REVEALED: The Secrets of an Arc Fault Detection Device AFDD
Within the latest edition of the UK wiring regulations BS7671 18th Edition Amendment 2, AFDDs (arc fault detection device) are now required on socket circuits within specific electrical installations.
Gary Hayers takes a trip to the test lab of Lewden Palazzoli UK to find out how an AFDD works.
The test rig show can replicate arcs defined in the product standard for AFDDs BS EN62606.
=== AD ====================
More information Lewden AFDD range.
hub.efixx.co.uk/lewden-afdd
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00:00 Arc Fault Detection Devices in BS7671 18th Edition Amendment 2
01:00 How do AFDDs operate - Lewden test rig
02:10 The importance of carbon in arc detection
02:59 Simulating a series arc fault and AFDD tripping
03:48 RCBOs don't detect arc faults
06:09 How do AFDDs detect arc signature currents
08:00 The difference between "good: sparks and arcs
09:50 AFDD Self-testing functions
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❌ This content on this channel is for electrical professionals.❌ ==================================
📹 Presented by
Gary Hayers - Editor eFIXX
with
Ian Peacock - Technical Manager - Lewden Palazzoli
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#efixx #electricians #AFDDs
Maybe its me, but having seen videos by JW etc on AFDDs I kinda need more than a 'lab rig' demonstration that has been built to show it working. There needs to be a much more 'real world' example for me to know that they will genuinely save lives. That is to say the lab rig is contrived such that it will trip the AFDD ignoring the fact that people don't have carbon rods with adjustable spacings between in line conductors as part of their 'standard' install. (I also appreciate that making a rig that is repeatable and reliable is importnat for demo purposes). I have NO doubt AFDDs work for the specification they have been made to meet, and that specification goes into great depth about when, and how, it should trip. But given others have tried to replicate 'real world' situations and sturggled to trip the AFDDs I think we need a demo that is genuinely more 'real' to show that they work in the real world and will save lives. Maybe its just me. And maybe when the costs eventually, and inevitably, fall this will be a moot point.
I have said the same thing. Please someone show us the real evidence, a real life installation were arching is none to be a problem , and not some sales rep telling you what you want to hear just so he can make a sale .
Agree the test rig should be a socket with loose connections to see the whole senero of an arc in a real installation , this way you should see the arc , then the carbonising of the PVC and then the action of the device. I guest you would detect the smell of burning , long before the device trips.
@@adrianmawby9009 Yes but only if you are in the vicinity. And even then you might not realise where it's coming from. I think the real benefit of these devices is where the area (room, flat, house...) happens to be unoccupied at the time of the fault - or when the fault is occurring in some uninhabited space (loft, garage, under floorboards, etc).
@@gastube22 Not necessarily I am aware of one house fire that started this way and the smell of the fire inside the stud wall was initially mistaken for having come in through the nearby open window. Was only when the plasterboard cracked from the heat and collapsed that it was identified what the real source was. Had something cut the supply off then it might have stopped the fire spread or at least provided another piece of evidence to make the occupiers suspect a possible internal ignition had occurred.
Missing from the list of High Risk Buildings: houses where people make DIY AFDD test-rigs in their bedroom! :-D Interesting to see the comment about graphite corresponding to carbonised PVC, that gives a bit of a clue to their risk model. But it's sockets not lighting, which suggest it's not rodent damage or the ever-sketchy capacitive-droppers in budget LED room lighting. I assume they've got good data from fire authorities on the risk they're protecting from, but what is it: loose installation wiring; faulty double-insulated equipment ("amazon special" wall-warts, etc); mistreated flex/plugs (pinching, pulling)?
Man I've learnt a lot from this channel than I did in a year
Thanks for this explanatory and eye-opening video!
Brilliant explanation and demonstration - a game changer!
Muchisimas gracias por la descripcion de la proteccion, todo muy detallado!
Great device, puts my days of fitting the old Bladed MCB's to shame. Well done LP and thanks for sharing guys. 😃
Brilliant video as ever, I didn’t know there was difference between a spark and an arc. Cheers Gas
Excellent video, I now understand what they do, what they are for!
Very informative and well explained 👍
Thanks 👍🏻
It would be interesting to see devices switching off and on rapidly too see if that affects the afd. Likewise seeing a scope trace of the waveform of the AC supply.
Very interesting thank you 👍
Great stuff!...looks like the future of consumer units will be these and SPDs what more do you need lol... I had my doubts about these but hearing it from the horses mouth clears up a lot of things, especially the bit about Carbon/Copper electrodes as the burning PVC produces carbon. clever stuff.
Nice one gaz interesting stuff 🙌🏻🙌🏻think I’ll be getting them for my board change at home, I’m sold on the little smart led light that’s on them 🤣🤣
Given an AFDD apparently looks for some form of arc waveform ‘signature’ and every arc and spark waveform will have a random element to its structure you would expect to get a percentage of false negative (non trip on an arc fault) and false positive (trip on no arc fault) outcomes. I wonder what this percentage of reliability is?
That should be much more quantifiable with UK AFDDs already user-reporting the arc “signature” they trip about vs US we don’t even get feedback re if a combo breaker tripped for RCD vs AFDD, we just carefully avoid brushed motor treadmills in new homes…
Great question! In the video they try to differentiate between an ‘arc’ and a ‘spark’, does the relevant AFDD spec address the trip waveform issue? Just the promise of some potentially glitchy microprocessor driven device is enough to raise concerns in my mind.
@@adrianshingler9783 Ditto in mine, too. My first thought is that I'm only going to feel comfortable with a software-driven AFDD if I have a passive RCBO immediately upstream of it. I'm not going to say that software-driven devices are inherently bad - American GFCIs (All active devices) can trip quicker than a passive RCD, and can potentially detect more fault conditions - But if _market pressures_ are ever allowed to get in front of _Thorough, persistent and guaranteed complete real-world testing_ then I wouldn't trust an AFDD/GFCI as the sole safety device on a circuit. 👍
I'm certainly going to start quoting and fitting them, its a big plus for radials with white goods like dishwashers and fridge freezers , seen loads of issues with those over the years.. 2.5a fault current on a lighting circuit.. is it even worth fitting? i guess it could be with a faulty transformer .. hmm time will tell on that.. great video guys
The film shows that AFDD turns off when an arc acts between copper and graphite electrodes. But in real conditions there will be no graphite, and there will be no such arc between metal conductors. AFDD will not prevent a fire. The arc itself also does not cause a fire, this is specified in NFPA 921-2021. The ignition source will be heated conductors. Dangerous heating occurs at the site of poor contact without sparking, so the use of AFDD is useless.
I'm all for afdds. If you get some plucky punter picking the perfect pontoon of opportunity to alter or change any part of a circuit including a socket and manage to make a dogs dinner of terminal connections... Also, people don't ever seemingly check their terminals every five years or so - so many terminals in sockets are loose and I've come across them on immersions etc and I'm just stood there wondering 'how marginal is this between 'ok' and on fire'... These devices will definitely help create a defining line of 'who dunnit' and help with fault finding. And those terminals that haven't been tightened in 20 - 40 years.. maybe.. Just the price is a bit stratospheric but when it's looked as a once every 25year cost, at half the price they are ATM, I would consider them ok value. I'm just concerned they won't last 25years because someone cheaped out on some solder or didn't over spec the microcircuit componentry to last the oodles of on time.. I can't wait for one to get taken apart and for a detailed analysis of the componentry and see how it stacks against manufacturers specs to ascertain the longevity of the microcircuit componentry and controllers for e.g the self test function every hour... And whether the power factor of said circuits is optimised and LEDs arnt being overdriven in time for a premature death. 120quid for a failed led that costs 3pence because it's not user serviceable is something that sends shivers down my spine. I have to get one replaced in a display of a car I own and it will cost a hundred (mainly someone having better solder skills than I and having auto test equipment for validation checks and a workmanship warranty..) and my time getting the clocks out and then putting them. However the dealer would want a grand for a new unit and programming (ofc..) It's great having all these feature packed into one near little package but in the component itself it does lead to a high rate of potential failure and due to complexity, cost increase versus a simpler dumber and easier to maintain unit. Conclusion: one the one hand, great! It will solve a lot of problems (like ones between tenants and landlords..) and hubby and wife for setting the kitchen on fire because someone purports knowing how to do something. On the other... More e-waste. More complexity. More cost because it's not user serviceable for a component that could be replaced with the right skill and knowledge (i.e, that led I was talking about) Long winded gaff but this change is going to impact me directly so... Yeah. Happy fixxin
Use Wago sockets and terminals.
Good advice for someone who isn't me.. I will emplore that point to the electrically illiterate (y)
Well said T Perkins
I grew up in Braintree and did my apprenticeship there in the late 70s. With VF Lewis and Sons. They're long gone now. Things were a lot less technical back then. Is that the old Bonella Switches factory?
High Risk Residential Buildings of over 18m high or _over_ 6 floors (I presume including ground?). So, if a building is 8 floors high, do all flats need AFDD protection on 32A and above *socket* circuits? Or only the floors above six floors? If a radial supplying a only a washing machine that only has a one 13A socket on it with the washing machine permanently plugged in - is it classed as a socket circuit? 18th edition amendment two came into force on Monday 28th March 2022. So if if you have a 17th edition CU, does it need updating NOW?
In a few years when we have to fault find tripping afdd’s. How are we going to be able to find an arc fault with current MFT’s? I’m guessing we will need a separate test meter or new MFT with built in arc fault detection and work our way through the installation and circuits like a IR fault. Any of these devices on the cards anywhere ?
Great insight from Lewden and Efixx! Question, if the minimum operating current is 2.5amps, is it worth fitting them to lighting circuits? I would argue you very rarely draw that sort of current in your average installation these days with Leds being so common.
Most lighting circuits only need 3A mcb's or RCBO's with 1.00mm cable.
@@johnburns4017 most would get away with a 2a
If you remember Efixx told us about. the new 2A mcb's as detailed in the Amnt2 update. I actually believed them, and it was the first thing I looked for when my new regs book arrived....... doh!
what is the point of something that requires a specific arc gap to demonstrate
Interesting video, thank you. Current prices for a combined AFDD and RCBO are approx £120 whereas an RCBOs are approx £20 each or less. So with a 10 circuit board that would be an additional £1000. Any ideas when the combined AFDD and RCBO will be in the realms of affordability?
You only need them for high risk environments
@@theelliotmaaaan Agreed. But you could have for example an HMO which satisfied 16th / 17th Edition but would benefit from an upgrade to satisfy ECIR Code 3 Improvement Recommendations. But this is now an even harder sell for the Electrician when the additional cost will be £1000+ more than “last week”. So the net result will often be that Improvements will not be made.
@@stephencarter6634 Even more of a hard sell who only last year had to have a new consumer unit after being forced to have an EICR.. They probably brought this out a few years too late, just after everyone spent a fortune upgrading the consumer units..
Only on sockets and high risk shower immersion heater no need for lighting with led LTs
@@scott4shell I thought it says just circuits supplying socket outlets with a rating not exceeding 32A? Where does it say shower immersion heater?
How would an afdd react to an arc welder which I plug into a socket in my shed?
What they like on two way lighting with dimmers on ?
All looks very grand simulating faults that do happen (arking) usually inadequate connections are faulty, vast majority have been on main switches / consumer unit connections. These manifested themselves more since 25mm tails were fitted, in my considered opinion some consumer unit terminals are square and 25mm tails are extremely stiff but after time relax amounting to a loose connection on one or both causing heating which in time exacerbates a poor situation causing arking on load and possible fire. I am retired now but was a niceic QS for over 10years. In my view the tails need to be softer or lugs fitted to achieve a satisfactory connection!
"Imagine we are now on a socket outlet up to and including a 32A circuit". A 32A circuit in the UK is most likely a ring circuit, and you won't get a series arc fault on those. Also, in general, whilst the RCBOs won't pick up a series arc, as they are not designed to do so, then they will pick up a parallel arc to anything earthed.
i am still not sold on the AFDD, given that john ward and david savery did representing tests where it did not trip or only trip with some luck they are absolutely useless imho, alone that you need specialized test gear to get them to trip makes me wonder what the purpose of those is if real world faults are not tripping it, what is the purpose of it if only very specific arc's trip it? a loose connection somewhere surely will not trip it as previous tests have shown
Jesus the prices for changing boards will skyrocket
Techie question: I couldn't help noticing a TTL Serial breakout on the AFDDs PCB, plus the S-word¹ is also mentioned. If this is a fully _active_ device (As opposed to the fully _passive_ device that is a traditional RCD) wouldn't this make it an AFDD+GFCI, given that GFCIs - The American equivalent of an RCD - Are _active_ devices which use a ¹software driven CPU to analyse electrical conditions, then disconnect the load if a fault condition is detected? 😇 Also, going back to that TTL serial link: Could these also unlock the possibility of digital feedback to an electrical monitoring system (Perhaps via I²C, though an optical non-electrical link would probably be required by the regs) be a possibility now or in the future? 💡
Great device but does it come in anything less than rucksack size? We need a portable and reliable way to test the afdd
Could always wire it in series with the business end of an arc welder... ⚡🙃
I wonder how long these things are going to last .
If you select cable that doesn’t carbonised under these conditions such as LSF do you need to fit AFDD
A great question - let’s see what we can find out.
I'm only a humble sparks, but I see far more bad connections and arcing on lighting circuits where people change their own fittings and don't make good connections. Interesting that socket circuits are where the emphasis was placed. There must be concern for arcing within appliances. (I still don't think people have twigged how hard the "is this a HMO" question is, as it changes depending on occupancy.)
How much power (in watts) does these AFDD's use themselves? And can the firmware be upgraded by an electrician if required?
At a guess a couple of Watts; still you put 10 in a CU and there's now 20 Watts of heat in your CU.
I dunno about the power, but they have a continuously running CPU so perhaps the same draw as an Arduino (ATMEGA328P) at the very least. 🔋 In this video you can see pads on the PCB for a TTL serial connection to the PCB/CPU, but if these things are going to be sold as welded closed units (Most likely, as regulation would prefer that) the process for an _in-field update_ is probably going to be to _swap the AFDD out for another with the updated firmware on it._ 🗑 Though that said, it won't *just* be AFDDs where this approach will become commonplace over the next few years... 📱🚗😳
How would this work with a central heating boiler that uses arc/spark for ignition?
The ignition spark isn't drawn direct from the Line conductor - it's on it's own local 'circuit' supplied via a pulse voltage step-up transformer in the boiler, so the characteristics of what gets onto the mains supply circuit would be quite different to most usual fault conditions. Also the duration of the spark pulse is perhaps typically too short for an AFDD to pick up any remnant of it that gets into the mains circuit.
I had a bad connection in a junction box that almost went up in flames even though load was just 500w. Why 2.5A lower limit?
Use Wagos.
So they will not trip on lighting circuits in domestic with led bulbs fitted you’ll be lucky to get to the ampage unless there is a ton of spot lights
I am not an eletrician. How do I tell if it's a spark or arc? I have one extension lead with a few low powered computer accessories connected, plugged into a usual 13A double wall socket. When I switch that socket on in the dark, I could see a flash inside the socket through its white plastic. I plug this lead to a different socket, the flash follows. Is that a spark? or arc?
Switching things on will cause a spark which is normal - a broken wire or insulation fault will cause an arc with a very distinct waveform which is detected by an AFDD.
Well done on changing the laws of physics to justify a horrendously expensive product with limited usefulness. For information Arc - a luminous electrical discharge between two electrodes or other points. Good manufacturer sponsored video although I didn’t notice the disclaimer on it being so………
This looks very similar to the design Dave Savery did to replicate AFDD
Except made of lego
I’m not a fan of the concept of tripping on self test failure, I’d be immensely peeved off if I had one and it caused my freezer to defrost. I don’t know what the standard says but I’d prefer an audible alert.
I like the concept etc. but why are we putting them on low current socket circuits? I would have thought they would be most effective on things like cookers, electric showers and permanently installed heaters? High current circuits are most likely to have issues and least likely for people to notice. If your immersion heater or electric heating clonks on to warm up whilst you're still asleep you're much less likely to notice a fire breaking out than when using your hair drier connected to a faulty circuit. Particularly as most houses will have the hair drier connected to a ring final circuit which Lewden's literature suggests their AFDDs are rather less likely to notice an arc in. Equally you're unlikely to notice sizzling if you're in the shower and burnt shower isolators aren't uncommon things. If I was writing the rules, and maybe it's good that I'm not, I'd mandate them first in high current radial circuits likely to have high demand when you're asleep. Am I entirely mad?
there not looking for those particular faults that you suggested, there basically looking for the ones that have a specific waveform, higher currents wont make a difference
The main advantage has to be for where cable damage is likely isn’t it? Think old houses with rodents that love to chew PVC, AFDDs would eliminate the risk of fire surely?
@@brianhewitt8618 I don't think I agree. TCEng's point is that the 13A of your immersion heater, say, would be more than enough ( >> 2.5A!) to trip AFDD when the loose screw in the FCU causes arcing at 0200 in the morning.
I totally agree. That is where you tend to get most arcing faults I’d say. Showers are by far the worst for poor connections. Not too long ago, the owner of a wholesalers by me had a fire because of a immersion heater.
@@yrification Then put them on circuits with appliances that you deem suspect.
Only issue with this test is that in real world the conductors will be run in an earthed containment system or in parallel with CPC conductors, so its slightly unfair on the RCBO which would pick up the resulting earth fault in real world conditions
Can the firmware be programmed to fail the self test at 12 months and one day after installation I wonder.
And this is why I don't like software-driven circuit modules...
So when will they make an AFDD for the whole distribution board as an entry level low cost solution. I would have no issue with fault finding a tripped AFDD for the whole system by a process of the usual circuit elimination process rather than this expensive AFDD for each & every circuit not to mention the residual power usage & heat generated with these things when a board of say 15 AFDD's are all on & banked together. I think these AFDD's per each circuit are a milking money tree opportunity for manufacturers based upon fear & compliance of the general public. Just an opinion from a normal non sparkie homeowner.
Only socket circuits require afdd protection, having a single afdd will result in everything switching off including lights etc.
@@farmersteve129 that’s because rodents only like 2.5 mm 2 , anything smaller or bigger is tasty enough .😂
Last and proud 😉
Where is the evidence, from fire investigations, for the need for these devices please? Any links please? Serial arcs are likely to arise from poor connections, and one of the most common sources of fire, which caused the change in regulation to metalclad consumer units, was due to loose incoming supply connections, on the main switch, inside plastic consumer units. Loose connections, which could cause arcing, anywhere else in a wiring system, is commonly down to poor installation.
If you search for _arc fault cause of fire_ or similar terms you find plenty of papers and presentations. All by the likes of Schneider, Siemens, Eaton etc… Funny how these papers were researched and published just as the devices that will protect you were developed and marketed.
@@calmeilles interesting how thecpapers you mention are coming from manufacturers. After the 17th edition came out an IET staff member on an exhibition stand pointed to the number of BEAMA members on the IET Committee in answer to my question about the reasoning for the push to RCD/RCBO protection on all circuits.
There is no evidence, to support AFDDs , except from the very people who are trying to sell them . If they are so important for safety then why are they only required for circuits rated at 32amp or less and not required for every single circuit? We have all been and continue to be brain washed. Into believing what ever they tell us . Because no one has the guts to stand up to them.
@@seandempsey7351 Dave Watts (SparkyNinja) commented, on a Team Electrical podcast, that “AFDD’s are devices that have been designed to protect against a fault that should not exist”.
@@stevejagger8602 if the fault doesn’t exist then how can an AFDD protect against it? , If it does exist then surely it would be better to fix it therefore there would be know need for the AFDD , sounds like bolting the gate after the horse has legged it . But who am I to argue i’am just a humble spark who’s opinion means nothing. Don’t get me wrong I’m not totally against AFDDs I just believe we need real world test’s with real evidence to prove that they do work and to justify the ridiculously extortionate price. But there is no such evidence. Only what the manufacturers tell us after all they are trying to sell the things. In thirty years or so I have never come across any ache faults in a domestic installation so I’m sceptical as to weather AFDDs work . Show us the real evidence not some sales rep at work in production factory using a makeshift test rig. eFIXX are a fantastic place to learn about what new in the industry but they are only telling us what they have been told by the manufacturers. Personally I can’t fault eFixx or GHS they are doing a fantastic job
Where to buy in Spain?
If not already in trade over there, you might need to import from the UK. Just bear in mind you'll need one with a CE mark and EuroNorm categorisation, especially as „UKCA“ isn't recognised by any EU Member State. 😇 But personally, I'd look out for ones manufactured in Spain. As software-driven devices, you _really_ want ones which are produced under a legal system where the human rights to privacy, control of your own domestic electrics, and reasonable expectations of a decent lifespan (i.e: No built-in or pre-programmed obsolescence) are properly respected, which - Going on my unfortunate first-hand experiences - Isn't something you can assure yourself of goods which are made in conformance with UK law. If I ever have these things fitted into my consumer unit, I just know I'm going to lose *all* access to power as soon as the software in the AFDD works out that I'm gay, disabled, and was born before the _equality accepted after_ date of 1992... 🏳🌈🌻🇬🇧🚫🙅😢
Mmmm has anyone tested these with different loads, like would using a welder trip an AFDD? Or a brushed motor that tends to be sparky during operation..?
He did say they are programmed to ignore sparking motors - didn’t mention welders tho’
99% of the arc burn out faults i get are in shower pull switches (40 -50 amp) where its carbonised with melted cables. so why does it stop at 32amp?
I was wondering this too - the higher the current the easier it is to detect & more important to break it!
Less used and more likely to be noticed
@@dixonm9 Maybe but not much use if by noticing it means it has burnt your house down as heat as escaped box into atic!
@@andyrutherford203 your 99% have all failed and required your attention before getting close to that point. Think the point of it being mainly socket outlet circuits is that these are energised 24/7 and many appliances running without interaction from persons. I can see the regs moving towards full coverage eventually though, once use is more widespread and costs reduced
I'm waiting for these devices to give wireless Data acquisition, there's enough room in there for this tech, but as with all things in this industry, changes are slow
Wireless data acquisition = A conduit for remote intrusion into the device, and goodness knows what if somebody manages to break into yours! 🕵 Note to self: If I ever *have* to have an AFDD, include a bypass switch... 📱🛂⚡
Load of rubbish Consumers being ripped off again 40% of houses still have fuses, that's what needs addressing
2.5A this something should be strongly a the box of device this mean everything under 500w won’t trigger it 😩
probably just as well carbon arc lamps aren't a thing anymore.
You haven't seen some of the houses in the more backwards _ahem_ conservative parts of the UK... 😉
Excellent informative video, worth mentioning from a non electrical standpoint though is that you don't need to constantly look into camera unless speaking to the viewer directly, seems rude to look away constantly from the person answering your question, or ask the question to 'the viewer' when you want the answer from 'the interviewee'.. Great otherwise though don't get me wrong! Learnt a lot from you guys for years now!
What makes an HMO high risk? It's still just a single dwelling where residents are (probably) not related? Why is student accommodation high risk, aren't they supposed to be young, agile and above average intelligence? I think industry lobbyists have greased a few palms at the IET.
Number of lives and need for evacuation protocol will be the main factors. HMOs already have more stringent safety requirements
@@dixonm9 But it's like these types of buildings have been plucked out of thin air. They are no more or less likely to have an electrical fire than any other habitable building. An HMO is still just a house. The most dangerous aspect being you have to share a kitchen and bathroom. If you're going to say, "well, you have to start somewhere", then start with all new houses of five bedrooms or over. That would make more sense.
@@markrainford1219 it's not to do with liklihood of fire. It's to do with logistics of evacuation. It's an FRA approach
I am a bit disappointed with the lack of LEGO in the test rig for creating the arc fault. David Savery made his first tester completely out of LEGO 😁🐔🤡
Second
They don't work on small loads so no point having a 6a one
Surely a ‘healthy’ light should be green, not red….
Don't MCBs/RCBOs usually use green to indicate 'off' and red for 'on'? That might be why that is this way.
first
Welders gonna hate these for sure, they are nothing new, just a copy of central europe standards where everybody is building their own house and not having the cheapest cardboard box from 5 major developers in the country.
A welder shouldn't affect it as it's transformer isolated from the mains and should also be filtered .
I’ve never seen a AFDD in Europe while i’m quite into mains electronics for my entire life. In The Netherlands and Belgium there’s only GFCI’s and breakers in most houses.
@@Engineer9736 They're still a fairly new technology so you likely won't have seen them, they're not common in the UK either.
I don't use carbon rods in my circuits. snake oil
PVC carbonises 👍🏻