IS PREMIUM DIESEL REALLY WORTH IT?? 💸
After years of planning and scheduling, it's finally here! We've strapped our TT to the dyno to ask the question, is it really worth paying for premium diesels? 🤔
With 4 separate fuels and plenty of analysis equipment, it's time to find out...and the results may surprise you!! 👀
Tuning your car and want to get more data on your engine? Check out BDN Automotive's cylinder pressure monitor here - bdn-automotive.com/products/c...
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Let us know what you think about this test in the comments section. If you have tested any 'racing' diesel fuels yourself we would love to know!
I also wanna know if there's any "racing" additives
Super interesting test you've made here. Well I guess it heavily depends on the diesel engine and its ECU. My ol' Golf Mk3 convertible loves OMV Ultimate (non HVO, non GVO, liquid to gas diesel). It performs better and it runs extremly smooth. Ppl even told me that on parking lots and so on xD (other premium diesels are good too but not that good). The biggest changes actually came from using it over at least 10 full fuel tanks worth of driving. It is my daily (and stock!) and it occasionally gets the beans as well. :DDD It has a fairly simple ECU (TDI gen 1995 - motor code 1Z) and it takes what it gets and tries to avoid the smoking A/F ratio. That's it. Then it limits the torque (to 202Nm) and the boost to 0,9bar. Whatever happens else, highly depends on the fuel. Newer diesel will have way more controlling and managing stages, which could dampen the advantages of a way better diesel, at least that'd be my guess. And on "racing diesels" I can' t be asked xD Thanks for the test - cheers DIESEL POWER !!!
My 09' 1.9tdi pd BXE has been getting Hydra DPB100 for around 6 and a bit years, since 2017 when I first bought the car. It was sluggish and jittering under throttle so I assumed it was gunk in the injectors etc. It's been working perfectly ever since. No issues with the turbo or fuel pumps, I think there's a tandem pump3on my engine isn't there? Anyway all good, I'm not seeing any changes at all in fuel economy and I don't floor it everywhere, but still I've stuck with the Hydra additive and cheaper diesel, which is cheaper than so called premium diesel, so I'm happy overall. I hope to book my car in with you soon, after I knock a couple of much needed jobs off the to-do list. Great channel and thanks for your hardwork and passion for diesel engines of the VAG variety. 👊
I never noticed the difference with V-power petrol in my cars. But with V-power diesel on my 1.6tdi Fiesta i get around 10-15mpg more over regular diesel. Engine is smoother too.
Need to stick the car on the Dyno and then tune to the fuel and see what can be achieved. Rather than sticking the fuel in and seeing what power can be produced.
The amusing thing about tests like this, is the data will be there in black and white, yet people will still be adamant that their choice is better for reasons.
Yep! Despite the test there’s still people in the comments arguing over brands of fuel
about the only argument could be made is Costco fuel cus it's cheaper?
I'm driving premium diesel on my daily, according to your comment I'm one of "those ppl" :) I need to add that driving premium diesel with recognizable differences depends on a lot of stuff. I'm driving and old 1.9 TDI 1Z (built in 1995) and I recognized the differences after driving approx. 10 car tanks in a row with premium diesel only. The difference are so significant that even my neighbor asked me about it. He asked what I've done to this ol' engine b/c it runs so smooth. It is stock, nothing modified except proper maintenance. Also the power gap I've had on around 3500rpm vanished over time. Which was significant and way above some belief thing to recognize. On newer cars, especially with common rail systems many of those recognizable advantages might be dampen by the huge amount of management effort of the ECU. My ECU is plain simple: don't go over 0,9bar boost, don't smoke, keep the amount of fuel as similar as possible between all cylinders. Done. It doesn't care about power output so that 'd be the first property which can change with fuel quality, since it doesn't even get monitored by the ECU. Like many other properties, if the fuel is less prone to smoke, then my ECU will change the A/F ratio differently on a high quality fuel. Since the ECU is super simple in its management. While a newer cars ECU might observe and manage hundreds of parameters and keep the engine at check. Many fuel advantages (but also disadvantages of bad fuels) are dampen. Additionally you've a ton of parameters in an ECU which are based on "learning factors" during driving. It highly depends on the engine and its ECU what its doing and how it reacts to different qualities of fuel. A proper remapping might be necessary, to fully use the advantages of a higher cetan count and lower probability to smoke. Like setting up a petrol engine to a higher octane count fuel, you might change the spark timing, as an example. Otherwise you wouldn't have any recognizable advantages from the premium petrol. Frankly a "dump it in and see" doesn't work - as shown in the video (and many other tests).. this mindset might come from the old days with carburetors and petrol engines... It isn't about "a belief b/c of reasons" it is about doing a proper deep dive in technology and what it actually does. I'm an engineer myself, I might need to add.
@@BruceCarbonLakeriver that’s a lot of words 😂
I fully, whole heartedly, and complete, endorse this comment.
Your base fuel comes usually from the local refinery. It makes sense logistically when you think about it. In Southampton for example, the local refinery is the Exxon (Esso) refinery at Fawley. So you will see Shell, Mobil, Total, ASDA, Tesco etc tankers rocking up to fuel up. The drivers then add a particular additive package to the tank. By the time the lorry has been around a couple of roundabouts on the A326 it is considered "mixed to perfection". However the base fuel for them all is Esso. Only the additive package differentiates them.
Totally agree with you
The fuel is refined to a BS standard anyway to meet the B7 biodiesel pump fuel grade. They can't sell it to forecourts and franchises otherwise. But you're correct, in that a driver of a tanker will usually have additive in the tank before loading or post loading at a transfer station. I did a delivery to Fawley refinery last week.
I would be keen to know about Costco diesel, they only sell premium diesel. Is it really premium or just the name instead?
@@Lorenzo_Velasquez Will just be the name. The only real difference is the additives that are added in tank on the forecourt or at collection. For diesels, these only help reduce the gel point to improve burn and reduce carbon build up, help prevent gelling in the injectors, fuel filter and the pump (especially in cold temperatures).
I always thought it was same but with different additives but i am no scientist either way its too feckin expensive Robin gits 😂😂
Excellent piece of work, Ryan. Considerable time, effort and cost invested in the project is very much appreciated.
People have tried these tests over the years but I don't think anyone has ever gone as In depth as you guys have! Good to know I can continue buying tesco diesel!
Always said this. To get the most of of a turbo diesel, let it warm up, use plenty of throttle at low-er revs, cane it every now and again, don’t leave idling give a few seconds for turbo to stop before shutting down. Never had an engine/turbo failure, never had black smoke, always had good power.
You need the turbo to cool down for a few minutes if you've been driving it hard or driving on motorway.. It's not about it spinning
@@MyRealName just back off for the last mile is more than adequate. Just standard mechanical sympathy, No need to go over board.
Why can’t you idle a diesel? I’ve always done it with no problems.
@AlmostLastJedi this with short drives is what cloggs dpf
Use plenty of throttle at low revs? so i fuq up my clutch and flywheel early?
Thanks Ryan and the team. We appreciate your time.
Thank you guys... this was a very comprehensive video that must have took you forever to make... very much appreciated 👏
Ive used normal supermarket diesel all my life but made the change to v power and i can honestly say it feel way more responive then regular diesel fuel. So i will be sticking with v power
Shell diesel was giving me 35mpg but my car ran like cr*p. Switched to VPower got 41mpg but thats started to creep down sat at 38mpg so made a switch to BP Ultimate which now is slowly going back up.
@@bigbossbrixey5484 I too love paying extra for that delicious placebo effect, after swapping to Shell V power extreme ultra deluxe preorder limited edition my car doesn't even need the engine running to move, gets infinite mpg, it's vibration free and it only emits unicorn farts! Truly is magical stuff.
FINALLY! Always wanted to see a test on this!
Agreed i saw officially gassed results on the petrol ones and always wanna see the diesel comparisons
I’ve never noticed any performance difference what ever diesel I used, I have used the Dipetane as it was meant to heat the dpf up quicker and to higher temps. I never had any issues so I assume it worked 🤷🏻♂️ Love it you use the cheapest fuels in the race car, keepin’ it real 👍🏻
cant think of no other team to do this experiment, hats off to you!!
Although not comparing apples with apples, we can look at the fuelling of HGVs. There engines are as complex in their operation as any comparable car ICE, with sophisticated emission reduction systems. They cover vast distances per annum, far in excess of the average car driver and often work in arduous conditions under high engine loads, where fuel consumption can be measured in gallons per mile! Engine performance is massively important, but to most operators engine performance is secondary to fuel economy. Fuel cost being the largest expenditure to any operator, it would be obvious that any potential gains from using “premium” fuels, especially in economy terms would have been embraced by the haulage industry long ago.
I believe 5hey would only look at cheapest up front cost.
Very true, most big operators will move the tractor units on by 4 or 5 years service so only worry about meeting latest euro standard for minimising access charges and therefore they run cheap fuel as they are not interested in the long term mechanical benefits better fuel and servicing would add to a vehicles life span
I use shell v-power diesel in my standard daily. A friend uses supermarket in his tuned diesel daily. I get less smoke and what appears to be less lag (both have same turbo) and when it comes to services my filters are cleaner! So I’m continuing to use the V-power. Someone else I know, who drives the same daily vehicle he adds MANNOL Cetane Plus to his Shell V-power and it appears on Road to make a difference again!
This all makes me chuckle, I have a 3ltr 30 year old Toyota. I just fill up at Tesco's because where I live there is nowhere else. Always starts first touch of the key, goes up hills like they weren't there, and I love it.
This made me smile. I bought a 1994 Corolla GXi off a friend years ago for £1000. He let me have it cheap because he said the original clutch was on its way out. I drove the car everyday for 7 years with that original clutch 🤣 only repair, other than standard service parts, was a wheel bearing. Traded against a 2008 Yaris (which was horrible) as we needed a 5 door. Always regretted getting rid it was a an amazingly reliable and fun car.
Great work, Ryan. Thanks a lot for the time and effort, never bought diesel from Shell due to price, usually buy what's closer to me and that's Tesco and Morrisons.
Thanks for this test, I now fill up at Tesco, before did some time filling up in Asda and I seemed to get less mileage out the full tank.
Really thorough and interesting video. Would have loved to have seen a fuel economy MPG comparison, but appreciate the time and considerable effort you put into making this 👍 cheers
Superb test lads, thank you for doing this. Proves so many points. Simply use supermarket diesel and use a decent cleaning additive once a month depending on the mileage you do. 👍
Very interesting design of experiment there😎, I am a fuel test engineer and know just how hard it is to find solid statistically relevant results from one fuel to another. ( harder with diesel, gasoline has the octane difference which does help as well as the longer term gains of additive detergents ) Glad you ran 3x tests of each, 4 is significantly better next time, Fuel temp and test cell conditioning and barometrics have annoyingly large effects, so the better you can control that the more accurate your results will be, Going back to your “control” fuel was a very useful step as you saw. Conditioning runs before running an actual test run are industry standard - get everything upto same temps and condition before running a measured test 👍🏼 ( vehicle AND dyno) What you don’t get in your test ( understandably) is a long term gain result ( more premium fuels WILL clean the engine components which will give you better gains as your injectors etc will stay clean, ) Road trials are a nightmare so not even worth bothering with , and with 2 vehicles , forget it - waaaaaay too many variables . So not worth bothering with unless you have hundreds / thousands of hours to waste.. Nice work though 👍🏼👍🏼
So going from your comments and this very informative test, a tank of premium every 6 months or so is probably a good idea for the feeling system but otherwise use the cheapest stuff you can find?
@bencheetham are you at BP in Whitchurch Hill?
@@fredfred2363 I’m omni-present 😝.. who do you know at whitchurch ( surname only req.)
@@Divefire I’d recommend more frequent tank fulls or top ups, even the non “premium” Diesel offerings from shell / bp / esso etc will have more detergents than super market diesels I believe and will be beneficial even with a mix of supermarket fuel in yr tank. 👍🏼( but it will obviously be more diluted then) The more frequently you can use a better supplier, the cleaner your engine will get ( and then stay that way)
Brilliant 👍
thanks for running this test fellas
What makes a big difference i have found , is rather than spending a fortune on expensive diesel is every couple months i use an engine cleaner , exaust system cleaner , or injector cleaner , oil +filterchange twice a year as i do over, 15k miles a year and fuel filter every year or two, most people dont even do this basic stuff like but its money better spent, bought my current TDI at 150k miles currently put just shy of 20k on it since last july and its running even smoother and gets better mpg than when i got it as i changed oil twice since then and did all the other service bits and run fuel additives when i feel it needs it
Exactly what I've always thought, thanks for such a comprehensive test, huuuuuuge effort. I know for a fact that diesel is often "all the same" and tanker drivers often deliver premium diesel to cheap stations if that's what they have on hand. Wouldn't surprise me if a chemical breakdown of those fossil based fuel brands showed they were much the same. I've done terrible things to euro diesels since 2008, and only use name brand fuel to try and avoid water and algae from slow turnover. The small % of cleaners etc in premium diesel do jack shit compared to actual diesel fuel additives / two stroke, running upper intake cleaner / methanol, and doing physical cleans every year. People think Cetane is like Octane, when they are in fact total opposite. Run what you want, but worry more about the oil blowby and soot build-up in your upper intake tract, makes a far bigger difference. I found Napthalene and Nitromethane made no difference either, but that's another story.
Top work! Happy with your results. I personally run supermarket fuel with the ehn-99 and I've always felt the car was not faster but felt a bit smoother and eager. Deffo interested in seeing the "race diesel" test!
Perhaps you should consider a diesel boosters are also said to clean particle filters or to make sure that it does not get dirty as quickly
Many thanks Ryan a very informative video.
When I had my Mondeo st tdci I ran shell vpower diesel and it made a big difference, not in cleaness or power but I did get more mpg. About 55 instead of 50 without changing anything else.
But did the extra cost negate the extra mpg? or was the vpower cheaper overall?
Great test I used to shell v power but changed to texaco dispel had the same effect . But had any noticed that some stations when you fill up the performance changes . I’ve just stuck to one station
Diesel is diesel, you can boost the cetane rating but realistically it wont make much if any noticeable difference. This test is even run on a highly tuned engine, the fact that theres no difference here proves the point. Octane rating makes a difference in petrol but diesel is compression ignition anyway. Best thing to do is ensure your injector are clean. 2.0TDI TT with 180k miles on it here, never had engine issues on standard fuels.
True, ppl don't recognize that you actually need a proper remap of your engine for better fuels. Like advancing the spark timings on a petrol engine while using a higher octane fuel and higher compression ratios ^^
for a stock diesel you might consider the cleaning function, but the price difference in my country is huge. Fuel save diesel 31.24 thb vs V-power 46.94 thb
There is very little lube in modern Diesel. This has proven to be hard on things like HP fuel pump valve stems etc... So I have taken to adding like 200cc of 2-stroke engine fuel mix to 16 gallons of diesel. It can't hurt the engine as it all burns and it may help with internal lube. Things like HP pumps and valve stems may benefit from a little lube.
Basic forecourt diesel in the UK and EU is better quality than than most of the world including North America but boosting the Cetane rating still has benefits. A simple test is to compare how much soot is deposited on the back bumper.
I noticed with my vw tdi cetane booster definitely helps combustion and performance.
Great test!!! Thx
very thorough. great stuff
i worked at the plant that made 2EHN and it is already in all fuels that you buy anyway especially diesel, its a cetane improver, and in most injector cleaners and so called performance improvers. not sure if it will give you the boost you might expect. word of warning if you get it on your skin it will give you a headache as it is a vascular dilater.(makes you veins swell up) chemistry to make it uses very strong acids and is made in a way very similar to nitro-glycerine.
Drink some coffee after then as thats a vascular restrictor
after 20+years of running diesels the only additive i use now is millers Diesel Power Ecomax easily an extra 50miles on a tank on long runs & no fancy diesel in the vehicles neither, local garage stuff in most cases. good very involved test tho lads with the sum up V-Power helps but at a cost.
Lucas upper cylinder lubricant does the best job. I've tried so many and this one comes out to be the best.
I’ve tried Ecomax too for the 2EHN component. I have seen no difference in range, but subjectively a Toyota diesel felt sharper and slightly less clattery. On a Mercedes 220, no difference at all.
Ecomax works out around 3.3ppl (pence per litre) at 1000ppm treat rate. Somewhat less than other pump options.
If the additive you use cost around a 10er you will get at least 50 miles off that in diesel so its pointless
Same. And I’ve tested different ratios, drives, types and settled on millers for every tank woth tesco standard. All logged and various runs and drive styles over 70k miles and 2 cars. The price point is about break even for cost vs extra mpg but for all the claimed benefits and me having 0 issues with dpf, injectors, starting i will continue to use for the foreseeable!
Very interesting test and really useful outcomes. Great work Ben and much appreciated. Thanks a lot and continue the good work.🎉
Who's Ben?
A test like this is long overdue ❤️
Thanks for doing this. I'm one of those who's always just gone for the cheapest diesel available. I'd always get told how I'm missing out on power, or it would run better on premium or I'm killing my engine using supermarket fuels. On the occasions I did use premium I never felt a difference in power, responsiveness or noticed any difference in sound or fuel economy so I went back to good old supermarket fuel. It's nice to finally see some actual data to back up what I thought and what I've felt when switching between standard and premium, i.e, no difference.
You might not feel it, but there is a difference for sure. A semi blocked injector over a couple years will not produce the same power as a clean fully working Injectors
Interesting, i am using BP ultimate at the moment and it seems to reduce the frequency's of the regens, i am hooked up to vag dpf app , i would be interested to know the longer term effects on the egr valve ect excellent video
BP Ultimate Diesel all the way, highest cetane rating in the UK. Shell V Power has good friction modifiers for the diesel fuel pump, help keep the engine quieter on journeys...
I agree, I do so longer drives and test the brands against each other, BP and Ampol are good in Aust then shell and Caltex.
And with all that, their race car does 6k revs and gets abuse on track, on standard fuel, without any of those issues
@@possle its a race car, not an audi A4.
@@paulken1919 Exactly, it's a strung out race car that gets driven hard, not an A4 cruising down to the shops.
@@kristoffer3000 All the more reason it would show fuel differences and limitations...
I've been using shell v-power diesel in my BMW f11 530d with a stage 1 remap for the past few months. I read many constrasting articles & reviews beforehand. My mechanic advised me to use as he rates it. I've honestly not noticed the car being any faster, quieter, smoother or better mpg. It costs me approx £10 more per month. When my mech mot'd my car he says it was running 'cleaner' than last years mot as some sort of justification that he's been proven correct! 😁 After watching this video, I think I'll just switch back to std diesel & stick an additive in every now & again
Stick your normal diesel in, without an additive and don’t tell your mechanic, I bet he will still tell you it’s running cleaner than it was, just to make himself fell like he knows somert you don’t.
what may matter is if there are cleaning chemicals in the fuel that work. otherwise you can compare fuel consumption yourself. The road and the Dyno are not quite the same thing
@@ShalomBrother In theory, should a higher cetane content mean better combustion? If it's clean exhaust you're looking for then you should look for Hydrotreated vegetable oil (HVO If you have it in the UK
"you wanna know what I think"? I think it's really good of you to take the time and effort bringing us this vid. Half hour vid ... I'd bet my arse you spent far longer videoing it all. Personally when I was using Shell V-Power in mi' 3litre A4 I couldn't get it to smoke anywhere near if at all, when compared to Supermarket diesel. OH MANY MANY THANKS.
Heating oil with a dash of hydraulic oil for lubrication and upping the compression always goes well.
It's atmospheric preasure making the biggest difference and tyres heating up
Awesome test, I’m an Aussie diesel mechanic who used fo drive fuel tankers, it’s all just marketing BS! Would love to see some JET A1 tested, I don’t think it’ll go any better, just out of curiosity! I’ve ran a couple of CRD’s on jet and noticed no difference
Great work guys, not just with this extensive test but all your other content too! My daily commute is my trusty Smart Forfour diesel with a sensible custom rolling road remap. She's 20 years old, 215k miles on the clock. Sure it's nothing special to most, but i love my quirky cars. For the past 15 years of ownership I've predominantly used supermarket diesel. Reason being there are no 'big brands' close or en route to work, I would need to divert to fill up with say Esso or BP. Very occasionally filled up with Jet diesel if taking a different route, but mainly use Asda or Sainsbury's. The car has been very well looked after, with oil changes every 6000 miles using correct spec' oil MB229.3. Running the original mechanicals inc engine, turbo and gearbox. Starts every time sun or snow, still pulls like a train, doesn't smoke and passes the MoT each year with lower than it's rated VED band emissions. I do use Miller's diesel additive every few tank fills. I'm unsure if actually benefits the car, but can't do much harm other than the formulation stinks.
When will people understand that Premium Diesel has never been about Performance gains. its all about keeping your engine in top condition. Ive ran my BMW 120d M Sport with 202,000 miles, ALWAYS used Shell V Power Diesel, Engine in prime condition, DPF not clogged once, Injectors are running clean and free. With premium diesel its less about performance gains and far more about longevity of the mechanical parts with the use of detergents that are blended with the fuel.
100% agree
I bought my Chrysler 300c with 62k miles, it’s got a remap and always been run on the cheapest diesel available in my area. It’s now on 235k miles, never had any engine issues! On the face of it you have probably wasted thousands more than me on fuel with no real benefit!
Ok to be fair I have a ml7 golf tdi with 400,000 km and always used cheap diesel from good stations. I have never had a clogged dpf or injector problems either. My opinion is how you drive rather than diesel. I drive mainly highway. I think that has more to do with it than diesel
Great comment, using one example is definitely decisive, if you hadn’t used v power diesel it DEFINITELY would have had issues, right? 😂
That’s my understanding too.
Started using 'fancy' diesel on a Volvo C30 with 120k. Was getting average 51 mpg. By 125k Im getting 55mpg so the cleaning of the fancy diesel has definitely worked. I now run 3 tanks of standard diesel and then one tank of the good stuff.
I've got a V50 1.6D and has 166K miles on it so if it works on your c30 then deffo it will work on mine too. What else have you noticed with the "fancy" fuel?
@@VinDieselS70 same... 1.6D S Drive. The super-diesel did a great job cleaning the engine over around 5k so now i just use normal diesel for three fills and the 'fancy' stuff on the fourth to help cleaning. I use a DPF cleaner additive about two weeks before MOT and drive in 4th for about 10 miles to get a good regen going. 👍
@@AndrewGibson22 thank you Andrew. As this is my first Diesel with a DPF all hints and tips are welcome. The previous S70 and V70 D5 didn't have any DPF nonsense. Mind you, the old S70 was happy with veggie oil from Asda.
@@VinDieselS70 'cough, cough' gut it 'cough, cough' 😉
@@VinDieselS70 - I found Costco veggie oil really so much better than most others in my old Mitsubishi Pajero, it had a much higher chip butty and candy-floss aroma level than other regular cooking oils
Fascinating video lads. Thanks. One question, from a carbon build up point of view, is V-Power with it, or is it more sensible to chuck some carbon cleaner in every few tanks (normal road driving)
This is our race car, we use the cheapest fuel we can buy for it…..tells you everything you need to know.
very interesting video and as you said at the end of the day diesel is diesel they all have additives to make the fuel burn cleaner foe emissions reasons and lubrication . i think shell V power is just a way of getting more money off you at the pump the best way to look after your diesel engine is regular oil changes .
Love this sort of video. 👍
All good stuff 👍👍 I’ve never believed the hype about V Power Fuel . Being a Truck Driver who has had professional training on how to get a 44 ton Truck to do 8 mpg from 7 mpg it’s absolutely about your right foot and nothing else .
Thank you for doing this video and finally settling this the amount of times I’ve heard people bang on about better performance better emissions with V-Power etc is annoying I put Texaco’s premium diesel in my 2.0 tdi Audi and found it didn’t seem to run as smooth as Tesco fuel but I can honestly say there was zero benefit and it was £1.80 per litre compared with Tesco at the time being £1.44.9 per litre
I’ve been running the cheapest diesel since I started driving decades ago with no issues so unless I get some solid proof of an advantage in premium diesel I will not change because in my personal opinion the only benefit is a bigger profit to the manufacturer of the diesel….
I will say this: when I was in Italy with my 1.2 diesel fiat, the cheap diesel I filled the car up with, didn't help me up the mountains on my way back home. So maybe the real thing is in the tolerances of some fuel stations.
The main advantage of premium diesel is all about cleaning your engine, especially injectors, not making more power. And there is a big difference with my car starting on freezing winter mornings when i use regular diesel, versus when i use premium diesel. If you live in a cold country where temps fall far bellow freezing i would strongly recommend using premium diesel in winter. Premium diesel has also much lower freezing point than regular diesel.
Interesting points
Cold flow improver is not part of the additive mix. There is zero difference in cloud point and cfpp for premium diesel. Where the fuel comes from decides this.
@@BRMCaptChaospremium dinosaurs were used mate 😎
@@BRMCaptChaos Depends on weather, some actual data from a place with freezing winters about the CFFP of Diesel: -summer:
@@petermolnar8667 we don’t have a winter premium spec in the 590 annex. So we go to -15deg C. In reality, pre war, east coast UK was predominantly RUS fed with CFPP c. -22 to -26 Deg C. The problem being the CFPP was induced by cold flow improver, so one would have a -5deg c cloud point with a -25deg c cfpp, basically it was rubbish.
Hello. I use Shell V-power only. The truck runs very smooth at idle and overall a better performance. It is said that the injectors will last longer compared with cheap diesel. 50.000 km difference Bosch said. I have a 2010 Ford Ranger 2.5 tdci, tuned as good I could do about 372 bhp and 700 rwNm. Could be more, but I declined smoke.
Nice test 👍 Often wondered myself if mixing 2T and methanol would be a good homemade additive.
9:15 I agree, when I was testing fuel economy after remap I def drove differently to see it go down LOL
Seems like for the cost of the Shell VP you'd be better off to just buy regular diesel and put a concentrated additive in every tank
Absolutely fantastic video, love this stuff! Could I ask for your opinion on whether using Ultimate/Vpower over years would equate to less wear on the vehicle?
We would say not
Thank you for this video.
I use V-Power for the additives. My dad did a 6 year experiment on V-power versus normal diesel by recording every fill up for that time. After using regular Shell diesel for 3 years then started using V-Power. There was a marked increase in MPG (don't know about power) that offset the extra cost. This was 10 years ago mind. This was on an AMF 3PD.
So is it fair to say that one should basically fill up the exact same way you use cleaning additives, i.e. every other tank? Meaning one tank regular, one tank premium?
Sad wxxker
Your old man sounds a right laugh
Why would air/fuel ratio change? That doesnt make sense. Most of the cars don,t have flex fuel sensors to measure the octane on the diesel. I will burn the same amount no matter what diesel you habe.
@@MrSamueladerach I can only imagine that the additives allow a better burn? Shell claim better mpg but I am not sure why they say that. The V-Power is a powerful cleaner and on my vintage motorbikes I use it and keep the tanks topped up as you can see clearly how it keeps everything mint. With high pressure pumps and injectors maybe this makes a difference.
my dad has always told me, its just oil. it will all be the same. Where as petrol is a completely different result.
The only fuel Ive ever noticed a difference with was some biodiesel years ago on a bosch pumped 306, it wasnt so much more power, it was how much less smoke it produced, it was enough to be able to turn the fuel pump up more for the same levels of smoke. it also had the added side effect of raising the boost another 2 psi at peak.
I think I have noticed less smoke output with aditive diesel before but really small change, I usually run aditive because I'm scared of hpfp failure or injectores clogging etc.. Does that aditive add to lubricity or something?
When I bought my TDV8 RR last year, I filled it with `premium` on the way home. It went better from that moment on. Months later, and with a new fuel filter installed, it's even better. Former owners only bought theirs from a supermarket `Sainsbury's` I think.
Very interesting test 🎉
Good test chaps 👍💪😉
Used to build filling stations and was quite involved in the process of buying / selling fuel. I can tell you the condition of the forecourt is far more important than the brand. All fuel comes from the same refineries, the additives difffer. A poorly maintained forecourt is far more likely to lead to dodgy / contaminated fuel & cause issues than supermarket fuel. Supermarkets make very little profit on fuel. Their margins come from people visiting the shop before/ after they’ve filled up. Worth millions per year per store.
Iv used cheap diesel in my t5 174 maped 220 bhp started having problems with dpf light coming on went back to using shell no problems maybe shell fule is better refined so i stick with the good stuff
Be interesting to see a comparison on engine oils. People use cheap oils that clog. Shell Helix Ultra is made from a gas base rather than crude ( info from shell when I sold oils) burns cleaner. I change my oil a 6k
Thanks for all the hard work. I started watching the video to see if there was an mpg increase. Doh! Please can you do one showing if there is?
It's something we can look into doing, may take a while though!
the only reason im going for shell is because i believe it may or maybe burns cleaner thats it also i went to tesco once and the car was running funny i was suspecting they are scamming it maybe i just hoped shell dont do it or controll it better. It definately opens my eyes so thank you. Could you consider making a video about other additives ? like injector cleaners dpf cleanrs and other ? not sure how to test it but would be a good vid to watch
Shell V power is GTL so distilled slightly different, this gives a slightly higher cetane number which means it runs cleaner but slightly lower calcific value.
My Re Mapped 535d running 390 hp has been on a diet of Shell Vpower since 40000 miles and now at 270000 never had an injector problem and still runs sweet as a nut !
That's the "rub"...... time and effort "most people" don't bother with it. Good luck to them and every continued success to you, spent your money getting your car where you want it then run it on cheep fuel??? Most people simply don't care. 535d NICE.
That proves literally nothing about the fuel though. For all you know you could never have an injection problem on nomal diesel. The 1986 diesel engine in my boat has been running for 36 years with no injection issues either, and its been ran on the cheapest shit available, red diesel that's been sat in tanks for too long etc.
Exactly that - I always filled up with premium on all my cars. 1.5dci has been running since 60k sitting at 215k with nothing needed other than regular servicing. My 4.2TDI & 2.0TDI run sweet as too.
@@ceirwan Well all fuel is the same.....
@@AmeriaUprising Had a 1.9 tdi that clocked 750k km and only ever put the cheapest stuff, nothing ever went wrong. I'm sorry but only fools put expensive diesel in cheap car, why did you buy a cheap diesel car if not for lower running costs as you're doing a lot of miles?
I have had dodgy supermarket fills, only a couple, but its better to go to proper filling station. I notice more mpg with bp ultimate, on longer runs, but no where near the cost difference. Regular bp or shell, and additive bottle in tank occasionally. The dpf comments....depends which euroversion your vehicle is, the newer, the more sensitive to what is put in the tank, but even then if your doing longer runs its fine as everything gets up to temperature
Thanks for doing this test. I logged the fuel consumption over 180k miles on two 330d BMWs. I ran one in supermarket diesel for 20k miles, and had issues with poor throttle response, which required BMW to do a lot of internal cleaning of various components. For the remaining miles, I initially used branded standard diesel, then switched to premium whenever I could get it, and the spreadsheet showed a consistent improvement in mpg on the premium fuel - maybe not the first tank after some standard fuel, but certainly thereafter. And certainly enough to justify the extra price. BP seemed to have a slight edge over Shell, which seemed better than Esso. More recently, I haven’t been quite so meticulous with my records, and run 4x4s, with a much lower annual mileage. My default fuel is premium; I think the vehicles are more economical (but lack numeric evidence to support this claim, and clouded by my current driving various in type and distance), the cars seem to run smoother and start better on premium, and for sure the mpg is much better when towing heavy trailers. That’s just my opinion of course 😁.
just out of interest, when you say 'premium', do you mean branded regular diesel (i.e. 'premium' brand) or the full fat poncy V-Power type fuels? When I had a bimmer I used to run a tank of the BP equivalent of V Power now and then, normal BP probably 1 in 3 tanks and supermarket the rest of the time. Not sure if I ever saw and particular improvement in anything, but then I wasn't paying that much attention either, and I got rid of it after about 37k. Now I don't do so many miles and run a Focus 2 litre tdci (160bhp version) and I hate it so it gets supermarket only since it doesn't deserve anything else 😁
@@stevepettifer4896 By premium I mean Shell V Power or the the BP equivalent. I know there are so many variables and so many opinions, but I personally never saw the benefit in running an occasional tank of V Power and standard fuel the rest of the time. Somebody else mentioned that premium diesels store better - that’s my belief too (no evidence of course), and given some of my vehicles are left unused for extended periods of time, it adds to my personal argument 😁.
I use the premium in the T6. While loads on forums bemoan the EGR and DPF I've never had that issue. Of course run times and servicing will vary too but fuel with more detergents will surely keep the entire system cleaner over time?
I would add for mpg I find premium worse.
The more I think about this, the more my brain hurts. Now I’m wondering about the impact of different fuels on the need for DPF regeneration, and therefore impact on oil dilution rates. And then how different diesel fuels might affect engine oil when oil dilution occurs. I am going to stop thinking about it 😁.
The box diesel must be for private use. No business use can use red diesel now. HVO has no colour, it literally looks like water and hardly any smell. I work for a national firm using HVO in very heavy equipment and big engines and when our delightful government removed the tax duty relief on red diesel, the transition over to White diesel was essential. We've noticed a reduction in power across most vehicles with a rise in fuel economy (apparently). We had trial's before we switched over from red diesel to HVO and everything appeared to be positive at the time. We are seeing fuel pipes rotting out now and I think there is some pump and injector issues starting to happen.
Astra CDTi. 80k on the clock. Prem diesel gives me 50 - 70 more miles per tank. I don't use premium diesel every time but when I do it clearly moves 50 - 70 more miles before the red light comes on.
Loving this content. Mine's always been quieter and accelerates more readily per degree of throttle pedal movement on V-Power on part throttle. But at full throttle if anything it seems to make less power than standard fuel. Again at part throttle only there's less diesel clatter. Its audible but I doubt it'd measure as dBA.
I had a focus diesel my dad had the car for a year and gave it back for a couple of years then he had the car again. We always put v power in he did either tesco or morissons. Every time we had it back it was really slow to accelerate. But it would improve and go like a rocket after a few tanks of v power. When he had the car back he was shocked how much faster it was really caught him off guard.
@@chrishart8548🤔I’m going too take a guess and say when you had the car maybe you drove it a bit more enthusiastically, and maybe longer distances, which would of gave the engine a good clean through and making it more responsive more start too finish DPF regens aswell,,, as apposed too you dad who may of just used it too pop shops, short journeys Ect which diesels engines don’t like they just start too clog up with carbon DPF starts too get blocked more when it gets cancelled if you don’t notice it’s doing one when u park up. Or engine getting too temp. But you get my point Ps no offence 👍
I would never use the supermarket fuels, especially Diesel as Tesco where I live have been known for damaging engines due to water in the fuel.
I used Sainsbury's own diesel for ages coz I got Nectar points but then I got the dreaded diesel bug due to the water vapour and heat so it actually benefits getting higher grade fuel. I've heard "all diesels the same" but maybe the storage and systems involved differ thus supermarkets having lower standards thus higher water ingress within the fuel?
One thing I noticed from filling up with diesel at Morrison’s is that it doesn’t foam nowhere near as much as other forecourts I have used(so you can get more in before pump clicks off) Don’t know if having a less foamier fuel will affect anything?
Been looking for a video about this.
As a fuel industry person. All branded diesel with one exception is the same as unbranded diesel. Exxon/Mobil is the exception because they have a unique formulation of additives that can be tested for.
I use peak oil diesel supreme which is cheaper than supermarket fuel and has the additives in, it’s cheaper because it’s a small local oil supplier. I put ehn99 in too. No issues so far been using it a year.
The only other thing to try is remapping on different fuel types to see if you can truly gain any useable benefits! Probably going down a rabbit hole though!
Some have done tests on this very thing but with petrol. Risk being a tune done on high octane fuel and then the car run on low octane is knocking / pre-ignition.Higher gains could be made when tuning on better fuel, but risks come about if the fuel isn’t consistent. They compared Tesco 99 with others
yeah but diesels don't care about detonation. it only matters for petrol.
I've used v-power for the last 12,000 miles and don't know about power, but it does clean the engine out the more you use it. My mpg has slowly got better the more I used it. So it's clearly cleaning the combustion chambers etc. It no good using it just now & then. It an accumulative effect, ie the more you use it.
I've run my car on v power diesel for the last 10 years it's runs perfectly. I used to run my small work van on v power it once said 915miles to empty on a 55 litre tank. The company said were not allowed to use premium fuel so it got shell fuel saver. When it adjusted to the fuel it felt like the turbo had failed I was on the motorway going 70mph and suddenly had less power I could barely pull over 50mph. It slowly improved but after I had to work the engine much harder. I only showed 575 at best with a full tank and the power was very on/off and surged back and forth it was horrible to drive. I now have an electric car and it's lovely.
@@chrishart8548Sounds more of a van issue than the fuel, higher cetane diesel is not going to give you 35%+ of extra fuel economy, that’s utterly ridiculous.
@@TrueSkyl1n3 you can't believe the distance to empty number anyway but it was very impressive to see 915miles. I did get it as low as 372miles once. That was foot to the floor everywhere for that tank of fuel
I love that people will watch this, see a thorough test using a dyno and good process; and still argue they are right. We ran a Merc 300TD on veg oil 50/50 diesel and it made exactly no difference to how it drove. Diesel engines aren't fuel limited like turbo petrol engines are.
I had a Hyundai i30 diesel. Swapping from supermarket fuel to Shell (standard, not premium), the average fuel consumption readout changed by a couple of mpg, which I put down to something in the diesel.
Need a shed of a pd to test. Ive used kerosene,new and old veg, hydraulic oil, red, engine oil. Kero and engine oil mix was probably the best for cost and ease of use(cold starts), but every motor was lethargic with anything but diesel in it. It all depends what you can get cheap/free, id guess at 150,000 miles covered using 'alternative' fuels. I ever ran a CR on kero/diesel mix, it only caused issues when kero ratio was over 1-1 as i started getting pump-rail pressure differential faults, this was on a 2.0 renault van.
Interesting as I've got a renault 2.5dci and I've tried a 50/50 diesel/kerosene in winter and 50/50 new veg/kerosene in summer and never experienced those issues
A few years ago I used to get the v-power for my euro 4 transit, a noticable mpg improvement, checked regularly,. In the Euro 5 diesel relay I've covered 50k in 18months, absolutely no difference in mpg whichever diesel i buy, Better buying the cheapest and adding, additive or some 2stroke occasionally
Very informative vid amazing the price difference and no power gains as such.Did the 2stroke oil make any difference?
We didn't test the 2 stroke on this one, that test may come later
Love this sort of thing. Interesting, cheers. However . . . the tests were using the engine at full power over the rev range. With me doing average driving at low to medium power and revs and with some boot to get around Mrs. Miggins in her Kia SuperFart. At small power settings I'd imagine that the difference in fuels/additives will make a difference - it's what I find anyway. About 5% better going from cheap diesel (EN590) from local central heating oil supplier to (as it's convenient for me) Murco diesel. With a cetane and 'combustion catalyst' additive, even better, maybe between 7% using carefully done tank to tank top-ups to check on the wildly over-optimistig MPG guage.... I've found that (surprise surprise) that too much cetane improver mades for some more traditional diesel engine clattering when cold at low power and revs in my 2012 Peugeot Partner van. Seems to make sense that at Full Welly in a well-tuned engine that there's little difference, after all it's the total energy content of the fuel that's the important thing for sheer power, and a good tune will burn nearly all that energy, and any racers who see an improvement are maybe not setting the tune for the additive-less fuel. Sorry about the long post, Guy
A thought it was about the quality of the fuel more than power making or emissions etc, i always heard supermarket stuff had more water in or more bio, it does say at like asda pumps 10 percent bio where as ya shells and bp etc doesnt have as much, interesting to see as a home mechanic i always recommend good fuel like a do good oil, is it all basically all same stuff? And what about petrol? I always use vpower in my 2.5 mk4 mondeo obvs youve got e5 and e10 with that but interesting to find out sometimes when ive used e10 car feels to run better weriod and all blags head lol, like others have stated i seen all different lorrys at Tamworth refinery so can see it all comes from same place just like your baked beans but heinz always tastes better
Great vid really interesting! . . . .I don't know anyone who buys V power or equivalent which makes me wonder how long it sits in fuel station holding tanks, all fuel deteriorates with age.
Fascinating and very useful video, lots of data! Btw, on a different point, I had a 2001 e46 330d, bought it in 2010 with ~88k miles on the clock, sold it to a mate in 2018 with 192k, he then took it to 220k and it was still running great. ~95% of the fuel I put in it was supermarket fuel. (For the record, at the point he took it to 220k, he then just let it sit and rot for 2 yrs, and then it was scrapped 12/2022 😢, RIP my old 330d). ND51 XGC, should anyone want to check the mileage & MoT history.
Hi, thanks for the test information. I have always used premium but have never been under the impression that it would give any better performance either power or economy wise mainly because it's exactly the same B7 fuel except premium have detergents added which theoretically keep everything a bit cleaner and maybe improve economy as time goes by simply because everything should be a bit cleaner... I can't see the point of adding additional additives to supermarket fuel because this works out more expensive than premium which has additives added for you.
It's cheaper to use an additive
Just to chuck in my 2 cents there, maybe might help to add. I've been an avid user of just regular old texaco fuel, until it sadly shut down around my area, but I proposed my own mini-test. I switched to Supreme99, then had to use shell-vpower due to it being closed down. At the beginning of the 3 month trial, I noticed a significant punchier throttle, as well as a cleaner engine noise. It ran smoother, and a little bit punchier, but again the punchier feeling might just boil down to me being placeboed lol. However after 3 Months, I switched to regular shell fuel, I did notice no difference, but sometimes I would notice the fuel not being as responsive, and on some given days it would literally feel the exact same. I'd say these premium fuels do have a better consistency maybe, with the added additives to clean your engine fuel systems. I'd love to see this test done on a long-term basis, how similar cars with similar journeys would perform, what wear and tear it can cause, but there are too many factors for that to even be accounted for. Personally I'd say every once in a while for the next few fill-ups maybe just up-to a month, add a bit of "Premium Fuel" in, to let it clean your systems, injectors , etc. then just switch back to regular old fuel. Or the better option which I am now going to potentially trial out, is adding these additives yourself, such as injector cleaners etc. I think currently I just pay an extra premium to have it done all in one fill haha
Could you please make shell v power + dipetane(fuel lubricant) and also simple diesel + dipetane dyno test, interesting does it make any improvement to power or nm, you did it mentioned it before
I thought the vpower had cleaning agents in ??? And was also a cleaner diesel???. But every 3 to 4 mths I still stick a bottle of injector cleaner though car . Audi tt mk2 tdi
Can't offer any expert advice, other than over roughly 360,000 miles between 3 VAG products over 10 years, i've just used whatever i could get at the time and never had an issue - the odd occasion ive filled with x power or the BP stuff by mistake its made no difference and i always run full to empty, so yes it was a full tank but no extra power and mpg always the same. The only thing i do ensure is that i use the best quality filter change every 10k and use the proper method to refill the housing using vcds.