Pros & Cons Of Tyson's "Tick Tock" Head Movement In Kickboxing/Muay Thai
Mike Tyson utilized sideways head movement so effectively many people wonder why we don't see it used more in other fight sports. Today, per request, I explain my thoughts on why that is.
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Have you ever had success with "tick tock" head movement in muay thai, kickboxing, karate and/or mma?
I spar with a guy some who's primarily a boxer and he does this alot seems to work well. Gotta remember to bait him with a straight punch and do a head kick like you said!
No we call it peekaboo style or Tyson style but I would never use that kind of head movement in 6 or 8 point striking. Just works with punches
im trying it in mma/kickboxing but instead of bending at the knees and hip i just bend at the torso so my head doesnt really change level. its more subtle but ive had some success using it to slip straight punches and counter as well as keeping my opponent guessing
He used it in boxing. Not that much you can do when someone dips very low. In Muay Thai, Kickboxing you can knee the head or kick to the head. So it's a complete different scenario.
I've played around with it and did ok, but I've also caught head kicks too lol.
what most people miss about this style is the footwork involved... because he skips into a strong stance on every weight shift. you can connect your legs with a band in order to condition your stance and tension
I use the peek a boo style in kickboxing, but not for the whole fight duration. I use it like once or twice in a fight, on a big acceleration, just to throw some big power shots and get inside the guard of my opponent. The fact they know you can do it is a mental pressure for them, but as you’re not always doing it they can’t time head kicks or stuff like this.
Yes, that's how I'd do it. Jab (to provoke punch reaction) then Tick-Tock-Tick while getting inside, just once in a while, and not as the base movement you do all the time. And before they'd adjust, you do something else.
Exactly how it should be done in kick boxing
Feel like it will work really well in mid range, provided you’re fast enough to pull it off. What do you do about big round kicks or Round house style knees when your feet are planted like that?
@@nathanbarnhart7823 As you’re doing it once in a while it surprises your opponent. So, 99% of the time, they end up on the backfoot when you accelerate, so they’re not in the position to throw a big kick actually. Most of the time they try to throw some powerless jab to keep you away, but as you’re an elusive target that’s not really a threat for say.
There's a guy in my gym who use this style, i'm more into movement since i come from Karate and have the best kicks in the gym, i come from full contact but we still move a lot, not like point Karate tho. Before learning how to deal with it he was kicking my ass, he is shorter but very muscular pretty much like Tyson besides being white. When someone is better than me in sparring i think a lot about It and after doing that for a month i had the conclusion that If i can go low and internal kick his legs while alternating with liver long knees this style dies. Now he can barely touch me, i incorporated long knees like another punch for anyone who likes to be close, it's working really well but it's important to use It carefully, If you get your knee technic really sound it's very easy to drop your sparring partner, i did It without meaning to and that's not nice.
Never really heard it referred to as "Tick tock" style, it's quite famously known as the "peak-a-boo" style.
Trained muay thai for 10 years then switched to kickboxing for a year and now doing boxing since last november, my hands got so much faster and stronger that finally had the confidence i never had on them , fast footwork and head movement but those vices of boxing made me see how dangerous is it to forget about all other strikes and clinch, the ideal is definitely mix a bit of the 3 fundaments.
Gabriel as a young coach myself and former competitor in MMA, I just want to thank you so much for this channel. Your insight in the striking department is invaluable.
It could be that no one can do Tyson's back and forth movement like he can. He doesn't just go back and forth with his head; he often jumps his body into angles that kill his opponent with the power he delivers with added speed.
Just switched from watching an old video of yours to this one as it came out; big fan of your fighting skills and discipline!
Awesome! Thank you!
Gokhan Saki and Mike Zambidis sometimes, both of this guys use side to side head movement to counter in a similar way to Mike Tyson, but it's less movement than Tyson, but is still kinda of possible to use this type of movement in kickboxing
Always found the guard MUCH more reliable than head movement in anything that uses more than hands. It's so DANGEROUS to move the head a lot in Kickboxing or Muay Thai. Always found myself moving into shots. And if you move into a kick or a knee, it's *GOODNIGHT IRENE* LOL
It may work better in kickboxing or Muay Thai but once you transfer over into MMA, the high guard is trash.
@@jgeez8829 Yeah, only cause of take downs though. High guard isn't really relevant in MMA. Unless you got two stand up guys.
@@ninjasrose1653 the glove size makes the Guard fairly useless. Guys like Pete Yan still use it very effectively, but you have to have a move active guard.
@@nathanbarnhart7823 That also... Definitely need an active guard. But, even then. That can be playing with fire sometimes!
@@nathanbarnhart7823 BS. Glove size is overrated on defense. Mma fighters are just usually shit strikers. And if theyre good, not everyone is gonna be defensively sound.
Great analysis! I would add that Tyson had always maintained the goal of the peekaboo for him (as the perpetually shorter fighter) was to quickly place the opponent on their back foot. I think the style could still be somewhat effective against a kickboxer inside of their kicking range. Take away a kickboxer’s kicks and put them on their heels and you can get to work. Meet them in a 50/50 and try to be Tyson and you’re asking for significant strikes.
how about clinch and knees? I guess just do not become predictable with it I guess.
@@MusMasi exactly. Hopefully you have them leaning back a bit where knees aren’t so powerful. It’s applicable in much fewer situations but the head being offline in close quarters can be a plus. But ya never know!
I love combining these two. I think about it quite often so I was glad to see you do this.
Gabriel you always have the best fight tips! You are a great fighter and a great teacher
Thanks for the video Gabriel, I’ve been pondering how well this could be instituted in Muay Thai for a while!
Gabriel varga thank you for the videos which make the new martial artist become smarter
Great video! I guessed the answer, but the video was very enjoyable nonetheless with the concise technical breakdown. I really like this channel. It’s great for striking technique breakdowns. It’s like Wonderboy Thompson’s channel but without all the goofy stuff.
Thanks Gabriel. I become a great fighter ang trainer because of you
Helpful vid. I've been joining friends at their boxing and doing sparring to improve my hands. Finding the balance between being more upright and comfortable for kicking and turning/twisting into punches more like their coach will ask for has been a challenge.
I often do the same and spar with the boxers at my gym and do most of their drills too. I like to take what I learned, write it down, then take it into a kickboxing/Muay Thai mindset. I don’t slip the jab a lot cause they can lift their lead leg up for a head kick easily, and a good opponent will pick up on it. Instead countering with a leg kick as they jab or with a teep/push kick works as a good substitute to halt their ability to use their hands and then go in myself. Sometimes I also use boxing sparring as a way to focus on distance management with the hands and tighter head movement in the pocket, though not too much head movement so I don’t make a habit and get kicked. It’s useful in case I ever take a kickboxing match and the ruleset limits the clinch a lot.
Man, I don't know why Gabe, but I just love you man...
I like you mr. Varga. Although you have sometimes said, and proven in the ring that you are not a sadist, you have a masterful sense of martial arts. When you now say "if you stand still with your body I will make you suffer with kicks in the chest or abdomen" you represent the reason why so many of us fight. It is almost a philosophical fact, being able to live and be both at the same time: violent and non-violent at the same time. To be able and to have to hurt if it is necessary, and to find the way and the time for it to be. Oss!
Has anyone else watched Mike Tyson mysteries? Surprisingly great show
I spar once with a guy that used peek a boo while kickboxing. He fought orthodox in long distance and turn on peek a boo in close distance it was hard to kick him when he was already slaming you with his fists since each slip came with a punch, tying him was a good option.
I don’t know much about Muay Thai or Kickboxing. But when I was in the army I used the peekaboo style when I sparred against Muay Thai and kickboxers and I did really well. We would typically go 2 rounds of kickboxing then 2 rounds just boxing. I definitely ate some awful front kicks and low kicks like you mentioned, but for the boxing rounds they were toast.
Blending this into outside takedown attempts works but in my experience you can't stick to only this kind of movement. But very effective to mix in and out of a fight
Please go over advanced tactics of fighting against an opposite stance fighter. Everyone talks about having the outside foot and the lead hand fighting as well as how effective your cross becomes, but just wanted to see your insights on the topic.
I've seen it to a subtle degree in fighter on petchyindee fight card can't remember who. Worked alright but he was still standing tall but swaying side to side
Gabriel how about a video on boxer vs kickboxer what what is your prediction of how a fight would go? Thanks again
Good afternoon Gabriel, I must say I took both Muay Thai and Kickboxing. From my own experience however Kickboxing seemed closer to boxing as opposed to Muay Thai. Kickboxing seemed to have focused more on head movement, and footwork that comes from boxing.
Sounds about right
Hey Champ! Speaking of boxing, do you sometimes do boxing only sparring round? And if so, do you still box as if you are in a kickboxing match or you would utilize a bit more of the movements that are relatively more safe in boxing? Thanks!
I tried it yesterday, I guess it would work great when I keep the distance close to avoid kicks
In western boxing it's a particularly good set of skills for a shorter fighter. For kickboxing I'm thinking it's safest vs someone of the opposite stance and you move to the outside, but that if you time your movements well that you can still utilize these moves, just more selectively. If you post your lead leg outside a southpaw's lead leg while slipping left they shouldn't be able to knee or kick you very easily since your foot and head is outside theirs and your moving away from their power side. Pivoting after slipping outside is an extra protective measure that prevents moving your head back into their center where you can get hit and can position you to hit them while they are still turning to face you.
@GabrielVargaOfficial what do you think about mixing the peekaboo's footwork to kickboxing or mma?
Lerdsila and Anderson Silva used head movement quite well... Also its becoming much more common in mma now...
Do you think its efficiency can increase once we've managed to reach close distance or do we have same issues but with knees and elbows ?
Cool, one thing Tyson did was to use quick side steps mixed in and do it while close. If you add in footwork and do the tick tock movement in closer, could it still be useful in kicking sports? I think you would still be vulnerable to knees and being timed... But I'm curious if it could be used sparingly?
Hi, long time fan. I just came home from practice today and have been mulling over an issue. I had a guy approach me for a spar today. For context, he's about 25lbs bigger than me. He just seems to March down through my punches and kicks and enters the pocket, pressuring me. I'm not sure how I should handle this. On one hand, I feel like I should put more oomph into my lowkicks and check hooks to discourage him from entering without respecting my hits, but I don't want to be the jerk that escalates the spar for no reason. Hoping to get your insight
Use your footwork cut angles move side to side never straight back counter his shots
I've been meaning to make an episode on that subject. I'll try to get something put together soon.
Have had this struggle so many times. To put "oomph" on my shots to keep bigger sparring partners from pressuring me back and risk escalation, or just continue to be bullied back by the larger fighter and keep things civil? Curious to see what Gabe has to say.
@@SonOftheBattleCry I definitely try to and intentionally work on it but they can also cut angles to cut you off. There's only so much I feel like I can do to keep him from entering without regard for my counters and checks
@PogChamp for sure, but you don't always get to spar with people in your weight class. Footwork definitely helps but if they're also good at footwork, then they'll cut you off and continue to pressure into the pocket. You only have so much space with other people sparring around you
You can bob'n'weave in MT or KB but you gotta make sure that you don't bend down in your waist, cause then you're asking for a knee or kick in the face, but rather to dip in your knees and lowering head together with the whole body without excessively bending over forwards.
Catching kicks as you weave? Or learning to kick from the half squat?
I think the key is to only use this in a certain way. Firstly don’t use it when in kicking range, but it could be used when in short punching range. Use this not in a side to side static way but if you see the clip of Tyson shown in this video he is moving side to side whilst shuffling forward and keeping the distance at close range. It’s hard to kick at such close range. For me it is good to use the normal Muay Thai defence when at a range where kicks can be utilised but then when you get into short range punching range, you can use the peekaboo style but ensure you are keeping the distance short range by using correct footwork like Tyson does in this example clip shown in this video.
Tyson developed the Tick Tock motion because he needed to close the distance quickly and safely to land his powerful uppercuts and hooks. If he could slip powerful and accurate boxer's punches, he could also have slipped kicks and knees in MMA. The guy's Tyson fought needed to keep him at a distance and his Tick Tock motion overcame everything they used to keep him out of range. He was awesome..
you cant really slip knees and kicks tho
The tick tock movement is probably not wise to do in a MMA fight but the D’Amato switch could help when not overused
is there a big difference between Mike's style of head movment and doing the dempsey roll? my coach told me that they're different .
Just saw the trailer for Hulu's Mike 😂🤣
the extra power from the tik tok hooks also translates to roundkicks
Gokhan Saki uses good head movement.
I think you'd probably be better off with the in and out method so if you get a kick coming at you, lean back or move back same with straights and hooks
what if instead of squatting and doing a level change side to side you just limit the motion to the upper body and bend back and forth at the torso just enough to make straights miss
Frankie Edgar used it some what in mma although he was not gifted with thunderous power, Mike Zambidis was probably as close as it gets for a kickboxer, Ramon Dekkers took ideas from Tyson and other boxers and added to his ass kicking abilities in Muay Thai
🥊
It is GOKHAN SAKI that do this "tik-tok" style with a lil bit modification.
It can work in mma since it can feint a takedown or move you into clinch range. With the threat of a takedown the leg kicks are risky. Dillashaw kicks from that lowered position.
Thought what Tyson used was the Dempsey Roll? Maybe I just watch too much Ippo. The thing people forget is footwork. Even in kickboxing and muay thai a lot of people forget about footwork. I'm guilty of it. Sometimes I forget to take proper angles or mess up my foot placement and in turn it costs me a setup attack. Seen people do the roll and they literally just plant their feet and move their upper body. Tyson will advance or take angles while doing the roll towards his target. Every move he made was a setup for a killshot. That's what set him apart from most fighters. As a kickboxer that prefers leg and body kicks, Cro Crop is the guy I personally watch on how to set up my moves.
Peak a book style is for boxing h
Hey bro aer u hungarian by genetics?
Dont see it much in boxing, either. Its really a Catskills/Cus D’Amato thing. Very energy intensive style.
Anyone here after topuria waiting to see if people can exploit his head movement in the ufc
I feel like smart and somrak used it a li
Ahhhh dammit, I’ve been trying to find a kickboxer who utilizes this. There’s many other techniques within the Tyson/d’amato style tho too, like the d’amato shift
What about george foreman longguard? (The mummy)
Actually when u bent down low u can execute a stronger low kick! Especially with a left hook!
Mike tyson needs to fight someone almost same age same weight as him if he wants to go up against a Muay Thai fighter
30 secs gang
That's what your girlfriend said 😎
@@brianbadonde8700 In fact it takes forever for me to come cuz i dont have a gf
@@thesolidsnek8096 oh a so your a serial masterbaiter I see
I suck at emulating Tysons style. Im just not built for it.
It’s like a sub style of boxing. No one can ‘emulate’ without long and HARD training.
You can still apply the same concepts. Try watching Julio Cesar Chavez, he was very good at weaving in. Tyson is something of an exagerated version of the idea of slipping and using it to load up power. He took it to an extreme and tended to throw everything into every shot. But the same movements less exagerated will allow you to evade punches and increase power with less effort, it just takes practice. Whatever side you slip to loads the punch for that side.
Bad peakaboo shadow boxing at the start.. lol good information though
Please tell me Im not the only one who cringes whenever Gabe says “tic tock” lmao PEEK-A-BOO my guy, peek-a-boo! Love the channel but ouch lol
I disagree Gabriel it must work even for MMA because its a technique to close in mainly, and by doing that you are already making the kick threat lesser and lesser with each bobbing step.
Tyson's footwork was more impressive than his head movement. One second he was in front of you, then he's standing next to you caving in your skull. Like Jordan and Brady, Tyson's on the GOAT Mt. Rushmore.
It’s more of a pendulum.
What's wrong with your knee? It's all taped up
There’s this fat guy who wins using this style in kickboxing ☝️something saki