PS5 Pro Spec Leak: What Graphics Performance Is Feasible?
2024 ж. 7 Нау.
70 554 Рет қаралды
► Watch the FULL video here: • DF Direct Weekly #152:...
► Support us on Patreon! bit.ly/3jEGjvx
► Digital Foundry KZhead: / digitalfoundry
► Digital Foundry Merch: store.digitalfoundry.net
► Digital Foundry at Eurogamer: eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry
► Follow on Twitter: / digitalfoundry
Developers need to stop trying to get high spec pc settings on consoles but instead develop around the hardware & prioritize 60fps first
Exactly and then there wouldn't be a need for a new system.
The issue isn't with consoles directly, its just poor optimization on cross platform games - usually stems from Studios churning out unfinished games quickly.... If you look at games like Ratchet and Clank or Horizon FW, those games are very well optimized, 60fps with RT on and looked amazing. On the other hand, Elden Ring (crossplatform) was terrible on PS5. Juddery mess and the graphics looked worse than Forbidden west. Having a PS5 pro with double the performance (which realistically requires a different archtecture), will only add to the issue. Devs will have to optimize for basically a whole different platform mid generation, hence why DF suggests its only going to be a clock speed bump with some upscaling hardware. Issue isnt Devs, its studios and the time given to make a game. Having PC level fideltiy on consoles with upscaling tech is perfectly doable.
Except they arent trying to get high pc settings. Quite often the settings are lower than pc can even go in certain areas.
@@BNR_248 They could replace the 3700 like CPU with a 5700.
60 fps would be low graphics for modern games..look at alan wake 2. The 60 frame mode heavily degrades the graphics on console. Ans by 2025 top of the line games will barely hit 60 on ps5 pro or just muddy the textures but just play older games on series x or pc if you want just 60 frames.
If I had a nickel for every time I've seen a PS5 Pro spec leak...
How many nickels have you got
5 😂
I'd have enough money to buy ps5 pro
Are you suggesting you don’t believe Richard here?
You could maybe buy gum...
If getting the Pro means getting 60FPS in quality mode in games like FFXVI and FFVII Rebirth then I'm getting one.
Rebirth already gets to 60fps most of the time. I think that game would benefit more from a slight bump in resolution. It actually keeps graphics settings the same in perfomance mode too, as far as I can tell. FF16 could do with a bit of both since the resolution gets lower and frame rate drops are much more frequent. FF16 tries it's best during battles to hold 60fps and it manages a lot, but it still drops sometimes, even when it's pulling the resolution down to 720p. Outside battle it doesn't even pretend to aim for 60fps, which is a shame, and it guts the resolution and graphics settings to manage this. I doubt I'd upgrade, since I've resigned myself to accept 30fps. But I'm certainly interested in what it could do.
That’s my thought too. Rebirth at 4k/60 would be insane
You will never get actual 4K 60 on console this generation but maybe their upscaling would make it decent@@saesang352
Consoles want to sell you nice graphics at the cost of performance, I think they'll do the same with the Pro, more graphics, but still swapping between 30 and 60fps, hope that's not the case this time
GTA 6!
I think if the pro can hit 60fps in quality mode in 4k games, that would be pretty decent
Tbh that’s the minimum it’s needs to make it worthwhile
Something between 45 and 60 fps at 1800p is possible in every current gen title but i wouldn't expect stable framerate.
4k (native) in 60 fps? Yeah that aint happening.
😂😂😂. My £2k system struggles with that
@@user-sx3pc4dj3r WUUUTTT? It says 8k 120 on the PS5 box! Are you saying that isn't true? 🤪
All I want is Quality graphics res at 60fps. So yeah 2x GPU power would be nice.
It sounds like it'll be short of 37 tflops but with hardware enabled DLSS from Sony (if that's true), I'd expect it to be very competitive with most cards in the 35-45 tflop range especially in terms of visuals.
@techsamurai11 Stop using flops as performance for gaming please.
So do I, so I sold my Series X and rebuilt my PC with a 4070 Super lol.
Shouldve gotten a pc. And yes i know gpus are overpriced as fuck but you can optimize and getting 60fps is no biggie.
You would also need ~2x CPU power to double the frames.
The biggest jump will be on the CPU side of things which will be a huge help in getting games to that 60 FPS mark. Do not expect too much of a change when it comes to the graphics. As RDNA 3 wasn't a massive leap over what RDNA 2 was already doing in terms of rasterization.
This generation was weird. We had 60 fps on games like hfw but choppy 720 p sub 60 fps on games that look worse than last gen (skull and bobes)
Because optimisation is up to the developers and some are better than others
It is not weird, really. Every generation have great technical achievements and complete turds.
I probably wont upgrade, but I think it could bring a meaningful improvement. Yes, it won't introduce a higher upper resolution ceiling, but it should be able to help new games hit reasonable resolutions instead of having 3 more years of new releases pushing low res in both performance and quality mode.
I feel like the pro is gonna resolve the performance modes not getting to 60 fps but i dont think the res is gonna get much higher for those and i think the quality modes are gonna still hold up at good res because even the most heavy UE5 titles yet can do resolutions above 1440p and still be 30 fps locked so those i think are not gonna get change by the pro at the end of the day devs have to keep using as the base the OG ps5 and then if they want they can add a patch for the pro but im sure 90% of the devs are just gonna do the games based on ps5 and then the pro will made performance modes stable 60 and thats it just like a ps4/ps4 pro situation were 90% of the games didnt even had a patch or take a lof advantage of it
I really want to See the benefits for the Playstation vr2.... Hoping for no reprojection and native Resolutions in All titles....
this would be amazing
No reprojection should be possible for pretty much any current game running on a PS5 Pro (I would argue the PS5 Pro really isn't that powerful if it couldn't). Hopefully the devs care to patch their games.
Only thing I care about. No noticeable vr improvements or none at all I won't get this and It'll sell way worse than the ps4 pro if it doesn't improve vr. The pro is basically always a guarantee sale to a vr user as I think every last psvr1 user bought a pro.
Yes! I think ps5 PRO mainly reason to be will be to reinforce psVR2 performance and quality. For non vr games will lock all performance modes at60fps at 1440p or lower. I hope!
My ideal Ps5 pro is you'd get both the benefits of a graphics and performance mode and not have to choose.
a 2x gpu performance boost on PS5 PRO is equivalent to going from 2070 super to 4070 super. absolutely no way this will happen unless they decide to go for a 700-800$ msrp and place it as a premium option instead of a mid gen refresh
PS5 GPU is faster than 2070 Super already, to begin with
@@mitsuhh Not really, they basically trade blows with each other depending on the game.
@@AngelicRequiemX Wrong.
ps4 pro was 2x gpu boost. So whats the point of a pro console if its not gonna be a significant uplift.
@@mitsuhh I'm correct, go look it up yourself. Even Digital Foundry did a video on this a year or two ago.
Resolution and frame rate have really struggled this gen. The only quality experience this gen has been the select few 40fps titles. In games like Alan wake you know the visuals are supposed to be impressive but you can’t quite appreciate it because you can’t see the details like they are meant to be seen because the resolution is so low.
I really want to play Alan Wake 2 in quality mode at 60fps. Really hated the low resolution of the performance mode, like 720p upscalded.
*upscaled
If you hit the three dots, you can edit your post.
well it won't happen, you get for what you pay, in that case you paying for cheap box which can run games in a low quality, it's sad that you have to pay for it more than a PC gamers, at this point you can spend 1500 on a RIG and it will run games better than upcoming ps5 pro with always decent framerate, idk what people think if 1500 is too much to build own PC then I think that some people instead of wasting time on games should work twice as hard to save some money.
@@ThereIsOnlyOneRandom$1500 is overkill, you can buy a PC that will run circles around consoles for less than $1000.
@ThereIsOnlyOneRandom Wow something twice or three times the cost will run it better. What a shock. What is the point of comments like this? The point of mine is how much performance can you milk out of a $500-$600 box with continuously advancing hardware. That's what people watch these DF videos for.
Quality mode 60fps is a MINIMUM. But considering modern quality mode on ps5 often times is 1080p-1440p upscaled I’m hoping for 4k. Or since it has its own custom DLSS even if it’s upscaled hopefully it looks as good as DLSS. Not like fsr.
So if the Xbox series X refresh has Bluetooth 5.2 built into the consul does that mean we can use AirPod pros be able to hear game chat talk to people and use noise, cancellation
I’m getting one no matter what. I was so close to buying a PS4 pro years ago but didn’t pull the trigger and I regretted it for a few years. They ended up discontinuing it and then PS5 was unavailable for so long that I was basically stuck with my base PS4 for like 4-5 years when I could have been using the pro if I had just bought one for $299 at the time. I’ll keep my PS5 and put it in a spare room and get the pro asap as long as scalpers don’t ruin the situation again. PS Direct seems to be the key anymore to getting stuff. Don’t rely on retail stores.
I just got a ps4 pro for my daughter. I use it more than my ps5. I prefer the slimmer controller.
@djnes2k7 bro what? The PS5 gets much better performance and doesn't sound like a jet engine. It's literally just a PS4 Pro but better
You can use ps4 controller on ps5 dude buy why do that the dualsense is miles better.
@@terry85mar it only works on the PS4 versions of games but yeah, it still works on PS5. This dude is an example of not knowing the tech he is using
It’s little hard to judge what pro maybe capable. Until we know full spec, and if it gets ram bump. (Rumours say pro may have 20 GB Gddr6). will Soc still be zen 2, or could be zen 3/RDNA3. We don’t know yet. Too soon to tell.
Just give us 1440p at 60fps across the board.
Yesss
If we could eliminate these shitty "upscaling internally from 720p to 1440p" modes, that would be a huge benefit to image quality. You should be upscaling *from* ~1440p, not *to* 1440p.
I would like to see 120hz modes target a somewhat higher resolution. Currently they tend to run at 1080p, which is ok, but a bit blurry with how close I sit.
I will take 1440p/60 fps over 1080p/120 fps any day of the week .
@@Crashed131963 For me, if it's a fast-paced game with sniping the tradeoff is worth it, but it's definitely a major compromise. Being able to play Doom Eternal or COD at 1440p in the high frame rate mode would be great! :)
Specs or not they need to squeeze it into a $500-$600 product so regardless they are limited to what the market would spend so that or the demand now that consumers already own a ps5 and what would the increment of the upgrade be vs a purchase.
There is only one thing that I ask out of a PS5 Pro, playing the fidelity modes at 60fps If that happens I’m buying one
bruh then its not even worth it, rather save money for ps6 then if 60 fps is the max you want lol
I normally hate when people say this, but at that point you can just get a PC. For the price of two PS5 consoles you could have a PC that could wipe the floor with the PS5
@@SenorWhyMEwhy wait, if it’ll give you more 60 fps experience with higher resolution. PS6 ain’t coming till 2028
@@beammeupscottsp7952 well you do you I’ve been enjoying pc gaming luckily got my 4090 when it was 1400$ so I won’t be upgrading for quite a long time waiting to try ghost of Tsushima
@@beammeupscottsp7952because who knows which games will and will not support this functionality. Simple logic and people should already know this from the crappy ps4 pro. Hardly anything took advantage of it. Just a money scheme for console suckers, and they fall for it.
I play on quality mode so unless the ps5 games start going down to 1080p output res or less on the quality modes then im gonna just wait for a ps6
With dynamic resolution games dropping to 720p & a blurry ghosting FSR being applied for a 1440-2160 output, we really need to get the minimum dynamic res to 1080p for a high quality upscale This will achieve that & more I'd rather they focused on hardware RT upgrades though than many things people are talking about
I don't see the reason for the pro consoles this time around. Back when the original pro consoles released it was due to the fact that 4K displays were becoming mainstream and the console manufacturers wanted to make consoles able to leverage the better displays. None of that this time around.
Fps simps will never be satisfied. I'd rather see more quality games.
@@MikeRotch-ur7sx agreed, it's not the hardware that is holding this generation back, it's the lack of quality titles
90hz Native minimum for all PSVR2 Games 👌
Seems like every console since the PS4/Xbone has just been an upgrade rather than a leap. I view the PS5 as basically a Pro version of the PS4 Pro, and the Series X as a Pro version of the XboneX. They certainly don't feel like any kind of generational revolution like consoles of the past. Doesn't seem like that's even possible anymore in a console model where you need to keep prices down.
There is diminished return on gpu’s now. Same with graphics cards. That’s why the 4090 is almost 4x the cost of a ps5.
This is pretty true. Especially with a lot of games like Halo Infinite and GoW Ragnarok on last gen. We'll probably never see the leap between gens the way we used to with say the NES to SNES to N64.
It's the same in every technology sector. Advances come fast to begin with and slow as the tech matures. Look at graphics cards, you can still get by just fine with a 10 series Geforce from 8 years ago!
Well there's three factors for graphics: hardware, software, and Art. Auto-Modellista might be grossly outdated, but it's unique Art still holds up great to this day. The likes of Uncharted 4 looks great on the Base PS4, despite the weak hardware. It's just that the software was so good from Sony. And as a third example, you can look at the new Expansion of GTA on the Xbox Series X. Here we are really seeing the hardware push things beyond the limit.
To follow up on my previous comment, well Art is completely upto the individual and developers. Now I don't expect that we will have anything unique Art wise, to push fidelity forward. But there are always niche cases, but far from the mainstream. Software can come with improvements from Sony and Microsoft, in terms of Drivers, Kernel, OS, API, and other code. It can also come from a middleman such as Unreal, making iterative but improvements such as 5.4 stable versus 5.0 beta to Unreal Engine. And software improvements can also come from the developers, making their code more robust, efficient, and complex. Do I think we will see this? No. We will get some evolutionary improvements, but no big leaps in that technology. As for hardware, that is somewhat straightforward. Last generation we got very slow and weak hardware from the likes of the Base Xbox One. That level of hardware was expected in 2011, and was outdated in 2014. Whereas the last gen console of the Xbox One X, that was rather over-powered for a 2014 expectations, despite it actually releasing around 2018. So here is where we will make most of the progress! So yes, the hardware IS important. Now the PS5 and XSX were slightly overpowered for their time. This makes it hard to make a mid-gen "Pro" upgrade. It was easy last generation for Sony, and even easier for MS. But now the roles are reversed. I think if the PS5 Pro is unveiled and it comes with a +50% upgrade overall, that would be great. If it's lower than that, well, the differences will be difficult to identify. There is a growing probability that Sony actually WON'T upgrade the console, but instead just divide the platforms by giving the new console more RAM and extra NPU cores for RayTracing. So the difference between the two consoles might be a FEATURE rather than pure grunt. Although I will say, last generation was a bit disappointing in terms of games having optimisations for the consoles. And the current generation is MUCH worse. We have the hardware, and software. We are just lacking developers, those that optimise the final product, and not treat the customers as Beta Testers. They rather pump out mediocre results fast, rather than spend the extra money and time, to do the job correct the first time. So the pessimistic take is this: PS5 Pro might be a DOWNGRADE because the developers are getting worse and worse. Which spells caution anyone using an Xbox Series S, ASUS ROG Ally, or a Valve SteamDeck. Perhaps Sony/Microsoft needs to mandate a minimum requirement to publishers: 2160p and 60fps. That will force the developers to a certain level, and they will either have to drop the Settings down in the game, or dynamically, or the developers have to get creative again and optimise their product.
pretty much the same spec upgrade ps4 pro was to ps4. But this time it can actually be used to do more usefull things , since games have 60fps modes now.
60 fps in quality mide or a performance+ mode with higher resolution, and higher resolution on vr, I'll grab one.
Two points: 1) More than a resolution boost, increasing the chances of a steady 60 fps mode for PS5 games going forward is a big deal. 2) Aside from those who already have a PS5, there are still lots of us who have not yet upgraded from the PS4/Xbox One generation. A PS5 Pro would be a nice place to make that jump, although it is nothing too revolutionary.
I hate how fast tech loses its power. Digital Foundry used to call the cpus in the next gen (now current) consoles a generation leap. Now those Ryzen 3700x esque cpus are bums?
digital foundry will say anything to keep the lights on. They bring attention to crap that you never notice or care about when immersed in a game. They through every buzz word they can at us, and unfortunately for a lot of people they get fomo and start spec chasing. The majority of gamers don’t have hdmi 2.1 to fully take advantage of the base ps5 and series x. But those same people with come here and feel the need to play the same game, just a litttttttle bit different.
The consoles are 3 years old now, hardware has moved on and games have getting more and more demanding Now the consoles are still quite competitive with PC in their price which is pretty impressive this far into a generation (especially compared to last gen) they are saying it's starting to show signs of aging in the performance modes targeting higher fps, the resolution is cut back quite a bit Also this gen we have seen devs do the bare minimum to get a game to run so it also could be optimization issues but the fact is that the console's hardware is older now and games with top tier visuals will push them especially in the performance mode.....it's going to be interesting how it turns out
Tech isn’t really losing its power that fast. Back in the day, lates 90s early 2000s moores law wasn’t obsolete so hardware was going outdated within like 3 years.
@@issacschraederAlso, the eighth generation consoles got lucky that CPU performance advancements largely stalled for a good chunk of that generation with AMD only really catching up to any meaningful extent with Zen 1 then getting ahead in some ways in IPC with the likes of Zen 2.
@@theprfesssor What games are exactly perfectly taking advance of the 3700x 8 core 16 threads? I think a lot of performance modes use decent bit of CPU power, but honestly, probably GTA 6 will be the first really massive game to truly utilize a "generational" leap in CPU power. Simulation, vehicle damage like in GTA 4 again, NPCs on screen, AI behavior, etc... Games are still very much just prettier ps4/xbox one games.
DF videos in 1080p hit harder than any 4k video. …what’s playing in John’s background?
The game in johns background is probably starfox on the n64.
Definitely Star Fox.
Some electricity waste to push his ego.
@@i3l4ckskillzz79there's literally someone playing the game behind him dude
@@i3l4ckskillzz79you should upgrade your monitor to a decent 1080p. It is clearly a person sitting on the left playing the game 😂
What interests me most is whether the psvr2 will be compatible with the ps5 pro.
GTA 6 gets its own supercharged console.
Exactly
GTA 6 will not be revolutionary. It will be the same old open world games we see today. The most recent of open world games of gta type was the Saints Row reboot. Use that as a basis of GTA6 will do and do better.
Chrono Odyssey, GTA6, UE5 games will all benefit from more power to run them smoothly (60fps?)
For me, this secret sauce NEEDS to come with a system-level feature where the games are enhanced without a patch being necessary by the devs. This DLSS-like needs to get engage on the system, using the targets for resolution and FPS by the system. ESPECIALLY for "old" games that probably wouldn't get a patch for the Pro regardless. Recent games and new ones should have the option to take advantage with theses features if that's their plan, but that souldn't be the only case where the features will be used.
At least there are games that run at dynamic resolution, so those games should see a benefit even without a patch.
By that logic, no new gaming gpus or gaming focused CPUs should be released
Watching that smooth, action packed gameplay of StarFox 64 in the background makes me remember how the experiences we have with today's games - with all their fancy tech - pales in comparison, for the most part, to many of the experiences we've had generations ago. Very few games invoke that kind of satisfaction/joy from playing.
There actually is a display upgrade that warrants the Pro: pretty much nothing runs at a high resolution in games' performance modes. Just getting closer to 4k to take fuller advantage of my OLED makes the Pro a day 1 purchase for me. I want a sharper image and higher frame-rates, and I will pay the price for it. I have a library of demanding games and I have a PS VR2. Easy choice for me.
50% raw performance increase with better upscaling technology is really all we need. We just want quality mode and performance mode to combine. If you can take a 1080p image and make it look 1440p then add 50% more performance, thats the goal
The industry needs to forget about this 4k nonsense for consoles and target 60fps for all titles at 1440p resolution and push the actual graphics tech as far as possible under these parameters.
The issue is most TVs are 4K and scaling 1440 to a 4K frame will always look jaggy/fuzzy. 1440 really only looks sharp when it’s played on a 1440 native screen. Sadly, the industry decided to go 1080p to 4K instead of spending a few years developing 1440p (or 2K) TVs. Shame but here we are.
@@seeafishThe solution is to rely on stuff like FSR to always produce a 2160p output, I don't get why this still isn't the standard.
I'm with John, I want to see the system actually be able to run those higher resolutions in the 60fps modes. This 720p crap's gotta stop, upscaling be damned.
My 2k system relies on FSR and upscaling for QHD. What hope does a console have? 😂
@@user-sx3pc4dj3r It's own upscaling solution, and in that case, probably dedicated hardware for it. Sony is capable.
Great discussion DF dudes. 👍🏽
Just like in case of PS4 Pro, I'll wait for new generation. It's not like I think it wasn't enough of an upgrade. For me a BIG issue was that it came late and I thought: why bother when in like 3 years I'll be getting a next-gen console? I was also worried about utilisation of beefier hardware. After all, all games needed to run on PS4 too, so it was a main target platform. In reality most often we saw higher DRS boundaries and some additional detail in games (the latter severely limited by stupid decision by Sony to not add more RAM). It was very rare to see games that could bring substantial upgrade over base model, that is 60fps. Even first-party exclusives like God of War offered unlocked option at best, fluctuating between 40 and 50 fps in most scenarios. IMO the biggest reasons for getting Pro was much better PSVR experience and SATA3 interface (unlike SATA2 in base models) which allowed you to replace HDD with SSD and get really noticeable loading times boost. Overall, I've never regretted not getting 4 Pro and I doubt there will be enough reasons for me to get 5 Pro. Regular PS5 is de facto a development goal this generation so I doubt majority of developers will bother to add true extra value to owners of Pro. Also, it's worth to note that doubling GPU power doesn't translate to twice the framerate. PS4 Pro have twice the CUs compared to PS4 also running at higher speeds (max 911 MHz vs 800MHz) and it wasn't enough to deliver 60 fps performance modes. CPU also got significant boost from 1.6 GHz to 2.13 GHz. These changes weren't making as much difference as one would expect "on paper" and I think this was primarily caused by developers trying to get regular PS4 version as good as it can get and then using Pro's power overhead like as an afterthought, not really focusing on fully utilising these additional capabilities. Even dedicated checkerboarding hardware support wasn't really that often utilised. Unless Sony really comes up with something special, best I expect is situation similar to Series S and X - the latter running games prettier, with better resolution, but not necessarily with much better performance. Bigger internal FSR resolutions etc.
*God of War offered unlocked option at best, fluctuating between 40 and 50 fps in most scenarios.* God of war plays at 1440p/60 locked as it is . Look up any frame rate Ps5 review of the game .
@@Crashed131963 on PS5, not on PS4 Pro! Even though PS5 runs the same version of the game, it si.pky powers through limitations of older hardware.
On pc the upgrade from rx6700 10gb to 7800xt is pretty big in my opinion, about 70% more performance in raster (double in rt), rx 7800xt is slightly faster than rx 6800xt in raster and slightly faster than 6900xt in rt. Rx 7800xt average fps in 1440p is higher than rx 6700xt average in 1080p, rx 7800xt average fps in 4k is similar to rx 6700 10gb average fps at 1440p. I think a gpu "similar" to a 7800xt could be good for a mid gen console, obviously even better if supported by good upscaling technology.
I want more 60-90fps games. That should be the new target. Not 30-60. I skipped the ps5 this time around only because they were always out of stock and by the time they were in stock again, I had already chased a series x, which has been great for someone like me that never had a 360 or xbone
get a pc
Man, I just want consistent 1440p 60fps.
Im ready..Im absolutely done with a 30fps choppy mode of blurry 60fps with dips mode
Move to PC 👍
@@SixShots5PC games aren't optimized worth a shit. Source is that I fucking have one with better specs than my PS5 yet it doesn't run as well
@@mysterymeat1216 Thats not a pc problem, thats a developer issue, most pc games run fine
@@SixShots5 I never said that was a PC issue. Learn to read. And no, most PC games are horribly optimized. Especially indie games
@@mysterymeat1216Good for you bro, it's nice you have your own opinion, have a great week
I just want new IPs😭
The thing I want from ps5 pro is being able to get both quality and performance modes. I want 4k 60fps with ray tracing all at once, I don’t wanna choose between them.
All of these different console specifications is creating hell for developers.
Ps5 pro will be the only way to play GTA 6, Dragon's Dogma 2 and probably a lot of other games, so yeah, release it already
There is no pro
PS5 pro needs 1440p 60fps with full graphic fidelity idk about 4k just want good detail and a solid 60fps
Not happening
@@ZackSNetworkyou sound like an expert with your detailed response.
Right?! Like a lot of games just reach 1800p on fidelity which is totally okay. Literally no one with a little bit of knowledge expects gta 6 in 4k60 fidelity mode. If they can give us 1440p 60fps with fidelity in gta 6 with the ps5 pro im super thankful. The details matter so much more than 1440p or 4k. 4k is eating too much raw power even 4090 struggles with cyberpunk at 4k full fidelity all details ultra and it‘s a over 2.200€ card. People don‘t understand If I can get a super realistic lookin game st 1440p60 it‘s the best thing they can do
Agreed..1440p upscaled looks prertt sharp on a good 4k tv and upgrade the older games to 4k or 4k 60
before even sony try to make a ps5 pro they should FIX first the rampant stick drift of dual sense.
Without a decent CPU upgrade (to a 5800X3D) or something it won't matter if you bump up the GPU. The existing CPU won't keep up.
Keeping my expectations subtle but what I would expect at the very least is for these performance modes on games to not look like Vaseline was smeared on the screen
Very odd feeling to be talking about console refreshes before the newest iteration of Unreal Engine is even used in most games
Remember that UE5 demo and people saying this will be a standard with the PS5 and XSX? lol. I can't say that I have seen anything UE5 that has impressed me.
@@cyphaborg6598Ue5 only delivers when you drop to 30 fps or drop to 1080p (or below!)
At that point can you call it worth it?
Most games built on UE5 are having issues hitting 60fps in performance mode unless they forego Lumen and sometimes Nanite. If you do that, what would be the point of using UE5? I think it'll be used for small games where frame rates are not important. AAA titles will steer clear of UE5 as will other graphically intensive titles. They have more control over other engines and don't run the risk of complete failure to hit 60fps unless they drop internal resolution to 0.
@@cyphaborg6598Well, the new remake of Brothers a two tale is gorgeous on UE5 but it actually showcases why a major title will never run on UE5 in this console generation or future ones because they have more granular control on other engines and can choose what to use and what not to use.
I don't expect a 4k60 for PS5 Pro. But I expect all of the latest demanding titles will also support a Quality+VRR+40fps mode. 40fps mode is acceptable from what I have experienced in supported games, such as Spiderman 2, Hogwarts Legacy
On a cheap Plain Jane 4k/60hz TV a ps5 in performance mode play those games at 1440p/60 fps locked .
Here's an interesting question - does the variability of hardware and settings affect learning AI? Essentially does DLSS work better if you only have a single spec machine with one set of settings (like a PS5 Pro or X Series X2) than an infinite range of machines with different settings?
Nah in this case nvidia is the one that train the AI themselves and then send the updates on a next version of DLSS so having the samd hardware wont do much it will be up to sony and microsoft to train the upscaller for it to work best with time
@@allansolano5587 But won't it be easier to learn with 1 console and yield a better upscaler?
As John talked about, it looks like the PS5 can only do UE5 at 30fps. If the Pro can do them at 60fps then I'm getting one.
The ps6 should be able to run every UE5 game at 4k60fps but when the next gen UE6 comes out it will most likely struggle to run those games at 4k and the same cycle is gonna repeat and we'll need a ps6 pro
Pre order it. Will be hard to get once the scalpers get involved.
I dont think the pro will be able to get stable fps just by raw power in those game they will need an AI upscaller or a frame gen AI to get them to the 60 fps because UE5 titles arent always gpu bound most of them are cpu bound and the cpu isnt changing and the chip is just gonna bump the clocks probably so i will think UE5 will be unstable 60 on a ps5 pro and when ps6 comes out it will be 60 but just for the first 3 or 4 years and then the cycle repeats
@@randyrrs7028that how hardware works everywhere. Everything gets obsolete.
@@randyrrs7028 yeah but its taking a long time to see true full featured UE5 games truly land, it's hard to imagine UE6 will be ready to go when the PS6 launches. The misalignment between software and hardware is ever present, which is why I prefer when games are tailored to run great on existing hardware instead of trying to force advanced features into unready hardware. Spec bumps are mostly worth it to play older games well rather than to play new games merely alright. But I know the majority want to buy at launch so releasing crippled games will continue.
Devs have already hit the PS5/XSX's performance ceiling. This is evident in titles that drop under 60 FPS which can then be benchmarked against PC equivalent hardware. There's no magic sauce here like there was with the PS3. Which wasn't even secret sauce it was literally developers learning their way around Cell as the console cycle went on. This is not the case with the PS5/XSX. These are x86 machines. An architecture that has been around for 4 decades. Everyone knows x86 by now so exploiting the architecture for ways to increase performance won't happen. The only thing that can increase performance to base models is FSR, which kinda sucks atm and developers optimizing their games as much as they can. If a mid gen refresh releases then I'm here for it.
This comments smells like a load of crap.
Practically yes, theoretically not. It may sound like being pedantic but multiplat-focused development nowadays is fairly high-level and not really taking the platform-specific things into consideration. Not all x86 chips are the same. If you really wanted to, you can still tailor things on bus timing/bandwidth and keeping in mind how to keep all the necessary things in cache and fed, specifically around the PS5 APU and bus system. Like actually going deep and profile each instruction and delays/cycle, maybe even ignoring the API. This is how Mario 64 modders today could squeeze 2x FPS or new graphical features from an actual Nintendo 64 (look up Kaze Emanuar). This is unrealistic of course, your games would take decades to make and it really only runs well on 1 platform. Both the PS2 and PS3 were never really maxed out, on PS2 the VU0 was known to be so underutilized like single digit %, on PS3 most devs simply has no time to tinker with the Cell unless somebody shared their SPU code.
Why can't devs implement amd fluid motion frames on console? Works wonders on pc
Afmf at 30 fps isn't good
I love it when people like you who don't know 5hit about how stuff works just write all this crap from consoles peasants feed in u in the comments section. PS3 cell processor wasn't anything special, PS3 was weak system, peasants just won't admit it
Will it play apex at a native 1440p 120fps?
Current quality modes in 60 FPS and performance modes in 120 FPS would be ok for me.
RDNA3 will be 2 years old when the Pro comes. They better have something more modern in there. But yeah, memory bandwidth and size, hasn't changed much so that will probably limit the performance.
PS5 uses a customized CPU/GPU (SoC/APU). Plus, games lag behind doing what the hardware supports. It's not really going to matter much if PS5 PRO is "cutting edge" for hardware. On top of that, most games are still thinking about the XBox One S as a target, and PS5 exlusives running on the PS5 PRO will be written to support the PS5 with the "PRO" as an afterthought... anything you do to improve on the PS5 PRO needs to be relatively simple to implement.
The most spread rumor is it'll be RDNA3 but with the addition of certain RDNA4 features. The One X did a similar thing I think by being a hybrid of GCN 4 and 5.
they wont. It has to be cheap. As long as its 2x gpu improvement its fine
We got games running at 720p and people say we dont need a pro.
We don’t need a pro because the problem was never the performance of the game console. Adding a new hardware for devs to optimize will just be an extra burden
For native 4k HDR gaming GPU is the most important, CPUs make little difference, question is does we really need raytracing or we can be satisfied with some reflection no real time and super precise, who will check it every minute
Still won't be enough, we'll still have games that can't do 4k @60 fps (locked). It should be compulsory now.
What on earth are you talking about? it all depends on the design choices and how great graphics you want you can get 4k60 very easily, it just requires the graphics to be built around that target or you can get games which struggle to reach HD and hit 60 FPS because it has very poor optimisation or the graphics are so ambitious
john got that beard ON. i see you sir. 👀
He needs to keep it. He's simultaneously overweight and insists on a very short haircut while also wearing ill-fitting glasses, so he needs all the help he can get. I don't see him losing weight or improving his hair, so anything that helps is to be applauded at this point.
@@selohcin as long as John is happy and healthy I hope he doesn't lose a pound. the beard looks great and i wanted to give him his flowers, it's strange and disappointing you chose to come in and nitpick his looks.
If ps5 pro is equivalent to a nvidia 3070 or better then I’m getting one. I want PSVR2 performance updates to coincide with it also.
If the base PS5 is a 6700. I bet the Pro will be like a 7800 equivalent, or maybe slightly better with optimizations. It’ll be well worth it
The PS5 Pro is said to be as powerful as the 6800 XT and the games are getting more demanding every year too, At that time even a 4080 would barely be enough for 4K 60. And don't expect the performance of a 5080 in a $500 console
@@randyrrs7028 it’ll be way better than a 6800 XT. It’ll have double the GPU power of the base PS5 and also RDNA 3/4 features. I’m guessing a 7800-7900 non-XT
Probably more like a cutdown RX 7700. No way they can keep costs down any other way @@saesang352
@@saesang352 i d bet 7800XT w better ray tracing.
I might be interested in upgrading to a Pro model… But the biggest factor… Will I still be able to use my coloured plates for the casing??
4K 60 fps (or unlocked frames with FSR Quality) is what I need. Holding off on FF7 Rebirth so that I can play it on PS5 Pro. My 4090/7800X3D has spoiled me too much, man. So, on consoles, I need the exclusives to look extra good! I hope Sony delivers! :')
Will it have games?
Imo, We don't really needs PS5 Pro because most developers even still released their game in PS4. The problem right now is that most of developer are too lazy to make optimization for PS5.
Well it least the ps5 pro will make it easier for those darn lazy developers to optimize their games.
Expect devs to max the s hit out of it and aim for 30 fps. Best case scenario it’s 60 fps with the base ps5 doing 30. Devs have shown that they always value graphics over frame rate and then scramble last minute to get the game running at 30-50 uncapped.
Studios need to develop their games to limits of the hardware the game is expected to run on, play to the strengths of the hardware, and work around or solve the problems the weaknesses of the hardware provide. That is all players/users of the PlayStation platform ask, nothing more, nothing less.
I just don’t want to choose between resolution and performance anymore 4K/60 is perfect for single player games, but I doubt that even the Pro will do that in new demanding games …
Same. I will gladly pay for a higher resolution 60 fps, even if it's not 4k.
It's a 7800XT with slightly slower speeds and shared memory. The big news are the 120 AI accelerators and the rumored custom DLSS from Sony which is huge news since it will replace FSR and it will have hardware acceleration and Sony will draw upon their 26 years of Reality Creation.
Custom DLSS on a 7800XT hey 😂
@@fcukugimmeausername Yeah, AMD will have AI hardware acceleration too in their new cards. FSR will be like DLSS soon. It was just a matter of time especially with AI computing becoming its own industry. Are you familiar with Reality Creation on TVs? If you have a Nintendo Switch, it's almost a requirement to use a Sony TV with Reality Creation to fix the image.
@@fcukugimmeausername Sony already does "magic" with a custom processor on their TV's. it can actually be a separate chip alongside the APU
The PS5 Pro is said to be as powerful as the 6800 XT and the games are getting more demanding every year too, At that time even a 4080 would barely be enough for 4K 60. And don't expect the performance of a 5080 in a $500 console
@@randyrrs7028 The specs of the 6800XT are vastly different than the rumoured specs of the PS5 Pro which are an exact match to the 7800XT with a slighly lower bus speed and shared memory. If the PS5 Pro was based on a 6800XT then it wouldn't sell well and would make little sense from a technical standpoint.
they need to make the pro actually available to purchase and not running around having to look where they are
Knowing the regular ps5 is around 450 USD and their profit margin is small.... What i want to know is how expensive they want to make the ps5 pro 😬😬😬 700????
Final Fantasy XVI will get a bump from 720p to 800p for performance mode
Who are we kidding Square-Enix won't even patch it lol
It better be 1080p
Just give me true 1440p 60 fps at least. And for gods sake FSR 3.5 is a must.
What about PS3 backwards compatibility?
It's not possible as PS3 was built on a different architecture ( cell processor ) instead of x86 ( like pc), It would have to have a bespoke ps3 chip on board or a dynamic binary translator / emulator which would effect performance
Sure, 4k 60 is what everyone wants.. But sadly the push for graphics will most likely continue once again, at the expense of resolution and framerate. The power of the conscole is irrelevant if the priorities are not straight.
Cue: "The base PS5 is holding back/ ruining games for the PS5 Pro!" Console manufacturers are shooting themselves in the foot in the long term by releasing pro versions of their consoles. But really, they're shooting us, the gamers, in the foot. Sony is learning the wrong lesson from last generation if it thinks that a Pro console in the tail end of every generation is the right model. And and this includes Microsoft, but at least this generation tried something a little bit experimental by having a tiered console from the outset. But ultimately, that hasn't really worked either. Having tiered hardware like this dilutes the brand and fractures the market, especially when the pro tier is introduced several years into the generation lifespan. And sadly, the pro model will always do unsatisfactory numbers in comparison to the base model. It doesn't get fully capitalised on, so people end up feeling disappointed after spending a premium on a gap-fill console before being asked two years later to Start saving up for the NEXT generation console.
if it enables Destiny 2 to have 120FPS in the PvE mode, I'll easily pay $600.
We so don’t need to a pro version of the ps5 after three years!
1080p 60-120 I'd be happy.
I think the biggest problem this generation is the developers implementing graphical features that are slight upgrades but so detrimental to image quality and performance. I actually prefer more cross generation games cause they still look better than the Ps4 Pro but run at locked 60fps (some exceptions to this). Unless developers can figure out the secret sauce that companies like Insomniac can do, just focus on competent graphics and better image quality and performance.
PS5 Pro isn't going to change the fact that there isn't any games for the console... They barely tapped the full potential of the PS5 original.
We need games to push the current platform, majority of the games in the current catalog are still PS4/PS4 Pro enhanced.
If current Playstation and Xbox struggled to handle 1 console system, how they can handle 2 consoles system (TV & Handheld) as per rumours? How is that possible ???
PlayStation "Escalation of commitment bias" 5. Sony will make PS5 Pro to better meet the new games requirement, then the devs will up the game's requirements again and their publishers will shorten the development time thus they;ll release rushed and un-optimized games that will run like shit.
Yep, this new hardware isn’t helping the issue.
If 16K isn't on the box, I am not buying it.
granted it will have $16k on the box LMAO
My rx 570 4Gb was ancient and finally got an AM4 mobo ( w a weak Ryzen 3600), but when I bought an RX 7600 8Gb, that's Gen4: the difference was IMMENSE. !! You can play 1440p games on native. ! ( Not interested la n 4K, or PS5 for that matter)
The best-case realistic scenario is a GPU that matches the specs of the RX 7800 XT, which is 70% faster than the current PS5 GPU. This will allow Alan Wake 2 to improve from running at 835p at 60 FPS to around 1260p at 60 FPS.
70% based off what?
@@mitsuhh The leaks stating that the PS5 Pro will have a 60-CU GPU.
The actual best case scenario would include dedicated upscaling hardware, which is highly likely.
@@BCBtheBeastlyBeast It's completely impossible, since the PS5 Pro would have to use the same GPU architecture as the regular PS5. The RDNA2 architecture does not have machine learning upscaling features.
@@selohcin Can be a separate unit inside the machine, or they could have worked with AMD in their partnership to implement it seamlessly. Happened with PS4 Pro.
There is zero point in releasing a PS5 Pro when A the PS5 isn't even doing well and B we haven't even scratched the surface of what the PS5 can do 😂. Bring out some games, not new hardware lmao.
It’s doing 3x better in sales than xbox series s/x. 😂😂😂
1st party is doing fine at using the PS5, and you're not going to get many 3rd party devs optimizing even more to hit the 1st party quality. Basically, the only way you're getting better performance in the PlayStation ecosystem is to release a more powerful console.
New hardware please
@@electrikoptikyeah but both are garbage tho 😂😂😂😂
@@electrikoptik and that's funny? I'd rather Xbox was doing well too.
LAUGHS WITH GAMING PC WITH RTX 4090
How many kidneys do you have?
Tell me you're a uneducated 15 year old kid without telling me.
Yeah fuck poor people!
As a 4090 owner I appreciate people don't want to spend massive amounts to chill and play games. Consoles will always have their place
2 KIDNEYS MINUS MY BANK ACCOUNT :D@@deathtrooper2048
consoles gamer's will get finally 1440p in new games like Heldivers 2 but if the CPU will be the same so the story will be the same as it was with ps4 and ps4pro, resolution boost and average 10fps more, that's the reality and price tag will be 599 for the disc version
Please make this video!
As long as we can get the horizon to not have far distance pop ups will be great.....
really excited to see what the sony DLSS equivalent can do & if 3rd party games will support it going forward
Could be that it's another situation where tech appears in a console before proliferating to PC, referring to AMD and their partnership with Sony here.