connection to the Internet, meaning without any sort of firewall, you could have ports providing various services to the wider internet that could be used and abused, and were rarely secured properly. With the rise of broadband, we started using routers rather than simple modems. which provided NAT. While this isn't strictly a security feature in itself, it meant there was no direct connection to your machine from the outside world unless you specifically allowed it, meaning malicious actors had to get a little more creative.
@@EdKolisalso Flash is no longer used in browsers, but there's video games that used Flash technology in their UI, and are still played today
just to be 100% sure java ≠ javascrip, javascript is still used for client-side website programming (and i think its used on the server end to some degree as well)
As far as I can tell, Java applets were never widely used. Most people never even installed Java unless they were developing software. If a website required something on the client end, it generally used JavaScript instead, which most browsers enabled by default.
In the business world antivirus software hasn't gone away, it just evolved into EDR/XDR. We use SentinelOne for example, which uses both file signatures and behavioral heuristics which can catch interactive user behavior as well as automated malware. Such software often has integrated and automatic response capabilities such as asset-level quarantine or paging out to professional security analysts.
We got some McAfee appliances in our warehouse.
Yep trend micro and sentinelOne. Some antivirus jumped on the crypto train and became malware too. Malwarebytes has too much telemetry going on in the background.
@@garcjreww
@@HanSDevXMalwareBytes is also hot garbage 😂 created a malware dropper once that bypassed most AV but I only intended for it to work against Windows Defender, tested it against malwarebytes premium and it detected the first stage as malicious when it was written to disk but somehow wasnt fast enough or decided not to stop it from executing? So it ran my payload and gave me access to the PC whilst also making the hypithetical user think it had protected them. Showed a video of that to most of my friends and got then switched to Kaspersky free or ESET (nod32)
Didn’t wiz almost buy sentinel one?
To be honest in some moment using a third party antivirus became unbearable. Like, when I still used windows I always used Avast, but amount of malicious software I could get with time passing gradually became nonexistent. Using basic "internet survival instinct" was just enough. On the other hand, anti viruses themselves behave like a malware, constantly using higher and higher system resources with each update and keeping adding more aggressive ads. And the amount of false-positives was astonishing, Norton was even worse in that regard. But I still know older, less tech-literate people like my parents, who still like to install malware from MacCaffee. In my case last nail to the coffin of anti-virus software was ditching windows altogether and permanently switching to Linux. Here, permissions and firewall are just enough.
MacCaffe💀
Before switching to Linux one of the headaches I had was the Windows security stopping me from downloading and running things like CheatEngine. Whenever a security thing popped up it was a false flag.
really? my antivirus uses 0.20% cpu (with a 1s refresh rate) when idle and bellow 2% when accessing web pages for few seconds, ~300MB of ram with 1.9GB of storage. The web browser with 13 tabs uses 2.9GB of RAM, 4.22% CPU. A game like Cities Skylines II uses more than an antivirus; with 59.4GB of storage, 7GB of RAM, CPU above 10%. Todays modern machines are more powerful.
@@STCatchMeTRACjRo wait until you would want to play some demanding game when it comes to dynamic loading of assets, like an open-world rpg. Then how big handicap is antivirus is clearly visible: game constantly stutters when it wants to load something, cause AV use all the disc cache. It's even worse on a HDD.
Almost like a mob protection racket...
Paying a subscription for access to virus protection was always wild to me
So what do you use now for virus protection?
My family did it when I was in elementary school. I got malware from a pirated video editor and Avast helped clean it without having to reformat the PC.
@@Blazergl common sense
AVG worked well and was free...
@@BlazerglNothing. No longer an issue...
What I find odd is if you install 2 antivirus, they will usually flag each other as virus
Anti virus is still a virus like counter terrorists are still terrorists
its a strategy.
Every see one flag itself as a virus? I have. It was something called Panda.
No, Antivirus needs very high system privileges - it is behavior similar to malicious programs. Usual calculator will not ask for it.
Tbh i worked on an antivirus its a strat
I think the biggest reason that antivirus software is dying off is the fact that a lot of exploit vectors (such as Flash) have been sealed off, and new ones haven't been introduced. It's just a lot harder to get a virus if you don't make a habit of running random executables off of shady websites.
except in a lot of cases- they haven't been "sealed off" they have just been replaced with newer alternatives that just so happen to not have 99% of their threats discovered and marked down, Java, Flash, Unity, HTML5- give it 5 years and we'll be replacing the threats we know yet again for yet another black box full of exploits.
Anti-virus software was essential before Windows XP and Microsoft created far bigger security flaws than raw sockets and VBScript. The wide open hole of ActiveX made Flash look like a well guarded bank.
truth be told microsoft has its own virus protection that ships with windows and is practically non intrusive and just works, low key, makes the pc experience much better, it doesn’t feel like a bab you need to watch all the time now
What’s fun is that on Linux you just have good system design from the start with permissions and scrutiny from the entire world. Whereas windows has to cover for the fact that you can just do a few clicks and have malware installed
@@1495978707Its basically the same on Linux although much more people use Windows and therefore more malware gets spread out for that instead of Linux because they want to attack as most people as possible
@@1495978707Or maybe there’s also the fact that Linux is like 1% of the market share and aside from specific viruses targeting Linux servers the average Linux user is really at no risk of danger lmao
This. Exactly this. This video is sometimes misleading and has some half truths. But as you said, Windows Defender is more than enough for home users today.
I instinctively despise anything that has Microsoft's hands in it, but Defender is one of the only two that I can honestly praise (the other being Visual Studio). Coupled with an ad blocker to mitigate Indian pop-up scams, it's enough to protect my family from everyday threats they might encounter on the internet.
The last time I had an actual virus on my computer was around 1998, and it was because some of the younger guys in the office had brought infected floppy drives to work to play video games on the office computer, and it infected every computer in the office. That was a LONG time ago!
so, what it actually did to computers in that office?
@@helios8369 Nothing dramatic. The virus corrupted several documents including the squadron's deployment schedule, but we removed the virus by running an antivirus on every computer in the office, and we restored the corrupted documents from backups. I warned the young guys that any further use of personal floppies on an office computer would result in administrative action, and it never happened again. One thing that hasn't changed since then is the need to back up your files on a regular basis. It saved our bacon.
it really is a LONG time ago when you mentioned the floppy drives. we also use that to keep a copy of hangaroo and play on our school PC running win98. 😄
Damn! Those bad boys…
@@MicrosoftGuy They were young Airmen in their early 20s, so not that surprising.
Someone please tell scammers that anti-virus utilities are a thing of the past. I get about 10 notices a day that my McAfee subscription (which I never had) is about to expire.
We're going out of business sir so you get the refund but you must pay us google play cards for some reason.
One time I got a call saying my car insurance was about to expire. I don't even own a car. Did someone buy one in my name? Thanks for warning me... No, I think it's just a scam!
Or don’t tell them so that they never improve their game
@@anthonybf2 DO NOT REDEEM.
Norton and McAfee replaced the Winsocks upon installation in order to gain control upon file throughput. This slowed the speed of the I/O to a crawl. And, the original Winsock weren't restored when the antivirus was uninstalled. There is to say, the use of RAW sockets notably speeds up the computer. It wasn't done because of incompetence, but because of convenience...
90% of my computer is used for Steam, and 10% Chrome. Microsoft Defender can handle it 👍
😂 I like the split
Ms defender is a solid application to use now along with ms firewall
I use Kaspersky and it's extremely efficient
I actually had Norton up until very recently. Back when I was younger my mom bought it because it gave us (our family) peace of mind when using computers. It secured the expensive PC purchase through a simple we bought once like word (and only bought again when we wanted to upgrade). Flash forward and software is a subscription service, it's antivirus + 1000 features you don't want to pay for, it won't shut up with a billion pop-ups and takes control of your PC when IT fails and crashes, and you realize it's just bloatware that uses fear mongering to keep users subscribed. All operating systems and most popular websites today have enough security that Norton is pretty useless. Third party antivirus software also just doesn't help much. Like it doesn't do anything more than the default features now for AVERAGE users. But even for power users it's just become bloat and intrusive when they know how to navigate. Antivirus software literally depends on fear mongering to be relevant and preying on ignorant (of computers and the internet) populations.
anti virus hasn't gone anywhere. defender misses alot of things. apple has XProtect and Microsoft has defender. both cover VERY specific , worldwide campaigns.
Not as ubiquitous as it once used to be though
well the things is since virus dont break your computer most people don't care. i just never use my computer for my credit card. since with all the pirated games and porn it for sure has a lot of crap in it. and I cant use anti virus software other than defender because it flags a lot of programs that I use daily. and yeah paying for software is not an option when you make 300 USD(minimum wage is less than 200) a month as a programmer in Argentina. we used to at least have reasonable steam price with 90% discount compared to the USA but people using vpns to buy games here ruined it for us and was removed. so we have no option but to pirate everything even corporate software in public and private sector is all pirated. also nobody ever talks about online privacy here. is a non issue for normal people.
@@LogicallyAnswered Exactly. Also, Microsoft makes money just by selling enterprise protection suite (Microsoft Defender for Endpoint, Microsoft Defender for Cloud etc.) to big corporations. This is treated as a separate business unit in MSFT.
I still use Malwarebytes because I've noticed that it catches things that Windows Defender doesn't, and vice-versa.
@@Dumb_Killjoy Malwarebytes used to be my favorite AV, and the only problem I had was that it would slow down my PC quite a bit. But when I saw it couldn't detect Windows XP horror edition, which is 3 years old at this point, disappointed me. I dug into some research about the best AV software, and I found Kaspersky. My PC was so much faster after removing Malwarebytes, and I installed Kaspersky thinking it would be even slower since I would be getting better protection. But no! My performance didn't drop in the slightest! I was very happy to see that not only Kaspersky offers a free version, that has literally no ads or shoves in features to the UI you can't use unless you upgrade, they have a full 1 month trial you can use for the Standard version and Plus! So you basically had 2 months of free trials and the fact that Kaspersky offered those two free trials AND a free version that doesn't bug you about plus or premium actually made me wanna buy the software more and I did actually end up purchasing 5 devices for 2 years. I have had no regrets.
The thumbnail almost gave me a heart attack 😂
😂
Of course, the trojan virus has been detected stuff always scare multiple users. 99.9% of those are just scammers trying to scare people into paying them money.
I wonder if anyone has fallen asleep while watching KZhead on their computer and woke up to this thumbnail
Nostalgic🙃
They are focused on entiprise systems now. For instance, your workplace might use an agent to monitor all your company's devices, etc. Endpoint security
My dad still buyin Norton Antivirus and been doin so since the 90s lol. One loyal one.
It fucking sucks though and so does the company. Both Kaspersky and Windows Defender are way better.
I give your dad prop.
Good old Norton Virus! 😁
🗿
So horrible giving that company his money
I think Windows 8 was just ahead of its time and viewed through a negative light because Microsoft doesn’t seem to have fanboys like Apple does. Just like dark themes, online radio subscriptions, tablets etc an OS focused towards touch screens probably isn’t far away from being a need for a lot of people. I see it at my work place and as an owner of an ROG Ally I regularly see posts from people who complain about that handheld not playing well with windows desktop.
Oh no definitely. Apple gets applauded for what Microsoft gets booed for there's no vice versa. I do think the best route forward is a singular OS that can become optimized to whatever form factor it's being used for. Like tablet mode in Windows 11 should be a LOT more than it currently is. They could also introduce a gaming mode like SteamOS has on the steam deck. Something that isn't full desktop windows ALL THE TIME would go a long way for keeping windows relevant as users have significantly different form factors.
@@vullord666Linux is what people are looking for. Just the way Linux works seems to mean making new desktop environments and UIs a lot easier. Though SteamOS uses KDE which still isnt as great on a touch screen as something like GNOME. Windows 8 was also pretty stable and lightweight compared to 10. 10 used to be such a buggy mess, i hated using it.
"I think Windows 8 was just ahead of its time and viewed through a negative light because Microsoft doesn’t seem to have fanboys like Apple does" No, Windows 8 had just bad UI and UX. "Windows 8 shutdown" was the most popular google search for months because the UI was so bad at communicating way of shutting down (on desktop only possible via gesture or command line). Tiles just don't work at a large desktop too. The reason why Apple's design philosophy works and Windows (8)s dosen't, is that Apple still recognizes the differences between Touch and Desktop UX. MacOS still feels and operates different than iOS, despite its optical alignments. The Menus and workflows all work the same since Mac OS X Lion, only the system settings got an major design change. Microsoft on the other hand went the "one ring to rule them all"-direction by trying to make one operating system and its UX universal for all devices.
@@Big-Chungus21I have mixed feelings on 10. My first laptop went through the semi-forced upgrade from Windows 7 and was never the same (it was only 4 years old at the time). On the other hand, my current laptop came with Windows 10 (since updated to 11) and has had no issues running either. IMO, the bugs with Windows 10 were due to Microsoft forcing it onto computers that couldn't properly run it. I'm reasonably sure that's why they put restrictions on which devices could upgrade to Windows 11.
@@karlrovey Really the reason they put restrictions on which devices can use Windows 11 has to do with whether the CPU has a TPM chip. There isnt much of a difference between the first intel CPUs with TPMs and the generation before that, or even those CPUs and modern Celeron or Pentiums. In fact a 7th gen i5 or i7 is probably more powerful than a new celeron or pentium. They say its for security reasons, though a TPM isnt necessary to have a secure device. Really, theyre doing this because it forces people to buy new computers after the market recently began to dramatically decrease. This means new Windows licenses being paid for with each computer manufactured. Windows 10 could run fine on some pretty damn old computers, I used a 4th gen i3 for a long time with Windows 10 and it ran pretty ok, but only after those updates had been rolling in for quite a few years. The biggest issue was the OS being rushed out in order to silence the complaints about Windows 8 / 8.1. Yet I would still rather use 8.1 than those early versions of Windows 10.
Microsoft got sued during Vista for buying giant antispyware and having an antivirus that has lower level access to windows than the antivirus community. Essentially accusing them of trying to put them out of business. This stalled Microsoft's efforts
Lol, they got sued for making better antivirus software. That just proves that McAfee, Norton, and all the rest are just scams.
And who can forget the good old days when your computer could get hosed with malware or trojans just by leaving it on all night? Fun times.
Those operating systems still can bro....dont run XP
@@jmanakajosh9354 Great tip, thanks.
how could that happen?
@@vorkheftruck Unlike today, the older versions of Winblows had no built-in firewall. That meant that after logging your IP address, hackers could plant malware directly onto your computer. Back in the 90s, a friend of mine's boss got his personal laptop totally trashed simply after leaving it on all night at work (and inadvertently connected) to perform routine maintenance.
@@vorkheftruckIt was so fucked. You can literally run XP in a VM, connect it to the internet, and it can still happen
I ditched Avast when it started just deleting exes from my computer at complete random, it even got to the point where it deleted exes from it's own folder. And best of all I had no way of reporting this.
Avira was doing that to me, Id try to recover them and Id say "this file could not be recovered". Good thing I had a cold storage backup of my stuff..
Users have still not become tech savvy. There are still a huge number of users who interact with emails such as refunds from Amazon and download from sketchy websites. 12:33
yes but assuming you just watch KZhead and well other official and respected apps on the browser your prob going to do fine, and i never use my Gmail/email anyway.
XP had a security package. I believe it was introduced with SP2, it may have been SP3 though, and it had a firewall.
I remember how much slower the computer was after installing Norton.
yep, it was bloat ware from the start. seemed like waiting forever for puter to boot. OH, and then slowing the puter down so much u was wait for it to do whatever. And thins was on a 'fast'' pc at that time too.
This makes me nostalgic for XP and Win 7. I loved chasing an infected file that upon discovery by anti-virus software would rename itself. Good times.
Many ppl hate Windows 8, but I'm really nostalgic about it, because we had Windows 8.1 at school for most of my time there, and I studied IT and coding so I would be there many hours a week
In the 2000s I just used Avast and Sygate Personal Firewall. Worked like a charm and it was a lightweight combo.
I had the same convo! Not enough people knew about Sygate 😅
And what do you use now?
@@guydreamr windows 11's own protection.
Am still using avast as its easier to disable temporarily compared to windows defender.
i ran avast for a long while till i switched to Malwarebytes. i still have it to this day, its good at cleaning up old corrupted files actually.
The biggest anti-virus software is in your mind.
Still remember using Norton Antivirus, and how it constantly scanned my machine, slowing it down to the point at times making the PC nearly unusable.
symantec endpoint protection is excelkent norton sucks bit it was good in the dos days
One big plus for dedicated anti-virus software is that they are great for people that aren't tech-savvy. Most anti-viruses auto-update and usually don't require system restarts to update, while most Windows updates are voluntary and most people just hit "update later" when prompted because they don't want to stop using their computer for 2 minutes while it restarts. Being tech-savvy isn't just knowing to not click on the giant "you've won!" scam ad banners, but also knowing that you should keep all your firmware and software up to date as much as possible, knowing to check the actual email address and not just the nickname that shows, knowing to check file extensions fully, etc. Dedicated anti-virus programs and ad-blockers are the best ways I can try to keep my parents' and grandparents' computers safe, since I'm not physically there with them watching over their shoulder at what they're clicking on.
Sometimes security companies you trusted are the ones that sucks and put the whole company in the mouth of hackers. Can you believe the 1 of the Big 4 was hacked and credentials were stolen because they trusted security company were slacked? This sort of cases happens more often and put us in wonder if security companies are real deals or not.
More people also use smartphones/tablets which primary way of installing programs is app stores which are less prone to be malware compared to some .exe file on some site. Perhaps Microsoft will also get people to use their store on Windows instead, lol.
Very true
@@helios8369 hence why I wrote less prone and not 100 % malware free lol
"appstores are less prone to malware" lol, you've clearly never used said appstores before, they're littered with endless scams and copycat apps that mimic the legit ones and shove ads, harvest your data and hog your system resources harshly and relentlessly, alot of apps are also just money grabs, they don't even hide it anymore, and some get millions of downloads regularly because people are stupid and don't take 5 seconds to think and read the app before installing them, also, said malware and scam apps are regularly approved by the stores themselves.
And who could forget the days of Adobe Flash Player. Back in the day even KZhead needed a flash player to work and was prone to viruses.
Thanks for reminding me to open my anti-virus software and run a full system scan. A big reason I got away from "always on" anti-virus software is because it behaved like a virus itself. Constant pop-ups, slowed my computer down, blocked me from things I _wanted_ to do, and was often unclosable. Heck, in the fifteen minutes I've had mine open while this video was playing, I've gotten three huge pop-ups from it about things I don't care about.
I swear modern anti virus software has made it absurdly difficult to add exceptions, if it lets you at all..
My parents were paying for Kaspersky for ages and all it did was bog their older laptops down and cause issues when the overpriced subscription ended. Eventually my mom had an issue where she completely forgot and didn't write down her user password and it didn't just auto-login one time, so the OS was reinstalled, which ended up being a good thing as it removed all the bloat and I just set up Windows Defender and now her computer runs much better than before. Antivirus companies nowadays seem to survive on older users that still believe viruses that will destroy their computer are common.
One sentence: "McAfee last Monday after trying to download a simple, harmless video game PDF..." I got rid of all of it. It didn't give a notice that it had expired. It lied and told me I had 5 Trojan viruses (only takes 1 to cripple a damn computer). And SOMEHOW managed to keep sending me ads to renew a $90 subscription after it was all uninstalled. I go with House Call and Windows Defender now. That Redditor was right: "The first thing I do whenever I get a new Laptop isn't to start downloading my apps again, it's to delete McAfee."
To be honest, one still needs a day to setup a new Windows computer - remove all crapware and change lots and lots of Windows settings. 0:00
Windows is the virus now
It takes a while day just to remember how to setup the computer with onedrive randomly moving and deleting files
Antivirus used to be like paying protection money to the mafia. Pirating one is a real Vito Corleone vs Don Fanucci moment.
I have mcafee on my laptop and I’m pretty sure it promotes me downloading viruses so I end up having to get a new computer faster. On my desktop, I managed to remove mcafees permission to do anything when setting it up and it’s been so much better.
@@helios8369 Using window's uninstaller to remove mcaffe I ended up making my laptop unable to boot, having to factory reset it to get it working again. These things are malicious bruh
Why not just uninstall it? Is it a work or school laptop or something?
Years ago I got a backdoor installed on my 2nd computer , from that moment I get anxious every time Defender scans my PC!
How’d that happen?
Using a custom hosts file and a malware/adware blocking dns like Adguard are also active measures you can take to block known harmful sites.
I worked for an AV company currently working as an IT admin. Anti virus has not gone anywhere. It's still very present they just renamed it into cyber security these days. It's still expensive and companies do have to pay for it alot yearly and definitely as long as computers are there, it's gonna be always there. May be you do not use antivirus but people works in tech uses it as it's the laptops are provided by companies with default installed security packages. As a KZheadr you might not need it but wait till one day a ransomware attack happens and you will make sure to use it after that😂😂😂. Ransomware has a season. When it happens it happens in bulk. I've had a customer who killed himself because he owned a studio and was effected and all their footages were gone and he couldn't answer the clients. Installing antivirus would have enabled auto backup encryption which would have saved him his life.
Being a business is like putting a target on your back, even with an anti-virus you can never forget people are shooting at you. Great advice! Such a sad story.
That or creating a cold backup? Hard drives have become very affordable, and the adage of having 3 copies for important data has never been more relevant.
@@Flight042 taking 3 backup is the job of an IT admin. A small business do not do that usually because it's time consuming.
@@chairpants Windows allows for automatic backup's with one button press. The initial setup will take less than 30 seconds for an experienced person, 2 minutes for an inexperienced person reading a guide. Risk mitigation of single point of failures of mission critical asset in any industry is standard.
Antivirus or "Cyber Security Software" didn't protect the world at all for ransomeware viruses, just look at "Wanna Cry". All the Antivirus was useless. Software that operates with scanning and blacklisting can only protect reliable against malware that is already known. And if the user just licks "yes" and "accept" for everything while operating within a poorly administrated IT network, no software in the world will protect you. You also don't need Antivirus to enable some backups, there is enough software for that and most of the time the OS itself can do it. Setting up backups is IT administration 101 and not the duty of some external, paid antivirus software. Stop selling snake oil.
Windows defender is life! It has been 11 years since i install an antivirus, windows defender is more than enough for me. I visit sketchy sies often without any issue.
I remember they made my computer slower and more prone to freezing, just like the Internet Explorer that gave you a million taskbars. Then when it expired, it'd give you pop ups and nag you so much you'd start thinking it was just a virus that convinced you to pay for it all along. More issues would come into a computer with expired anti virus than one that never had any. Or at least that was the impression given from the perspective of an average user like me and my family. My dad got Norton at some point and after struggling with that there was McAfee next year, and then something else I don't remember on a different year, until early 2010s I downloaded Security Essentials and it kicked them out the system and it seemed to be doing better than those but without need for subscription fees or expiration dates.
my first pc in 2004 i used avast. and in the XP era i got a lot of viruses. once i lost all my archives because all of them were giving sigh of infection. in windows 7 when microsoft defender released i started using it. i also never had a severe virus case because i was more experienced.
I used to use Avast but after noticing it would gradually slow my computer's performance down and then give me popups that I have X amount of issue to resolve, all locked behind a paywall ofc, I promptly removed it and my computer ran better than ever since then.
Back in the days when Microsoft Office was a better option than Google Drive
I’d argue that Microsoft office is still better for more intense tasks.
@@LogicallyAnswered I'm just speaking from my personal experience with Google Sheets, I've found it to be useful for advanced functions like API Scraping in the same way that Excel is. But I'm just learning so time will tell how that changes for me
I'd pick neither because I'm a user of open source software. I use LibreOffice.
You mean Google's set of office apps like Google Docs. Microsoft Office is better tho imo. Here comes an argument in the replies!!
I've used both; I prefer MS Office as it has more features and also a native desktop app. Scrolling though a 45 page document in a web app is nightmarishly slow!
It's honestly bloatware now, some computers like Dell come with Mcaffe installed...
Most annoying part of anti-virus is the constant notification everytime I just want to use the PC for game, youtube videos and web browsing. They constantly popup to remind us when it is expiring and constantly remind us to buy the subscription
I still use anti-virus software because I go to a lot of places mostly for really old obscure software for really really dumb projects. And most sketchy sites that still host a legit download, will try and can breach defenses just by you being on them. I mean I still have to be tech savvy and alert, but I rather have a extra layer even if its a bit paranoid when it shouldn't, And also because windows defender is about as good at its job as a fish is breathing on land (Actually, it does a great job at letting files it shouldn't be on the computer but tries to stop software that's legit in every form and fashion, like a unity game from itch, from surviving. Yeah, no. its anti-software, not anti-virus). I rather not lose my computer because I missed one key detail. I do not recommend to anyone to do what I do, because I just have really dumb projects that requires just as dumb software that nobody has a download link for anymore because the company probably went bankrupt, its not a safe or cheap way to use your computer. Don't do I do at home kids.
This is what I have to do for modding my consoles and console games. Sometimes the mods i'm looking for cease being hosted on legitimate sites, and I have to look for them on mirrors which aren't always safe.
Looks like we are on the same club.😂
These days most of the threats are neutralized on the server side. The ones that do trickle through are either zero-day, or social engineering scams which are harder to detect. I run a Watchguard firewall for a client, which filters all incoming traffic for email, web and application filtering and the only threats to come through are some social scams which are obvious. One thing I am religious about is never allowing users to run as administrators, as that extra layer of authentication stops most malware dead in its tracks via password prompt.
Do you run those checks with or without deep packet inspection (https)?
@@zNoah for email, deep packet as that's where all our threats originate. For https, just a basic block list suffices. Any website that's deemed harmful is blocked entirely anyway.
What about those users who use the default Administrator account and protect it with 'Password', or 'Admin' as the password. I used to see that so often when I was working with small businesses.
@@ConradNeill They're on their own. :)
@@ConradNeill I haven't work on small businesses, but you could create an admin user and remove their account from the admin group
Good ol days where website didn't ask you if they could get administrative access, location access. Download permissions or notification permissions. They just did it
Great video, brings back some memories of installing Avast, Kaspersky TDSS Killer, MBAM. Every few months you'd get the trojan popup, or malware... PUP... PUMs.. In the Cyber Security industry, traditional 'AV' still lives on in EDR/'XDR' platforms for companies/organizations. Microsoft Defender, Sentinel One, Crowdstrike, Bitdefender, Sophos, etc. It's about as ubiquitous as it's ever been. Though, the function vs traditional AV is quite different now that Java/Flash are deprecated. Now the main concern is are these endpoint agents secure, patched by vendors. You're putting your data in the hands of an external entity, the more things change the more they stay the same!
Another important thing to mention is that hackers prefer to target companies and organizations rather than individuals.
I stopped using antivirus when I stopped being a kid.
some people never grow up... it might not be a problem though
Do we ever stop being a kid?
Sorry to tell you but your still a kid. Windows 10 & 11 has Windows Defender built in. It was an Anti Virus developed by Microsoft and is installed in all windows. This is a huge reason no one downloads Anti Viruses anymore.
@@helios8369 isn't this a video about windows PC. I didn't see any Linux or Mac. Just like In the video he already explained windows 8 was when windows defender was being standard. So no matter what when you run a fresh copy it will always have an Anti virus. Just like Microsoft edge is always on every PC. Your not gonna use edge but it still gonna be the top used browser. Also for what reason do you wanna turn off the stock Anti Virus. It doesn't have huge impact when I play games. Even on my handheld PC they run great.
@@helios8369 he said his not a kid because he doesn't use anti virus. But you really do use one. Im assuming you need that resource for gaming. We'll I have windows 10 on my steam deck a $400 handheld pc. It's basicly a low end PC for gaming. If your PC is lagging or running bad. The Anti Virus isn't the problem and is something else. I'm getting 60fps on high back 4 blood heck even 30fps on Forza Motorsports a brand new un optimized game from Microsoft. All with the stock anti virus running. A lot of the issues can be fix by just adding more ram.
I remember before, i would go to a site i normally go to and then all of a sudden the page will change and display Windows XP file explorer and a fake virus scanner saying there are like 20 viruses or so and then wants you to download a virus protection. It will then ask for your credit card to pay and get rid of the "viruses" Only thing was that i was using Windows Vista and they were starting to annoy me becauae they would appear at least once a week
I remember spreading virus just because using a pendrive in different computers and browsing some files. Is that still the case? Also I still always create a folder named autorun.inf with a file inside, in pendrives, as it suposedly protect or protected from some poorly written malware, not sure if still relevant. Once I saw a pendrive that had a physical lock that could set it to read-only, that was great but I only saw it a fancy looking "mp3" pendrive or something instead of widespread.
Two things Hari did not mention in this video: 1. Kaspersky. 2. Mac. I wonder why.
I started with Windows98 , XP , Vista, Windows 7 , and Windows 10 at the moment.
I think the Base Windows Defender was good enough for most users I guess.
Same thing happend to me, McAfee came as pre-installed when i got new gaming pc :/ and It's locked behind paywall so i had crappy mcafee to get out of my pc.
I've never used antivirus like that. Once in a while if I download something sketchy, I'll install malwarebytes to scan it but that's it. If I didn't have malwarebytes I'd just run it in a vm
Just use Virus total if the file is small enough
3:40 please stop with the zooming, I feel like you just slapped some stock photos on some text and added your voice. I still like your videos, but it's been bugging me for a while.
I know it's the same zoom effect like 10 times! it's not in time with what he says or anything, it's just a bunch of stock photos zooming in, it's really annoying and it distracts from what he says instead of adding to it
Agreed, it makes it really hard to watch. I'd rather just see his face talking.
ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM AGAIN It's honestly terrible to watch
Really appreciate the feedback guys. Will let my editor know about this.
Not to mention that AV companies became kind of scummy. Such as Symantec forcing life lock on its users and requiring a credit card for the free trial.
at least we still have Kaspersky!!!
And everyone will argue about whether to pronounce it like a Russian name or like Casper Sky! Speaking of which, did they go out of business after the sanctions? It's funny though, thinking that one of the best antivirus programs comes from a country known for producing viruses!
@@EdKolis who better to write antivirus software then ? :)
I became a teenager and realized what scams were and just kinda got smarter about the internet. I wouldn’t say it’s useless but I’ve needed antivirus so little I find little need for it and defo can’t justify paying for it anymore.
its even less useful now now with protection auto installed (windows defenders etc.).
Some Anti-virus are often used to manage things more easily like firewall. due it having a more userfriendly UI.
This days even firefox prevents any downloaded file that has a weird code from downloading. I notice this happens a lot with anime mp4 files of higher quality.
It's funny because the notion that antivirus software has become sort of optional is completely new to me.
Another thing not mentioned in the video - viruses too have evolved and changed: makes little sense to fry your computer or to demand money - gives no profit, and you can just reinstall OS (or even get back to restore point). But making your computer secretly work for the hacker - oh, can bring so much more profit. I think our computers are still full of viruses, they just don't bother us, so we don't care :)
While the video is correct about the trend of the general public to avoid premium anti-virus subscriptions obviously the world still needs anti-virus since Windows would be virtually unusable without Windows Security. Windows Security is not enough to stop zero day attacks or sophisticated MaaS based browser hacks. Plus windows defender doesn't offer protection from AD/pop-up scams. None of the truly nasty stuff is properly addressed by Windows Security alone. It's difficult to show my clients the money and time saved from hacks that never happened because they had proper antivirus and internet security in place. Horror stories are still the best tool we have to convince the laymen that the Internet is an increasingly dangerous place. Also, who are all of these people that know how to restore and backup their computers? 😊
Another very important part of security is HUMAN error 😕 we need threat-modeling and training built into the HR process at organizations everywhere and sadly people never seem to see it till it's to late.
Great description buddy! Nice video!
I remember my dad demanding i had 5-6 of those on my pc/laptop. These were ccleaner, superantuspyware, avg, the build in one from windows, and a few others. We now know many of these collect and sell your information, especially when using these versions on your phone. It’d slow my computer down like crazy too! (And thats with all popups shut off)
I always used a hacked antivirus software that couldnt detect its own hack.
Doesn't sound too reliable lol...
Back during Windows 7 days . When I installed the base OS..and have not put in an antivirus.. and went online to patch the windows. It caught a virus minutes after going online.
We still use anti-virus software. Almost everyone. Windows Defender = anti virus software. It was a software package just like norton before Micorosft bought the software to release it within Windows. It still slows down your pc, still gives fake positives and still doesn't stop real virusses. You would say that with all data Microsoft sends from our Computers, they would be able to block the bigger fish, prevent ur pc files from being locked, yet it still happends. And Microsoft hasn't been getting much safer over the years. They still have to fix tens, if not hundreds of security flaws each and every month. Even when their own azure cloud is being hacked, they just ignore it for months, leaking government data from many countries. And just say it was a small oopsie.
The RAW socket argument in this video is extremely flawed. I remember at the time Steve Gibson has been criticised for scare crowing for attention, as he has always been controversial in cybersecurity circle. Windows XP (and Windows NT as a whole) uses BSD socket stack and both UNIX and Linux has full RAW socket capability and they have been fine for years. AFAIK, there wasn't any substantial exploits against WinXP's RAW socket. By the time of WinXP SP2, the whole network and system security has been tightened and RAW socket ability has been nerfed. So the whole argument about this is a moot point. Also network/RCE exploit isn't the same as virus. The high profile virus/worm attacts by network are SQL Slammer and Blaster. These are not network socket related but network service related. Lately I feel this channel's information accuracy has been degrading for quite sometime. Has anyone pay attention on research and factchecking?
I haven't but like you when people tell me we don't need antivirus it raises a big red flag! In a world filled with data-leaks, pirating, tons of boomers still in the workplace and a low digital awareness from younger generations due to mobile compute it's VERY concerning.
@@jmanakajosh9354 It's not that we don't need AV software anymore, we just don't need to be consciously engaged with it because Defender is activated by default. Also because Defender runs silently most of the time, it might seem like you have no AV at all.
The stages involved in antivirus protection include prevention, detection, search, and removal of viruses and other types of malware. Antivirus software helps in resolving problems by proactively identifying and eliminating cyber threats, such as keyloggers, browser hijackers, Trojan horses, worms, rootkits, spyware, adware, botnets, phishing attempts, and ransomware attacks.
Several statements in this video are not necessarily accurate: Windows XP SP2 for what I remember came with Firewall, that was prior than Windows 7 as stated here. Windows 7 came with Windows Defender, that was prior than Windows 8 as stated here. The reality is that Windows ships with antivirus and is not that bad out of the box. With antivirus, firewall and some other security features; Microsoft made the need of 3rd party antivirus impractical. - Because most 3rd party antivirus are Paid versions and most of the times they are not better than the antivirus shipped with Windows. - Because when more than 1 antivirus resides on a computer, resources get affected and/or conflicts can arise. Currently one of the tools to keep selling the Windows OS and push for updates to keep revenue is the antivirus. When Microsoft declares an OS End Of Life, they stop antivirus support in terms of updates and the cloud. That way the user is compelled to acquire a newer current Microsoft OS that will eventually go through the same cycle. I hope this helps. Best regards
I run Win10 Pro with Malwarebytes to do scientific data number crunching and word processing. I also use Firefox a lot. Yet I will get notified of PUPs or PUMs every 1-3 months from Malwarebytes, and haven't been notified about a virus in several years. The take away from this video seems to be that ir's not necessary to use Malwarebytes. Is it safe to really do that?
No. It is not safe to do that, unless you're already inside a monitored network like a corporation with an IT department. It's MOSTLY dangerous to small businesses but if you have the ability use Malwarebytes.
I use Norton. I am far too paranoid not to have anti-virus, Firewall and VPN. I might be a fool, but at this point I feel safer.
People also don't pirate things as much these days which is definitely a big factor.
The funny part about this is the vast majority of people still do this unless they own a Chromebook
I basically stop using dedicated antivirus when windows 10 comes out. The new Microsoft Defender is pretty good protecting Windows. Before that, protection is limited to spyware and monthly security update, similar to Windows Security Essentials
Basic cyber security advanced so much that scammers have had to revert back to phone scams, where the network is so weak it’s as though it was made for the benefit of scammers
the first 30 seconds put me down memory lane lollol
I purchased a laptop for my daughter last week and I was wondering whether I'd need to buy AV. I haven't bought a laptop in years.
@@helios8369 that was pretty much my thought. Thankyou 👍
I got great memories of using VBA code in Excel to do all manner of computer tasks that were "admin disabled" at my job. Lol
Excellent video! Oddly enough, it just came up in my recommendations. About two weeks ago I got a notice that McAfee was going to expire and I decided not to renew it because I get free antivirus from Cox Cable. It is peculiar that this video just came up in my recommendations though! 🤣😂🤣
Even back when viruses were a thing, you were better off not using anti-virus software and simply being responsible. Anti-virus software really didn't do much of anything unless you went high-end like Kaspersky or Bitdefender. Crap like Mcafee only sold customers a false sense of security, resulting in more problems because people thought they were safe. Some people were so clueless they'd install anti-virus, then exit out of it every time the computejr booted because they didn't want it running in the background. Somehow they couldn't understand that if you exit out complete, it can't do anything at all. So they'd buy an annual subscription, then immediately shut down the software every time it started.
So should I just uninstall mcaffee? I had a 1 year trial when I got my laptop and it’s never been renewed but it’s also saying that like it’s still doing stuff
Windows got a firewall with the launch of Windows XP SP2. It was bad enough that ISP in the XP era would offer free security software to combat it. Think Zone alarm. Microsoft offered a subscription based AV with Windows Live OneCare. A month before Windows 7 was launched, Microsoft Security Essentials was released. It did not come preinstalled with Windows 7 due to anti-trust concerns. Windows Defender was Windows 7 firewall and anti Spyware software. They did merge with Windows 8. Fortunately Microsoft Ignored antitrust concerns in the end because again how bad it was.
I often wonder what happened to all the music people downloaded in the mid 2000s
It's a lost art, mostly that music probably ended up in landfilled hard drives.
This video made me remember that I need to update my Avast virus definitions 😂
Plug for Malwarebytes, very lightweight and some great additional internet security.
I once used an antivirus but as the years went by it was getting bloaty, slowing down my desktop and became as good as a piece of malware itself. Then the AV company outsourced its support. The "support" was more interested in hawking its own programs applying really high pressure sales techniques. It was not support. It was toxic. I just let the subscription go and enjoyed a faster computer.
i have seen some videos where they show windows defender vs anti-virus, and defender is good but not as good as some of anti-viruses, but i do remember when anti viruses were very intrusive to your user experience with content pop up for update, when pen drive being connected, Mutiple notification when you are online, but now you probably won't even notice its running.also i probably don't need it , but its better than formatting and reinstalling the whole windows with software, just for that reason i am using an anti-virus.
well this would only work for windows users and apple users as they both get a free AV but assuming your not going to sketchy websites most free AV are fine.
have i accidentally sniffed some LSD or something because the zooms and effects on the background images are wild stuff
The trend on the enterprise side has been to bundle in anti-malware into EDR tools like Crowdstrike or Cortex.
Windows XP SP2 came with Firewall too
Malwarebytes will only be the optional third party antivirus
I still remember using avast in 2009 on my old vaio laptop and it actually stopped it from booting and I had to do get into safe mode just to uninstall it. Since then I just stopped using third party AVs.
i love having Norton lol the prices for the extra packages are ridiculous though